Author Topic: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?  (Read 4808 times)

meteor

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What happened that changed your mind?  I want to compare notes with others, to help me evaluate where I might want draw the line on these types of situations.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2018, 04:28:45 PM by meteor »

kei te pai

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2018, 04:31:16 PM »
Yes. Sibling unwilling to assist during parents final illness, and then overly focussed on money from estate. They are not getting anything from me.
There is  also a  reduced amount to go to several younger members of extended family who are unwilling to live within their means.
I have given a lot of thought to which charities I support and increased percentage of estate to go to them.

SnackDog

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2018, 05:31:19 PM »
If I had to base inclusion in the will on behavior I liked all the time, nobody would be in it.

Duke03

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2018, 05:43:04 PM »
I live by the notion that I refuse to reward bad behavior.  So if someone can't manage to be a productive member of society and try their best they can forget about me leaving them anything in the will.  This goes for my own children and close relatives especially.

hops

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2018, 06:38:23 PM »
My wife's abusive father. I would've liked to disinherit her mother for similar reasons but my wife felt differently.

joonifloofeefloo

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2018, 06:53:18 PM »
Yes. People who threw money away, used up other people's finances with abandon, and/or did not access finances legally and morally accessible to them. If they value money and other people's efforts so little, that's not a good place for my hard-saved money to go.

G-dog

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #6 on: December 01, 2018, 06:58:23 PM »
My mom cut my sister out of her will after years of very little contact.  I donít think my sister cared that much but was probably hurt by the sentiment (not the loss of very little money). Itís a long story with plenty of blame on all sides, but was no drama in the end.

AccidentalMiser

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2018, 08:55:27 AM »
Yes. People who threw money away, used up other people's finances with abandon, and/or did not access finances legally and morally accessible to them. If they value money and other people's efforts so little, that's not a good place for my hard-saved money to go.

This.  There are people for whom large sums of money would be a curse.  Furthermore, I do not feel obligated to reward people (family or otherwise) with money I earned just because thatís what other people do.  Currently, all my children are in my will but that hasnít always been the case.  The only real concern I have is the possibility of creating division between after my death.  I donít care too much about what they think of me but I know how families can be torn apart by the apportionment of the parentís estate.  I donít want to be the cause of something like that.

seemsright

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2018, 09:48:30 AM »
yes many times. I cut my entire family off back in '03 when they could not respect where I was going or my marriage. I have had to cut off an entire group of friends when I had my DD. As I did not feel like raising her within them would be good influences for her.

It all comes down to respecting yourself first and foremost. I will not downgrade myself for others. I know the path I am on and if you are not respecting me or showing the same amount of excitement for what ever thing I am I am excited about you are not a true friend.

I have huge goals and I fully understand people will come and go and I am okay with that. I refuse to be stepped on or not respected. If people say they will be at a place at a particular time and they cannot do it over and over I am not being respected. I can really get on a soap box for this type of thing. But that is the jist.

SunshineAZ

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2018, 10:23:13 AM »
I live by the notion that I refuse to reward bad behavior.  So if someone can't manage to be a productive member of society and try their best they can forget about me leaving them anything in the will.  This goes for my own children and close relatives especially.

THIS!  I actually don't have anyone in my immediate family, except my mother, to leave anything to because most of my extended family is dysfunctional, and I have no children of my own. Currently my beneficiaries are only DH and my mother.  I had some hope for my nephew, and am still hoping that he will mature when he gets a bit older.  He is early 20s now, but had a few incidents of taking financial advantage of my mother, (who is admittedly a codependent enabler), which really lowered my opinion of him.  My DH does have 4 adult children and who have 3 grandchildren, with 2 more on the way next spring.  So I am considering leaving something for them and/or grandkids.  They are all good responsible kids, who I adore.

sol

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2018, 10:43:38 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2018, 10:46:12 AM by sol »

hops

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2018, 11:17:56 AM »
I agree with not using one's wealth to control someone else. I had a great-grandmother who, the joke went, changed her will as often as she changed her underpants. You learn a lot about the character of your relatives from how they respond to those machinations.

