Author Topic: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)  (Read 12015 times)

Bettis

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Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« on: October 14, 2014, 07:31:51 AM »
This stemmed off of my other thread but it isn't topical so I'd rather the discussion stand off on its own.  This isn't a financial thing, it's more that my wife is having issues nursing and she does not like the idea of artificial formulas.  Among other things, she thinks the formulas are giving our little boy acne but I'm not sold that it's the formula causing it and even if it is, it would go away just fine.  She did ask her doctor and got the okay to do the homemade formula but I am still a bit concerned.

She got the recipe from her sister's friend who did a lot of research and we have gone to a farm that does sell it.  I cannot find the exact recipe but it is a lot like the first recipe on this page.

http://www.realmilk.com/how-to/recipes-for-whole-foods-baby-formula/#rmbf

The farm's webpage (if it matters) is http://www.lawtonsfamilyfarm.com/index1.html

Since there are political ties to the topic (at least in New England, it's illegal in RI, legal in MA) it is hard to find honesty in what the benefits and risks are.

Does anyone have insight on the topic?  I really don't want my boy at risk for illness and neither does my wife, but she thinks it's better than formula and I'm skeptical.

Note: She has not started feeding him it yet because not all the ingredients have come in.  All she started to do was make the whey.

Tai

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #1 on: October 14, 2014, 08:40:41 AM »
No. Don't do it. Buy a quality, commercial formula. Or even better, get some help for your wife with her nursing problems and stick to breastfeeding. The reason governments started mandating the pasteurization of milk was to protect babies and young children from disease.

Bob W

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #2 on: October 14, 2014, 08:49:59 AM »
As a former WIC clinic director I would say no.

Use a quality formula that is not "soy" based.  Soy will make little boys testacies small.  (and big boys too)

Winter's Tale

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #3 on: October 14, 2014, 08:52:20 AM »
I don't think it is worth the risk.  I am sympathetic to your wife as I had nursing trouble, too.  But, I would strongly advise against this.  I can certainly relate to the feeling that formula is somehow not as "real" as breastmilk.  But, in this situation, I think it is the way to go.  A bout of food poisoning from raw milk that would be no big deal for an adult could be catastrophic for a tiny baby.  Have you asked your pediatrician what he/she thinks?

Second the idea that nursing support could be helpful to your wife (although I had poor experiences with lactation consultants myself).  Perhaps you could post her specific problem here to get some suggestions or input. 

BooksAreNerdy

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #4 on: October 14, 2014, 09:11:36 AM »
I own a family milk cow and I would say no, do not do it. We drink our cow's milk raw but I would never trust anyone else's cleanliness or milking practices. My 3 year old does drink our cow's raw milk but I would not give it to my infant until she was at least one year old.

GuitarStv

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #5 on: October 14, 2014, 09:25:52 AM »
Raw milk is not safe for infants.  There is no conclusive evidence that drinking raw milk is better for you than drinking pasteurized milk, but there is a lot of evidence that drinking unpasturized milk greatly increases risks of disease.

Breast feeding was very hard and frustrating for us, but we saw a bunch of people (doctor, couple nurses, midwife, lactation consultant) until it sorted itself out after the first couple months.  I know how hard things can be so no judgement if it doesn't work out for you . . . but make sure you explore every option as far as the breast feeding goes before giving up on it.

VirginiaBob

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2014, 09:32:08 AM »
When we left the NICU, the discharge instructions were very specific on what formula to use.  We were told that if we failed to follow the instructions, and something were to happen to the babies (twins), Child Protective Services would be notified and we could potentially be charged with negligence.

So no making our own formula for us.

tweezers

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2014, 09:35:59 AM »
I would reiterate finding a good lactation consultant or LaLeche League group.  The information and forums on Kellymom.com are also invaluable.  Its a sample size of one, but I'll also add that both my babes were exclusively breastfed and they had baby acne.

snshijuptr

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2014, 09:48:23 AM »
Step 1) Increase her supply:
       - Find a lactation consultant
       - Contact the local La Leche League
Step 3) Find human milk supplements:
        - Find your local milk sharing network http://hm4hb.net/
Step 4) Find a good soy or other milk based commercial formula.

Between these 4, you should be able to feed your baby all that they need.

