Author Topic: negotiating with current job vs interviewing  (Read 447 times)

Case

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negotiating with current job vs interviewing
« on: July 31, 2020, 01:49:41 PM »
Looking for some perspectives here.  I know the standard Ask A Manger advice is "don't try to use a job offer to negotiate a raise at your current job because it will affect your relationship with your manager and take you a target in the future". 

I work in science R&D.  I started at medium sized American chemical company A, which was taken over by large American chemical company B, which split into some companies and I was moved into Company C.  Point of telling you this is that I have been involuntarily moved multiple times.  When you get moved a lot, it can affect your career trajectory.  Company A paid less than B, and so I was moved into Company B at a lower rank (so that my pay wasn't affected).  Additionally, whenever you start a new role, no one cares about your past accomplishments and you have to start fresh every time.  As a result of this, I am starting to lag behind my former coworkers (still at Company B) in terms of pay and rank.

I generally like my current work group; I get along with all of my coworkers, am well liked, have a good relationship with my manager, yada yada.  I receive high performance ratings, but current manager wont promote me because I don't have enough visibility in Company C yet.  I have been in this group for 2.5 years, and it seems like a promotion is maybe a year off.  My manager is working with me though; she just recently has given me a new role that will give me more visibility, and may eventually lead to a promotion.  There are no definite terms though; and she even said this position may lead to another position which then may lead to a promotion.  I have been working on this with my manager for over a year now; progress on getting me opportunities is slow... but at least it's starting to happen.  Company C, like many companies nowadays, is having financial headwinds related to COVID; that may be contributing to my slow progress, but this issue is also older than COVID.

I'm starting to have success on my existing projects, and that could lead to great success.  Having career success is equally important to me in comparison to money.  I want success badly (getting moved from Company A/B robbed me of following through on past successful project).

I just got an interview for a nearby job.  I don't have an offer yet, but wanted to get the ball rolling on ideas...

In an ideal world, I'd get a raise more quickly (immediately), and keep my current job.  I like the people and manager despite the circumstances, and see a future for myself here.  But, I don't want to damage my relationship with my manager, with whom I have a great relationship.  I also want to see my current project through, hopefully commercialize it.

What do you think?

bloodaxe

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Re: negotiating with current job vs interviewing
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2020, 02:38:19 PM »
I generally like my current work group; I get along with all of my coworkers, am well liked, have a good relationship with my manager, yada yada.  I receive high performance ratings, but current manager wont promote me because I don't have enough visibility in Company C yet.  I have been in this group for 2.5 years, and it seems like a promotion is maybe a year off.  My manager is working with me though; she just recently has given me a new role that will give me more visibility, and may eventually lead to a promotion.  There are no definite terms though; and she even said this position may lead to another position which then may lead to a promotion.  I have been working on this with my manager for over a year now; progress on getting me opportunities is slow... but at least it's starting to happen.  Company C, like many companies nowadays, is having financial headwinds related to COVID; that may be contributing to my slow progress, but this issue is also older than COVID.

I'm starting to have success on my existing projects, and that could lead to great success.  Having career success is equally important to me in comparison to money.  I want success badly (getting moved from Company A/B robbed me of following through on past successful project).

It looks like a lot of political stuff is happening at your company. It sounds very frustrating.

However, there are going to be politics no matter where you work.

My unrelated to the thread advice is this: you only have partial control of whether you get a promotion or have career success. I would place a higher value on things that you have complete or near complete control of.

Edit: 5 years ago you said you could fire this year: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/leave-unsatisfying-cushy-job-for-stressful-exciting-job/msg621722/#msg621722

Why isn't this the plan anymore?
« Last Edit: July 31, 2020, 02:41:01 PM by bloodaxe »

FIRE 20/20

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Re: negotiating with current job vs interviewing
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2020, 05:02:17 PM »
Regarding what bloodaxe asked, how many more years before you're FI and do you plan to RE?  That could change the approach you take.

I would let go of the frustrations about what's happened in the past.  Lamenting the acquisitions, not being able to continue the old successful project, and comparisons to your peer group don't help anything.  They only contribute to frustration and suffering.  That's not to say that you shouldn't recognize where you are vs. where you want to be - just that the focus should be on what to do now given where things are not on the details of how you got there. 

