Author Topic: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?  (Read 19281 times)

zephyr911

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #50 on: February 17, 2016, 10:05:30 AM »
agreed. it is like people think adding 1 person means a proportional increase in expenses. Example: expenses are $1000
1 person = $1000
2 people = $2000
3 people = $3000

just no...it doesnt have to be that way...
It's even worse than that with most people, if you ask me. In the above anecdote, she didn't just say having kids meant factoring more costs into the calculations, she brought them up as her excuse for giving up on calculating. And I guarantee my lack of children would be the first thing brought up if I discussed finances with CWs. Every time the subject comes up, you hear sweeping generalizations like "kids change everything", when, they really just add variables to the equation.

But the truth is, some people raise healthy and happy children for less than we spend on our dogs and cat. Yet somehow there's this pervasive myth that disposable income vanishes at conception and you're now stuck working till 70. edit: My theory is, this is true if you try to indulge in all the same stuff after kids as you did before (did it as a stepdad, stayed broke, can honestly say it contributed to our failure), but otherwise totally dependent on choices. It's the "foregone conclusion" shit that irks me the most.

One of my favorite CWs, around my age, was talking the other day about how he hopes to be able to retire in his 60s (~25 years from now). I don't know if he'd play the kid card in this discussion, but I know he flew out to Colorado to snowboard all week and doesn't save beyond the 5% for full TSP match. I'm jealous as hell (of the trip) but I'll probably FIRE next year, and I'll spend a month in CO if I want. Timing and priorities, c'est la vie.
« Last Edit: February 17, 2016, 12:32:39 PM by zephyr911 »

Mtngrl

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #51 on: February 17, 2016, 10:23:12 AM »
DH and I have always lived frugally, with the goal of early retirement. Among family and some long-time friends, we had a reputation as cheapskates -- because we did things like take our lunches to work, buy thrift-store clothing and repair instead of replace items. When we built our retirement home three years before FIRE, most of the people we knew thought we had lost our minds. How could we afford to do such a thing? At that time we revealed our plan to retire in three years. No one believed us. DH's business partner, a man up to his eyeballs in debt, refused to believe it right up until the day DH signed the papers to sell his interest in the business. For the first year post-fire our parents were sure we would be reduced to eating cat food because of our foolish mistake. Three years later, we still have friends and family members who think we must be 'poor' (despite our very nice house and paid-for vehicles, etc.) because we prefer to eat in instead of out, we still pack lunches when we go skiing, and we prefer camping vacations to European jaunts. In some ways, this is frustrating; on the other hand we never have to worry about them asking for money.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #52 on: February 17, 2016, 11:36:37 AM »
When I walked away from what everyone else thought was a great job (it did PAY great, I'll give it that) and hinted strongly that I now considered myself retired at 42....well, let's just say I pretty much had to share certain "numbers" to ease the worry of some close family members. Didn't feel comfortable doing it though.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #53 on: February 17, 2016, 11:49:54 AM »
Nope. Except in general terms. Not that we would have much in the way of accomplishments to talk about. Siblings on both sides are in way better job situations than us and, sadly, way more debt. And we are not paragons of Mustachian badassity by any stretch (working on it). The only thing we have told anyone, when directly asked, is that the 5 months of involuntary unemployment didn't put us into bankruptcy (cue massive confusion on the listener's part); we can survive another bout of that if we had to and that our current pathetic combined incomes would allow us to hold on until full-age retirement. Of course, holding out working for peanuts until we are 65-67 is not good enough. But, other than my parents, who are doing great, nobody on either side of the family can conceive of anything other than 9-5 until you die...and buying bigger houses/new cars every few years on credit as a way to leverage wealth (pauses to scratch head...never have figured out that thought process). And most of our friends have to pay down their maxed-out credit cards if they need to take a business trip and wait for reimbursement. Everyone thought we were destitute before the job losses started since we were still driving our old, high mileage cars etc. and that was when we were relatively spendypants. Just by not living paycheck to paycheck, we are considered weirdos in our circles. Sigh... I'm so glad this forum exists so we can, at least electronically, interact with others who aren't interested in spending every dime they earn.

RedmondStash

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #54 on: February 17, 2016, 12:03:19 PM »
When I mentioned to spouse's older sister, who is comfortably retired, that we were probably within a few years of retirement, she was astonished. I mentioned a) no kids, b) good jobs in IT, and c) generally frugal lifestyle. I don't think she'll believe it until she sees it. I'm not sure I will either; it's both exciting and scary, and we're not quite there yet.

I did feel cautious about talking in any more detail or depth, just because she seemed so startled already. I think she was pleased, though, knowing that spouse's future looks bright.

I try not to geek out too hard about money and numbers around my friends, since so many people are scared of both. I don't want to come across as evangelistic or pushy. I do have one friend I am slowly grooming to talk more about money, investing, compound interest, etc. She is terrified but open to it, as long as I put it in terms of bears and salmon instead of people and dollars, because otherwise her brain shuts down in panic. I know that once she gets past the fear, she'll be happier when she understands how things work a little more clearly. Knowledge is power.