I'm a crunchy mama, but the "research" on raw milk (mostly from the Weston A Price Foundation) just isn't very good. They like to compare raw milk to cantaloupe, but listeria infection is still very common with raw milk.  Plus, you are still feeding your baby Cow Milk! If cow milk formula gives him a rash, then cow milk is probably the problem.

historienne

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2014, 09:53:21 AM »
With all due respect, this is a terrible idea.  It's not even just that it's raw milk (although that's also a bad idea). Most young babies cannot eat cow's milk without reacting badly.  Milk-based formulas break down the proteins into more easily digested components so that babies can handle them.  By giving unprocessed cow's milk, you are risking much much worse reactions than a bit of baby acne.

Also, the doctor really ok'd this?  I am...surprised by that. 

If she really can't handle giving formula, look into informal networks for getting donated breastmilk.  A local La Leche League might be able to point you in the right direction.

Kellymom is the major breastfeeding website - these people are pretty anti-formula in general, and here's their advice: http://kellymom.com/nutrition/milk/milk-supplements/
"Cow’s milk is more specific to a baby cow than a baby human. Cow’s milk formula is based on cow’s milk but has been engineered to be closer to human milk (still a ways off, but closer). Many infants still have problems with cow’s milk formula (allergies, GI problems, etc.). Babies who are exposed to cow’s milk before their first birthday are more likely to be anemic, have diarrhea or vomiting, and/or experience an allergic reaction (the proteins in milk are more numerous than those in other milk products, such as the yogurt). The excessive protein load in cow’s milk can also overload a baby’s kidneys. It is deficient in vitamins C, E, and copper. It is harder to digest as well, often causing intestinal blood loss. A number of studies have also indicated that early introduction of cow’s milk may contribute to the development of Insulin-Dependent Diabetes Mellitus."

bonjourliz

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2014, 09:54:34 AM »
Has she gotten good support for her nursing issues?  I have several lactation counselor friends -- i am sure they'd be happy to talk on the phone if she wants to talk to someone.

I would do donor milk (even informally - from friends who are nursing their own babies and are willing to pump) before making my own formula. But TBH I have never researched the process.

How old is the baby?

Winter's Tale

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2014, 09:57:28 AM »
Another breastfeeding site that I found helpful was workandpump.com.  It has some good info even if your wife will not be working.

samburger

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2014, 10:04:03 AM »
I just read an article this morning about formula feeding that your wife might find helpful, if you want to pass it along to her: http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/why-i-dont-breastfeed-if-you-must-know/2014/10/13/74c5fd3e-459a-11e4-9a15-137aa0153527_story.html

catccc

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2014, 10:19:26 AM »
What are her issues with nursing?  Can she pump?  A lot can be done to increase supply, latching issues can be worked on... there's a lot to try (and maybe you already have?) before using an alternative.

Bettis

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2014, 10:21:30 AM »
I suppose it is unanimous.  I did let her know my concern and if something happened to our baby and I could have prevented it, I wouldn't be able to live with myself.  Dramatic, maybe but I read and shared with her an article that scared the crap out of me.

http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2014/02/a-mom-and-a-dairymans-plea-dont-feed-children-raw-milk/#.VD0v3_ldVg0

I asked her if she would return all the stuff we ordered (obviously we can't return the milk) and she's thinking it over.

As far as nursing goes, she was gung ho about it throughout the pregnancy but after she started, it would hurt her and she wouldn't be able to produce much milk.  She'd pump both sides and only get the very bottom of the bottle.  There was a lactation consultant at the hospital and we took a class with her while during the pregnancy so she knows how to do it but the results have been poor.  She thinks that since she hasn't pumped in a bunch of days, she won't be able to ever get a good supply so she just ended up quitting about a week ago.  The baby is 5 weeks old.  I doubt she'd reach out for any help but I'll urge her to try calling the consultant.  She's very... headstrong and if she even knew I was asking for advice, it would not be a pleasant conversation.

mrsggrowsveg

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #15 on: October 14, 2014, 10:29:33 AM »
I will drink raw milk myself (if I knew the farmer), but wouldn't give it to an infant.  I understand where she is coming from.  I would suggest going with a really high quality manufactured formula such as Holle Organics:  http://www.holle.ch/en_GB/our-products/organic-baby-milk-formula

I am a bit skeptical of any research by the Westin A Price Association. 

