How cold is too cold for a baby

[powersln]

Last winter my wife and I had our thermostat set between 58-60 all winter to save on propane gas.   Now we have a 6-month old (wife stays home with him).   Is it dangerous for the child's development to keep it that cold?   Should we look into keeping the house that low, and buy an electric heater for the baby's room?

On another note, propane sucks.   We have natural gas lines across the street.   Is it worth tapping into considering natural gas has become so cheap?

[velocistar237]

We got an electric heater when we brought our preemie home in the middle of winter. The electric bill skyrocketed.

If you dress the baby warmly enough, then the baby will be fine. The rule of thumb I've heard is that you should dress your child they way you're dressed; if you're comfortable, they will be, too. To that I would add that an extra layer should solve the problems of differences in activity and tiredness.

There's a builder in this area who makes net-zero houses, and they use so little gas that he's switched to propane to avoid the monthly natural gas surcharge. For a typical on-grid house, however, propane isn't ideal. Get some quotes and run the numbers for yourself.

[tooqk4u22]

New born babies don't have a way to regulate their internal body temperatures so yes it can be too cold or hot for them, but that can be cured with clothing and blankets and nuzzling up to a parent.  Although I guess you're not supposed to use blankets for infants when they are sleeping (can't remember and the pros change opinions all the time).  As they develop more and become more active (crawling/walking) this is less of an issue. 

Besides a baby will let you know when they are not comfortable - my first liked it really warm when he slept if it was below 80 in his room forget it he wasn't sleeping.  We used a portable heater (one of those oil filled radiator types) worked great.

As for your second questions you need to run the math (including whether or not your existing appliances are compatible - heater, water heater, stove - NG and propane isn't always interchangeable) and NG isn't so cheap anymore it is doubled since its lows earlier this year so rates at utility cos may be increasing.

[kkbmustang]

Get a couple of sleep sacks for the little one. Put the baby in his/her regular footed pajamas, then zip them up in the sleep sack.  This is safer than blankets and keeps them toasty warm.

[bogart]

My son was born in March (some years ago), and we definitely turned the heat up (to 68) through the end of that winter (as much for me, up bare-chested in the middle of the night to feed the LO, as for him).  I'm pretty sure that by the following winter we just went back to our usual (which is thermostat down to 55 at bedtime, though of course the temperature drops only gradually).  We do keep it at 68 when we are awake.  We did use the sleep sacks @kkbmustang mentions b/c blankets aren't (or weren't) recommended for little babies sleeping.  As we moved toward using blankets, I used knit ones that seemed to allow more air circulation, rather than solid/fabric ones.

As for the NG, I can tell you that 2 years ago our NG company offered to connect our house for free provided we hooked in a NG heater (we accepted).  You could check whether there's anything similar in your area, though I'd guess such offers are uncommon I really have no idea.

[RoseRelish]

Get a gas connection if you can! It's way cheaper than propane. Propane is priced off of oil. The spread between oil and gas is massive right now. A rule of thumb to compare is take the oil price and divide by 6 to get the energy-equivalent gas price. That would mean gas should be $15 with oil at $88....or oil should be $21 with gas at $3.50.

[Uncephalized]

New born babies don't have a way to regulate their internal body temperatures so yes it can be too cold or hot for them, but that can be cured with clothing and blankets and nuzzling up to a parent.  Although I guess you're not supposed to use blankets for infants when they are sleeping (can't remember and the pros change opinions all the time).  As they develop more and become more active (crawling/walking) this is less of an issue.

That's not quite correct AFAIK. Premature infants often have impaired thermoregulatory abilities, because they haven't developed enough and the uterus is always a toasty 98F-99F so there would normally be no need for the ability. But normal, healthy neonates can upregulate fat oxidation in response to cold stress (they have more brown adipose tissue than adults do, for this very purpose), and can sweat to cool off. They do have a narrower band of tolerable temperatures, though, because they have a much higher surface area:volume ratio than adults and no ability to move or change clothes or do any of the things older humans can do. It's obviously not too healthy to be under thermal stress all the time but it's not like they're going to get sick it's 1 degree too cold or warm.

