Why so much hate?

[usmarine1975]

I have been on the forum only a few weeks.  One thing I have noticed is that some like to project their ideas or thinking as the gospel.

This is a forum for open discussion about different ideas to help us propel to FI.  Certainly the core belief is spend less, save more, retire early.

That being said some discussions have went the route of gospel. I am right because you haven't proven me wrong, or your an idiot for thinking that way.

I guess I just thought we all have the same goal and would want to share and hear different thoughts on different topics.

In general I have enjoyed perusing and posting when I can.  My post here is to simply suggest that disagreements do not change our end goal.

Buying life insurance, investing in vanguard, buying a truck, riding a huffy, etc...

I come here to be challenged and to get new ideas.  I don't know everything nor do I have it all figured out.

I guess what I am saying is being Mustachian is not religious in nature.  Its a concept Mr.  MMM drafted through his blog.  One in which we all can share some common shred of interest. We are not all the same nor should we be.

 There isn't one right way to be Mustachian. If there is let me know I will cease and decist and move on.  Being Mustachian is about challenging the status quo not creating a new one.

I love the forum and the blog because it helps me evaluate my own circumstances and set of values. And occasionally I need a face punch. Let the face punches commense.

[Cheddar Stacker]

No facepunch from me. I notice it at times as well. But stick around because to me it seems more the exception than the rule.

That said though, most of us end up here because we are fairly like-minded. It can sometimes become a bit of a herd, but there are enough differing opinions in most areas to keep everyone open minded and in check.

There are a few topics, specifically the one you and I just posted in a few minutes ago, that have a clear winner and a clear loser in the minds of mustachians. We've seen it too many times and we don't like it.

I keep my mind as open as possible these days. Its one of the best things about mustachianism IMO. But there are a few topics where ithe door has closed. That is one. I don't spew hate or condone it, but I do understand where it comes from on that topic.

[Exflyboy]

I guess I have not noticed so much hate.. Maybe I tune it out.

On the whole I would agree with you.. yes more than one way to skin a cat as they say.

We sometimes have a poster that is sa far out in left field that we can't relate to them or their arguments don't hold water.

Not so long back we had a poster making $70k a MONTH with a $100k a year country club membership and really not interested in being frugal and it was clear that "knowing the right people" was very important to her and her Hubby's career.

They were a little in debt (as in a "little" for them.. Hair on fie emergency for the rest of us) and were really not interested in making radical changes.

Yet she posted on this forum and argued at length.

Nothing really wrong as such but it did garner a lot of negative reactions, including from me to be honest. I had to  stop myself and be reminded that this was not MY life and if thats the way they choose to live thats great.

Until another 2008 happens of course.

I think that was the worst chain of "hatred" we had, but even that dialogue had mostly civil discussion.

Frank

[marty998]

This is about the current Insurance thread isn't it?

1 or 2 posts in there probably went too far imo.

[Cheddar Stacker]

Also go search the forum and blog for everest wealth management. That should give you some perspective on the hate toward this topic.

[brewer12345]

This is about the current Insurance thread isn't it?

1 or 2 posts in there probably went too far imo.

Fully agree.  The insurance salescritters failed to provide numbers or commit public suicide.  Standards have really fallen.

[Ohio Teacher]

I have seen what you talked about, but I believe most of it exists for two reasons. 

First, MMM is very blunt in his blog posts.  His wording is matter-of-fact, he uses much profanity, and he frequently speaks of punching people in the face.   I think many people, myself included, take the liberty of some of that MMM bluntness when we post in the forum. 

Second, and I think this is the big one, is when someone comes in and posts a question or shares an idea that is so unbelievably at odds with MMM's philosophy.  I get that we are all individuals and that this is not a religion.  But if you are posting on the MMM forums, I would think it would be a prerequisite to have read at least a good portion of MMM's posts.  Judging by some of the posters in here, that is not the case.  As such, they usually get flamed for it. 

Unrelated: OP, there is no way you are 14 years old.