BooksAreNerdy

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #16 on: October 14, 2014, 10:38:46 AM »
My second baby was also born 5 weeks ago yesterday. Nursing was painful for me for about 4 weeks with both girls. Latch is the issue if you are having pain. 'Knowing how' because you took a class is BS. Every mama and every baby is different. I had to relearn how to latch with this baby. She had a lazy latch and didn't open wide enough. It bruised my areola and made even pumping painful. Then I realized that my pump flanges were too big. Also causing bruising and pain.

I also take a tincture called 'let the milk flow' that is made local. Check out your local health store, coop, or farmers market for tinctures to increase supply.

Nursing is hard. It is totally possible to get supply back after not nursing for a week. Look into it if you are interested.

Breast milk is best, formula is acceptable, cow milk straight up is not even an option for a 5 week old baby. Also, please make sure you are watching your wife for signs of PPD. Sometimes its rough when reality and expectations don't line up. :)

Also, even though my profile pic is of me milking our cow straight into my coffee cup, I don't necessarily believe it is 'better' than processed milk. However, it is surely better than factory farmed milk. At some point, when we no longer have a cow, i will buy milk from a small local farmer who pasteurizes his milk. We have our own cow because different breeds of cows have different tasting milk with varying ratios of milk to cream and what you feed effects milk flavor. Our cows milk is delicious and almost half cream. She is a guernsey, grocery store milk is from Holsteins. :)

historienne

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #17 on: October 14, 2014, 10:57:00 AM »
Get a lactation consultant to make a house call.  It may or may not be possible to improve the breastfeeding situation, but it's definitely worth a shot. Google "galactogogues" for info on supplements to improve supply.  Maybe try to rent a hospital-grade pump if the one she has is not working out.  Get donated milk from friends.

But, for the love of god, do not give unprocessed cow's milk to a five week old!!!  And if your doctor seriously approved that course of action, I would find a new doctor.  That is way, way out of the norm for medical advice.

Finally, I second a PPD/PPA screening.  PPA commonly manifests itself in overwhelming worries about baby's safety, which could be part of what is going on here.  Your wife should be coming up to her follow-up OB/GYN visit soon - maybe encourage her to broach the subject, or at least to answer honestly to the screening questions.

chemgeek

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #18 on: October 14, 2014, 11:41:03 AM »
Tongue ties can cause a baby not to latch properly, causing sometimes intense pain for the mom and the baby not to get as much, which limits supply. I don't think this is on most doctors' radar, so something to look into. Also, I've been told that the brand of breast pump matters significantly and that the only real way to go is to get get insurance to cover a hospital grade pump.

http://tonguetie.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=10

GuitarStv

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #19 on: October 14, 2014, 12:07:32 PM »
Our child had a tongue tie.  The breastfeeding was much easier after we had it snipped.  The midwives put my wife on supplements of Fennugreek and Blessed Thistle which drastically helped by increasing the milk supply initially.

ABC123

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #20 on: October 14, 2014, 12:22:39 PM »
Wait a minute -- are you seriously saying that you/your wife discussed the idea of homemade formula, and specifically homemade formula from raw milk, with an actual pediatrician, and the pediatrician said this was ok??? 

Bettis

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #21 on: October 14, 2014, 12:27:24 PM »
My wife went to the doctor late last week, explained everything and the doctor told her that as long as she was careful about putting the right amounts of each ingredient, it is fine.  I wasn't there so I don't know if the doctor missed the fact it was raw milk.  Wife and I talked and we are not going to do it so problem averted.  We're going to try to return all the ingredients... although I guess we are stuck with 4 half gallons of milk.  I don't even trust drinking it after all I've heard.

Beric01

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #22 on: October 14, 2014, 12:28:50 PM »
I don't even trust drinking it after all I've heard.

A lot of people swear by it, though I probably wouldn't drink it myself. YMMV.

greenmimama

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #23 on: October 14, 2014, 12:28:59 PM »
Goats milk alone is about the closest thing to human breast milk around.

We adopted and I hated the thought of formula, we had some great friends who donated breast milk and through other friends we found other mamas more than willing to give.

All 3 of our boys had BM till around 14mo, it was a lot of effort and love on a lot of mama's lives, we are so thankful. Those rare times we didn't have enough, we supplemented with formula, but I just loved being able to feed them donor BM.