There are some family members I would not tell about our financial picture. It would either be awkward or lead to mooching attempts.

freezerburn

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #55 on: February 17, 2016, 12:38:27 PM »
I don't tell my family anything about my finances.

...
When I told my mom (who is bad with money), she congratulated me but almost immediately asked how much I was going to make. I said "enough." She kept pressing and I was blown away that she was so worried about this number instead of being happy for me. She then had all these conversations with family members about how this was like raising me my whole life and then "not letting her see the scoreboard."

Honestly, I'm still pissed off about this more than a year later. I basically won't be sharing any sort of details regarding a promotion or anything with her (unless I'm named partner).
...

I have similar exchanges with my mother. Anytime my finances or job-related stuff comes up, she demands to know details: "How much are they paying you? What percent raise did you get?" etc., critiques whatever promotion/benefits I got, and gets mad when I won't give specific numbers. Then out come the sarcastic hurtful comments (judgmental comments that she also makes on the rare occasions it comes up that I've spent money on a specific thing, like travel).

I have seen her literally throw a tantrum when I won't divulge these details, but I feel I have good reason not to. The first time I ever saved up a significant sum of money, she found out and allocated it to her own needs, insisting that I give it to her. In retrospect this wound up having a far-reaching effect on the course of my life, since I'd earmarked the savings for a job-related move and had to find employment close to home instead. She then became irate when I went to a bank on my own and set up my own checking account as soon as I got that first full-time job--because she wanted my paycheck to go into our joint account.

I was 19 when all that happened, and obviously I still have issues! Issues that mean I don't tell her any details if I can possibly avoid it since I feel like she'd start asking me for money--she seems determined to live beyond her means and this has been the case as long as I can remember. I dread that she will hit me up for money eventually anyway, so I'm hoping by saying less now, and tying up all my spare $$ in retirement accounts, I can postpone that as long as possible. Luckily she wants me to save for retirement, so if asked I do tell her that I'm doing that--just not the details of how much, and not about how I have FI as a goal.

... And I guarantee my lack of children would be the first thing brought up if I discussed finances with CWs. Every time the subject comes up, you hear sweeping generalizations like "kids change everything", when, they really just add variables to the equation.

But the truth is, some people raise healthy and happy children for less than we spend on our dogs and cat. Yet somehow there's this pervasive myth that disposable income vanishes at conception and you're now stuck working till 70. edit: My theory is, this is true if you try to indulge in all the same stuff after kids as you did before (did it as a stepdad, stayed broke, can honestly say it contributed to our failure), but otherwise totally dependent on choices. It's the "foregone conclusion" shit that irks me the most. ...

I don't have kids and don't plan to, something I've talked about with my closest friends. When I first discovered MMM and made changes to my savings, I told a couple of those close friends about my goal to save lots and retire relatively early. One of them immediately said, rather meanly, "Oh, so this is why you don't want kids, because they're too expensive!" I can honestly say that the potential cost of kids did not even REMOTELY enter my kid-decision-making process, yet there was suddenly no convincing this friend that money was not my guiding reason for choosing to be childless. Ugh.

I don't talk about FIRE with anyone but my partner now, who is already pretty mustachian and totally supports my goals.


zephyr911

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #56 on: February 17, 2016, 01:11:28 PM »
I have seen her literally throw a tantrum when I won't divulge these details, but I feel I have good reason not to. The first time I ever saved up a significant sum of money, she found out and allocated it to her own needs, insisting that I give it to her. In retrospect this wound up having a far-reaching effect on the course of my life, since I'd earmarked the savings for a job-related move and had to find employment close to home instead. She then became irate when I went to a bank on my own and set up my own checking account as soon as I got that first full-time job--because she wanted my paycheck to go into our joint account.
WOW! I'd be leery too! She'd still be casually appropriating your earnings at will if you hadn't drawn that line, most likely.
Mine has never demanded anything from me, but has needed minor help here and there, which I gladly gave. I sometimes find myself surprised when she pays me back because I don't even explicitly ask, but it illustrates how she feels about things.
Quote
I don't have kids and don't plan to, something I've talked about with my closest friends. When I first discovered MMM and made changes to my savings, I told a couple of those close friends about my goal to save lots and retire relatively early. One of them immediately said, rather meanly, "Oh, so this is why you don't want kids, because they're too expensive!" I can honestly say that the potential cost of kids did not even REMOTELY enter my kid-decision-making process, yet there was suddenly no convincing this friend that money was not my guiding reason for choosing to be childless. Ugh.

