Author Topic: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??  (Read 1724 times)

TheAnonOne

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Hey guys/gals,

I have always had a few pricey hobbies, autox, motorcycle, building PCs, but now I am actually getting into something a bit healthier.

I have commuted on bikes to work for 2 years now (5mi each way), but recently started getting into group rides of longer distances. I own a cheap specialized ($400 when new) commuter bike, and it really doesn't cut it for longer rides of 50+miles in a single day, I can only hold 12-15 mph reliably when the team is mostly wanting to ride 15+.

So I have been researching road bikes and fell in love (visually at least) with the Cannondale SystemSix

Only problems....

1. I have never rode one, scared it might be too aggressive for me, uncomfortable, and/or built for more "in shape" riders. I am 240lbs and 6ft tall, I could lose 30lbs.
2. Price - Base model is $4400, though the models with the Areo wheels and DI2 are more like $7k

The money is mostly a sticker shock item as we have a decent stash already with a NW of around 700k and a HHI of nearly 250k


Am I being dumb for lusting over this? Will it even help me keep up with the group? Am I just out of shape? Maybe it will make me want to ride even more? Other thoughts?

GuitarStv

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2019, 09:57:37 AM »
Bike is not as important as the engine.  I ride around on a decidedly non-aero steel frame road bike, and average more than 16 miles per hour on solo 100+ km rides.  The bike has no problem keeping up with fancy carbon aero bikes on fast rides (I notice the difference mostly when climbing, but I'm a big guy on a heavy bike).

I wouldn't spend money on an aero bike frame unless you've first optimized your position on the bike for aerodynamics.  This is the number one most important thing - way more important than the frame you ride.  Stretch regularly and build core strength until you can comfortably keep your back parallel with the ground in the drops for 20 - 30 minutes periods at least.  After that you want to purchase an aero helmet and extremely tight fitting aero clothing - both of which will matter more than an aero frame.

Laserjet3051

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2019, 10:05:19 AM »
I agree that the engine is far more important of a variable than the bike is. That said, there is no reason why one cant improve both engine and bike, if warranted. $4400 is far more than I'd want to spend. In terms of aerodynamic efficiency, there is a point of diminishing returns that is much less than $4400. Frame geometry is critical in reducing frontal air resistance, with a longer top tube, one is forced into a more aero tuck position. No drops on the bars of a bike is also a significant handicap in this respect. Rotational weight (e.g. wheels) is more important than non-rotational weight, but unless your racing semi-professionally to professionally, I'd stick with something <$3K.

LifeHappens

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2019, 10:16:15 AM »
That's... a lot of bike. Transitioning from a cheapish commuter bike to something that aggressive could be pretty tough. Do you have a decent local bike shop in your area? If so, I suggest visiting them and seeing what they recommend for your interests. There are lots of choices between $400 commuter and $7k aero bike.

GuitarStv

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2019, 11:06:35 AM »
I am 240lbs and 6ft tall, I could lose 30lbs.

I just saw this part that was missed when first skimming through.  If you're 30 lbs overweight, you're likely carrying a lot of belly fat.  Belly fat will physically prevent you from getting into a proper aero position because when you bend your knees your thighs will bash into your stomach.  Fixing this (and getting your back parallel to the ground) will provide you with way more aero benefit than a new frame.

jamesbond007

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2019, 11:39:51 AM »
If you want to get a new road bike, I suggest getting the Cannondale Synapse Carbon with 105 drivetrain instead. Di2 is nice and fancy but you are not gonna go 1mph faster because you have Di2. Synapse is a very good bike and comfortable for really long rides. I ride mine for 70+ miles on weekends in a single session and nothing beats the comfort. Of course, the Specialized version is the Roubaix, Giant has Defy, Trek has Domane. You cannot go wrong with any of these. YOU are more important than the bike. The cheapest way to increase power per lb is losing weight and maintaining a steady cadence. Even a $30K bike cannot help you with that. I bought my Synapse (2-year-old model) during a closeout sale for $1250 + tax. I did not need it. I was doing 16mph average on my Specialized Secteur aluminium with a Tiagra drivetrain. Synapse is a definite upgrade for me but still much cheaper than $4K.

