Author Topic: Divorce help and discussion  (Read 40518 times)

jo552006

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #150 on: September 12, 2017, 01:31:55 AM »
I separated my posts, as the first was more specific and less rant-y.  This is not in response to anything in particular, but ties well with Caracarn's view that in today's society divorce has become too acceptable.

Especially recently, I think each generation seems to have less personal accountability, and a worse work ethic than the previous one.  Caracarn seems to be coming at marriage from a biblical perspective, but even if you look at marriage as purely legal, it's too easy for people to give up.  I'm all for ending a bad marriage, and will not shy away from offering that option, but I feel like it's the easy way out in a lot of cases.

I don't think the lack of personal accountability is just in marriages but in everything.  We use the term accident so often to mean something that was unintended, but if an accident was preventable, was it really an accident?  If you're texting and slam into my car, I'm not going to be thankful that you didn't "mean" to hit me.

I bring up this topic because I think a lot of problems WITHIN a marriage come down do personal accountability (and also work ethic).  The ability to say "I fucked up" and own an action/mistake, seems to be almost devoid from our generation. The ease of which a marriage is dissolved, attests to that.  I am not proposing that marriages should be harder to end, but that when people want to get married, they should truly understand that they are making an oath to another person.  If people want a purely legal marriage, to be dissolved when it no longer suits them, why do people go through the ceremony, invite family and friends, etc?  I suspect that at least when most marriages start, they are not purely legal, but when they get hard, instead of working hard, suddenly they become purely legal.

TLDR, when in a marriage, work hard, act like an adult and own your actions, personal accountability is good for literally every part of your life, but is especially helpful in marriage where two people's lives are tied together.  When thinking about a divorce, make sure you tried to make your marriage work.  Marriages are hard; you took a lifelong oath to another person, not exchange promise rings.  Treat it as such.

Again... this is NOT directed at anybody in particular here in fact I'd like to believe people on this forum give greater thought to dissolving a marriage thank the average person.  Also for the record, I don't advocate stay in or working on an abusive relationship.

There's a lot of good advice, for people who are going through/thinking about divorce.  I don't feel like there's much to add except to pile on with anybody who says divorces are expensive.  Yet one more reason why trying to make  a marriage work can be a good thing.

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #151 on: September 12, 2017, 03:26:14 AM »
I have been considering divorce for the last year, and very seriously for the last six months. To the outside, we are a remarkably high functioning, successful, and productive couple. We have a beautiful home, we're delightful and social, we run a successful Meetup group and Airbnb. What others don't see is are the painfully sore areas of misalignment that have plagued us for a while now - the incredibly cliche problems of sex and money disagreements. The problems have been going on for years and are not going to be solved. I fantasize about being freed of him and living a happier, more frugal life.

Since we are both independently successful and have no children, I'm of the opinion that we should separate. Cut our losses and move on to other lives and people who will be better for each of us and be happier in the long haul. No hard feelings - I just don't feel we're great for each other. He, on the other hand, doesn't feel he will ever be able to find someone as wonderful as me and is horrified at the thought of divorce (probably because he hates feeling rejected and is the child of divorce). When we've talked about it, he has explicitly said he will make the process difficult and made threats of suicide.

Yes, suicide.

I have no problems being impartial, emotionless and amicable in a separation, but that is wildly outside his ability. I've already mentally divvied up our stuff in what I feel is a very good split. I've started making lists of things I should do to "circle my wagons" before serving papers (download financial documents, take picture of assets, etc). I just don't really know how to start the divorce process so that I don't end up with $20k in lawyer's fees. Anyone have any suggestions?

I did not see anybody explicitly see anybody mention this so I'll throw this suggestion out there.  This applies to other posts I saw as well, but I suck at quoting, especially across multiple pages.  Make sure your marriage is truly doomed, and give it your best shot for success.  You didn't say, "DH thinks he's perfect and thinks everything is my fault."  You literally said cliche issues which implies they are fairly common.  Do you guys just have different viewpoints or values?  I'm sure there are serious problems, but I ask because his view may very well be true that he WON'T find somebody as awesome as you.  Maybe, the inverse is true, but there are changes needed.  Especially with his viewpoint, maybe he'd be willing to work on his marriage harder?

Seriously, there's tons of ways to deal with money issues, splitting finances, sitting down and talking, allowances, budgets, partially joint finances, etc.  Maybe you sit down and make an agreement on things, and sign it. (note this is an agreement, not a document to control another person)  If he's the type of person who's word is his bond, maybe that could help.  Sex issues, well REALLY depends on the issue, but even on those issues there are options.  What about open and non-monogamous marriage?  What can either/both parties do to change whatever the issue is, sometimes sex lives get boring, but that doesn't have to be the answer.  With all issues, communication is key.  Good communication.

