Lawyer Mustachians - Should I get off the Partner track?

[Aelias]

Bear with me here . . . I’m trying to think this thing through.

I’m currently an associate at an L&E defense firm.  Honestly, it’s a great job—I like the people I work with and I like the work I’m doing.  Additionally, despite being on a reduced time schedule (80%), I am still treated like a “rising star” by getting good cases, lots of marketing opportunities et cetera.  However, comp is low for my market and level of experience-- $135,000 for 80% time (would be about $170,000 for full time)

So, I get a contact from a recruiter about a non-partner track “counsel” position at big name L&E firm.  It’s all the same work I’m doing now, but with more autonomy and responsibility managing my own cases. It’s 100% remote work-from-home, meaning I can come into the office if I feel like (in a visiting office) but there’s no expectation to do so.  It’s 35-40 hours a week worked, not billed, and there’s no billable hour expectation. And, I’d be making more money--$155,000.
 
Record scratch—“Wait a minute. I could be doing all the same work, working from home, and making more money?”  Yeah, I think I’d be crazy not to consider this.  The downside is it is off the partner track—no chance of advancing in that direction at the firm, ever. And I would not be building a book of business—meaning it would be basically impossible to be a partner at another firm of any size, ever.

I’m married with 2 kids (and probably another at some point), and my husband makes about $95,000 as an electrical engineer.  Our planned FIRE date is September 15, 2032 (our 25th wedding anniversary), but that is crazy conservative given that we already have $750K in retirement savings.  Obviously, extra comp on my end could move that a little closer.  And working from home saves me 1.5 hours a day on my public transit commute (plus $1000 in transit costs). And I’ll be home when my kids come home from school.

BUT I’m giving up the chance to be partner, probably forever, with the partner comp and the security of having my own clients.  But I’m not really on the partner track in my current job, and I’d have to start working full time hours to be partner track.  And I think I could probably still move in-house from a position like this if I wanted to.

It’s a tough choice.  I’m definitely considering using the offer (assuming I get it) to leverage a raise out of my current firm, but they’re stingy on comp, so I’m not optimistic.  And on the one hand, I feel loyal to this firm because they’ve given me a lot.  And on the other hand, I feel like an idiot for feeling loyal to this firm because it’s a firm and I know they’d cut me loose in a heartbeat if I stopped being profitable for them.

So, I’m looking for advice. What say you, Lawyer Mustachians?

[Miss Piggy]

Not a lawyer here, but...

Wouldn't this new opportunity actually be LESS money, if you look at it as an hourly basis?

[trashmanz]

Hmm... they say no billable hour expectation, but if you hhave a set salary vs. percent of compensation, there is still a billable hour expectation in there somewhere.  Would be good to know what that is. 

Also, how do they stop you from having your own clients?  If you bring in a client, you have to have a partner managing the business?

Can you do work from home at your existing firm?

Also not sure how it can be the exact same work.  Maybe same type of work, but with different clients, partners and in house counsel the work may change fairly dramatically?

[Jack]

However, comp is low for my market and level of experience-- $135,000 for 80% time

I’m married with 2 kids (and probably another at some point), and my husband makes about $95,000 as an electrical engineer.  Our planned FIRE date is September 15, 2032 (our 25th wedding anniversary), but that is crazy conservative given that we already have $750K in retirement savings.

Deflate your lifestyle and FIRE now (or soon -- as in, before 2020). You've won; quit playing!

[trashmanz]

Also, what year associate are you? 

As a side note, what is your FIRE number?  With 750,000 now, and planning 16 years more of saving, making combined 235,000 each year that is a huge stash!  Even without adding any more money you could easily have almost 2 Million at just 6% growth.

[bobechs]

1. You want to be a partner.

2. You can't be a partner.

3. But you still want to be a partner.

4. Get over your cheap self.  You have a choice of two quite similar jobs, differing only in details,  neither of which leads to partnership in this life.

5. I know, you still want to be a partner.

[ZMonet]

Lots of good points already made...   A couple of others:  (1) Being a partner at a firm isn't as lucrative as it once was.  Partnership also doesn't provide the same job security it previously did.  Unless the title means something to you, I don't think you should care; (2) Not sure how many firms you've worked at, but if you like the people (attorneys, parelegals, support staff, etc.) you work with, that is a huge plus and not the norm; (3)  How do you think you will feel about not having office interaction if you're consistently working from home?; and (4) Agreed that a billable hour expectation must be in there someplace and you should find out where it is.

