Author Topic: How do you factor in potential inheritance?  (Read 2924 times)

deborah

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #50 on: January 23, 2023, 07:04:48 PM »
I will never get an inheritance. I have insisted on being written out of any. It will make life easier, as no one will ever be able to be upset that I got more than they think I should have. There have been too many inheritance dramas in my family in the past, with various people never speaking to their siblings again. Itís easier to inherit nothing. I have enough, so why would I need any more?

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #51 on: January 24, 2023, 11:04:41 AM »
I will never get an inheritance. I have insisted on being written out of any. It will make life easier, as no one will ever be able to be upset that I got more than they think I should have. There have been too many inheritance dramas in my family in the past, with various people never speaking to their siblings again. Itís easier to inherit nothing. I have enough, so why would I need any more?


That is a totally legit approach. I've seen similar miseries happen on the side of the family that has money... the money didn't cause all the dysfunction but let's just say it sure didn't help when it came time to distribute any of it.  If there's one  thing I'm most thankful to my father for it's that he extracted himself from all family business/estate interests a few years before his death. It might have hurt his net worth, but it made every aspect of the emotional baggage easier.

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #52 on: January 24, 2023, 11:30:26 AM »
I will never get an inheritance. I have insisted on being written out of any. It will make life easier, as no one will ever be able to be upset that I got more than they think I should have. There have been too many inheritance dramas in my family in the past, with various people never speaking to their siblings again. Itís easier to inherit nothing. I have enough, so why would I need any more?

If you could have seen the look on my in laws faces when I pointed out it was fair to divide their estate by grandchildren (of which my spouse has provided none) you would understand that sometimes even insisting on being written out can cause family issues. Just disclaim if your family is that toxic.

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #53 on: January 24, 2023, 11:52:46 AM »
I'm assuming it will be zero, we don't need it and I hope my parents get to enjoy every last dime before they pass.

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #54 on: January 24, 2023, 01:00:01 PM »
I will never get an inheritance. I have insisted on being written out of any. It will make life easier, as no one will ever be able to be upset that I got more than they think I should have. There have been too many inheritance dramas in my family in the past, with various people never speaking to their siblings again. Itís easier to inherit nothing. I have enough, so why would I need any more?

If you could have seen the look on my in laws faces when I pointed out it was fair to divide their estate by grandchildren (of which my spouse has provided none) you would understand that sometimes even insisting on being written out can cause family issues. Just disclaim if your family is that toxic.

Iíve had some nasty shade thrown my way for NOT taking financial assistance from family members, choosing instead to live very frugally during our grad school years.

charis

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #55 on: January 24, 2023, 01:24:06 PM »
I will never get an inheritance. I have insisted on being written out of any. It will make life easier, as no one will ever be able to be upset that I got more than they think I should have. There have been too many inheritance dramas in my family in the past, with various people never speaking to their siblings again. Itís easier to inherit nothing. I have enough, so why would I need any more?

If you could have seen the look on my in laws faces when I pointed out it was fair to divide their estate by grandchildren (of which my spouse has provided none) you would understand that sometimes even insisting on being written out can cause family issues. Just disclaim if your family is that toxic.

Iíve had some nasty shade thrown my way for NOT taking financial assistance from family members, choosing instead to live very frugally during our grad school years.

Family is weird like that.  I don't understand the impulse to be upset when someone doesn't accept money, unless there was an issue of safety or malnourishment.

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #56 on: January 24, 2023, 05:43:53 PM »
I'm in a similar demographic to OP, and my father just passed away last year. Due to his expert frugality he did leave his children a modest inheritance. I FIRE'd almost two years ago knowing that 1) I would be okay if I didn't inherit anything and 2) I likely would and that would just make it that much easier/safer to live on investments. One major benefit was I spent a lot more time with my father in the last 1.5 years of his life than I would have if I'd had a job. The additional money I could have made would not have have been worth those days.

A proposed compromise solution:

Don't factor it in at all for lean FIRE calculations. By definition we're already pushing the limits here.

Make an honest estimate/talk with your benefactor if that's not weird and then discount the number as appropriate for regular FIRE calculations... In OP's example I'd propose including 50% of expected inheritance.

