Author Topic: To have hobby or not to have hobby?  (Read 8986 times)

KittyWrestler

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To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« on: June 08, 2012, 12:47:12 PM »
I have a question and need a bit of help to see a bit more clearly. Like some folks point out, I am clearly lost....

So I get the impression that the mustachian way of living is to try to cut down everything including your hobby and try to do everything free... I just saw a post about photography and camera equipment, although OP's idea is to reduce cost and buy a cheaper equipment to achieve the same result, but as cheap as it is, it still costs money..

I get advises that my $4/month XBOX subscription is wasteful. I use it to connect with my friends. My craving for seafood and sushi is also wasteful. OK, I will try to change that and cut them out..

But I'd like to ask how should one to judge what hobby spending is wasteful and what hobby spending is not? My take on that is that it depends on individual person. If certain hobby, i.e taking photos give someone great pleasure and spirit growth, as long as that person is spending dollars wisely, it is OK.. Is it the right path of thinking?


Did I hear somebody even have a boat? I'd think that's a big chunk of cash? But again, it may mean a lot to that person..

So I am interested in seeing how do you judge your certain hobby is bad and has to go and certain one is good and gets some allowance? Did you successfully cut out some hobbies that you thought was important to you only to find out you didn't miss it?
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 01:27:46 PM by KittyWrestler »

Grigory

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2012, 01:04:30 PM »
Quote
If certain hobby, i.e taking photos give someone great pleasure and spirit growth, as long as that person is spending dollars wisely, it is OK.. Is it the right path of thinking?
That's my attitude as well. While it's entirely possible to cut out all discretionary spending (hobbies, occasional cheesecake, Netflix subscription, etc.), it won't lead to anything good: you'll either become a dull robot or snap at some point and go on a shopping spree. People always need something to entertain or amuse themselves with. As long as you're not going on giant credit-card shopping splurges like a typical consumer, it's okay to treat yourself every now and then. The mustachian journey is not a race - it's a marathon.

MrSaturday

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2012, 01:25:42 PM »
To get some perspective, add up all your nonessesntial spending (be honest!) and look at it as a percentage of your overall spending.

If it's a small percentage, the dollar amount is irrelevant.  If it starts approaching (or exceeding) what you spend on bare essentials, then consider cutting down on the things that are least important to you.

It's fine to "waste" money on things that you enjoy, but be conscious of how much you're borrowing from you future [retired] self.

Jamesqf

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2012, 01:30:51 PM »
I agree.  For me, frugality doesn't mean being a miser, it means getting value for money. If you're spending money on stuff you don't really enjoy because society/advertisers say you should, you're not getting value.  If you're spending on something you enjoy, but are using borrowed money for it, you're still not getting full value.

So your XBOX subscription at $4/month is hardly extravagant by any measure, and it seems you're getting value from it.  On the other hand, spending upwards of $100/month on cable channels you don't watch would be wasteful.  Further, even if you do watch them, you might discover that you get more pleasure at less cost from spending your time reading, biking, etc.

I'm another of those who can spend money on some fairly expensive things because I enjoy them.  (The airplane and horse lead the list, but I didn't get them until I could pay cash.)  On the other hand, there are lots of things the average person spends money on that I don't have.  No car payments, because a new car wouldn't add any value to my life. (The Insight's 12 years old, the Toyota pickup over 20.)  No cable TV, no expensive cell phone plans, etc, all for the same reason.

KittyWrestler

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #4 on: June 08, 2012, 01:32:47 PM »
To get some perspective, add up all your nonessesntial spending (be honest!) and look at it as a percentage of your overall spending.

If it's a small percentage, the dollar amount is irrelevant.

A lot of ppl here probably will disagree. I am still new so I am only speculating..
Let's say if you make 20 millions a year and you spent 1% on your discretionary spending like country club, golfing equitpment, I think per mustachian's way of thinking, that's bad bad bad stuff.. So the dollar amount still matters.. The spirit I am seeing here is that regardless of what you make, try not to be wasteful in anyway.. If you make 20 millions, try live on $27K a year. Otherwise, you are not doing what MMM is doing..

KittyWrestler

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #5 on: June 08, 2012, 01:34:50 PM »
So your XBOX subscription at $4/month is hardly extravagant by any measure, and it seems you're getting value from it.  On the other hand, spending upwards of $100/month on cable channels you don't watch would be wasteful. 
Well said!

