Brand-new lady mustache

[tammyLav]

... snorting coke)

aww, I KNEW I forgot something... that doesn't count as a grocery expense? I also feel like you're being a little harsh on the old car... yes, it is an Audi, but we did go out of our way to get a very used car with a lot of miles on it. I just want to repeat that, lest someone think I'm whining about being broke while driving a $50k vehicle! It's not mustachian enough, I understand that now, but we could certainly have done worse. We had only one car through 10 years of marriage before that ;)

Quick cautionary musing:  mortgage rates are currently absurdly low, but they're not 2% low unless you've got an ARM or something with a balloon payment (or an uncle Vinnie).  How long does that 2% last?

I was curious about that myself, and called today to make sure I was hearing correctly. It's 2% fixed. So, I am not planning on doing much to pay that off until we are muuuch further down the road. It's really nice getting the opinion of so many mustaches on the topic of debt... Looking at it now, I still have some hard work to do over the next few months to get rid of the car and the plastic, but once we get past that, the picture becomes much better that I feared. We'll need to work hard to bring in extra projects, but it seems a lot more doable than when I first posted here!

[bogart]

... snorting coke)

aww, I KNEW I forgot something... that doesn't count as a grocery expense?

I guess it depends which sort you're snorting:  if my quip about the Audi caused the beverage to spew from your nose onto your keyboard, then sure, file it under groceries :) .  And really, I was (mostly) just giving you a hard time about the Audi, but, you know, since the group seemed to be on a roll ...

As for the mortgage:  cool.  One other quick thought that I forgot to post earlier -- you should be maxing your (and your DH's) retirement savings before you start saving for college.  You can always pull principal out of a Roth to pay for college ... you cannot use student loans to pay for retirement (and you aren't doing your children any favors by not planning for your future).

[tammyLav]

I'm with you 110% bogart. I paid for my own college... with loans, which I will encourage my kids not to take out.. and full-time work. I feel like I gained from the experience, and learned so much. I agree with MMM, that I don't want to make things too easy for my kids that they don't have the desire for hard work. I will help them out, but financial security and retirement definitely come first.

[arebelspy]

I'm with you 110% bogart. I paid for my own college... with loans, which I will encourage my kids not to take out.. and full-time work. I feel like I gained from the experience, and learned so much. I agree with MMM, that I don't want to make things too easy for my kids that they don't have the desire for hard work. I will help them out, but financial security and retirement definitely come first.

Absolutely agree.  A lot of people in the "Will You Pay for Your Children's College" thread said they wanted to pay for the whole thing.

I'm of the opinion that it's good for the student to pay for some and take some responsibility instead of having Mom and Dad pay for it all (when they are already an adult).  I want to prepare them for that, and help them, but I think it's better for them to not pay for it.  The Millionaire Next Door talks extensively about gifting money to kids and how it can be detrimental.

I like the way you put it above, well said.

[bogart]

I'm with you 110% bogart. I paid for my own college... with loans, which I will encourage my kids not to take out.. and full-time work. I feel like I gained from the experience, and learned so much. I agree with MMM, that I don't want to make things too easy for my kids that they don't have the desire for hard work. I will help them out, but financial security and retirement definitely come first.

Well, maybe 90%.  I'm neutral, honestly, on the college issue, or lean toward parents paying or helping.  My mom paid for mine (and I took out modest loans, which I paid off promptly), and I worked hard (at my studies) and got a great education.  I'd like to do the same for my son and did do the same for my stepkids.  But I don't think it makes sense to fund kids' college at the expense of saving for your own retirement (and my own personal choices/preferences aside, I wouldn't argue, either, that everyone should pay for their kid's or kids' college -- but it is something I had done for me and am happy to pass along to the next generation).

[kdms]

My two cents....just wanted to sympathize about the Audi, because I'm in the exact same situation with my beautiful, gorgeous, fun, eye-catching Ducati (Italian) motorcycle.  In my case that motorcycle is one of the things standing squarely between me and the ability to stay home with my son and raise him myself instead of shipping him off to daycare.  Needless to say, the bike's up for sale.