Use whatever the expected number is for any FAT fire calculations knowing that you can fall back on lower spending if you need to. Obviously this only works if you're at peace with regular spending levels.


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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #57 on: January 24, 2023, 08:28:30 PM »
I think itís reasonable to assume that Iíll inherit something in the next 15 years, given my particular circumstances (barring outright fraud), and that helps me sleep better at night. And frankly, without this expectation, I probably would not have felt safe firing when I did - my WR is between 4 - 5%. So, I count it, ďa littleĒ. Even 1/4 of the expected amount would create an adequate safety buffer. Having said that, I also donít see myself as ďforever firedĒ - I expect to create a small income stream, though this may not happen for another 5 years - another safety buffer. Or I could move to lower COLÖ or get a PT job. There will always be unknowns, but the risk feels worth it to me, to get to recreate my life anew now.

LD_TAndK

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #58 on: January 25, 2023, 04:38:57 AM »
I don't factor an inheritance directly into my FIRE / spending calculations, but it is likely I'll receive one. I keep it in my overall optimistic view of the future, along with social security which I think will still be a thing in 30 years.

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #59 on: January 25, 2023, 12:22:34 PM »
I will never get an inheritance. I have insisted on being written out of any. It will make life easier, as no one will ever be able to be upset that I got more than they think I should have. There have been too many inheritance dramas in my family in the past, with various people never speaking to their siblings again. Itís easier to inherit nothing. I have enough, so why would I need any more?

If you could have seen the look on my in laws faces when I pointed out it was fair to divide their estate by grandchildren (of which my spouse has provided none) you would understand that sometimes even insisting on being written out can cause family issues. Just disclaim if your family is that toxic.

Iíve had some nasty shade thrown my way for NOT taking financial assistance from family members, choosing instead to live very frugally during our grad school years.

Family is weird like that.  I don't understand the impulse to be upset when someone doesn't accept money, unless there was an issue of safety or malnourishment.

Some people want to control others with money - either giving or promising to give - and then holding it over their head.  Others want to be "fair".  They gave your sibling money for college/wedding/house/whatever and they want to give you the same to keep it even.

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #60 on: January 25, 2023, 04:53:39 PM »
I will never get an inheritance. I have insisted on being written out of any. It will make life easier, as no one will ever be able to be upset that I got more than they think I should have. There have been too many inheritance dramas in my family in the past, with various people never speaking to their siblings again. Itís easier to inherit nothing. I have enough, so why would I need any more?

If you could have seen the look on my in laws faces when I pointed out it was fair to divide their estate by grandchildren (of which my spouse has provided none) you would understand that sometimes even insisting on being written out can cause family issues. Just disclaim if your family is that toxic.

Iíve had some nasty shade thrown my way for NOT taking financial assistance from family members, choosing instead to live very frugally during our grad school years.

Family is weird like that.  I don't understand the impulse to be upset when someone doesn't accept money, unless there was an issue of safety or malnourishment.

Some people want to control others with money - either giving or promising to give - and then holding it over their head.  Others want to be "fair".  They gave your sibling money for college/wedding/house/whatever and they want to give you the same to keep it even.
True - however in my situation it wasnít the people offering support who were throwing out shade.  It was those who had taken assistance who got angry that we didnít make the same decisions.

yachi

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #61 on: January 26, 2023, 08:33:50 AM »
My parent's are in their early 70's.  We have about 80K earmarked for some end of life care for them.  It's not much, but it covers the statistical chance they end up in a nursing home.  Pennsylvania has some very aggressive filial responsibility laws, so I felt it prudent to assume we'd have to pay something.
If I knew they had enough wealth that we'd see an inheritance, I wouldn't worry about financially caring for them in old age.

Villanelle

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #62 on: January 26, 2023, 09:36:34 AM »
My parent's are in their early 70's.  We have about 80K earmarked for some end of life care for them.  It's not much, but it covers the statistical chance they end up in a nursing home.  Pennsylvania has some very aggressive filial responsibility laws, so I felt it prudent to assume we'd have to pay something.
If I knew they had enough wealth that we'd see an inheritance, I wouldn't worry about financially caring for them in old age.

