Author Topic: Can I call myself a Mustachian?  (Read 10333 times)

StartingEarly

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Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« on: July 12, 2014, 08:22:30 PM »
I am in my 20s.  I work in the trades as an electrical apprentice.  I typically make over 60k a year.  I have worked in my current job almost two years.  The reasons I think I may be a Mustachian.  In that time I've managed to save about 50k and my current assets are 60k.  My 401k is automatically maxed out.  All of my vehicles are paid off.  I have no student loan dept since I worked summers and went to tech school because I didn't want to have debt.  I tend to think about my purchases pretty carefully.  My main vehicle has over 130k miles on it.

For why I might not be a Mustachian.  I like pickups even though I have almost no use for them, I have one that never gets used, though I do hate it and plan on getting rid of it and being pickupless for a while.  I also like fast motorcycles and probably pay about 1500 a year in related expenses for a motorcycle that I use less than 5k miles a year and don't commute on for safety reasons.  It is purely a hobby and an expensive one at that.  I have absolutely no budget, the only way I keep track of money is seeing how much I have total across my asset classes about once a month, it has been climbing steeply so I've ignored a budget as unnecessary and restrictive.  I pay $60 a month for a smartphone.  I offroad my vehicles and drive very aggressively which tends to damage them or wear them out much faster than normal and burn a lot more gas.

So let me know what you think, are my savings habits enough to counterbalance my age and locality (central Wisconsin) habits and still be called a Mustachian, or do I have a long ways to go?
« Last Edit: July 12, 2014, 08:38:41 PM by StartingEarly »

La Bibliotecaria Feroz

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2014, 10:20:16 PM »
Dude, it's a self-applied label and, as far as I know, not a registered trademark or anything, so it's up to you whether you call yourself one or not. Do you WANT to be a Mustachian? I have "Handlebar" status in the forum but I'm really still more of an aspiring Mustachian. It's a work in progress.

You certainly have an awesome amount saved. That said, you know your hobbies are hellaciously wasteful and bad for the environment. Only you know whether the enjoyment you get from them is "worth it." (For instance, flying is expensive and burns a lot of fuel, but I'm getting on a plane next month anyway.) Alternatively, you could get out of your damn truck and go for a hike, or get a mountain bike, which would be waaaay more Mustachian and a way to enjoy nature without tearing it up so much.

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2014, 10:47:31 PM »
I want to be financially independent before 45, so I do have some Mustachian ideals.  I don't know about the other categories though.  I do plan to shift my hobbies to be a little more environmentally friendly as the years go on.  Planning on getting an electric motorcycle when they come down in price, but I will have a motorcycle of some sort for the foreseeable future.  I am a little better with my driving habits, but I still have a bigger vehicle than I need for my main vehicle even after I get the pickup sold.  Current vehicle is an AWD Ford Escape Hybrid. 

I did buy a bike last year, but I still have a hard time getting myself to ride it very often.  I have probably ridden it a little less than 200 miles this year.  I also don't commute with it because I work at 7, so it's rarely warm enough even in the summer.  Plus I often have to work a 16 hour shift without knowing it that morning and still having to come in at 7 the next day.  So riding a bike to work would cut into my sleep time and safety.

boarder42

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #3 on: July 13, 2014, 04:45:43 AM »
I have a boat my wife and I save 50% of our monies I consider myself part mustachian. Just finding this blog and starting to follow some of the principals to increase your savings and decrease your spending is a good first step. As for retire by 45. You need to put all your financials out here and it's pretty easy math to figure this out.

hybrid

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #4 on: July 13, 2014, 05:05:11 AM »
If you are looking for a yes or no answer, then the answer is no. Our host would find your clown truck ridiculous in the extreme. Above all else, get a bike is his mantra.

I took the moniker "hybrid" for a reason. I am doing many, most even, of the things that our host does but there are a lot of areas where we part ways. I am far quicker to outsource rather than insource repairs, I still drive more than I like (though I bike to work most days), we own too many vehicles, use too much electricity, and our savings rate isn't anywhere near 70% (more like 30%).