TheAnonOne

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2019, 12:38:01 PM »
I am 240lbs and 6ft tall, I could lose 30lbs.

I just saw this part that was missed when first skimming through.  If you're 30 lbs overweight, you're likely carrying a lot of belly fat.  Belly fat will physically prevent you from getting into a proper aero position because when you bend your knees your thighs will bash into your stomach.  Fixing this (and getting your back parallel to the ground) will provide you with way more aero benefit than a new frame.

Indeed I am. It is a process but I am actively making changes to lose weight. I don't think I could go into a full flat back position at this point. Theoretically couldn't I lower the seat into some sort of "happy medium"?

TheAnonOne

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2019, 12:40:29 PM »
If you want to get a new road bike, I suggest getting the Cannondale Synapse Carbon with 105 drivetrain instead. Di2 is nice and fancy but you are not gonna go 1mph faster because you have Di2. Synapse is a very good bike and comfortable for really long rides. I ride mine for 70+ miles on weekends in a single session and nothing beats the comfort. Of course, the Specialized version is the Roubaix, Giant has Defy, Trek has Domane. You cannot go wrong with any of these. YOU are more important than the bike. The cheapest way to increase power per lb is losing weight and maintaining a steady cadence. Even a $30K bike cannot help you with that. I bought my Synapse (2-year-old model) during a closeout sale for $1250 + tax. I did not need it. I was doing 16mph average on my Specialized Secteur aluminium with a Tiagra drivetrain. Synapse is a definite upgrade for me but still much cheaper than $4K.

Really good notes here. Do you ride faster with the new bike at all?

I understand that the engine for me is really non-optimal at this point. Though, the bike I have is also really non-optimal, I am working on the long term fix, but also looking for a short term boost as well. I just don't want to be 2 miles behind everyone!

honeybbq

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2019, 12:41:44 PM »
I would not commute on an aero bike.  You want to be up high and be seen in traffic. This bike is the opposite, you are low and compressed.
This bike is for racing. PS if you are riding in a group you will get ugly glares if you show up in that thing if you are part of a road-bike community.

I have a Cannondale Synapse (ala Jamesbone007) mentioned. I rode it in several half ironmans, commute on it, and ride it around town for errands.

I have a cervelo P2 aero racing bike that is optimized for long rides and comfort. I used that for my ironman. I would use it for 60+ mile long bike rides. (PS I got mine used from a friend and actually paid less than my roadie).

I'm only about 1 or 2mph faster on my aero bike 0n a flat course that is closed. If it's hilly or technical at all, my road bike has better gear and handles better. It is not easy to steer and the shifting can be a problem with Di2 systems if you aren't used to it.  As mentioned, it's more about the engine than the bike. Diminishing gains here if you are 30+ lbs over weight.

You can get a brand new Cannondale with a carbon fork for less than 2k. You can probably find a used one on CL for half that. You'll have to get used to clipping in, and getting new pedals and shoes.

I can totally see your need for a good roadie, I can't see your need for a fancy pants bike.

rothwem

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #9 on: June 13, 2019, 12:43:21 PM »
I vote that you get a cheap CAAD10 or 12 off of eBay/Craigslist/Facebook marketplace, slap an ultegra or 105 group on it, put a set of 32 spoke alloy rimmed wheels on it (I really like Easton’s right now) and go from there. You should be able to do it for under $2000 and you’ll have a durable 17 pound bike that you can race or hit any group ride with. 

If you start to feel the urge to upgrade, pinch your belly. If you can pinch greater than an inch, buy a power meter. If not, snag some Chinese carbon wheels.

There’s really no need to spend $4400 on a road bike is basically what I’m saying. $2000 goes a looong way if you use your head.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 01:02:29 PM by rothwem »

TheAnonOne

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2019, 12:50:50 PM »
I would not commute on an aero bike.  You want to be up high and be seen in traffic. This bike is the opposite, you are low and compressed.
This bike is for racing. PS if you are riding in a group you will get ugly glares if you show up in that thing if you are part of a road-bike community.