We've talked about an inheritance with my parents several times.  Periodically, they make sure when know where the will is, where their safe deposit box is, and the general make-up of the estate and trust. Any time my parents bring up the inheritance, my answer is the same. Truly the biggest gift they've given my sibling and me is that we don't have to worry about financially supporting them.  That's rare and I don't take it for granted at all, and I want them to know I appreciate it.  getting more money than I need, long after if will significantly change my life choices is nice.  But that pales in comparison to just knowing that what DH and I have worked for for ourselves is secure, and that we won't have to make painful choices about returning to work if we have to pay for someone to get in-home care or move to a medical facility.  That we won't ever have to think that it would be nice if mom or dad have X, but that there's no money for it.  Or that we need to work an extra few years to make sure we can provide what they might need.

I'm so, so fortunate in that regard.

yachi

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #63 on: January 26, 2023, 10:48:56 AM »
My parent's are in their early 70's.  We have about 80K earmarked for some end of life care for them.  It's not much, but it covers the statistical chance they end up in a nursing home.  Pennsylvania has some very aggressive filial responsibility laws, so I felt it prudent to assume we'd have to pay something.
If I knew they had enough wealth that we'd see an inheritance, I wouldn't worry about financially caring for them in old age.

We've talked about an inheritance with my parents several times.  Periodically, they make sure when know where the will is, where their safe deposit box is, and the general make-up of the estate and trust. Any time my parents bring up the inheritance, my answer is the same. Truly the biggest gift they've given my sibling and me is that we don't have to worry about financially supporting them.  That's rare and I don't take it for granted at all, and I want them to know I appreciate it.  getting more money than I need, long after if will significantly change my life choices is nice.  But that pales in comparison to just knowing that what DH and I have worked for for ourselves is secure, and that we won't have to make painful choices about returning to work if we have to pay for someone to get in-home care or move to a medical facility.  That we won't ever have to think that it would be nice if mom or dad have X, but that there's no money for it.  Or that we need to work an extra few years to make sure we can provide what they might need.

I'm so, so fortunate in that regard.

This is a very healthy way of looking at it.  I'm super proud of the way my parents raised me, and considering how many of us they had to raise I think they're in fine financial shape.  My grandmother spend her early childhood in a house with a dirt floor, cooking using firewood.  Me being able to retire early just two generations removed from that is unbelievably awesome.

valsecito

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #64 on: January 27, 2023, 03:48:20 AM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

A messy inheritance process there inevitably will be. No thanks to one of their children.

nereo

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #65 on: January 27, 2023, 08:12:51 AM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

A messy inheritance process there inevitably will be. No thanks to one of their children.

This has the makings of an interesting haiku

charis

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #66 on: January 27, 2023, 08:25:03 AM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

This.  I just cannot think of my parent's money as my money, even theoretically.

nereo

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #67 on: January 27, 2023, 09:42:29 AM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

This.  I just cannot think of my parent's money as my money, even theoretically.
how do your parents view their estate?

Villanelle

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #68 on: January 27, 2023, 10:42:56 AM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

This.  I just cannot think of my parent's money as my money, even theoretically.

I don't think of it as anything but my parents' money, for sure.  But they've also been very clear, for many years, that they are planning to leave money (with specific $ ranges mentioned) to my sibling and myself.  They also have asked, multiple times, if there are specific items either of us want.  For example, I'd like to have my mom's charm bracelet and the hope chest she got from her parents for her 16th birthday, both of which are anchors of very special childhood memories to me.  It actually thrilled my mom when I told her that, to the point that I suggested to my sister--who is much less sentimental and demonstrative--that if there was an item she even kind of wanted, she should mention it because it would bring mom mom a lot of joy.  But that doesn't mean I think of that hope chest as mine.  If my parents decided to sell it tomorrow, they'd be well within their rights to do so, of course.  it is their property.

Maybe my family is unusual in that we have fairly candid conversations about this stuff, and that helps.  Having a sister who worked in a death-related profession probably helped with that.  But we know who the executor will be, what is in the will, the approximate value o the estate, the various organizations where my parents have accounts, their basic wishes for the money, etc.  None of that makes me think of it as mine in any way, or feel I have any say in how it is spent or what my parents do with it (dad has a decent chunk in an actively managed account!  The horror!).  It just means they wanted to prepare us so that when the time comes, we have fewer details to figure out.   They put this in the same category as telling us their passwords and code to open the garage.  That doesn't mean I feel like I suddenly own their home or am entitled to log in to their email.  It just means I have info that might be useful someday.