For us, the decision to remove my FIL from our will was a way of enforcing boundaries that had been repeatedly violated over many years. It would've been vastly preferable to have never been put in that position. He doesn't know anything about it and most likely never will, as he's in poor health.

Imma

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2018, 11:19:41 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

But if the 'reward' should not be based on someone's behaviour, how do you decide who will be in your Will? (Especially if you don't have kids).

My partner and I have each cut out a parent from our wills. One abandoned their family when the kids were young, the other was a domestic abuser. Both failed so miserably at parenthood that we don't want to give them any of our hard earned stash. The other parents were not perfect either but at least they stepped up and took their responsability when they had to.

joonifloofeefloo

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2018, 11:43:02 AM »
^ Yeah, I don't think of the decision as reward/punishment. It's, "Where will this money I've worked so hard to save go the furthest?" If Joe would blow it in six months, not there. If Tammy has been manipulating funds from a vulnerable person for the last ten years, depleting what the latter has available for self, good people, good charities, not there. But stretching the hard-saved money for as long as possible can happen via a trust for my son (who has a disability and will likely need a buffer of support), people who will help him, well-managed charities, and nonmarket housing options for people who need those.

It makes no sense to me to save, work, save, work then give it to someone who is very likely to throw it all away.

meteor

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #14 on: December 02, 2018, 12:22:41 PM »
Just to clarify my original question: I didn't intend for this question to be applied to "telling" someone about changing my will (or even informing them if they are in it).  I'm keeping that as private information.  I too, agree that using a will to control people is manipulative - and I don't intend to do this.

Car Jack

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #15 on: December 02, 2018, 12:35:17 PM »
What will?

Fortunately, my state assigns my assets without a will exactly as I would.

Catbert

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #16 on: December 02, 2018, 02:52:18 PM »
Just to clarify my original question: I didn't intend for this question to be applied to "telling" someone about changing my will (or even informing them if they are in it).  I'm keeping that as private information.  I too, agree that using a will to control people is manipulative - and I don't intend to do this.

You need to think about what problems will be generated by cutting part, but not all, of your family out of your estate.  It's one thing to leave nothing to your siblings or children (or other category of relative) and quite another to leave substantial assets to one sibling/child and not the others.   It will make problems within the family that you won't have to deal with.  Yes, I agree that there are some extreme circumstances where it's justified but not just because you don't like there lifestyle.   

Cassie

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #17 on: December 02, 2018, 03:00:18 PM »
One of my sons is a drug addict so it would harm him to receive money. He has not been clean longer than a year. He is not inheriting however my oldest will either give him his share if he has been clean for years or help with his rent if he is homeless like he frequently is.  So my oldest gets 2/3 with the understanding he will help his brother. All 3 boys know about this.

SunshineAZ

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #18 on: December 02, 2018, 03:21:09 PM »
I live by the notion that I refuse to reward bad behavior.  So if someone can't manage to be a productive member of society and try their best they can forget about me leaving them anything in the will.  This goes for my own children and close relatives especially.

THIS!  I actually don't have anyone in my immediate family, except my mother, to leave anything to because most of my extended family is dysfunctional, and I have no children of my own. Currently my beneficiaries are only DH and my mother.  I had some hope for my nephew, and am still hoping that he will mature when he gets a bit older.  He is early 20s now, but had a few incidents of taking financial advantage of my mother, (who is admittedly a codependent enabler), which really lowered my opinion of him.  My DH does have 4 adult children and who have 3 grandchildren, with 2 more on the way next spring.  So I am considering leaving something for them and/or grandkids.  They are all good responsible kids, who I adore.

For the record, nobody in my family has any idea about who will or will not be "in my will".  I would never use that as a manipulation tool.  I just refuse to give my hard earned money to someone who will blow it frivolously within a month.  Or use it to buy drugs, etc.

