Author Topic: My parents 50th anniversary vacation (w/ Zika concerns) vs planning for a kid  (Read 8523 times)

jeromedawg

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Hey all,

Wanted to get some input regarding a dilemma we're having on a decision as to whether or not we should try to go on a vacation for my parents' 50th anniversary.

Here are the details: my parents had been passively planning a cruise (Disney) for the past couple years with another couple from their church up through a week ago when they finally booked the cruise without much input from us. When I say "passive" I mean they had just been talking about it but never definitively scheduled anything out or got all our families on the same page about best times to go and options we would agree on. Unilaterally, it seems, the date decided was 6/15/19 (7-days) and to the Eastern Caribbean, where there currently is an advisory for Zika.

Now, my wife and I have been taking about planning for a potential third kid. At the time when they were passively planning, we didn't think to bring up our plans for having another kid - we were busy figuring out how to raise our newborn and 2yr old. So when we shared this with them, they got all bat-crazy. At first, we were trying to convince them to book something elsewhere: why does it have to be the Eastern Caribbean? Both my dad and my brother have expressed disinterested in the ports (St. Thomas and Tortola) anyway and we know for a fact that several in our party are prone to seasickness on these cruises. In fact, my dad even proposed that we suggest where to go because he seemed tired of the "bickering"... and we did: a shorter 5-day Bahamas cruise (to ports where there is no current Zika advisory).
However, my mom was and has been insistent on cruising with this other couple and their family for whatever reason. So much so that she was unwilling to compromise on our alternate suggestion. The only date the other couple and their family can go is 6/15/19 due to other engagements AND the fact that they really want to see the Caribbean and don't care for the Bahamas or anywhere else. So basically, my mom is prioritizing cruising with these other people (who we have met maybe once or twice and one of my brothers and his family have never met) and their preference, over any preferences we have... notably: *not* traveling to a Zika-affected region. Having my wife stay on the ship (if pregnant) crossed our minds but all doctors we have spoken to advise against even that... not to mention that it would likely be miserable for my wife, who is prone to seasickness.

Given that they would pay for us in full (minus taxes/gratuity), I figure we don't have much control over what they decide. However, we have 90+ days out to cancel without much recourse (I think there might be a $100 fee to the concierge/booking company but that's it). I told my parents, to appease them at the moment, that they should go ahead and book it; however, with the understanding that we very well may cancel if we need to (e.g. in the case that we happen to conceive). I think if we cancel at all, they will be upset, even though I've level-set that expectation up-front.

So the thing about Zika is that if men travel to a Zika-affected region, they are supposed to wait 6mos+ before trying to conceive. For women it's shorter at 2 months I believe. My parents kept implying and asking us why we were in such a rush to have another kid, and that we should wait in "their opinion." Given nobody knows how long it may take to conceive, I think that's a pretty insensitive and selfish comment to make. If we were to all go and wait 6 months after, that would mean no kids potentially until 2020 or later. We'd like to have our kids closer in age if possible just given our own personal preferences - our two are 1.5 years apart and though it can be super-hard, I think it's a good thing. I'm not going to get into justifying why we want our kids so close - I just want that. My parents keep guilt-tripping us with "This is our big 50th anniversary thing - we've never asked much of you before" blah blah blah.

Another thought is if we are pregnant, I could just go with one kid (probably our son) OR we could have my parents take our son and watch him (they actually offered this). I don't know how much I'd trust my parents watching him without us there for a week, and I suppose going with him would be an option but I'd feel sad without my wife and daughter there. I still can't get over the fact that the priority is this other couple yet they keep saying they want all of us to go... am I missing something? What would you guys do?

« Last Edit: March 15, 2018, 07:14:03 PM by jeromedawg »

MayDay

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Honestly they are being jerks about this. If they want you to come,they can change plans.

Frankly,I think you owe it to everyone to just cancel now. Be honest and do it sooner rather than later. It isn't going to get easier if you wait.


Gin1984

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I would not go, and frankly I'd be reevaluating the relationship.

birdiegirl

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Could they go on two trips to celebrate?  Go on the cruise with their friends and do another trip with your family.  Then they get two celebrations and no one has to worry about safety. 

jeromedawg

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Could they go on two trips to celebrate?  Go on the cruise with their friends and do another trip with your family.  Then they get two celebrations and no one has to worry about safety.

Nah, they and the other couple have been very insistent. I can see why they might be upset - they had been planning this for nearly two years now. I think they were implying that we should have told them of our plans for another kid when they brought that up too... I didn't know we were supposed to give a 5 year roadmap for planning our parenthood! The thing is, the other couple has 2 or 3 kids of their own, who are all going. They have kids that are the same ages as my kids and nephews, so my parents thing it'll be some grand ole celebration and the more the merrier. I think my mom is trying to save face because they've been talking about this for 2 years and she doesn't want to disappoint the other family. Honestly, I doubt the other family even cares whether or not we go. But my parents make it out to seem as if they do...

The other thing that crossed my mind was why it has to be Disney - obviously there are perks, but my SIL told us that her friends wondered the same and that you could cruise to the Eastern Caribbean for $4-5k less per room than what my parents would be paying on Royal Caribbean. Then again, isn't RC notorious for Norovirus outbreaks? Hahaha... whatever.

In any case, it does sound as though my parents are asking us to plan our family around their vacation. They claim "it's only ONCE that we'll be able to celebrate this" - well duh, you only get one 50th anniversary, usually. LOL! I would think they'd be more excited about potentially getting more grandkids but perhaps they're checked out...

Missy B

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Well, I'd bail ASAP. Nothing about this situation is good.

CupcakeGuru

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I guess I am playing devil's advocate here. You want your parents to plan THEIR 50th Wedding Anniversary around your wife's theoretical, future pregnancy?

I'm guessing that your parents are in their mid 70's. How many group family trips are in their future?

Several years ago, my in-laws planned a full trip for all the kids, spouses and grandkids. It was a very hard trip for me due to some medical issues at the time, and I did contemplate not going, but it was THEIR trip. I am so glad that i sucked it up and went because they can no longer travel and they still talk about how fun it was to have everyone there.
« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 04:52:23 AM by CupcakeGuru »

MayDay

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Cupcake Guru, a 15 month delay in conception does not seem reasonable, considering the trip could be to literally anywhere else in the world.

He isn't saying no, he is saying let's go somewhere without Zika.


Lady SA

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I wouldn't go on the trip.
1. your wife will be miserable anyway because she is prone to seasickness
2. zika risk is way to high and potentially throws your family planning plan out the window
3. the guilt tripping is quite offputting and I have no tolerance for that, let alone the desire to reward them for it with my presence
4. the utter unwillingness to make any changes to accommodate your family means that your parents are forcing a "my way or the highway" situation, and so they should be willing to accept the natural consequences of that.

