Author Topic: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)  (Read 36253 times)

Goldielocks

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #100 on: August 20, 2014, 06:06:22 PM »
Wow -- 1/2hr appointment once a week to communicate.   I am definitely my own worst problem here.  I will need to get started.

Thanks for the great story, and congratulations!

Dr. Doom

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #101 on: August 21, 2014, 08:01:27 AM »
Congratulations!  That's such wonderful news!

I would advise her to make sure no one gets a hint that she's considering leaving, until she has that bonus check in her hot little hands.  It wouldn't be all that unusual for them to let her go, if they know she's planning on leaving anyway, in order to save themselves the bonus $.

Completely agree.  She's going to hold the cards close to her chest. 

The timing works for me, anyway -- She'll get her bonus in March, and those three months in 2015 should allow me to frontload my 401(k) for the year.  Then -- poof for both of us.

My big takeaway from this whole experience is that I didn't sufficiently communicate my FIRE plans with my spouse until much too late.  Instead of a journey of two, I was hiking the trail solo and then just sort of expected her to automatically join me at the end.  And it can potentially take a long time and quite a bit of work on both sides -- lots of talks, sharing, and 2-way dialogue -- for things to come together. 

Somehow, I had this mistaken idea that saying, "Honey, we can quit now" would be all it would take to get her onboard.  Holy crap was I wrong.

@okashira, I think she'll probably exit quietly rather than make a mess with a genuine FU-style departure.  Although it'd be fun in the short term (they're always great stories, and the FU thread on this forum is staggeringly awesome) she's going to want to maintain relationships and leave the door open with her soon-to-be-ex employer.

Thanks again for all of the support. The community on these boards is amazing and I'm not sure we would have reached this point without some of the feedback and ideas presented here. 




Dr. Doom

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #102 on: August 21, 2014, 08:47:52 AM »
...
I can't say I'm surprised that this is what sold it for her to understand why you have to get out.  Your detailed work posts are written with such detail and style that they make me frustrated for you.

I wouldn't say it sold her but it definitely helped.  Thanks for reading, btw, I'm continually surprised that people are interested in that content, especially given the length.  Don't be frustrated for me, though -- I'm actually with a really good employer right now, and having all of those less than good experiences makes me grateful and mostly content to be where I am for a bit longer, because I know how much worse it can be.   


Cheddar Stacker

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #103 on: August 21, 2014, 08:51:55 AM »
Thanks for reading, btw, I'm continually surprised that people are interested in that content, especially given the length. 

I just clicked over to your blog yesterday and I'm still back in January. I'm looking forward to seeing how 2014 progressed. Love the first few posts. I forgot about Ghosts and Goblins until yesterday.

SunshineGirl

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #104 on: August 21, 2014, 09:37:04 AM »
The three tactics I might use in your situation are:

1. Schedule a long-ish vacation ASAP and make it one where you do/learn something new. Like, three weeks in South America studying Spanish. I find that a change of venue and experience always makes my SO and I say things like, "Wouldn't it be great if we could....all the time?"

2. How about floating the idea of the two of you starting a business together on the side of your normal jobs, in the hopes that THAT would give her the validation she would need to be viewed how she wants to be viewed by others? If you haven't already, check out Tim Ferriss' books and blog. The goal is to create income without creating time-intensive work.

3. "It's not okay for you to be unhappy with your job. Let's make your number one priority finding a job you like, even if it means making less money." She's demonstrating that change is hard for her in any regard.

Frankies Girl

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #105 on: August 21, 2014, 09:52:25 AM »
Dr. Doom - that is a wonderful update and I'm so happy for the both of you! :D

I can't wait to see how this plays out for you both. After reading your blog and the work history (which is highly entertaining btw), I've been rooting for your successful journey to FIRE - and how awesome that the spouse is joining you!



EscapeVelocity2020

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #106 on: August 22, 2014, 09:55:24 AM »
Fantastic news, fo sho!  Don't be surprised if there are some cold feet on her part, but now that it is out there, you have a foundation to build on.  There are studies that both people (typically older) should retire at the same time.  Keep on sharing, as you can probably tell we are all interested to hear how it goes :)

Chranstronaut

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #107 on: August 22, 2014, 11:09:25 AM »

My big takeaway from this whole experience is that I didn't sufficiently communicate my FIRE plans with my spouse until much too late.  Instead of a journey of two, I was hiking the trail solo and then just sort of expected her to automatically join me at the end.  And it can potentially take a long time and quite a bit of work on both sides -- lots of talks, sharing, and 2-way dialogue -- for things to come together. 

