The Truck Problem

[roomtempmayo]

I want a truck.  I've wanted one for decades.

I've never owned a truck because they're so expensive.  That, and I don't absolutely need a truck.  I've gotten by this long without one.  So, this is a want, not really a need.

My uses are hauling moderately heavy and dirty stuff, pulling trailers up to about 5000 pounds, and moderate two track off-road driving, including through 6-8" of snow.

My local Craig's List used truck market is awful.  Anything more than five years old has rust (we salt the heck out of our roads), and twenty year old rust buckets with 250k miles still go for $3-5k.

Question: What's the cheapest way to get a reliable four wheel drive half or three quarter ton truck?

The non-truck alternatives all have drawbacks.

- I could get a commercial van with a hitch, but then I'd have the mess inside and it wouldn't be four wheel drive.

- I could get an SUV with a hitch and a utility trailer, but I don't have anywhere to park a trailer.  UHaul rents trailers reasonably, but that would leave the logistics of picking up and dropping off.

- I could continue to rent trucks when I need one, but that's inconvenient and it adds up.  I've spent about $2000 over the past year on truck rentals.

Here are the options I've considered:

- Buy from a GSA auction or state surplus auction in a rust-free state, fly there and drive it back.  The price might be right, but these are sold very as-is, so there'd be a risk of buying unknown problems.

- Buy from a private party in a rust-free area.  Again, fly there and drive it back.  Downside here is that prices are still high.  Twenty year old rust free trucks seem to go for 5-7k with major miles.

- Buy a small retired box truck and put a flatbed on it.  Purchase price would likely be low, but even if I built the flatbed that would be an additional cost.  It also likely wouldn't be four wheel drive.

That's as far as I've gotten.  Folks here must have been down this route before.  How do I hack the truck problem?

[Jon Bon]

Preach!

I am in the exact same boat. A used truck that feels "affordable" its completely beat to shit and likely a maintenance nightmare. The best deal I found pre-covid was to find one coming off a 3 year lease ~30-40k miles for less than 25k. Anything more used then that was on its forth owner and 50% ferrous oxide.

Also lets talk about capabilities here. I realize that truck buying is almost 100% aspirational at this point. What we need is a small utility trailer good for about 1000 pounds that can be towed by nearly anything. I get storing and parking a trailer is a PITA but it is the right tool for the job. A truck is just convenient to have, if I need to get 10 sheets of drywall cool use the truck. If I need 100 sheets, just get that shit delivered!

To be fair I truly do need a truck more than most. I "haul" something truck worthy likely 1x a week. Hwoever the minivan I have works just fine, better than a truck in many situations.

Where I am right now? Ford Maverick. A new truck for 21k? Please and Thank you.

I don't need the whole tow  50k pounds of lumber through the Rockies in winter BS. No one does this, if they do its in a Peterbilt semitruck. I need the jack of all trades vehicle but master of none. My job is to variable and my truck needs to be equally flexible.

Minivan is getting a bit long in the tooth. What I need?  A new minivan, what I want. well you get the point!

[Morning Glory]

We bought a 40 year old rust bucket when we needed a 4wd vehicle for towing and farm chores. Yes it has rust but it ticks all your other boxes. No need to be rust free if you are hauling tree branches around.

[roomtempmayo]

Where I am right now? Ford Maverick. A new truck for 21k? Please and Thank you.

I'm strongly considering the Maverick.  It's a big upfront cost, but even if I only get ten years of use out of it (an awfully pessimistic estimate) that's $2k/year in purchase price, which is basically what I've been spending on rentals.

The Ecoboost engine/tow package/AWD version doesn't get the gas mileage of the hybrid and costs a few thousand more than the base model.  But it also provides reasonable softroad performance and 4000 pounds of towing capacity.

I think a Maverick with the option to pull a utility trailer occasionally would work out really well, at least for me.

[Metalcat]

Right now? There is no sane way to buy a used truck, used vehicles are all insane right now. Wait until the market is sane again, or just accept that you are going to overpay for a truck.

[Fomerly known as something]

I want a truck.  I've wanted one for decades.

I've never owned a truck because they're so expensive.  That, and I don't absolutely need a truck.  I've gotten by this long without one.  So, this is a want, not really a need.