Yes, this is "their" anniversary trip, but that in no way obligates you to attend. "This doesn't work for us, thanks. We will see you when you get back."
Here's the thing. Your parents are essentially acting as "hosts" in this scenario, because they are setting up the logistics/plan/timing. Good hosting etiquette includes making an effort to accommodate your guests needs AND if your gathering doesn't work for someone for one reason or another, gracefully accept that they can't attend, or be flexible if you really want them there. Your parents are doing neither.

I would cancel as soon as possible (and pay any incurred penalties so no one is holding that over your head to guilt you later), and offer an alternative way of celebrating with them because cruising at all is not gonna work (they've already shot all those suggestions down). Maybe offer to host a party on land after they get back, or come spend a special weekend with them.
They are adults. They can handle some disappointment that one of their kids' families won't be able to come to their anniversary cruise extravaganza.

Be prepared for massive guilt tripping, and stay strong. Don't contort your own family into knots to accommodate your parents' rigidity. That rigidity means their plans wont work for everyone (even if they desperately want it to), and they need to learn to be ok with that. You aren't asking for the moon, here. You are asking for basic respect and autonomy.

jeromedawg

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I guess I am playing devil's advocate here. You want your parents to plan THEIR 50th Wedding Anniversary around your wife's theoretical, future pregnancy?

I'm guessing that your parents are in their mid 70's. How many group family trips are in their future?

Several years ago, my in-laws planned a full trip for all the kids, spouses and grandkids. It was a very hard trip for me due to some medical issues at the time, and I did contemplate not going, but it was THEIR trip. I am so glad that i sucked it up and went because they can no longer travel and they still talk about how fun it was to have everyone there.

I can see the point here but MayDay is right - we could go literally anywhere else: why does it have to be constrained to the preferences of this other family? Why are they so important?

One of my brothers is sort of taking their side with an SMH attitude: "it's *their" trip - let them do what they want. If you don't want to go, then don't go" - of course, he already expressed discontent with the destination. Even the agent who booked our trip said the destinations we would be going to (Tortola and St. Thomas) will likely still be recovering from the hurricane damage, and my dad agreed. So I'm sort of at a loss as to why everything is banking on it being my mom's decision. Then again, I guess I'm not - she's the school district admin/principal/teacher/etc who thinks that no wrong can be done by her and that her way is the best way.

It's going to be sad if some or not all of us will make it but that's going to ultimately be on them due to their insistence on prioritizing preferences outside their immediate family.

I'm still leaning towards going and taking my son IF my wife is expecting at that point in time (we are not planning to try to have one *before* the cruise at this point). My wife will have the alone time with our daughter and it actually might be nice  'downtime' so that my wife isn't dealing with two kids and can just spend time with our daughter. I'll be sad but that might be a reasonable compromise. At this point, if my parents bring anything up or give us any more guilt trips or hard times with the intention of guilt tripping us all into going, I'm going to start bringing up why they have to prioritize this other family. Of course, my brother was doing this the entire time they were passively planning and talking about the trip (why does it need to be with this other family? Can we just do our own thing?) and my parents couldn't give a reasonable explanation other than a very vague "because it's our 50th anniversary".
« Last Edit: March 16, 2018, 11:09:32 AM by jeromedawg »

Catbert

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decision. Then again, I guess I'm not - she's the school district admin/principal/teacher/etc who thinks that no wrong can be done by her and that her way is the best way.

It's going to be sad if some or not all of us will make it but that's going to ultimately be on them due to their insistence on prioritizing preferences outside their immediate family.

I'm still leaning towards going and taking my son IF my wife is expecting at that point in time (we are not planning to try to have one *before* the cruise at this point). My wife will have the alone time with our daughter and it actually might be nice  'downtime' so that my wife isn't dealing with two kids and can just spend time with our daughter. I'll be sad but that might be a reasonable compromise. At this point, if my parents bring anything up or give us any more guilt trips or hard times with the intention of guilt tripping us all into going, I'm going to start bringing up why they have to prioritize this other family. Of course, my brother was doing this the entire time they were passively planning and talking about the trip (why does it need to be with this other family? Can we just do our own thing?) and my parents couldn't give a reasonable explanation other than a very vague "because it's our 50th anniversary".

First, I gotta say that "because it's our 50th anniversary" is enough reason IMO for them to decide on the timing and destination.  That said I like the possible "compromise" you outlined - assuming your wife likes the idea.  However, if you're all going to bail on the trip do it sooner rather than later. 

jeromedawg

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decision. Then again, I guess I'm not - she's the school district admin/principal/teacher/etc who thinks that no wrong can be done by her and that her way is the best way.

It's going to be sad if some or not all of us will make it but that's going to ultimately be on them due to their insistence on prioritizing preferences outside their immediate family.

I'm still leaning towards going and taking my son IF my wife is expecting at that point in time (we are not planning to try to have one *before* the cruise at this point). My wife will have the alone time with our daughter and it actually might be nice  'downtime' so that my wife isn't dealing with two kids and can just spend time with our daughter. I'll be sad but that might be a reasonable compromise. At this point, if my parents bring anything up or give us any more guilt trips or hard times with the intention of guilt tripping us all into going, I'm going to start bringing up why they have to prioritize this other family. Of course, my brother was doing this the entire time they were passively planning and talking about the trip (why does it need to be with this other family? Can we just do our own thing?) and my parents couldn't give a reasonable explanation other than a very vague "because it's our 50th anniversary".

First, I gotta say that "because it's our 50th anniversary" is enough reason IMO for them to decide on the timing and destination.  That said I like the possible "compromise" you outlined - assuming your wife likes the idea.  However, if you're all going to bail on the trip do it sooner rather than later.

It's enough reason for them to decide on timing and destination, sure. But IMO not a very good explanation as to the question: "why is everything banking on this OTHER family and their preferences?" --- "because it's our 50th anniversary" sounds quite silly put in that context.

Thinking about it, the other couple and my parents had their anniversaries weeks apart, so I'm sure that's a big part of it too. But elevating that above immediate family for the sake of "our 50th" is putting the cart before the horse. In essence, she's saying "it's really important that you're all here. But it's also more important that we do it with this other family and go by their schedule"

Cromacster

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decision. Then again, I guess I'm not - she's the school district admin/principal/teacher/etc who thinks that no wrong can be done by her and that her way is the best way.

It's going to be sad if some or not all of us will make it but that's going to ultimately be on them due to their insistence on prioritizing preferences outside their immediate family.