I have a Cannondale Synapse (ala Jamesbone007) mentioned. I rode it in several half ironmans, commute on it, and ride it around town for errands.

I have a cervelo P2 aero racing bike that is optimized for long rides and comfort. I used that for my ironman. I would use it for 60+ mile long bike rides. (PS I got mine used from a friend and actually paid less than my roadie).

I'm only about 1 or 2mph faster on my aero bike 0n a flat course that is closed. If it's hilly or technical at all, my road bike has better gear and handles better. It is not easy to steer and the shifting can be a problem with Di2 systems if you aren't used to it.  As mentioned, it's more about the engine than the bike. Diminishing gains here if you are 30+ lbs over weight.

You can get a brand new Cannondale with a carbon fork for less than 2k. You can probably find a used one on CL for half that. You'll have to get used to clipping in, and getting new pedals and shoes.

I can totally see your need for a good roadie, I can't see your need for a fancy pants bike.

It's interesting that the synapse is coming up so much here because a few people at work mentioned it.

Is there any reason for the bad looks on group rides on Areo bikes?

rothwem

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #11 on: June 13, 2019, 01:00:47 PM »
Is there any reason for the bad looks on group rides on Areo bikes?

If you mean tri-bikes, its because when you're on the aerobars, you can't steer very well and your brakes are far away from your hands. 

Also, triathletes are generally very strong riders, but *typically* have terrible bike handling skills.  On fast group rides, the
required bike handling skill increases with the group's speed.  You need to be able to hold your line at 20 mph around turns with someone 10" from your shoulder. Its not uncommon on faster rides for you to bump shoulders, hit handlebars and rub tires with other riders and you need to be able to do those things without freaking out and/or crashing.  The trouble is, it takes a lot of miles to get comfortable with that stuff, and most triathletes just don't spend enough time riding in groups to develop those skills. 

honeybbq

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #12 on: June 13, 2019, 01:09:35 PM »
The synapse is just a good all road all purpose bike. Middle price point, pretty decent components come standard (shimano 105s, etc). You can also get it REI, so you don't have to go to a fancy bike shop. There are lots of other good choices besides Cannondale though. You should test ride some bikes and see which ones you like.

Tri bikes (or aero bikes) as mentioned, are harder to steer and while the components are more complex, the bike isn't as good in more difficult terrain IMO. Sharp turns, traffic, stopping quickly... none of these are the benefits of this type of bike. When you're 'in aero' position you use different parts of your leg, and typically triathletes like me like this so that we can 'save' our legs for the bike. You also get to 'rest' a little more than on a road bike.

I've ridden thousands of miles on both my bikes. Riding my tri (areo) bike is "easier" on me physically but more challenging mentally. If you are new to the clip-in scene, I would definitely take the baby step of a roadie which will be just as fun, handle better, and be less delicate component wise than an all carbon bike.

PS if you're gonna shoot your wad, get an Argon 18 and send me pics. Kthanxbai.

LifeHappens

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2019, 01:15:45 PM »
Is there any reason for the bad looks on group rides on Areo bikes?

If you mean tri-bikes, its because when you're on the aerobars, you can't steer very well and your brakes are far away from your hands. 

Also, triathletes are generally very strong riders, but *typically* have terrible bike handling skills.  On fast group rides, the
required bike handling skill increases with the group's speed.  You need to be able to hold your line at 20 mph around turns with someone 10" from your shoulder. Its not uncommon on faster rides for you to bump shoulders, hit handlebars and rub tires with other riders and you need to be able to do those things without freaking out and/or crashing.  The trouble is, it takes a lot of miles to get comfortable with that stuff, and most triathletes just don't spend enough time riding in groups to develop those skills.
To expand on this, aero bikes are built for going fast, mostly in straight lines, by yourself. If you've never been on one, they're tough to handle. The steering is really touchy, it's harder to shift and brake. A regular road bike is more user friendly.

TheAnonOne

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #14 on: June 13, 2019, 01:38:45 PM »
Is there any reason for the bad looks on group rides on Areo bikes?

If you mean tri-bikes, its because when you're on the aerobars, you can't steer very well and your brakes are far away from your hands. 