AJ

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2012, 01:37:41 PM »
I think one thing that many people fail to consider (and that is heavily advocated here) is learning to like cheaper activities. Yes, a costly video game hobby might very well bring you tons of enjoyment. But, with some up-front effort and the right outlook, you may find that hiking is just as much fun, plus it is healthier. If you have champagne tastes and a beer budget (even if that budget is deliberately low) just learn to like beer.

You may really really enjoy fine foods, but you can also learn to like cheaper (still healthy) foods just as much. And isn't that preferable? Why not get the same amount of enjoyment for less money? Tastes are not set in stone.

grantmeaname

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2012, 01:40:58 PM »
If you make $20M a year, you should retire after a month with more money than you could ever remotely dream of needing!

I think one thing that many people fail to consider (and that is heavily advocated here) is learning to like cheaper activities.
While there's definitely merit to what you're saying, I'm a big proponent of learning to do your original activities cheaper. Make your own champagne if you love it to death. Play video games 12 months after they're released, when they cost less than half as much and you can resell them almost at cost when you're done. Learn to fish if you want to eat seafood three nights a week. Grow your own organic arugula if you won't accept anything less.

spider1204

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #8 on: June 08, 2012, 01:44:31 PM »
Ya, I think's it all about optimizing what you get out of money, which will most definitely include spending on hobbies.  For me, rock climbing is pretty much my absolute favorite thing to do and gets prioritized above just about everything.  As a result, I end up having to pay for a car and insurance even though I bike to work everyday.  It also means that even though I might enjoy going to play paintball sometime, I know that either take away money that I can spend on climbing or it will push my retirement date back further and thus reduce the amount of time I can spend climbing.

As long as your examining your spending carefully to make sure your not wasting money on things you don't really value I think your doing well.  However, I think part of this is taking a closer look at the things that you think you value and making sure that you actually do value them.  I think this is where a lot of the wisdom from the blog comes from, most people even the spendthrifts are spending their money on things that they think they value, but by trying new things like riding your bike to work instead of driving or cooking your own food instead of eating out you may realize that these things aren't truly that valuable to you.

As far as your specific examples, it completely depends on your primary goals.  I would probably compare the cost of xbox live and seafood vs the extra time it will take to reach your goals, and also keep in mind what you would be doing with this extra time.

Donovan

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2012, 01:44:47 PM »
I personally am what my fiance calls a hobby addict.  I play guitar, box, sing opera, am writing a web app, have just gotten into rock climbing (because there's a wall at my new job!), and do a little bike repair on the side.  And these are all multi-time a week things, not just things that I may vaguely like to do occasionally.  I really, really hate being idle.

However, my total cost for my hobbies comes out much lower than some of my other costs.  This is because I think it is perfectly possible to love and delve into a subject on a budget.  I think it comes down to making sure that you really NEED something in order to enjoy your hobby to the fullest.  Often times, you probably don't.  For example, I have 2 guitars (my electric and my classical).  The electric was my first, and it's a somewhat low end, budget model guitar.  Whenever I walk in a shop to get strings, I play around with the nice fancy expensive ones and start calculating out how I might be able to pay for one...but in the end I always leave without it, because I still have a perfectly functioning guitar at home!  I don't actually NEED the new guitar to continue enjoying myself, I just WANT it because it's new and shiny.

If something add genuine utility to you hobby, then it could be a good purchase (up to you to weigh it's cost/utility ratio and what else that money could be put towards).  However, if something is just a new shiny version of something that you already have that still works perfectly fine...then there are probably better places to put your money.

spider1204

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2012, 01:51:36 PM »
Donovan, where do you work, I need to apply!

Donovan

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #11 on: June 08, 2012, 01:56:51 PM »
Donovan, where do you work, I need to apply!

Haha, it's a software company in Indianapolis.  It just so happens that the CEO and founder is an avid rock climber, so when they rebuilt the gym a few years ago he had a giant old storage closet converted into a pretty decent bouldering cave.  I've been in there during my lunch time pretty much every day since I started. It's great fun :)

dancedancekj

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #12 on: June 08, 2012, 01:59:18 PM »
I think one thing that many people fail to consider (and that is heavily advocated here) is learning to like cheaper activities.
While there's definitely merit to what you're saying, I'm a big proponent of learning to do your original activities cheaper. Make your own champagne if you love it to death. Play video games 12 months after they're released, when they cost less than half as much and you can resell them almost at cost when you're done. Learn to fish if you want to eat seafood three nights a week. Grow your own organic arugula if you won't accept anything less.

