Author Topic: Own a car or not? (UK)  (Read 1731 times)

Manchester

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Own a car or not? (UK)
« on: December 02, 2019, 10:34:58 AM »
Hi All,

Looking for your advice.

My current car is leased (pre mustachian and being skint at the time decision).  The lease expires in September next year.  I'm disillusioned with owning a car.  Traffic is always shocking here (Manchester UK), it's terrible for the environment and from next year I'll be working from home full time, so I shouldn't have a commute to contend with.  I've always 'needed a car' as I manage a few accounts and setup my software at new sites across the UK.  With the improvements in technology, I feel I can reduce client visits moving forward.  New business can be geared to 'online installation' which saves time and money for both parties. 

My car 'costs', very roughly, are:

£2500 per year to lease
£750 per year insurance
£600 per year petrol
£200 Misc (wear and tear + servicing)

That totals out at around £4k.  When you take on a new vehicle you usually have to pay a lump sum in the first year on top, which can be anything up to £1k. 


I've always been given a car allowance from work, who also pay for any work-related mileage (and would continue to cover expenses for client visits, whether I travel using public transport etc). 

I could have a public transport/taxi budget of £300 per month and still have more money in my back pocket (with less damage to the environment and more encouragement to exercise).  I don't know what occasions I'd need a taxi for though.  A new tram line is being built around 2 miles away from my house into the city centre for nights out or watching my football team, I get my groceries delivered, use my sister's prime account etc.  If I want to visit friends/family, most of them are walkable or biking distance away and I usually visit them with my fiance who has no plans of going car-free. 

My Fiance drives and has a car, so any joint driving or emergencies we still have access to a car.  She is opposed to the idea as she believes it will put an unnecessary burden on her.  She doesn't like the idea of me taking her car, and leaving her 'stranded' (I'd give her access to my uber account, so she'd still have access to go anywhere, in the off chance I needed her car desperately).  We also plan to start a family after we're married this summer.  So having a car might make trecking children around more luxurious if we have two cars at our disposal.

I could easily afford to replace my car.  I could buy one tomorrow if I wanted, so should my trial go tits up, I've always got that option. 

My circle of family and friends are non-mustachian and wouldn't get it.  I've tried explaining the maths behind my thinking, but they just think I'm tight.  I'm not bothered by their misconceptions, and it's not my job to try and convert them.  Just adds a bit of context to the debate.  I'll be seen as that guy who can't afford a car so he gets the bus everywhere, as opposed to that guy who actually cares about the environment and his own back pocket. :P

The pros are:

- more money
- lower my carbon footprint
- more exercise

The cons are:

- less flexibility in travelling and a requirement of further organisation
- potential strain on my partner
- social status impacted (LOL)


never give up

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2019, 10:53:39 AM »
It sounds as though you only need to be a one car family at the most and you should at least give it a trial. If it doesnít work out you havenít lost anything.

I walk 25 miles to and from work in a week and love it. Iíve reduced my mileage from 4000 a year to about 1000. Iím not in or around a city so donít have a good public transport system, so canít go car less but would love to.

For friends and family stress the environment/exercise points more than the cost as I agree they wonít understand. If you do what everyone else does youíll get what everyone else gets. Itís good to be different.

shelivesthedream

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2019, 10:59:12 AM »
I am very pro-not-having-a-car. Thus far it has been a priority for us. The possibility of having to buy a car is the major thorn in the side of our move-to-the-woods plan...and even then we're wondering if there are reasonable ways round it.

Three suggestions have I for you:

1. Don't get a new car when your lease runs out. As you note, you can always get one later. It's much easier to not have a car at all than to have a car and "try" not to use it. If you do find yourselves having children when expected, you can always get a car then...or not. We have a toddler and another one on the way and have no use for a car at present.

2. Don't borrow your fiancee's car ever. She's clearly not happy with it. Don't try to persuade her that it'll be fine or she can take an Uber. YOU can take an Uber. YOU'RE the one giving up YOUR car. Let her do whatever she wants with hers and don't touch it, or your carlessness will become an issue.