I'l add that dad is very proud to be leaving money to my sibling and me.  I think it would hurt him a bit if I said I didn't want his money.  Acknowledging that it is a huge gift to me has value to him, just as telling my mom that I fondly recall sitting with her, over and over, and asking her to tell me the story of each of her charms on her bracelet had value to her.   

Even if I planned to donate every penny of an inheritance immediately, or take the bracelet to a pawn shop for melt value, telling them those things would be hurtful.  Giving is a an act that has great value to them, so I honor that by expressing my appreciation.

I know it's not that way for every family, and I am fortunate that there are no complicated family dynamics and everyone is respectful and not motivated by greed.  But for my family, acknowledging that there will almost certainly be an inheritance, and that it is valued and meaningful, has value and meaning for my parents, too.   

valsecito

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #69 on: January 27, 2023, 11:36:40 AM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

A messy inheritance process there inevitably will be. No thanks to one of their children.

This has the makings of an interesting haiku
The bloodsucker feeds
even now on their corpses.
Come soon paradise.

charis

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #70 on: January 27, 2023, 11:56:14 AM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

This.  I just cannot think of my parent's money as my money, even theoretically.

I don't think of it as anything but my parents' money, for sure.  But they've also been very clear, for many years, that they are planning to leave money (with specific $ ranges mentioned) to my sibling and myself.  They also have asked, multiple times, if there are specific items either of us want.  For example, I'd like to have my mom's charm bracelet and the hope chest she got from her parents for her 16th birthday, both of which are anchors of very special childhood memories to me.  It actually thrilled my mom when I told her that, to the point that I suggested to my sister--who is much less sentimental and demonstrative--that if there was an item she even kind of wanted, she should mention it because it would bring mom mom a lot of joy.  But that doesn't mean I think of that hope chest as mine.  If my parents decided to sell it tomorrow, they'd be well within their rights to do so, of course.  it is their property.

Maybe my family is unusual in that we have fairly candid conversations about this stuff, and that helps.  Having a sister who worked in a death-related profession probably helped with that.  But we know who the executor will be, what is in the will, the approximate value o the estate, the various organizations where my parents have accounts, their basic wishes for the money, etc.  None of that makes me think of it as mine in any way, or feel I have any say in how it is spent or what my parents do with it (dad has a decent chunk in an actively managed account!  The horror!).  It just means they wanted to prepare us so that when the time comes, we have fewer details to figure out.   They put this in the same category as telling us their passwords and code to open the garage.  That doesn't mean I feel like I suddenly own their home or am entitled to log in to their email.  It just means I have info that might be useful someday.

I'l add that dad is very proud to be leaving money to my sibling and me.  I think it would hurt him a bit if I said I didn't want his money.  Acknowledging that it is a huge gift to me has value to him, just as telling my mom that I fondly recall sitting with her, over and over, and asking her to tell me the story of each of her charms on her bracelet had value to her.   

Even if I planned to donate every penny of an inheritance immediately, or take the bracelet to a pawn shop for melt value, telling them those things would be hurtful.  Giving is a an act that has great value to them, so I honor that by expressing my appreciation.

I know it's not that way for every family, and I am fortunate that there are no complicated family dynamics and everyone is respectful and not motivated by greed.  But for my family, acknowledging that there will almost certainly be an inheritance, and that it is valued and meaningful, has value and meaning for my parents, too.   

This reads as though you are equating my comment with telling my parents that I don't want their money.  That's not at all what I meant or implied.  I simply don't think about their money, much less their money being my money.  We are a small family unit, no one seems to be motivated by greed.  I am the executor on their will, I have read it, and I'm familiar with the rest of their affairs. 

My mother had several occurrences of cancer starting at 50 years old, so she's happy to be alive and thriving for her grandchildren (and the rest of the family), so she feels sad and uncomfortable discussing her impending death.  She therefore doesn't enjoy discussing what jewelry, etc, will be left to us upon her death.  This is not related to my thoughts on their money, but it may explain why it's not a common source of discussion for understandable, not complicated family dynamic, reasons.