Sibley

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #19 on: December 02, 2018, 03:25:58 PM »
One of my sons is a drug addict so it would harm him to receive money. He has not been clean longer than a year. He is not inheriting however my oldest will either give him his share if he has been clean for years or help with his rent if he is homeless like he frequently is.  So my oldest gets 2/3 with the understanding he will help his brother. All 3 boys know about this.

Consider a trust? That could backfire, badly.

GizmoTX

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #20 on: December 02, 2018, 04:03:35 PM »
One of my sons is a drug addict so it would harm him to receive money. He has not been clean longer than a year. He is not inheriting however my oldest will either give him his share if he has been clean for years or help with his rent if he is homeless like he frequently is.  So my oldest gets 2/3 with the understanding he will help his brother. All 3 boys know about this.

Consider a trust? That could backfire, badly.

I agree: leave his share in a testamentary trust, created by your will. Does your will make allowances for any of your sons dying before you do? If it's the oldest, what then? A trust avoids these issues. Make a brother a trustee if you'd like, but know that will set brother against brother.

remizidae

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #21 on: December 02, 2018, 05:00:59 PM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

But if the 'reward' should not be based on someone's behaviour, how do you decide who will be in your Will? (Especially if you don't have kids).

My partner and I have each cut out a parent from our wills. One abandoned their family when the kids were young, the other was a domestic abuser. Both failed so miserably at parenthood that we don't want to give them any of our hard earned stash. The other parents were not perfect either but at least they stepped up and took their responsability when they had to.


This is all a fantasy about controlling others. I find it distasteful to use money as a weapon to manipulate your family or show them your disapproval. And frankly, it's not going to work--if you disinherit your annoying sister-in-law, it's not going to make her realize how right you were. It just leaves a legacy of bitterness and resentment. Is that how you want to be remembered?

Leave your money to your closest relatives--it's the natural choice and is least likely to lead to resentment or litigation or family civil war. Leave it to your kids or spouse. I would go to siblings if you don't have kids or a spouse. (Don't understand these people talking about disinheriting their in-laws--it would never occur to me to leave in-laws money in the first place.) And if that rule results in someone you don't like getting some money--who cares? You'll be dead then anyway.

remizidae

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #22 on: December 02, 2018, 05:14:36 PM »
One of my sons is a drug addict so it would harm him to receive money. He has not been clean longer than a year. He is not inheriting however my oldest will either give him his share if he has been clean for years or help with his rent if he is homeless like he frequently is.  So my oldest gets 2/3 with the understanding he will help his brother. All 3 boys know about this.

Your children are going to hate each other if you do this. I second the suggestion to create a trust. That way, there will be a legally enforceable mechanism to ensure your wishes are carried out, and, more importantly, you avoid putting one of your sons in the position of slavemaster over his brother.

Cassie

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #23 on: December 02, 2018, 05:25:59 PM »
Chances are I will die before my younger husband and he will use up the money.  If there is money left it wonít be worth the cost of a trust. The others donít have a relationship now with the addict brother. They are supportive when he is clean. He is 40 and I may outlive him with how he is living ( homeless, getting into fights and using meth).

hops

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2018, 06:05:01 PM »
(Don't understand these people talking about disinheriting their in-laws--it would never occur to me to leave in-laws money in the first place.)

Some people are raised with the expectation that they will eventually provide for their parents. It can take some adjusting when marrying into a situation like that -- in the past, there've been some interesting conversations here about that.

Imma

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #25 on: December 03, 2018, 12:12:20 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

But if the 'reward' should not be based on someone's behaviour, how do you decide who will be in your Will? (Especially if you don't have kids).

My partner and I have each cut out a parent from our wills. One abandoned their family when the kids were young, the other was a domestic abuser. Both failed so miserably at parenthood that we don't want to give them any of our hard earned stash. The other parents were not perfect either but at least they stepped up and took their responsability when they had to.


