Author Topic: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…  (Read 6044 times)

AlanStache

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My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« on: March 30, 2019, 01:22:05 PM »
I think my new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute.

The house next to mine was empty for ~6 months and the owner (who I have never met) had his guy doing some renovations on the property during that time; I have had a few nice words with the caretaker but dont have his contact info.

New neighbor moved in in February, within a few days I had two different guys knock on my door in the early morning before work asking for “Alice”, I said no one by that name lives here and they left, they both were looking for my address.  They both left with no fuss and were overall polite about it.  I will assume my new neighbors is “Alice”, but I have not spoken to her.

One evening I went out for a run and was stopped by a different neighbor “Barbra”, she wanted to talk about my new neighbor and commented on all the different cars stopping at Alaces house and had I noticed?  Yes I had.  None of my windows look towards Alice's but I had still noticed that she gets a number of visitors each day and they stay less than 15 min. 

It seems most of her guests park and walk directly in thru the side gate and enter the back door, I have seen this several times.  My gate is right next to Alaces and I have noticed mine left open many times where it never has been before; I grew up with animals and learned to never leave a gate open.

Over the last few years I have spoken to “Candice” across the street a few times, she is semi-retired and does work from home.  I have not spoken to her about Alice; but she would have a very good-direct view of the comings and goings at Alice's. 

So I have no direct evidence Alice is selling drugs or a prostitute but dude-really-come on.

What is my next move?  I could put a camera outside but I am not sure I want to be that overt.  I could talk to Candice, but I am not sure why; I have seen plenty with my own eyes?  Do I call the cops?  What is the Miss Manners guide to gossiping about your neighbor with the cops?

Notes:
>> From the city property records I found the owner of Alices house but could not find a match on FB. 
>> I think Alice has kids, I have seen a few small ones there but they are not there all the time I think.
>> There is no one hanging around out front of Alice’s.
>> Alice's car has been parked in the driveway with a flat tires the entire time; it is possible but unlikely she walks to a job in the area.  I have not seen a working car at the house overnight.   
>> Today I put some wire on the gate to prevent the latch from being opened.  I hope the Johns or drug users get the hint to try the other gate.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 01:25:12 PM by AlanStache »

MrThatsDifferent

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2019, 02:00:30 PM »
Dude, you’re being a creep, knock it off. Leave your neighbor alone. Or better yet, go meet your neighbor, introduce yourself, have a welcome to the neighbor gift basket or something and you know, talk and get to know each other as people. I hope you’re a better person in real life than in your post. Sheesh.

use2betrix

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2019, 02:07:56 PM »
I think instead of making assumptions and being nosey, you should start by being an adult and walking next door and introducing yourself as the new neighbor. Might answer a ton of these questions. Maybe she cuts hair? Maybe she sells things on Craigslist? Maybe she’s a fortune teller?

I think based on your current assumption, if you call the police, you’re probably the a-hole, not her.*

* - disclaimer, you may be totally accurate, but really have nothing beyond a wild guess and apparently too much time on your hands.

maizeman

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2019, 02:14:34 PM »
What is my next move?  I could put a camera outside but I am not sure I want to be that overt.  I could talk to Candice, but I am not sure why; I have seen plenty with my own eyes?  Do I call the cops?  What is the Miss Manners guide to gossiping about your neighbor with the cops?

It may be worth taking a step back to reevaluate and gain some perspective.

You are proposing -- as a serious option -- to call the police and say "my neighbor has too many people visiting her and they don't stay for long enough." That doesn't seem like a reasonable or proportionate response to a sum total inconvenience to you of two people coming to the wrong door by mistake.

sol

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2019, 02:15:45 PM »
Third possibility:  you new neighbor just has lots of friends who drop by to check on her.  Could also be social workers, welfare checks, addiction recovery group members, or a big Mormon/Catholic family visiting a new widow.  Just because a person has more visitors than you're used to doesn't mean they are breaking any laws.

So far I don't see a problem here.  Go meet the new neighbor, be sure to mention that your gate has been left open and you'd like that to stop.  Most people want to be good neighbors, and will do their best to accommodate reasonable requests.  Just don't be such a creep about it.  And maybe consider talking to people directly before you start calling the cops.


sol

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2019, 02:20:01 PM »

What is the Miss Manners guide to gossiping about your neighbor with the cops?