That's part of what I love about the Mustachian philosophy. A lot of problem solving and strategy is involved to achieve the best results (and oftentimes cheapest) possible. Sometimes the first couple solutions don't work, but nothing brings me more satisfaction than achieving the same result for less. While many people in the following three hobbies oftentimes spend hundreds of thousands of dollars, it's easy to achieve the same satisfaction with much less.

  • Gardening - raise from seed, cuttings, or free offsets from other people instead of buying off the rack from your local big box store for a fraction of the price. It makes you a better gardener/horticulturist when you do this as well by understanding the nature of the plants you grow.
  • Aquariums - People are selling aquariums for ridiculously cheap prices on Craigslist all the time. Sometimes they give them away for free. Lighting at your local hardware store is often more than adequate for what most people need, even for growing plants or corals. Fish are also constantly being re-homed on Craigslist, and a lot of times you can breed your own (guppies and other livebearers for starters)
  • Food - Working with cheaper substitutes is fun since it allows you to flex your Mustachian cooking muscles and develop your cooking repertoire. Some of my tastiest discoveries have been when I've done something different and really hit on a new food combination. My latest example was using shredded cabbage instead of rice noodles for pad thai - deeeelicious. Raising your own food also gives you a bigger appreciation for the work put into the food produced and made available at your grocery store.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 02:00:56 PM by dancedancekj »

spider1204

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #13 on: June 08, 2012, 02:02:57 PM »
Ah ok, and I would even be qualified too, too bad I just started a new job already.  However, if you ever get hooked enough on climbing and wanna come on down to the Red River Gorge (in KY) feel free to PM me.

KittyWrestler

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #14 on: June 08, 2012, 02:26:40 PM »
Yes, a costly video game hobby might very well bring you tons of enjoyment. But, with some up-front effort and the right outlook, you may find that hiking is just as much fun, plus it is healthier.
I think it's not an accurate assumption that video game is expensive. You have seen MMM's mountainerring equitpment. They are expensive upfront but very cheap to upkeep.

Same as video game. I play two games only these days. $4 is all I spent a month on it..

Hiking isn't free at all. I hike as well. It's a big thing in Colorado. But you need shoes to go hiking, I don't care what kind of shoes, you wear shoes and they cost money at some point of time. If you are into 14er climb, which I am preparing for the next 14er right now,there will be some cost upfront to get some proper equipment. Even if it costs a dollar, that's still money.

« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 03:12:21 PM by KittyWrestler »

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #15 on: June 08, 2012, 02:27:27 PM »
Haha, it's a software company in Indianapolis.  It just so happens that the CEO and founder is an avid rock climber, so when they rebuilt the gym a few years ago he had a giant old storage closet converted into a pretty decent bouldering cave.  I've been in there during my lunch time pretty much every day since I started. It's great fun :)

That's hilarious! I assumed you worked at a rock climbing gym... that shows me.

KittyWrestler

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #16 on: June 08, 2012, 02:35:08 PM »
Ya, I think's it all about optimizing what you get out of money, which will most definitely include spending on hobbies.  For me, rock climbing is pretty much my absolute favorite thing to do and gets prioritized above just about everything.  As a result, I end up having to pay for a car and insurance even though I bike to work everyday.  It also means that even though I might enjoy going to play paintball sometime, I know that either take away money that I can spend on climbing or it will push my retirement date back further and thus reduce the amount of time I can spend climbing.

Rock climbing is expensive too since I am a climber myself. Especially you get into technical climbs. These hardware cost is outrageously expensive. And you can't grow your own rope out of your backyard.. And used rope that took the fall already could kill you..

I get the feeling that if something is healthy  to your body, people are less harsh about it.. But my video game cost of $4 a month is being used as the prime example of waste. Same as gardening/flower beds, that is viewed as a great hobby, but it costs money too... But the fact that I am enjoying getting lost in a world killing stuff with my friends is waste of money and time.. Not trying to convince anybody gaming is good.. heck, I can't even convince my parents yet.. LOL... But just want to make a point that not all hobbies are treated equally by the society..
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 02:39:27 PM by KittyWrestler »

Kriegsspiel

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #17 on: June 08, 2012, 02:43:37 PM »
You get GREAT return on video games, if you like the right ones.  I played hundreds of hours of Call of Duty when  I was in college, playing with 3 to 6 people I knew, including roommates.  If you get Skyrim, that's another hundred hours of fun.  You can play sports games with friends, and over Xbox Live.  Then there are some games that have no replay value, or that just aren't fun in the first place.  I think the people who are totally against video games don't realize the great value you get from teh right game.

