Author Topic: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE  (Read 3013 times)

Harper

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SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« on: August 03, 2017, 08:09:41 AM »
I've floated the MMM world by my SO a bit in the past few months and have really taken hold of tracking our spending.  SO is loving that I'm doing this.  We are really attacking some "easier" categories of spend.  This week we are on vacation and I brought up retirement.  I said to him that I want to retire early and that I wasn't going to wait until I was 62 to retire.  His response?  No we are not retiring at 62, we are waiting until 65 because we need SS.  Nope.  I even told him that I wanted to retire in 10 years and he thought I was crazy.

I've read the awesome post of 50 ways to convert your SO to mustachianism but that doesn't really apply here.  He's on board for this.  It's the idea of retiring early that I can't convince him of.  (Oh and since it will come up, it's not that he loves his job and doesn't want to retire, he doesn't and me retiring early without him wouldn't fly either). I guess if I understood the 4% SWR better I could explain it to him.  I did tell him the 25x your expenses idea and that with our current spending we don't have enough.  If we could cut spending by half, we would have enough even now.

Thoughts?

TartanTallulah

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #1 on: August 03, 2017, 08:35:29 AM »
Be patient, be subtle, and just drop the idea of early retirement into conversation from time to time. You've got plenty of time, and if he's on board with being frugal you're in a much better position than someone whose spouse wants to retire early but won't save.

Eventually, he'll be telling people it was his idea all along :-)


pbkmaine

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #2 on: August 03, 2017, 08:59:43 AM »
"It's fine if you work until age 65. I will fully support you on that. But I have lots of other things I want to do, so when we reach full financial independence, I plan to stop working. I hope you will support me."

Caoineag

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #3 on: August 03, 2017, 09:03:42 AM »
If he thinks you need SS then maybe the problem is that he doesn't understand how market gains work. Maybe show him how much the portfolio earns every year for the next 10 years? By the time you are getting close, the portfolio should be making more than your expenses. That is what finally convinced my hubby that we could do this.

Physicsteacher

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #4 on: August 03, 2017, 09:51:06 AM »
If your goal is retirement in ten years and SO is already on board with making the spending changes you need, is there any harm in going along letting the stash accumulate for a few more years before once again bringing up RE? My DH was happy to accomodate my requests to track expenses and ramp up our savings rate, but he didn't really believe retirement before sixty was a possibility until we'd been on this path for a couple of years. Even though he is generally a math guy, it took actually seeing growth in our portfolio to overcome his doubts. It's different seeing the formulas, graphs, and tables of hypothetical scenarios and actually watching the big wad of money generate meaningful returns.

Fire2025

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #5 on: August 03, 2017, 10:14:00 AM »
The retire early part is the most difficult to truly get your head and emotions around.  I agree with other posters, keep saving and moving forward and then revisit again slowly.  Maybe bring it up every couple of month/ years and see if the idea is sinking in. Or talk about it all the time, until you normalize it in your home. 

You know your SO best, to know which tactic would work best.

I also think the Simple Math post is the best simple explanation of FI/RE concept:
http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/01/13/the-shockingly-simple-math-behind-early-retirement/

At least this is the one that blew the top of my head off.  Good luck.

Harper

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #6 on: August 03, 2017, 12:13:08 PM »
Thank you, I really appreciate all the advice. 

Another problem we have is that most of our savings (outside of 401K stuff) is not invested but in low interest savings accounts.  He's very conservative.  I've been working at moving some to VTSAX and STAR.  So I need to work on that too....

I'm a red panda

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #7 on: August 03, 2017, 12:26:18 PM »
Personally, I'd worry about FI first.

Once you get there, you can decide what to do with it.

Harper

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #8 on: August 03, 2017, 12:30:17 PM »
Quote
Personally, I'd worry about FI first.

Once you get there, you can decide what to do with it.