With that said, I think it's almost always a good idea to interview for other positions even if you're happy where you are.  I told my employees the same thing when I was a manager.  I would go to the interview with the mindset (although not the actual intent) that you're unemployed or in desperate need for work and nail the interview.  Only after you have an offer in hand will you be able to make a good decision.  They might offer more money, a better project to work on, and you might love the team and manager.  Or you might not even get the job.  Or maybe they'll offer you 80% of what you're making now to do lower level work.  In my experience the offer (or rejection) makes the path forward very clear and the time spent planning for contingencies now is wasted.  When I've faced this situation the path forward has generally been pretty clear after I had the offer even if sometimes it was scary to make the leap. 

Case

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Re: negotiating with current job vs interviewing
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2020, 08:04:23 PM »
I generally like my current work group; I get along with all of my coworkers, am well liked, have a good relationship with my manager, yada yada.  I receive high performance ratings, but current manager wont promote me because I don't have enough visibility in Company C yet.  I have been in this group for 2.5 years, and it seems like a promotion is maybe a year off.  My manager is working with me though; she just recently has given me a new role that will give me more visibility, and may eventually lead to a promotion.  There are no definite terms though; and she even said this position may lead to another position which then may lead to a promotion.  I have been working on this with my manager for over a year now; progress on getting me opportunities is slow... but at least it's starting to happen.  Company C, like many companies nowadays, is having financial headwinds related to COVID; that may be contributing to my slow progress, but this issue is also older than COVID.

I'm starting to have success on my existing projects, and that could lead to great success.  Having career success is equally important to me in comparison to money.  I want success badly (getting moved from Company A/B robbed me of following through on past successful project).

It looks like a lot of political stuff is happening at your company. It sounds very frustrating.

However, there are going to be politics no matter where you work.

My unrelated to the thread advice is this: you only have partial control of whether you get a promotion or have career success. I would place a higher value on things that you have complete or near complete control of.

Edit: 5 years ago you said you could fire this year: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/ask-a-mustachian/leave-unsatisfying-cushy-job-for-stressful-exciting-job/msg621722/#msg621722

Why isn't this the plan anymore?

Oh man, thanks for linking that old post, a blast from the past.  Coincidentally i used the same compny A, B, C terminology in exactly the same way.... because itís old me I guess.

So yea, compny B ended up buying A.  I moved into Company B and joined a group I wanted there, and then a few months later they moved me out, to company C.  I was geographic relocated too.  What a fuckin mess.

I havenít retired yet for a few reasons:
-COVID changed everything and i think we need more security blanket than 25x.
-wanting of extra money for potential retirement adventures beyond simple frugal living. 
-honestly i need to spend more time crunching numbers to figure out what my realistic retirement spending is.
-if possible, Iíd like to have more success in my career.  A scientific major technical success.
Itís important to me... but Iím also weighing it versus corporate BS which hinders it, etc..

To your point, At present I have some control over my success on my projects at work.  But yea, at some point I might need to retire if what I seek is an impossibility.

spaniard999

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Re: negotiating with current job vs interviewing
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2020, 07:43:55 PM »
I have an extremely similar situation.
My current company which I worked for 4 years, has been a freaking rollercoaster.
4 different CEOs since I have been there, the separation from a parent company to go public and being bought by another conglomerate of companies right after that.

I have seen lots of people on the important roles getting raises and promotions while the rest of mortals are just stuck in there.

I decided I wanted more for me and I wasn't going to settle for less than certain amount.
I did some interviewing and ended up with 3 offers of other companies. I have to say that my current company is in an industry heavily hit by covid-19, so there have been several waves of layoffs.

I approached my manager saying that I had an offer for another job but that I really loved my work here and I wanted to stay if possible, but I wanted to be fairly compensated for my work.
He asked me to share just the basic details of the offer so he could tell HR since they liked me and wanted me to stay.

Long story short, they gave me the raise I was looking for even though the company is going through rough times and layoffs.

And no, it did not cause any friction with my manager.

My 2 cents: Look after yourself, because no one else will.