Author Topic: I have a potential job opportunity, but I'd have to move to the outskirts of NYC  (Read 4881 times)

JLee

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Edit: To clarify, it's the Ridgewood NJ area.

What do you Mustachians think?  Right now I'm making $57k/yr working for an IT company in Phoenix. I have $13k/yr in roommate rental income that effectively covers my house (owe 128k @ 3.75%).  If I move, I could likely get someone to move into the master suite and my house would be self-sustaining. I am close friends with my roommates and I trust them to take care of my house, so that's not a concern (unless they moved, lol).

The new job's details are fuzzy, but what I know so far is it is likely approximately $550/day (W2 pay), four or maybe five days a week from April through October. Potentially around $80k.  Housing is ridiculous. 2/2 apt likely $1500/mo, maybe higher. I would find a roommate and try to cut that in half.

I don't like New Jersey much, but I wouldn't mind spending a bit more time experiencing NYC (despite the ludicrous expense). I love Arizona and would want to come back here for the winter and find a contract job here. Alternatively, I could take time off - my buddy who's referring me to this job said it's possible I could just leave for the winter and return for the next season, effectively giving me ~$80k/yr with 6 months off. I assume this has no benefits, though, but it isn't 1099 income so I won't have to pay 100% into social security/etc.

I am thinking if I do end up getting offered this position, it would be silly to turn down because I would get a considerable raise and also an immense amount of time off, which I could use to further my overland/expedition driving hobby, visit my girl in Canada (though winters suck up there, hah), or find another job and keep growing the stache.  Also it would establish my worth in the workplace at a much higher rate (and give me some experience dealing with a LOT of high end equipment, which I don't do where I work now).

Downsides are instability, but as my house effectively pays for itself and I'm not bad at keeping my expenses low, I am not incredibly worried on that front.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2015, 10:54:23 PM by JLee »

Argyle

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What happens when your Phoenix roommates do want to move on?  Because eventually they will.

What is your ultimate goal, financially?  And career-wise?  How close are you?

I don't see a lot of up side it adds a lot of complication for not that much extra money you'll clear, plus there's the cost of going back and forth between Phoenix and New York.  Why not work out the financials of each and see what it all looks like?  Also where each would lead you in 5 years and 10 years.

JLee

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What happens when your Phoenix roommates do want to move on?  Because eventually they will.

What is your ultimate goal, financially?  And career-wise?  How close are you?

I don't see a lot of up side it adds a lot of complication for not that much extra money you'll clear, plus there's the cost of going back and forth between Phoenix and New York.  Why not work out the financials of each and see what it all looks like?  Also where each would lead you in 5 years and 10 years.

I could rent it again- rentals here go for a fair percentage higher than the equivalent mortgage cost.  More details are coming up, I'm being told now it's likely around 3 months in the off season, not 6. The cost of going back and forth is fairly negligible- ~3 days driving.

The jump from $28/hr to $55/hr is huge and I think it would be fairly unlikely for my income to drop much after that point. From what I am being told from friends in the IT industry, the earlier you jump up in pay the better off you will be down the road- establishing / raising the bar for what you are worth in the job market.

I can't plot a 5 or 10 year graph because there's no way in hell I'm staying where I am now for even three years. Two is unlikely. My current employer doesn't pay enough to make it worth staying. One of my coworkers told me he believes I could get a job for $75k tomorrow, so I am also exploring the local job market.  I am relatively new to IT; less than 2.5 years, actually. I've had an exponential learning (and salary) curve since I started, but I am starting to plateau at my current employer.  I am very interested in contract work, as I love new cities and am willing to move around from place to place. I can fit everything I need for 6 months in my vehicle so I am not concerned with moving expenses.

I am new to the FI journey - just started last month. I would like to retire in ~10 years, which isn't happening at my current salary (or current employer, for that matter). Ultimately I am shooting for being able to put $50k/yr away, but that's a ways off yet.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2015, 09:04:39 PM by JLee »

mozar

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I would stay put and look into the local job market. 3 days driving is not negligible.

Ricky

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I am thinking if I do end up getting offered this position, it would be silly to turn down...
Turn down for what? Sorry, had to.

Ok, two things:

1. If you move, make sure you are making at least a ~4% return on your money. If it doesn't cash flow, then you're better off selling the house. Just because its paying for itself doesn't make it a good investment. But it does sound like it would cash flow. Just need to run the numbers of course and figure out the return against your down payment.

2. Why not find something in Phoenix? Think about where you want to be long term. It's not about income always, it's about savings rate, and of course happiness. You already have a pretty good setup. You'll definitely find better opportunities nearby. Moving cross country doesn't sound like a good idea for you to me.
« Last Edit: February 26, 2015, 09:33:00 PM by Ricky »

JLee

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I am thinking if I do end up getting offered this position, it would be silly to turn down...
Turn down for what? Sorry, had to.

Ok, two things:

1. If you move, unless you are making at least a ~4% return on your money. If it doesn't cash flow, then you're better off selling the house. Just because its paying for itself doesn't make it a good investment. But it does sound like it would cash flow. Just need to run the numbers of course and figure out the return against your down payment.