I'm still leaning towards going and taking my son IF my wife is expecting at that point in time (we are not planning to try to have one *before* the cruise at this point). My wife will have the alone time with our daughter and it actually might be nice  'downtime' so that my wife isn't dealing with two kids and can just spend time with our daughter. I'll be sad but that might be a reasonable compromise. At this point, if my parents bring anything up or give us any more guilt trips or hard times with the intention of guilt tripping us all into going, I'm going to start bringing up why they have to prioritize this other family. Of course, my brother was doing this the entire time they were passively planning and talking about the trip (why does it need to be with this other family? Can we just do our own thing?) and my parents couldn't give a reasonable explanation other than a very vague "because it's our 50th anniversary".

First, I gotta say that "because it's our 50th anniversary" is enough reason IMO for them to decide on the timing and destination.  That said I like the possible "compromise" you outlined - assuming your wife likes the idea.  However, if you're all going to bail on the trip do it sooner rather than later.

It's enough reason for them to decide on timing and destination, sure. But IMO not a very good explanation as to the question: "why is everything banking on this OTHER family and their preferences?" --- "because it's our 50th anniversary" sounds quite silly put in that context.

Thinking about it, the other couple and my parents had their anniversaries weeks apart, so I'm sure that's a big part of it too. But elevating that above immediate family for the sake of "our 50th" is putting the cart before the horse. In essence, she's saying "it's really important that you're all here. But it's also more important that we do it with this other family and go by their schedule"

Maybe they are using the other family as a scapegoat. They really want to do this cruise with their friends, so that's what they are planning.  This allows them to pass the blame for the where/why.  In the end I guess it really doesn't matter as it is their anniversary.  Them trying to guilt you into joining them is another issue.

Mr. Green

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My wife and I are also trying to have a kid. We reserved a room at a Sandals resort in Jamaica in August before we remembered about Zika. After checking with the CDC we cancelled. I know the odds are small but with Zika the issue is how bad the birth defects are. Another HUGE thing worth considering is that 6 months might be short for how long it would stay in your reproductive system. There are confirmed cases of Zika still being present in semen 12 months after infection. I'm 34 and my wife is 32 so the though of delaying any attempt to get pregnant for over a year is a risk we're just not willing to take.

jeromedawg

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My wife and I are also trying to have a kid. We reserved a room at a Sandals resort in Jamaica in August before we remembered about Zika. After checking with the CDC we cancelled. I know the odds are small but with Zika the issue is how bad the birth defects are. Another HUGE thing worth considering is that 6 months might be short for how long it would stay in your reproductive system. There are confirmed cases of Zika still being present in semen 12 months after infection. I'm 34 and my wife is 32 so the though of delaying any attempt to get pregnant for over a year is a risk we're just not willing to take.

That's another salient point about the "6 month" rule - they say to wait "at least" 6 months but there's no guarantee that it will be gone after that. I'm assuming you can go have blood tests/samples/etc done but that seems unnecessary if it can be avoided up front.

If we are not pregnant by 3-4 months out, we will end up canceling in full. We *might* be okay sending off our oldest despite my reservations - considering my brothers and their families will be going, I think he'll be OK. If it were just my parents and nobody else, I'd be a bit more concerned.

mm1970

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My wife and I are also trying to have a kid. We reserved a room at a Sandals resort in Jamaica in August before we remembered about Zika. After checking with the CDC we cancelled. I know the odds are small but with Zika the issue is how bad the birth defects are. Another HUGE thing worth considering is that 6 months might be short for how long it would stay in your reproductive system. There are confirmed cases of Zika still being present in semen 12 months after infection. I'm 34 and my wife is 32 so the though of delaying any attempt to get pregnant for over a year is a risk we're just not willing to take.

That's another salient point about the "6 month" rule - they say to wait "at least" 6 months but there's no guarantee that it will be gone after that. I'm assuming you can go have blood tests/samples/etc done but that seems unnecessary if it can be avoided up front.

If we are not pregnant by 3-4 months out, we will end up canceling in full. We *might* be okay sending off our oldest despite my reservations - considering my brothers and their families will be going, I think he'll be OK. If it were just my parents and nobody else, I'd be a bit more concerned.
I would either go with the kid or not go.

I wouldn't send the 2 year old without his parent.

MayDay

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Here's another thought- if you and your son go while your wife is pregnant,you have to wear a condom for the rest of the pregnancy (or not have sex).

Sending a text year old on a big group vacation seems like a bad idea in general but obviously depends on the individuals involved. But if your parents want to have fun with their friends, howich childcare will they want to do? And has your brother said he'll watch your toddler?

jeromedawg

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Here's another thought- if you and your son go while your wife is pregnant,you have to wear a condom for the rest of the pregnancy (or not have sex).

Sending a text year old on a big group vacation seems like a bad idea in general but obviously depends on the individuals involved. But if your parents want to have fun with their friends, howich childcare will they want to do? And has your brother said he'll watch your toddler?

My wife and I are also trying to have a kid. We reserved a room at a Sandals resort in Jamaica in August before we remembered about Zika. After checking with the CDC we cancelled. I know the odds are small but with Zika the issue is how bad the birth defects are. Another HUGE thing worth considering is that 6 months might be short for how long it would stay in your reproductive system. There are confirmed cases of Zika still being present in semen 12 months after infection. I'm 34 and my wife is 32 so the though of delaying any attempt to get pregnant for over a year is a risk we're just not willing to take.

That's another salient point about the "6 month" rule - they say to wait "at least" 6 months but there's no guarantee that it will be gone after that. I'm assuming you can go have blood tests/samples/etc done but that seems unnecessary if it can be avoided up front.

If we are not pregnant by 3-4 months out, we will end up canceling in full. We *might* be okay sending off our oldest despite my reservations - considering my brothers and their families will be going, I think he'll be OK. If it were just my parents and nobody else, I'd be a bit more concerned.
I would either go with the kid or not go.

I wouldn't send the 2 year old without his parent.


He will be a bit older by then - almost 4yrs old by that point in time

obstinate

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We have opted not to do any travel to areas that are affected by Zika until we are done with the kid thing. It's one of those low risk but catastrophic consequences type of things.

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I have to agree No chance of Zika, if you are having another child do not go.

jeromedawg

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My wife and I are also trying to have a kid. We reserved a room at a Sandals resort in Jamaica in August before we remembered about Zika. After checking with the CDC we cancelled. I know the odds are small but with Zika the issue is how bad the birth defects are. Another HUGE thing worth considering is that 6 months might be short for how long it would stay in your reproductive system. There are confirmed cases of Zika still being present in semen 12 months after infection. I'm 34 and my wife is 32 so the though of delaying any attempt to get pregnant for over a year is a risk we're just not willing to take.