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #71 on: January 27, 2023, 12:34:52 PM »
I was just talking to DH about this. His parents died decades ago and never left him anything. I'm more likely to have to pay to support my mom and step dad than inherit from them, but my dad and step mom are a wild card.

He's definitely going to die first, he's on borrowed time as it is and she's much healthier. My dad has 3 kids, but one hasn't spoken to him in decades. The other has the only grandkid.

Their entire estate is shared, he had nothing when they married, but they built a rather successful business together, so I can't imagine he'll leave anything directly to any of his kids as none of it is his to give.

She has no kids, and her brother is quite wealthy so her nieces and nephews are well taken care of. She doesn't like my brothers, mostly because they hate her and aren't exactly nice to my father. She liked the grandkid until she became a teen, and isn't likely to get any closer with her as she gets older, especially once my dad passes.

So that leaves me. She'll have a few million in assets by the time she dies, and I'm the only family member she really gets along with, so it's possible she could leave it all to me. Or she could leave it all to a cat shelter. Or she could marry a 22 year old pool boy and leave it all to him to fund his music career.

It's hard to say...

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #72 on: January 27, 2023, 01:12:49 PM »
^
This is an example of what I was thinking about.  I once asked my mother about LTC insurance, and she dismissed it out of hand - "no one can afford that" (she had one parent with early alzheimers and one with dementia).  Is LTC care the same as "the nursing home"? It sounds like it isn't.  But I'm not seeing any folks these days dying peacefully at home of old age.

LTC is a large category that includes, but is not limited to, nursing home care. Nursing home care is not covered by Medicare, either, except for short stints after hospitalization.

Is that true?  I had an aunt who lived in a nursing home after having a stroke and she had no money, only SS and Medicare.

Yes, it's true. Basically, you pay the nursing home until your money completely gone, then Medicaid (state-administered program for the poor) takes over and pays. Medicare (federal health insurance) plays no role.

If you have property (e.g., house) then it goes to the state in compensation. If you have a spouse still living, they get to stay in the house until death and keep one car, and a very small amount of money per month to live on (but basically no savings to speak of) so that the ill spouse can be cared for. After the longest live spouse dies, the house/estate goes to the state.

Sometimes spouses divorce to protect the remaining assets for the healthier spouse. My father and his separated wife did this or she'd also be paying down all of her savings pay for his 18K/month living expenses.

When my father is out of money and has sold all the property he owns except his house lot, then he will be forced to go into a nursing home on Medicaid and the state will take the proceeds of the sale of whatever is left of his estate.

Edited for clarity.

This varies by state.  In Michigan, the primary resident of the person in a nursing home on Medicaid is exempt.

Villanelle

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #73 on: January 27, 2023, 01:20:11 PM »
I don't. My parents. Their property.

This.  I just cannot think of my parent's money as my money, even theoretically.

I don't think of it as anything but my parents' money, for sure.  But they've also been very clear, for many years, that they are planning to leave money (with specific $ ranges mentioned) to my sibling and myself.  They also have asked, multiple times, if there are specific items either of us want.  For example, I'd like to have my mom's charm bracelet and the hope chest she got from her parents for her 16th birthday, both of which are anchors of very special childhood memories to me.  It actually thrilled my mom when I told her that, to the point that I suggested to my sister--who is much less sentimental and demonstrative--that if there was an item she even kind of wanted, she should mention it because it would bring mom mom a lot of joy.  But that doesn't mean I think of that hope chest as mine.  If my parents decided to sell it tomorrow, they'd be well within their rights to do so, of course.  it is their property.

Maybe my family is unusual in that we have fairly candid conversations about this stuff, and that helps.  Having a sister who worked in a death-related profession probably helped with that.  But we know who the executor will be, what is in the will, the approximate value o the estate, the various organizations where my parents have accounts, their basic wishes for the money, etc.  None of that makes me think of it as mine in any way, or feel I have any say in how it is spent or what my parents do with it (dad has a decent chunk in an actively managed account!  The horror!).  It just means they wanted to prepare us so that when the time comes, we have fewer details to figure out.   They put this in the same category as telling us their passwords and code to open the garage.  That doesn't mean I feel like I suddenly own their home or am entitled to log in to their email.  It just means I have info that might be useful someday.