2. Why not find something in Phoenix? Think about where you want to be long term. It's not about income always, it's about savings rate, and of course happiness. You already have a pretty good setup. You'll definitely find better opportunities nearby. Moving cross country doesn't sound like a good idea for you to me.
Finding something in Phoenix is certainly an option and I am already in contact with a recruiter. Part of the draw here is I have a good friend inside who can help me get a job that, on paper, I don't qualify for (I started just over two years ago as an intern, and now I am on a team of three people responsible for escalated / emergency support for well over 100 banks across the country - he knows my learning rate better than an average potential employer would).

mxt0133

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If you're going to take risks now is the time.  Getting that kind of salary and experience will help boost your savings rate now and in the future.  I personally say do it.  The time to leave a job is when you stop learning and plateau. 

DO NOT let an employer hold you back with regards to pay or learning opportunities.  As much as employers say they want to train and give you more responsibilities the cannot promote everyone, if you feel that you are no longer learning or are comfortable then it's time to go.  Years of experience in IT is not as important as the actual ability to do the job, so don't compare yourself to other just because they have more years of experience.  They could very well just have more experience doing the same thing over and over where as someone with less experience can actually do more and have better qualifications or certifications.

With regards to the house, rent it out to your friend as long as he is willing to live there with another roommate and then just sell if he decides to move out.

Ricky

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If you get the offer, I'd do one, possibly two things:

Bring the offer to your boss and see if he's willing to negotiate to keep you. If you're worth it, he'll at least offer you something. If it's insulting, then just move on. But if you move on:

Be ready to become serious about being a landlord, a long distance one at that. Or sell. Because the current roommates won't last. They'll leave if you leave and you'll need a property manager.

JLee

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If you're going to take risks now is the time.  Getting that kind of salary and experience will help boost your savings rate now and in the future.  I personally say do it.  The time to leave a job is when you stop learning and plateau. 

DO NOT let an employer hold you back with regards to pay or learning opportunities.  As much as employers say they want to train and give you more responsibilities the cannot promote everyone, if you feel that you are no longer learning or are comfortable then it's time to go.  Years of experience in IT is not as important as the actual ability to do the job, so don't compare yourself to other just because they have more years of experience.  They could very well just have more experience doing the same thing over and over where as someone with less experience can actually do more and have better qualifications or certifications.

With regards to the house, rent it out to your friend as long as he is willing to live there with another roommate and then just sell if he decides to move out.

I am going to ask for a promotion shortly - I was brought in to my team as the junior member and I am now migrating into more of a team lead role than anything else. If I get what I am asking for, I think I'd be in a good position to stay for another year. If I get shut down, then I think it's time to go for sure. I haven't plateaued *yet*, but I have a feeling it's getting close (unless I switch departments, which I could also do but I'd likely go from a 40hr week to a 50, maybe 60hr week - which I do not want to do).

I am getting burnt out at my current job. It's generally extremely fast paced and we burn through employees faster than anywhere else I've ever worked. I am ready for something else, whether it's in Phoenix (ideal) or somewhere else. I love the idea of contract work. Higher pay for the uncertainty and moving around? Absolutely - I love new places, new people, new experiences - and since I don't have a job where staying in one place for a long time is beneficial (hell I don't get three weeks vacation time until I've been here five years), and I'd like to take advantage if I have the opportunity. :)
« Last Edit: February 26, 2015, 09:51:45 PM by JLee »

JLee

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So, a bit more info...if it pans out, I'd be looking at an annual salary equivalent of $143k/yr for ~9 months (~$107k) with 50hr weeks (about $7500/mo net, without 401k/insurance factored in - vs ~$3100/mo now). I am still waiting for further information, but he said I have a good shot if I want it.

JLee

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I have updates!

I accepted a job offer last week - I start in NJ on the 28th. Permanent (not contract) staff, ~$36k raise, far better benefits, twice the vacation time, a massive learning opportunity, and I get out of the hellhole I've been working in (which has been getting progressively worse over the last ~8 months).  I'm renting a room from a friend at a low rate, so my cost of living will not dramatically increase either.  :) 

It's interesting reading back to my old post 7 months ago, when I was 'getting burnt out'. That point has passed now and it is beyond time to GTFO. Workloads are ramping higher and higher, we're getting even more clients, and meanwhile we have a hiring freeze...

If you get the offer, I'd do one, possibly two things:

Bring the offer to your boss and see if he's willing to negotiate to keep you. If you're worth it, he'll at least offer you something. If it's insulting, then just move on. But if you move on:

Be ready to become serious about being a landlord, a long distance one at that. Or sell. Because the current roommates won't last. They'll leave if you leave and you'll need a property manager.

One of those roommates is a friend of 7+ years who is planning on staying long term. The other is my brother, who will also likely be there a while unless he moves out of state for some reason. I've been out of the country since the end of May and they're not complaining about anything.

I would still like to go back to Phoenix after a year or so, but if this works out well enough I will consider staying longer.

mozar

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Thanks for the update!

cchrissyy

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congrats!

MBot

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Congratulations!