BTW: what are your sources for Zika being present up to 12 months after? I haven't come across anything but I may just be missing something. In fact, I've seen more recent articles stating that Zika persists less than 6 months. It seems like it's just one of those things though where nobody really knows for sure - so why even risk it, right?

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Theyíre being jerks. Just donít go. Stand up for yourself.

I also have a four-year-old who is close with our relatives and I donít think Iíd send her on a cruise with any of them. I would expect to get back a super whiny entitled-feeling kid because whoever they were with would just do whatever my daughter wanted, but maybe thatís just my family.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2018, 05:05:31 AM by ShoulderThingThatGoesUp »

jeromedawg

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They’re being jerks. Just don’t go. Stand up for yourself.

I also have a four-year-old who is close with our relatives and I don’t think I’d send her on a cruise with any of them. I would expect to get back a super whiny entitled-feeling kid because whoever they were with would just do whatever my daughter wanted, but maybe that’s just my family.

I'm drafting up another email asking them to consider changing to a different destination. If not, we will definitely cancel if the advisory isn't lifted by 4 months out. I'm just going to keep reminding them on a regular basis too. We would like to go if possible but as long as Zika is in the picture no way. There is a chance the advisory could be lifted like it was for the Bahamas. As far as trusting my oldest kid with my family, I think we would overall. It's just that I wouldn't trust my dad or one of my brothers taking him and watching him exclusively. My mom would be fine and I know my oldest brother and both my SILs are very good with him. We would feel bad about him missing out from hanging out with his cousins (all boys). At the same time, my wife "doesn't want to let my mom win" since she's obviously trying to control things and have her way
« Last Edit: March 17, 2018, 12:44:28 PM by jeromedawg »

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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Listen to your wife and pick her over your mom especially if it involves a baby and a chance to show your commitment. Just my opinion.

FIREby35

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Dude, I'd cancel over the sea sickness. Do you get sea sick? I do. I would never go voluntarily onto a cruise ship in the open ocean and I definitely think my spouse would be crazy for asking me to and even crazier for insisting. I literally throw up constantly and feel terrible. Every.Single.Time.

Not to mention being pregnant. Or the fact that its an expensive cruise. Or Zika.

I mean, seriously, you want to pay money for this?

I know you don't. But man, you gotta cancel. Sometimes, you just gotta be true to what you see.

BTW, they can have a cruise for the 50th anniversary. More power to them.

They just can't have a cruise and you. Their choice.

jeromedawg

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Dude, I'd cancel over the sea sickness. Do you get sea sick? I do. I would never go voluntarily onto a cruise ship in the open ocean and I definitely think my spouse would be crazy for asking me to and even crazier for insisting. I literally throw up constantly and feel terrible. Every.Single.Time.

Not to mention being pregnant. Or the fact that its an expensive cruise. Or Zika.

I mean, seriously, you want to pay money for this?

I know you don't. But man, you gotta cancel. Sometimes, you just gotta be true to what you see.

BTW, they can have a cruise for the 50th anniversary. More power to them.

They just can't have a cruise and you. Their choice.

I'm actually fine. My wife has issues. One of my SILs has issues too and I know my mom is prone to it too but she likes going anyway LOL.

We've been on a few past cruises but the last one not so much for my wife in particular as she threw-up a couple nights upon forgetting to take the meds but she was also pregnant with our second AND we had our first with us who also was sick leading into the first few days. The first few days on that one were miserable.

In this case, Zika is the biggest concern really.
(My parents would be paying btw, so we'd be freeloading hahaha)

I actually sent them another email asking them to reconsider going on a different cruise to a non-Zika destination - we would be able to book another cruise pretty easily per the booking agent without penalty so this is the only reason I suggested it. Of course, this wouldn't change the fact that my wife may not be able to go IF we are pregnant in that 24 week+ pregnancy range, but we'd at least be more open to going even if it's just my son and I.

This just ended up stirring the pot more, and revealed more hidden agendas/intentions: e.g. one of my brothers and SIL seem to want to keep the Eastern Caribbean presumably because they've never been so it would be a bucket list trip... but they're sort of hiding behind "mom really wants it to be THIS cruise" - at least, that's my guess, after trying to ask them directly if they'd be OK with changing to the Bahamas instead. My other brother and SIL don't care at all - if they had a choice I know they wouldn't choose Disney due to environmental issues, etc... this is the same SIL who also gets seasick. They're just going with the flow to appease whatever my parents want. My dad, who often screens and responds *on behalf* of my mom, threw out the ole "why don't you check with your brothers and get back to us" pitch to divert things, which spurred the whole mess.

At this point, they can choose the Bahamas and we would *probably* go, or they can choose to stick with the Eastern Caribbean in which case we most likely will not go (and I've made this clear to them several times... we are planning to wait a bit to see if the advisory if lifted, and if not will cancel)
« Last Edit: March 17, 2018, 10:54:59 PM by jeromedawg »

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I think the parents have every right to plan the trip they want, for whatever reasons they want that.  (Yes, even if that includes catering to someone else's wished.)  And the OP in turn has every right to not join the trip.  I don't think it's especially reasonable to be resentful about that though.  They are offering X free trip, and you are turning it down.  They aren't wronging you by not going on the trip you want, and you are not wronging them by not going on a trip you don't want.   Graciously decline, wish them a very awesome trip and tell them you can't wait to hear about it and see the pictures when they get back.  End of discussion.  Asking them to change for you (which I see you've already done) is the wrong move, so I'd let the go ASAP.  You've been offered a gift.  You don't negotiate for a better/different gift.  You accept, or not. 

Since there has been a booking already made, I would politely and simply ask what the deadline is for you to decide, if you think there is still a chance.  Or just decline now.  If they don't take your "no" gracefully, simple repeat that it just doesn't work for you guys but you are excited for your parents to have this awesome trip (to show that you support their choice), or some version of that speech over, and over again.  Under no circumstances should you mention again the terms under which you would attend (especially because, even if they make that change, it sounds like your wife still might not attend, and if she ends up being 34+ weeks pregnant, I'm guessing you wouldn't either.)

jeromedawg

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I think the parents have every right to plan the trip they want, for whatever reasons they want that.  (Yes, even if that includes catering to someone else's wished.)  And the OP in turn has every right to not join the trip.  I don't think it's especially reasonable to be resentful about that though.  They are offering X free trip, and you are turning it down.  They aren't wronging you by not going on the trip you want, and you are not wronging them by not going on a trip you don't want.   Graciously decline, wish them a very awesome trip and tell them you can't wait to hear about it and see the pictures when they get back.  End of discussion.  Asking them to change for you (which I see you've already done) is the wrong move, so I'd let the go ASAP.  You've been offered a gift.  You don't negotiate for a better/different gift.  You accept, or not. 