I don't talk about FIRE with anyone but my partner now, who is already pretty mustachian and totally supports my goals.
Yeah, I made what I would refer to as an indefinite postponement of any procreation plans somewhere around 2001, and only got serious about frugality a couple of years ago. During my engagement to DW we had some, shall we say, dramatic discussions, mostly because she started out our relationship with a lot of talk about not reproducing and then had some very strong second thoughts when we got serious - much to my consternation. I'm not opposed per se, but there are aspects of our lives that don't square with it, just yet. Anywho, we got to a relative meeting of the minds and agreed to let it ride for now. When we FIRE (ish) she'll still only be 33 or 34 so it's not like the door is shut... it's just low on the list and not necessarily moving up in time to happen.
For now, we're gonna play aunt and uncle and think about things for a while. If we decide we want kids after an age where we should be reproducing, foster or adoption is always an option.

SwordGuy

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #57 on: February 17, 2016, 06:48:51 PM »
I don't hide that we've started a rental property business.  I was careful to let co-workers know that the sum total cost of our (then) home and 3 rental properties was less than almost all houses that co-workers put up for sale on the bulletin board at work.

So, anyone who is paying attention would know that I have some money saved (or I wouldn't be buying extra houses), but not how much.   

I mention to people about how to invest in the market the MMM way because it could help them.   Anyone paying attention would figure out I have some money to invest, but again, I don't discuss how much.

I mentioned to my mom a couple of years ago that I was planning to retire from my day job and make art full time.   She thought I was going nuts!   So I sat down with her and set out the plan.   Once she realized I wasn't having a mid-life crisis and that I had actually thought this all through, and that the numbers would support it, she was very supportive.  That was made easier because she and my dad had always saved and, though she really didn't take an active hand in it, my dad had always invested and kept her informed of what he was doing.  So she was familiar with the concepts and knew they would work.

It was actually kind of nice because it gave us both something to talk about that we were both interested in.

A few of my very close friends know I'm planning on retiring in about a year.   I've explained the general plan but not the full details.

JimLahey

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #58 on: February 18, 2016, 02:38:47 AM »
I haven't asked for money from my parents for years now. My mom has borrowed money from me. Not sure what my dad thinks. I feel like he thinks I am reckless with my money but don't know for sure. I told him once that I was trying to pay off my student loans and he wanted to know why when the interest rates are so low. My brother probably knows more about my financial situation than any one. He knows roughly how much I make and that i'm trying to pay my student loans off before I get married, buy a house, etc. Sadly my mom is probably the one person I wouldn't want knowing how much I have saved. I mean it's not really impressive but enough that she would probably ask for more handouts.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #59 on: February 18, 2016, 06:54:38 AM »
I tell parents enough so that they don't need to worry about me, siblings enough so that they know they can come to me with questions about diy, budgets, pensions etc. Friends know that I like to mess around with credit card bonuses and diy but they don't necessarily put it down to finances.

I dislike how much SO tells MILs and SIL about our finances - they are in permanent money crisis and we gave them money before which was due to be paid back but never was. I think that saying too much to them encourages them to ask for more, even though SIL now earns more than us.

little_brown_dog

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #60 on: February 18, 2016, 06:59:31 AM »


It's even worse than that with most people, if you ask me. In the above anecdote, she didn't just say having kids meant factoring more costs into the calculations, she brought them up as her excuse for giving up on calculating. And I guarantee my lack of children would be the first thing brought up if I discussed finances with CWs. Every time the subject comes up, you hear sweeping generalizations like "kids change everything", when, they really just add variables to the equation.

But the truth is, some people raise healthy and happy children for less than we spend on our dogs and cat. Yet somehow there's this pervasive myth that disposable income vanishes at conception and you're now stuck working till 70. edit: My theory is, this is true if you try to indulge in all the same stuff after kids as you did before (did it as a stepdad, stayed broke, can honestly say it contributed to our failure), but otherwise totally dependent on choices. It's the "foregone conclusion" shit that irks me the most.


Kids are inherently financially risky, even if you are frugal and don't blow money on toys and material goods. For example, the cheapest kids are completely healthy, have no developmental or learning problems, do well in regular public schools (or homeschool), don't have any allergies or special dietary restrictions, and if they want to go to college either get scholarships or manage to find part time work that pays enough to defray a significant amount of tuition. That's alot of variables to bank on.  Even if you luck out and manage to have kids like this, there is still the added expense of feeding more people, clothing more people, paying for routine healthcare for more people. And of course, many (if not most) parents would like to help at least a little bit with college. All of these are the bare minimums, before you even get to frugally adding in a sport here or there, or maybe a modest family vacation each year (things even mustachians would be hardpressed to consider wasteful). So yes, the cost of raising kids is dependent on choices - but most of those choices are not really choices at all, they're just the cost of being a responsible parent who makes sure the kids are well fed, clothed, kept healthy, and educated appropriately.

