Author Topic: Not Bailing Out My Parents  (Read 3774 times)

JLTinVA

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 23
Not Bailing Out My Parents
« on: March 17, 2019, 02:28:06 PM »
Not sure where to post this. I donít know if Iím looking for advice or encouragement or if I just need to vent to internet strangers who wonít judge me (or at least I wonít know if youíre judging me).

My parents are terrible with money. They always have been. They have never made much, and they spend all that they make (and more). They declared bankruptcy when I was about 8 years old. Then they got into significant credit card debt when I was in my late 20s, at which point my husband and I bailed them out to the tune of $43,000 (we also paid their taxes one year, paid for my grandmotherís funeral, and paid for my brotherís rehearsal dinner (as they were going to charge it and refused to tell him they couldn't swing it)). Now here we are in our early 40s, and they have somehow gotten themselves into $122,000 of debt (home equity line and credit cards). The monthly minimum payments on their debt is greater than their monthly income. They canít (wonít) declare bankruptcy because they are part owners in a family cottage (with my motherís siblings) that is sacrosanct: they refuse to sell their share of it, the other owners are also broke and canít buy them out, and none of them owners wants to be the first to pull the trigger and force a sale of the whole thing. The extent of their debt only became known to me when they needed help buying a stove...then paying a medical bill...then paying their property tax. I finally told them I needed to know the full extent of their financial situation, and got what I think is all of the info about a month ago.

So...we crunched the numbers and told them they need to sell their home to pay off their debts. The house is in terrible condition as none of their money ever went into maintenance or improvementóselling the house would only get them to zero, with nothing left over. Weíre willing to move some of our investments into purchasing a condo that they could live in rent-free (theyíd pay the condo fee). In return for providing them with a basically free place to live, we have asked for oversight/conservatorship of their finances. Their credit cards will be closed, their credit frozen so they canít get new cards, money for the condo fee direct deposited to our account, money for savings direct deposited to an account they donít have access to (to be used for their future health expenses), and they can live on whatever is left (which will be tight, but livable). If we donít do this, history shows they will get themselves right back into this situation.

And they said ďno.Ē Well, they didnít say ďno,Ē but they are giving me the slow no. And theyíre putting pressure on me to give them money immediately to relieve some of the stress. My father actually said to me, ďI have a bill due tomorrow. If I donít get the money today, Iím afraid Iím going to have a heart attack.Ē Not directly asking for money, but trying to guilt me intoóonce againóbeing their ATM. Oh, then I see their latest credit card bill and theyíve spent $100 on wine in the past 3 weeks. They are $122K in debt and are charging wine on their credit cards.

I know Iíve enabled their credit addiction in the past, and I feel guilty for thatómaybe if I hadnít helped so much before, they wouldn't be here now? But I wanted to help because theyíre my parents and I wanted to make life better/easier for them. But this time...Iím not giving them money. I have presented a plan my husband and I are comfortable with which involves significant financial investment for us and very little from them. If they donít take it, thatís on them, not on me.

Right? Because I still feel like shit because I can afford to bail them out and am choosing not to.

Gin1984

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4834
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2019, 02:35:31 PM »
If you bail them out, they will get to a point you CAN'T.  They have already shown you they are getting worse. You are doing nothing wrong by saying no.

terran

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2878
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2019, 03:10:17 PM »
It sounds like you made the wrong choice in the past and you're making the right choice now. Stay strong!

Miss Piggy

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1365
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2019, 03:43:37 PM »
This sounds a lot like dealing with a drug addict. Toughlove is the way to go here. Stay strong!

Paul der Krake

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4861
  • Age: 12
  • Location: UTC-10:00
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2019, 04:22:04 PM »
I hope your Dad doesn't pick up poker, because he clearly has a tendency to overplay his hand.

Freedomin5

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2878
  • Location: China
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2019, 04:56:08 PM »
Actually, you CANíT afford to bail them out. Itís $122k right now. If you bail them out, itíll be $250k in a few years. Stick to your guns and keep repeating your offer of the condo. If they want help from you, they receive it on your terms. They are in no position to negotiate with you in terms of the type of financial help they receive from you and the terms and conditions attached to that help.