Since there has been a booking already made, I would politely and simply ask what the deadline is for you to decide, if you think there is still a chance.  Or just decline now.  If they don't take your "no" gracefully, simple repeat that it just doesn't work for you guys but you are excited for your parents to have this awesome trip (to show that you support their choice), or some version of that speech over, and over again.  Under no circumstances should you mention again the terms under which you would attend (especially because, even if they make that change, it sounds like your wife still might not attend, and if she ends up being 34+ weeks pregnant, I'm guessing you wouldn't either.)

Just want to make it clear that we weren't requesting a consideration for change based on the fact that "we don't like the Eastern Caribbean" or "we think it'll suck" - it's based on a very valid concern, and so we were only appealing to that. My dad actually seems flexible in that way... I'm not so sure about my mom. We are waiting to hear back. If they don't want to change it, then we are fine with that - no hard feelings. I just took issue with them guilt-tripping us into going and making us feel bad that if we didn't go they would be really sad. I was merely offering an alternative to address *that* problem: "if your priority is to have YOUR family all there and you'll feel bad if not, then maybe you should consider changing the destination. Otherwise, if you must keep the current destination please understand that we will likely cancel, and please do not guilt trip us about it"

Either way, we are fine. If anything, we are more upset now about learning of my brother/SILs' obvious motive of this being some sort of bucket list trip and then hiding behind my parents to push keeping it.

I told them no hard feelings if we can't go, we are just trying to make things work to the best of our ability but in prioritizing our own immediate family needs first and foremost. If they do make the change and my wife is at 24 weeks or more (where she can't go), she may still encourage me to go and take my son. The primary reason why we wouldn't do that with the Eastern Caribbean cruise is because if I contract Zika I'm contagious for at least 6 months and this could affect the fetus too. Otherwise, my wife might be all for having me go and taking my son (she would want my son to experience things more than anything but would want him to be with one of us at least). I would obviously be sad in not having her there either, so it's something we would have to discuss further closer to that point in the case that they concede to changing it.

jeromedawg

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Well, things fell apart fast after the last correspondence :T

My parents ended up just deciding to cancel the cruise entirely. But their intentions were revealed, along with one of brother's/SIL's, regarding the whole mess. We cleared up that it wasn't *really* about their friends more than it was having ALL the family there. Basically, my mom's stance is that "If there's a chance even one of you can't go, then none of us will go" - I'm not sure why this wasn't the case before when I had already told them there's a strong possibility we would cancel based on the fact of where they're going. Guess it didn't sink in until we pleaded with them one more time. I really didn't want them to cancel the whole thing because of us but my parents felt it was 'easier' just to do that than trying to figure out somewhere else. Really, the Caribbean was the only place they were willing to go (Alaska we did last time and there's no way they're going to agree to a European or other cruise likely due to the additional time and scheduling). When asked regarding the Bahamas, my mom played the "what if" game with "what if the zika advisory comes back" ? I don't think anyone cared to go to the Bahamas though, especially since they have already been, which leads into the intentions revealed with one of my brothers/SILs - we had asked them about the possibility of changing from the Caribbean to the Bahamas (this suggestion was made even PRIOR to booking and they didn't really seem to like the idea then but never said much in either direction) and they started getting agitated, asking why we would want to change it but not saying they didn't want to go when we asked them about their preferences. Yet the only thing they would say is "if this is what mom wants than we're fine with it" - they were dodging the question more or less, so when my parents sent out the cancellation email, they showed even more disappointment explaining how they had been planning the possibility of meeting up with some of their own friends and how they're disappointed in that as well as having to tell their boys the trip is now cancelled. I still think too that the Eastern Caribbean would have been a bucket list trip for them. So we went back and forth about how we didn't intend for this to happen and that we had one valid concern - it wasn't just some random preference that we have. They kept saying "if this is what mom wants..." so I said "mom wants ALL OF US to be together" - them bringing up disappointment in meeting their friends, etc just revealed that they had ulterior motives for their own preferences and were using "whatever mom wants" as the scapegoat. Ironically, this is my same brother who complained and questioned why my parents are so excited for this cruise they've planned out over a year in advance....

Needless to say, this has really brought out the true colors in some people. Our request has stayed the same but the 'consequences' have turned out to be drastic and I'm sure half the people in my family are looking our direction and fuming ("you knew about this for months/years - why didn't you say anything earlier" - really? Would saying something have really changed anything? I doubt it - when I last said something you guys disregarded it completely and still booked the trip. I was telling my wife though, along with some of what you guys have alluded to: "what do you think this would have looked like if we had waited until 4 months out from the cruise and then told them we were canceling? They would have gone batsh*t crazy!"
« Last Edit: March 18, 2018, 11:16:44 AM by jeromedawg »

Cassie

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Since your parents are older, this is a special event, etc I would go and take your son and leave your wife and daughter at home.  That seems to me to be a great compromise.

Mezzie

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You made a simple request/suggestion based on a valid concern. They blew it out of proportion. I'm sorry it ended as it did, but I certainly hope you aren't feeling any guilt.

Gin1984

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Since your parents are older, this is a special event, etc I would go and take your son and leave your wife and daughter at home.  That seems to me to be a great compromise.

Cassie, did you not read that zika is sexually transmitted?  No, no one who wants a baby, male or female, should be going to a zika infected area, if they can help it.  Frankly based on how limited our data is, I would even send a child, because their brains are still developing. 

jeromedawg

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You made a simple request/suggestion based on a valid concern. They blew it out of proportion. I'm sorry it ended as it did, but I certainly hope you aren't feeling any guilt.


It's hard not to feel any guilt at all but it is what it is. My brother and sil are obviously not happy with me because I essentially ruined *their* plans... At some point they even casted blame on us in the form of "you are unwilling to wait/hold off on having kids" in a passive-aggressive form. I told them we are unwilling to plan our family around a vacation...

MayDay

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You made a simple request/suggestion based on a valid concern. They blew it out of proportion. I'm sorry it ended as it did, but I certainly hope you aren't feeling any guilt.


It's hard not to feel any guilt at all but it is what it is. My brother and sil are obviously not happy with me because I essentially ruined *their* plans... At some point they even casted blame on us in the form of "you are unwilling to wait/hold off on having kids" in a passive-aggressive form. I told them we are unwilling to plan our family around a vacation...

That is ridiculous on their part. No one is stopping them form going. they'll just have to pay for their own vacation. boo hoo.

jeromedawg

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You made a simple request/suggestion based on a valid concern. They blew it out of proportion. I'm sorry it ended as it did, but I certainly hope you aren't feeling any guilt.