I'l add that dad is very proud to be leaving money to my sibling and me.  I think it would hurt him a bit if I said I didn't want his money.  Acknowledging that it is a huge gift to me has value to him, just as telling my mom that I fondly recall sitting with her, over and over, and asking her to tell me the story of each of her charms on her bracelet had value to her.   

Even if I planned to donate every penny of an inheritance immediately, or take the bracelet to a pawn shop for melt value, telling them those things would be hurtful.  Giving is a an act that has great value to them, so I honor that by expressing my appreciation.

I know it's not that way for every family, and I am fortunate that there are no complicated family dynamics and everyone is respectful and not motivated by greed.  But for my family, acknowledging that there will almost certainly be an inheritance, and that it is valued and meaningful, has value and meaning for my parents, too.   

This reads as though you are equating my comment with telling my parents that I don't want their money.  That's not at all what I meant or implied.  I simply don't think about their money, much less their money being my money.  We are a small family unit, no one seems to be motivated by greed.  I am the executor on their will, I have read it, and I'm familiar with the rest of their affairs. 

My mother had several occurrences of cancer starting at 50 years old, so she's happy to be alive and thriving for her grandchildren (and the rest of the family), so she feels sad and uncomfortable discussing her impending death.  She therefore doesn't enjoy discussing what jewelry, etc, will be left to us upon her death.  This is not related to my thoughts on their money, but it may explain why it's not a common source of discussion for understandable, not complicated family dynamic, reasons.

No, I wasn't equating the two.  But it felt like there was an implication that thinking or talking about an inheritance was thinking of parents' money as one's own money, and I was pointing out why that's not the case (though it could be in some situations, but far from all).  I think and talk about it because my parents think and talk about it.  They want me to plan on inheriting.  They want us to retire earlier because of what they will leave us.  They want the money they worked hard to earn and save to be meaningful to us.  It would dishonor that wish for us to absolutely pretend it didn't exist, because their mission is to make our lives easier and better. 

So while I don't think of it as my money, I do think of it as part of my future--because that is precisely what they want, and in fact what they have structured some major life decisions around being able to do.  I wish my dad had retired a few years sooner rather thank working longer in order to reach a target goal they set for our inheritance.  But he didn't.  (To be fair, I think he worked because he found it fulfilling, at least with the jobs he took after ostensibly "retiring".)  That's the point I was trying to get at--for them and for my family, to not think about they money they will leave us would strip my parents of some joy and pride.  Some people feel it is dishonoring (or something like that, if that's not the right word) to consider parents' money while the parents are still living.  I believe some might even insinuate it is like a vampire, "feeding on corpses" ;).  And in some families, that might be true.  Mentioning mom's charm bracelet would be received as greed and thinking that maybe it's okay to retire a year or so earlier because an inheritance offers an additional failsafe to the plan would be received as inappropriate and greedy. But certainly not all families operate that way.  In my family, my parents feel these things are their legacy and they want to feel secure in the knowledge that the legacy will live on and be appreciated.  That means me having mom's hope chest in a place of honor in my home, and it means us thinking gratefully of my parents as we take a vacation that might otherwise have been outside our retirement budget, or we enjoy some extra months or years of freedom from employment because of what they gave us.  Telling them now (at least indirectly) that those things are likely to happen is better than any Christmas or Father's Day present I could ever give them. 

Again, I'm not suggesting this way is superior or that every family should try to approach it this way.  But I am saying that for some families, "don't think about it even a tiny bit until it is is yours, which may or may not happen" isn't what best honors the parents (if that is even the goal, and I know it isn't always).

valsecito

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #74 on: January 27, 2023, 02:22:12 PM »
I am saying that for some families, "don't think about it even a tiny bit until it is is yours, which may or may not happen" isn't what best honors the parents (if that is even the goal, and I know it isn't always).
My wife and I have been on the receiving end of similar generosity.  Luckily, my parents were and are still alive. We're planning to have them over to our holiday home this summer. Quite special, as their generosity helped us build it.

charis

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #75 on: January 27, 2023, 03:03:27 PM »
...