I did try to induce lactation, I tried very hard, but my body for whatever reason would not produce more than a few drops, I tried all the supplements and everything, it was way more expensive than formula.

greenmimama

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #24 on: October 14, 2014, 12:30:09 PM »
I would def drink the milk myself, it's delicious, or if you prefer it cooked, you could make delicious chocolate pudding, or yogurt, or ice cream with it, it will be unbelievably good!

bonjourliz

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #25 on: October 14, 2014, 12:31:39 PM »
You need a consult with a good lactation consultant.  And FYI, hospital consultants are notorious for giving bad advice.  Not always, but enough.

Kellymom.com has loads of information.  LLL too, but I found kellymom to be more accessible. 

That pumping output is not horrible, given baby's age at the time.  And pain while BF is not unusual, but usually a sign that something needs to be tweaked... Latch adjusted, tongue tie clipped, etc.  Often easy fixed but the key is getting that good support in the first place.  And neither OBs, nor pediatricians, are well-trained in BF. 

As for the acne, it may improve if you take dairy (and/or soy) out of baby's diet. Much easier to do through BF (wife simply elimates that from her on diet) than formula. 

GuitarStv

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #26 on: October 14, 2014, 12:32:01 PM »
Don't waste the milk you already have, just pour it in a big pot and heat to 145 degrees F for a half hour to pasteurize it.

workathomedad

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #27 on: October 14, 2014, 12:33:47 PM »
We make baby formula using BOOBS

Under ACA you can get free breastfeeding consultations and help. I'd check with your local women's health place.

SisterX

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #28 on: October 14, 2014, 12:34:25 PM »
Piping up here as someone else who had nursing problems in the beginning.  Is the problem low supply, or something with the baby's latch?  If it's low supply, Mother's Milk Tea and lactation cookies, lots of oatmeal, and almonds can all help.  It takes some time, but they do help.  We had to supplement for the first 2 months but since then I've been able to nurse full time without help, even to get some in the freezer.  And, my girl had baby acne too.  Some babies just get it.
If the problem is with the baby's latch, have you talked to a certified lactation consultant?  If you can't afford that, or don't want to do that, there are videos on youtube about what a proper latch should look like.  Again, it takes a little bit of practice but Baby Krambigmac should pick up on it soon enough.

As for the milk, it should be fine for you and your wife to drink, but if you're concerned then I would suggest freezing it in small portions and using it in baked goods and for cooking, since the heat should kill any harmful things.

justajane

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #29 on: October 14, 2014, 12:48:24 PM »
What you produce from pumping is often no indication of whether your supply is low. Some women don't respond well to pumps. I'm breastfeeding my third right now (five months old), and I've had much less luck pumping this time around. I have no idea why.

They only way to know if your baby isn't get enough breastmilk is if they are losing weight or if they are producing no wet diapers. Otherwise, they are getting enough, even if they fuss or always seem hungry.

I would suggest supplementing while you try to coax the baby back to the breast. Or you can contact a LLL leader about feeding the baby pumped milk via a tube instead of an artificial nipple. We did that with our first for weeks until he latched on properly. It sucked, but then I enjoyed 12 more months of nursing him.

http://kellymom.com/bf/got-milk/supply-worries/enough-milk/

Christiana

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #30 on: October 14, 2014, 12:50:17 PM »
The Mothering.com forums are also a good place to ask experienced nursing mothers questions about breastfeeding.

The best way to build up supply is to hang out in bed topless with the baby, and feed on demand.  But I also strongly recommend getting some one-on-one help from a La Leche leader or the best lactation consultant you can find.  Sometimes there is just something wrong...especially if nursing is painful. 

This is a good time to pull out your Optimism Gun:  a little competent help will very likely get breastfeeding going well for your wife and son.



La Bibliotecaria Feroz

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #31 on: October 14, 2014, 02:47:44 PM »
Just to play devil's advocate, the latest research suggests that breastfeeding has been oversold. No one is arguing that it isn't "best"--it is--but the differences between breastfed siblings and formula-fed siblings are tiny to nonexistent. (Disclosure: I nursed for 6-8 months but both times experienced supply issues that I was not able to resolve/didn't work hard enough to resolve, and after that they were on formula.)

Store brand formula is fine. I used at various times Target brand, Parent's Choice (Walmart) and the Costco brand, which was the cheapest.

Your baby will be fine if he needs formula.

mm1970

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #32 on: October 14, 2014, 03:14:27 PM »
It's probably not too late to relactate.  Get a consultant!  Her supply might be fine, some women just cannot pump but the babies get enough milk.

