Author Topic: FIRE, ER, and dating???  (Read 32826 times)

Holyoak

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FIRE, ER, and dating???
« on: August 26, 2014, 10:14:50 AM »
So how do you do it, when you are all of 47 and retired, divorced after 23 years of marriage from a cheater, navigating through stigma, gold diggers, etc.  My relationship spanned three decades, my 'picker' may be a bit rusty, and this new situation I am in both emotionally and financially requires I ask MMM.

Of course nearly the first thing gals ask is "what do you do"?  How do you navigate this essential question?  I guess the majority will figure you are an unambitious unemployed bum, weirdo, sugar daddy, or outright liar.  Of course they will see either my 20 year old Camry, or 9 year old manual transmission Toyota Matrix I rolled up in, and...

I really don't care about this, as these things are really the truth serum to see what a gal is made out of/motivations; just the same, how do you navigate being fairly young and retired when perusing ladies to date?

Thanks a lot for your wise counsel!

Kaspian

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #1 on: August 26, 2014, 10:32:48 AM »
I wish I could tell you and if you find out, let me know.  I'm single, 43, not FI yet, but when a girl finds out I don't own a car, walk (12 minutes) to work every day, shop at the ugly grocery store, and live in an apartment (not a house) they're none too happy to date me.  That's just as well, because I usually find out they owe $10K in credit card debt, use the latest iPhone, still have student loans, drive a leased gas guzzler BMW, and plan on someday having a $50K wedding with a horse-carriage and fireworks involved.  Meh, guess I'll stay single.  I ain't letting that crazy behaviour anywhere near my savings.

Zikoris

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #2 on: August 26, 2014, 10:38:33 AM »
You could try the new-age environmentalist hippie/hipster demographic - we tend to be pretty non-materialistic. You can find us at vegetarian meetups, farmers markets, "natural" beaches, the library, and community center canning/sewing/home-brewing workshops.

Sarita

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #3 on: August 26, 2014, 10:50:27 AM »
You could try the new-age environmentalist hippie/hipster demographic - we tend to be pretty non-materialistic. You can find us at vegetarian meetups, farmers markets, "natural" beaches, the library, and community center canning/sewing/home-brewing workshops.

+ 1 :)

MayDay

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #4 on: August 26, 2014, 10:53:23 AM »
I don't think you can blame a gal for not wanting to date an "unemployed" bum. But yah, if you tell them you are retired I can see how that would attract the gold diggers.

My wealthy retired grandpa (quite a bit older than you) solved this by marrying a lady with her own job and nest egg (which ended up being bigger than his) and did a prenup and they keep all separate finances.

Do you volunteer? How about something vague to start, like "I am heavily involved in environmental advocacy for (insert endangered animals of your choice)".  Or whatever applies to wherever you volunteer.

matchewed

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #5 on: August 26, 2014, 10:55:23 AM »
Or it could be the normal things you'd do regardless of ER. Go do your interests and meet people. Try online dating or similar things. Get to know someone first. If you're having trouble answering the inevitable "What do you do for a living?" question then practice on some answers and get on with the dating.

Potential answers to that question include - "I'm an investor.", "I have partial ownership of a few businesses.", "Nothing and I love it." whatever. FIRE and ER doesn't change the core thing about dating and meeting people, you just probably do less of it in bars. Which I think most people would agree that you don't have to meet people there anyway.

Stick with the basics, find people with similar interests, go on dates, be a decent person...etc.

yogagirl95

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #6 on: August 26, 2014, 10:56:36 AM »
You never know. I am in the same position, although I consider myself semi retired. I am dating someone who agrees with me that Money and things are not important.

FrugalZony

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #7 on: August 26, 2014, 10:57:07 AM »
Let me know if you find out! I am going through a divorce right now after a 23 year relationship as well.
Just the mere thought of dating makes me break out in sweat.
My soon to be ex husband is already making plans, because he just does not want to be alone.
Whereas I don't want to face the fact, that I will have to deal with this sometime down the road.

In the long term, I know, I'd really like to have a partner in my FIRE ventures, someone to really team up with, but I don't have the slightest idea how to make that happen.

So from the female perspective this is not any easier guys, believe me. Appearances matter and people judge.
I find guys, who try to impress you with fancy restaurants, cars etc. suspicious.
I don't care much for manicures and spending hours to get dolled up for a date.
But if you don't, people will probably think you don't care enough for them.

My girlfriend, who has quite a bit of experience in online dating, showed me some of the online profiles of guys who had messaged her
and all that did was make me want to puke!
The stories I hear from her just make me want to skip the whole thing altogether and become a crazy old cat lady.
They do make for interesting entertainment though. I don't watch TV, but listening to her stories is better than any soap opera!
« Last Edit: August 26, 2014, 11:02:09 AM by FrugalZony »

Zikoris

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #8 on: August 26, 2014, 11:03:56 AM »
Oh, and for "What do you do?" I'd stick with "Investor".

Beric01

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2014, 11:30:23 AM »
You could try the new-age environmentalist hippie/hipster demographic - we tend to be pretty non-materialistic. You can find us at vegetarian meetups, farmers markets, "natural" beaches, the library, and community center canning/sewing/home-brewing workshops.

This group kind of turns me off a bit as well, though. I'm not a hippie - I bike and don't own a car because it saves me money and makes me healthier. Maybe I should try to pretend to be a hippie?