Also, triathletes are generally very strong riders, but *typically* have terrible bike handling skills.  On fast group rides, the
required bike handling skill increases with the group's speed.  You need to be able to hold your line at 20 mph around turns with someone 10" from your shoulder. Its not uncommon on faster rides for you to bump shoulders, hit handlebars and rub tires with other riders and you need to be able to do those things without freaking out and/or crashing.  The trouble is, it takes a lot of miles to get comfortable with that stuff, and most triathletes just don't spend enough time riding in groups to develop those skills.

To be fair, "Group Ride" for me isn't "Line Riding" maybe a bit of side by side riding for 3-4 hours but nothing close to "suited up and going 24MPH"

rothwem

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #15 on: June 13, 2019, 01:56:34 PM »
I think it’s also important to make the distinction between a tri bike and an “aero road” bike. The aero road bikes have drop handlebars but they also have certain tt/tri bike features like internal cable routing, shaped tubing, and aero profile seat posts.

Most of the aero road bikes handle fine and shouldn’t gather you any funny looks at a group ride. They’ll handle just as well as a “normal” road bike.

This category of bike is also fairly new, and there’s some innovation going on there in terms of brake types (I know that Giant’s aero road bike, the Propel uses tiny little v-brakes) and internal routing that can be tricky to work on.

The main downside to the aero road bikes like the system six is cost to benefit though. You’re not going to go much faster on on aero road bike than a standard Caad10 with box section rims, but the bike will cost twice as much. Like guitarstv said above, the main gains you get aero-wise are from body position.


rothwem

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Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #16 on: June 13, 2019, 01:57:31 PM »

To be fair, "Group Ride" for me isn't "Line Riding" maybe a bit of side by side riding for 3-4 hours but nothing close to "suited up and going 24MPH"

Then why bother with a fancy bike?

GuitarStv

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #17 on: June 13, 2019, 02:04:40 PM »
I am 240lbs and 6ft tall, I could lose 30lbs.

I just saw this part that was missed when first skimming through.  If you're 30 lbs overweight, you're likely carrying a lot of belly fat.  Belly fat will physically prevent you from getting into a proper aero position because when you bend your knees your thighs will bash into your stomach.  Fixing this (and getting your back parallel to the ground) will provide you with way more aero benefit than a new frame.

Indeed I am. It is a process but I am actively making changes to lose weight. I don't think I could go into a full flat back position at this point. Theoretically couldn't I lower the seat into some sort of "happy medium"?

Your saddle height is set based upon your leg length, seat tube height, and crank length.  It's not usually a good idea to mess with this once you set it to a good position.  (Although, if you're not in a good position and have your saddle too low, you are robbing yourself of an awful lot of power with every pedal stroke . . . so find some videos online and figure out where the saddle should be.)

You can get a longer stem (stretch your position out more), rather than have a significant saddle to bar drop to achieve a similar effect, but there's a limit.  If you stretch out too far you can fix the legs into belly problem a bit but your lower back and shoulders will start to hurt all the time.


Body position is key though.  The numbers aren't even close.  It controls like 60% of your total aerodynamic drag.  The frame is like 5 - 8%.  And body position is free to fix.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 02:09:25 PM by GuitarStv »

TheAnonOne

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2019, 02:04:44 PM »

To be fair, "Group Ride" for me isn't "Line Riding" maybe a bit of side by side riding for 3-4 hours but nothing close to "suited up and going 24MPH"

Then why bother with a fancy bike?

You benefit from areo MORE when not line riding.

rothwem

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #19 on: June 13, 2019, 02:44:59 PM »

To be fair, "Group Ride" for me isn't "Line Riding" maybe a bit of side by side riding for 3-4 hours but nothing close to "suited up and going 24MPH"

Then why bother with a fancy bike?

You benefit from areo MORE when not line riding.

Right, but why do you need the benefit? Basically, you’re on the bicycle equivalent of a Honda Fit right now. You’re discussing buying a Formula 1 racecar, when a Porsche 911 (CAAD10) would probably be a better choice for you since you’re not racing anyone.