3. Don't try to explain the maths to anyone. Tell them, in a totally casual way, that you're trying out not having a car for environmental reasons - then change the subject. It's true, it's a popular trend at the moment, something that they will understand (if not sympathise with), and if you can say it in a slightly self-deprecating way they won't feel like you're getting at them. I do this with all sorts of things. "Yeah, we don't eat out much because of my food intolerances. Sucks to be me, right! Anyway, do you want to come over to ours instead?" "Hah, can you imagine me behind the wheel of a car? I'm the world's safest and most annoying driver - you'd never want to be stuck behind me! I just find driving really stressful, to be honest, so I've never wanted to have a car." "I buy all of ToddlerSLTD's clothes on eBay. I can do it quickly on the laptop while he naps. He grows out of them so quickly I find it easier to just buy a big bundle in his size and not have to go to the shops and browse. It's not like he has serious preferences anyway!" I just find another (true) reason that makes it seem like a personal preference and give that instead.

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2019, 03:40:24 AM »
Thanks for the advice guys.

@never give up 'if you do what everyone else does, you'll get what everyone else gets' is a brilliant statement.   

@shelivesthedream I'll adhere to your advice, especially on point 2... happy wife, happy life. :P 

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2019, 04:01:41 AM »
We don't own a car and live in a city in Italy where pretty much everyone owns a car.  We also have 2 kids who we ferry around on public transport or sometimes taxis or car sharing, if really necessary.  Most of our friends own cars which they only use on weekends or very occasionally, which just seems like a waste to me.  The attitude here is "but you have to own a car!" even if you very seldom use it.  Everything is within walking or public transport distance from us - kids' schools, supermarket, fruit and veg markets, our workplaces, doctors etc. My husband works weekends so we very rarely get to go away for the weekend - so we use either train or flixbus for our weekend trips within Italy.  If he didn't work weekends, we might consider car ownership I guess just so that we could go to cool places that aren't train or bus accessible.

The main thing we have to deal with is peer pressure and incredulousness that we don't own a car from others around us.  People are just amazed that we are able to get around on public transport or foot especially with kids - even though they do this themselves 90% of the time due to lack of parking here.  Owning a car is a 'keeping up with the Joneses' thing here.  So I'd say ignore all the naysayers and do what you want to do.  Use carsharing, public transport and your bike and see how it goes.  It's a huge cost saving and also makes you (and any future kids) fitter as well. 

Imma

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2019, 04:18:52 AM »
Thanks for the advice guys.

@never give up 'if you do what everyone else does, you'll get what everyone else gets' is a brilliant statement.   

@shelivesthedream I'll adhere to your advice, especially on point 2... happy wife, happy life. :P

We don't own a car either and for about a year we shared one bike, because basically my s/o was too cheap to replace his stolen one. This eventually became a serious issue in our relationship, which I had never expected to happen. He was totally right that one bike would be theoretically enough because I take the bus to work, but it's MY bike that I want to be able to use WHEN I like, bought with MY money. And I don't want to come home to find it gone because HE wanted to go someplace suddenly. I really hated him taking it to work because they don't have a secure place to park it. Long story short, it brought out a possesive streak in me that I didn't know I hate. He scratched it one night when he had a few drinks and that's when he decided the one bike experiment was over.

I can totally imagine that your fiancee has the same feelings about you wanting to use her car because you're too cheap to replace yours. Becoming a one car family and truly sharing a car only works when it's a joint decision. What are her feelings about mustachianism?

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2019, 04:45:17 AM »
We don't own a car and live in a city in Italy where pretty much everyone owns a car.  We also have 2 kids who we ferry around on public transport or sometimes taxis or car sharing, if really necessary.  Most of our friends own cars which they only use on weekends or very occasionally, which just seems like a waste to me.  The attitude here is "but you have to own a car!" even if you very seldom use it.  Everything is within walking or public transport distance from us - kids' schools, supermarket, fruit and veg markets, our workplaces, doctors etc. My husband works weekends so we very rarely get to go away for the weekend - so we use either train or flixbus for our weekend trips within Italy.  If he didn't work weekends, we might consider car ownership I guess just so that we could go to cool places that aren't train or bus accessible.

The main thing we have to deal with is peer pressure and incredulousness that we don't own a car from others around us.  People are just amazed that we are able to get around on public transport or foot especially with kids - even though they do this themselves 90% of the time due to lack of parking here.  Owning a car is a 'keeping up with the Joneses' thing here.  So I'd say ignore all the naysayers and do what you want to do.  Use carsharing, public transport and your bike and see how it goes.  It's a huge cost saving and also makes you (and any future kids) fitter as well.