I do like the idea of claiming to be an "investor" post-FIRE. I'll just say I manage an investment portfolio (which happens to require zero work as it's all in index funds). :-)

My current plan is when I FIRE (very early 30's) to move to a cheaper COL country (Southeast Asia) where I actually would be decently-well to do with my FIRE income. Women in Asia are just more frugal than in America. I'm not going to try to change someone living here in the states - women who appreciate frugality are just too hard to find here, particularly the non-hippie type.

SummerLovin

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2014, 11:35:50 AM »
Start in "Meetups and Social Events" to get to know your fellow mustachians, and get out and meet people.  When you're really ready to date, and have let go of the chip you're carrying, check out "Mustachian and Single" to see if there are like minded women that you might date.

Believe it or not, there are actually women out that don't care what you drive or what you do for a living as long as you're a good person, can take care of yourself financially, and treat them respectfully.  Unfortunately, from what I have seen, many men in your situation are "generally" looking for someone much younger, that they can "mold" and have more children with- which also begets the need for financial support.  It is a rare middle-aged man who is interested in women his age group.  Food for thought.  Good luck.

Zikoris

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2014, 11:42:03 AM »
You could try the new-age environmentalist hippie/hipster demographic - we tend to be pretty non-materialistic. You can find us at vegetarian meetups, farmers markets, "natural" beaches, the library, and community center canning/sewing/home-brewing workshops.

This group kind of turns me off a bit as well, though. I'm not a hippie - I bike and don't own a car because it saves me money and makes me healthier. Maybe I should try to pretend to be a hippie?

I do like the idea of claiming to be an "investor" post-FIRE. I'll just say I manage an investment portfolio (which happens to require zero work as it's all in index funds). :-)

My current plan is when I FIRE (very early 30's) to move to a cheaper COL country (Southeast Asia) where I actually would be decently-well to do with my FIRE income. Women in Asia are just more frugal than in America. I'm not going to try to change someone living here in the states - women who appreciate frugality are just too hard to find here, particularly the non-hippie type.

You might be a hipster without knowing it. It gradually happened to me over about 3 years. One day people just started telling me "GOD you're such a hipster", and that was that.

mpbaker22

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #12 on: August 26, 2014, 11:43:31 AM »
Remember that you're not just a "mustachian."  You are someone with a different mindset than most people.  Your lack of interest in people with $10K debt probably doesn't stem from the fact that they have some debt, but that they put material wants over happiness.  That's right, those material possessions aren't actually providing them happiness, and they have put the material ownership above happiness.  You'll just have to find someone who has the same idea that she wants happiness over material goods, and that isn't necessarily hard to do.

Beric01

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #13 on: August 26, 2014, 11:55:47 AM »
You could try the new-age environmentalist hippie/hipster demographic - we tend to be pretty non-materialistic. You can find us at vegetarian meetups, farmers markets, "natural" beaches, the library, and community center canning/sewing/home-brewing workshops.

This group kind of turns me off a bit as well, though. I'm not a hippie - I bike and don't own a car because it saves me money and makes me healthier. Maybe I should try to pretend to be a hippie?

I do like the idea of claiming to be an "investor" post-FIRE. I'll just say I manage an investment portfolio (which happens to require zero work as it's all in index funds). :-)

My current plan is when I FIRE (very early 30's) to move to a cheaper COL country (Southeast Asia) where I actually would be decently-well to do with my FIRE income. Women in Asia are just more frugal than in America. I'm not going to try to change someone living here in the states - women who appreciate frugality are just too hard to find here, particularly the non-hippie type.

You might be a hipster without knowing it. It gradually happened to me over about 3 years. One day people just started telling me "GOD you're such a hipster", and that was that.

Haha, now you're scaring me! I don't buy into any of that new-age/religious stuff though, and while I don't mind helping the environment, it's not like it's my number one goal in life or anything. Maybe I'm a part-time hipster?

And I really like what you're saying, but it's even harder to find these people as someone in their mid-twenties. Everyone says I'm "very mature for my age" or "way ahead of my age" - few people of either gender seem to want a longer-term relationship at all. I've got to say the OP is fortunate - being older at least more women are looking for a serious relationship.

DoubleDown

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2014, 01:13:07 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

Beric01

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #15 on: August 26, 2014, 02:21:39 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

So basically, rather than "being yourself", be fake? Besides, I wouldn't want to date a woman who would fall for such a ploy. If you're asked such a simple question and can't even give a straight answer, it says a lot about you.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2014, 02:23:17 PM by Beric01 »

Luck12

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #16 on: August 26, 2014, 02:25:36 PM »
Oh, and for "What do you do?" I'd stick with "Investor".

I'm not FIRE quite yet, but I answer "As little as possible" and women (and guys) usually laugh (and if they don't, they don't have a sense of humor).   Then I just say "Actually, I'm not as lazy as that sounds, I run, play tennis, tutor kids, play volleyball, etc etc".  Often, convo just flows to those topics, sometimes it goes back to occupation and then I answer it seriously. 

Luck12

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2014, 02:26:58 PM »
So basically, rather than "being yourself", be fake? Besides, I wouldn't want to date a woman who would fall for such a ploy. If you're asked such a simple question and can't even give a straight answer, it says a lot about you.

So it seems you're one of the people I refer to as not having a sense of humor. 