Reynolds531

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 299
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #6 on: March 17, 2019, 05:07:42 PM »
If you are able to implement your plan, I have zero doubt in a couple of months they will unfreeze the credit and start over. Lots of people like this in my family.

seemsright

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 281
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #7 on: March 17, 2019, 05:08:51 PM »
It is crystal clear you got the best thing from your parents...you learned what not to do with money.

Please do not think it is your place to bail them out AGAIN! Save your sanity and DO NOT do it again.


I got the magic of learning what not to do from my parents. And in '03 my parents tried to force my hand into giving them money and at the same time impacted my marriage...I chose to put my marriage first and decided that my mental health was important and that was the last time I have spoke to them.

You are going to have to put up hard boundaries with them and do not back down. Your sanity and your wealth is worth it..

Catbert

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1817
  • Location: Southern California
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #8 on: March 17, 2019, 05:34:12 PM »
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/playing-with-fire-is-getting-burned/

Hold firm.  You've already done plenty.  Read this horrifying journal ever time you start to weaken. 

They won't mean to but they will continue to fuck you over.

pbkmaine

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8268
  • Age: 63
  • Location: The Villages, Florida
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #9 on: March 17, 2019, 05:47:10 PM »
It’s never going to stop until you stop it. They will never be sensible with money.

nyfireguy

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 15
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #10 on: March 17, 2019, 05:55:28 PM »
I agree with all of the above.. I have had to put my foot down in a similar situation, not as much debt related but lack of $$ and an unwillingness to earn. You can only do so much and you've done more..

Being you don't want to just cut them off, which I get, I'd make, reluctantly, one last offer of the condo and explain, once again, this is the only option that involves you.

However I will agree with one of the other posters, they will re-open lines of credit and probably figure out a way to NOT pay the fees which you'll end up stuck with 

GizmoTX

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1444
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2019, 10:34:25 PM »
No. Absolutely no. Itís the only way they will learn.

Frankies Girl

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3190
  • Age: 82
  • Location: The laboratory
  • Ghouls Just Wanna Have Funds!
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2019, 10:54:22 PM »
You love them. We all know this, they know it. They also know that because you love them, they can use that love to manipulate and use you to patch up their grossly neglectful spending.

You need to stop bailing them out because until you do, they won't stop being assholes about money. Until they face actual consequences, they have no reason to stop. You bailing them out gives them the license to keep being spendthrifts. You are part of the problem - so step out of it and tell them. Do not buy a house or anything for them. Do not take control of their finances. Do not do anything other than offer to help them sort things and make phone calls or internet research. They are not helpless and you should not be taking over as their parent because they are helpless little children, and if you did do this... you know that they will be angry and resentful of your control even if it was "for their own good" right? Stop it. Just stop.

I'd suggest a hard line in the sand starting now. You've already tried the pay for their mistakes and bills and shit. It didn't work and they obviously didn't appreciate it or feel the least bit embarrassed about it because they not only did not change at all, they got even more in debt and now your father is using blackmail and emotional manipulation to try to get you to pay his bills - as soon as the words about that bullshit "likely going to have a heart attack if this bill isn't paid" left his lips, I would have told him he should be ashamed that he would stoop so low as to try to make his poor decisions and irresponsibility your problem after all you'd done before, and threatening to have a heart attack is just childish and disgusting behavior. And I would have told him that at this point, you'll be happy to call the ambulance or take notes in the emergency room if he's unconscious, but he better never use that sort of gross manipulation on you again or the relationship is over with. And I'd also tell him that he needs to have a serious think on how terrible he's treated you and taken advantage of your love and generosity over the years and this is the straw that may be the breaking of the relationship - that he values his stupid wine and insane spending more than his relationship with his daughter? Oh hell no.


Now that may sound really cold, but what he's doing to you is stone cold manipulative and using you like the Bank of Daughter is WRONG.