What part of Italy are you in (if you don't mind me asking).  The people in your town sound similar to those in mine.  I have a family member who drives less than 10 miles a week (mostly journeys to and from the gym ironically).  She wants to lease a brand new Range Rover.  It makes me feel all fidgity thinking about the wasted expense and damage to the environment caused by the need to feel like you're 'cock of the road'.

Arian

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2019, 05:24:53 AM »
Could you have a 'no-car' trial for a couple of weeks a few months before your lease ends? That way you would see if it's achievable and have time to acquire a car before your lease ends if you do need one.

I have been tempted to get rid of our second car for a couple of years. I tend to walk everywhere and only use the car maybe once or twice a week. It's frustrating taxing and insuring a vehicle that gets so little use. I don't know why but my husband seems  quite reluctant to the idea. We did share one car years ago before we had kids and we were working in the same city. That worked well and we saved a fair bit of money.
 

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2019, 05:25:23 AM »
Thanks for the advice guys.

@never give up 'if you do what everyone else does, you'll get what everyone else gets' is a brilliant statement.   

@shelivesthedream I'll adhere to your advice, especially on point 2... happy wife, happy life. :P

We don't own a car either and for about a year we shared one bike, because basically my s/o was too cheap to replace his stolen one. This eventually became a serious issue in our relationship, which I had never expected to happen. He was totally right that one bike would be theoretically enough because I take the bus to work, but it's MY bike that I want to be able to use WHEN I like, bought with MY money. And I don't want to come home to find it gone because HE wanted to go someplace suddenly. I really hated him taking it to work because they don't have a secure place to park it. Long story short, it brought out a possesive streak in me that I didn't know I hate. He scratched it one night when he had a few drinks and that's when he decided the one bike experiment was over.

I can totally imagine that your fiancee has the same feelings about you wanting to use her car because you're too cheap to replace yours. Becoming a one car family and truly sharing a car only works when it's a joint decision. What are her feelings about mustachianism?

I don't mean to be rude, but this made me laugh.  I can imagine a Dutch couple going mad at each other because one of you keeps borrowing the other's bike.  I can understand it must annoy you, but I don't think it would bother me personally.  :')

I'm not a possessive person at all.  I moved homes a lot as a child, shared everything with my brother, in 26 years of life I've never had my own bedroom etc.  I'm the type of person that, should I return home and my S/O had taken my bike, I'd just shrug my shoulders and come up with a new plan.

My S/O isn't mustachian by a long way.  However, she doesn't covet materialistic things.  She rarely buys new clothes, she's happy to do DIY around the house, she doesn't drink/go on nights out etc.  She does value our social status, she'd be slightly 'embarrassed' if her family thought I stopped driving because I couldn't afford a car.  The way she see's it is 'we have more money than ever before, so why should I hinder myself by not getting a car?'

We have quite a high household income, for our ages I'd presume we're in the top 10% easily, so she thinks we can afford luxuries and still FIRE - but the speed of reaching that goal is where we differ. 

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2019, 05:36:56 AM »
Could you have a 'no-car' trial for a couple of weeks a few months before your lease ends? That way you would see if it's achievable and have time to acquire a car before your lease ends if you do need one.

I have been tempted to get rid of our second car for a couple of years. I tend to walk everywhere and only use the car maybe once or twice a week. It's frustrating taxing and insuring a vehicle that gets so little use. I don't know why but my husband seems  quite reluctant to the idea. We did share one car years ago before we had kids and we were working in the same city. That worked well and we saved a fair bit of money.

I suppose I could.  I've been put off doing something like that because I'd be paying for my car as well as public transport.  Whenever there's an option to walk I take it.  I car share quite a bit with my brother already.  I use public transport to go and see my football team etc. From Jan/Feb I will be working from home 5 days a week.  Currently I work from an office around 2 or 3 days per week.  So it would make more sense to try it next year.

My plan was to return my car in September and see how long I can last before I crack.  If it impacts my life too much I could go to one of the many dealers in my area and buy one in cash.  I don't think leasing is the best idea financially, but I could easily spend £150 pcm and still be around £100 pcm better off.

afterthedark

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #10 on: December 03, 2019, 06:36:41 AM »
About 6 years ago I realised my intention to leave the car at home and take the train wasnít going to happen while I had to pass the car in the drive and spend more time, energy and money to get to work. So I sold my car and did the experiment you are thinking about, with the same thought that if it didnít work out Iíd buy another car. Before I sold the car I worked out how much I would save a month, making sure to include extra money I might need for supermarket deliveries or a certain number of taxis or hire cars. Six years later I still donít have a car. 