CommonCents

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #18 on: August 26, 2014, 02:35:23 PM »
Start in "Meetups and Social Events" to get to know your fellow mustachians, and get out and meet people.  When you're really ready to date, and have let go of the chip you're carrying, check out "Mustachian and Single" to see if there are like minded women that you might date.

Believe it or not, there are actually women out that don't care what you drive or what you do for a living as long as you're a good person, can take care of yourself financially, and treat them respectfully.  Unfortunately, from what I have seen, many men in your situation are "generally" looking for someone much younger, that they can "mold" and have more children with- which also begets the need for financial support.  It is a rare middle-aged man who is interested in women his age group.  Food for thought.  Good luck.

+1

I'd advise against dating until you can have multiple dates without mentioning the cheating/being burned.   (I say this from experience.  I dated someone long-term that cheated on me...lied about basic elements of his life...and later, cheated on his wife with the wife of his best friend...  I didn't date for well over a year after this.)  Everyone's got a bad story there, but you don't want to lead with it.  Lead and focus on the positives - on you and in them.  Don't advertise your money but don't lie either.  You can evade initially, until you know the person better (e.g. "I keep myself busy, but let's avoid the overused standard "date" questions.  Tell me about...").  Best of all is getting to know people through an activity before you start dating, so you know their character.

MandyM

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #19 on: August 26, 2014, 02:37:36 PM »
So basically, rather than "being yourself", be fake? Besides, I wouldn't want to date a woman who would fall for such a ploy. If you're asked such a simple question and can't even give a straight answer, it says a lot about you.

So it seems you're one of the people I refer to as not having a sense of humor. 

I have a sense of humor, but I agree with Beric01. Giving a vague answer (I'm an investor) is different than alluding the question. I may find the stunt man story amusing, but it doesn't mean I'll continue to date a person.

I dated a man for several months last year. He was between jobs, but not really looking. He had some rental income and savings and was looking into a career change. I was totally ok with this, but then again, I'm onboard with that life in general. When meeting new people he generally said he worked in real estate or was a real estate investor.

Zikoris

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #20 on: August 26, 2014, 02:37:36 PM »
It would irritate me if a guy gave BS/nonsense answers to serious and important questions. That would include answering "What do you do?" with "lion tamer" or the equivalent. "As little as possible" is legit though. As a person who hates dating, if I ever found myself in the position of having to go through it again, I would be trying to assess compatibility asap.

Oh, and by the way, look for any local meetups geared towards retirement, FI, or Mustachianism in your area - we have a small but growing group in Vancouver that meets regularly.

Beric01

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2014, 02:49:53 PM »
So basically, rather than "being yourself", be fake? Besides, I wouldn't want to date a woman who would fall for such a ploy. If you're asked such a simple question and can't even give a straight answer, it says a lot about you.

So it seems you're one of the people I refer to as not having a sense of humor.

I can definitely make people laugh. I just don't see any reason to have it be through means of such stupid, long-winded answers. Zikoris's answer of "as little as possible" also is fine by me, as long as it follows with your real occupation soon after. One can inject humor into a conversation without turning it into a conversation completely devoid of content.

Luck12

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2014, 02:55:15 PM »
Luck12's answer of "as little as possible" also is fine by me, as long as it follows with your real occupation soon after. One can inject humor into a conversation without turning it into a conversation completely devoid of content.

Fixed it for you.  That answer is all mine and copyrighted.     

MgoSam

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2014, 02:59:54 PM »
I would avoid giving a coy answer, generally if someone sees someone in their 40s that isn't working, their first impression will be that they are unemployed. I would tell them the truth, that you are retired. Yes you will get people wondering how that happened, but that gives you an opportunity to tell them about yourself and then gives you an opportunity to talk to them. Some will think that either you inherited money, that you started a company that got sold for millions, or that you were hit and got a huge insurance settlement, wait until you tell that you instead saved up money and lived wisely to where you don't need to work!

Russ

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2014, 03:05:01 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

meh, all this alpha male / cocky-funny / pick up artist stuff is just a reasonably convincing way of pretending to be a regular interesting & confident person. I guess if you pretend long enough you become it, but I've always thought doing some actual self-discovery was more effective.

FWIW I think joking answers are fine if you don't have anything better to say... but when your date asks you a second time what you do, you ought to be able to take the cue that he or she would like a little more serious of an answer. I would consider anything else at that point to be incredibly insulting. In the example above, the person being asked doesn't simply try to avoid answering the question, they refuse to answer it. That sound like the action of neither a confident nor trustworthy person IMO.

Holyoak

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #25 on: August 26, 2014, 03:07:57 PM »
Thanks everyone for your perspective. 

I should have been more clear as to time frame and situation.  I have not seen my ex wife in well over a year, and have been dating since that time.  Been divorced since December, and currently have a SO who is very in-line with my philosophy, personality, (and old cars *smile*).  I now carry little if any emotional baggage from my marriage, though at the time the insane levels of deceit, betrayal, emotional rape, and psychopathy on her part was nearly fatal to me, and nearly so for my beautiful, kind daughter.  For you folks who have never been the victim of remorseless, even absurdly sadistic infidelity, especially the long term kind I suffered through, I pray you NEVER even come close to it. 