I have a four month old right now - we NEVER buy her anything and all of her items were given to us through our baby shower or as hand-me-downs. We still spend 100 a month on formula (required due to inability to breastfeed) and diapers alone (and we cloth diaper most of the time!). She was hospitalized for some issues after birth too. We are only four months in, and we have easily spent 1200 on just keeping her fed and healthy.

Before I became a parent, I also thought a lot of the kid expenses were just the result of overindulgence or wasteful spending. Now I see, like with most things, a big part of it is just luck and you can't really control much of it.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2016, 07:07:07 AM by little_brown_dog »

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #61 on: February 18, 2016, 12:44:30 PM »
Only my wife knows about my accomplishments, which maybe small in comparison with the rest of the MMM community, but I think at the moment, I am the wealthiest person in my family, and I am only 32.

I am a millionaire in the country I was born in, and in my wife's country, and I have no loans except my mortgage. Its kind of a big deal in my family to be this way, but no one has a clue.

I just don't think its a good idea to tell them. As far as they are concerned, I am living without being a burden to them, and they don't have to send me any money, and they are happy.

RedBaron3

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #62 on: February 18, 2016, 01:42:21 PM »
My Dad:Great with finances, is generally frugal, and retired early.  I discuss a lot of concepts with him but leave specifics on expenses, savings, 401k contribution rates to percentages.  He knew my starting salary out of college but nothing in detail since them, and he doesn't ask.  I told him the minute I paid off all student loans since he was a co-signer. 

My Mom: Financially illiterate so I don't share anything.  She's been essentially retired since age 50 though through my dad's good planning.

My Sister: I try not to share anything.  She overshares with me.  I know her and her husband probably make twice as much as me, but she still complains to me about money issues. She exaggerates a lot and her husband is a smart guy with good financial sense, so I don't take her too seriously.  I do throw in a few sarcastic remarks like a good younger brother should. 

My father-in-law: I share nothing and he doesn't ask.  He's been laid off a few times over the years and probably spends half of what he makes on alcohol and cigarettes which is sad.  I think I make a lot more than him and don't care to bring it up at all.  He does tell my wife privately that we're "doing things right" and how proud he is that she is able to stay home with the kids. 

My mother-in-law: This is where it gets fun.  We tell her mostly nothing and it drives her crazy.  She makes little digs or comments fishing for info, especially when I'm not around.  She seems to think I make 3 times what I actually do.  How else could we afford a nice house in a nice neighborhood on only one salary?  My wife tells her a few nuggets just for fun.  She almost fell to the floor when she heard I had a $1 million life insurance policy.  She knows we put 20% down on a nice house and doesn't understand how anyone could have so much cash.  She typically starts any sentence talking about someone with "it must be nice."  She'll never retire because they spend beyond their means and they've constantly borrowed against the house.  She doesn't ask for handouts and never would, but it's annoying when someone constantly sees themselves as the victim with no blame for the situation they're in.

Wife's Sisters: They're just starting out in their careers and are still trying to establish themselves and build positive net worth.  We talk openly with them about budgeting and long term planning because it's helpful to them, but we don't discuss our numbers. 

zephyr911

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #63 on: February 18, 2016, 02:03:30 PM »

Before I became a parent, I also thought a lot of the kid expenses were just the result of overindulgence or wasteful spending. Now I see, like with most things, a big part of it is just luck and you can't really control much of it.

Right, but even if your luck sucks, you can still do math. This is fundamentally no different from rejecting Complainypants excuses about riding bicycles or modifying climate control habits. Yes, I realize we all face unique challenges. The problem is not in being unable to use 100% of the lifehacks that others have come up with. The problem is in taking one single challenge or set of challenges as an excuse for not trying, not doing everything you can with what you do have, or failing to even attempt to optimize by crunching some numbers to find low-hanging fruit.

I freely admit that it's easier for me to achieve a ridiculous SR and retire before 40 than it would be for my parentally inclined peers. But I reject, with extreme prejudice, the idea that this is a simple binary equation and reproduction is the only factor setting us apart.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #64 on: February 18, 2016, 11:50:03 PM »
I tend to follow what seems to be the common theme here. The parent that's better with money, my mom in my case, I'm more open with. My dad sadly has always been pretty bad with money, to the point of being declared insolvent at 60 and having to keep working now pretty much forever I keep the details to myself.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #65 on: February 19, 2016, 05:18:33 AM »
My situation is different.  My wife and I don't have a lot saved via IRA and TSP, but we have my military pension to live off of.  We won't be rich, but my pension will give us a very nice quality of life.  Drawing 4% from our investments will be icing on top.

My dad retired from the Navy as well and he and my mom have some investments but primarily live off their pensions and SS.  They are in pretty good shape, I've actually talked to both about some investment stuff (like leave Edward Jones ASAP).  They know roughly our finances and I know theirs.

My brother is a bit of a train wreck financially, but his wife makes good money as an accountant, so they are in pretty good shape.

On my wife's side, her mom has a good stache of money and SS + teacher's pension, plus she lives very frugally, so she'll be fine.