[matchewed]

Also don't mistake people challenging your own views with hate. You may come in here and talk about challenging ideas but to then post about being frustrated that people have challenged your ideas...

One point is that if you do make a claim it is up to you to support your claim. Someone coming in and challenging your claim by saying "prove it or I ignore you" is certainly valid. That's like an initial filter for shitty ideas. It's kind of the point of discussion and learning if new ideas are worth the effort of learning at all.

Some of these seemingly rote answers are rote right now because of some certain key fundamentals. For example advice on skipping financial advisors in lieu of just figuring out a decent AA that let's you sleep at night and using index funds is supported by the time value of money, reducing repeat payments, a bit of DIY...etc. Someone making the opposite claim would have to provide some serious justification. When that isn't provided some people fall back on accusations of dogmatic thinking. And while that may have a bit of a ring of truth, it is also a bit lazy as all they'd have to do is provide some justification.

All that being said everything has to fall under the rules of the forum. Always see rule #1.

[ender]

I have posted and read a ton on here for quite some time and have no idea what you mean when you say there is "so much hate."

Are there some threads which end up somewhat heated? Of course, this is the Internet after all. It's bound to happen but honestly, as someone with probably 30k or more forum posts over the past 10 years (kill me now plz, lol) this forum is by FAR one of the more welcoming, polite, and civil forums out there.

Perhaps instead of making broad straw-man arguments against the entire forum you could address this a bit more constructively?

[Thegoblinchief]

Compared to the internet at large, we're all lords and ladies wearing top hats and drinking tea.

For myself, some of my bluntness is intentional. I want to shake people out of their comfort zone -- the same way MMM shook me out of mine.

[usmarine1975]

Thanks for noticing my age was wrong.  I changed the month and day to keep my birthdate off the forum apparently the year was wrong as well. You are correct I am not 14.

As far as this being about any one post it certainly is not.  My frustration may also stem from other blogs, online persona's etc...  In general it's too easy to be such online.

It was just a general rant from what I have seen in the past year and on here in the past few weeks. 

And I think my point was more that part of being a Mustachian or at least in my mind is not falling to the status quo or the common held beliefs or thoughts and to constantly be challenged. 

It's not just about the Insurance Thread as I listed a couple other threads as well.  It just seem's that in each thread you get a person or so who thinks they are the authority and I am not taking sides on this just stating. 

I love the blog reading it, commenting and entering into discussions.  I have not bought into every one of Pete's recommendations nor do I with every one who posts.  But I harbor no hard feelings to anyone who feels or does differently then me.  I think for me the point of the blog is to push the common held belief's or the idea that we must keep up with the jones's. 

Again I need a face punch from time to time and I like the term and have adopted it.  I didn't post this on any other discussion because it was not a one issue item.  I felt it warranted it's own discussion.  "so much Hate"  might have been a bit much, but I also like to shake things up a bit. 

[wtjbatman]

Compared to the internet at large, we're all lords and ladies wearing top hats and drinking tea.

For myself, some of my bluntness is intentional. I want to shake people out of their comfort zone -- the same way MMM shook me out of mine.

QFT. Especially your first sentence.

Some other things I enjoy doing on the internet include reading ESPN.com, Deadspin, Yahoo/CNN/Fox News articles, etc... and I wouldn't touch their comment sections with a ten foot pole. On the other hand, this place isn't nearly as draconian or as filled with kool aid drinkers as a place like Bogleheads. It's a happy medium. At least IMO.

[usmarine1975]

I guess I really should keep things in perspective.  Compared to other comment sections we are a bit mild.

[Middlesbrough]

I think there is enough self face punching that people are willing to volunteer that calling out others is acceptable. Nobody is perfect, but we are willing to help if you understand and are open to change.

[DeepEllumStache]

We are also following a blog that does advocate questioning the things society takes for granted (long commutes, SUVs, etc).  People posting on the forums are more inclined to question every response.  That can be a very fine line to tread (or completely whiff and fall off the edge) when you bring up a facepunch or an alternate viewpoint. Different posters will also interpret responses differently, someone might see a personal attack in what the poster intended to be a light facepunch or an alternative view.