The Porsche is going to feel like an incredible upgrade from your Honda Fit. And no disrespect, but you’re not going to see much benefit going from the Porsche to the F1 car at this point in your riding career.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #20 on: June 13, 2019, 04:39:53 PM »
If you want to get a new road bike, I suggest getting the Cannondale Synapse Carbon with 105 drivetrain instead. Di2 is nice and fancy but you are not gonna go 1mph faster because you have Di2. Synapse is a very good bike and comfortable for really long rides. I ride mine for 70+ miles on weekends in a single session and nothing beats the comfort. Of course, the Specialized version is the Roubaix, Giant has Defy, Trek has Domane. You cannot go wrong with any of these. YOU are more important than the bike. The cheapest way to increase power per lb is losing weight and maintaining a steady cadence. Even a $30K bike cannot help you with that. I bought my Synapse (2-year-old model) during a closeout sale for $1250 + tax. I did not need it. I was doing 16mph average on my Specialized Secteur aluminium with a Tiagra drivetrain. Synapse is a definite upgrade for me but still much cheaper than $4K.

Really good notes here. Do you ride faster with the new bike at all?

I understand that the engine for me is really non-optimal at this point. Though, the bike I have is also really non-optimal, I am working on the long term fix, but also looking for a short term boost as well. I just don't want to be 2 miles behind everyone!

Well, I am doing 16.5mph on average right now. Up from 16mph. Is that a big improvement? Hell no. Does that make a difference mentally on really long rides? Yes. The bike alone is not the reason for it. I changed my tires to continental GP4000Sii which have substantially lower rolling resistance than the stock tires. Also, my bike takes 28mm tires compared to 25mm on my previous bike. Plus, I became stronger riding more hills. A combination of these factors may have contributed to a slightly faster average speed.

Be careful lowering the saddle. You will end wasting your power output or worse end up injuring yourself and you could never ever bike again. If anything you'd want to be more upright until you get used to it and build up strength.

Dave1442397

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #21 on: June 13, 2019, 06:27:06 PM »
I'd say spend $150 on a real bike fit from a pro before you spend money on a bike.

A lot of bike shops say they can do a bike fit, but from my experience most of them don't know much beyond the very basics. Here's an example of a place that knows what they're doing - http://www.ero-sports.com/2018/

I wouldn't go crazy spending thousands on a bike at your level. There are always faster riders out there no matter what bike you're on. I ride with groups that cruise at 25-28 mph, and there are guys on those rides who were professional riders at one point (all in their fifties now, or I'd never keep up), and they ride the oldest, heaviest bikes out of all of us.

I would go for Di2 (Ultegra) or SRAM etap. I've put 21k miles on my Di2 bike, which replaced my old CAAD-10 with mechanical SRAM Rival groupset. The difference is well worth it to me. I've made one adjustment to my Di2 setup in all those miles. My CAAD-10 would get serviced every six months because it wouldn't shift properly, and no matter how many adjustments it got (at three different bike shops) it still shifted like crap again after a few hundred miles.

If you want a nice bike at a good price, get a bike fit to check what size frame and geometry is right for you, and look at https://www.canyon.com/en-us/road-bikes/#section-bikeModels

You can also hunt for bargains on Facebook, ebay, and Craigslist once you know exactly what will fit you. I got my bike as a shop demo with a 40% discount.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #22 on: June 13, 2019, 06:30:24 PM »
If you want to get a new road bike, I suggest getting the Cannondale Synapse Carbon with 105 drivetrain instead. Di2 is nice and fancy but you are not gonna go 1mph faster because you have Di2. Synapse is a very good bike and comfortable for really long rides. I ride mine for 70+ miles on weekends in a single session and nothing beats the comfort. Of course, the Specialized version is the Roubaix, Giant has Defy, Trek has Domane. You cannot go wrong with any of these. YOU are more important than the bike. The cheapest way to increase power per lb is losing weight and maintaining a steady cadence. Even a $30K bike cannot help you with that. I bought my Synapse (2-year-old model) during a closeout sale for $1250 + tax. I did not need it. I was doing 16mph average on my Specialized Secteur aluminium with a Tiagra drivetrain. Synapse is a definite upgrade for me but still much cheaper than $4K.