My BIL makes great money and invests most of it, so once again in good shape.

marcela

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #66 on: February 19, 2016, 08:10:29 AM »
We share quite a bit with my family, and I try not to share much with my husband's. Part of that has to do with the income levels of those involved. My ILs (MIL, FIL and SIL) have significantly higher income than us and are constantly expecting us to spend at their level. Pleading money trouble makes sense to them and (usually) works to get us off the hook for their spendypants adventures and purchases. My family comes from a much more modest background. Telling them about our finances works to keep them from giving us money. It also helps that we frame it through the lens of preparing for the possibility of me not being able to work in the future due to a chronic illness.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #67 on: February 19, 2016, 09:28:48 AM »
I'm pretty open about my finances and frugal behaviour (and my lapses in frugality), especially with my immediate family.

I talk often with my dad about finances and investing and he is supportive that I have put such an emphasis on saving. He even has access to my banking accounts and can transfer money out of it whenever he wants (so he sees exactly what I make and spend). In fact he notified me before the credit card company or bank that there was unusual activity in my account when my card # had been stolen.

And I talk with my sister all the time about finances and planning. We have both watched a lot of Gail from Til Debt Do US Part and Princess, and I think we're on the same page. She's started on MMM lately as well, so current finances and ways to live more efficiently/economically have started coming up more often.


EngineerYogi

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #68 on: February 19, 2016, 10:14:05 AM »
i'm open about everything in my life ... probably to a fault.   but i dont really care.  its who i am and how i relay information.

This is me, probably to my DH's chagrin... but oh well.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #69 on: February 19, 2016, 10:25:36 AM »

agreed. it is like people think adding 1 person means a proportional increase in expenses. Example: expenses are $1000
1 person = $1000
2 people = $2000
3 people = $3000

just no...it doesnt have to be that way...

Doesn't have to be, but easily can be. IME, there is no real economy of scale advantage for high dollar items like childcare, college tuition, airfare, etc.

I share some things with my family. I told them when I paid off my student loans and we are debt free. They know that we make pretty good money (for what we do) and live well below our means. We are all fairly open about our finances if they happen to come up.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #70 on: February 19, 2016, 10:55:18 AM »
We share quite a bit with my family, and I try not to share much with my husband's. Part of that has to do with the income levels of those involved. My ILs (MIL, FIL and SIL) have significantly higher income than us and are constantly expecting us to spend at their level. Pleading money trouble makes sense to them and (usually) works to get us off the hook for their spendypants adventures and purchases. My family comes from a much more modest background. Telling them about our finances works to keep them from giving us money. It also helps that we frame it through the lens of preparing for the possibility of me not being able to work in the future due to a chronic illness.

It's ironic to me (but not terribly surprising) that you have to plead money troubles to your high earning/spending family, while your modest earning/spending family wants to give you money to make sure you're ok.

zephyr911

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #71 on: February 19, 2016, 03:10:58 PM »
We share quite a bit with my family, and I try not to share much with my husband's. Part of that has to do with the income levels of those involved. My ILs (MIL, FIL and SIL) have significantly higher income than us and are constantly expecting us to spend at their level. Pleading money trouble makes sense to them and (usually) works to get us off the hook for their spendypants adventures and purchases. My family comes from a much more modest background. Telling them about our finances works to keep them from giving us money. It also helps that we frame it through the lens of preparing for the possibility of me not being able to work in the future due to a chronic illness.

It's ironic to me (but not terribly surprising) that you have to plead money troubles to your high earning/spending family, while your modest earning/spending family wants to give you money to make sure you're ok.

All that just to avoid openly stating you have different priorities, or did I miss something?

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #72 on: February 19, 2016, 09:06:30 PM »
AFAIK, everyone has been too polite to ask for specifics.  I don't offer numbers because, well, privacy is nice (I don't think DH has offered numbers, either, but not 100% sure.) 

OP, I get the longing to experience pride from your parents in your accomplishments.  It is not always realistic to hope for this.  In my case, I don't offer details to my parents because it will just result in them pointing out everyone else who has done better than I have.  I am mostly resigned to not having their approval in the way that I would like, and tell myself that given my circumstances, this problem merits one of these.  Life is pretty good, really!

Parizade

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #73 on: February 22, 2016, 07:58:16 AM »
I went to visit my mother in hospice yesterday, my sister was there also. We work for the same company and we both got our annual reviews/bonuses this week. I know that I make twice what she does and my bonuses are also probably double what she gets so I didn't even bring it up. She mentioned that hers went well but didn't offer any details, so I just told her I was happy for her and left it at that.

At such times I feel it would just be rude to say much of anything. She knows I'm doing well financially, that is enough. I don't need to rub it in.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #74 on: February 22, 2016, 08:30:41 AM »
Recently told my dad I hit $100k for the first time, he said "that's great" then we talked a bit about investments, he commented about investment options in the 70's and 80's (no 401k, IRA, discount brokers, etc) and moved on to the next topic.  If my parents ever asked, I'd tell them, but generally it just doesn't come up. 