The Official Miss Manners Guide to Gossiping About Your Neighbors With the Cops.  Chapter 1:  Don't.

Imma

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2019, 02:30:09 PM »
I agree that the very first thing you should do is get to know your new neighbour! Just introduce yourself, bring a pot of flowers, mention the gate issue, maybe put a lock or something on the gate so her visitors can't enter your property. For future reference it's always convenient to trace the owner's contact details but there's no need to do anything yet.

Just from meeting Alice you'll get an impression of the type of person she is. In my area producing drugs in homes is very common and that's a massive fire hazard. When I got suspiscious about a neighbour I watched for certain signs, didn't see them, and stopped caring. Person could very well be a dealer, but that's not my problem. Generally dealers like to keep themselves to themselves to avoid being noticed, so if this person is dealing at all she'll probably quickly solve the gate issue.

remizidae

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2019, 03:23:25 PM »
What is the problem here? Learn to tolerate the existence of people in the world whose lifestyles you may not approve of.

Hula Hoop

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #8 on: March 30, 2019, 03:39:54 PM »
We used to live across the hall from 2 prostitutes.  It was clear as there were always clients hanging around outside their door waiting for their turn.  Occasionally, they'd ring our doorbell by mistake.

Even though prostitution is illegal here we never would have called the police on them.  No way I'd want to deprive someone of their livelihood.  Live and let live.  They were good neighbors in other ways and always polite and courteous.  I felt sad for them that that was their profession but figured it was not my business.  I never saw any sign of a pimp.

Freedomin5

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2019, 04:56:55 PM »
You’re making assumptions. I’m glad our neighbors never called the cops on us when my father hired two women who would come to our home each morning and stay the whole day. Clients would drop by every 15 to 30 minutes or so.

If neighbors had called the cops, the cops would have found a legal and busy insurance brokerage firm run out of the home office, with clients dropping by to make payments and pick up policies.

As long as the neighbors aren’t actually bothering you and you have no direct evidence (like a client knocking on your door and asking you to have sex with them or sell them drugs), then just let things be. If you have direct evidence of illegal activity (e.g., you see a drug exchange go down), then call the cops.

AnnaGrowsAMustache

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2019, 04:58:43 PM »
Maybe she's super mustachian and selling stuff online, and people come to pick up. You don't have a clue, really.

BTDretire

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2019, 06:59:59 PM »
We have a next door neighbor that had a lot of short time traffic like that, about 2 years ago.
 Then one day my wife called me said she heard two gunshots next door.
She was working in the yard and ran into the house.
 I ask if she called the police she said no, I called them on my short drive home.
The 911 operator said just a minute... then said you call call your wife and tell her everything is OK,
those were just two Flash/bangs she heard.
 4 black SUVs outside the house with agents in all their gear had raided the house.
There was some jail time but just in the last two weeks all the bad actors are back in the house.
 Oh, and then 5 weeks ago the neighbor across the street, had a firetruck, ambulance and two cop cars outside. Girl overdosed and died. That is the second suspicious death in that house.
 I live in a subdivision with 97 homes, nice neighborhood except for my two neighbors.

BeanCounter

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2019, 07:27:13 PM »
Years ago we were living above an apartment with similar traffic. We started tracking plate numbers and were considering talking to the police. But we talked ourselves out of it because we thought we might be jumping to conclusions. After a few weeks I walked down the building steps into a drug deal. And then a few weeks after that I went to get groceries out of our car and found myself face to face with the business end of a Mac-10. I played it cool and kept walking and was fine. But after that we called the police and turned in our list of plates. We later found out that gun had been used in a drive by that killed an officer.
OP I don’t think your being too cautious. Just keep your eyes open and be careful.

austin944

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #13 on: March 30, 2019, 07:38:14 PM »
Introduce yourself to your neighbor "Alice" and casually ask her if she'd be OK with your installation of security cameras that would capture the activity in the street in front of both of your houses.   Explain that you are concerned about some recent unexpected visitors (you need not mention they were looking for her).  You could also mention the visitors who were looking for her and not mention any cameras, and ask her why they are getting your address by mistake.  Then closely observe her reaction.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 08:01:28 PM by austin944 »

red_pill

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #14 on: March 30, 2019, 07:46:50 PM »
Listen to your gut. You know what’s normal for your neighborhood and the vibe you’re getting from the activity next door.  If it wasn’t suspicious you wouldn’t be posting.