I ask all this because I see an underwhelming trend in this thread for people to talk about trying to save a marriage.  In a lot of cases divorce is the best thing, but I saw no giant red flags in your post clearly pointing towards that being your only options.  I'm *hoping* that given your viewpoint that divorce is better you've already truly given it your best shot to make it work.
Ladyinred is clearly unhappy on the money front, but the giant red flag to me is the unresolveable differences on sex - being pressured into or out of sex, or into or out of a particular kind of sex, for the rest of your life, is not something I would press on anyone.  Particularly with an emotionally abusive partner who threatens suicide to keep the other partner in line.

If it's not possible for ladyinred to negotiate a sexually open marriage with separate finances, I would suggest that she lines up her successor if she can but sets a date and goes anyway if she can't.  What her husband does about that is on him, not her.

kayvent

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #152 on: September 12, 2017, 03:50:39 AM »
LOL "how marriage was originally designed"... You mean like when a young woman had to marry her rapist as the rapist's punishment for spoiling the woman's father's property? Or when a woman found not to be a virgin on her wedding night was stoned to death? If we follow the Christian traditions, that's the original marriage. Or were you speaking of some other, non-biblical model of marriage?

Although it will sound inflammatory, I have an honest and sincere question: Do you think you are smart or do you know you're being an idiot?

Deuteronomy and Leviticus, at least in a verbal form, have been around for three and a half millenniums. Heck, even if you think they are anachronistic, they are two and a half millenniums old. Now, in all that time, do you think you (modern man) are one of the first sets of people to ever talk about those verses?

If you think so, you are grossly wrong. If you realize that you aren't a savant or that talking about the Bible isn't a modern concept, perhaps you need to realize that your comment is juvenile at best. When I hear comments like yours, they remind me when I hear a creationist say "Evolution can't be right because monkeys are still around." Both of y'all ignore that the community you are dissing has hundreds or thousands of years of explanatory history and discourse on a topic and your root criticism grazes something it dealt with in its infancy.

As caracarn offered, if you want to discuss this topic I am more then willing to in PM.

 pot. kettle. The plural of millennium is millennia.

This made me laugh. So you are calling Snacky an idiot? Also, the plural of millennium is both millennia and millenniums. Crack open a dictionary. I don't mind being corrected on things. I do find it hilarious to be corrected when I am not wrong.

PoutineLover

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #153 on: September 12, 2017, 06:37:27 AM »
I have been considering divorce for the last year, and very seriously for the last six months. To the outside, we are a remarkably high functioning, successful, and productive couple. We have a beautiful home, we're delightful and social, we run a successful Meetup group and Airbnb. What others don't see is are the painfully sore areas of misalignment that have plagued us for a while now - the incredibly cliche problems of sex and money disagreements. The problems have been going on for years and are not going to be solved. I fantasize about being freed of him and living a happier, more frugal life.

Since we are both independently successful and have no children, I'm of the opinion that we should separate. Cut our losses and move on to other lives and people who will be better for each of us and be happier in the long haul. No hard feelings - I just don't feel we're great for each other. He, on the other hand, doesn't feel he will ever be able to find someone as wonderful as me and is horrified at the thought of divorce (probably because he hates feeling rejected and is the child of divorce). When we've talked about it, he has explicitly said he will make the process difficult and made threats of suicide.

Yes, suicide.

I have no problems being impartial, emotionless and amicable in a separation, but that is wildly outside his ability. I've already mentally divvied up our stuff in what I feel is a very good split. I've started making lists of things I should do to "circle my wagons" before serving papers (download financial documents, take picture of assets, etc). I just don't really know how to start the divorce process so that I don't end up with $20k in lawyer's fees. Anyone have any suggestions?

I did not see anybody explicitly see anybody mention this so I'll throw this suggestion out there.  This applies to other posts I saw as well, but I suck at quoting, especially across multiple pages.  Make sure your marriage is truly doomed, and give it your best shot for success.  You didn't say, "DH thinks he's perfect and thinks everything is my fault."  You literally said cliche issues which implies they are fairly common.  Do you guys just have different viewpoints or values?  I'm sure there are serious problems, but I ask because his view may very well be true that he WON'T find somebody as awesome as you.  Maybe, the inverse is true, but there are changes needed.  Especially with his viewpoint, maybe he'd be willing to work on his marriage harder?