KittyWrestler

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #18 on: June 08, 2012, 02:48:24 PM »
You get GREAT return on video games, if you like the right ones.  I played hundreds of hours of Call of Duty when  I was in college, playing with 3 to 6 people I knew, including roommates.  If you get Skyrim, that's another hundred hours of fun.  You can play sports games with friends, and over Xbox Live.  Then there are some games that have no replay value, or that just aren't fun in the first place.  I think the people who are totally against video games don't realize the great value you get from teh right game.

Excessive gaming is bad for anyone even if you don't spend any money on it. But I agree, unless you gamed in multiplayer shooter games like COD (I play Gears btw), you don't know the level of fun.. It's really not about the game itself, it's about the ppl you play with. That's why I rarely play games that is a single player campaign..  I also play rockband across Internet since my drummer and bass and singer live in three different states.. it has a different kind of fun.. definitely relaxing..

WageSlave

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #19 on: June 08, 2012, 03:14:10 PM »
So I get the impression that the mustachian way of living is to try to cut down everything including your hobby and try to do everything free...

I think that's somewhat of a mis-characterization of the MMM idea.  I think a better super-terse summary is "life style optimization".  It's about taking the time to really learn about yourself: what truly makes you happy, brings you the most fulfillment, gets you excited about living?  And once you know those things, how can you do them the most efficiently?  (Efficiently implies cost-effectively.)

But I'd like to ask how should one to judge what hobby spending is wasteful and what hobby spending is not? My take on that is that it depends on individual person. If certain hobby, i.e taking photos give someone great pleasure and spirit growth, as long as that person is spending dollars wisely, it is OK.. Is it the right path of thinking?
...
So I am interested in seeing how do you judge your certain hobby is bad and has to go and certain one is good and gets some allowance?

If you're truly interested in FI/MMM/ERE, I suggest you start by reading Your Money Or Your Life (YMOYL).  It's not without its flaws: the tone is kind of mushy at times, and some of the case studies are quite a bit removed from the average person.  But the fundamental concepts and methodology are sound.  In particular, understanding and actually doing the sections on tracking and evaluating your expenses are critical to being able to lead an MMM-style life.

Basically, you look at money as "life energy"; that's a fancy way of saying that you have a choice as to how you spend every hour of your life.  You have a finite number of hours in your life, so the obvious goal should be to maximize the number of hours you spend doing the things that make you happy and bring you fulfillment.  The number of hours you have left before you die is your "life bank".  Generally speaking, unlike a money bank, a life bank only decreases over time.

The first part of the book shows you that your money is really just another representation of your life energy.  Based on your real income, every $1 represents some amount of time you gave up.  Your real wage is not your hourly rate, or salary divided by working hours: it's those things minus taxes, minus commute time, minus other work-related expenses.

Money is just an intermediate form of life energy.  So the crux of the expense tracking and evaluation process is to say, for every purchase I made, "was it worth the X hours I spent earning wages to pay for it?"

Did you successfully cut out some hobbies that you thought was important to you only to find out you didn't miss it?

Some certainly do.  Again, I think it largely comes back to self-reflection, and understanding what you value the most.  Does every minute of every day of your life bring you maximum fulfillment?  If so, and you are doing it in a way that is sustainable, then you're probably not part of MMM's target audience.  But I think a lot of people, when posed with that question, know that the honest answer is "no", but at the same time can't conceive of making any real changes to their life.  Perhaps you (and I suspect a significant portion of the population) fall into this category---that is, introspection and objective analysis of what makes you happy doesn't come naturally---that's where the process in YMOYL comes in.  It gives you tools to answer the question honestly and directly.

If you're completely unwilling to change, then this site is probably lost on you.  But understand that all growth is change.  Whether want to grow to be more like MMM, or to have more knowledge, or be stronger, or charitable, or more spiritual, lose weight, eat healthier, learn a new skill... whatever, it all requires a change.