Thanks for the update Dr. Doom!  I am so happy to hear how things have gone for you two, and I really enjoyed hearing about your method of setting an appointment to talk things over.  I feel like making this kind of arrangement would be beneficial when dealing with many challenges in life, not just FIRE.  It's hard for me to remember that as I become more comfortable with someone, I let some of the most important fundamentals of communication drop away-- when really, that's when I need them most!  This thread provided me with quite a bit of self-learning.

Good luck to you and your wife!

Cassie

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #108 on: August 22, 2014, 02:24:26 PM »
You both did an awesome job of really listening to each other & taking the time to understand one another. I am so happy for you both!!

lhamo

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #109 on: August 22, 2014, 06:41:36 PM »
Whooo hoooo!!!!!  What a great story.  So happy for both of you.

She may find it hard to do, but I would encourage her (and you in support of her) to be as firm about setting reasonable boundaries at work as possible.  The bonus is a nice target, but she shouldn't be killing herself to hold out until March if they are making unreasonable demands on her time that are making your lives miserable.  She has already told them she doesn't really want this new job and they aren't listening.  Fine.  She shouldn't give them any more than the minimum, and should be focusing her attention on planning for the wonderful life you guys are going to have post FIRE. 


Dr. Doom

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #110 on: August 23, 2014, 07:42:27 AM »
Thanks for reading, btw, I'm continually surprised that people are interested in that content, especially given the length. 
I forgot about Ghosts and Goblins until yesterday.

Never forget about Ghosts and Goblins!  NEVER!!! <G> That game was eventually replaced with Kung-Fu, which doesn't have a single zombie in it.  Total bummer.

Dr. Doom

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #111 on: August 23, 2014, 08:01:17 AM »
Dr. Doom - that is a wonderful update and I'm so happy for the both of you! :D

I can't wait to see how this plays out for you both. After reading your blog and the work history (which is highly entertaining btw), I've been rooting for your successful journey to FIRE - and how awesome that the spouse is joining you!

Thanks, FG!  I still can hardly believe it.  This weekend we're starting to get into the nuts and bolts of downsizing, and she's genuinely interested and excited about the process.  Such an amazing thing to be doing this 100% together.

It's hard for me to remember that as I become more comfortable with someone, I let some of the most important fundamentals of communication drop away-- when really, that's when I need them most! 

This is very insightful and is certainly part of what happened with us.  Sometimes we make incorrect assumptions that our partner is on the same wavelength on certain topics so there's no need to have a discussion, and it's difficult to find out later that you were wrong. 

@EV, yeah, I am sort of prepared for a bit of backpedaling at some point, especially if her work-grind lets up and she starts to think her job is 'tolerable' again, but even so, the biggest hurdle has been cleared and we have better communication on this subject now, so I'm totally sure that we'll keep moving in this direction.  She was SO completely pissed at not being able to have visits with our nephews due to weekend work (which she values above just about anything else in life, btw) that I'm hopeful that any potential changes will be slight.

>>be as firm about setting reasonable boundaries at work as possible.

We're trying.  It's a constant challenge.  Much of the weekend stuff relates to a) outages and b) scheduled work that can only be performed off-hours due to service availability requirements (It's IT-type stuff).    It's very difficult to say no to this sort of stuff because it's not strictly project work, and in addition, since she's "management" now, it's simply harder push back.  Agree with your point though, 100%, I support her pushing back - just not sure how successful it's going to be.  She could always take the hard line "Well, if you schedule this work on the weekend, it just ain't getting done" approach but that makes for a hostile environment.  At that point, she's picking poisons.


G-dog

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #112 on: August 23, 2014, 08:57:02 AM »
You both did an awesome job of really listening to each other & taking the time to understand one another. I am so happy for you both!!


+1 and I'll add this is a great example of the benefits of love, patience, tenacity, as well as how easy it is to think you are communicating well, but missing some key element that the other needs to understand.

Congratulations! On both being on the same page now, but more so on how you managed to get there.