I have to say that I had a lot of pain with my first child for six weeks. It was awful.  Even after, with nursing and pumping, I was plagued with plugged ducts and mastitis.  I nursed him for 13.5 months, no formula.

It was slightly better with #2, pain for about 3-4 weeks.  You'd think it would be easier.  I thought I'd go longer, because I was only working 6.5 hours a day, so I thought the process would be easier. It wasn't. Still with the plugged ducts, tried to get help from the doctor's office and they couldn't make time for me and that was IT.  So I started weaning at 8.5 months and finished at 10 months.

Formula is fine.  It is FINE. I used plain regular formula, most of the time Costco brand, but also Enfamil when we traveled because they had these nice single serving packets.

I am glad that I breastfed. I am very happy I did it and for the most part, enjoyed it.  But the plugged ducts were something else and they kept recurring every two weeks.  I think if i weren't working it would have been different.

I would NOT use raw milk.

(I was a 100% formula baby myself.)

SisterX

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #33 on: October 14, 2014, 03:24:26 PM »
Ok, I just went through and actually read all of what came before my earlier comment.  (Sorry, I glossed through the first time.)  I really sympathize with how your wife is feeling--I so wanted to exclusively breastfeed my girl, but due to complications with the emergency c-section I had my milk didn't come in for about a week and then my supply was really low for a while.  Disappointment, raging hormones, and exhaustion mixed to make me feel really bad about the fact that I needed to supplement.  And, she had latch issues which made it really painful at first.  I had two big sores on my nipples.  Ouch!
Our hospital sent a lactation consultant to me as well but, honestly, I was so out of it at the hospital that I barely heard a word she said.  It wasn't until I was out of the hospital and feeling a little better that I was able to really take in what a lactation nurse told me.  And, outside of the hospital the nurse stayed with us for over an hour diagnosing problems and helping to resolve them.  She did several follow-ups over the next week, too, and since I did have to supplement she helped show me how to use a feeding tube at the breast, giving my body the stimulation it needed to produce more milk.
It can be really, really tough on a new mom!  She might not want to hear advice, but it can be really helpful.  At the very least, the important thing is to let her know that she's not a failure and that you support her no matter what.  So many people get up in arms over breast or formula and it's CRAZY.  She might be feeling a little crazy too.  The first time my lactation consultant asked about the birth, I burst into tears.  I didn't, and still don't, feel bad about how everything happened, but I couldn't stop crying and felt like a lunatic.  Didn't help me at all, to feel crazy on top of everything else.  And I did not even have PPD/PPA, this was just normal post-pregnancy stuff.
She can totally do this, if she'd still like to.  It will take time, and it will be work.  But feeding a newborn is always going to be a lot of work, no matter how it's done, and she might feel better about herself if she can get some measurable success.
If she does want to keep trying, have her eat galactogogues, the lactation-boosting foods and teas.  And try, as much as possible, to make things relaxing for her.  No mom ever produced tons of milk when she was stressed out and exhausted.
Good luck, no matter what you and your wife decide!  And congrats on the little one.  :)

TrMama

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #34 on: October 14, 2014, 03:42:53 PM »
Congrats on the new little Mustachian! I can see he's already teaching you both about how babies have their own agendas, regardless of what we plan for before they're born ;-)

I'm glad you've decided against the raw milk. The risk is certainly not worth it.

Baby acne is perfectly normal in newborns. It's caused by all the excess hormones the baby gets from mom before birth. It will go away on it's own and has nothing to do with what he eats.

If mom still wants to breastfeed, get a lactation consultant in AND call someone from your local La Leche League to come out for a visit. If she's decided that formula is the way to go, then that's just fine too. You and your wife were probably both given a lot of formula and you both turned out just fine.

The first several weeks of nursing suck. The first several weeks of nursing your first really, really suck. Neither mom, nor baby, know what they're doing and it's like a big clusterfuck of the blind leading the blind. I nearly gave up on nursing my first it hurt so badly. The only reason I stuck with it was because we lived far away from any store selling formula, my midwives made several home visits, I had lots of painkillers on hand and my parents kept me well supplied with wine. Galactogogues are great, but booze is better. It helps numb the pain and helps you relax. Go pour her a glass of wine and tell her that everything is going to be just A-OK.