My uses are hauling moderately heavy and dirty stuff, pulling trailers up to about 5000 pounds, and moderate two track off-road driving, including through 6-8" of snow.

My local Craig's List used truck market is awful.  Anything more than five years old has rust (we salt the heck out of our roads), and twenty year old rust buckets with 250k miles still go for $3-5k.

Question: What's the cheapest way to get a reliable four wheel drive half or three quarter ton truck?

The non-truck alternatives all have drawbacks.

- I could get a commercial van with a hitch, but then I'd have the mess inside and it wouldn't be four wheel drive.

- I could get an SUV with a hitch and a utility trailer, but I don't have anywhere to park a trailer.  UHaul rents trailers reasonably, but that would leave the logistics of picking up and dropping off.

- I could continue to rent trucks when I need one, but that's inconvenient and it adds up.  I've spent about $2000 over the past year on truck rentals.

Here are the options I've considered:

- Buy from a GSA auction or state surplus auction in a rust-free state, fly there and drive it back.  The price might be right, but these are sold very as-is, so there'd be a risk of buying unknown problems.

- Buy from a private party in a rust-free area.  Again, fly there and drive it back.  Downside here is that prices are still high.  Twenty year old rust free trucks seem to go for 5-7k with major miles.

- Buy a small retired box truck and put a flatbed on it.  Purchase price would likely be low, but even if I built the flatbed that would be an additional cost.  It also likely wouldn't be four wheel drive.

That's as far as I've gotten.  Folks here must have been down this route before.  How do I hack the truck problem?

GSA does stupid things like only pay for conventional oil which will void new car warranties.

[MilesTeg]

You won't find a decent used truck for a reasonable price at the moment because of shortages.

Avoiding a rust bucket is a good idea. Rust isn't just a cosmetic issue, it can destroy the structural integrity of key components of the vehicle making it unsafe. Your best bet (once shortages ease) is what you suggested: look for older used vehicles in arid locations. You can also buy a used fleet vehicle from an arid place (you don't have to limit yourself to auctions).

You can also consider buying a rust free but high mileage vehicle and rebuild/replace the engine/transmission when necessary. Refurbished parts for old domestics are plentiful and cheap.

But, on the price. Realize that the reason older trucks are still relatively expensive is because older trucks still have a lot of value. And that means you can resell easily and with a decent recoup.

[Dave1442397]

This might not be quite enough truck for you, but it starts at $20k, which seems like a bargain these days.

https://www.ford.com/trucks/maverick/2022/

[Jon Bon]

You won't find a decent used truck for a reasonable price at the moment because of shortages.

Avoiding a rust bucket is a good idea. Rust isn't just a cosmetic issue, it can destroy the structural integrity of key components of the vehicle making it unsafe. Your best bet (once shortages ease) is what you suggested: look for older used vehicles in arid locations. You can also buy a used fleet vehicle from an arid place (you don't have to limit yourself to auctions).

You can also consider buying a rust free but high mileage vehicle and rebuild/replace the engine/transmission when necessary. Refurbished parts for old domestics are plentiful and cheap.

But, on the price. Realize that the reason older trucks are still relatively expensive is because older trucks still have a lot of value. And that means you can resell easily and with a decent recoup.

Right the shortages are definitely a thing.

That being said, its not like there were quality trucks to be found for a reasonable price out there to begin with. Ive been tracking them for a few years now, and frankly they are just not worth the price premium.

Its amazing what marketing can do......

[SwordGuy]

https://www.harborfreight.com/automotive/trailers-towing/1195-lb-capacity-48-in-x-96-in-heavy-duty-folding-trailer-62648.html

They frequently have 25% off coupons if you don't need one right away, and it folds up so it doesn't take up much space when it's not in use.

I renovated lots of houses with a small sedan and this trailer.   Works like a champ.   

All told, when I got it some years ago, it cost about $1000, which included getting a hitch put on my sedan, the trailer, some wood and bolts for a trailer bed and railings, and a lifetime license tag for it.   Auto insurance covered it for no additional charge.

That covers "need" rather cheaply.