Really good notes here. Do you ride faster with the new bike at all?

I understand that the engine for me is really non-optimal at this point. Though, the bike I have is also really non-optimal, I am working on the long term fix, but also looking for a short term boost as well. I just don't want to be 2 miles behind everyone!

Well, I am doing 16.5mph on average right now. Up from 16mph. Is that a big improvement? Hell no. Does that make a difference mentally on really long rides? Yes. The bike alone is not the reason for it. I changed my tires to continental GP4000Sii which have substantially lower rolling resistance than the stock tires. Also, my bike takes 28mm tires compared to 25mm on my previous bike. Plus, I became stronger riding more hills. A combination of these factors may have contributed to a slightly faster average speed.

Be careful lowering the saddle. You will end wasting your power output or worse end up injuring yourself and you could never ever bike again. If anything you'd want to be more upright until you get used to it and build up strength.

+1

Getting tires with a good rolling resistance that are the right size for your weight makes a tremendous difference in speed in my experience.  A 28 or even 32 mm tire is much more appropriate for a 200+ lb guy than a 23 or 25.  It lets you run the tire at lower pressures which will be more efficient over bumpy roads, and it reduces road vibration that goes into your body which will make you less fatigued (and therefore faster).

A good tire vs a crap tire is also a big difference.  The GP4000SII is a great tire.  The GP5000SII is also a great tire.  But if you're tight on cash, Continental Ultra Sport IIs use the same tire compound and have very good rolling resistance for about 1/3 the cost (but they'll puncture more easily).

You can also pick up some free speed simply by regularly keeping your drivetrain very clean, by taking apart and servicing your wheel bearings (lightly grease rather than overpack the bearings and they'll roll better . . . but pack the hell out of them if you just want them to last forever), and by taking apart/cleaning/greasing your jockey wheels (lots of stuff seems to get stuck in this area . . . I'm forever pulling bits of hair, grass, and string out of my lower jockey wheel).

the_fixer

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #23 on: June 15, 2019, 07:30:33 AM »
When my wife was competing she had an aero setup and crosswinds are a big deal that I have not heard mentioned and not good for a commuter.

Even in slight crosswinds it will seriously push you around. Even aero spokes can be a liability in crosswinds.

FWIW my wife has multiple bikes including some high end carbon bikes and her favorite bike for commuting is the aluminum frame Cannondale that she purchased back in 2001, it has survived a broadside hit from a car that ran a red light (bent the crank and sent her flying across 3 lanes if traffic) and has more miles on it than any car we have owned.

It is slightly less comfortable than her carbon bikes but her carbon bikes with high end components constantly need work and eat parts like it is a all you can eat buffet. Her aluminum Cannondale with 105 / tiagra only needs a minor tune-up once and a while and it just goes even with a few dents in the frame :)

If she were to buy a bike it would be the aluminum Cannondale CAAD. If she wanted to get crazy with money we would be looking at a titanium frame.....

Carbon fiber no thanks

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #24 on: June 15, 2019, 07:45:18 AM »
Nothing wrong with buying a nice carbon bike if it will motivate you to ride even more. But that specific model of bike is probably not appropriate for the type of riding you are doing. That is a fast race bike, very aggressive geometry, and I guarantee there isn't a single extremely experienced road racer who would want to spend all of their time on that bike. I work at a shop, have for over 7 years, and I spend a lot of time talking people out of their unrealistic bike wants. 95% of the time people are looking at way more bike than they need, and are shocked when they test ride what they thought they wanted and it is extremely uncomfortable. When I get these customers on a bike that matches with their riding goals/needs, they nearly 100% of the time come back to the shop shortly after and thank me for helping them find the correct bike.