Camera could be good - where I live lots of people have them and there’s nothing “overt” about having one. Nor would I ask “Alice” for her permission - first of all you don’t need her permission and second of all, what if she says no?  Then you would have to decide to do it anyway or not.  A camera could be an excellent deterrent to people being on your property or at least would let you monitor the activity in front of your house without having to stare out the window all day.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2019, 07:56:38 PM by red_pill »

AlanStache

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #15 on: March 30, 2019, 08:08:52 PM »
Thanks for all the feed back.  Sorry if it came across that I was phone in hand, about to call the cops with a "I need to talk to the manager" wig on.  (https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/speak-to-the-manager-haircut)  In my industry it is drilled into us that if we observe odd behavior it should be reported so it can be correlated with other reports of odd behavior; if it was all innocent odd behavior - great, but someone needs to be informed of odd things if there is any hope of identifying something bad.  That would have been my approach with the cops; not to call 911 and demand they kick her door down.

She is not mustachian, trash can over flowing with crap (blowing into my yard...).
She is not trading on craigslist, have not seen anyone carrying things in and out. 

Part of why I have not taken action earlier was things felt weird; like not obviously drugs and not obviously sex - hence the post.  I have only seen men who are over 30 going in/out and always by themselves (she is probably late 20's / early 30's).  Drugs should have included at least one woman or group.  So sex right?  But some of the guys were in there for single digit numbers of minutes.  I dont know the average duration of time spent with a prostitute; but the times I observed felt short.  Also as Imma said I would have expected someone doing illegal things to be more careful about arousing suspensions of the neighbors.  But I have also been told that I could never be a criminal because I am to logical and to clearly see the ways I would be caught. 
"Like dude Alice, help me look the other way - tell your johns the correct address, help me to not give a shit."

The only plausible 'legal' explanation I saw in here was she is cutting hair. 

Yes I was absolutely making assumptions, but numbers of men by themselves walking into someones back yard, letting themselves into a back door, staying for a short time then leaving, carrying nothing and leaving with nothing, is odd behavior.

Short of seeing a briefcase full of coke fall and open up or some guy with his willy out hand her cash there is no way I could be sure illegal activity is going on.  The standard for calling the cops to report something being odd should lower than seeing el chapo sharpening a bloody clever. 

I have no issue with prostitution or drugs.  I do have a problem with someone selling them in a residential neighborhood and having the customers walking into my back yard and presumably trying to open my door.   

My town has some bad areas and maybe I have taken a defensive mind set about my very nice solid blue collar neighborhood.

re talking to her - I am not the most social or talkative guy so knocking on someones door who I suspected of doing illegal things was not my first instinct.  I am working on changing that about me but change is hard and takes time. 

Asking the possible drug dealer/prostitute if she is ok with me putting up a camera with her house in the field of view does not seem like a good move. 

Thanks for all the posts.  Will see how this goes.

BicycleB

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #16 on: March 30, 2019, 08:09:17 PM »
If after meeting her you remain suspicious, perhaps install a motion detector light for your yard/gate?

OneCoolCat

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2019, 08:21:10 PM »
No one wants to live next to a brothel but unless you have small children I think you should just mind your own business.  Chances are its not prostitution - I mean inviting clients over to your own house - pfft.  If she is a prostitute then chances are she trusts these "clients" if shes willing to invite them into her home.  I would be curious but calling the law - nah.

secondcor521

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #18 on: March 30, 2019, 11:09:29 PM »
Do the guys walk out looking sharp with nice haircuts?  (I'm guessing not.)

I had a group of drug users living next door to me for a while and I never caught on until the police did a SWAT-style raid at 6:00 am one day.  She was a nice lady with a 6-year-old son, but I later learned that she was a recovering drug addict who decided to let a few of her other attempting-a-recovery friends to stay with her.  Sadly, one or more of them relapsed at some point.  So they started a drug den which they supported with drug sales and petty theft of TVs and so forth.  The stolen items were found in the house.

I never caught on because in general I keep to myself, and she was a nice person with a kid who acted reasonably normally in my interactions with her.  Also, the drug sales tended to happen early in the morning or late at night.