Can't help you with irrational "wants".  :)

[Jon Bon]

https://www.harborfreight.com/automotive/trailers-towing/1195-lb-capacity-48-in-x-96-in-heavy-duty-folding-trailer-62648.html

They frequently have 25% off coupons if you don't need one right away, and it folds up so it doesn't take up much space when it's not in use.

I renovated lots of houses with a small sedan and this trailer.   Works like a champ.   

All told, when I got it some years ago, it cost about $1000, which included getting a hitch put on my sedan, the trailer, some wood and bolts for a trailer bed and railings, and a lifetime license tag for it.   Auto insurance covered it for no additional charge.

That covers "need" rather cheaply.

Can't help you with irrational "wants".  :)

Right the utility trailer is a great solution. I live on one of those pesky city lots so a utility trailer is going to be an eyesore that I trip over 4x a week type thing. If I had a bit more space sure.

And as I recently heard, all car purchases are aspirational. As in yeah I need AWD because now im totally gonna go camping. Or I need a truck because now I'm totally going to do truck stuff now!

My thoughts are a need a new vehicle in the next year. So a new car in the 20's that can carry 5 people AND do truck stuff is gonna be it. Also to be clear I'm mostly FIRED so a new car for 25 versus a new to me car for 10 makes little to no difference, that and I do truck stuff way more often then your average suburban dad.

[Morning Glory]

[quote author=MilesTeg link=topic=122950.msg2867264#msg2867264 date=1625417306

Avoiding a rust bucket is a good idea. Rust isn't just a cosmetic issue, it can destroy the structural integrity of key components of the vehicle making it unsafe.
[/quote]

 The holes in the floorboard are annoying in winter lol but it cost 1/20th as much as my friend's truck and does all the same truck things, with the bonus of not having to worry about scratches and dents. I even get "nice truck" compliments and questions about when I'm going to restore it. I'm getting ready to sell it after six years because we sold our rural property and will likely get more than I paid. I recently got more than I paid for another truck that hadn't even moved in years (long story).

[MilesTeg]

Avoiding a rust bucket is a good idea. Rust isn't just a cosmetic issue, it can destroy the structural integrity of key components of the vehicle making it unsafe.

 The holes in the floorboard are annoying in winter lol but it cost 1/20th as much as my friend's truck and does all the same truck things, with the bonus of not having to worry about scratches and dents. I even get "nice truck" compliments and questions about when I'm going to restore it. I'm getting ready to sell it after six years because we sold our rural property and will likely get more than I paid. I recently got more than I paid for another truck that hadn't even moved in years (long story).

If there's enough rust to have eaten through the floorboards, then the frame and/or control structures are almost certainly compromised too. I hope you don't get in a collision or get in a driving situation that exceeds the compromised strength of those elements as the likelihood of serious injury or death is greatly increased.

[Morning Glory]

Avoiding a rust bucket is a good idea. Rust isn't just a cosmetic issue, it can destroy the structural integrity of key components of the vehicle making it unsafe.

 The holes in the floorboard are annoying in winter lol but it cost 1/20th as much as my friend's truck and does all the same truck things, with the bonus of not having to worry about scratches and dents. I even get "nice truck" compliments and questions about when I'm going to restore it. I'm getting ready to sell it after six years because we sold our rural property and will likely get more than I paid. I recently got more than I paid for another truck that hadn't even moved in years (long story).

If there's enough rust to have eaten through the floorboards, then the frame and/or control structures are almost certainly compromised too. I hope you don't get in a collision or get in a driving situation that exceeds the compromised strength of those elements as the likelihood of serious injury or death is greatly increased.

There's no air bags and it only has lap seatbelts too!!

Don't worry, it mainly gets used for farm chores and the occasional trip across town with heavy/big stuff. Frame is intact and husband replaced all the brake lines last year. It's actually quite road worthy, but we don't take it on highway trips with the kids because the fuel mileage is terrible and that's not what trucks are for anyway ; ). The biggest danger is that I once nearly put my foot through the hole in the bed while loading something.

[roomtempmayo]

Avoiding a rust bucket is a good idea. Rust isn't just a cosmetic issue, it can destroy the structural integrity of key components of the vehicle making it unsafe.