This is all a fantasy about controlling others. I find it distasteful to use money as a weapon to manipulate your family or show them your disapproval. And frankly, it's not going to work--if you disinherit your annoying sister-in-law, it's not going to make her realize how right you were. It just leaves a legacy of bitterness and resentment. Is that how you want to be remembered?

Leave your money to your closest relatives--it's the natural choice and is least likely to lead to resentment or litigation or family civil war. Leave it to your kids or spouse. I would go to siblings if you don't have kids or a spouse. (Don't understand these people talking about disinheriting their in-laws--it would never occur to me to leave in-laws money in the first place.) And if that rule results in someone you don't like getting some money--who cares? You'll be dead then anyway.

My partner is my first heir and after him follow some of our parents and our siblings. I wouldn't disinherit someone because they are annoying, but like I said, one of my parents committed crime against me (that's what beating up your kid is) which is a pretty serious thing. We're not in touch so my parent doesn't know.

I am one of those people that has their in-laws in their will, to cover the situation of my partner and I dying in the same event. Imagine we're in a car accident and my partner dies instantly while I succumbed to my injuries a few days later, if we didn't put our in-laws in our wills, his assets would go to me and our joint assets would then go to my family, leaving his family empty-handed. Our will is written in such a way that our assets would be devided equally between both families if this happens.

Of couse if my partner outlives me by decades, I don't expect  him to keep my family in his will forever, but I would appreciate if he returned some heirlooms and personal effects and gift them some cash.

elliha

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #26 on: December 03, 2018, 03:04:41 AM »
I don't have a will and if I die first my husband will inherit what I own and when he dies the kids will get anything that is left. I am fine with that but let's say I become a widow I will likely create a will and give my kids their legal share (my country does not allow one to completely disinherit your kids, they will get half of what you own by the day you die regardless) and give the rest to charity but I honestly hope to not leave much of an inheritance to them if ever possible and use the money I have to do fun things for me, give to charity and help them while I am still alive if there is any money I feel I can spare. By giving while you are alive I will have more control than if I wait until I am dead. If I had no people that I legally would have to give an inheritance to I would give half to one of my best friends and the rest to charity that she can pick out for me and her together. I trust that she and I have very similar views on charity so I know that my will would be done by her picking too. Her parents are quite poor and will live a very small inheritance if anything so this is why I would give it to her.

Villanelle

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #27 on: December 03, 2018, 04:14:51 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

I agree that a will isn't a reward, but I think there are other reasons for removing someone from a will.

There is someone in our life I would probably remove if DH was on board.  (This person has no idea he was ever in the will, so wouldn't know he was specifically removed, although people with comparable relationships would still be included so that would probably stand out to him.--e.g. only one person of X relationship wouldn't be included.)  It's not a way of controlling him as it would never be discussed.  But he's someone unlikely to spend money wisely or even safely and money most likely would be used to enable behavior harmful to him and to others.  So why *would* we give him money?  Just because all of the other SameBiologicalRelationships on both sides of our family get money?  I don't think inheritance should be a control mechanism, but I also don't think anyone is entitled to money just because we share DNA.  If someone is a thoughtless, difficult, unpleasant presence in my life?  Even if there wasn't a concern about the money actually being harmful for someone, I can respect an argument that one shouldn't reward bad behavior.  I'd rather leave money to a dear friend who has been loving and helpful and kind and thoughtful and in doing so, enable her to live a somewhat better life, than to give it to my [hypothetical] kid who spit in my face, for example. 

The assumption that disinheritance is about either control or showing disapproval seems to miss other options.  Someone could very well feel that giving a person money would be detrimental, or simply that they would rather spend their money making X's live better, instead of Ys.  I look at our will as essentially a final spend, and just as I'd rather spend a weekend with X than with Y or spend money on an evening out with X than Y, I'd also rather spend $200k on improving X's life than Y.  That has nothing to do with punishment or manipulation or a display of disapproval.

mbl

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #28 on: December 03, 2018, 07:23:34 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

Well stated Sol...exceptional comment.
I concur.

trollwithamustache

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #29 on: December 03, 2018, 08:34:52 AM »
well, yes but its maybe not so dramatic. The kids cover a range of ages and things are structured to take care of them, and get them ideally into productive adult hood. If all goes well and we don't croak soon, the oldest will cycle out of the current trust/will.

