Author Topic: Good REIT's in Europe?  (Read 3061 times)

h2o

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Good REIT's in Europe?
« on: March 13, 2015, 09:19:49 AM »
Hello fellow Mustachians, junior stubble here.

I just started investing some of my savings in ETF's and just read some posts about being a lazy house owner by investing in REITs. However I live in The Netherlands, Europe and therefore I think it is wise to find some good funds locally (yet diversified) that is trading on the AMX or something close by, instead of all the suggestions from the States. Mainly because I would be trading in USD instead of EUR, which doesn't seem smart; yet another factor (currency fluctuations) to keep track of.

Or doesn't it matter so much?

Help appreciated!

kvaruni

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 92
  • Location: Northern Ireland, UK
Re: Good REIT's in Europe?
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2015, 08:49:45 AM »
Have a look around at what iShares has to offer. Most of them are listed in Ireland, The Netherlands or Germany. If you want one close to home, have a look at: http://www.morningstar.nl/nl/etf/snapshot/snapshot.aspx?id=0P00001SFT . Costs are fair at 0.4%. On Morningstar you can probably find some more, but this particular ETF is listed on a fair number of stock markets (so multiple hits) and other property (developed world, US, Asia, UK) might be less relevant to you.

en welkom op het forum :).

h2o

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: Good REIT's in Europe?
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2015, 05:25:07 PM »
Thanks for the advice! 2% dividend is the best we can do here, hmm? Nothing like the 7% mentioned on blogs for REITs oversees? Or am I over-ambitious here and seeing things wrong?

Anyway I'm just playing with the idea of diversifying my portfolio with some real estate for the dividend in it instead of the earnings of shares that is highly fluctuating.

How have you diversified your portfolio if I may ask?

En dank je wel :) dit is een verbazingwekkende wereld waar ik nu net in stap dus alles is nog uitzoekwerk ;)

daverobev

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3322
  • Location: UK
Re: Good REIT's in Europe?
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2015, 06:30:39 PM »
Currency fluctuations don't matter; what you buy matters. IE, what is IN the wrapper.

In Canada you can buy US stocks and ETFs directly, or you can buy a Canadian ETF that basically just holds the US ETF. The total return in *Canadian* funds will be (nearly) the same.

Anyway, as to REITs - most ETFs are *domiciled* in Ireland or Lux because they have favourable tax systems (ie, no local withholding tax) - assuming you buy in Euros it shouldn't matter the stock exchange, assuming you can trade on that exchange of course.


Maybe http://www.ishares.com/uk/intermediaries/en/products/251958/ishares-stoxx-europe-600-real-estate-ucits-etf-de-fund?siteEntryPassthrough=true

Some other stuff here http://www.morningstar.co.uk/uk/news/67588/get-real-with-real-estate-etps.aspx

I'm just being a human Google for you, really!

kvaruni

  • 5 O'Clock Shadow
  • *
  • Posts: 92
  • Location: Northern Ireland, UK
Re: Good REIT's in Europe?
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2015, 03:46:10 AM »
as daverobev says, I wouldn't worry too much about all of that. What you really want is a low-cost ETF or fund that closely follows the underlying index. Dividends will apply equally to all ETFs or funds that follow the same index (more or less). Of course, if you exploit the home bias and want to invest in the European property market then the performance will indeed be different from the US market, for example. All a matter of choice :).

I'm not big on property or dividends in general and strongly believe in just having a portion of your money in equities, equally spread over the world according to their share in the world cap, and the other portion in high-interest investment grade bonds. The bonds are just there to balance out the ride, whereas the stocks are the money cows (or so we hope). What asset allocation you choose is entirely up to your own level of risk tolerance and your investment horizon. Everything else such as commodities and property is always hailed in the best of times, but never performs as expected in the worst of times. I have heard too many claims of how gold and property will safeguard you from a crash or will deliver stellar performance. The truth is, some gold I bought just before 2008 is only worth 40% of what it was back then and I just bought a house in the UK where prices are still 50% lower in some areas than they were before 2008.

TL;DR: choose the index you want to follow for property exposure, then just select an ETF or fund to match. Property markets in Europe are, of course, an entirely different animal than in the US. Don't overdo property in your portfolio. You might already have exposure through your own house, and it is hardly the safe haven or cash generator that some blogs proclaim.