Case Study Spreadsheet club (like a book club...only with a spreadsheet...)

[Ladychips]

@SquashingDebt , I’m trying to catch up.  Although I truly have internet issues, that may have realistically been just an excuse for my procrastination and avoidance.  I’m working on it now!  Unfortunately, I have questions.  Hopefully, @MDM will have time to answer my SOS!

My husband and I have regular jobs (w-2s) and a rental property.  However, I am also part of an LLC (with a partner) that owns a few rental properties.  On lines 33-36, do I just put our personal rental or do I add the personal and my half of the LLC properties here?  If only personal, where does the LLC info go?

[MDM]

My husband and I have regular jobs (w-2s) and a rental property.  However, I am also part of an LLC (with a partner) that owns a few rental properties.  On lines 33-36, do I just put our personal rental or do I add the personal and my half of the LLC properties here?  If only personal, where does the LLC info go?

You tell me. :)

Seriously, where do you enter your LLC information when you file?  On schedule E, the same as your own rental property, or somewhere else? 

[SquashingDebt]

@Ladychips, good to hear from you!  Want to let me know when you're caught up and then we can keep going?

[Ladychips]

All right! 

Thanks @MDM  for the pointer. 

@SquashingDebt , I really appreciate your patience.  I’ve completed columns A-D, through line 130.  Is that where you are?  As a side note, was it your understanding that we also had to do columns E-L, line76 so that it would fill in B76?  I THINK I’m starting to understand MDM’s madness!

I think lines 133-137 are next.  It looks like we’ll have to do columns E-L in addition to A-D.  I do have some questions…  As I said earlier, I have several rental properties (with mortgages).  I’d put my half of the mortgage in this section, right?  Also, I am doing my spreadsheet for 2018.  I had a small loan in 2018 that is now paid off.  But I need to include it here anyway?  And I’m assuming I should do the loans at what they would be in December of 2018, not January?  Are my questions making sense?

@philli14  and @FireKingGreen  – are you still joining us?  Have you completed A-D, rows 1-130?  Do you need any assistance?  Do you want us to wait or are you ready to proceed?

[SquashingDebt]

Hi @Ladychips.  I've actually only done A-D up through row 73.  I'll tackle 75-137 tonight or tomorrow.

And yes, looks like for the mortgage and loan sections, you have to fill in E-L.  I've mostly been working down the columns but it seems logical to do these little sections along with the rest of the expense calculations.  (I don't have a mortgage or any loans, so I'll be leaving those blank anyhow, haha.)

[Ladychips]

@SquashingDebt  oddly, I'm really enjoying the fact that you and I are about as different as different can be regarding our finances.  That really brings home to me how flexible MDM's spreadsheet is.  The next big section is monthly expenses. I've been tracking for a few years so that was easy.  The only mistake I made was that I put some expenses (property tax) in as annual.  That looked REALLY bad.

Thanks again for being patient enough to let me catch up.  It really helps to have company on the trip.

[MDM]

As a side note, was it your understanding that we also had to do columns E-L, line76 so that it would fill in B76?

Yes.  Per the Instructions tab: " - For mortgage and personal loans, enter the original principal, length, and interest rate in cols. E, F, and I in the appropriate rows.  Excel will calculate the payment."

As I said earlier, I have several rental properties (with mortgages).  I’d put my half of the mortgage in this section, right?  Also, I am doing my spreadsheet for 2018.  I had a small loan in 2018 that is now paid off.  But I need to include it here anyway?  And I’m assuming I should do the loans at what they would be in December of 2018, not January?  Are my questions making sense?

If you are doing this for tax estimation purposes, and you want to look specifically at 2018 taxes, use the 2018 version linked at Case Study Spreadsheet updates.  Otherwise, using the most recent version is usually best.

For rental mortgages, there are (at least) two ways to proceed, neither of which will be "accurate" but either might be "good enough".
a) include interest payments in cell B34, and principal payments in cell D56.  Of course these will change from month to month, so pick some average.
b) enter the loan terms in one or more of rows 133-137.  Outside the spreadsheet, subtract the mortgage interest from rental income before entering cell B33.  Again, this is a moving target, thus the comment about accurate vs. good enough.

[philli14]

All right! 

Thanks @MDM  for the pointer. 

@SquashingDebt , I really appreciate your patience.  I’ve completed columns A-D, through line 130.  Is that where you are?  As a side note, was it your understanding that we also had to do columns E-L, line76 so that it would fill in B76?  I THINK I’m starting to understand MDM’s madness!

I think lines 133-137 are next.  It looks like we’ll have to do columns E-L in addition to A-D.  I do have some questions…  As I said earlier, I have several rental properties (with mortgages).  I’d put my half of the mortgage in this section, right?  Also, I am doing my spreadsheet for 2018.  I had a small loan in 2018 that is now paid off.  But I need to include it here anyway?  And I’m assuming I should do the loans at what they would be in December of 2018, not January?  Are my questions making sense?

@philli14  and @FireKingGreen  – are you still joining us?  Have you completed A-D, rows 1-130?  Do you need any assistance?  Do you want us to wait or are you ready to proceed?

On track :) Quietly following along, have been busy but no questions/concerns that haven't already been brought up! I'm good to keep going.

[SquashingDebt]

Ok, I'm caught up!  I've also been tracking my expenses for awhile (8 years or so?) so it was pretty easy to fill in.  I just used 2018 numbers, which seemed precise enough seeing that I'm a ways away from making any real decisions based on this data.