Also, pumps are crap. Unless she needs to be away from the baby for long periods, put it in the back of the closet and just feed baby from the tap. I was never able to get a drop out using an electric pump despite having oversupply issues.

Icecreamarsenal

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #35 on: October 14, 2014, 03:45:04 PM »
Man, is this a medical doctor?
That's pretty gung-ho with regards to your child's well-being!
Homemade vaccinations next?

Allie

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #36 on: October 14, 2014, 04:15:13 PM »
Whew, I'm glad you're going to skip homemade formula.  It just sounded like a disaster waiting to happen. 

My first spent time in the NICU and was started on formula and nutrition through lines.  He loved formula and resisted pumped milk and breastfeeding for weeks after he should have been able to nurse.  During a visit to my pediatrician, she called in the resident lactation consultant.  She walked over, grabbed my boob and my son, popped them together just right and declared the problem solved.  After a bit of practice, I was able to support him for a good reliable latch too.  It just didn't come naturally to him and if everything wasn't done just right, he couldn't latch correctly.  He nursed for 9 months without too much trouble after that. 

Having a good, knowledgable lactation consultant who can get in there and work with your wife and baby may make a world of difference.  I was a little uncomfortable with the idea at first, but in the end it was really worth it. 

Good luck!

MayDay

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #37 on: October 14, 2014, 06:34:58 PM »
I nursed my first until almost age 2 but my second quit at 7 months. I got some donor milk and formula fed.

The only formula I was comfortable with was Baby's Only. It was quite expensive but I was happy to pay. If your wife's concerns are Ingredients!&$@! then you might make sure you have checked out all the possibilities of commercial formulas. FYI Baby's Only is labeled as a toddler formula in order to comply with WHO guidelines to not market formula to babies. I also was happy to support a company (the only formula company that I'm aware of) that complies with the WHO guidelines.

By all means it's great to nurse but sometimes it's just not in the cards, and PP can be very emotionally fragile.  We are lucky to live in a country with safe alternatives to nursing, use them without guilt if you need to.

Goldielocks

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #38 on: October 14, 2014, 09:12:58 PM »
Ok
Did you know that a cow can be healthy and disease free and still carry ecoli in feces?
That is just one normal bacteria that can cause problems for people.
This is why milk is pasteurized.  I work in food industry, so I know how clean milk from a single cow can be, but I still won't risk it. Too easy for you to get it slightly warm or old on your end, too. It is not just about the farmer.

Buy organic commercial milk and use kefir per the option on the recipe. I am all for letting toddlers eat dirt to build their own immunity, but draw the line at babies under a year.

Also a great idea is to try to keep up with at least one feeding of breastmilk a day. If she has troubles, it is possible to compromise.

Miaow1

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #39 on: October 14, 2014, 09:31:23 PM »
I got TB from raw organics and it left me with long term health problems. TB is not easy to treat and the effects can be lifelong. Pasteurization is the heating of milk to kill bacteriaand viruses. non-pasteurized milk is simply not safe.

Freedom2016

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #40 on: October 15, 2014, 12:04:22 AM »
Ok, I just went through and actually read all of what came before my earlier comment.  (Sorry, I glossed through the first time.)  I really sympathize with how your wife is feeling--I so wanted to exclusively breastfeed my girl, but due to complications with the emergency c-section I had my milk didn't come in for about a week and then my supply was really low for a while.  Disappointment, raging hormones, and exhaustion mixed to make me feel really bad about the fact that I needed to supplement.  And, she had latch issues which made it really painful at first.  I had two big sores on my nipples.  Ouch!
Our hospital sent a lactation consultant to me as well but, honestly, I was so out of it at the hospital that I barely heard a word she said.  It wasn't until I was out of the hospital and feeling a little better that I was able to really take in what a lactation nurse told me.  And, outside of the hospital the nurse stayed with us for over an hour diagnosing problems and helping to resolve them.  She did several follow-ups over the next week, too, and since I did have to supplement she helped show me how to use a feeding tube at the breast, giving my body the stimulation it needed to produce more milk.
It can be really, really tough on a new mom!  She might not want to hear advice, but it can be really helpful.  At the very least, the important thing is to let her know that she's not a failure and that you support her no matter what.  So many people get up in arms over breast or formula and it's CRAZY.  She might be feeling a little crazy too.  The first time my lactation consultant asked about the birth, I burst into tears.  I didn't, and still don't, feel bad about how everything happened, but I couldn't stop crying and felt like a lunatic.  Didn't help me at all, to feel crazy on top of everything else.  And I did not even have PPD/PPA, this was just normal post-pregnancy stuff.
She can totally do this, if she'd still like to.  It will take time, and it will be work.  But feeding a newborn is always going to be a lot of work, no matter how it's done, and she might feel better about herself if she can get some measurable success.
If she does want to keep trying, have her eat galactogogues, the lactation-boosting foods and teas.  And try, as much as possible, to make things relaxing for her.  No mom ever produced tons of milk when she was stressed out and exhausted.
Good luck, no matter what you and your wife decide!  And congrats on the little one.  :)