Seriously, there's tons of ways to deal with money issues, splitting finances, sitting down and talking, allowances, budgets, partially joint finances, etc.  Maybe you sit down and make an agreement on things, and sign it. (note this is an agreement, not a document to control another person)  If he's the type of person who's word is his bond, maybe that could help.  Sex issues, well REALLY depends on the issue, but even on those issues there are options.  What about open and non-monogamous marriage?  What can either/both parties do to change whatever the issue is, sometimes sex lives get boring, but that doesn't have to be the answer.  With all issues, communication is key.  Good communication.

I ask all this because I see an underwhelming trend in this thread for people to talk about trying to save a marriage.  In a lot of cases divorce is the best thing, but I saw no giant red flags in your post clearly pointing towards that being your only options.  I'm *hoping* that given your viewpoint that divorce is better you've already truly given it your best shot to make it work.
Ladyinred is clearly unhappy on the money front, but the giant red flag to me is the unresolveable differences on sex - being pressured into or out of sex, or into or out of a particular kind of sex, for the rest of your life, is not something I would press on anyone.  Particularly with an emotionally abusive partner who threatens suicide to keep the other partner in line.

If it's not possible for ladyinred to negotiate a sexually open marriage with separate finances, I would suggest that she lines up her successor if she can but sets a date and goes anyway if she can't.  What her husband does about that is on him, not her.
The major red fleg of threatening suicide over divorce is an indication of the unhealthiness and emotionally abusive nature of that relationship. Ok, people fight about money, sex, whatever. But coercing someone to stay by saying you'll kill yourself if they don't? Thats some twisted manipulation. I bet there are a lot of other little actions and gaslighting going on. Just because outwardly two people can look fine and convince themselves that they are fine does not mean everything is fine. Divorce sounds like a good option in that kind of marriage. Ladyinred, you are not responsible if he does go through with that, and i bet its an empty threat anyway. You deserve to be in a relationship that satisfies you with a partner who respects you, and from your post, it doesn't sound like you're in one.

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #154 on: September 12, 2017, 06:53:21 AM »
LOL "how marriage was originally designed"... You mean like when a young woman had to marry her rapist as the rapist's punishment for spoiling the woman's father's property? Or when a woman found not to be a virgin on her wedding night was stoned to death? If we follow the Christian traditions, that's the original marriage. Or were you speaking of some other, non-biblical model of marriage?

Although it will sound inflammatory, I have an honest and sincere question: Do you think you are smart or do you know you're being an idiot?

Deuteronomy and Leviticus, at least in a verbal form, have been around for three and a half millenniums. Heck, even if you think they are anachronistic, they are two and a half millenniums old. Now, in all that time, do you think you (modern man) are one of the first sets of people to ever talk about those verses?

If you think so, you are grossly wrong. If you realize that you aren't a savant or that talking about the Bible isn't a modern concept, perhaps you need to realize that your comment is juvenile at best. When I hear comments like yours, they remind me when I hear a creationist say "Evolution can't be right because monkeys are still around." Both of y'all ignore that the community you are dissing has hundreds or thousands of years of explanatory history and discourse on a topic and your root criticism grazes something it dealt with in its infancy.

As caracarn offered, if you want to discuss this topic I am more then willing to in PM.

 pot. kettle. The plural of millennium is millennia.

This made me laugh. So you are calling Snacky an idiot? Also, the plural of millennium is both millennia and millenniums. Crack open a dictionary. I don't mind being corrected on things. I do find it hilarious to be corrected when I am not wrong.
Thing is: words matter, and words have meanings.  The fact that a particular group has over time rationalised a particular set of words into a meaning which is different and specialised to that group doesn't give them sole rights to the meaning of those words.  And if those words are in the Bible (you used that word so I'm guessing Christian rather than Jewish), then they are the words of a proselytising religion which gives everyone the right to have an opinion on their meaning because their meaning is not contained to the particular group and its particular interpretation.

La Bibliotecaria Feroz

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #155 on: September 12, 2017, 07:49:20 AM »
+1 that ladyinred is in an emotionally abusive relationship.

I get that in the long term, divorce is not shown to make people happier. But that's a post hoc fallacy. Maybe the people who got divorced had different problems than the ones who stayed married (of course they did! That's why they got divorced!) so it hasn't been shown to NOT make people happier, either.

Suggesting that someone in an emotionally abusive relationship try harder is wildly inappropriate.