Everyone I met/dated was from online, and at the time I had a job, so the "what do you do" question was not an issue, even with what may have seemed a low status job.  I know and have experienced very kind, non-materialistic, like minded women, which did and does give me hope!  I'm generally an introvert, although I come across at times as very extroverted (classic INFJ personality), never portray myself as anything but me, and simply wonder what it is like to date when in the situation of FIRE which is so new to me.  I'm not trying to sabotage my current relationship, but lately I have seen a few issues that I have discussed with her that may necessitate a break-up, and I appreciate the help given.  Thank you!


Beric01

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2014, 03:13:09 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

meh, all this alpha male / cocky-funny / pick up artist stuff is just a reasonably convincing way of pretending to be a regular interesting & confident person. I guess if you pretend long enough you become it, but I've always thought doing some actual self-discovery was more effective.

I'm sure these kinds of tactics do work - on a certain type of woman. I'm not interested in that kind of woman. Any woman who can't see through the game deserves the guy they end up with, and likewise the guy with the girl. I see these types of guys all the time, and it's pretty obvious they're just putting on a show - just let them do as they will.

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2014, 03:20:20 PM »
Oh, and for "What do you do?" I'd stick with "Investor".
I don't know, "Investor" kind of turns me off. I envision Wall Street wanna-be's, power ties and brief cases made of real Alligator skin, gold Rolexes, and shiny new leased Jags, ranting "greed is good!!!" to everyone. Probably not the image the OP wants to project :-)!

For me, as a single (divorced) FIRE'd female I'm just direct and honest and think the OP (or anyone in that situation) should probably just be upfront and say something like - "I live pretty modestly and am able to get by on a small (pension, investment income, trust fund, part time work, whatever) so retired while I was young to________" fill in the blank. If a woman (or man in my case) shares those same values then great, if not then I am happy to not have wasted any time on someone who doesn't share the same goals - or is at least OK with the way I live my life - and he [probably feels the same.  Of course I'm single and NOT looking (at least not for a permanent partner - and I am VERY upfront about that) so in my case the long term financial/lifestyle stuff doesn't matter as much. As long as he is OK with just doing simple fun things like a hike or bike ride (and many guys are) then I don't really care about the money-stuff very much.

okashira

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2014, 03:25:54 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

meh, all this alpha male / cocky-funny / pick up artist stuff is just a reasonably convincing way of pretending to be a regular interesting & confident person. I guess if you pretend long enough you become it, but I've always thought doing some actual self-discovery was more effective.

I'm sure these kinds of tactics do work - on a certain type of woman. I'm not interested in that kind of woman. Any woman who can't see through the game deserves the guy they end up with, and likewise the guy with the girl. I see these types of guys all the time, and it's pretty obvious they're just putting on a show - just let them do as they will.

The David Deangelo guy always creeped me how. But, I hate to say it, it generally works on a very significant % of women, including frugal, intellegent type.  Just don't over do it and always remember you are just joking around.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2014, 03:27:29 PM by okashira »

Aphalite

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #29 on: August 26, 2014, 03:27:18 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

meh, all this alpha male / cocky-funny / pick up artist stuff is just a reasonably convincing way of pretending to be a regular interesting & confident person. I guess if you pretend long enough you become it, but I've always thought doing some actual self-discovery was more effective.

I'm sure these kinds of tactics do work - on a certain type of woman. I'm not interested in that kind of woman. Any woman who can't see through the game deserves the guy they end up with, and likewise the guy with the girl. I see these types of guys all the time, and it's pretty obvious they're just putting on a show - just let them do as they will.

I think you're misunderstanding. It's not that you're not giving a straight answer, it's that you're turning a first date from an interview to something relaxing and casual. Women don't like boring and straight - they like a bit of unpredictableness. I don't know why you have to be condescending about the whole thing. "tactics", "certain type of woman", etc.

shotgunwilly

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #30 on: August 26, 2014, 03:37:13 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

meh, all this alpha male / cocky-funny / pick up artist stuff is just a reasonably convincing way of pretending to be a regular interesting & confident person. I guess if you pretend long enough you become it, but I've always thought doing some actual self-discovery was more effective.

I'm sure these kinds of tactics do work - on a certain type of woman. I'm not interested in that kind of woman. Any woman who can't see through the game deserves the guy they end up with, and likewise the guy with the girl. I see these types of guys all the time, and it's pretty obvious they're just putting on a show - just let them do as they will.

The sad thing is, it works on a large percentage and all types of women.  (Who will of course will always deny that is does work on them.)  They even marry these people, and then contribute to the outstanding divorce rate when they wake up to how fake the person is or how incompatible they are.

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #31 on: August 26, 2014, 05:06:50 PM »
Thought I might throw in this paper as it relates to Mustachianism: Male Financial Consumption is Associated with Higher Mating Intentions and Mating Success.

Quote
Males who have higher mating intentions may maximize their economic displays, saving little and even spending beyond their capacity through the use of credit. These men may seek and possibly obtain a greater number of sexual partners. This hypothesis was tested in a randomly selected community sample of men aged 18-45 included in a telephone health interview. The degree of financial consumption was directly related to future mating intentions and past mating success, even when accounting for age, years of education completed, and marital status.