+1. I also had a lot of trouble nursing my first. Sadly, homeopathic galactogogues didn't do much for me (fenugreek, lactation cookies, teas, etc.). What did work for me is domperidone. I got my midwife to prescribe it for me, and it was the wonder drug that boosted my supply to reasonable levels (although I still supplemented w/ formula, fwiw). One note: I believe it can only be made at a compounding pharmacy, which can be pricey. I started ordering it online at a fraction of the price.

My son also had latch problems, and wound up nursing only via nipple shield. I'll tell you it was a tough 6-ish weeks before we got things working well enough to continue with it. He nursed until he was 11 months.

Good luck to you.

agent_clone

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #41 on: October 15, 2014, 04:49:42 AM »
There was a lady on the radio the other week talking about breastfeeding
Link here: http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/lifematters/why-it27s-ok-to-bottle-feed-your-baby/5775278

She initially had supply problems and could not give her child enough milk.  She ended up doing a combination of breast feeding and formula.

I wouldn't recommend unpasteurised milk for adult consumption, let alone baby consumption as unless you are sure of the cows supplying the milk there is a serious risk from bacteria.  I have no idea on whether cows milk is ok for babies or not, however I would be looking at formula, you may want to use a different formula I guess.

Catomi

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #42 on: October 15, 2014, 05:48:21 AM »
I'm glad you've decided against the raw milk formula. I think everyone else has given great advice. I just wanted to add a couple of things that, if they were already said, I missed. First, it is rare for someone to respond as well to a pump as they do to their baby.  Milk letdown is mediated by oxytocin, which is a "bonding" hormone - and I've never talked to anyone who was as fond of their pump as their baby. So don't decide that she's not producing based on how much she can pump.

Second, the first several weeks are by far the hardest. I had a rough time with both of mine; the first was very little and nursing him hurt, and the second in retrospect has a lip tie. It would have been enormously helpful if I'd had their latches evaluated by a lactation consultant. In both cases I did this in the hospital, but I was in a total fog and it would have been helpful to re-evaluate later. If a baby is tongue tied/lip tied it can make it difficult for them to efficiently nurse, and can lead to weight gain issues or digestive upset if they're swallowing air along with the milk. Both tongue tie and lip tie can be snipped; I understand it's a minor procedure.

Finally, nursing is hard, hard work. It is time consuming and for me was definitely painful in the beginning. But it gets so, so much better. I'd say once I was past the first 3 months with both of mine, it got much easier, even downright convenient compared to washing bottles.  And the nursing relationship is a special one, IMO.

If she wants to relactate, she should be able to. Seeing a lactation consultant should help a lot. If she decides she really doesn't want to nurse, that is a perfectly valid decision. But I would absolutely go with formula or donor milk, and ditto the others that if the pediatrician knew you were considering raw milk and signed off on it, I'd get a new pedi.

justajane

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Re: Making Baby Formula (Raw Milk)
« Reply #43 on: October 15, 2014, 08:43:50 AM »
I also wanted to add that there are plenty of successful nursers out there who have experienced pain, sometimes intense, especially during the first few weeks. The LLL adage, "It shouldn't hurt" might be true but it is not helpful. Yes, a bad latch might be causing your wife pain, but painful nursing can be caused from lots of things.

I've been nursing my third exclusively for five months and just had a nursing session that I would describe as toe curlingly painful. It sucks but if you want to nurse you soldier on until you fix whatever is the problem. Pain ebbs and flows for all but the lucky few. And hopefully the good outweighs the bad. Neither option (breastfeeding or formula) is sunshine and roses all the time.