And to make the change less scary, do a 30-day trial run.  Try no sushi for one month.  Surely you can do that.  If it's the most awful, gut-wrenching experience you've ever had, well, maybe you can't cut it out.  But I suspect you'd miss it, but not be miserable.  And perhaps when you let yourself eat it after one month, it would taste that much sweeter.  And that suggestion really speaks to another foundational MMM concept: delayed gratification.  You love sushi, but what if you only do it once/month?  Go back and re-read about hedonistic adaptation.  I hate to be cliche, but in short, sometimes less is more.  I can't convince you of this any more than I can convince my child the oven is hot---she's going to have to burn herself before she learns.

I think another typical route for people on an MMM-style journey is to try a lot of different low-cost/free hobbies.  And they might find, their new free/lower-cost hobby is as good as (and therefore can replace) an old/expensive hobby.  Here, you're limited only by your imagination.  Outdoor/nature-type stuff may not be for everyone, but it costs virtually nothing to try.  Start small and simple: find an out-of-the-way place to have a picnic with your family once a month.  If it's something that everyone enjoys and looks forward to, congratulations, you have a new "hobby" that costs practically nothing.  If after six months or so, the reception isn't as spectacular as you expected, try something else...

KittyWrestler

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #20 on: June 08, 2012, 03:23:24 PM »
Hi Matt, your response is probably the best I have seen that makes the most sense and practical. Thank you for taking the time writing it up!! I have gone without sushi already.. you are right, I miss it. but not that bad.. it's the seafood cutting out that makes me miserable. No fish, no shrimp.. that.. I have to endure...

I definitely like your saying about "was it worth the X hours I spent earning wages to pay for it?" I have seen it many times, but your explanation really hit it right on..

So taking my most argued $4 a month XBOX Live subscription cost, which is viewed as a waste.. It takes me 2 mins of work per month to pay for it. I think it is not bad.. However, a sushi meal costs 12 minutes of my work to earn it... It is gone  in one hour, it's probably not a good deal..
« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 03:29:25 PM by KittyWrestler »

WageSlave

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2012, 04:56:11 PM »
I'll also add that the fulfillment you derive from your for-pay job might somewhat skew a YMOYL analysis.  If you happen to love your job to the point that it's just as fun and exciting as any of your hobbies, then FI may not be such an important and immediate goal for you.  However, there is still a case for it: nobody says you have to quit your job when you achieve FI, and the state of FI only gives you more options in life; it increases your freedom.  Furthermore, that job you love could easily become lousy due to numerous factors out of your control (management change, restructuring, Enron-style shenanigans, etc etc).

And I get the impression that most people on this site don't hate their jobs, but they love other things (such as hobbies) much more.  In other words, the time they spend doing their jobs takes away from other more fulfilling activities.

I'm assuming that achieving FIRE is one of your top goals (since that's kind of the point of this site :) )...

I definitely like your saying about "was it worth the X hours I spent earning wages to pay for it?" I have seen it many times, but your explanation really hit it right on.

Note that there's another implication to this: depending on your real wage, there's a ceiling to how much fulfillment you can buy.  I'm not so cynical as to say there's a cap on your actual level of fulfillment, but there is certainly a cap on how much money you can spend.  And if you want FIRE, then your spending cap is further reduced, because you'll have to save a significant portion of your wage.  (The pleasant irony to this is that the more you save now, the more you'll have to spend later.  Did I hear someone mention delayed gratification?)

So taking my most argued $4 a month XBOX Live subscription cost, which is viewed as a waste.. It takes me 2 mins of work per month to pay for it. I think it is not bad.. However, a sushi meal costs 12 minutes of my work to earn it... It is gone  in one hour, it's probably not a good deal..

Do you mean it literally that $4 takes you two minutes to earn?  If so, that implies your real wage is $4 * 30 = $120/hour.  This implies an annual income of well over $250k/year.

