The Money Mustache Community
Learning, Sharing, and Teaching => Ask a Mustachian => Topic started by: mgnhrvth on April 27, 2016, 05:58:03 PM
-
One of my family members (younger sibling) is separating from the military later this year (involuntary separation due to Army downsizing). He has an undergrad degree in business/finance but has not used those skills in 8+ years of military service. He is seriously pursuing this Edward Jones option:
http://careers.edwardjones.com/explore-opportunities/new-financial-advisors/compensation/compensation.html (http://careers.edwardjones.com/explore-opportunities/new-financial-advisors/compensation/compensation.html)
My question is - is this a ponzi scheme? He's been told he has to bring the names and contact info of 200+ real, potential customers to the table in the next couple of months.
Has anyone pursued this route with Edward Jones and made a legitimate career of it?
-
He'll be a salesman. He'll be trying to sell people on these really high fee funds that will underperform the very cheap Vanguard funds. I couldn't take a job like that because I would know that every person I sold the products to was being screwed.
-
^^^ ditto. Such a sleeze bag job. And I scalp tickets. To steal money from people in the name of saving should be a criminal offense.
-
He'll be a salesman. He'll be trying to sell people on these really high fee funds that will underperform the very cheap Vanguard funds. I couldn't take a job like that because I would know that every person I sold the products to was being screwed.
Agreed! I couldn't do a job where I was intentionally recommending something I know is by far not the best option
-
I was an EJ customer for a number of years before I saw the light. A few years ago I was getting burned out on high tech and my EJ advisor invited me to one of their recruiting dinners. I was interested in it because I thought I like investing and advising others sounded fun. However at the end of the night I realized that was not what this job was about. It was about being a salesman and assets under management was the name of the game. I had half of my money with EJ and the other half I was managing on my own with a desired asset allocation and rebalancing. I had it mostly in Fidelity Spartan funds. After a few years I realized I was beating my EJ advisor, probably mostly due to the fees. Now I'm half in Fidelity Spartan funds and half in Vanguard. Nothing is left at EJ.
It is not a ponzi scheme. But EJ is not appropriate for people that hang out here.
With all of that said, if you are a good at it, after a few years, you can make a really good income as an EJ advisor. It is not easy however nor low stress. A true mustachian probably couldn't bring himself to do it however.
-
EDIT: This is the page I meant to post, oops: http://kronstantinople.blogspot.com/p/edward-jones-saga.html
A long read, but interesting. Also it's a blog, so take it for what you will.
Saw this article posted awhile back. It's long (and interesting), but the quote below talks specifically about military.
http://www.economicpopulist.org/content/edward-jones-dr-jekyll-and-mr-hyde-financial-services-industry-5554
ENTICING THE TROOPS ONTO ANOTHER BATTLEFIELD
In a move that might be regarded as pure genius or as cynical and exploitative, EDJ has aggressively (and "excitedly") launched the "FORCES" program, to recruit returning military veterans into its ranks. America loves and trusts its noble servicemen! Let's flip that good will into some profit, people!
In a poll commissioned by Edward Jones, 75 percent of respondents said they would like to have a former soldier as a financial advisor, citing factors such as integrity and discipline. Moreover, they saw it as a way to "express gratitude" for the veteran's service.
Jones' plan is a big PR coup, given all the publicity about the unemployment rate among "our finest." But it's a real economic coup for EJ as well: Thanks to the G.I. Bill, veterans can receive a monthly income while they are being trained by Edward Jones. (Jones has a euphemistic way of phrasing this: "Our training and compensation program dovetails with GI benefits.")
For each vet, tens of thousands of tax dollars will be disbursed that would otherwise have been paid by Edward Jones for its costly training. What a deal!
There is a menacing aspect to this inspired idea: Any vet who joins the Apprenticeship/On-The-Job Training Program under the G.I. Bill forfeits his right to receive a college education.
And the likelihood, as we've demonstrated, is that the veteran will not complete the training and develop a sustainable business. He loses big-time, just as if he'd blown his GI benefits on a sleazy trade school.