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #32 on: August 26, 2014, 05:32:36 PM »
Hey OP, sorry to hear you're going through this tough spot. But as someone who's been-there-done-that, I can tell you that even though this is a hard and scary time, it is a time of amazing opportunity. You have the opportunity to find someone else special, or to date 1,000 women if you want, or none at all. Here's my advice that I sincerely hope you will take to heart, because some of your (understandable but misplaced) concerns expressed in your post suggest you will gain a lot from it:

Google "cocky/funny" or "David D'Angelo". You will learn that the car you drive, the fact that you are retired early, and everything else is either immaterial or can be used to your benefit.

Here's the correct answer to the "What do you do for a living?" question:

"I'm a stunt man. Have you seen those movies where the hot actor has to show his bare ass, and they bring in a body double? That's me."

That's the attitude you want to convey. And that answer will invite further conversation and questions, like "Really, what do you actually do?" Then you say, "No really -- haven't you seen that in movies? Someone's got to do it, and it's me." You're being funny, creating attraction, keeping the entertaining conversation going, and creating mystery about your REAL occupation (which is already plenty interesting and can be revealed in due time). This is just one example, but it shows how the key to attracting women has just about nothing to do with the kind of car you drive, and everything to do with your attitude and presentation and being an interesting person.

meh, all this alpha male / cocky-funny / pick up artist stuff is just a reasonably convincing way of pretending to be a regular interesting & confident person. I guess if you pretend long enough you become it, but I've always thought doing some actual self-discovery was more effective.

I'm sure these kinds of tactics do work - on a certain type of woman. I'm not interested in that kind of woman. Any woman who can't see through the game deserves the guy they end up with, and likewise the guy with the girl. I see these types of guys all the time, and it's pretty obvious they're just putting on a show - just let them do as they will.

The sad thing is, it works on a large percentage and all types of women.  (Who will of course will always deny that is does work on them.)  They even marry these people, and then contribute to the outstanding divorce rate when they wake up to how fake the person is or how incompatible they are.

It's sad that people are attracted to humor?!?  That's the strangest statement I've ever seen.  I'm certain that it would be effective.  Look at any list of what partners want from the other and guaranteed top 3 if not #1 is a sense of humor.

Is it the method of communication here?  Because if this was said to you in person, I can almost guarantee you and everyone else would be laughing.  Like aphalite mentioned above, it moves the first date from an "interview" type situation into a much more casual and comfortable atmosphere.  Honestly, it's pretty brilliant. 
« Last Edit: August 26, 2014, 05:34:33 PM by Eric »

DoubleDown

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #33 on: August 26, 2014, 06:22:41 PM »
Thanks aphalite, okashira, and Eric. You guys nailed it.

I really don't get all the outrage over using humor and confidence to improve one's prospects in dating or attracting members of the opposite sex, and calling it "tactics" and "fake." You might as well express similar outrage over advice to be likable, have manners, and be confident at work in order to improve one's career prospects.

Here's another thing: Advice that can be boiled down to "be yourself" ignores the potential that "being yourself" may actually be horrible advice. Some people are socially inept. Many guys have no clue how to actually approach and talk to women, or they have misguided ideas (such as that "being nice" will be successful). Telling them to "be yourself" may be essentially sentencing them to a lifetime of failure and loneliness. It doesn't mean someone has to be fake -- they can learn how to converse, to create attraction, and to do interesting things so they actually are interesting and have something to talk about

Beric01

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #34 on: August 26, 2014, 06:40:16 PM »
Thanks aphalite, okashira, and Eric. You guys nailed it.

I really don't get all the outrage over using humor and confidence to improve one's prospects in dating or attracting members of the opposite sex, and calling it "tactics" and "fake." You might as well express similar outrage over advice to be likable, have manners, and be confident at work in order to improve one's career prospects.

Here's another thing: Advice that can be boiled down to "be yourself" ignores the potential that "being yourself" may actually be horrible advice. Some people are socially inept. Many guys have no clue how to actually approach and talk to women, or they have misguided ideas (such as that "being nice" will be successful). Telling them to "be yourself" may be essentially sentencing them to a lifetime of failure and loneliness. It doesn't mean someone has to be fake -- they can learn how to converse, to create attraction, and to do interesting things so they actually are interesting and have something to talk about

And here is the crux of the situation. It takes hard work to get into a relationship. But notice what's going on here? It takes hard work for a single gender. Let me ask the question: why is this day of supposed gender equality in everything else, is all of the work in dating still put on men's shoulders? Why do men need to initiate and women get to decide?

I could play the game. Read every book and attend every seminar on "attracting women". Go out on town one night, talk to 100 women, and hope that increases my odds. But what do women need to do in the same situations? Just respond, just choose which of the countless men out there that approach them that they are interested in. This is just as true on dating sites as anywhere else.

To me it looks like I need to put in as much effort into dating as to getting an education. That just sounds like too much work. And frankly, I'm just not that desperate. For me, a relationship would be nice to have. For a women who thinks a relationship would be nice to have, all she needs to do is go on a date when a guy asks her, accept future dates, and boom, she's in a relationship. For me as a guy, I need to compete against all of the other guys who are out there, just desperate for a relationship, and are putting all of this effort into researching the "science of attracting women".

Add in my bit of idealism that women are actually human beings, and shouldn't just be calculated down to a science, and you have the clear solution: why even bother?

dividendman

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #35 on: August 26, 2014, 08:04:53 PM »
I get so annoyed when people ask what I do. As if your employment is all you do.