I think it's awesome that you've started this trip....initially it's going to be hard (but it'll get easier), and there are going to be days where you question what you're doing, but you'll get through them.  :)

[tammyLav]

Yeah, I took it for one last fun drive today. Will be listing it on craigslist tomorrow. We've got one of those great "car commercial" roads that runs along a cliff overlooking Manhattan and the ocean.. lol, I turned up the music and just enjoyed the drive, knowing that like MMM's "king for just one  day" post, I can always come back to this experience, but as the novelty it's meant to be. I like his was of describing how a happy life is one with peaks and valleys and plain old dull days. I'm treating the experience like a delicious french pastry...I know it's going to be delicious, but I will be a happier (financially) healthier person if I am not indulging myself every day. Doesn't mean I will never enjoy a car like this (or better) again... just that I don't need to own it. In fact NOT owning it willmake it even more delicious when I do get a chance to drive a nice sports car like that. It's not like my other car is a junk heap... it's just a more practical choice for us that i plan on leaving in the driveway more often!

Now that I'm an adult, the only time I really wish my parents had gotten their act together was when we were first hitting our financial skids. I wish they could have helped us. I want to make sure I'm able to give financial wisdom to share with my kids, and some money and advice to help them avoid big financial bruisings.. I'd love to teach them all about the MMM philosophy so they know from an early age what pitfalls to avoid, and what REALLY matters in life (which I feel proud to add I've known all along...  just have to get that money portion in order)

[skyrefuge]

We've got one of those great "car commercial" roads that runs along a cliff overlooking Manhattan and the ocean..

Hopefully you had a photographer strategically positioned outside to take photos as you drove by, to help boost that Craigslist ad!  :-)

[twinge]

I'd love to teach them all about the MMM philosophy so they know from an early age what pitfalls to avoid, and what REALLY matters in life (which I feel proud to add I've known all along...  just have to get that money portion in order)

I had vaguely mentioned the idea of extreme early retirement to my 11 year old son a while back and I just overheard him the other day telling his grandparents when they asked him what he wanted to do when he grew up and he said something along these lines:

"I'm going to do really well in school, get a scholarship to study engineering, work really hard and not spend any money until I'm stinking rich and then retire before I'm 30, buy a small farm and write books." 

So I guess the philosophy is pretty intuitive and appealing.  We'll see if it lasts the various pressures and temptations in adolescence, college and his 20s though...

[tammyLav]

Ok, I have to make a suggestion to the MMMs if they read this :) We need like buttons! I'm loving some of the comments... just imagining my car commercial/craigslist ad. something like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D930NyRYsz0. Do you think Tawny Kitaen is available for craigslist ads? I would think I could get a little more $$ that way...

Also, I love that twinge's 11 year old is already thinking about a money mustache. That is really cute.. hopefully he can keep his eye on the prize but what a head start!

[grantmeaname]

MMM has a good article about how to write an effective craigslist ad.

You could link the post for us to critique it if you wanted.

While on the subject of making a little more money off the sale: keep in mind that many of the things that make buyers willing to pay more are very cheap to do. You could get touch up paint for scratches, wax the car, vacuum everything out, clean the rest of the interior so it's totally spotless...

[Gerard]

I apologize for focussing on food here, but if your husband is spending up to 12 hours surviving on PB sandwiches, I would definitely spend some time on that. Ideally (depending on his work environment) he'd be eating a few small meals (or big snacks) every couple of hours. Maybe you could cook together for an hour or two on the weekend, and build up a supply chest for him. Get a big bag of chicken legs, season and roast them. Take in one or two a day. Or a meat loaf -- slice it and make big-ass sandwiches with some ciabatta or something. A tupperware of red pepper strips, carrot sticks, celery sticks. Pasta salad (with excellent/cheap costco parmesan). Pizza. Microwavable lasagna? Cubed cheese. Even a can of tuna. Give the peanut butter a new job (maybe for at home): http://rasamalaysia.com/gado-gado-recipe/

Topic change -- when I started commuting partway to work by bike, I felt way better almost right away. Dealt with stress better, too.