They're both retiring in the next year around normal retirement age, and have more than they need (how much more, I'm not sure).  They weren't MMM frugal, but were more frugal than the average Joneses, and got started a bit late due to my dad having a business that didn't work out in his early 30's.  I definitely lucked out with the parent lottery, as money has never been an issue between us.  They paid my way through college, and I got a job and went independent immediately after graduation.  A (relatively boring) fairytale ending.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #75 on: February 22, 2016, 10:16:39 AM »
I try not to reveal too many specifics, but at the same time I do want them to be proud of what I've accomplished. I've been renting for all my adult life and they ask me from time to time if I am getting close to saving enough to buy a house. I really don't have much intention on buying, even though I have enough for a down payment, so I sort of lie and say I'm still saving for it. My dad recently wanted me to buy a newer car to replace my old beater, but I refused on the premise I was still saving money. He sort of asked, "Well, how much do you have left?" as though he really couldn't understand why I wouldn't have enough for both. I haven't told them about my early retirement plans. They would probably think it was a rather unrealistic notion.

I don't want them to know how well off I am becoming right now, as they'd probably have a different view of my life and what I should be doing.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #76 on: February 22, 2016, 10:21:21 AM »
I try not to reveal too many specifics, but at the same time I do want them to be proud of what I've accomplished. I've been renting for all my adult life and they ask me from time to time if I am getting close to saving enough to buy a house. I really don't have much intention on buying, even though I have enough for a down payment, so I sort of lie and say I'm still saving for it. My dad recently wanted me to buy a newer car to replace my old beater, but I refused on the premise I was still saving money. He sort of asked, "Well, how much do you have left?" as though he really couldn't understand why I wouldn't have enough for both. I haven't told them about my early retirement plans. They would probably think it was a rather unrealistic notion.

I don't want them to know how well off I am becoming right now, as they'd probably have a different view of my life and what I should be doing.

Or maybe if you shared your values with them, they'd understand you better, and see why you aren't buying those things.
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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #77 on: February 22, 2016, 10:26:54 AM »
My parents and brothers know my plans, my mom knows some vague numbers. I would tell them more specifics, if they were interested. They ask about general plans and how-to's, but specific numbers don't really come up. My parents are doing fine, but my brothers and their families are struggling financially (one of them is actively working in the right direction, the other I have no idea) and I don't want to ever come across to them like I'm bragging.

My boyfriend is the only one to whom I share specific numbers, both goals and little achievements.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #78 on: February 22, 2016, 11:47:14 AM »
I try not to reveal too many specifics, but at the same time I do want them to be proud of what I've accomplished. I've been renting for all my adult life and they ask me from time to time if I am getting close to saving enough to buy a house. I really don't have much intention on buying, even though I have enough for a down payment, so I sort of lie and say I'm still saving for it. My dad recently wanted me to buy a newer car to replace my old beater, but I refused on the premise I was still saving money. He sort of asked, "Well, how much do you have left?" as though he really couldn't understand why I wouldn't have enough for both. I haven't told them about my early retirement plans. They would probably think it was a rather unrealistic notion.

I don't want them to know how well off I am becoming right now, as they'd probably have a different view of my life and what I should be doing.

Or maybe if you shared your values with them, they'd understand you better, and see why you aren't buying those things.

I kind of share my values with them, but sometimes they don't get it. The less they know about how much money I have, the less they'll be confused when I won't pay for things they think I should. Knowing my mom, she'd probably think I ought to be taking her out to dinner all the time if I have so much money. Seems like the poorer people think you are, the less they expect from you!

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #79 on: February 22, 2016, 12:10:44 PM »
I try not to reveal too many specifics, but at the same time I do want them to be proud of what I've accomplished. I've been renting for all my adult life and they ask me from time to time if I am getting close to saving enough to buy a house. I really don't have much intention on buying, even though I have enough for a down payment, so I sort of lie and say I'm still saving for it. My dad recently wanted me to buy a newer car to replace my old beater, but I refused on the premise I was still saving money. He sort of asked, "Well, how much do you have left?" as though he really couldn't understand why I wouldn't have enough for both. I haven't told them about my early retirement plans. They would probably think it was a rather unrealistic notion.

I don't want them to know how well off I am becoming right now, as they'd probably have a different view of my life and what I should be doing.

Or maybe if you shared your values with them, they'd understand you better, and see why you aren't buying those things.

I kind of share my values with them, but sometimes they don't get it. The less they know about how much money I have, the less they'll be confused when I won't pay for things they think I should. Knowing my mom, she'd probably think I ought to be taking her out to dinner all the time if I have so much money. Seems like the poorer people think you are, the less they expect from you!