[EricL]

I agree.  I have many opinions, ain't none of them humble, and tend to think everyone is entitled to them.  Especially when confronted by opinions that are obviously inane.  Kind of like, well, everyone.  But I will try restrain myself in the future to preserve general civility.

[skunkfunk]

Some things just aren't up for question. Transportation costs for instance. Biking is a no-brainer. Even if you can't bike to work, biking whenever possible is simply understood as necessary to live the lifestyle advocated by the blog, unless you have some serious physical impairment that makes it impossible. Having a dually truck you drive unloaded on the highway 120 miles a day is the opposite of this and therefore not acceptable.

Just for instance. I mean yeah you may disagree, but then you'd be wrong.

[usmarine1975]

Need a like button for comments we like.  I need a face punch daily hence the reason I daily read the forum.  And to think I used to wait for a new thread on the blog.

[FIRE_HELP!]

I guess I have not noticed so much hate.. Maybe I tune it out.

On the whole I would agree with you.. yes more than one way to skin a cat as they say.

We sometimes have a poster that is sa far out in left field that we can't relate to them or their arguments don't hold water.

Not so long back we had a poster making $70k a MONTH with a $100k a year country club membership and really not interested in being frugal and it was clear that "knowing the right people" was very important to her and her Hubby's career.

They were a little in debt (as in a "little" for them.. Hair on fie emergency for the rest of us) and were really not interested in making radical changes.

Yet she posted on this forum and argued at length.

Nothing really wrong as such but it did garner a lot of negative reactions, including from me to be honest. I had to  stop myself and be reminded that this was not MY life and if thats the way they choose to live thats great.

Until another 2008 happens of course.

I think that was the worst chain of "hatred" we had, but even that dialogue had mostly civil discussion.

Frank

I remember reading that threat - although, being a golfer, I don't think there are any $100k/year country clubs anywhere in the world

[TheNorwegianGuy]

I have been at quit a lot of different places around the very wide internet and have never seen so little hate (and so much support) as in this forum :)

[swick]

Compared to the internet at large, we're all lords and ladies wearing top hats and drinking tea.

For myself, some of my bluntness is intentional. I want to shake people out of their comfort zone -- the same way MMM shook me out of mine.

Har! +1

Once in a while things get a little too macho for me, but often the mods swoop in and spray some lavender aromatherapy and everyone calms down.

There were a bunch of threads I was going to respond to, but this was too perfect, how did you know I'm an aromatherapist? ;) Lavender really does work wonders! I wish there was a an anti-agro troll busting spray that could be dispersed via blog post!

Joking aside, We mods don't see everything and unless it is reported or we happen see it in our casual surfing, we don't always know about it. I'm Canadian and generally stay out of the controversial political threads and some that just don't apply to me.

 Please use the report function. In general, we try and let people sort it out themselves, for the most part our community is great at calling each other on bullshit - once in a while we'll need step in. Posters create the community though, and if there is someone or something poisoning the community, let us know.

As the forums have gotten bigger there is definitely more people who take a hardliner "I'm right" stance and there is no reasoning with them. There is a major difference between a friendly facepunch and using it as an excuse to be a total jerk, which we don't want.

[surfhb]

Some things just aren't up for question. Transportation costs for instance. Biking is a no-brainer. Even if you can't bike to work, biking whenever possible is simply understood as necessary to live the lifestyle advocated by the blog, unless you have some serious physical impairment that makes it impossible. Having a dually truck you drive unloaded on the highway 120 miles a day is the opposite of this and therefore not acceptable.

Just for instance. I mean yeah you may disagree, but then you'd be wrong.