Once everyone is out, this will probably get changed, she's a good kid and the intent isn't she gets nothing, but until everyone is collage'd up nobody gets to blow my stache on silly things.

Maenad

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #30 on: December 03, 2018, 08:57:51 AM »
For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

But doesn't this just create a posthumous F-you? The Inheritance Drama thread is full of stories of how hurt people are when a parent dies and they find out they've been disinherited.

I understand how manipulative it is to use money as reward/punishment, but for people with abusive family members, why should they leave money to their abusers? Where is the line between manipulation and experiencing the natural consequences of one's behavior?

El Jacinto

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #31 on: December 03, 2018, 10:45:09 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

It isn't being used to control life choices. I wouldn't give a drug-addicted family member money because it would do more harm than good. The same is true with giving out inheritances. If you believe giving the person money results in more harm than good, it's a bad idea to leave them money.

slappy

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #32 on: December 03, 2018, 11:05:40 AM »
We are in the process of doing this now, but not as it relates to finances. We have established a guardian for the kids in the event that we both pass away. We chose him based on our relationship with him, his relationship with his kids and our understanding of his parenting style. Over the past year or two, he has been changing, and we recently discovered he has been cheating on his wife. My husband is emphatic that we remove him as guardian and choose someone else. He believes that cheating on the wife, especially the way this whole situation has gone, is deceitful and dishonest and he doesn't want the kids being raised by someone like that. It's really sad to me and I'm hoping this person gets things straightened out and can regain our trust. The second guardian is really someone I don't want to raise my kids. Our parenting styles are very different and I worry about the transition for the kids. I hate dealing with this, so I've decided not to die!

jeninco

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #33 on: December 03, 2018, 11:59:20 AM »
We are in the process of doing this now, but not as it relates to finances. We have established a guardian for the kids in the event that we both pass away. We chose him based on our relationship with him, his relationship with his kids and our understanding of his parenting style. Over the past year or two, he has been changing, and we recently discovered he has been cheating on his wife. My husband is emphatic that we remove him as guardian and choose someone else. He believes that cheating on the wife, especially the way this whole situation has gone, is deceitful and dishonest and he doesn't want the kids being raised by someone like that. It's really sad to me and I'm hoping this person gets things straightened out and can regain our trust. The second guardian is really someone I don't want to raise my kids. Our parenting styles are very different and I worry about the transition for the kids. I hate dealing with this, so I've decided not to die!

Yeah, we had to think long and hard about who should "inherit" our kids (and most of our $) if we both died together. I hadn't thought about this as being "removed" from our will, but we haven't told anyone (except the kids "godparents" who agreed) that they weren't going to be the guardians. The couple we (easily) agreed on isn't biologically related to us, although we have living parents, aunts/uncles, and siblings. (All of whom are enormously unsuited to the task.)

Good luck cleaning this up!

Novik

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #34 on: December 03, 2018, 12:26:54 PM »
We are in the process of doing this now, but not as it relates to finances. We have established a guardian for the kids in the event that we both pass away. We chose him based on our relationship with him, his relationship with his kids and our understanding of his parenting style. Over the past year or two, he has been changing, and we recently discovered he has been cheating on his wife. My husband is emphatic that we remove him as guardian and choose someone else. He believes that cheating on the wife, especially the way this whole situation has gone, is deceitful and dishonest and he doesn't want the kids being raised by someone like that. It's really sad to me and I'm hoping this person gets things straightened out and can regain our trust. The second guardian is really someone I don't want to raise my kids. Our parenting styles are very different and I worry about the transition for the kids. I hate dealing with this, so I've decided not to die!