+1 Definitely true in my surroundings. But then you run the risk of being considered a mooch if someone subsidies your spendypants participation, or you get labeled uninterested in spending time with family etc.  I can't tell you how many times people tell me "well, you can afford it"...with not knowing anything about my finances. Totally besides the point. Thankfully my family doesn't need my money, but I'm sure they have their opinions on what I could be spending on. I tried sharing my values with them and the response was  "I don't think your mother would be willing to drive a Toyota". Oh well. Not my money.

sleepyguy

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #80 on: February 22, 2016, 01:20:49 PM »
Overall plan... yes (although they think I'm 'full of it', haha), specific details... no.

My family and I are WORLDS apart in beliefs.  I'm from a large family (9) and probably every single one would be in the Anti-MMM section.

Some comedy from my family are as follows... and no, I WISH I made these up...

Brother, "It's IMPOSSIBLE to live on any less than $50k per year", this is while he living rent free.

Mother, "You need to move to a bigger house for your growing family!", we have about 1800sq/ft livable space at our current house, family of 4.

Sister, "You don't eat out?  You should really eat out at least 2-3x per week to stimulate the struggling economy...", no comment (yes she spends a fortune on eating out).

Not even touching the outrageous clown cars and mansion houses... so weird as we all grew up frugal and quite poor.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2016, 01:24:25 PM by sleepyguy »

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #81 on: February 22, 2016, 02:07:51 PM »
Sister, "You don't eat out?  You should really eat out at least 2-3x per week to stimulate the struggling economy...", no comment (yes she spends a fortune on eating out).
Tell her your investments stimulate the economy far more than a few restaurant dinners would.
Quote
Not even touching the outrageous clown cars and mansion houses... so weird as we all grew up frugal and quite poor.
I get that, actually. We weren't poor when I was a kid but we were below average for our neighborhood during my formative years and I was always acutely conscious of it, which I believe contributed a great deal to excessive spending later on. It's easy to develop the mindset that you'll "never live like that again" or that you'll "prove them wrong".

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #82 on: February 22, 2016, 02:32:27 PM »
One brother, my Dad and I all are pretty sharp with finances and have done well so we share plans, strategies and bounce ideas off one another occasionally.   Pretty nice actually to have these resources for discussion.   Other siblings are pretty normal Americans, getting by but not setting it on fire.  Really don't get into discussions with them much, other than when they bring something up, I might give a little input or very unforced advice.   Also have to be careful not to be boastful about accomplishments.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #83 on: February 22, 2016, 02:52:29 PM »
This is kind of a repeat of what I said in another thread, but I have only talked about numbers with two people.
My wife is one and about 6 months before my mother died I told her our networth.
  I have one friend that I discuss stock and mutual fund information, but he has no idea about my net worth.
I have a sister that thinks I have money, but any money is money to her, because she has $negative. She
only works 20 hours and has excuse-itis about getting another job. It's actually very sad because our* house
she lives in is short walking distance to at least 40 businesses, that she could visit once a week saying, "just checking in
and available for work" She has time to make acquaintances with all the managers.
It is a few short years and she will be living on $800** a month SS. (She's 56)

*When mom died she left the house to us, she lives in it and I get no rent. (blood from a turnip thing)
I'm 1000 miles from the house, and pretty much figured her staying in the house would be the best for her financially.

** I hope she gets that much, she had a lot of years off the books.




faramund

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #84 on: February 22, 2016, 09:12:57 PM »
There is another side of it - namely kids. I've been pretty open with my kids (14-17yrs) about our investments and retirement plans, but I've heard/read other people say you shouldn't let your kids know how much you have/earn, because it gives them a false benchmark for when they're starting out.

Obviously, that's not what I do, I think getting your kids to understand money and investments is very important. Of course, kids are still kids, my 17year old says he wants to save money, and he's trying to convince a friend of his to save/use as an apartment deposit, the money he's planning to spend on a 'flashy' car, but money doesn't tend to stay in his possession very long. Still, if he's intellectually got the right idea, maybe as impulse control kicks in, he'll do better .... hopefully...

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #85 on: February 22, 2016, 09:26:07 PM »
There is another side of it - namely kids. I've been pretty open with my kids (14-17yrs) about our investments and retirement plans, but I've heard/read other people say you shouldn't let your kids know how much you have/earn, because it gives them a false benchmark for when they're starting out.

Obviously, that's not what I do, I think getting your kids to understand money and investments is very important. Of course, kids are still kids, my 17year old says he wants to save money, and he's trying to convince a friend of his to save/use as an apartment deposit, the money he's planning to spend on a 'flashy' car, but money doesn't tend to stay in his possession very long. Still, if he's intellectually got the right idea, maybe as impulse control kicks in, he'll do better .... hopefully...