It's hard not to feel any guilt at all but it is what it is. My brother and sil are obviously not happy with me because I essentially ruined *their* plans... At some point they even casted blame on us in the form of "you are unwilling to wait/hold off on having kids" in a passive-aggressive form. I told them we are unwilling to plan our family around a vacation...

That is ridiculous on their part. No one is stopping them form going. they'll just have to pay for their own vacation. boo hoo.

That's very true - I told them they can still go. And considering they travel somewhere nearly every year (and have the money to do so) there's really nothing holding them back from going. Plus, it seems this vacation ended up really being about *their* plans anyway. My wife is more upset about their apparent agenda than anything else at this point.

The other aspect of all this is because they are going to cancel now, they don't want to plan anything or deal with it. Basically, they're implying that since we 'screwed' this up we should make up for it by planning something else for them. At least, it seems heads are turned our way. My brother and SIL are now complaining and implying that we screwed it up: "this was an easy way to have something planned...now we have to plan something for their 50th" - lol, how awful and selfish does that sound?
« Last Edit: March 18, 2018, 04:55:56 PM by jeromedawg »

Cassie

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Sorry but I missed the part about it being sexually transmitted. I would not risk that either. The Bahamas is really pretty and a cruise there would be great too.  I am 63 and would never put my kids in this situation. I would gladly change the location to do a family trip. WE have been on 5 different CAribbean cruises and all of the islands were great and they were all fun trips.   

Blonde Lawyer

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It's too late now and not likely applicable to the cruise situation but I was going to suggest researching beyond just what the CDC recommends.  The CDC is doing a very overly cautious scorched earth approach for other countries, but far less so for the US. I went to Singapore about 5 months ago.  The CDC had the full on Zika warning.  The Singapore govt tracks the disease like crazy and links, on a map, every single place that has had a case.  There had been no new cases for months and when there had been cases, they had been confined to one part of the island.  They were also spraying like crazy.  Once I had that info, I was comfortable going to the unaffected part of the island.  The CDC's approach to other countries would be like telling people here to not go to South Carolina because there was once a case in Florida.  I agree we should all be careful but it's worth digging a little deeper if there is a trip that is very important (work, wedding, funeral, etc.) Doctors are always going to CYA and say don't go.  I actually have a doc that recently told me no Florida which is just absurd.

CrustyBadger

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What about suggesting a house rental somewhere for the whole family, near the beach with activities for what sounds like a passel of young boys?   Or a family camp for a week? Or a resort like Nemacolin in PA?   

MrsTuxedocat

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I think that your parents aren't being understanding and are being needlessly cruel. I understand that it is important to celebrate as a family on such a big and monumental milestone. However, the Zika virus is a very real threat and it's heartbreaking to see the affects of the virus on newborns. Realistically, you couldn't travel if your wife was pregnant and to start "trying" you'd have to wait six months after you have visited the affected country.

Suggest something else, I think Hawaii is okay???  Or how about renting a cabin somewhere? Isn't this about family time anyways and if your parents have their heart set on the cruise, they can go as a couple.

You have to look out for your own family first.

jeromedawg

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I think that your parents aren't being understanding and are being needlessly cruel. I understand that it is important to celebrate as a family on such a big and monumental milestone. However, the Zika virus is a very real threat and it's heartbreaking to see the affects of the virus on newborns. Realistically, you couldn't travel if your wife was pregnant and to start "trying" you'd have to wait six months after you have visited the affected country.

Suggest something else, I think Hawaii is okay???  Or how about renting a cabin somewhere? Isn't this about family time anyways and if your parents have their heart set on the cruise, they can go as a couple.

You have to look out for your own family first.

Well my mom came around, sorta, by saying she now wants to cancel the whole thing in entirety. And one of my brothers/SILs are *not* happy about this (though they would say "whatever mom is ok with we are ok with").

Hawaii could be an option. Another we threw out there was visiting her siblings (our aunts, uncles, cousins) etc in Texas after she guilt-tripped us about how she's so sad they never get together... though when we pitched it she seemed less than enthusiastic, probably because she has tried multiple times in the past to organize get-togethers and a couple of my uncles and many of the cousin don't seem to care or want to give the time. We have talked about renting a beach house along the coast or cabin in Yosemite but someone is bound to complain. They want a "hands-free" vacation that doesn't require any planning (at least on their part). Essentially, they want it to be all-inclusive, more or less. The cruise would have fit the bill but they are unwilling to go *anywhere* besides the Caribbean. So options are quite limited. My brother/SIL are making us feel bad about this saying "this is all they've ever wanted" and "they've been planning this for a long time and you knew it" -- we've apparently made a mountain out of a molehill. Funny thing is, cancelling the trip in entirety was never our idea or intention - my parents came up with that. All we suggested was A) can we go elsewhere like the Bahamas or B) you guys go without us - we're fine and you'll be fine too. Of course, nobody wanted either of those options. I guess the third option my brother/SIL and parents were trying to get us to consider was: C) wait to have kids - plan your family around the vacation - our vacation is more important.

Blonde Lawyer

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I think that your parents aren't being understanding and are being needlessly cruel. I understand that it is important to celebrate as a family on such a big and monumental milestone. However, the Zika virus is a very real threat and it's heartbreaking to see the affects of the virus on newborns. Realistically, you couldn't travel if your wife was pregnant and to start "trying" you'd have to wait six months after you have visited the affected country.

Suggest something else, I think Hawaii is okay???  Or how about renting a cabin somewhere? Isn't this about family time anyways and if your parents have their heart set on the cruise, they can go as a couple.

You have to look out for your own family first.

Well my mom came around, sorta, by saying she now wants to cancel the whole thing in entirety. And one of my brothers/SILs are *not* happy about this (though they would say "whatever mom is ok with we are ok with").

Hawaii could be an option. Another we threw out there was visiting her siblings (our aunts, uncles, cousins) etc in Texas after she guilt-tripped us about how she's so sad they never get together... though when we pitched it she seemed less than enthusiastic, probably because she has tried multiple times in the past to organize get-togethers and a couple of my uncles and many of the cousin don't seem to care or want to give the time. We have talked about renting a beach house along the coast or cabin in Yosemite but someone is bound to complain. They want a "hands-free" vacation that doesn't require any planning (at least on their part). Essentially, they want it to be all-inclusive, more or less. The cruise would have fit the bill but they are unwilling to go *anywhere* besides the Caribbean. So options are quite limited. My brother/SIL are making us feel bad about this saying "this is all they've ever wanted" and "they've been planning this for a long time and you knew it" -- we've apparently made a mountain out of a molehill. Funny thing is, cancelling the trip in entirety was never our idea or intention - my parents came up with that. All we suggested was A) can we go elsewhere like the Bahamas or B) you guys go without us - we're fine and you'll be fine too. Of course, nobody wanted either of those options. I guess the third option my brother/SIL and parents were trying to get us to consider was: C) wait to have kids - plan your family around the vacation - our vacation is more important.