Anyway, if someone asks "What do you do?" I think a clever reply is "In the event of what?" :)

Alabaster

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #36 on: August 26, 2014, 08:43:03 PM »
Oh, and for "What do you do?" I'd stick with "Investor".

Even I would judge you harshly is your profession was "investor" and you rolled up in a beat up car.

studentdoc2

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #37 on: August 26, 2014, 08:50:55 PM »
Thanks aphalite, okashira, and Eric. You guys nailed it.

I really don't get all the outrage over using humor and confidence to improve one's prospects in dating or attracting members of the opposite sex, and calling it "tactics" and "fake." You might as well express similar outrage over advice to be likable, have manners, and be confident at work in order to improve one's career prospects.

Here's another thing: Advice that can be boiled down to "be yourself" ignores the potential that "being yourself" may actually be horrible advice. Some people are socially inept. Many guys have no clue how to actually approach and talk to women, or they have misguided ideas (such as that "being nice" will be successful). Telling them to "be yourself" may be essentially sentencing them to a lifetime of failure and loneliness. It doesn't mean someone has to be fake -- they can learn how to converse, to create attraction, and to do interesting things so they actually are interesting and have something to talk about

And here is the crux of the situation. It takes hard work to get into a relationship. But notice what's going on here? It takes hard work for a single gender. Let me ask the question: why is this day of supposed gender equality in everything else, is all of the work in dating still put on men's shoulders? Why do men need to initiate and women get to decide?

I could play the game. Read every book and attend every seminar on "attracting women". Go out on town one night, talk to 100 women, and hope that increases my odds. But what do women need to do in the same situations? Just respond, just choose which of the countless men out there that approach them that they are interested in. This is just as true on dating sites as anywhere else.

To me it looks like I need to put in as much effort into dating as to getting an education. That just sounds like too much work. And frankly, I'm just not that desperate. For me, a relationship would be nice to have. For a women who thinks a relationship would be nice to have, all she needs to do is go on a date when a guy asks her, accept future dates, and boom, she's in a relationship. For me as a guy, I need to compete against all of the other guys who are out there, just desperate for a relationship, and are putting all of this effort into researching the "science of attracting women".

Add in my bit of idealism that women are actually human beings, and shouldn't just be calculated down to a science, and you have the clear solution: why even bother?

While you're complaining about "needing" to be the one who initiates, there are plenty of woman who are complaining about the responses they get when they initiate.  I've had close male friends report that they will not go on a date with a woman who asks them out because her "aggressiveness" clearly means she's desperate (their words). I've also had men respond poorly when I (a woman) ask them out. Our society has some serious issues with regards to gender/dating/experience/etc., and it does a major disservice to people on both sides of the equation.

Frankly, I think that's why the wide word of internet dating is nice. Easier to weed through the jerks or (as in your case, perhaps) the passivity. Because good partners who hate all of the BS do exist.

But I agree that the "game" of attracting an opposite partner is stupid. Although I'm all for humor and making jokes to diffuse a situation, I think there's far more to be said about being genuine. If your genuine self is always cracking jokes, go for it. If not, don't make yourself into someone you're not. You may end up attracting more partners... but in a few months/years down the line, your incompatibility will eventually show through.

With all that said, there's nothing wrong with being happily single.

Spartana

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #38 on: August 26, 2014, 09:14:58 PM »
Oh, and for "What do you do?" I'd stick with "Investor".

Even I would judge you harshly is your profession was "investor" and you rolled up in a beat up car.
well I guess they never said they were a "good" investor :-)!

SummerLovin

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #39 on: August 26, 2014, 09:16:42 PM »
Thanks aphalite, okashira, and Eric. You guys nailed it.

I really don't get all the outrage over using humor and confidence to improve one's prospects in dating or attracting members of the opposite sex, and calling it "tactics" and "fake." You might as well express similar outrage over advice to be likable, have manners, and be confident at work in order to improve one's career prospects.

Here's another thing: Advice that can be boiled down to "be yourself" ignores the potential that "being yourself" may actually be horrible advice. Some people are socially inept. Many guys have no clue how to actually approach and talk to women, or they have misguided ideas (such as that "being nice" will be successful). Telling them to "be yourself" may be essentially sentencing them to a lifetime of failure and loneliness. It doesn't mean someone has to be fake -- they can learn how to converse, to create attraction, and to do interesting things so they actually are interesting and have something to talk about

And here is the crux of the situation. It takes hard work to get into a relationship. But notice what's going on here? It takes hard work for a single gender. Let me ask the question: why is this day of supposed gender equality in everything else, is all of the work in dating still put on men's shoulders? Why do men need to initiate and women get to decide?

I could play the game. Read every book and attend every seminar on "attracting women". Go out on town one night, talk to 100 women, and hope that increases my odds. But what do women need to do in the same situations? Just respond, just choose which of the countless men out there that approach them that they are interested in. This is just as true on dating sites as anywhere else.

To me it looks like I need to put in as much effort into dating as to getting an education. That just sounds like too much work. And frankly, I'm just not that desperate. For me, a relationship would be nice to have. For a women who thinks a relationship would be nice to have, all she needs to do is go on a date when a guy asks her, accept future dates, and boom, she's in a relationship. For me as a guy, I need to compete against all of the other guys who are out there, just desperate for a relationship, and are putting all of this effort into researching the "science of attracting women".