The pattern you describe does sound like drug dealing to me.  If it's small time, they'd go in the back door, hand over the cash, and stick a baggie of whatever in their coat pockets and walk out - so that explains the short amount of time spent.  I wouldn't have a problem with calling the police and asking what you should do if you think drug dealing might be going on in your neighborhood.  They'll usually give you very good advice.

If you can manage to get your neighbor's real name, you could mention it to the police when you call them.  From what I understand, the drug communities in most cities consist of the same people getting arrested over and over (for either the drugs or the theft and other activities that are associated with the drug use).  The officer will probably be candid with you if they know the person is a user/dealer.

If it's all on the up and up, the police are probably going to be professional about it and not follow up, not label you a kook, and won't harass or investigate your neighbor just on your suspicions.

I agree it could be innocuous, and I agree that getting to know your new neighbor would be good in any case.  But your descriptions sound very similar to my old neighbor.

I would say based on my experience with my situation that you're probably not in very much danger and that if she is a user/dealer she'll want to maintain a low profile and overtly normal behavior.  But if I saw guns or had small kids I might treat the situation differently, and each person has their own risk meter they should respect.

Catbert

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #19 on: March 31, 2019, 06:09:34 AM »
To answer one question since I'm visiting Amsterdam at the moment: average time with a prostitute in Amsterdam red light district is 6 minutes.  2 minutes is not unusual.  15 minutes including getting undressed is the max time for your fee.

Cyanne

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #20 on: March 31, 2019, 07:34:43 AM »
I have had neighbors think that I was a prostitute-and I'm not!  I had purchased the house during summer and worked in a school so I had summers off (school secretary). I also had the following:

My brother who was my roommate at the time coming and going frequently and working weird hours.
My ex-husband who came to pick up and drop off my daughter for visitation.
My boyfriend who came over to see me and take me out on dates or hang out.
A number of male friends.  At the time most of my female friends were married with small kids so they never came over-I went to their houses.

I had no idea that my neighbors thought I was a prostitute until I was talking to my next door neighbor's mother. She provided daycare for her grandchildren. She was asking me about what I did and I told her that I was a secretary at an elementary school and had summers off so I was at home during the day. She then asked me about the guys who were coming and going from my house. Yikes! I figured out where she was going with her questioning. I explained about the different men (see list above) and assured her that nothing icky was going on! It also explained why her daughter would glare at me through the window.

Your neighbor may be a prostitute and/ or dealing drugs or not. Do not make such broad assumptions without knowing more facts!!!

hops

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #21 on: March 31, 2019, 08:18:08 AM »
I had a next-door neighbor with a lot of foot traffic that might've seemed suspicious if you didn't know he ran a business out of his garage. A few months ago, a man and woman with a small child moved into a rental house on a sleepy street a couple blocks over, and some neighbors felt uneasy about the amount of activity there but kept quiet in case it was a legitimate business. Then an early morning SWAT raid put an end to that speculation.

These situations remind of this huge scandal when I was a kid and all the gossipy neighbors were convinced a woman who had just moved in was cheating on her husband because there was a UPS truck in her driveway every afternoon. The things they said about her were awful. A few of them were sufficiently embarrassed (and possibly disappointed) to learn she was a UPS driver who came home every day for lunch.

Roland of Gilead

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #22 on: March 31, 2019, 08:52:38 AM »
I was always curious where Mrs. Kravitz lived nowadays...

COEE

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #23 on: March 31, 2019, 09:05:08 AM »
We had some good neighbors when I was growing up.  I played with their son Oliver pretty regularly.  One day about 20 unmarked and marked cruisers drove up from the front and the back ally - in all four directions and hauled off Oliver's dad and Uncle's.  It was sad.  Apparently Oliver's dad was dealing coke out of the house.

Dad told me years later that he always saw a lot of foot traffic at the house but didn't think much of it because they were a Mexican family in Phoenix, and Mexican families are large.  Dad thought the people were just there to tell grandma hi or whatever because the only people that ever showed up appeared to be Mexican as well.

Since then I've lived next to many Mexican families with similar foot traffic, but no drug busts.  All have been very good loving people with large families.  Oliver's family included.

Go say hello.  Don't let your mind wander.  Smile and welcome them to the neighborhood.  Offer up your help if they need any for any reason.  Mention that you keep finding your gate open for some reason.