If you don't end up strong enough to have that type of convo (above) then you still need to tell them the Bank of Daughter is closed. So nicely:

Mom & Dad, I love you and I'm so sorry things are difficult right now for you, but going forward I am no longer able to give you any more money or bail you out of debts you've incurred. There are agencies out there that can help you find a cheap subsidized place to live if you lose your current housing, and I can help you research debt consolidation and other state/government assistance programs when I have time, but I can't afford to gift you more money or provide any financial assistance any more. You are adults and you are the ones that made this huge problem and aren't taking any steps to fix things for yourselves because you expect me to keep fronting the money to bail you out each time. But I can't be your safety net any more because I am draining my own earnings and endangering my own future to keep doing this over and over again for you. This is hurting me and hurting our relationship and I just can't do this any more. I'm sorry but that's how things are going to be going forward. Please don't try to guilt me or say things like you're going to have a heart attack if this or that doesn't get paid. That is childish and manipulative and I won't entertain any conversations that contain these types of threats or guilt trips.


I'd suggest you try reading a few books (check your local library!) by Susan Forward: Toxic Parents and Emotional Blackmail. There are several others that are great to read, but those two should be easy and fast to get through and help you to see clearly what is going on and how to break that dysfunctional cycle.

This is NOT the same thing as helping out a relative that has had unexpected bad luck or a series of terrible things happen. Of course you'd be there for a friend or family member if you could. But in your parents' case, they are spoiled babies that need to stop being lazy regarding their spending habits and make some hard choices about what is actually a want and what is a need. And they also need to learn that sometimes they don't get to have everything they want exactly when they want it just because they demanded it to be so. If they want to spend like they're rich, they themselves need to be RICH. Simple as that.
« Last Edit: March 20, 2020, 11:01:23 PM by Frankies Girl »

MrThatsDifferent

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1863
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2019, 12:05:09 AM »
I insist, INSIST, that you get the book Co-dependent No More by Melody Beattie. Read it front to back first, please!

Your parents have a spending addiction and you canít keep contributing. Their bills, their consequences. Youíve already gone above and beyond. They have assets, itís time the feel the burn, which is a shame, but not your problem.

JLTinVA

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 23
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #14 on: March 18, 2019, 07:54:00 AM »
Thank you all for the advice and support. I tell myself the same things, but sometimes the "they're your parents, you need to help them" voice in my heart overwhelms the rational voice in my head. Hearing that rational voice amplified here has been extremely helpful. And it's been so much cheaper than a therapist :-)

I guess I never really knew (or admitted to) the extent of their spending addiction. For far too long, I bought into the story they tell themselves about how it's not their fault, they have terrible luck, and blah blah blah. I know there is an addiction, coupled with untreated depression in my Dad. They are far beyond anything I have the ability to fix, no matter how much I may want to.

@Frankies Girl, your response in particular was so helpful to me. I swear I've memorized these responses so I'm ready the next time (and there will be a next time) he tries that kind of bullshit. I'm also looking at the books you and @MrThatsDifferent have recommended.

A heartfelt thanks to all for reading and responding. You have no idea how much better I feel.

SimpleCycle

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1033
  • Location: Chicago
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2019, 09:36:23 AM »
Frankie's Girl really nailed it here.  I also was going to recommend Co-Dependent No More.  You have already bailed them out a ton, and their behavior and situation has just gotten worse.  You should not fix this for them, other than providing logistical help and guidance, and only if they ask for it.  Stay strong, you can do this.

BNgarden

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 209
  • Location: Alberta
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2019, 09:49:42 AM »
You may also find this book useful (in particular, you have the right to change your mind):
The Assertive Option: Your Rights and Responsibilities
by Patricia Jakubowski.

It's old enough that it may be in the library (unless they cull regularly) or in 2nd hand shops.

I would mentally at least 'rescind' the offer of a condo.  You may need to verbalize this in future, but "I've changed my mind" is a complete and sufficient phrase if they ask why.