Can I call myself Mustachian? Well, compared to how radically different I am from my neighbors and coworkers then yeah, I feel pretty comfortable with the label. You need to feel comfortable in your own skin, no matter how you choose to define it.

Hedge_87

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #5 on: July 13, 2014, 09:45:02 AM »
I know how you feel about the whole truck thing. I have a dodge that I love to drive.  I still plan on keeping it for truck related things. (Sorry everybody who says a tiny car and tiny trailer can do the same thing but you are wrong.) I just no longer drive it to things I can accomplish with my bike or wife's car.

You sound a lot like a younger me. I graduated lineman school in 07. I got my journeyman lineman card in 2009 I have then taken several extra courses provided by the company on their dime.  I am now working as a substation maintenance technician. A little words of advice from somebody who was in a very similar situation about 6 years ago.
1.) As you get your step raises put them into saving/investments.  I see to many young guys living paycheck to paycheck in our industry and as soon as they get their next raise they inflate their lifestyle and are no better off than before.
2.) Even though your maxing out your 401K and a Roth IRA you can do more
3.) Any additional schooling you can do especially if it's paid for the company are worth your time to take.
4.) Bars are fun once you turn 21 but will severely damage your savings rates. (Especially if you drink to much and start buying rounds)

I wish I would have found this resource at the beginning of my career.  It's really hard to make the right decisions with money when your 20 years old. I saved quite a bit and am farther ahead than most of the people I work with but I could be a lot farther than I am now

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #6 on: July 13, 2014, 09:56:28 AM »
I don't actually have a maxed Roth, I only am putting money into a 401k for now at the 17,500 a year rate plus company match of about 2500 depending on overtime.  Most of my other money is going into a savings account and when it builds up I pull it out to put into an online brokerage firm.  I haven't been using that firm for a few weeks though since I got burned day trading, but I do intend to get back in soon with something like SPY or another index matching fund and then dollar cost average in every time I get another 5k to dump into it.

The truck is for sure going, I don't really drive it anymore and put it up for sale.  The Escape is staying for now since I am on call 24/7 and can't go without a car.  My response time has to be low even during winter.  I may downsize to the Elio car when that comes out onto the used market, but right now it's not even made yet so that's a few years out.

As far as a broader financial picture I have no debts, am currently living at home and paying the associated expenses out of a future inheritance as agreed upon by the family.  I am in the second year of a five year apprenticeship and will be making more money every six months, none of which I plan on spending.  I buy a few nice things for myself, but at the end of the day my favorite hobby is my motorcycle and that is still a 96, so I think I have a good handle on spending.  I would say my overall savings rate is right around 40k a year and I should be able to cover all of my expenses easily by the time I'm 45 (24 now) with my investment income.  Ultimately I plan on being semi retired in my mid to late 30s as I see that as a better option for my mental and physical health.  The environment I work in surrounds me with chemicals daily.  The big kick that started all of my retirement dreams was my uncle dying before turning 65.

boarder42

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2014, 10:43:43 AM »
savings rate is a percentage of total income not a numeric value if i make 3million a year and save 40k a year it will take along time to retire.  what percent of your total income are you saving.  from there its quite simple to figure out if you can retire in 21 years.  i would bet you could make it sooner for sure. 

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2014, 02:41:28 PM »
I said in my first post that is around 60000 a year.  Sometimes more with overtime.  Sometimes less.  Base is about 48000.  I have calculated out my expected retirement expenses and they're higher than my current ones because I would like to travel.  I plan to live in a toy hauler and probably spend 40000 a year.  I could retire before  45, but 45 would give me a lot of security.

avongil

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #9 on: July 13, 2014, 02:52:41 PM »
I had an air cooled 911 I used to love. Still love them and want one so bad... There is nothing on 4 wheels that compares in my opinion.
had to kick the habit. At 600$ a pop for a drivers ed and related extra expenses when going to them it was just way too much.