Just to walk you through an example of what I mean by real wage.  Take a median income earner with a $50k/year salary.  There's about 2000 working hours in a year, so you might be tempted to say his hourly wage is $25/hour.  But...
  • Taxes: let's say that his total federal and state income tax burden is 7%.
  • Commute: let's say he commutes 30 minutes each way, or an hour/day total.  Assuming 250 working days per year, that's an additional 250 hours he'd have back if he wasn't working.
  • Let's say that for his commute, he's half-way between the MMM walker/biker, and anti-MMM driver, and takes public transportation.  Monthly cost is $85, so annual cost is $1020.  Assume he wouldn't need this if he wasn't working.
  • Once a month he feels obligated (peer pressure, keeping up appearances, etc) to go out to lunch with his colleagues, and spends $15.  Annual outlay: $180.
So his real yearly net pay is: 50,000 - 50,000*0.07 (taxes) - 1020 (transit) - 180 (restaurant) = 45,300.

To get his real hourly wage, divide not by 2000, but 2000+250 (commute), and get 45,300/2250 = 20.13.

So that's nearly a $5/hour difference, or about 20% lower than the "advertised" wage.  I think I picked fairly conservative expenses: tax burden could be higher depending on state, he could have a longer commute, he could be pressured into eating out more often or taking clients out to lunch/dinner.  If he drives a car---even a cheap, fuel-efficient car---his gas, car insurance, licensing, and maintenance will drive this number down very quickly (one of the countless reasons why MMM pushes biking so often).  What if he has to wear a suit every day?  There's an additional wardrobe + dry cleaning cost.

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2012, 07:22:26 PM »
Another wonderfully subtle troll post.   I am impressed by you Kitty, I enjoy your posts more and more.  :D

No, Mustachianism is not about cutting out all spending.

It's about conscious spending.  Thinking about how your spending affects the world.  Being happy with life, not with stuff.  Exercising your body and your mind.

It's not about the exact dollar amount you spend, or don't.

One could have an expensive Mustachian hobby.  But it doesn't make it Mustachian to be cheap.

I think you should go through and read each MMM blog post.  And, if you've done that already, do it again.  Because clearly you've missed the point.
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KittyWrestler

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #23 on: June 08, 2012, 09:09:35 PM »
Another wonderfully subtle troll post.   I am impressed by you Kitty, I enjoy your posts more and more.  :D

No, Mustachianism is not about cutting out all spending.

It's about conscious spending.  Thinking about how your spending affects the world.  Being happy with life, not with stuff.  Exercising your body and your mind.

Thanks for slapping my face again. In my original post, I did state my take on this issue: "If certain hobby, i.e taking photos give someone great pleasure and spirit growth, as long as that person is spending dollars wisely, it is OK"
Didn't you see that? Did it imply I enjoy having stuff?

You don't know me so I think it is not fair to make assumption that I have a lot of stuff. If you come to my house, you will find I have less toys than MMM.  He's got more mountaineering stuff than me now. I used to have all the mountaineering toys while I was single...mostly camping gears, climbing equitpment, snowboard, bindings, hiking poles, and some games...  After kids, i enjoy being a mom and spend my time with my family so  I sold all my toys or gave them away. XBOX Live which costs $4 a month is my only hobby spending now.. I actually thought hard about gaming. That $4 is my way to enjoy and escape and keep in touch with a few cool folks.. I am gonna keep it.. There, it's a concise decision.. I am spending on a hobby that matters..




« Last Edit: June 08, 2012, 10:40:49 PM by KittyWrestler »

Lars

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #24 on: June 08, 2012, 09:11:30 PM »
If you are considering if something is worth it for money vs time spend, i believe it is best to consider things over the long haul - whether it is Xbox live, sushi, or new cars, those choices typically happen more than once.  In other words, How long would I have to work to pay for this activity in retirement? (Alternately how much sooner could I retire if I didn't spend money on that?) The simplest way I've seen to figure that is multiply the monthly cost by 300 and divide by your real hourly wage mentioned above. When you consider things like large vs small house, eating out or not, new or 5 yr old cars the time spans get surprising and impressive. 

 

Kriegsspiel

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #25 on: June 08, 2012, 10:27:18 PM »
[no hijack] What is FIRE?  I've seen that acronym around quite a bit, but I haven't seen the definition...[/no hijack]

erwannabe

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #26 on: June 09, 2012, 02:21:54 AM »
I believe FIRE stands for Financial Independence Retire Early.

grantmeaname

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Re: To have hobby or not to have hobby?
« Reply #27 on: June 09, 2012, 10:07:55 AM »
Yeah, something like that. It's a little bit of an awkward acronym because individually people refer to them as financial independence and early retirement. Some of the posters around here use FI/ER because that's a bit less awkward as an abbreviation, but it's also a bit more awkward to say.