I understand that but for me, it's important to know why I'm sacrificing to get to FI.  If I'm white knuckling it through a job that is $$$ but miserable, I can do that if I see the light at the end of the tunnel.  If there's no light then I should back down and get a lower stress/lower paying job.

ixtap

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #9 on: August 03, 2017, 12:52:38 PM »
Quote
Personally, I'd worry about FI first.

Once you get there, you can decide what to do with it.

I understand that but for me, it's important to know why I'm sacrificing to get to FI.  If I'm white knuckling it through a job that is $$$ but miserable, I can do that if I see the light at the end of the tunnel.  If there's no light then I should back down and get a lower stress/lower paying job.

Ask your SO why he is interested in being frugal. What is he picturing as the reward?

StarBright

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #10 on: August 03, 2017, 01:01:06 PM »
Quote
Personally, I'd worry about FI first.

Once you get there, you can decide what to do with it.

I understand that but for me, it's important to know why I'm sacrificing to get to FI.  If I'm white knuckling it through a job that is $$$ but miserable, I can do that if I see the light at the end of the tunnel.  If there's no light then I should back down and get a lower stress/lower paying job.

Since your SO is on board with savings and some investing (it sounds like) can you just hang on to that knowledge for a while (ie. what you are sacrificing) and try again on the ER for you in a few years? Maybe you can practice essentially living on your SO's income without them even knowing?

My DH has no interest in either of us retiring early but he is in his dream job that he wants to work until he is 70 and I'm in my love/hate $$$ job that I've been working for a decade to support him in his quest for his dream job. I'm waiting until our both our kids are out of daycare until I bring up ER for me again.

Sometimes people can't see beyond their immediate financial situation. My DH sees that we are saving lots of money, but he also sees that we spending lots of money on childcare. In 3 more years we get almost 2k back a month compared to what we have now. I'm planning on letting him see how much we accumulate at that point/already have saved towards my retirement before I broach the topic of me cutting back again.

In 3 years we should be able to live off of DH's income quite easily while letting my substantial retirement savings grow until we are old enough to draw it down. Can you give it a year or two and attempt something similar?

Harper

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #11 on: August 03, 2017, 01:06:59 PM »
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Ask your SO why he is interested in being frugal. What is he picturing as the reward?

SO has major "bag lady syndrome".  That's the basis for his frugality.  Even if we both lost our jobs today, we would be fine.  Major cutbacks and maybe downsize the house but we would be fine.

But yes, i do feel fortunate that he is good with being frugal and being more cognizant of our spending.  That is the hardest part I think of converting a spouse

Quote
Since your SO is on board with savings and some investing (it sounds like) can you just hang on to that knowledge for a while (ie. what you are sacrificing) and try again on the ER for you in a few years?

Yes, you (and others that have said the same thing) are right.  I'll just continue to push the savings and revisit ER in a few years.  I may enlist our tax guy (who we've worked with for years and also does financial planning) to help with discussions of ER as he only now works minimally and SO respects him.  I wouldn't enlist him to invest for us but more to help my case for ER.

thank you everyone!

trashmanz

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #12 on: August 03, 2017, 01:12:00 PM »
I would see what his real "issue" is, because I don't think you have really hit on it.  Then I think its just a matter of finding the numbers and getting an adviser that is on board to explain the numbers.

Inaya

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2017, 01:54:02 PM »
Quote
Personally, I'd worry about FI first.

Once you get there, you can decide what to do with it.

I understand that but for me, it's important to know why I'm sacrificing to get to FI.  If I'm white knuckling it through a job that is $$$ but miserable, I can do that if I see the light at the end of the tunnel.  If there's no light then I should back down and get a lower stress/lower paying job.
Can the light at the end of the tunnel simply be a low-paying job that you love? The flexibility you can gain by being FI opens up many doors, and RE is only one of them.

Skills Barterer

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Re: SO on board with cutting spending but not for RE
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2017, 02:07:34 PM »


Ask your SO why he is interested in being frugal. What is he picturing as the reward?

Yea!  Because just fast forward a few years.  Your investments are going to be bringing in way more than what you make annually.  What will be the point of that?