Try this:  Shift you hobbies. Try something cheaper. Stay away from the expensive stuff like skiing, off roading, race car driving, power boating etc...

I found dirt bikes to be the ultimate motoring fun. If you like blasting around in a 3000 lb vehicle off road, then you will love blasting around in a 250 lb vehicle off road. You can go farther, faster and longer. Any trail is possible. Its so fun it's retarded with a very low cost. A used dirt bike is under 2K and insurance and registration is dirt cheap.  In some states the only way to roll is with a registered and insured dirt bike.  A full day of riding can be had for 5$ of gasoline. Its so fun you just start laughing at the gas station when paying for it.

I went from a fairly fun hobby, to a retarded fun hobby that was 1000 X cheaper.  There are many awesome ways to have fun, don't be afraid to try them.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2014, 02:56:17 PM by avongil »

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2014, 03:15:29 PM »
I am planning on getting an on road off road motorcycle like you suggested.  However being under 25 the insurance kills.  I will probably get one next season.  I am getting rid of the pure dirt bike since it requires a pickup and I don't use it anymore because of the effort involved and expense.  However for winter time I will probably have an old pickup that costs little to keep around for the occasional off road adventure. 

My fast bike expense will also drop a lot next year.  Insurance will only be 20 a year vs 60 now.

Thegoblinchief

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2014, 05:23:16 PM »
You're in great shape and are making solid progress.

Could you be "better" or more extreme? Certainly, but that's your decision to investigate and make a value determination.

For example, I have a lot more fun hiking or biking than using a motor, but you're definitely going he right direction with frugal motorsports.

Welcome!

avongil

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2014, 09:44:13 PM »
Check other insurance companies, I used to pay 70$ per year in NJ for it since it is as 250 cc bike.  I used Rider insurance.

I just ran a quote for PA, since I have not insured it yet:

VEHICLE 1:( 1999/YAMAHA/TTR250L )    Assigned Driver: A G
Comprehensive with Collision   No
   
   
Coverage   Limit   Deductible   Premium
Bodily Injury   $15,000 per person/$30,000 per accident   N/A   $ 41.00
Property Damage   $5,000 per accident   N/A   $ 4.00
UnderInsured Motorist-NonStacked   $15,000 per person/$30,000 per accident   N/A   $ 7.00
UnInsured Motorist-NonStacked   $15,000 per person/$30,000 per accident   N/A   $ 8.00

60 Bucks!  Can't go wrong with dirt bikes, they are so fun for the money.  The trick is to buy a used one.




StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2014, 09:50:25 PM »
That is horrible coverage.  If you hit a car of any real value or hurt anyone you'd be really sorry you bought that coverage.

avongil

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #14 on: July 13, 2014, 10:04:46 PM »
Dirt bike dude.... I just rode it a few miles on the street. No risk in hurting anyone or causing damage outside of the minimal road ride.
you can play with the coverage on rider.com, it's still cheap if you up it.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2014, 10:09:29 PM by avongil »

RetireAbroadAt35

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #15 on: July 14, 2014, 03:29:00 PM »
I'd up the uninsured/underinsured coverage.  Even a minor accident (especially on a bike!) can cost $100k in medical easily and most people carry less insurance than that.  After seeing a friend get screwed over badly by an underinsured motorist, I try to keep $500k of coverage on any vehicle I drive.

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #16 on: July 14, 2014, 06:22:30 PM »
Yeah, I am normally on full coverage with 500k of liability.

avongil

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #17 on: July 15, 2014, 10:48:06 AM »
Dirt bike. Most people have them unregistered and uninsured. 

Insurance should be selected wisely. I know a dude that insures everything in his home. Not needed.
Over insuring a dirt bike is just wasteful. You are just riding in the woods, the chances of hitting someone else approach zero.

I just do the minimums to avoid law enforcement.  When you get stopped on a registered and insured motor vehicle, you get the "have a nice day" instead of a bunch of tickets and an impounded bike.