That's really rough. A story for you, that might be relevant: If my mother's will had kicked in when we were little we would've been sent to live with a close friend of hers with a similar parenting style - in another country, across the continent. As we aged, the will changed to have us to live with a different close friend whose parenting was quite different, but who lived nearby - so we'd have less disruption in our lives since by then we had roots of our own in the city.

Not sure how old your kids are, but even if they're little you only need to not die until they get old enough that the different parenting is less crucial!



On topic: I don't have a will (yet... working on it), but when I do, after kids/spouse, I would plan to allocate significant funds to very close friends who are in lean financial circumstances, rather than anything back to my parents, who are both more than taken care of.

Dee18

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #35 on: December 03, 2018, 05:27:00 PM »
In about half the states, the parents’ selection of a guardian is non-binding on the court.  When I wanted my child’s potential guardian to be a non-family person, instead of my sibling, my attorney advised me to keep a paper trail (mostly emails to a close friend, who was not the designated guardian, about why I made that choice) that the attorney could use in court if need be.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2018, 08:08:53 PM by Dee18 »

Mtngrl

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #36 on: December 03, 2018, 05:43:52 PM »
My father disinherited my brother, over a fight they had when my brother was married. By the time my dad died, unexpectedly and suddenly, he and my brother were on good terms again (brother was no longer married), but Dad never updated the will. I was the sole legatee -- but I divided the estate with my brother anyway. Still, I know my brother was very hurt. (Neither of us had any idea of the terms of the will until my dad died.)

My in-laws have disinherited one son who has not spoken to them in twenty-five years. He has made it clear he wants no contact. Meanwhile, my husband and his sister care for their increasingly frail parents. I would be very surprised if this brother says a word after they are gone.

joonifloofeefloo

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #37 on: December 03, 2018, 06:44:30 PM »
I divided the estate with my brother anyway.

:))))))))))))))))))))))))     Good person. You considered the circumstances and intentions, and chose to do right by both your dad and your brother. Beautiful.

honeybbq

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #38 on: December 04, 2018, 09:56:17 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

We modified our will and removed the money going to my step son  because he's a drug addict and the amount we left him would easily buy him enough drugs to kill himself and 100 of his best friends. I guess we are evil horrible people for refusing to enable our step son's "choices".

PS drugs are bad people
« Last Edit: December 04, 2018, 09:57:50 AM by honeybbq »

sol

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #39 on: December 04, 2018, 11:08:03 AM »
We modified our will and removed the money going to my step son  because he's a drug addict

Meh.  Drug addiction is just a different sort of pathway to (chemically induced temporary) happiness.  It's easier to achieve contentment with heroin than with hard work and industrious purchases of index funds which enable early retirement, but the end result is pretty close to the same: you can choose to lay around all day and feel good without being a productive member of society.

Would you withhold inheritance money from someone who was retired early?  Are you only going to gift money to people who slave away at a difficult job all day every day until death?

I have a couple of relatives who are widely considered to be failures.  They are poor, and do too many drugs.  But generally speaking they are happy people who live their lives they way they want to.  They play music, and make big meals for their friends.  They are politically active, and have fulfilling love lives with other impoverished drug addicts.  You and I may not approve of their life choices, but objectively speaking their choices are making them happy and that's what we're all striving for, right?  And in the worst case scenario of something truly horrible happening, there are always drugs to make you feel better for a while.  That's an option the rest of us generally don't have, and I suspect they think I am foolish for not partaking in the magical "make your problems disappear" substances.

I can think of lots of good reasons to withhold an inheritance from someone.  I just don't think you should hold it over their heads while you are still alive as a means of trying to control people.  Money is supposed to be a tool for finding freedom, and threatening to cut someone out of your will is instead using it as a tool of oppression.  Give or don't give, that part is up to you, just don't be a dick about it.  You have to let people make their own choices, good and bad.

DS

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #40 on: December 04, 2018, 11:11:03 AM »
No.  My will is not a reward.

The very idea of trying to use my wealth to control another person's life choices is entirety antithetical to everything this forum is about. 