SunshineAZ

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 200
  • Location: SE Arizona
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #17 on: March 18, 2019, 09:52:51 AM »
You have received some good advice, I hope you can stay strong.  I don't really have anything to add, except to say that I am sorry they are trying to take advantage of you.  My family is pretty bad with money, I tried helping some out in the past and quickly learned that it just enables more bad decisions.  (And, to add insult to injury, they resent you for it.)  They now know that they can come to me for advice, but I will not give them money. 

frugalfoothills

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 274
  • Age: 30
    • Bulls, Bears and Beers
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #18 on: March 18, 2019, 10:09:11 AM »
There's a thread of mine floating around here somewhere about a close friend of mine (who lives with me actually) and my attempts to "help" her with her dumpster fire of finances. All it got me was thousands of dollars in back rent that I will never be paid and a good bit of resentment toward her for taking advantage of my love and kindness again and again. I made tons of excuses for her over the years as to why she couldn't get it together... lied to myself about her ability to change, lied to myself about her willingness to change, lied to myself about her manipulation of me, etc.

I gave her a pass on literally THOUSANDS of dollars in rent because, in my mind, I was helping her dig herself out of her financial hole... obviously since she wasn't paying rent she would be able to use that money to pay off debt and start saving.

Spoiler: she did NOT use that money to pay off any debt, she defaulted on her existing debts, AND she incurred more debt to the tune of $36K by buying a new truck.

We had a few heart to hearts and I offered to help her with her finances by looking over her entire situation, assessing the damage, creating a budget, and setting up an Adulting for Dummies monthly schedule for her bills/debt payments. I assumed that she just lacked knowledge and understanding and that once I provided this foolproof plan for her to improve her situation (which, by the way, still allowed her SIX HUNDRED DOLLARS A MONTH for "fun" spending), she would take this opportunity and hit the ground running to get her shit together.

Spoiler: she did not do any of that, she continued on with her terrible habits, and just this weekend she left a letter out on the counter from a collector for a NEW card that she got, maxed out, and got sent to collections since our last talk.

We are in a much better place these days, but that's only because I set boundaries FOR MYSELF. I decided that as long as she pays me rent each month then it's not my business if she files bankruptcy at 30, gets her truck repossessed, and doesn't save a dime in the process. I love her and wish she would do better for herself, but loving her doesn't mean that it's my problem to fix her. If I take stock of all the "help" I gave her over the years it sadly all amounted to nothing... in fact, her situation got worse during my help, AND it was to my own detriment (did I mention she owes me thousands of dollars?)

I am sorry you are in this situation. I can't imagine how much more difficult it is when the manipulators are your parents. I just wanted you to know that I do understand your desire to want to help them and even the multiple "wrong" decisions you've made to actually help them over the years, because I've made similar choices. But it's best to just cut your losses, admit defeat, and set your boundaries. For me, my boundary was "I will forgive your past transgressions IF you pay me rent every single month going forward. BUT if you do not do this, you will need to find a new place to live, even though we are friends." Maybe your boundary is "I will help you stop the bleeding by freezing your cards, helping you sell your house, and even subsidize your living situation while you pay off your own debts. BUT if you do not do this, I will not help you sort out any part of this mess, and you will have to work it out on your own."

Good luck! It's a shit situation.

FINate

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1697
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #19 on: March 18, 2019, 10:52:24 AM »
Over the past several decades there's been an increase in parents thinking and acting as if they have a peer relationship with their young kids, rather than a parent-child relationship focused on leading their kids to an independent adult life. Often (though not always) resulting in kids struggling to transitioning to break free in adulthood. I know this first hand because my in-laws are this way, treating their kids as extensions of themselves while never preparing them to be self-sufficient. To this day my FIL continues to attempt to manipulate his middle aged children. They are well into adulthood yet he does not treat them as peers, instead treats them as part of his immediate family. Not sure if this applies directly to your case, but bring it up for two reasons.

First of all, give your 20-something self some grace. Family dynamics are so ingrained that it's almost impossible to see clearly what's happening as a young adult. There's no need to feel shame or guilt for bailing them out in the past. Think of it as a learning experience (albeit an expensive one) where you woke up to the reality of your parent's behavior and expectations. Use this experience to stiffen your spine for the difficult conversations ahead.