AlanStache

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #24 on: March 31, 2019, 09:28:02 AM »
Today, Sunday, I was mowing the front yard and Candice was out front and we got to talking.  She showed me two videos. 

First: From March 9th, two uniformed cops at Alices front door.  The video was taken on a cell within Candices house and you could hear yelling from Alices door step on the video. 

Second: From March 15th.  Also shot from within Candices with a cell; 8 to 10 unmarked police cars roll up one by one and raid Alices.  Candice says about a dozen people were inside.  This video shows my car in the drive so I am 100% clueless and unaware of what was going on. 

Candice also says there have been lots of cars parked along the street and often blocking my drive and hers.  She also believes there are cameras on the utility pole and on a city front end loader parked a few doors down by some construction. 

So yes it is or at least was a brothel.  And there would seem to be no point with informing the police that I have seen suspicious activity. 

Catbert: thanks for the data - pathetic hang times even for drunken Brit adolescents :-)

COEE

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #25 on: March 31, 2019, 12:03:23 PM »
Well there you go.  If she was doing something illegal she'd be in jail.  The DA obviously don't have enough to press charges if she's still there, or she's posted bail, or whatever... lots could be happening.

Now you go over, introduce yourself, and bring over a dick-in-a-box.

maizeman

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #26 on: March 31, 2019, 12:15:39 PM »
And there would seem to be no point with informing the police that I have seen suspicious activity. 

This would seem to be the key takeaway from the whole process. The system works without us having to pry too much into our neighbor's businesses unless they are actively causing harm to us personally.

Also, of the two, I think I would prefer to live next to "Alice" than "Candice." Hanging out inside your house and secretly recording video and audio of people coming to your neighbor's front door to show off to other neighbors? Yikes.

Cassie

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #27 on: March 31, 2019, 01:42:15 PM »
We had neighbors that were dealing drugs next door and we had small children. They also drove drunk and high.  I wrote down all the license plates and turned them in. Eventually they nailed them and the house was sold.

Taran Wanderer

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #28 on: March 31, 2019, 02:01:37 PM »
I used to live next door to and shared a driveway with a couple with three small children. They had TONS of friends, and they’d always drop by for just 5 to 10 minutes. Most were a little rough looking, but all were polite, and nobody messed with my stuff. I figured they were probably dealing, but there were no funny odors, no mess, and no trouble.

Then one day a bunch of police showed up, my doorbell rang, and the former all-state fullback from my high school football team was at my door in a flak jacket and badge, asking if the drug mule’s girlfriend could use my bathroom. And the drug mule making the drop-off next for was the younger brother of my high school classmate.

If you suspect something is wrong, it probably is. Keep data. If there are big problems, share it with the police. If not, keep the data and offer it to the police when they show up make an arrest - they will need it. If there are no problems and the police never show up, be a helpful neighbor and follow the advice above about asking innocent questions about your gate being open. That’s my advice, FWIW.

AlanStache

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #29 on: March 31, 2019, 02:18:04 PM »
...
This would seem to be the key takeaway from the whole process. The system works without us having to pry too much into our neighbor's businesses unless they are actively causing harm to us personally.

Also, of the two, I think I would prefer to live next to "Alice" than "Candice." Hanging out inside your house and secretly recording video and audio of people coming to your neighbor's front door to show off to other neighbors? Yikes.

I dont think she recorded anyone but the cops.  She did take a few still pictures of cars parked blocking my driveway.  I am not clear what the objection to either of these two actions are?  There have been a few times in past when I wish I had taken a picture or two as proof something happened it would have been useful later on.  In this case if the house owner does not believe her to be a bad tenant there are now pictures not just a few peoples word.  Yes police reports are more convincing than pic.

The system: Here yes it seems the cops were looking into her not long after she moved in (if not from where ever she last lived).  But if they had not been I would rather show the cops pictures of XX different men going into Alices house and coming out a short time latter, than to go to them and verbally tell them.  pictures -> 1k words.

Perhaps I have just come to grips with the fact that there are cameras everywhere and mass digital storage is cheap.  I do often make a point of leaving the phone & Garmin behind, especially when in nature.  "Take only memories, leave no digital footprints"?

maizeman

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #30 on: March 31, 2019, 03:44:33 PM »
It the thought of your neighbor hiding in their house* secretly filming what happens in your own yard or photographing who is coming and going from your house to send those photos to the police and/or share with your other neighbors doesn't bother you. Given that, I suspect our ethics and values are different enough that we're not going to be able to have a productive discussion about why Candice's behavior creeps me out way more than anything you've told me about Alice.