I hope to FIRE April 2015  - we should start an annual FIRE party sometime.

kodokan

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #113 on: August 24, 2014, 12:46:20 PM »
Thanks for reading, btw, I'm continually surprised that people are interested in that content, especially given the length.

I'm LOVING the work history story! I've just spent several hours this morning reading it from the start, along with dipping into your other, more financial content. I've been boring on to hubby all day about 'this great new blog I've found, the guy's a terrifically amusing writer, really nails Corporate America... look, I'll send you the link, read it, read it!'

Can't wait to read how your work finishes over the coming months - obviously it's going to be a happy ending, now that you've got some real traction with your wife. Good luck to you both.

Dr. Doom

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #114 on: August 28, 2014, 06:51:37 PM »
You both did an awesome job of really listening to each other & taking the time to understand one another. I am so happy for you both!!


+1 and I'll add this is a great example of the benefits of love, patience, tenacity, as well as how easy it is to think you are communicating well, but missing some key element that the other needs to understand.

Congratulations! On both being on the same page now, but more so on how you managed to get there.

I hope to FIRE April 2015  - we should start an annual FIRE party sometime.

That is so cool.  So next year there should be two threads posted to these boards within days of one another, announcing our respective departures from regular work.  I'm really happy you're almost there.  You must be counting days at this point.  How do I know?  Because I sure as hell am.  Very exciting.

BTW - I'm also glad that some people are enjoying the blog. Thanks for all of the kind words!

HappierAtHome

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #115 on: August 28, 2014, 08:30:28 PM »
Quote
I'm also glad that some people are enjoying the blog. Thanks for all of the kind words!

I read through the entire blog recently and loved it. Now I check for updates just a little too frequently :-P

MsRichLife

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #116 on: August 28, 2014, 08:58:58 PM »
Well done on breaking through the communication barrier with your wife.

I must say, DH and I have been on this journey together and it's wonderful to have someone to get excited with. Now we just need to agree what we are going to do with ourselves once FIREd....travel around the world in slow time OR buy a farmlet!

TomTX

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #117 on: August 30, 2014, 06:36:51 AM »
We're trying.  It's a constant challenge.  Much of the weekend stuff relates to a) outages and b) scheduled work that can only be performed off-hours due to service availability requirements (It's IT-type stuff).    It's very difficult to say no to this sort of stuff because it's not strictly project work, and in addition, since she's "management" now, it's simply harder push back.  Agree with your point though, 100%, I support her pushing back - just not sure how successful it's going to be.  She could always take the hard line "Well, if you schedule this work on the weekend, it just ain't getting done" approach but that makes for a hostile environment.  At that point, she's picking poisons.

As a middle ground, she can just flatly tell them that she's taking off Monday (or Monday/Tuesday) after weekend work. If they "need" her in those days - fine. Start leaving at lunchtime 4 days a week. Or take lunch from 10-2 (siesta!) Whatever.

She can reclaim her time without refusing the weekend work. Might not be ideal, but it's something.

G-dog

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #118 on: August 30, 2014, 06:44:10 AM »
You both did an awesome job of really listening to each other & taking the time to understand one another. I am so happy for you both!!


+1 and I'll add this is a great example of the benefits of love, patience, tenacity, as well as how easy it is to think you are communicating well, but missing some key element that the other needs to understand.

Congratulations! On both being on the same page now, but more so on how you managed to get there.

I hope to FIRE April 2015  - we should start an annual FIRE party sometime.

That is so cool.  So next year there should be two threads posted to these boards within days of one another, announcing our respective departures from regular work.  I'm really happy you're almost there.  You must be counting days at this point.  How do I know?  Because I sure as hell am.  Very exciting.

BTW - I'm also glad that some people are enjoying the blog. Thanks for all of the kind words!

Oh yes - counting the days on a spreadsheet (calendar days, work days, % calendar days left, % work days left).
There is a new job open at work, part of me wants to apply, parts of me just wants to hunker down and finish up.  Though, my SO is not really on board yet and I did say I would look for other jobs.....

HairyUpperLip

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Re: Reader Case Study: Convince SO that I can FIRE (with or without her)
« Reply #119 on: August 30, 2014, 07:44:09 AM »
hey, really enjoying your work experience series on your blog. can't wait for the rest!