I would steer you in a direction of something like...Trek Domane, Specialized Roubaix, etc. These are comfortable, long distance road cycling bikes. The geometry is set up to be less aggressive and more forgiving so you can ride for as long as you want. They are stable, and fun to ride. They can still be fancy and light if you want to spend the money, but have some nice starting prices as well. I'm not as familiar with Cannondale and Giant, but I guarantee both of those brands make something in the same category. You should visit shops, and test ride some bikes to really get a feel for what a fast road bike will fit like. It is very eye opening to actually get on the bike and pedal it around.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2019, 07:47:11 AM by mountain mustache »

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #25 on: June 15, 2019, 08:03:19 AM »
I’m always reminded of this post when potential purchases like this come up.

https://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/12/26/cure-yourself-of-tiny-details-exaggeration-syndrome/

Please I beg you do not spend all of that money on an aero bike because you are in love with it “visually”.

Instead:

1.  Feel free to buy a poster of the SystemSix for your bedroom wall. You can probably get one with some moody and dramatic lighting.

2. Get a bike fit at a reputable local bike shop. Fit is everything.

3. Buy a proper roadie bike that suits you based on the fit. As previously mentioned the Defy, Synapse and the like are fantastic choices here that will improve your riding and enjoyment.

4. There is no point paying more than Shimano 105 level.

5. Set a challenging weight loss or time goal and when you hit it feel free to upgrade the wheels. Keep the old wheels for the winter. Wheels make a big difference but again you don’t need to go crazy here.

6. If you still want to spend loads of money on a bike remind yourself of points 2-4.

7. If you still want to buy the SystemSix remind yourself that (a) aero bikes age fast (it’s cheaper to replace the poster on your bedroom wall than it is the bike when it starts to look dated) and (b) you’ll probably be faster on the Defy/ Synapse type bike.

I went bike crazy pre-MMM. I had two Di2 bikes and a bunch of expensive kit. When I read this post of MMM that I linked above I realised I didn’t enjoy cycling any more than I had with my entry level bikes and my times were no different. I sold the lot and bought a single Mustachian values type bike. I love cycling and I love the additional £3500 ($4500) this gave to my FIRE fund.


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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #26 on: June 17, 2019, 09:16:26 AM »
Well, I feel like i found my tribe here w/ obsessions about bikes!

Anyhow - I agree w/ others regarding a not-super aggressive geometry for the riding you describe, and that a 105 will make you quite happy. And you don't need race wheels!

Suggest checking out online such as : https://www.coloradocyclist.com/road-bikes

and paying for a good bike fit to get everything set just right for you (greatly increases comfort on long bike rides).


Now someone needs to talk me down from buying a tri bike (I actually do race and went to worlds on my road bike.... and hope to re-qualify - the lack of a good tri bike is actually hurting my finish times....)

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #27 on: June 17, 2019, 09:18:50 AM »
Now someone needs to talk me down from buying a tri bike (I actually do race and went to worlds on my road bike.... and hope to re-qualify - the lack of a good tri bike is actually hurting my finish times....)
Can you borrow or rent a tri-bike for your races? That's a big chunk of $$ to drop on a bike with limited utility outside of race day.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #28 on: June 17, 2019, 09:30:19 AM »
Now someone needs to talk me down from buying a tri bike (I actually do race and went to worlds on my road bike.... and hope to re-qualify - the lack of a good tri bike is actually hurting my finish times....)
Can you borrow or rent a tri-bike for your races? That's a big chunk of $$ to drop on a bike with limited utility outside of race day.

The rental ones seem to be in pretty bad shape from what I've seen. I actually need one for training as well. I've been racing for 3 years, so not really an impulse purchase. I also race a lot - I think I have 15 on my calendar for this year (I have a race sponsor so I don't have to pay entry for many of the races that I do.) . At some point renting (200-300 per event) costs a lot more than having a bike (and the bikes aren't fitted to you - the thought of riding 56-112 miles on a poorly fitted bike makes me want to cry). If I am doing a group/peleton ride or a draft-legal race then I use my road bike (or if it is sick-hilly), otherwise I'd be on the tri-bike.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #29 on: June 17, 2019, 09:37:51 AM »
I also race a lot - I think I have 15 on my calendar for this year
Well, with 15 races a year you've probably crossed the threshold to needing your own tri-bike! I'd suggest shopping used, but I know the used market for high end bikes is a bit of a minefield. Still couldn't hurt to ask around at your local bike shops to see if they know of anyone looking to unload a tri-bike in your size.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #30 on: June 17, 2019, 09:43:05 AM »
I also race a lot - I think I have 15 on my calendar for this year
Well, with 15 races a year you've probably crossed the threshold to needing your own tri-bike! I'd suggest shopping used, but I know the used market for high end bikes is a bit of a minefield. Still couldn't hurt to ask around at your local bike shops to see if they know of anyone looking to unload a tri-bike in your size.