But to the OP: keeping babies warm is what fuzzy warm blankets are for. Also, you can keep them close to your body, which is very good for their physical and emotional well-being anyway (babies are supposed to be held! Skin to skin contact makes them calmer and also helps transfer the beneficial skin and gut bacteria that form the first line of defense in the immune system). 60F is not that cold. Plenty of more outdoor-living cultures raise babies in really extreme climates with no central heating and do just fine. So don't worry! :)

[herisff]

Also, be sure to keep his/her head covered. Babies can lose a lot of heat through the skin on the head, and they don't even have hair (usually) to help! Basically, if your baby feels warmer than you are, that's good. If s/he's cool to touch, that's too cold. Babies will always feel warmer than an adult.

[Irishmam]

If you put a onesie, footed jammies and then put your little one in a baby sleeping bag, then they should be OK. I am always hesitant to put put any independent heater in the babies room, in case of fire. When outdoors, definitely put a hat on the baby as that's where they lose all of their heat. Enjoy!!

[happy]

We never heated our babies rooms... but our winters are not very cold 30-40F over night. I'm guessing the room temp could easily have got to 50F overnight.

Very young babies stay swaddled and stay warm. But as soon as they can move, they play this game where they lie on their back and kick all the blankets off.  Then cry since they are cold.  My sleep improved dramatically once I used sleeping bags. I recall knitting a large thick one for my son. worked like a charm.

[somethingsomething]

this whole thread makes no sense to me.

is it really worth it to save a couple dollars per month by keeping the heat low enough in your house that you are wondering if it's too cold for your CHILD?

i think you should just crank the heat and enjoy a nice warm house with your newborn.

[velocistar237]

this whole thread makes no sense to me.

You can save a good chunk of money by heating inefficient houses to less than the standard 70 degF. Some people need that money or value the freedom that the money can buy more than they value the heat. If it's fine for the child, then it makes sense for them to turn down the heat. If not, then not.

Does this just seem too extreme to you? We have people all over the spectrum here.

[Norman Johnson]

We live in an old house and it is -30C outside in the winter time. My son was born in April and was six months old by the time fall weather started to get cold. We dressed him in fuzzy footed PJs and when it was really cold, put a sleep sack on him. It was about 17C in his room all winter. I don't think it harms their development if it's chilly, in fact, they say you lessen the chances of SIDS if you keep the room cooler.

That being said, if your baby is too cold to sleep, they will tell you. They aren't just going to die of hypotherma in their room without letting out a few screams first. Babies are pretty good at telling everyone they need something. ;)

[velocistar237]

Babies are pretty good at telling everyone they need something. ;)

Yes, yes they are.

[travelbug]

On the other hand, if you keep it too cold for your baby they can become sick and then you have medicine and doctors costs to contend with.
Also, their sleeping pattern is developed and back in the newborn days some mornings I would have paid a million dollars for two hours of solid sleep.

[somethingsomething]

this whole thread makes no sense to me.

You can save a good chunk of money by heating inefficient houses to less than the standard 70 degF. Some people need that money or value the freedom that the money can buy more than they value the heat. If it's fine for the child, then it makes sense for them to turn down the heat. If not, then not.

Does this just seem too extreme to you? We have people all over the spectrum here.

Yes, this is way too extreme for me. It also really feels li‏ke a micro-optimization. Far be it from me to tell other people what to do, but I personally would much rather just increase my income so that this sort of expense becomes trivial.

That said, you should do what you think is right. I'm just voicing my opinion that a thread about how cold to keep a newborns room seems from my perspective (keyword my) to have a weird priority inversion occurring.

[twinge]

Yes, this is way too extreme for me. It also really feels li‏ke a micro-optimization. Far be it from me to tell other people what to do, but I personally would much rather just increase my income so that this sort of expense becomes trivial.

That said, you should do what you think is right. I'm just voicing my opinion that a thread about how cold to keep a newborns room seems from my perspective (keyword my) to have a weird priority inversion occurring.

I think the key thing to think about is the question of what is healthy/comfortable for a newborn and are we needlessly warming up a room because we *think* we are doing what is right for our child, but actually are not making a difference (or perhaps even making it worse?).  Children are born in different climates all over the world, with and without central heating--it is an interesting question of how to keep your baby warm and how warm they need to be. (I have to say when I see my toddler happily running around naked in temps where I want to put on a sweater, I don't think I personally can just go by intuition here).  In a mustachian perspective, it doesn't matter how high your income is--you still would want to decide whether this expense is rational since that money can ALWAYS be used for something else (e.g. that newborn's college fund) and it depletes our planet's resources to heat a home.   Maybe babies feel cozier, sleep better, and learn to regulate their temperatures more effectively when they sleep in a warm sleepsack in a colder environment? I have no idea, but it would fit with the environment we evolved to live in more than a centrally heated room.  Do babies experience more illnesses when in a warmed room or in warm clothing in a cooler room? I don't know--I'd want to see what the evidence says before assuming that it's better to keep a room warm. There are many bacteria that thrive in warmer environments that don't in cooler ones.