Second, do not entangle your finances with your parents in any way. Do not buy them a condo. Do not take over their finances. Do not bail them out. This will only reinforce their expectation that your purpose is to manipulated and used as they see fit.

One final note: be proactive with the conversation and don't wait passively for the next situation. By taking the initiative you will set the agenda for the conversation, far better than being blind-sided unexpectedly. If they are close enough to meet in-person, then have them over to your place for coffee to discuss the situation. Having them in your house is intentional - your home, your space, you set the agenda. Don't let bygones be bygones. Not saying you should hold a grudge, but you have history and baggage that needs to be addressed and you shouldn't wait until the next "I'm going to have a heart attack if you don't give us money" moment - nip this in the bud ASAP.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2019, 01:13:52 PM by FINate »

Linea_Norway

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6750
  • Location: Norway
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #20 on: March 18, 2019, 12:36:31 PM »
You have my full support for not bailing them out again. You hve done more than they deserve already. You are not their ATM.
+1 for not providing them a free house to live. That is still a way of financing their lifestyle. You can help them by making a budget, that they will probably ignore.
They have turned your offer down. You don't need to keep that same offer open forever. Please get yourself less financially involved with your parents.

Car Jack

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1630
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #21 on: March 18, 2019, 01:09:18 PM »
Your parents' finances equate to the Titanic.  They are begging for soap so they can clean the deck.  What the hell do they need to clean the deck for......they're going into the North Atlantic.

Do not buy them a condo.  Advise them to sell first the shared vacation place.  Then, they should sell their house.  Then they should rent.  Ok.....let's come out of dreamland.  They'll do none of that.  Perhaps they'll take $500 that you'd give them and buy lottery tickets.

You should give them zero.  If your father says "If you don't give me this money, I'm going to have a heart attack", calmly reply "Would you like me to drive you to the hospital or will you be able to call your own ambulance?".  That's classic guilting manipulation.  Come on...he's not 6.  Will you give him money if he threatens to hold his breath until he turns blue?

Your alternative should be clear.  When you get paid, hand your entire paycheck to your parents.  I think door #1.....give them nothing.....is the winning solution.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2019, 01:11:35 PM by Car Jack »

civil4life

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 441
    • My Journal
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #22 on: March 18, 2019, 01:11:36 PM »
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/playing-with-fire-is-getting-burned/

Hold firm.  You've already done plenty.  Read this horrifying journal ever time you start to weaken. 

They won't mean to but they will continue to fuck you over.

As soon as I read this post, I thought of this journal.  It is a must read for you.

In my mid thirties now.  It took a long time and therapy ($$) for me to develop an adult relationship with my parents.  Although finances was not one of the issues.  There have been times were I told my dad over the phone that if he did not change the subject of the conversation I would hang up on him.  It took a few hang ups, but he did start to adjust.  You cannot change their behavior only the way you react to their behavior.  Hopefully a change in your reaction might help them fix theirs, but there is no way it will happen on its own.

Practice as much as you need in saying "NO".

If they bring it up on the phone you could do the same warning I would give my dad.  If he did not change I hung up. 

They are adults that need some tough love.

Cassie

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6485
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #23 on: March 18, 2019, 02:53:24 PM »
I totally agree with Frankieís girl and others. Stay out of their finances and let them solve their own problems. They will only resent you for helping.  They are adults and can figure it out.  Maybe they should apply for low income senior housing as sometimes the waiting list can be long.

mm1970

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7831
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #24 on: March 18, 2019, 03:47:24 PM »
Quote
Second, do not entangle your finances with your parents in any way. Do not buy them a condo. Do not take over their finances. Do not bail them out. This will only reinforce their expectation that your purpose is to manipulated and used as they see fit.

Yep.  This is the tricky bit: at some point, parents get old.  They start making bad money and life decisions because mental function deteriorates.  Only you can know if that is the case here - but it seems not.  Seems like a long history of bad choices.

frugaliknowit

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1687
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2019, 05:09:06 PM »
Unless you and your husband are multi-million wealthy and 6 figure income, I would not buy them a condo.  Besides the risk of them not paying the condo fees and you getting stuck with the tab, someone has to pay the taxes on it.  Let them rent whatever they can via government agency help or whatever...