Add in my bit of idealism that women are actually human beings, and shouldn't just be calculated down to a science, and you have the clear solution: why even bother?
I don't know where you live but there are just as many women out there as men looking for partners. Dating shouldn't be a one sided, and some women do make the first move. Unfortunately, many men see them as forward, or loose when in fact they are putting themselves out there risking rejection as well.  Men are not the only ones who have work at relationships. If people really were themselves and didn't pretend to be someone they really aren't we would all be better off.  I see people waste 6-12 months faking it, only to spend another year getting to know the real person, then finding out they were incompatible from the start.
To OP it is clear you are already planning your next steps before you're even out of the current relationship. I think if you found out your SO had posted the same questions that you did, you'd be butt hurt and indignant. Just an observation.
As for the what do you do question, what DO you do? As little as possible is acceptable, but "I'm a Mustachian" would be a nice ice breaker and  let you get a feel for compatibility,


Daisy

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #40 on: August 26, 2014, 10:37:47 PM »
This is an interesting topic because maybe just 5 years ago, if I would have met a guy that said he was retired in his 20s or 30s I may have thought several things:

1. He's a slacker
2. He's looking for a sugar momma (and this seems to be happening more these days)
3. He may have been fired and unable to keep a job, and who knows what personality traits lead to this (i.e., is he relationship material)

Now in my 40s and of a somewhat new mindset and openness to FIRE, my new view would be:

1. Cool, how did you accomplish that?
2. Cool, I'll have a similar soul to do fun stuff in FIRE with (slow travel, low-key and interesting activities)
3. Cool, if this works out I can cut my expenses even further by sharing housing, etc.

So now, the shoe's on the other foot because *I* am the one that plans to FIRE and am worried about what guys would think. Will they think I am a slacker, looking for a sugar daddy, or have personality flaws that prevent me from holding a job and/or being a good partner?

Interesting how my perspective has changed. Although I still think the age at which one FIREs may make a difference. Doing it in your 20s and 30s raises suspicions, but doing it in your 40s and 50s demands respect. Not that successfully FIREing in your 20s and 30s doesn't demand respect, but I would be suspicious if they were really FIRE or just unemployed and hiding something about themselves.

EDIT: I wanted to add that I've always been a fairly frugal person and loved investing topics. I wasn't super frugal or anything, but a lot more than my peers. So the early retired comment from a youngish guy would just send off red flag alarms to be careful about. It's a wild and crazy world out there, so anyone that doesn't seem to fit the regular mold would initially get this reaction from me. Now I may know better. But not everyone out there calling themselves early retired may be exactly what you think that term means. Of course, I wouldn't want a guy that is totally immersed in debt either. Or a workaholic. I guess I *am* picky after all.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2014, 10:47:43 PM by Daisy »

Zikoris

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #41 on: August 26, 2014, 10:57:11 PM »
Oh, and for "What do you do?" I'd stick with "Investor".

Even I would judge you harshly is your profession was "investor" and you rolled up in a beat up car.

How about a beat up bike? No car here!

Daisy

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #42 on: August 26, 2014, 11:35:11 PM »
As far as trying to answer the question of "what you do" seriously and honestly for potential mates, I wish there was a word to combine all of the little individual things you do that help keep you in this low-expense lifestyle - like an investor, financial advisor/planner, chef, cyclist, handy man/woman, travel agent (to get good deals), house cleaner, auto mechanic (if you fix your own cars), social director, etc.

If this was a valid answer if you were doing this stuff for other people and getting paid for doing it, why can't we answer the question the same way if we are doing it for ourselves and getting paid in the sense of lowering our costs?

And I suppose some people get paid to be a life coach...well you are your own life coach.

Malaysia41

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #43 on: August 27, 2014, 12:39:38 AM »
...

My current plan is when I FIRE (very early 30's) to move to a cheaper COL country (Southeast Asia) where I actually would be decently-well to do with my FIRE income. Women in Asia are just more frugal than in America. I'm not going to try to change someone living here in the states - women who appreciate frugality are just too hard to find here, particularly the non-hippie type.

SE Asia is full of status flashing.  Plenty of women will happily spend your 'stache on Prada et al.

Sometimes I feel it is worse than the US, and I wonder whether it will be the culture's undoing.

Gerard

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #44 on: August 27, 2014, 05:48:23 AM »
A first date is kind of an interview -- both people are trying to figure out whether they want to see this person again. For me, glib evasive answers are telling me "no". Likewise telling me I have no sense of humour if I don't find you funny. So, it's probably good that there are people doing those things and speeding up Getting To No. :-)

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #45 on: August 27, 2014, 09:58:22 AM »

Thanks aphalite, okashira, and Eric. You guys nailed it.

I really don't get all the outrage over using humor and confidence to improve one's prospects in dating or attracting members of the opposite sex, and calling it "tactics" and "fake." You might as well express similar outrage over advice to be likable, have manners, and be confident at work in order to improve one's career prospects.

Here's another thing: Advice that can be boiled down to "be yourself" ignores the potential that "being yourself" may actually be horrible advice. Some people are socially inept. Many guys have no clue how to actually approach and talk to women, or they have misguided ideas (such as that "being nice" will be successful). Telling them to "be yourself" may be essentially sentencing them to a lifetime of failure and loneliness. It doesn't mean someone has to be fake -- they can learn how to converse, to create attraction, and to do interesting things so they actually are interesting and have something to talk about

I totally see how and why the cocky funny thing works. However, I found it nearly impossible to pull off when I was dating in situations where it would've been useful. The problem for me is that I sort of clam up around a woman im very attracted to.