I'll disagree.....I drive a 100 miles a day in a truck because my life requires I surf and work in post production in LA.    Best part is....i know I'm right ;)

Ok....so I hold off FI for 7 years?   pfsst.....Who cares!   I get to surf daily.....it's a no brainer

[Middlesbrough]

Some things just aren't up for question. Transportation costs for instance. Biking is a no-brainer. Even if you can't bike to work, biking whenever possible is simply understood as necessary to live the lifestyle advocated by the blog, unless you have some serious physical impairment that makes it impossible. Having a dually truck you drive unloaded on the highway 120 miles a day is the opposite of this and therefore not acceptable.

Just for instance. I mean yeah you may disagree, but then you'd be wrong.

I'll disagree.....I drive a 100 miles a day in a truck because my life requires I surf and work in post production in LA.    Best part is....i know I'm right ;)

Ok....so I hold off FI for 7 years?   pfsst.....Who cares!   I get to surf daily.....it's a no brainer

Absolutely no way you could fit your board on a car at all? Seriously?

[Beric01]

MMM is about challenging your pre-conceived ideas, not making you feel warm and fuzzy (though he does that too). As long as it doesn't descend to the level of personal attacks (I stepped out the of the cycling thread to avoid that mess as it was unproductive), constructive criticism is fine.

[sheepstache]

When I think of times people have complained about the forum being mean it's often because they want support for some decision that they've made.  Like, more than once someone has started a thread just to say that they're not going to bike or that they're going to send their kids to private school or something.  And not because they wanted to be talked out of it.  Members who argued with their reasoning were then accused of being dogmatic.  But the thing is, a big part of the MMM deal is that you can make decisions that are contrary to consensus.  So, if you've accepted that you're going to go your own way regardless of what others think, why would it bother you that a bunch of people on the MMM forum disagree with you?

That might be another way of agreeing with those who pointed out that this whole thing is based around the hyperbole of facepunches and we assume if folks have made it this far they can take it.

[usmarine1975]

I agree when it comes to hearing arguments. I like to hear another point of view and have my own challenged. I am speaking more to the if you don't agree your biased, ignorant, or have no analytical skills. Or basically the your wrong I'm right mentality.  Personally I don't think I have it all together or have it all figure out. Hence the following this and other blogs and commenting or discussing.  I personally have not been offended. I went through Marine boot camp hardly anything anyone says could come close to what I have already heard.   My thread was merely an attempt to bring it to light.

I don't pretend I am full Mustachian. I know that I am not.  And I am OK with that.  My title may have been a bit harsh but it did garner some attention.

Now off to face punch myself some more.

[Paul der Krake]

I think we're doing okay.

This is a place where frequent posters are aged 20-60+, of all political affiliations, earn anywhere between 25k to 250k, generally know how to spell and effectively communicate through hundreds of daily messages, and coexist in relative harmony. Like the goblin chief said, despite our bickering we're the cream of the crop of online communities.

So chin up and buy VFIAX.

[Beric01]

I think we're doing okay.

This is a place where frequent posters are aged 20-60+, of all political affiliations, earn anywhere between 25k to 250k, generally know how to spell and effectively communicate through hundreds of daily messages, and coexist in relative harmony. Like the goblin chief said, despite our bickering we're the cream of the crop of online communities.

So chin up and buy VFIAX.

Only a crazy person would buy VFIAX over VTSAX. ;-)

[Cheddar Stacker]

I think we're doing okay.

This is a place where frequent posters are aged 20-60+, of all political affiliations, earn anywhere between 25k to 250k, generally know how to spell and effectively communicate through hundreds of daily messages, and coexist in relative harmony. Like the goblin chief said, despite our bickering we're the cream of the crop of online communities.

So chin up and buy VFIAX.

Only a crazy person would buy VFIAX over VTSAX. ;-)

[sarcasm font]
You are both IDIOTS! The market is overvalued, payoff your low interest fixed debt, buy rental real estate, and buy annuities. Otherwise you're doing it wrong! Hate!
[/sarcasm font]

Just playin around OP. No offense intended.

[usmarine1975]

None taken, sometimes the elephant in the room needs poked.