Trudie

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #18 on: July 15, 2014, 11:36:26 AM »
You seem to be doing well.  I wouldn't worry about the labels.  I've been reading here for awhile and cannot quite give you an operational definition of "Mustachian" and don't really care.  I think the important thing is to read about others' experiences, learn, and take action to improve your life and your finances.

The thing I like about this site is that it challenges the conventional wisdom on finance topics, where many other "experts" do not.  It makes me think.  Use what you can.  Discard the rest.  It is *fun* though to read about others' experiences ducking normative values about consumption and money though.  I love reading about "stealth wealth."

It seems like the goal of many here is to achieve FIRE (financial independence, retire early).  With this, as with other things, there isn't a consensus view of the optimal time to do this.  You may ask for opinions, you may get them anyway (and most people are well-intentioned).  Life is a balancing act for all of us, we have different considerations and challenges.  There isn't a "one size fits all" perspective.

avongil

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #19 on: July 15, 2014, 12:14:11 PM »
+1 Trudie

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #20 on: July 15, 2014, 06:08:56 PM »
Just because it's a dirt bike doesn't mean it should be uninsured.  I might want to hit a trail that's a ways away from home.  My nearest trail is about 2 miles away.  We are swarming with revenue agents around here.  No thanks on the no insurance.

avongil

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #21 on: July 15, 2014, 07:45:41 PM »
That's the right attitude. The cops have a their hands full with the uninsured off road vehicles, they will just wave you off!


Pylortes

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #22 on: July 15, 2014, 08:54:46 PM »
Since your question has not gotten a lot of actual answers, I vote "Yes",  I think you are a Mustachian who can use the label.  My rationale is 1. You have a kick ass savings rate (especially impressive at a young age) 2. You seem to be minimizing expenses/waste other than the truck hobby and 3. You have enough self awareness to recognize and critique your own weaknesses and 4. You are here with us in this forum/community learning like the rest of us.   So in my opinion you are clearly a Mustachian.  That being said I have no real authority to declare someone a Mustachian,  and the term doesn't have an exact defined meeting.  Carry on my friend and its time to start working biking into your routine instead of the clown trucks!  :0)

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #23 on: July 16, 2014, 09:17:22 PM »
Well, I would like to replace the trucks with an Elio car.  They're a pretty cool three wheel motorcycle with an enclosure and safety features.  They won't be coming out for a while though, but they're less than half of even what a Corolla goes for at 6800.  Plus they're expected to crest 80mpg on the highway.  One of the most anti-mustachian things about me is I love to drive around and explore, so I burn a lot of gas, this should cut it way down.  The escape only gets about 26-30.

DollarBill

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #24 on: November 01, 2014, 08:57:35 PM »
Only thing I have to say is KLR 650...it's a do all low cost bike.

Calvawt

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #25 on: November 01, 2014, 09:48:40 PM »
I think you fit the bill to be mustachian.  Everyone can make improvements, but you are well ahead of the general population to start.  good luck!

arebelspy

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #26 on: November 01, 2014, 10:03:46 PM »
What's a "Mustachian"?
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.

EconoWiser

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #27 on: November 01, 2014, 11:48:48 PM »
There's no exam that you have to pass or anything...

BTW You'll kick the bike and pick up habit as soon as you have kid(s) ;-)

StartingEarly

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #28 on: November 03, 2014, 04:53:16 AM »
My truck actually is a 4 cylinder though.  It's a 2008 ford escape hybrid with fake all wheel drive.

arebelspy

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Re: Can I call myself a Mustachian?
« Reply #29 on: November 03, 2014, 08:20:54 AM »

What's a "Mustachian"?
One of those young whippersnapper kids who wear their complainy pants so low their badassitiy is showing :-)!

You win the Clever Post of the Day!  Love it. :D
We are two former teachers who accumulated a bunch of real estate, retired at 29, spent some time traveling the world full time and are now settled with three kids.
If you want to know more about us, or how we did that, or see lots of pictures, this Business Insider profile tells our story pretty well.
We (rarely) blog at AdventuringAlong.com. Check out our Now page to see what we're up to currently.