I read the first part of your post and thought, that's a horrible idea!  I'm glad to hear you are more open with your children.  I gained an appreciation for saving and investing really early on because my dad was open with me.  I don't think his salary gave me a "false benchmark" at all, because I knew he worked with the same company for 22 years and worked his way up.  I remember going with him to pay the last mortgage payment on our home, and going with my mom to visit their financial planner.  We could have "kept up with the Joneses" because of my dad's salary, but he was definitely mustachian and passed that down to his kids.

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #86 on: February 22, 2016, 09:48:56 PM »
In broad terms, yeah, my family knows I'm doing well. My parents have always been frugal (my Mom occasionally crosses the line into straight up being a cheapskate) and smart with money, and were always pretty solidly middle-to-upper-middle class growing up. My dad has offered to let me use his copy of TurboTax or whatever he uses the past few years, so he knows what I make, if not my savings %.

My brother has been pretty sensible as well so far, in a general sense of "don't by stupid shit" and "spend less than you earn" but historically hasn't read up much on Personal Finance or anything. He knows that it's an interest of mine and has asked me questions from time to time.

Most impressively, a few months back, he texted me to say "You should check out this money blog called Mr. Money Mustache. If I didn't know any better, I would have guessed that you were secretly the author..." and since then, both he and his SO have been reading up on it and at least are on board in theory with the concept, although I don't know if they feel it's actually a realistic option for them as they're both public teachers in an extremely HCOL area. When I last saw them over the holidays, on more than one occasion one of them commented that "that's not very mustachian," or "MMM would call you out for that..."  etc, about whatever we were discussing at the time :D

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #87 on: February 23, 2016, 12:45:36 PM »
My dad probably has a pretty good idea about our finances, although not every detail- He and my mom (who has passed away) were both very financially responsible, my dad left his job at 53 or 54, to do less demanding contract work, and quit entirely at 55 when my mom was diagnosed with cancer, never bothered going back. I have no worries about his financial situation, and learned lots growing up about financial planning and being frugal from them both.
Husband and I don't give anyone all our financial information, but are pretty open with individual items, and our friends know that we're pretty financially savvy, so will sometimes ask about things. For example, how much life/disability insurance we carry and the cost, how/why we choose what retirement saving vessels to use. One of our friends is planning a fist baby, and as the wife and I have super similar jobs and benefits, we told them they could have info about what my income on mat. leave looked like, what pension buyback cost, and the life/disability/health insurance options and cost available while on leave, as well as costs for everything baby related, what we now spend on daycare, ect. Which they took us up on :) But we don't really go out of our way to discuss finances with people, as it makes some people uncomfortable, and I probably wouldn't give anyone our entire financial picture

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #88 on: February 23, 2016, 01:55:08 PM »
Well I told him but yeah, he initially got worried and told me I should sell the houses. I explained to him that I make money off the houses, the tenants pay the mortgage and I make money off the principal, cash flow and appreciation, etc. He said well, you know better than I do about this stuff.

My dad is 80 and lives in an apartment, still works, though not sure if it is for financial reasons though I suspect it is at least in part. I want to move from working class to investment class, and right now, my investment income matches my six figure salary. Why sell? Eventually, but not now. Heck, the properties will be paid off by the time I hit SS. I have a fall back other than SS...

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Re: Do you tell family about your financial accomplishments?
« Reply #89 on: February 23, 2016, 03:18:53 PM »
I talk in fairly great detail with my Dad, because he seems interested and I trust him.  I would do same with Mom, but she doesn't seem as interested in the topic.  The in-laws get no details from me, for a variety of reasons.

One person I tell nothing to any more is my drug-addict sister - even if she asks directly she doesn't get anything more than a "we do OK" answer from me.

With friends and most of my extended family, I generally try not to bring finances up, but will discuss details if it has come up and seems appropriate.

Then I post way too many details of many aspects of my life to a bunch of strangers on the internet, so not being consistent at all ;)

Loved this. ^

I discuss investments with my dad, gives us something else to talk about besides home improvement, but we don't talk balances.  My wife and I discuss FI hopes/projections/guantlets all the time, that's all I need.  I did once reach out to my most frugal college friend to ask if he had ever heard of MMM or FIRE.  When I heard back that he had not, but looked into it and is not interested because he "has a good gig at work so why would he want to leave that?", I stopped looking in my circle of friends for Mustachians.  It's possible they are out there, but it doesn't come up.

It's way more about living the life you want than a number, but discussing specific progress towards a specific goal has a pretty narrow appeal.  I think most of my family would think our FI target is way too small, but they are putting in in-ground pools in Cleveland and driving Hummers.  We all know we are not alike.

+1 to not wanting to come off as bragging.  I think some would think it was bragging if I overshared, and some would think I'm depriving myself and family of luxuries they view as necessities.  Neither one is a comfortable situation.  I'm not trying to reform them, just live how I want, which does not include full-time employment until death.  If they were truly interested and I trusted them, I'd share.  It's just money.  It doesn't define me.