If you're happy where you're at, a 15% raise wouldn't be enough to get me to jump ship.  Do you think you could negotiate a raise and/or increased flexibility with the (possible) offer?

[Dee]

Well, similarly to a previous poster, who put it more bluntly, it does seem to be an implicit assumption in your post that becoming a partner is desirable for you.  But does that assumption actually bear out in your case? What is it about being partner that is desirable - the money itself? If so, is your plan to become partner and then leave the partnership when you are FI? For me, the new job offer sounds SO MUCH BETTER than you current situation for all the reasons you state (possibility to work from home; sane, predictable weekly hours but discretion over some aspects of your schedule to coordinate with children's schedules)... it seems like it would allow you to enjoy your life now more easily than partner-track would, and would also allow you to become FI in a reasonable time... so, yeah, to me the new job seems like a big improvement based on your description.

[LeRainDrop]

Hmm, I actually wonder if this new position is with the large firm that I recently left (after about 8 1/2 years) because it sounds remarkably similar to an opening that I know they've been interviewing to fill recently.  If it is with my old firm, then I could confirm for you that it truly does not have an hours requirement, but rather it's workload based -- like as long as you seem to be getting done enough work and to the quality level expected, then the 35-40 hours per week is right on.  I think it's a really good gig.  Again, if it's my firm, I know the lead attorney on this team very well, and I think she is awesome.  I am very happy to have quit the partnership track.

[Cannot Wait!]

Not a lawyer but ...

Other than being a partner, is there anything else you'd like to do with your life?  Because you'd have an extra 1.5 hrs a day to get started on it with the new job!  Amongst the other perks!

If there is nothing you'd rather do - then it's time to get started on the partner track.

[Aelias]

Thanks for all the constructive comments.

To respond to a few questions: I'm a 7th year associate.  My understanding is that there's an expectation for hours worked and quality of work produced, not hours "billed" in the traditional sense.  The number of hours I expect to devote to work is probably going to be roughly the same.

I can see that my post reads like I want to be partner, but I think that's the crux of the question--do I want to be partner? What's so great about being partner anyway? Especially if your lifestyle is such at you don't need the money?  The only thing about being partner that really means anything to me is that I'd call the shots on my work.  But is it worth the work to get there? I'm starting to think not.

Yes, we could totally slash our lifestyle right now and FIRE, especially if we were willing to relocate. Insert face punch here.  As I said, I view 2032 as crazy conservative--I'm still bringing my husband around on the whole FIRE concept, so that's where we are now. Realistically, I think 2026 is totally doable.  I do like my practice for now, so I'm ok to continue working another 10-15 years, but, yeah, I have a lot of other things I want to do with my life.

So, all of this points toward the new job. I do want to talk to my current boss and see if we can work something out because he's a good guy and I respect him.  But his hands are tied by the firm's management, so there's only so much he can do.

Anyway, thanks all for indulging me.  Nice to get some feedback from folks who understand that money and prestige aren't really the point.

[onlykelsey]

I'm in BigLaw in a different field, but will actually ask a non-law question.

If you're home all the time, what will that do for your mental health? your marriage?  I have seen a few friends switch to working from home, and suddenly they are responsible for 95% of the kid/household/etc items.  It seems like an easy thing to slip in to.   I don't know how old your kids are, but would you need childcare?  Would it be outside the home?  I'd think a lot about how a work from home position would actually work for you, and talk to your husband.

I'll also point out I'm not sure I see a path where you both step up your hours to have a chance at partner, and raise a third child, at least if the parents in my firm are any indication.  Or are those not mutually exclusive for you?

[Aelias]

Very fair question about childcare.  My kids are very young, and they would still be in daycare full time. Even though I'd be working from home, I would still be working.   And watching the kids is definitely also working.  So, trying to watch the kids while I work from home would be,  in my view,  basically impossible.

I don't think having 3 kids and making partner are mutually exclusive (I know women who've done it) but it's rough.  I'm lucky to have a great husband who does at least 50 percent of the childcare, and sometimes more.  For example,  he has always had pick up and drop off duty because 1) we found a good, inexpensive home daycare near his office and 2) he doesn't have work "emergencies" like I do. I would think my being home might actually take presure off him, especially as the kid's transition into our neighborhood schools.