[DarinC]

There are always gonna be peepz with too much time on their hands and a chip on their shoulder. Just the way of the world.

[skunkfunk]

Some things just aren't up for question. Transportation costs for instance. Biking is a no-brainer. Even if you can't bike to work, biking whenever possible is simply understood as necessary to live the lifestyle advocated by the blog, unless you have some serious physical impairment that makes it impossible. Having a dually truck you drive unloaded on the highway 120 miles a day is the opposite of this and therefore not acceptable.

Just for instance. I mean yeah you may disagree, but then you'd be wrong.

I'll disagree.....I drive a 100 miles a day in a truck because my life requires I surf and work in post production in LA.    Best part is....i know I'm right ;)

Ok....so I hold off FI for 7 years?   pfsst.....Who cares!   I get to surf daily.....it's a no brainer

I did say unloaded.

[Trudie]

Most of what's on here I view as cafe conversation.  Some posts are a bit too much for me.  Sometimes if I'm really annoyed I just don't choose to engage.  I like to read though.  It's interesting to see others grappling with choices and then grapple with your own.  Regular reading of the forum does cause me to question some of my own habits.

Still, sometimes it feels a little "cultish" -- even in the use of the term "Mustachian."  As in:  "This is what it takes to be a card-carrying mustachian..."  I don't think there's one way to do anything, but it's good to collect ideas.

For instance, I commute to my job (live in fairly rural area).  No, I don't need a facepunch.  I know it's something I want to do something about, and I understand the costs -- even before reading here.  But, for a variety of reasons right now I'm much better off keeping this job while I look for another.  All of the posts about commuting and biking aren't going to change my reality or speed up the process of getting a different job.  There's no magic wand waving.

[arebelspy]

I guess I just thought we all have the same goal and would want to share and hear different thoughts on different topics.
...
I guess what I am saying is being Mustachian is not religious in nature.  Its a concept Mr.  MMM drafted through his blog.  One in which we all can share some common shred of interest. We are not all the same nor should we be.

There's plenty of differing opinions, but sometimes people post stuff that is flat out wrong, or just crazy.

People can be called on their bullshit without accusations of a cult.  Other opinions are great.  Flat out false information is not.

Compared to the internet at large, we're all lords and ladies wearing top hats and drinking tea.

For myself, some of my bluntness is intentional. I want to shake people out of their comfort zone -- the same way MMM shook me out of mine.

Har! +1

Once in a while things get a little too macho for me, but often the mods swoop in and spray some lavender aromatherapy and everyone calms down.

There were a bunch of threads I was going to respond to, but this was too perfect, how did you know I'm an aromatherapist? ;) Lavender really does work wonders! I wish there was a an anti-agro troll busting spray that could be dispersed via blog post!

Joking aside, We mods don't see everything and unless it is reported or we happen see it in our casual surfing, we don't always know about it. I'm Canadian and generally stay out of the controversial political threads and some that just don't apply to me.

 Please use the report function. In general, we try and let people sort it out themselves, for the most part our community is great at calling each other on bullshit - once in a while we'll need step in. Posters create the community though, and if there is someone or something poisoning the community, let us know.

As the forums have gotten bigger there is definitely more people who take a hardliner "I'm right" stance and there is no reasoning with them. There is a major difference between a friendly facepunch and using it as an excuse to be a total jerk, which we don't want.

+1 to this, especially bolded parts.

[Kaspian]

People can be called on their bullshit without accusations of a cult.  Other opinions are great.  Flat out false information is not.

+1!!

Hopefully I get called vicious names if I try and sling some bullshit or fool myself.

However, there are many people who are more sensitive to comments than others and it could be difficult for them to manoeuver a site where people use expletives freely, facepunch, and think they're badass.    I have no idea how one would accommodate both personality types.  Just hope it all washes together to form a happy medium?   I'm thick-skinned.  I know that.  My best friends and I all call each other derogatory names regularly in normal conversation.  We like it and insults/harshities slide off like Teflon.   Took me a long time to learn many aren't like that.  So...  I try to be nice.  But (like many of the strong personality types here), tiptoeing and sycophantism just isn't in the blood.  Can't and don't want to change that.