-
An EJ broker
advised sold a client a $100k 16 month to maturity municipal bond at a premium. After adding up the interest to be received and subtracting out the premium that will be lost, in the best case scenario (bond doesn't default), the client was guaranteed to make less money than the commission he paid to buy the bond. The client took on risk and was in a worse financial position in order to create a commission for the broker.
You know what they say on Wall Street: "As long as the broker and the brokerage make money, who cares about the client because 2 out of 3 ain't bad."
-
Thank you all for the feedback - yikes - no idea EJ was/is this bad.
I have all of my investments with Vanguard and TSP (and bank with USAA) and have had great experiences (and returns) with all three.
Any ideas RE trying to talk my brother out of this plan? He is an ethical guy.
-
Show him this thread.
-
One of my family members (younger sibling) is separating from the military later this year (involuntary separation due to Army downsizing). He has an undergrad degree in business/finance but has not used those skills in 8+ years of military service.
Thank you all for the feedback - yikes - no idea EJ was/is this bad.
I have all of my investments with Vanguard and TSP (and bank with USAA) and have had great experiences (and returns) with all three.
Any ideas RE trying to talk my brother out of this plan? He is an ethical guy.
He can do so much better. I think he could reflect back on his military skills and see how well they dovetail with his business degree. Employers everywhere are seeking what he has-- the leadership skills, the crisis-management experience, and the math/business vocabulary. If an employer doesn't appreciate what he's bringing to the company then he doesn't want to work there anyway.
If he hasn't already, he needs to update his Linkedin profile and join the "Veteran Mentor Network" group. (https://www.linkedin.com/groups/4466143) He can ditch the "military inferiority complex" (which is a very common handicap) and focus on finding employers who will truly value both of his skill sets. That group has its fair share of recruiters and headhunters as well as military veterans in almost any field he'd care to network.
He can browse the blog's title archive (http://the-military-guide.com/post-titles-by-month/) and contact me if he has more questions.
I don't know what codes the Army wants to put on his DD-214, but if he wants to stay in the military then there's always the option of joining the Reserve/Guard. I realize he may be pretty burned-out on the military right now, but I know a couple servicemembers who were involuntarily separated and went on to great careers (with military pensions) in the Reserve & Guard.
-
He's been told he has to bring the names and contact info of 200+ real, potential customers to the table in the next couple of months.
Everything you need to know about the job in one sentence. They want him to be a salesman, not a financial advisor. In fact, he's probably over-qualified for the job. You don't need a finance background to sell mutual funds - just know how to sell them. Anyone moderately educated in investing wouldn't buy half the products he'd be selling. I took a look at the website you linked. The entire compensation package screams "you'll get nothing unless you're earning brokerage fees."
-
An EJ broker advised sold a client a $100k 16 month to maturity municipal bond at a premium. After adding up the interest to be received and subtracting out the premium that will be lost, in the best case scenario (bond doesn't default), the client was guaranteed to make less money than the commission he paid to buy the bond. The client took on risk and was in a worse financial position in order to create a commission for the broker.
You know what they say on Wall Street: "As long as the broker and the brokerage make money, who cares about the client because 2 out of 3 ain't bad."
As an investment specialist, my old job was to build portfolios and advise the 'advisors'. I had a wholesaler come into my office and actually say the 2/3 aint bad bit. Stood up and told him the meeting was over. Such a sleezy profession all around, I hate that I'm in it but also know that there are lots of people that need real help.
-
I don't think very highly of EJ. They are the only financial company I know that does door to door sales. We get a EJ financial adviser at the door more often than an LDS missionary (who also come around frequently).
Part of my pre-maritial counseling involved financial counseling. I think the parishioners who did it only did it as a sales pitch, because they were guaranteed a new list of names to take back to the brokerage. What a freaking scam. (The advice was pretty bad too.)
-
Thank you all for the feedback and insight!
End of the story - he was not 'selected' for this Edward Jones program, which is probably a blessing in disguise...
Thank you again.
-
And I notice again that EJ ads are at the bottom of this page. Ah, the irony.