Thank you!!!!! I've been shopping used and I'm working my network to see if I can get a discount. I hope to get settled on one in the next few weeks (nationals in August, other nationals in November - so I need time on the bike before then, right!?!) Trying to stay under 5k.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #31 on: June 17, 2019, 09:57:17 AM »
I also race a lot - I think I have 15 on my calendar for this year
Well, with 15 races a year you've probably crossed the threshold to needing your own tri-bike! I'd suggest shopping used, but I know the used market for high end bikes is a bit of a minefield. Still couldn't hurt to ask around at your local bike shops to see if they know of anyone looking to unload a tri-bike in your size.

Thank you!!!!! I've been shopping used and I'm working my network to see if I can get a discount. I hope to get settled on one in the next few weeks (nationals in August, other nationals in November - so I need time on the bike before then, right!?!) Trying to stay under 5k.
I did a ride out of a local bike shop on Saturday and noticed they're discounting 2019 models already. If you really look you might be able to find a dusty 2018 bike that meets your needs.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #32 on: June 17, 2019, 01:01:34 PM »
Now someone needs to talk me down from buying a tri bike (I actually do race and went to worlds on my road bike.... and hope to re-qualify - the lack of a good tri bike is actually hurting my finish times....)
Can you borrow or rent a tri-bike for your races? That's a big chunk of $$ to drop on a bike with limited utility outside of race day.

The rental ones seem to be in pretty bad shape from what I've seen. I actually need one for training as well. I've been racing for 3 years, so not really an impulse purchase. I also race a lot - I think I have 15 on my calendar for this year (I have a race sponsor so I don't have to pay entry for many of the races that I do.) . At some point renting (200-300 per event) costs a lot more than having a bike (and the bikes aren't fitted to you - the thought of riding 56-112 miles on a poorly fitted bike makes me want to cry). If I am doing a group/peleton ride or a draft-legal race then I use my road bike (or if it is sick-hilly), otherwise I'd be on the tri-bike.

Are you part of a tri club? That's where I got mine (used) when she was upgrading and getting rid of hers.

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Re: Thoughts on Areo bikes- Specifically Cannondale SystemSix??
« Reply #33 on: June 17, 2019, 04:43:58 PM »
Now someone needs to talk me down from buying a tri bike (I actually do race and went to worlds on my road bike.... and hope to re-qualify - the lack of a good tri bike is actually hurting my finish times....)
Can you borrow or rent a tri-bike for your races? That's a big chunk of $$ to drop on a bike with limited utility outside of race day.

The rental ones seem to be in pretty bad shape from what I've seen. I actually need one for training as well. I've been racing for 3 years, so not really an impulse purchase. I also race a lot - I think I have 15 on my calendar for this year (I have a race sponsor so I don't have to pay entry for many of the races that I do.) . At some point renting (200-300 per event) costs a lot more than having a bike (and the bikes aren't fitted to you - the thought of riding 56-112 miles on a poorly fitted bike makes me want to cry). If I am doing a group/peleton ride or a draft-legal race then I use my road bike (or if it is sick-hilly), otherwise I'd be on the tri-bike.

Are you part of a tri club? That's where I got mine (used) when she was upgrading and getting rid of hers.

I haven't been able to turn up anything that way. There are 3 fairly large clubs in the DC area... I'm busy making a spreadsheet of my options and hunting around for used bikes online. Basically, from one manufacturer to another, with the same components (and same frame material), the bikes can vary in price by 2-3k. It isn't an emergency, so I can spend sometime searching around. I started the process last year and decided to hold off for another year because I qualified for worlds and spent my bike money going to Spain to compete instead (and it was 100% worth it!).