Maybe Mr. LIR is genuinely mentally ill and genuinely suicidal. You know what? STILL not her problem and STILL abusive. She is under no obligation to be his punching bag while he gets his head straight.

jo552006

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #156 on: September 12, 2017, 08:21:36 AM »
Suggesting that someone in an emotionally abusive relationship try harder is wildly inappropriate.

Yes it is, so let me be very clear.

Ladyinred, if you are in an abusive relationship, whether emotionally or physcially, please get out.  Also, if that is the case, you have my sincerest apologies for not realizing it in my response.

With only the post I quoted to look at I did not jump to abusive.  I did read this thread, but if Ladyinred made other posts, or posts on different threads I did not connect them to the post I quoted.  I realize the suicide point and promising to make it messy could point towards abusive and controlling, but I did not simply assume that.  I also noted the use of the word freed, but again, am not adept at reading between the lines as much as others may be.

If you (or anybody) is in an abusive relationship, please seek to get out ASAP.  This likely means doing whatever you need to in order to be prepared with an exit strategy depending on the level of control the other person has.  Who pays the phone bill?  Will you have a cell phone after you leave?  What money will you leave with, etc.  Where will you go, etc.  In your case if it's just division of assets, then I'm assuming mediation is a good way to go, but if my understanding is correct your spouse can basically make you pay the divorce penalty simply by not working with you.

PVD_Kev

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #157 on: January 24, 2022, 04:58:50 AM »
I am doing the most un-Moustachian thing because I need to save myself. I am divorcing my (second) wife after four years, my best friend, and love of my life because of her alcoholism. It is psychologically, and financially, necessary in the long run to forever split from her self-destructive drinking that five rehabs, several trips to the hospital, dozens of group meetings, and our love for each other could not stop.

It is an insane situation to be in; I am willing to give her a $210k good-bye check just to get her addiction away from me and my family and friends.

Luckily I can afford a good therapist who specializes in families of addicts. I go to Al-Anon. My friends and family, as well as my wife's friends and family, are all very supportive. But this still feels like a financial "own goal". On the plus side I can ditch the things she spent money on that were very non-Moustachian: cable bills, expensive haircuts, and (of course) a lot of alcohol and cigarettes.  On the minus side, her modest (disability) income is out of here and of course, I took a $210k hit to my FIRE plan.

Any advice for an aspiring Moustachian in this situation, financially or personally?

iluvzbeach

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #158 on: January 24, 2022, 11:59:40 AM »
I donít have any advice to offer but can provide words of encouragement. It sounds like youíre making a very tough decision, one that will save you. So sorry youíre going through this and wishing you the best.

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #159 on: January 24, 2022, 12:25:42 PM »
I'm sorry you are in this shitty situation but glad that you are taking steps to help yourself and that you have support doing it.

Adventine

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #160 on: January 24, 2022, 01:13:23 PM »
I am doing the most un-Moustachian thing because I need to save myself. I am divorcing my (second) wife after four years, my best friend, and love of my life because of her alcoholism. It is psychologically, and financially, necessary in the long run to forever split from her self-destructive drinking that five rehabs, several trips to the hospital, dozens of group meetings, and our love for each other could not stop.

It is an insane situation to be in; I am willing to give her a $210k good-bye check just to get her addiction away from me and my family and friends.

Luckily I can afford a good therapist who specializes in families of addicts. I go to Al-Anon. My friends and family, as well as my wife's friends and family, are all very supportive. But this still feels like a financial "own goal". On the plus side I can ditch the things she spent money on that were very non-Moustachian: cable bills, expensive haircuts, and (of course) a lot of alcohol and cigarettes.  On the minus side, her modest (disability) income is out of here and of course, I took a $210k hit to my FIRE plan.

Any advice for an aspiring Moustachian in this situation, financially or personally?



I'm sorry you are going through this. It sounds like you tried your best to help. It's tough when you can't save the people you love from themselves.

You are doing the right thing by setting boundaries and protecting yourself from someone who is self-destructing. At this stage, your mental and physical health are most important. If you need to spend more money to keep yourself healthy, balanced and sane, whether it's in the form of professional counseling, legal help, or physically distancing yourself from your wife (ex. moving to a new city, state or country), the expenses are worth it.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2022, 01:14:54 PM by Adventine »

PVD_Kev

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #161 on: January 25, 2022, 04:56:52 AM »

I'm sorry you are going through this. It sounds like you tried your best to help. It's tough when you can't save the people you love from themselves.