Again, I'm not suggesting this way is superior or that every family should try to approach it this way.  But I am saying that for some families, "don't think about it even a tiny bit until it is is yours, which may or may not happen" isn't what best honors the parents (if that is even the goal, and I know it isn't always).

You seem to be inferring some negative judgments about your lifestyle based my post.  You shouldn't. The bolded statement is a clear distortion of my simple statement that I don't think of my parents money as mine. 

wenchsenior

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #76 on: January 27, 2023, 03:22:26 PM »
^
This is an example of what I was thinking about.  I once asked my mother about LTC insurance, and she dismissed it out of hand - "no one can afford that" (she had one parent with early alzheimers and one with dementia).  Is LTC care the same as "the nursing home"? It sounds like it isn't.  But I'm not seeing any folks these days dying peacefully at home of old age.

LTC is a large category that includes, but is not limited to, nursing home care. Nursing home care is not covered by Medicare, either, except for short stints after hospitalization.

Is that true?  I had an aunt who lived in a nursing home after having a stroke and she had no money, only SS and Medicare.

Yes, it's true. Basically, you pay the nursing home until your money completely gone, then Medicaid (state-administered program for the poor) takes over and pays. Medicare (federal health insurance) plays no role.

If you have property (e.g., house) then it goes to the state in compensation. If you have a spouse still living, they get to stay in the house until death and keep one car, and a very small amount of money per month to live on (but basically no savings to speak of) so that the ill spouse can be cared for. After the longest live spouse dies, the house/estate goes to the state.

Sometimes spouses divorce to protect the remaining assets for the healthier spouse. My father and his separated wife did this or she'd also be paying down all of her savings pay for his 18K/month living expenses.

When my father is out of money and has sold all the property he owns except his house lot, then he will be forced to go into a nursing home on Medicaid and the state will take the proceeds of the sale of whatever is left of his estate.

Edited for clarity.

This varies by state.  In Michigan, the primary resident of the person in a nursing home on Medicaid is exempt.

Wow, that is very surprising, considering most peoples' main asset is their home. The home is typically exempt if the remaining spouse is still living in the home, but not once both spouses  are out.

So you can qualify for Medicaid and go into a nursing home and the house will still go to the heirs? That is quite the excellent deal.

ETA: I just looked at Michigan rules for qualification, and they look the same as most other states.

 The house is not exempt, except insofar as it usually seems to be (exempt if the person or their spouse lives there or has registered 'intent to return' there). A lien goes against the value of the house based on cost of care in the nursing home, which is collected upon sale of the home after the last remaining person living there has died or gone on Medicaid.

Here is the passage: 

Home Exemption Rules
The home is exempt if the Medicaid applicant resides in it or has Intent to Return, and in 2023, their home equity interest is no more than $688,000. Home equity is the value of the home, minus any outstanding debt against it. Equity interest is the amount of the home’s equity that is owned by the applicant. If a non-applicant spouse lives in the home, it is automatically exempt regardless of any other circumstances.

While one’s home is generally exempt from Medicaid’s asset limit, it is not exempt from Medicaid’s Estate Recovery Program. Following a long-term care Medicaid beneficiary’s death, Michigan’s Medicaid agency attempts reimbursement of care costs through whatever estate of the deceased still remains. This is often the home. Without proper planning strategies in place, the home will be used to reimburse Medicaid for providing care rather than going to family as inheritance.
« Last Edit: January 27, 2023, 03:27:17 PM by wenchsenior »

Villanelle

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #77 on: January 27, 2023, 03:40:07 PM »
...

Again, I'm not suggesting this way is superior or that every family should try to approach it this way.  But I am saying that for some families, "don't think about it even a tiny bit until it is is yours, which may or may not happen" isn't what best honors the parents (if that is even the goal, and I know it isn't always).

You seem to be inferring some negative judgments about your lifestyle based my post.  You shouldn't. The bolded statement is a clear distortion of my simple statement that I don't think of my parents money as mine.

I think I'm having a more general conversation, spinning off from your posts, and seem to be inferring that they are directed specifically at you.