Unfortunately, people really feel this way.  My friend is pregnant with her second and had to miss her BILs wedding in Mexico.  Her husband still went and they are going to use protection for the duration of the pregnancy.  Yet, husband's parents were still furious.  She had been to their house in Mexico right before conceiving the first so why wouldn't she risk it now too? The reason is the stress of the risk of that first trip was not good for her.  Her baby had some complications that were NOT zika related but they had to rule it out first and that was rough.

Since the wedding has been planned for quite sometime, the family has flat out said they are pissed that they didn't just postpone trying for number 2 by six months.  Number 1 is only 1 so it wouldn't have been out of the ordinary to wait another 6 months.  They said something to her like you can't control when you get pregnant but you can control when you don't get pregnant meaning they should have been using protection leading up to the wedding.   Family can be crazy sometimes.

jeromedawg

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I think that your parents aren't being understanding and are being needlessly cruel. I understand that it is important to celebrate as a family on such a big and monumental milestone. However, the Zika virus is a very real threat and it's heartbreaking to see the affects of the virus on newborns. Realistically, you couldn't travel if your wife was pregnant and to start "trying" you'd have to wait six months after you have visited the affected country.

Suggest something else, I think Hawaii is okay???  Or how about renting a cabin somewhere? Isn't this about family time anyways and if your parents have their heart set on the cruise, they can go as a couple.

You have to look out for your own family first.

Well my mom came around, sorta, by saying she now wants to cancel the whole thing in entirety. And one of my brothers/SILs are *not* happy about this (though they would say "whatever mom is ok with we are ok with").

Hawaii could be an option. Another we threw out there was visiting her siblings (our aunts, uncles, cousins) etc in Texas after she guilt-tripped us about how she's so sad they never get together... though when we pitched it she seemed less than enthusiastic, probably because she has tried multiple times in the past to organize get-togethers and a couple of my uncles and many of the cousin don't seem to care or want to give the time. We have talked about renting a beach house along the coast or cabin in Yosemite but someone is bound to complain. They want a "hands-free" vacation that doesn't require any planning (at least on their part). Essentially, they want it to be all-inclusive, more or less. The cruise would have fit the bill but they are unwilling to go *anywhere* besides the Caribbean. So options are quite limited. My brother/SIL are making us feel bad about this saying "this is all they've ever wanted" and "they've been planning this for a long time and you knew it" -- we've apparently made a mountain out of a molehill. Funny thing is, cancelling the trip in entirety was never our idea or intention - my parents came up with that. All we suggested was A) can we go elsewhere like the Bahamas or B) you guys go without us - we're fine and you'll be fine too. Of course, nobody wanted either of those options. I guess the third option my brother/SIL and parents were trying to get us to consider was: C) wait to have kids - plan your family around the vacation - our vacation is more important.

Unfortunately, people really feel this way.  My friend is pregnant with her second and had to miss her BILs wedding in Mexico.  Her husband still went and they are going to use protection for the duration of the pregnancy.  Yet, husband's parents were still furious.  She had been to their house in Mexico right before conceiving the first so why wouldn't she risk it now too? The reason is the stress of the risk of that first trip was not good for her.  Her baby had some complications that were NOT zika related but they had to rule it out first and that was rough.

Since the wedding has been planned for quite sometime, the family has flat out said they are pissed that they didn't just postpone trying for number 2 by six months.  Number 1 is only 1 so it wouldn't have been out of the ordinary to wait another 6 months.  They said something to her like you can't control when you get pregnant but you can control when you don't get pregnant meaning they should have been using protection leading up to the wedding.   Family can be crazy sometimes.

I think it's usually people who either are done having kids or don't have kids themselves who especially have a hard time empathizing. That situation with your friend is awful... although, I guess a precedent was sort of set with her visiting right before conceiving but I also can understand there may have been added pressures to "visit your family" regardless and she may have felt the obligation was stronger than the concern at the time (and sounds like she regretted it based on your comment about how she was stressed out). Either way, it doesn't sound like something you want to screw around with in general. Everyone has their own risk tolerance and others cannot impose theirs on yours. My SIL's tolerance for risk is apparently high, but I bet you it wouldn't be this high if she were pregnant or wanting to conceive... at least, she'd be thinking and mulling over whether or not to go a lot more if she were.

That's a ridiculous thing to say and force upon someone, especially with hints of guilt-tripping all over the place. A wedding I can see as being huge though, and it's somewhat understandable from the perspective of "we've been planning this forever and you knew..." - so, I may have known but we're still not going to plan our family around *your* life. Sorry. It may sound selfish but nobody has a right to tell anyone else when they should have their kids. Perhaps in their perfect world, yes. But not mine. The frustrating part is that my SIL would keep speaking in hypotheticals after their meltdown and would point out that she's speaking in hypotheticals, yet use that as a way to passively assign blame on us: "it *could* happen but you don't know. And now we're planning [or not planning] something concrete based on a bunch of unknowns" - I never said I wanted to cancel the entire trip - that was my parents. Sure, my immediate family is planning for the unknown because we know the potential consequences... is there something wrong with that? All we said is that we may back out and my parents need to be OK with it (apparently they are not). And on top of that, if my brother/SIL just said "yes the Bahamas is fine" without imposing their selfish desires to check-off a bucket list item (which they can literally do anytime they want because they are loaded), we wouldn't even be in this position or situation. In a sense, they brought it upon themselves. I don't think they were estimating that my mom would respond the way she did with canceling the entire thing though, but they were *really* stuck on the whole Eastern Caribbean thing (and still are). It's really ridiculous and super selfish.

« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 09:31:37 AM by jeromedawg »

pdxbator

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It sounds like it worked out where the trip was cancelled. Have you ever been on a cruise? I went on one with my family and it was awful. I felt trapped! I'm just not that happy being in a floating hotel with all you can eat food.

jeromedawg

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It sounds like it worked out where the trip was cancelled. Have you ever been on a cruise? I went on one with my family and it was awful. I felt trapped! I'm just not that happy being in a floating hotel with all you can eat food.