You are doing the right thing by setting boundaries and protecting yourself from someone who is self-destructing. At this stage, your mental and physical health are most important. If you need to spend more money to keep yourself healthy, balanced and sane, whether it's in the form of professional counseling, legal help, or physically distancing yourself from your wife (ex. moving to a new city, state or country), the expenses are worth it.


Thank you all.  I am suppressing my "save money" urges during this process by hiring a good (but not expensive) attorney, avoiding attorney hours squabbling over the small stuff, giving the wife a thousand dollars here or there (so she can make it through the transition), seeing a therapist (in-network).  It is still a huge flushing of money and of all the emotions I can be feeling the impact to my bottom line is making me the most angry and frustrated. In the long run, it is all for the best, emotionally and financially.

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #162 on: January 25, 2022, 11:25:51 AM »
Thanks for reviving this post and sorry to hear what you're going through.

I had a very agreeable divorce a couple years ago, but since then have met and been dating a girl in a much lower financial situation. So going forward I'm absolutely horrified of the thought of ever getting married again. I know the obvious decision would be to *never* remarry, but is it still possible to remarry eventually while protecting my ~$700k (and growing) NW?

Milspecstache

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #163 on: January 26, 2022, 06:58:33 AM »
For those who even think that their partner will become adversarial, then please consider recording every future interaction.  I did and even told my wife (at the time) that I would be recording everything from that point on and she still called the cops on me later for no reason.  Many partners will become desperate and attempt to accuse you of domestic violence (DV) as a means of retaliation and even bolstering their position in front of a judge.  The best solution is to begin recording all interactions and even obtain witnesses for those situations that could be construed as DV.  I know there are real situations of DV out there but unfortunately, those are downplayed by the false accusations that occur often during divorce.  For men, your only defense will be a witness or a recording.  Every man that I seem to meet in this situation (adversarial spouse) either gets arrested or has proof to prevent it.  This is so incredibly sad but again, your only way out is to be pro-active and protect yourself.

Mediation.  I did it and it cost me $1500 or so.  Was awesome and fair.  I planned and planned and conceded on nearly every point to reach a fair and equitable settlement.

However, in the 3 years since she has since hired 3 different lawyers to harass me and take me to court at every opportunity.  But if you did the cheap mediation to begin with, and lived frugally, then you will have the financial means to hire a good lawyer to face the bad lawyer (ex-spouse's) that took the bad case of asking for ridiculous items that were already firmly settled in the settlement agreement.  I am probably around $10k in fighting the subsequent court battles but that, too, has been worth every penny.  Follow the agreement.  Read and study it.  Don't send harassing emails or texts.  Understand that stupidity or childishness will reduce your position in court.

Counseling.  I have been in weekly counseling for almost 6 years and it was and is worth every penny.  My spouse was a narcissist and has continued down the path of scorched earth so the counseling is necessary to move on with life and my own happiness.  I also cut off nearly all of the mutual friends as I don't have time to untangle the web of lies that ensued.  My now-grown children have to make their own decisions and I have to accept that.  Eventually they, too, will discover truth so I have done my best not to alienate so that opportunity will still be possible.

New relationships.  Met a new lady, same situation as myself, who is actually Mustachian!  She is also kind and caring and peaceful.  Hard to believe that the previous 17 year marriage failure could be overcome so quickly but focus on fixing your own personal and financial life.  Learn from your own failures that contributed to your divorce.  I made plenty of mistakes (workaholic mostly) but others of stupidity due to not caring enough and not being sensitive to the needs of others.  Divorce is a perfect opportunity to learn to care and love unselfishly.  Don't become bitter!  Then be open to future relationships.

Depression.  I spent many months crying and weeping, trying to understand why my life collapsed.  For me, God, church, and the Bible were the answer.  Please don't resort to addictions that will only make your life worse.  If you want revenge, the best way is to move on with your life in a peaceful and happy way.  Hard times will not always stick around if you do your part.  Embrace frugality and live simply.  Exercise.  Get a dog.  Sleep and eat healthier.  Help others in similar situations.  Volunteer.

spartana

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #164 on: January 26, 2022, 08:41:06 AM »
Thanks for reviving this post and sorry to hear what you're going through.

I had a very agreeable divorce a couple years ago, but since then have met and been dating a girl in a much lower financial situation. So going forward I'm absolutely horrified of the thought of ever getting married again. I know the obvious decision would be to *never* remarry, but is it still possible to remarry eventually while protecting my ~$700k (and growing) NW?
I also had a very agreeable divorce (we even did it ourselves for about $150 without a lawyer or need for any outside advise) and we remained friends afterwards (dudes a great guy). We were in our upper 30s when we divorced (married in our early 20s and no kids) and each of us was already FI separately via our own investments so the financial stuff was easy. Just needed to split the few joint assets 50/50.