I'm sorry it upset you.  Again, I'm just having a general conversation, inspired by your comment but not directly addressing you. 

I took don't think of my parents' money as mine and in nearly all cases I'd think that was pretty distasteful, so I guess we are in agreement on that.

charis

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #78 on: January 27, 2023, 04:17:57 PM »
...

Again, I'm not suggesting this way is superior or that every family should try to approach it this way.  But I am saying that for some families, "don't think about it even a tiny bit until it is is yours, which may or may not happen" isn't what best honors the parents (if that is even the goal, and I know it isn't always).

You seem to be inferring some negative judgments about your lifestyle based my post.  You shouldn't. The bolded statement is a clear distortion of my simple statement that I don't think of my parents money as mine.

I think I'm having a more general conversation, spinning off from your posts, and seem to be inferring that they are directed specifically at you.

I'm sorry it upset you.  Again, I'm just having a general conversation, inspired by your comment but not directly addressing you. 

I took don't think of my parents' money as mine and in nearly all cases I'd think that was pretty distasteful, so I guess we are in agreement on that.

I am definitely not upset, I actually thought you seemed upset by my comment, due to the negative spin, which confused me.  Glad that it's not the case. 

Wolfpack Mustachian

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #79 on: January 28, 2023, 09:11:53 AM »
...

Again, I'm not suggesting this way is superior or that every family should try to approach it this way.  But I am saying that for some families, "don't think about it even a tiny bit until it is is yours, which may or may not happen" isn't what best honors the parents (if that is even the goal, and I know it isn't always).

You seem to be inferring some negative judgments about your lifestyle based my post.  You shouldn't. The bolded statement is a clear distortion of my simple statement that I don't think of my parents money as mine.

I think I'm having a more general conversation, spinning off from your posts, and seem to be inferring that they are directed specifically at you.

I'm sorry it upset you.  Again, I'm just having a general conversation, inspired by your comment but not directly addressing you. 

I took don't think of my parents' money as mine and in nearly all cases I'd think that was pretty distasteful, so I guess we are in agreement on that.

I am definitely not upset, I actually thought you seemed upset by my comment, due to the negative spin, which confused me.  Glad that it's not the case.

I think you've highlighted something that seems to me to affect people's views on this. By saying that it's your parent's money (100% true, for sure) and you can't even think of it as your money - I think that's a big aspect of this conversation. It's definitely not your money, and thinking your parents' money is yours is, of course, super distasteful and leads to huge problems.

However, if your parents have told you that giving you their money is the plan and you have reason to believe that there's a good chance that it will happen, I believe the mental distinction can be made that it's not your money, but it likely will be to some point. As a poor analogy, I know that future gains on the stock market are not my money right now, but I'm certainly planning on living off of them. There's risk that there could be losses or simply not the gains I thought there would be, but chances are, I'll be counting on money I technically don't have now.

I realize this is a very imperfect analogy, but I just feel, in general, that I try to take as realistic a view on how things are going to go as possible. If I don't, it's generally to my detriment.

partgypsy

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Re: How do you factor in potential inheritance?
« Reply #80 on: January 28, 2023, 02:27:34 PM »
If finances get really dire (very unlikely), I'd be open to moving to Panama or Mexico or Portugal for several years, or even a van down by the river.

Dammit @spartana  you've got the whole forum wanting to live in a van by the river!  Ok. Ok.  What river and when are we meeting?
Lol. The River Seine outside Paris where we will dine on the finest government cheese...er fromage!

I haven't read this thread yet as I didn't really inherit anything or plan to.  But if I was going to "possibly" get an inheritance I personally would never count on it and would plan my life and finance based on my own earnings and investments.
I'm in the same camp (er van by the river) as you are, so ob, not something I need to factor. I guess if I was in such a position, would prefer to ask wealthy relative to gift pre-death, at least in part, than wait until die. Bc again when ltc, new spouses, etc come into play, seen too many stories where expected inheritance doesn't happen. The most recent case, a friend of a friend, her father, her spouse, and her sister passed in that order. The only person she thought would inherit something from, and make worth the pain and heartache of being executor was her sister, as she lived "wealthy". But as she went through mail found out she was not in the habit of paying her bills, so instead has become a huge mess...

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!