I don't mean to belabor this point, but asking about how cold to keep a newborn's room is NOT saying how cheap can I go without really harming my baby, but rather--what is the rational way to use resources in a way that is healthy and comfortable for my baby.  I think this is a very important point because much advertising is geared towards making us feel products will achieve  real human needs (e.g., an SUV will keep our families safe, a baby monitor will help guard against SIDS) without real evidence. 

[prosaic]

This isn't a newborn, right? The baby is already 6 months old, and will be older in the winter. Once the baby starts crawling (I have three kids and live in the north) here are some tips:

Once they crawl, they warm themselves through movement. Get some nice stretchy thin cotton hats and make sure the baby wears them on colder days if the baby will tolerate them. One of my kids HATES hats and has since he had the dexterity to pull them off on his own.

Ditch footed sleepers for daytime wear. Babies can't crawl as easily. Get one-piece outfits without feet, and then add socks. You can get two sets of socks -- the size the baby wears plus one size up, and layer them. Then when the baby grows out of one set, use the other.

Layers will keep the baby warm. A onesie and a cotton outfit over it then a fleece outfit over it will be best for indoor comfort and maneuverability.

The baby's "thermometer" for whoever is in charge is the hands and nose. If those are too cold to the touch, turn up the heat. Otherwise, young children are remarkably resilient when it comes to cooler temperatures.

[powersln]

this whole thread makes no sense to me.

This thread might make no sense to you, but it does make sense to the MMM community.   Haven't you read MMM on air conditioning?  This is just on the opposite side of the spectrum.

http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2012/06/14/the-worlds-most-efficient-air-conditioner/

[bogart]

Ditch footed sleepers for daytime wear. Babies can't crawl as easily. Get one-piece outfits without feet, and then add socks.

I totally disagree with this -- found pants (without footies) way too prone to scrunch up, annoying and leaving bare skin.  We stuck with footed onesies through winter 2 (so ~15 months) pretty mch exclusively and found this worked well for us.

[kolorado]

For sleeping, I dressed my babies in socks, undershirt and diaper with a cotton footed sleeper over it, a hat and a fleece sleep sack or swaddle. They were always plenty warm for sleeping at 60*. I was the one who was uncomfortable partially disrobing on those overnights for night feedings.
Daytime is different since the baby moves around quite a bit and is more exposed to temperature. I dressed my kids similar to how I was dressed with one more cotton layer. Then I used their hands as a guide. If their hands were cold, I turned up the heat.
My three babies were all different and tolerated daytime temperatures of 64*-68*. Even now this is an issue with my 7 year old. I have to keep the heat at least 64*  or she will go back to bed and stay there all day. I wore her a lot as a baby in a Moby Wrap to keep her temperature up.
Cold/Hot temperatures can indeed make your baby/child lethargic and irritable. Just like so much of parenting, you have to experiment a little bit and pay attention to your child's cues to determine how low you can go.

[Bakari]

On the other hand, if you keep it too cold for your baby they can become sick

Temperature has no connection to virus or bacteria infections
http://coldflu.about.com/od/cold/f/coldandweather.htm
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/22/health/22real.html?_r=0
http://www.everydayhealth.com/cold-and-flu/colds-and-the-weather.aspx

If cold is harmful to babies, how is it possible that Eskimos managed to exist before modern technology?

[Done by Forty]

I find that burning our old, discarded babies helps keep the new ones toasty.  And this modest proposal is entirely sustainable.  Should my baby get too cold and accidentally expire, it need not go to waste.  Hung and dried on a rack for nine months, he or she becomes perfect fuel for our next newborn, and a great way to keep our heating expenses down.

[grantmeaname]

If cold is harmful to babies, how is it possible that Eskimos managed to exist before modern technology?

1. They reproduce asexually by budding?
2. Adult eskimos spring from their mothers' uteri fully formed and ready for walrus hunting?