@MDM - what do you think about changing "beauty shop" to "salon" or something like that?  Beauty shop, at least in my experience, isn't really a common term these days and feels unnecessarily gendered.  (Men get manicures too!)  It stuck out to me as I read down the list.

[FireKingGreen]

I was away on a family trip, but believe I am just about caught up, assuming I haven’t made any fatal errors by continuing to use a google doc version...TBD.

One question before moving on. Child support doesn’t count as income, but it is a line item in my budget and I did not see a row listed. Thoughts on where to include or am I completely missing it?

[MDM]

@MDM - what do you think about changing "beauty shop" to "salon" or something like that?  Beauty shop, at least in my experience, isn't really a common term these days and feels unnecessarily gendered.  (Men get manicures too!)  It stuck out to me as I read down the list.

Sure, no strong feeling about "beauty shop."  Most of those categories were copy&pasted from various budgets people published in their case studies before this spreadsheet was available.

Because this is a spreadsheet, and changing rows can require documentation changes (and sometimes real reference changes), how about something like "Beautician/personal grooming" instead?  That would keep the same alphabetical order for expenses that come after the housing ones.

Actually, any name that keeps the replacement for "Beauty Shop" between
"Home/Rent Insurance"
and
"Charitable contributions" would work.

Suggestions?

[MDM]

One question before moving on. Child support doesn’t count as income, but it is a line item in my budget and I did not see a row listed. Thoughts on where to include or am I completely missing it?

Perhaps "Other untaxed income", cell B72, would work?

[SquashingDebt]

@MDM - what do you think about changing "beauty shop" to "salon" or something like that?  Beauty shop, at least in my experience, isn't really a common term these days and feels unnecessarily gendered.  (Men get manicures too!)  It stuck out to me as I read down the list.

Sure, no strong feeling about "beauty shop."  Most of those categories were copy&pasted from various budgets people published in their case studies before this spreadsheet was available.

Because this is a spreadsheet, and changing rows can require documentation changes (and sometimes real reference changes), how about something like "Beautician/personal grooming" instead?  That would keep the same alphabetical order for expenses that come after the housing ones.

Actually, any name that keeps the replacement for "Beauty Shop" between
"Home/Rent Insurance"
and
"Charitable contributions" would work.

Suggestions?

Beautician/personal grooming is a good improvement, and I'll think about it and see if I can come up with anything else. Thanks!

[FireKingGreen]

One question before moving on. Child support doesn’t count as income, but it is a line item in my budget and I did not see a row listed. Thoughts on where to include or am I completely missing it?

Perhaps "Other untaxed income", cell B72, would work?

Thanks! That is exactly where I had entered it as a placeholder.

[BlueHouse]

Hello!  I'm joining in and following along.  I tried to tackle this workbook 2 years ago and since, I copy/paste my personal worksheets into this workbook and use them both together. 

I'll chime in if I have a specific question, but in the meantime, I'm enjoying just making sure that I'm doing things properly.

@MDM have you ever considered adding a formatted section to the top of this workbook to show the main items that change as information is entered into cells?  I use a watch window but newer excel users might want a section that's always visible at the top of the sheet with a freeze pane added in.   

p.s.  Thanks so much for this sheet.  I love that when it tells me something I'm not expected, I can actually go through step by step to see what I've been forgetting in my own planning exercises!

[MDM]

MDM have you ever considered adding a formatted section to the top of this workbook to show the main items that change as information is entered into cells?  I use a watch window but newer excel users might want a section that's always visible at the top of the sheet with a freeze pane added in.

I've given it some thought, but not much, mostly because what thoughts I did have bounced among various things one might want to look at.  I use View>Split sometimes, mostly to look at how the marginal rate chart changes with some cell content.

Thanks so much for this sheet.  I love that when it tells me something I'm not expected, I can actually go through step by step to see what I've been forgetting in my own planning exercises!

You're welcome!  I wish there was some Artificial Intelligence add-on that would automate the explanation of odd-looking marginal rates, but that seems too much work.... ;)

[FireKingGreen]

Are we still working up to Line 137? I keep eyeballing my time to fire years/numbers thinking I must have added a zero somewhere. I feel much further behind than that.

[BTDretire]

  Hi all,
MDM has been very helpful, but, I want to spare him from any more of my novice questions.
 I'm doing tax planning, (quarterlies) We are retired. I can adjust the amounts in each category of assets I liquidate before the end of the year. (LTCGs or tIRA)
 I want to take LTCGs at 0% and do Roth conversions at 10%.
Here are the numbers to enter.
Line 25D- Qualified Dividends $6,500
Line 27D- LTCGs $70,000
Line 31D- tIRA Distributions $37,700
Line 45D-  HSA $8100
Line 2G - MFJ =2
Line 8G- Adult#1  65
Line 8H- Adult #2 61
Line 17G- 1040 Tax $350

 With these numbers, it seems that any additional $100 increase in LTCGs results in a $15 additional tax and  $100 increase in tIRA Distributions results in $25 additional tax. While decreasing LTCGs $100, results in no change in the tax due, and decreasing tIRA distributions $100, results in a $10 decrease in tax due.
 First, do you agree with my conclusion?
Second,  Is there any way to take more Roth conversions, at 10% tax?
Third, Is there any reason to take more LTCGs, since next year I can take them at 0%?
                           Thank you very much to anyone that verifies my data.