With people I'm only semi attracted to, it was pretty easy but I found that it didn't really matter. Just being calm and confident was enough - which was natural in those cases. But those experiences didn't translate into more confidence around women that I was very attracted to.

I also found that most people were good at dishing it back. So if you're going to do it you better be able to keep up.

The key is to be outcome agnostic and never get ahead of yourself. I have a bad habit of falling hard and fast for women I like. And as soon as that happens you're screwed. In every case in my life where that's happened, a break up/rejection/etc came very soon after.



Aphalite

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #46 on: August 27, 2014, 10:05:32 AM »
A first date is kind of an interview -- both people are trying to figure out whether they want to see this person again. For me, glib evasive answers are telling me "no". Likewise telling me I have no sense of humour if I don't find you funny. So, it's probably good that there are people doing those things and speeding up Getting To No. :-)

Agreed on that count! Can't imagine dating someone who doesn't share the same sense of humor - can you imagine filling in all of the time and days you would spend together in the future without silly jokes?

Mother Fussbudget

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #47 on: August 27, 2014, 02:03:54 PM »
OP - have you posted this on the "Single & Mustashian" forum?

I formerly went to a lot of meetups (meetup.com), but attend less and less frequently - not finding what I'm after either. 
I have a 'standard' profile on OKCupid, that leads off with humor, and goes from there.  First line:
"Great guy with sense of humor, killer body and money to burn seeks woman who doesn't believe everything she reads"

I'm also starting a 'mustashian' profile - probably call it "FIRE Weirdness", it will contain some of the brilliant thoughts found on the 'Single & Mustashian' forum put into my own words:
"Mustashian on my 2nd run at Financial Independence - goal:  3.5 years
I know I won't change who I am for another person, but part of love is the willingness to explore, and find the common ground we can romp through together, maybe even kicking some leaves around from time to time.  We may value different things, but as long as we can collaborate on things we can agree on for 'mutual mischief', we'll probably be okay.

Thriftshop is more than a Macklemore song - it's a wardrobe, and decorating source.  And Craigslist is my 'storage unit'.  Travel means wanting to collect the National Parks, whether that's from a tent (air mattress - no cold hard ground for this guy) or old VW bus.  Shoestring budget when possible, but will pay for value.  Rice & beans are my 'go to' - the disastrous environmental impact of factory meat farming, and the disastrous health effects of animal fat on my heart arteries has made me a 'mostly vegan' for the past few years... never felt healthier.   

Deal breakers:  addiction (smoking, alcohol, gambling, drugs), jesus freaks, and angry people.

There is no algorithm for love.  If there is, it's something we write for ourselves - not the robots at OKC or PlentyOfFish, or Match, Tinder, etc.

Well adjusted weirdo looking for same - for someone whose weirdness is compatible / complementary with my weirdness, and we can combine those weirdnesses into a whole new level of weirdness, and call it love.

I've changed over time. We all change over time. Sometimes a lot. You will change too. It's more important to find someone I can change, take dance lessons, and GROW with than someone who is an exact match to the person I am today.  It took me a couple years (ok, more than a couple) to get to where I am today, and I'm not finished yet. 

Wanna come along for the ride, and see & do new stuff on the way?"

shotgunwilly

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #48 on: August 27, 2014, 02:47:29 PM »
It's sad that people are attracted to humor?!?  That's the strangest statement I've ever seen.  I'm certain that it would be effective.  Look at any list of what partners want from the other and guaranteed top 3 if not #1 is a sense of humor.

Is it the method of communication here?  Because if this was said to you in person, I can almost guarantee you and everyone else would be laughing.  Like aphalite mentioned above, it moves the first date from an "interview" type situation into a much more casual and comfortable atmosphere.  Honestly, it's pretty brilliant.

Sorry for the confusion? But not humor... humor is good.  I meant "pick up artist stuff," or playing games.   

ENL

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Re: FIRE, ER, and dating???
« Reply #49 on: August 27, 2014, 08:25:58 PM »
As far as trying to answer the question of "what you do" seriously and honestly for potential mates, I wish there was a word to combine all of the little individual things you do that help keep you in this low-expense lifestyle - like an investor, financial advisor/planner, chef, cyclist, handy man/woman, travel agent (to get good deals), house cleaner, auto mechanic (if you fix your own cars), social director, etc.

If this was a valid answer if you were doing this stuff for other people and getting paid for doing it, why can't we answer the question the same way if we are doing it for ourselves and getting paid in the sense of lowering our costs?

And I suppose some people get paid to be a life coach...well you are your own life coach.

I am not FI, but am using mustacian principles to allow me to spend less so I can stay home with my son rather than work.  Let me just say that many other stay at home moms I have met are EXTREMELY SENSITIVE to people not using the word "job"  or "work" for what they do.  That's because they are having the very same frustrations.   I don't know if there is a good way of addressing it with people because the whole stay-at-home-mom set has been around for awhile and as a group still have not found a way to phrase it without  other people making stupid/incorrect assumptions. 

I often get people scoffing at my stay-at-home-mom gig myself.  I really wish our society would put more stock in people taking care of tasks themselves, but the focus seems to just be on the kind of money you make on a monthly basis from your steady 9-5 employment.