 I have no plans to marry again (and have a SO who feels the same) but my understanding for my state (Calif) is that any assets you have before marriage are your sole property in a divorce unless the assets were changed to some kind of joint thing - like your $700k would remain you assets unless you used it to buy a jointly owned house. This varies by state so you'd need to check out the laws in your state. However you'd  probably need or want to get a pre-nup for any current or future assets you will have. Since I and my SO don't plan to marry and are both FIRE and don't combine assets, just split expenses, it is pretty easy.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2022, 08:43:13 AM by spartana »

iluvzbeach

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #165 on: January 26, 2022, 11:41:29 AM »
For those who even think that their partner will become adversarial, then please consider recording every future interaction.  I did and even told my wife (at the time) that I would be recording everything from that point on and she still called the cops on me later for no reason.  Many partners will become desperate and attempt to accuse you of domestic violence (DV) as a means of retaliation and even bolstering their position in front of a judge.  The best solution is to begin recording all interactions and even obtain witnesses for those situations that could be construed as DV.  I know there are real situations of DV out there but unfortunately, those are downplayed by the false accusations that occur often during divorce.  For men, your only defense will be a witness or a recording.  Every man that I seem to meet in this situation (adversarial spouse) either gets arrested or has proof to prevent it.  This is so incredibly sad but again, your only way out is to be pro-active and protect yourself.

Mediation.  I did it and it cost me $1500 or so.  Was awesome and fair.  I planned and planned and conceded on nearly every point to reach a fair and equitable settlement.

However, in the 3 years since she has since hired 3 different lawyers to harass me and take me to court at every opportunity.  But if you did the cheap mediation to begin with, and lived frugally, then you will have the financial means to hire a good lawyer to face the bad lawyer (ex-spouse's) that took the bad case of asking for ridiculous items that were already firmly settled in the settlement agreement.  I am probably around $10k in fighting the subsequent court battles but that, too, has been worth every penny.  Follow the agreement.  Read and study it.  Don't send harassing emails or texts.  Understand that stupidity or childishness will reduce your position in court.

Counseling.  I have been in weekly counseling for almost 6 years and it was and is worth every penny.  My spouse was a narcissist and has continued down the path of scorched earth so the counseling is necessary to move on with life and my own happiness.  I also cut off nearly all of the mutual friends as I don't have time to untangle the web of lies that ensued.  My now-grown children have to make their own decisions and I have to accept that.  Eventually they, too, will discover truth so I have done my best not to alienate so that opportunity will still be possible.

New relationships.  Met a new lady, same situation as myself, who is actually Mustachian!  She is also kind and caring and peaceful.  Hard to believe that the previous 17 year marriage failure could be overcome so quickly but focus on fixing your own personal and financial life.  Learn from your own failures that contributed to your divorce.  I made plenty of mistakes (workaholic mostly) but others of stupidity due to not caring enough and not being sensitive to the needs of others.  Divorce is a perfect opportunity to learn to care and love unselfishly.  Don't become bitter!  Then be open to future relationships.

Depression.  I spent many months crying and weeping, trying to understand why my life collapsed.  For me, God, church, and the Bible were the answer.  Please don't resort to addictions that will only make your life worse.  If you want revenge, the best way is to move on with your life in a peaceful and happy way.  Hard times will not always stick around if you do your part.  Embrace frugality and live simply.  Exercise.  Get a dog.  Sleep and eat healthier.  Help others in similar situations.  Volunteer.

Congratulations on your post-divorce life success. Sounds like youíve done all the hard work and are in a great spot. My father was a narcissist and I sure know all about the chaos & drama they can bring to relationships.

K-ice

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Re: Divorce help and discussion
« Reply #166 on: March 04, 2022, 03:32:47 PM »


I am doing the most un-Moustachian thing because I need to save myself. I am divorcing my (second) wife after four years, my best friend, and love of my life because of her alcoholism.

....

I am willing to give her a $210k good-bye check ....

Any advice for an aspiring Moustachian in this situation, financially or personally?

I am so sorry you are struggling. But I would not recommend giving an alcoholic a $200+K "good buy" check. If there is any way to split your assets so they still get a portion of your pension, or something that they cannot blow in one year, you will be doing them a favor.

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!