[RiskDown]

Compared to the internet at large, we're all lords and ladies wearing top hats and drinking tea.

For myself, some of my bluntness is intentional. I want to shake people out of their comfort zone -- the same way MMM shook me out of mine.

This.

[RiskDown]

Facts are not arguable opinions are.

Read each line, and come to a definitive conclusion about the "facts". 

Fact:  I punched an old lady in the face 
Fact: I punched an old lady in the face, after she pointed a gun and threatened my life
Fact: I punched an old lady in the face, after she pointed a gun and threatened my life, because I threatened to steal her TV.

Perception governs your interpretation of facts... and it often varies from person to person.

[genselecus]

I agree with the posts that talk about a blended mindset towards Mustachianism. What I like about the idea of this site is that it reminds us to be logical with our decisions. Usually, with emotion aside there is a rational, correct answer. That said, it is logical to have emotions on matters (and in fact that's why we do the things we do), so it makes sense that the irrational can and should be a part of the decision making process. What's important is to separate the two elements and recognize what value you are placing on the irrational.

I make anti-mustachian decisions daily (in fact I'm eating some Chipotle right now). But I recognize the value that it costs me, and I recognize the emotional value that I put on it, and I decide to do it. To be mustachian is to think about the rationale of your decisions, it doesn't mean any particular decision is mustachain, IMO.

Of course, if you disagree with my opinion, you are wrong. Naturally.

[Rezdent]

Facts are not arguable opinions are.

Read each line, and come to a definitive conclusion about the "facts". 

Fact:  I punched an old lady in the face 
Fact: I punched an old lady in the face, after she pointed a gun and threatened my life
Fact: I punched an old lady in the face, after she pointed a gun and threatened my life, because I threatened to steal her TV.

Perception governs your interpretation of facts... and it often varies from person to person.

Love the progression in your example, thanks for sharing!
Gonna share this with a team I work with as it ties in with our studies.

[4alpacas]

Compared to the internet at large, we're all lords and ladies wearing top hats and drinking tea.

For myself, some of my bluntness is intentional. I want to shake people out of their comfort zone -- the same way MMM shook me out of mine.

This.

Yep!  I have received several face punches.  Due to harsh truths and face punches from the forum, I've cut my grocery budget by 75%, moved to a smaller apartment (save $500/mo), started carpooling and switched to a more fuel efficient vehicle (saving ~$100/mo), cut back on unnecessary clothing shopping (saving ~$100-500/mo), and I'm happier!  My direct comments might sound harsh, but I want the poster to find the happiness that I've found while simplifying my life.

[Annamal]

I think we're doing okay.

This is a place where frequent posters are aged 20-60+, of all political affiliations, earn anywhere between 25k to 250k, generally know how to spell and effectively communicate through hundreds of daily messages, and coexist in relative harmony. Like the goblin chief said, despite our bickering we're the cream of the crop of online communities.

So chin up and buy VFIAX.

I think we're doing ok, but we canalways do better, one thing I have been impressed with is that people on here are sometimes willing to go back and look at ways they've acted and re-evaluate them.

I was really really impressed when someone said they had apologised  based on a re-examination of their behaviour.

[ch12]

I wasn't talking about the name calling or the occasional face punch.  All very much a part of my normal routine and life.  I was trying to speak more to the dogmatic, somewhat religious my opinion is fact arguments.  Facts are not arguable opinions are.

I wanted to chime in, because I've noticed a fairly aggressive vibe from some people, including me. YOU WANT TO SPEND 10K PER MONTH ON A SWIMMING POOL, BUT YOU HAVE 300K IN STUDENT LOANS? WHYYYYYYYY????