For anyone who has done this, I hope that you at least kept your decision private instead of flaunting it at someone like some kind of punishment.

We modified our will and removed the money going to my step son  because he's a drug addict and the amount we left him would easily buy him enough drugs to kill himself and 100 of his best friends. I guess we are evil horrible people for refusing to enable our step son's "choices".

PS drugs are bad people

Was just reading this article "Parents Are Cutting Off Their Opioid-Addicted Kids ó and It's the Toughest Decision of Their Lives"

http://time.com/money/longform/parents-opioid-addiction-money-cost/

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #41 on: December 04, 2018, 11:13:37 AM »
I have not.

However, my great-aunt's (no direct heirs) will divided her (very high) assets much higher to one of her brother's children than the other brother's. She felt first brother's children spent much more care and attention to her throughout her life, and deserved more. The will stated this, she never did during life.

honeybbq

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #42 on: December 04, 2018, 11:46:26 AM »
We modified our will and removed the money going to my step son  because he's a drug addict

Meh.  Drug addiction is just a different sort of pathway to (chemically induced temporary) happiness.  It's easier to achieve contentment with heroin than with hard work and industrious purchases of index funds which enable early retirement, but the end result is pretty close to the same: you can choose to lay around all day and feel good without being a productive member of society.

Would you withhold inheritance money from someone who was retired early?  Are you only going to gift money to people who slave away at a difficult job all day every day until death?

I have a couple of relatives who are widely considered to be failures.  They are poor, and do too many drugs.  But generally speaking they are happy people who live their lives they way they want to.  They play music, and make big meals for their friends.  They are politically active, and have fulfilling love lives with other impoverished drug addicts.  You and I may not approve of their life choices, but objectively speaking their choices are making them happy and that's what we're all striving for, right?  And in the worst case scenario of something truly horrible happening, there are always drugs to make you feel better for a while.  That's an option the rest of us generally don't have, and I suspect they think I am foolish for not partaking in the magical "make your problems disappear" substances.

I can think of lots of good reasons to withhold an inheritance from someone.  I just don't think you should hold it over their heads while you are still alive as a means of trying to control people.  Money is supposed to be a tool for finding freedom, and threatening to cut someone out of your will is instead using it as a tool of oppression.  Give or don't give, that part is up to you, just don't be a dick about it.  You have to let people make their own choices, good and bad.

This is spoken like someone who has never really seen or spoken to a loved one struggling with drug addiction. This is not smoking a few MJs behind a 7-11 and being silly. This is not a punishment for being a failure (which I never said they were). This is the dark, scary place that people don't come back from. And we are not trying to control them, that's ridiculous because we can't. We've tried to help them but been mostly unsuccessful. Perhaps you are more gifted than we are in getting people to give up drugs? Maybe you could start a program.

Nobody threatened or held anything over anyone's head. They don't even know about this modification. Nor did they know about the original will. This is the kindest and most loving thing we can do.

joonifloofeefloo

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #43 on: December 04, 2018, 12:15:49 PM »
Quote
just don't think you should hold it over their heads while you are still alive as a means of trying to control people.  Money is supposed to be a tool for finding freedom, and threatening to cut someone out of your will is instead using it as a tool of oppression.  Give or don't give, that part is up to you, just don't be a dick about it.  You have to let people make their own choices, good and bad.

Very weird assumption, that removing a person = telling them, holding it over their head, threatening, etc. That wasnít the topic of the thread, or anything anyone here said they would do.

Off hand, I donít even recall anyone saying they would try to prevent others from even making their own choices about anything.

???

sol

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #44 on: December 04, 2018, 12:25:07 PM »
This is spoken like someone who has never really seen or spoken to a loved one struggling with drug addiction.

Your assumption is incorrect.  I don't think I need to go into details, because this would rapidly become a game of "who has the more fucked up family" and I hate winning that game even more than I hate losing it.  I won't even start.

Quote
Perhaps you are more gifted than we are in getting people to give up drugs? Maybe you could start a program.