So I'll just leave it at: please be aware that this behavior will really really bother some people, even if it doesn't bother you personally.

*Note also that for me there is both an emotional and ethical distinction between an automatic security camera and an actual human being spending their time tracking and recording things.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2019, 03:48:16 PM by maizeman »

austin944

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #31 on: March 31, 2019, 06:33:27 PM »
This would seem to be the key takeaway from the whole process. The system works without us having to pry too much into our neighbor's businesses unless they are actively causing harm to us personally.

What about the small children in that situation?  I'm not saying they'd be better off being taken by CPS, but I dunno, I'd rather live in a society where people had concern about the defenseless.

Dianalou

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #32 on: April 01, 2019, 12:34:13 PM »
I think Candice was my old neighbor. I used to get love letters from the HOA all the time for leaving our garbage cans out longer than an hour after trash was picked up. Tipped off by the neighbors.

GreenToTheCore

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #33 on: April 01, 2019, 01:15:25 PM »
This was a really interesting thread to read. I have often experienced a disconnect between different peoples' decision on when to call the cops.
Ex: We were on the highway (80mph limit), a truck ahead of us would accelerate to excessive speeding and then slow down way below the limit, lots of swerving, etc. Something was obviously not normal.
My friend was got angry at me for calling the cops, "He hasn't done anything wrong." (he did though, reckless driving and speeding)
My thought was, "Yet. He hasn't hurt anyone yet. I would feel like complete shit to wake up in the morning and hear a report that a DUI driver hit and killed a family on the highway. I knew he was there and I did nothing."

Since we have a nice spread of opinions here, I'd like to learn more about the don't-call-the-cops perspective. So far I've heard:
1) Live & let live
2) They haven't done anything to you
3) They're only hurting themselves
4) You don't want to waste their time if it turns out to be nothing
5) You don't have any actual evidence

What else to add to the list?
In what situation would you call the police?
« Last Edit: April 01, 2019, 02:57:36 PM by GreenToTheCore »

iris lily

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #34 on: April 01, 2019, 05:30:32 PM »
This was a really interesting thread to read. I have often experienced a disconnect between different peoples' decision on when to call the cops.
Ex: We were on the highway (80mph limit), a truck ahead of us would accelerate to excessive speeding and then slow down way below the limit, lots of swerving, etc. Something was obviously not normal.
My friend was got angry at me for calling the cops, "He hasn't done anything wrong." (he did though, reckless driving and speeding)
My thought was, "Yet. He hasn't hurt anyone yet. I would feel like complete shit to wake up in the morning and hear a report that a DUI driver hit and killed a family on the highway. I knew he was there and I did nothing."

Since we have a nice spread of opinions here, I'd like to learn more about the don't-call-the-cops perspective. So far I've heard:
1) Live & let live
2) They haven't done anything to you
3) They're only hurting themselves
4) You don't want to waste their time if it turns out to be nothing
5) You don't have any actual evidence

What else to add to the list?
In what situation would you call the police?

I live in the urban core. There is always controversy in my neighborhood, and among my immediate neighbors, when to call the cops.  I have lived here for 30 years and have seen our neighborhood come up so much in safety and property values that it is a testimony, to me, of involved residents.

It is automatic to me to call for cops when something is amiss.

That doesn’t mean the cops will come. In fact, they often do not come in any kind of timely way And by the time they get here, the person causing a disturbance is gone. But so be it. I want to log calls on problem issues even if police are not responsive.

I  let the cops handle it. Just because you place a phone call, and a policeman comes, doesn’t mean something will happen or  the person will be arrested. really is just so naďve to think that. What is going on right now my city is unregistered automobiles.

The “Live and let live “contingent thinks it is Mrs. Kravitz to be concerned about it because how does that hurt me? Well I think it’s pretty obvious how that hurts  me since taxes are not being paid thru these unregistered autos for our jointly used public resources. It  is amusing to me that those who are all about the besuties of Shared responsibility don’t really seem to want to take any responsibility.