LOL - this isn't the outcome I wanted. We were perfectly fine not going but my mom wasn't OK with that. We were also perfectly fine changing destinations but my brother/SIL weren't OK with that, and that led to my mom making the decision she did. The problem is that everyone is blaming us based on her and my dad's decision. We've been pleading with her *not* to cancel because of us and to just live with the fact that we're not going to be there - we told her that if she cancels this is going to cause a rift between my brother/SIL and us and that it's going to cause more contention there as they're obviously assigning us the blame. She has so far responded and more or less said "oh well, deal with it. and they need to learn to deal with it too" (in a nicer way).

I've been on a few cruises prior to this (they were all family cruises like the one we would have gone on) and we did have fun. Besides the seasickness for some people, I think we all still had a great time. Nobody wasn't looking forward to this. Probably the other thing that may make a difference is the destination and ports of call.

I'm a red panda

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I've gone on many cruises and loved them.  I've also been pregnant with a baby with severe abnormalities incompatible with life. (Which Zika is not always, but can be.)

There is no way in hell I would go on vacation to an area with a risk of Zika.  I've even told my work that I won't go on business trips to areas with Zika. I'd be willing to lose my job over that (though so far it has not been an issue, our Florida trip when I was pregnant was not to Miami.)

I'm really sorry this didn't have a great ending for you- but the reason I'm posting is to tell you don't let yourself be the scapegoat. You are not the reason the trip was canceled. Your parents made that decision. You were not the reason the trip wasn't relocated.  You offered reasonable solutions with "let's go somewhere else" or "you guys have a great time, sorry we won't be joining you". 

I am looking forward to another tropical vacation, but I want my living child to be a bit older before we do. There isn't a lot known on the effect of a developing brain either. I won't let her go to a Zika prone area right now.

Awesomeness

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Glad the trip was cancelled.  I just donít respond well to drama like this and itís unfortunate that your family seems to be the ďproblemĒ here when you arenít. Also sounds like thereís bitterness because of it which is just fuel for future drama.  All just a waste of time. 

Situations like these are easily solved for me if the power is all mine I just say no, I wonít do it, here are my reasons......   My exes family operated like this. Lots of drama and guilt and he never dealt with it the right way. Healthy boundaries is whatís needed.

I put the shoe on the other foot and look at it from a different perspective. Imagine treating your childrenís families the way she is.   I could not imagine being that demanding of my kids and prying into their ďreproductiveĒ lives. Even if I was paying for it. Itís beyond controlling,  I mean who doesnít like things to go their way but really come on!  And the deal with her friends? Accommodate them all day long but not your family?  Ouch.  Honestly her actions are appalling when you look at it that way.  Easily solved.

dcozad999

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I'd tell your brother and sister in law to piss off. My sister likes to try and lay down guilt trips all the time and it never works. Why? Because I don't feel guilty about whatever it is she's whining about at that time. I'm 42 years-old now and her bs has NEVER worked on me, so I'm kind of surprised she keeps doing it. She's the type of person that wants to have her way 100% of the time, which seems to be a strong trait in people that rely on guilt trips.

I think you and your wife are putting way too much emotional energy into this. It's all the back and forth you went through trying to convince them to change locations that made this into a mess. You should have said from the beginning, "Mom, I'm sorry we can't take this cruise with you, but I won't take my family somewhere under a Zika advisory.  Too little is known about the long term effects of this virus and I refuse to put my family's health in jeopardy. If you wish to choose a safer destination, we will be ecstatic to join you in celebrating your 50th anniversary. We love you, but please don't try and coerce us into changing our minds. The decision has been made." After that, you don't bring up the the trip when you speak with them, and if they try to bring it up and pressure you into going, you just reiterate that your decision is final.



Cassie

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i am 63 and both my older sibs felt free to boss me around as a adult.   My sister being the worse with yelling at me.  About 13 years ago she yelled and made a scene in front of my friends. I decided that was the last time. About a year later she yelled at me over the phone and I told her she wasn't welcome to visit me even though she bought a plane ticket for a planned trip.  I don't think my Mom ever completely forgave me even though we had always been close.   She died 5 years later. My brother no longer speaks to me and my sister emails occasionally.  They were never close but are now.  You didn't do anything wrong but if your family has a permanent fracture over this don't be surprised.  Family stuff is hard.

jeromedawg

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I'd tell your brother and sister in law to piss off. My sister likes to try and lay down guilt trips all the time and it never works. Why? Because I don't feel guilty about whatever it is she's whining about at that time. I'm 42 years-old now and her bs has NEVER worked on me, so I'm kind of surprised she keeps doing it. She's the type of person that wants to have her way 100% of the time, which seems to be a strong trait in people that rely on guilt trips.

I think you and your wife are putting way too much emotional energy into this. It's all the back and forth you went through trying to convince them to change locations that made this into a mess. You should have said from the beginning, "Mom, I'm sorry we can't take this cruise with you, but I won't take my family somewhere under a Zika advisory.  Too little is known about the long term effects of this virus and I refuse to put my family's health in jeopardy. If you wish to choose a safer destination, we will be ecstatic to join you in celebrating your 50th anniversary. We love you, but please don't try and coerce us into changing our minds. The decision has been made." After that, you don't bring up the the trip when you speak with them, and if they try to bring it up and pressure you into going, you just reiterate that your decision is final.


LOL... I'm so close to at this point.

My parents decided on not acting so hastily about pulling the trigger after we pleaded with them not to piss everyone off. They are very reactionary and emotional about it - not a good combo.

The only reason the back and forth occurred was because we offered an alternative destination and then my brother and SIL got involved with their agenda to 'stay the course' - if they didn't have such a preference, and said "sure, it's not ideal but the Bahamas works for us" this wouldn't even be a point of discussion and we'd all be going to Bahamas. But their preference was greater than our concern, so it is what it is. At the point they revealed their intentions about being adamant with the "preferred destination" and it conflicting with my mom's desire of "I want EVERYONE there," I think my mom (and dad) just reacted emotionally and spewed out "We're canceling" - that may have been a defensive mechanism or something to try to raise the stakes, who knows. We still have to discuss with her how this will pan out but right now it sounds like we'll be canceling and they'll all be going, which is *totally* fine with us. I really don't care anymore at this point hahaha.

This has been a dramatic rollercoaster for sure.
« Last Edit: March 19, 2018, 06:12:54 PM by jeromedawg »

dcozad999

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I find most families to be very strange. Or maybe I'm just delusional and mine is the strange one.
I can tell my sister to piss off (not in those words) and she'll still talk to me in a few days or a couple of weeks when she's done being mad. We are all short tempered and quick to lash out, but I guess we're also quick to forgive.

I find it hard to comprehend the stories I read about families being fractured and estranged for years/a lifetime based on an argument or disagreement. Maybe it's geographical distance?