I agree with the advice to not use your partners car at all barring a genuine life threatening emergency. Show them how little impact it has and they may come round to the idea. Of course deciding what to do when you go out together might be tricky, but maybe that is less of an issue as you wonít be leaving them potentially stranded.

Regarding everyone elseís opinion, I agree that telling them it is for environmental reasons or to get fit from the exercise can be better than cost cutting. But what Iím realising more as I get older is how much of our lives we spend concerned with what others are thinking about us (or we think they are thinking about us) and what a waste that is. Even if people comment on your choices, that is often more to do with them feeling judged because you make a different choice to them and that is their problem.

Imma

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2019, 06:45:47 AM »
Thanks for the advice guys.

@never give up 'if you do what everyone else does, you'll get what everyone else gets' is a brilliant statement.   

@shelivesthedream I'll adhere to your advice, especially on point 2... happy wife, happy life. :P

We don't own a car either and for about a year we shared one bike, because basically my s/o was too cheap to replace his stolen one. This eventually became a serious issue in our relationship, which I had never expected to happen. He was totally right that one bike would be theoretically enough because I take the bus to work, but it's MY bike that I want to be able to use WHEN I like, bought with MY money. And I don't want to come home to find it gone because HE wanted to go someplace suddenly. I really hated him taking it to work because they don't have a secure place to park it. Long story short, it brought out a possesive streak in me that I didn't know I hate. He scratched it one night when he had a few drinks and that's when he decided the one bike experiment was over.

I can totally imagine that your fiancee has the same feelings about you wanting to use her car because you're too cheap to replace yours. Becoming a one car family and truly sharing a car only works when it's a joint decision. What are her feelings about mustachianism?

I don't mean to be rude, but this made me laugh.  I can imagine a Dutch couple going mad at each other because one of you keeps borrowing the other's bike.  I can understand it must annoy you, but I don't think it would bother me personally.  :')

I'm not a possessive person at all.  I moved homes a lot as a child, shared everything with my brother, in 26 years of life I've never had my own bedroom etc.  I'm the type of person that, should I return home and my S/O had taken my bike, I'd just shrug my shoulders and come up with a new plan.

My S/O isn't mustachian by a long way.  However, she doesn't covet materialistic things.  She rarely buys new clothes, she's happy to do DIY around the house, she doesn't drink/go on nights out etc.  She does value our social status, she'd be slightly 'embarrassed' if her family thought I stopped driving because I couldn't afford a car.  The way she see's it is 'we have more money than ever before, so why should I hinder myself by not getting a car?'

We have quite a high household income, for our ages I'd presume we're in the top 10% easily, so she thinks we can afford luxuries and still FIRE - but the speed of reaching that goal is where we differ.

Yeah I mentioned the story because it's silly, but it was real. And I'm usually laid back and I don't care about posessions at all. But my bike is really pretty and comfortable and it wasn't cheap and it's the first bike I ever bought new. In other countries kids maybe dream about their first car, but I dreamed about my first non-crap bike for years and I'm not going to let some guy ruin it by riding it home from the pub and damaging it. And sometimes when I come home late after a long day at work I just don't want to walk allll the way to the supermarket to get food because someone else overslept and missed the bus to work. (I'm not normally a drama queen :) )
Sometimes such complicated feelings are behind our small daily disagreements.

Of course as hardcore mustachians we are living very extreme lifestyles that sound like deprivation to others. It's important that you're both basically frugal, but apparantly she's a bit more concerned about social status than you are. You could maybe frame it as a mostly environmental thing, rather than being cheap? Being green is quite trendy these days. Maybe that makes it easier to accept for her. If I were you I would try it for a while and see how life is without a car. If it really doesn't work out you can always get another car, maybe a small, older economic car bought for cash. That would already be a lot cheaper than the current situation.

So far my bike is my only status symbol - we live in a former council house :) I would recommend a decent council estate to everyone wanting to live a car-less lifestyle because most things you need in daily life are within walking distance. We chose to buy in this area specifically so we could go without a car. Living in the right place really makes it so much easier.