Linea_Norway

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6750
  • Location: Norway
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #26 on: March 19, 2019, 01:54:11 AM »
Unless you and your husband are multi-million wealthy and 6 figure income, I would not buy them a condo.  Besides the risk of them not paying the condo fees and you getting stuck with the tab, someone has to pay the taxes on it.  Let them rent whatever they can via government agency help or whatever...

The other thing is that your money should be making it's own money, either by gaining rent from a rental or by being in the stock market. Just buying a house where they can live for free, is costing you the growth of your money.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2019, 06:51:36 AM by Linda_Norway »

Roadrunner53

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2568
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #27 on: March 19, 2019, 04:12:02 AM »
You have bailed them out too many times and they never learned a lesson. They finally killed the Golden Goose.

My in laws were idiots with money. My FIL was Mr. Hobby Man and would spend money to pay for his hobbies. Then my MIL would kind of do revenge and buy collector stuff like you see on the Bradford Exchange. Every month she would get a new collector thing. Which then required cabinets to put the junk into. My MIL had lots of health problems so didn't work. But as soon as FIL got his paycheck, they would zoom to the bank and cash it. This is way before paychecks were auto deposited. They would run around like maniacs and spend the money. They wouldn't pay the electric bill till they had no electricity. They would run out of oil to heat the house. It was constant chaos in their lives. They racked up credit card bills. You know those checks that banks send you with zero or low percentage rates? My MIL would write out those checks and then spend all the money. I really don't know what they spent the money on because they had a junky car, they never did anything to improve their home, no new furniture and never took trips or vacations. They would eat at a diner often and spend on their hobbies. My one SIL got them straightened out a few times with a HELOC. Once the MIL died, the FIL sold the house and probably paid off debt. He moved in with one of his daughters. You cannot change these people. They are programmed to spend money. It has to be an addiction. 

I agree with another poster that your parents should sell the cottage, sell the house, pay off the bills and move into a low income senior housing place. Not sure if you considered it but maybe you should see a lawyer and declare your parents incompetent and you could control their income by paying their bills and for food. It doesn't sound like they are actually incompetent but totally stupid with money. Your condo offer was very generous but first I would look to see what your area has for senior housing and see if they are even qualified.  If so, I would try to make an appointment so they could see the place. One way or the other they are going to lose that house to bankruptcy or if they sell it, all proceeds will go to pay bills. They have to face reality that they caused this mess, and you should not have to pick up the pieces every time. You just have to say no to this.

Playing with Fire UK

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2982
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #28 on: March 19, 2019, 08:05:31 AM »
https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/journals/playing-with-fire-is-getting-burned/

Hold firm.  You've already done plenty.  Read this horrifying journal ever time you start to weaken. 

They won't mean to but they will continue to fuck you over.

As soon as I read this post, I thought of this journal.  It is a must read for you.

That's my journal. To summarise what I wish I'd known then:
- There is no amount of money that will make this right. They (my in-laws) will always spend all the money we could give them and more. They are an infinite void of spending that will never be complete. If we bought them a mansion they'd remortgage it to get a palace. I thought over and over '"If we can just: pay for some extra food... consolidate the debt... reduce the mortgage... then it will be okay", but looking back, I really thought this one last time would be the last time.
- Getting involved with their money ruined our relationship. We rarely have conversations that don't end up talking (or shouting) about money any more. It's so sad. They only call my SO when they are asking for money and it's upsetting for everyone.
- I thought they'd be grateful for the money, the help and the hours of our lives we've spent on their money issues: but they see me as the bad guy that took away their credit cards and won't let them buy a birthday cake for their cat and demands to know where the money has gone.

It would have been easiest to say no early on. The more they took the more they imagined was there for the taking. Please say no.

Cassie

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6485
Re: Not Bailing Out My Parents
« Reply #29 on: March 19, 2019, 10:32:23 AM »
Itís very hard to have someone declared incompetent with good reason.  People making stupid decisions doesnít qualify and I would just stay out of it. Nothing good will come from it.