[mechanic baird]

Get a big bag of chicken legs, season and roast them. Take in one or two a day.

My mom and I survived on a $125 a month food budget back in the 90's largely because of this tactic. At that time, you could still find chicken legs for 33 cents a lb so we cooked up a large batch and took one or two for each meal, paired with some fresh veggies...

I think I am going to copy this strategy now to save more on grocery bill.. Thx for the remind..

[moneymohawk]

Haha, sorry to return to the lunch thing, but Gerard's post got me thinking again.

I can eat the same thing for lunch every day for about two weeks.  Then I'm done.

There's some natural limit here.  Talk with your husband and figure out what his limit is.  Then take advantage of it!

Mass-produce a large quantity of something.  As soon as he says "next!" switch.  Everyone wins!

[galaxie]

I think the Audi represented a twisted form of entitlement to me. It made me feel more stable, proud and "grown up" to have a "real car" as opposed to a compact... when in fact the car in actuality is completely the opposite of that! I think what made me so happy about it (besides it being damn fast, but that's beside the point) was the yearning to actually BE stable and "grown up" instead of the financial roller coaster (though roller coasters do go up I hear, so maybe more of a financial cliff-dive?)

Wow, I absolutely recognize that feeling of disappointment/entitlement about the "real car".  Glad I'm not the only one who's felt that way.

I had just finished grad school.  I was making grown-up money, and I felt like I "deserved" to have grown-up things.  Furniture that wasn't given to me by family members, nice clothes, frequent fancy dinners out (I'm a foodie so I mean FANCY).  I wanted to have the kind of stuff that I imagined grown-ups have -- like I'd been deprived in school and finally I could have my reward.  Compared to the income I'd gotten used to, I was rich!  I felt like I should be able to Have Nice Things now.  I was disappointed to find that I couldn't just go around buying everything I fancied.  I mean, I wasn't being stupid.  I maxed out my employer's 401k matching and I wasn't actually going crazy buying stuff.  But that feeling you describe of mismatch between expectations of "grown-up-ness" and the actual consequences of being financially responsible... that resonates with me.  I felt let down.

I got over it when I started putting those things up against my larger financial goals.  Do I want more pretty clothes or do I want to pay off my house faster?  I could have folks over for dinner instead of eating out, and drop that money into Baby Savings or retirement.

[tammyLav]

Oh boy, I stepped away for a few days and now there are so many new great ideas! I love the food suggestions Gerard. That reminds me of one of my favorite crock pot recipies... dump a bunch of chicken legs in the crock pot with a whole lotta BBQ sauce... serve it over rice and there's food to eat for days :) Mmm, I am definitely paying attention to the food thing, because it is the foundation of everything that makes us feel good. I do feel like I should have thrown just a little cheese at dear hubby (to go with that whine, naturally), because his company is constantly catering lunches. So he does get free food as long as he swoops in fast enough to grab it out of his coworkers' clutches.

Cable's gone, my phone plan is cheaper, and I got a Costco membership. I was pretty amazed at how many staples I was able to pick up for a good price. I took a lot of care to plan out our meals, which I found helpful too, and I have been using meat as more of a garnish (we had Tikka Masala tonight... Indian food is awesome and delivers a lot of flavor with cheap ingredients) Counting that we are halfway through the month, I've spent a little under $400. I know still a lot for most of you, but I'm learning :) I have many staples still, so the next grocery trip can be smaller. I am hoping to end up between 700-800 this month. Down from $1200... that's a $400-500 improvement! Getting rid of the Audi will save us another $500 when you count gas, insurance etc (Galaxie, you are so right that it is about thinking of the big picture. Being "grown up" is overrated in any case!)... That's $1,000 more in my pocket every month! This is definitely an amazing feeling, finding happiness with careful choices. I feel like a big weight is off of me already, and moving forward, as we get rid of our debt and get our finances in order, I know it's going to get even better. I like how MMM philosophy is all about the power of picking yourself up and doing something right now... Any small thing, and just building off of that. It is an empowering way to think of it.