Hula Hoop

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #12 on: December 03, 2019, 07:35:59 AM »
So far my bike is my only status symbol - we live in a former council house :) I would recommend a decent council estate to everyone wanting to live a car-less lifestyle because most things you need in daily life are within walking distance. We chose to buy in this area specifically so we could go without a car. Living in the right place really makes it so much easier.

I agree.  We bought our place in a heavily immigrant but very central neighborhood for the same reasons.  It's relatively inexpensive, near all kinds of useful things and public transport and as an extra bonus we can get excellent home made tofu or Bangladeshi spices all within walking distance.

MatthewK

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #13 on: December 03, 2019, 09:50:44 AM »
ptf

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2019, 12:09:41 AM »
I agree that you shouldn't be using your fiancee's car. Be ready to discuss how she wants to deal with joint driving trips and err on the side of being super-generous and kind. Should you buy insurance to drive her car if you go away for a week to share the driving or does she prefer that you don't drive her car and you rent a joint car? Should you pay for both train tickets if you get the train somewhere?

I get the issue about what other people think; I do think that people will understand the environmental concern. Some others you could try:
I'm waiting for a proper self-driving car
Waiting for better electric cars
Safer/healthier for potential kids
More exercise for you
More exercise/independence for potential kids
Parking two cars is a nightmare where we live.

Having said all that: if you are keen on reducing spending and/or FIRE, this will not be the only time that you make a decision that people might comment on or that you feel judged about. Maybe this is a perfect time to find out who reacts well to your choice and who doesn't need to hear too much about your other plans or changes.

If someone really thinks less of you because you don't have a car, isn't it a gift to know that sooner rather than later so that you can re-evaluate the relationship.

SpreadsheetMan

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2019, 12:46:36 AM »
Good advice from SLTD.

My wife and I have only ever had one car as she has always been able to cycle to work. If she has needed a car for some reason I work from home, cycle or get the bus, itís not a problem when living in an urban area.

If you can get away with not having a car why not try it? Nothing is lost if it doesnít work out.

Linea_Norway

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2019, 04:33:53 AM »
I thought I wrote a reply here yesterday, but can't find it back.

You could consider buying a carrier bike: https://www.bakfiets.com/ either electric or not. There are even options for transporting young children in these in a safe way, when they are old enough for that.

I totally understand Imma's feelings about her bike being borrowed. If your main personal transportation device often is borrowed by someone else without making an appointment first, that is really annoying and inconvenient. And a bike is certainly a thing that is so easily replaced in a potentially cheap way.

So please don't use your GF's car unless she offers to use it during a trip for you both.

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2019, 02:55:47 AM »
About 6 years ago I realised my intention to leave the car at home and take the train wasnít going to happen while I had to pass the car in the drive and spend more time, energy and money to get to work. So I sold my car and did the experiment you are thinking about, with the same thought that if it didnít work out Iíd buy another car. Before I sold the car I worked out how much I would save a month, making sure to include extra money I might need for supermarket deliveries or a certain number of taxis or hire cars. Six years later I still donít have a car. 

I agree with the advice to not use your partners car at all barring a genuine life threatening emergency. Show them how little impact it has and they may come round to the idea. Of course deciding what to do when you go out together might be tricky, but maybe that is less of an issue as you wonít be leaving them potentially stranded.

Regarding everyone elseís opinion, I agree that telling them it is for environmental reasons or to get fit from the exercise can be better than cost cutting. But what Iím realising more as I get older is how much of our lives we spend concerned with what others are thinking about us (or we think they are thinking about us) and what a waste that is. Even if people comment on your choices, that is often more to do with them feeling judged because you make a different choice to them and that is their problem.

Great Advice, thanks!

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2019, 03:57:59 AM »
I agree that you shouldn't be using your fiancee's car. Be ready to discuss how she wants to deal with joint driving trips and err on the side of being super-generous and kind. Should you buy insurance to drive her car if you go away for a week to share the driving or does she prefer that you don't drive her car and you rent a joint car? Should you pay for both train tickets if you get the train somewhere?

I get the issue about what other people think; I do think that people will understand the environmental concern. Some others you could try:
I'm waiting for a proper self-driving car
Waiting for better electric cars
Safer/healthier for potential kids
More exercise for you
More exercise/independence for potential kids
Parking two cars is a nightmare where we live.