 The holes in the floorboard are annoying in winter lol but it cost 1/20th as much as my friend's truck and does all the same truck things, with the bonus of not having to worry about scratches and dents. I even get "nice truck" compliments and questions about when I'm going to restore it. I'm getting ready to sell it after six years because we sold our rural property and will likely get more than I paid. I recently got more than I paid for another truck that hadn't even moved in years (long story).

If there's enough rust to have eaten through the floorboards, then the frame and/or control structures are almost certainly compromised too. I hope you don't get in a collision or get in a driving situation that exceeds the compromised strength of those elements as the likelihood of serious injury or death is greatly increased.

There's no air bags and it only has lap seatbelts too!!

Don't worry, it mainly gets used for farm chores and the occasional trip across town with heavy/big stuff. Frame is intact and husband replaced all the brake lines last year. It's actually quite road worthy, but we don't take it on highway trips with the kids because the fuel mileage is terrible and that's not what trucks are for anyway ; ). The biggest danger is that I once nearly put my foot through the hole in the bed while loading something.

A pre-1990 truck is basically a unicorn around here, and a totally rusted out 4x4 F150 with 300k/miles would still sell for $3500 in an afternoon.  What's the case for that being a good buy?

[Morning Glory]

Avoiding a rust bucket is a good idea. Rust isn't just a cosmetic issue, it can destroy the structural integrity of key components of the vehicle making it unsafe.

 The holes in the floorboard are annoying in winter lol but it cost 1/20th as much as my friend's truck and does all the same truck things, with the bonus of not having to worry about scratches and dents. I even get "nice truck" compliments and questions about when I'm going to restore it. I'm getting ready to sell it after six years because we sold our rural property and will likely get more than I paid. I recently got more than I paid for another truck that hadn't even moved in years (long story).

If there's enough rust to have eaten through the floorboards, then the frame and/or control structures are almost certainly compromised too. I hope you don't get in a collision or get in a driving situation that exceeds the compromised strength of those elements as the likelihood of serious injury or death is greatly increased.

There's no air bags and it only has lap seatbelts too!!

Don't worry, it mainly gets used for farm chores and the occasional trip across town with heavy/big stuff. Frame is intact and husband replaced all the brake lines last year. It's actually quite road worthy, but we don't take it on highway trips with the kids because the fuel mileage is terrible and that's not what trucks are for anyway ; ). The biggest danger is that I once nearly put my foot through the hole in the bed while loading something.

A pre-1990 truck is basically a unicorn around here, and a totally rusted out 4x4 F150 with 300k/miles would still sell for $3500 in an afternoon.  What's the case for that being a good buy?

I'm pretty sure we are in a similar region or at least climate. I just did some browsing and late 90s- early 00s F150's (not 4x4) are going for about 2k here. 3500 is about right for a 4x4. We paid 2500 for ours 6 years ago, so we will likely make a small profit. I listed it at 4k to start but it's a 3/4 ton square body which is really popular now for some reason. I don't know the mileage because the odometer probably rolled over a couple times before we got it.

The "good buy" is that they have already depreciated as much as they are going to so you will get your money back when you sell, plus you only have 2k tied up in a truck instead of 20k (or 50k lol) so you can get by with liability only insurance. They are easier to work on than a newer truck because there's no electronics, and having to do the maintenance is no big deal if it's not your daily driver. In my state the licensing is also cheaper on older vehicles than newer ones.

[Ecky]

Any chance OP can describe more thoroughly his needs? What I'm seeing is:

-Tow 5000lbs
-Up to 8 inches of snow
-Offroad
-No room for a utility trailer

A truck might well be the right answer. I'd get the hybrid Maverick if I "needed" a truck. As it is, I only live on a dirt road, in an area that gets over 80 inches of snow each year. I'm doing home renovations where I can get away with pulling two 2000lb loads behind my hybrid to the dump rather than taking it all in one go, in exchange for getting north of 50mpg the other 99% of the time I'm using my vehicle - which I paid $3,000 cash for 8 years ago.

All sarcasm aside, my take is that satisfying a want is rarely more than momentary, but the car payment isn't. Additionally, nobody is born needing a truck. We have agency in how we structure our lives, and we may or may not choose to structure our lives in a way that a truck is a best-fit vehicle. I'd sit with it a while before pulling the trigger.