Quite the contrary.  I don't think you can convince anyone to give up drugs or any other addiction that they don't want to, and sometimes you can't even help them if they do want to.  Money is mostly irrelevant in addiction cases, except for the minority that have something to live for and genuinely want out.

I recently read some reporting about states methadone treatment programs, which are basically one-shot deals.  As in, if you relapse after your first trip to rehab, the state will declare you a lost cause and not devote any further efforts to you.  Much like cigarettes, virtually no one quits on their first try.  There were a handful of stories of people who wanted to get clean and failed.  The only "success" stories for getting off of heroin were twin brothers from a wealthy family, who genuinely wanted to quit, where the parents put up several hundred thousand dollars to send them back to private rehab over and over again.  It was like the fourth trip for one and the fifth trip for the other, at a cost of tens of thousands of dollars per trip per brother.

Quote
This is the kindest and most loving thing we can do.

Then you're probably doing the right thing, if you've convinced yourself that the money would be wasted on rehab.  It's your money and you get to make that decision.  I just hate to hear stories of people trying to use "I'm cutting you out of the will" as a threat against their relatives.  If you're not one of those people, then my ire was not directed at you.

Off hand, I donít even recall anyone saying they would try to prevent others from even making their own choices about anything.

There's a whole forum thread devoted to stories about inheritance drama, including some dirty manipulative dead relatives.  It seems to be a common problem.

Cassie

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #45 on: December 04, 2018, 12:50:46 PM »
My son has been to rehab numerous times.  Just like the other poster leaving money to a hard core drug addict would kill them.   I explained it to him so if I die he wonít think that I donít love him. My husband lost his brother to a overdose at age 30.  Itís heartbreaking. Sol, if you want to leave a pile of money to a drug addict child be my guest.   I donít want to be responsible for killing my child.

iris lily

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #46 on: December 04, 2018, 05:01:25 PM »
If I had to base inclusion in the will on behavior I liked all the time, nobody would be in it.
Awwww, god I love ya!

We have divided our estate up into 10 - 12 equal parcels. Were
I to do it over again I would just give assets to the handful of charitable organizations we named and forget about the people. But I WOULD urge the Executors to take whatever salary the state allows them to earn, that way I dont feel guilty at saddling them with the job.


iris lily

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #47 on: December 04, 2018, 05:04:48 PM »
Yes. People who threw money away, used up other people's finances with abandon, and/or did not access finances legally and morally accessible to them. If they value money and other people's efforts so little, that's not a good place for my hard-saved money to go.

This.  There are people for whom large sums of money would be a curse.  Furthermore, I do not feel obligated to reward people (family or otherwise) with money I earned just because thatís what other people do.  Currently, all my children are in my will but that hasnít always been the case.  The only real concern I have is the possibility of creating division between after my death.  I donít care too much about what they think of me but I know how families can be torn apart by the apportionment of the parentís estate.  I donít want to be the cause of something like that.

We have one of those situations in our family. Two siblings, one estranged from parents. Parents have chit tons of money, I mean millions. Only one sibling will inherit.

And that inheriting sibling will promptly give half of it to the other sib because that is the kind of person he is.

You can only control so much feom the grave, folks.

WhiteTrashCash

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #48 on: December 04, 2018, 05:27:27 PM »
I cut a formerly very close friend out of my will after my wife became sick and the friend decided to avoid me because "depressed people aren't fun to be around." I have very little contact with that "friend" at all now, actually.

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Re: Have you ever removed someone from your will because of their behavior?
« Reply #49 on: December 04, 2018, 05:55:44 PM »
My in-laws have a significant net worth and have passive aggressively tried to direct our behavior based on potential inheritance. Thankfully my wife doesn't put up with it or let it influence her decisions, but it does annoy her. We have benefited greatly from them being generous when they feel like it. They have also made comments that make it sound like they don't have a current will. I know they don't have any trusts setup. Assets in multiple states. It will be a mess unless they decide to do something about it.

This is a good reminder that we need to get a will written up.