Having said all that: if you are keen on reducing spending and/or FIRE, this will not be the only time that you make a decision that people might comment on or that you feel judged about. Maybe this is a perfect time to find out who reacts well to your choice and who doesn't need to hear too much about your other plans or changes.

If someone really thinks less of you because you don't have a car, isn't it a gift to know that sooner rather than later so that you can re-evaluate the relationship.

Thanks, that's some great advice. 

Funnily enough, when I'm added onto her policy, it actually reduces the annual cost of her insurance.  Perhaps I'll contribute some money to this as a token gesture to sweeten her up.  Whenever we go anywhere in the car together, I usually drive her car.  I also buy her petrol every now and again, so the joint trips won't be an issue.  I agree with most posters about seeking other arrangements when I'm travelling alone though.


Linea_Norway

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2019, 04:01:56 AM »
<snip>
Whenever we go anywhere in the car together, I usually drive her car.  I also buy her petrol every now and again, so the joint trips won't be an issue.  I agree with most posters about seeking other arrangements when I'm travelling alone though.

If you drive on visits, she can drink alcohol, which is an advantage for her if she wants to do that. So this might be a nice arrangement for her.

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #20 on: December 06, 2019, 08:01:02 AM »
<snip>
Whenever we go anywhere in the car together, I usually drive her car.  I also buy her petrol every now and again, so the joint trips won't be an issue.  I agree with most posters about seeking other arrangements when I'm travelling alone though.

If you drive on visits, she can drink alcohol, which is an advantage for her if she wants to do that. So this might be a nice arrangement for her.

I'll offer that to her... but she's teetotal!  Doesn't drink, smoke or take drugs.  She's a cheap date on a night out haha.  She isn't an overly confident driver though, she prefers it when I drive.  It's a good excuse for me to not go mad on the expensive alcoholic drinks when we go out. :)

afterthedark

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #21 on: December 09, 2019, 09:01:05 AM »
Another option is car share schemes. You may have more choice than this but Enterprise is available in my local town so I looked that up and they are in Manchester as well https://www.enterprisecarclub.co.uk/gb/en/programs/regions/north-west-england/manchester.html?gclid=CPu9z4L2qOYCFVd_GwodYQkKcw&gclsrc=ds. I manage with the train, so Iíve not worked out the pros and cons, but could be worth a look.

Manchester

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2019, 04:02:40 AM »
Another option is car share schemes. You may have more choice than this but Enterprise is available in my local town so I looked that up and they are in Manchester as well https://www.enterprisecarclub.co.uk/gb/en/programs/regions/north-west-england/manchester.html?gclid=CPu9z4L2qOYCFVd_GwodYQkKcw&gclsrc=ds. I manage with the train, so Iíve not worked out the pros and cons, but could be worth a look.

I took a look at this and got quite excited.  I have an enterprise within walking distance of my house.  Sadly, they aren't part of the scheme and my 'local' centre would require using pub transport.  :/

It's a great idea though.

Linea_Norway

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2019, 09:34:04 AM »
After today's hassle with one of our cars, I again vote for no car if you live so central that you don't need it. Everything you own, ends up owning you as well. And a car is one of big things that can cause trouble and expenses. We have decided to ditch one of our cars to be done with the hassle. But even that is a process which causes me stress.

afterthedark

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Re: Own a car or not? (UK)
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2019, 12:08:14 PM »
After today's hassle with one of our cars, I again vote for no car if you live so central that you don't need it. Everything you own, ends up owning you as well. And a car is one of big things that can cause trouble and expenses. We have decided to ditch one of our cars to be done with the hassle. But even that is a process which causes me stress.

Thatís exactly how I felt about owning (and selling) a car. Taking public transport can have challenges as well, but I find them easier to deal with.

Another option is car share schemes. You may have more choice than this but Enterprise is available in my local town so I looked that up and they are in Manchester as well https://www.enterprisecarclub.co.uk/gb/en/programs/regions/north-west-england/manchester.html?gclid=CPu9z4L2qOYCFVd_GwodYQkKcw&gclsrc=ds. I manage with the train, so Iíve not worked out the pros and cons, but could be worth a look.

I took a look at this and got quite excited.  I have an enterprise within walking distance of my house.  Sadly, they aren't part of the scheme and my 'local' centre would require using pub transport.  :/

It's a great idea though.

Iím not sure pub transport is the responsible option in this day and age when drink driving is frowned on.