As goblinchief said, we are lords and ladies compared to the general population of the Internet. I agree. But still, the automatic nitpicking that happens in these forums is a reason why I'm frequenting them a tad less. I still visit on a daily-ish basis. I am unhappy when Mr. Money Mustache goes down while I'm trying to read forum posts and I get an error. I have solved this by coming by less frequently and participating lightly; my decreased participation probably has a de minimis impact on the forums. In addition, I now have a monster journal somewhere else.

You guys are by and large fantastic people, and I value the large Mustachian community. I'm glad that we have sometimes passionate discussions and hold each other accountable for living mindfully, but I also don't want to be yelled at for shelling out money for registering my LLC. WHY NO SOLE PROPRIETORSHIP?!!!!!!

[Cassie]

In general this is a great forum.  what I have learned is that when you know you are correct about facts given re a subject & you have people saying you are wrong after you state the facts a few times then you just disengage.  It does not pay to argue with people when you have your facts correct.  Some people love to argue for it's own sake.   

[CarDude]

Facts are not arguable opinions are.

Read each line, and come to a definitive conclusion about the "facts". 

Fact:  I punched an old lady in the face 
Fact: I punched an old lady in the face, after she pointed a gun and threatened my life
Fact: I punched an old lady in the face, after she pointed a gun and threatened my life, because I threatened to steal her TV.

Perception governs your interpretation of facts... and it often varies from person to person.

Love the progression in your example, thanks for sharing!
Gonna share this with a team I work with as it ties in with our studies.

+1. I love this.

But yeah...regarding the OP, I do get what you're saying. I do much more lurking than reading on forums these days since real life is so busy. I also find that the older I get, the less interested I get in confrontation...I'd rather just preach to the choir (hence blogging about car safety rather than arguing with people over why Big Government isn't really just out to get them when their local city installs a set of traffic cameras).

[Bob W]

This is the first forum I've ever participated in.  So I'll take your word that we are lords and ladies compared to the restof the net.  I'm so nieve I use my real name and location.  Only seems fair though since that spinless MMM  tells us every detail of his life including where he lives and when he is out of town. Lol

[Bob W]

I guess I have not noticed so much hate.. Maybe I tune it out.

On the whole I would agree with you.. yes more than one way to skin a cat as they say.

We sometimes have a poster that is sa far out in left field that we can't relate to them or their arguments don't hold water.

Not so long back we had a poster making $70k a MONTH with a $100k a year country club membership and really not interested in being frugal and it was clear that "knowing the right people" was very important to her and her Hubby's career.

They were a little in debt (as in a "little" for them.. Hair on fie emergency for the rest of us) and were really not interested in making radical changes.

Yet she posted on this forum and argued at length.

Nothing really wrong as such but it did garner a lot of negative reactions, including from me to be honest. I had to  stop myself and be reminded that this was not MY life and if thats the way they choose to live thats great.

Until another 2008 happens of course.

I think that was the worst chain of "hatred" we had, but even that dialogue had mostly civil discussion.

Frank

I remember reading that threat - although, being a golfer, I don't think there are any $100k/year country clubs anywhere in the world

Probably not any at 100k per year but there are a lot with 250k + initiation fees and I found one at 650k.

[steveo]

There's plenty of differing opinions, but sometimes people post stuff that is flat out wrong, or just crazy.

People can be called on their bullshit without accusations of a cult.  Other opinions are great.  Flat out false information is not.

I agree with this in all walks of life. Sometimes I can't help but state listen thats freaken bullshit.

It amazes me when people state things that are just patently false and yet they believe it.

[okashira]

There's plenty of differing opinions, but sometimes people post stuff that is flat out wrong, or just crazy.

People can be called on their bullshit without accusations of a cult.  Other opinions are great.  Flat out false information is not.

I agree with this in all walks of life. Sometimes I can't help but state listen thats freaken bullshit.

It amazes me when people state things that are just patently false and yet they believe it.

Real Life Trolls.
yes they are real, I usually call them out, then keep my distance if they keep it up.