Several years ago there was a neighbor who had an unregistered vehicle. His temporary plates had expired months and months ago. He parked facing the wrong direction  every day. He parked right next to the fire hydrant, blocking it. So, this one car parked illegally in three different ways daily. I called the cops one day because the entire apartment house is a bit of a problem with noise and etc. The cop came and issued a warning ticket but he didn’t give an actual ticket to the resident because he said “I don’t want this guy to lose his car because then he’d lose his way to get to work and that’s really a problem!” , See? The cops are not evil heartless robots.

Funny ironic that sometime later that entire apartment complex caught on fire and it was a multi alarm fire and they had to use that hydrant but fortunately that tenant was gone by then.

Right now we have, operating at a very low level of crime, three female pan handlers. I call the cops on everyone of them, even the woman who drags along her eight-year-old child.
« Last Edit: April 01, 2019, 05:40:07 PM by iris lily »

civil4life

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #35 on: April 02, 2019, 11:38:17 AM »
I do agree a quick hello to say hi and mention the gate and even the trash.  You may ask the name so you could put a sign on your gate that says "Alyce's House" with arrow pointing to her place.

If after a visit you still get a not great vibe I would make a call to the police.  Or if the trash is really bothersome you could call code enforcement for that situation.

I live in an overall very dangerous city.  I am in a few block space of nice homes, but we still get regular traffic from homeless and people that pull car door handles hoping for an open one.  I probably would not be overly worried about prostitution, but drugs maybe.  Either case there would probably be a lot of money and potential for unsavory people with unsavory intentions. 

Also, you did the property research.  I am guessing it is known whether they are the property owner or not.  I would try to contact the actual property owner.  If I was renting a place I would not want something like that going on.  A property owner would have the right to inquire a bit deeper.

Cassie

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #36 on: April 02, 2019, 12:36:33 PM »
Not sure why you would call the cops on panhandlers. My guess is they don’t respond.

therethere

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #37 on: April 02, 2019, 01:27:55 PM »
You call the cops on panhandlers and improperly parked cars? I would be on the phone all day long.... Personally I think that's slightly over the top. But I respect that you are doing what you think is right. So have fun if that's how you want to spend your time. I would just be very cautious in this political environment that you don't get turned into one of those viral videos of cranky person calling the cops on someone of a different race/income.  Sure, you don't know the full backstory on those videos. But unfortunately the internet manipulates events and don't care about the backstory (if it doesn't fit their agenda or they didn't record it) and neither do your employers if you get named in one of those. 

I used to live across the street from low income, slum-like housing. There were drug dealers, homeless people (and tenants) sleeping on the lawn, and a whole bunch of stuff. I could even tell you which mailbox had the drugs/money in it and where people hid stuff outside. I only called the police if someone was getting hurt. Most police already know where the nuisance houses are. My calling every time there was a disturbance wouldn't help anything.

civil4life

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #38 on: April 02, 2019, 03:46:45 PM »
Panhandlers...I have a tent city a few blocks from me.  Only time I ever considered calling on was because of their own safety.  The person was very high on something.  I watched him for 30 minutes try to walk about 20 feet.  Someone eventually called and an ambulance took care of them.

iris lily

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #39 on: April 02, 2019, 10:32:00 PM »
Not sure why you would call the cops on panhandlers. My guess is they don’t respond.

The cops prioritize their calls. Often they don’t come right away but they will come eventually. The last time I called on our aggressive panhandler who tress passes and gets in people’s faces to yell at them, and is thought to have mugged someone,  two cop cars came. But too late— panhandler came but she had already scooted  out of the neighborhood.

iris lily

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #40 on: April 02, 2019, 10:33:16 PM »
Another reason to call cops is to get crime is logged.

Our aggressive panhandler bothers a lot of people but they don’t call the cps.. If more people were calling we would have better police presence when we reported her in the neighborhood.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2019, 12:29:34 PM by iris lily »

therethere

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #41 on: April 03, 2019, 08:54:17 AM »
The aggressive panhandler likely has mental or substance abuse issues. Or both. Calling cops isn't going to do anything for them except get them in jail for one night at the most. Then they will come out and do the same thing <24 hours later. Rinse, repeat. Multiply that times 10 panhandlers that is an insane waste of resources. They have issues that can't be solved by cops coming to talk to them.

Cassie

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #42 on: April 03, 2019, 09:06:11 AM »
There, exactly the point. Just wasting the cops time and resources.

iris lily

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #43 on: April 03, 2019, 12:28:29 PM »
There, exactly the point. Just wasting the cops time and resources.

Sorry, but when panhandlers regularly trespass on my property, come on my front porch,  leave my front gate open so my dogs escape,  get in my face and yell at me when I open my own front door ——they need to stop that behavior in my neigh orhood.  And while I am plenty able to yell back at them and snap their photograph and tell them  I’m calling the police, I actually do call the police,  and the call for service is logged.

The police will prioritize their calls for service. I don’t lie about what’s happening in order to move it up in priority,  I tell them it is an aggressive panhandler.

We are encouraged by police to call when something is amiss. We do have a non-emergency line for  non-time sensitive stuff. And,
I have the email,address of our neighborhood police offer and I send her messages occasionally. She and her captain attend our neighborhood meetng each month.

Many posters here, perhaps the majority?  Have a distint relationship with their police officers. We do not, we have an active relationship with them.

iris lily

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #44 on: April 03, 2019, 12:31:21 PM »
The aggressive panhandler likely has mental or substance abuse issues. Or both. Calling cops isn't going to do anything for them except get them in jail for one night at the most. Then they will come out and do the same thing <24 hours later. Rinse, repeat. Multiply that times 10 panhandlers that is an insane waste of resources. They have issues that can't be solved by cops coming to talk to them.
Perhaps you don’t understand that I am not interested in helping the panhandler. I am interested in protecting my block from ceime. I want the panhandlers off my block. If they are hassled often enough they don’t come back, they go elsewhere, score for me.

sol

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #45 on: April 03, 2019, 12:45:01 PM »
Perhaps you don’t understand that I am not interested in helping the panhandler.

Well in that case, you can always just shoot her.

If you're genuinely unconcerned with the welfare of other human beings if it inconveniences you at all, you might be a sociopath.  If you genuinely wanted to improve your neighborhood, instead of just your own personal situation, you would be advocating for helping panhandlers find other options instead of just shuffling them off to be someone else's problem.  What you're doing sure sounds like short-term thinking of the worst kind.

iris lily

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #46 on: April 03, 2019, 12:55:00 PM »
Perhaps you don’t understand that I am not interested in helping the panhandler.

Well in that case, you can always just shoot her.

If you're genuinely unconcerned with the welfare of other human beings if it inconveniences you at all, you might be a sociopath.  If you genuinely wanted to improve your neighborhood, instead of just your own personal situation, you would be advocating for helping panhandlers find other options instead of just shuffling them off to be someone else's problem.  What you're doing sure sounds like short-term thinking of the worst kind.
Yes! I might be, and probably am, a sociopath! I might as well shoot her!

Finally, someone here gets it.

;)



Taran Wanderer

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #47 on: April 03, 2019, 02:42:36 PM »
I fully support the need to help the panhandler, but what they need is systemic help. What iris Lilly needs is protection of their own personal property and freedom. Calling the police and logging the data is a way to make the case for the systemic support to help the panhandler. You can love your neighbor to a point, but beyond that you have to call for help. I don’t see the two things as mutually exclusive.

mm1970

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #48 on: April 03, 2019, 02:56:53 PM »
I fully support the need to help the panhandler, but what they need is systemic help. What iris Lilly needs is protection of their own personal property and freedom. Calling the police and logging the data is a way to make the case for the systemic support to help the panhandler. You can love your neighbor to a point, but beyond that you have to call for help. I don’t see the two things as mutually exclusive.

Yes, +1

therethere

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Re: My new neighbor is a drug dealer or prostitute…
« Reply #49 on: April 03, 2019, 03:12:26 PM »
Well in Iris_lily's case I would not call them a panhandler. But rather a person that trespassed and harassed them on their property. Saying they called the cops on an aggressive panhandler wasn't quite the full story and was somewhat misleading. It crosses the line when they're banging at your door screaming at you.

But calling the cops in aim to get a random (non-trepassing) panhandler off your block for the night (when they will just come back or another will replace them on the now empty corner) is a completely different story. And pretty much pointless and a waste of resources IMHO.

The entire point of the thread was discussing calling the cops on a situation where you are purely speculating and there is no evidence of a crime. And the crime which you are speculating on is low-risk to harming others.
« Last Edit: April 03, 2019, 03:14:09 PM by therethere »