Author Topic: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay  (Read 16087 times)

Metta

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Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« on: March 16, 2014, 08:43:42 AM »
I read the MMM column in which he recommends getting rid of paper checking, but this idea is surprisingly uncomfortable to me and my DH. Our routine for the last decade or two has been to do our yearly cash-flow planning in an Excel spreadsheet in late December then set up monthly budgets at the beginning of each month.

On the weekend, my DH pays the bills for the week (with paper checks) and I enter them into our spreadsheet. He enters everything into Quicken. It's a friendly, relatively quick check on what we're spending and allows us to adjust quickly if we need to adjust and spot problems before they are catastrophes.

At the end of the month, I close out the month, set up the next month with any carry-over necessary and we start anew. At the end of the year I make lots of pretty graphs and we have a little analysis party (usually with some yummy baked goods) and plan the future.

I can see putting more items to auto-pay on the credit cards because we itemize our credit card statements into our budget sheets anyway but I really can't see auto-paying credit cards. And if all we are paying with paper checks is the mortgage and our credit card bills (four, no-fee credit cards that we pay off each month) that's just five bills a month. Is there a reason to abandon our well-tuned system that has brought us this far?

Does it even make sense to use electronic bill pay of some sort? What do you folks use? And how much does it cost you to use it?

skekses

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2014, 09:38:10 AM »
I'm an accountant and deal with a lot of paper checks in my profession. In my personal life I autopay because I don't have many bills and what I do have are recurring charges for the same amounts each time. Using autopay does not cost me anything. In addition, I use mint.com and check my activity at least once a week to make sure everything looks right.

Pros of your current system:
- It's working for you and you find the process satisfying
- By using paper checks, you are presumably also actually looking at your bills - this means you are more likely to notice hidden/erroneous charges as well as consciously question the value of the bill you are paying (ex: do I really want to continue this magazine subscription?)

Cons of your current system:
- Time spent manually writing checks and updating Quicken

Pros of Autopay:
- If you are paying the same amount each month and are content with the services you are buying, then this is one way to simplify your life

Cons of Autopay:
- It's so easy to keep paying for things that you no longer value when you are not forced to deal with them
- It's also very tempting to not ever look at your bills because things are humming along just fine and nobody is complaining - I think using autopay has to go hand in hand with another form of tracking your expenses (which you are doing, so that's fine) to make sure you are indeed still paying the correct amount for the correct items
- When you've already paid and there's a problem, it's annoying to get your money back

Pros of Electronic Bill Pay:
- If you are not on autopay, then you are again (presumably) looking at your bills before typing in the number to authorize your bank to pay the check on your behalf
- Many banks still provide free electronic bill pay so there is no additional cost for using this over paper checks
- If you want to manage your cash flow, you can set the payment date in the future without having the concern of remembering to send out the check yourself

Cons of Electronic Bill Pay:
- Some banks require extra security features to send out bills over a certain threshold (encrypted key card)
- It can be a little unnerving to trust someone else to send out your payments for you when you are used to doing it yourself
- Some banks are now charging for electronic bill pay

Personally, I would not use autopay for a credit card. Maybe yes to autopay on the minimum due, but not on the full balance. I feel like that disconnects you way too much from your responsibility to actually look at what you are putting on your card (and using a cc in the first place already disconnects us from the purchase process, so that's two layers of disconnect).

Metta

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2014, 10:22:14 AM »
Thank you for such a well-reasoned analysis! It sounds like we are not missing any serious opportunities by continuing our paper check habit. Even if we were to use something like Mint.com, I think we would also continue to use our monthly budget sheets because it gives us a regular opportunity to talk about our progress, goals, and financial issues.

MDM

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2014, 11:51:35 AM »
Cost for electronic paying = $0.00 for any that we do, including paying the credit union Visa card by automated withdrawal from our checking account.

Credit card spending gets downloaded electronically, then categorized by hand (so we do look at each charge) into Quicken.

So you certainly could ditch the paperwork, all would be well, and if you want to try something new I'd say "go for it".  But you seem to have something that works for you so the phrase "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" comes to mind.

Jamesqf

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2014, 12:04:18 PM »
I much prefer electronic bill paying: no stamps or envelopes, and I get confirmation that payments are scheduled.  I can also do it from anywhere in the world.  The only time in my life I've ever paid interest on a credit card was back in the early '90s: I was in Britain for a couple of months, and their postal workers went on strike.

Of course I don't have that many actual bills, since almost everything goes on a credit card, and I just pay that.

Just looked at my checkbook, and I see I've written only three actual checks in the last year, one to the IRS, and a couple for one-off things.

RedMaple

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2014, 02:10:33 PM »
I have everything set up to autopay. I itemize all expenses in excel that I then reconcile with all ending balances using formulas (cc, savings, checking etc.) In excel I also compare my expenses to my budget. Autopay saves me with buying stamps, envelopes, checks, going to the mailbox. I don't have to think about when my bills are due. Each start of the month in excel I write out all of the expenses that I expect to be taken out of my checking account. So I sit back and make sure my real checking account matches what I calculated. I haven't had any issues. I went a step further a few months and cancelled all paper statements. Less mail to deal with.

Badass by 41

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2014, 02:57:24 PM »
+1 for putting everything possible on the CC and paying that off at the end of the month.  I use Mint.com and PersonalCapital.com to reconcile the CC charges just like I would a check ledger.

For the few bills I cannot pay by CC, or charge a fee for CC processing, I use electronic bill pay ($0.00 through my bank).

I too have only the odd 2-3 checks per year in my checkbook for one-off things.

My advise: stay with what's working if your truly find joy in it.  But realize you are potentially missing out on CC rewards, and/or precious time which could be spent doing more joyous things.

Metta

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2014, 04:39:41 PM »
I think my credit union may charge for electronic bill paying but I can check on that. I can certainly see the benefit in not having to stop and get stamps and the benefit to the planet and the household in having less paper hanging around. RedMaple's approach sounds much like ours but with less paper, stamps, and trips to the mailbox. It is worth thinking about and exploring, certainly.

I really appreciate hearing how everyone else is doing this! Thanks for the responses!

Frankies Girl

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2014, 05:34:12 PM »
We didn't start electronic bill pay until last year, as we had some reluctance and concerns, but we're happy with it now. As long as it is free to do, it saves us stamps and worrying about mail getting lost (which has happened several times in the year before we started online billpay).

We don't do any autopay - I like to look over the bills before paying.


TreeTired

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2014, 05:51:24 PM »
Anyone that will take a credit card payment gets paid by cc and I get miles.  This has included big (and small) tuition payments for 2 kids, and currently use credit card to pay homeowner, auto, and health insurance on the company websites.   Use BofA online banking for almost all the rest of the bills, even our property tax bill.

Dr.Vibrissae

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2014, 06:29:12 PM »
We use electronic bill pay through our credit union.  No charge and they guarantee payments (we have never had a problem, but they do have the guarantee that all payments will be posted on time or they pay the fees).  I also have the option of setting up recurring payments for bills that are the same amount every month.  I track everything weekly, and naturally always check other charges.  I personally don't like automatic payments, be cause it's harder for me to stop the payment or adjust it if something goes wrong or changes.  I like to have a little bit more control.

I'm curious NC_MJ, are you talking about college tuition?  My schools always charged a fee for paying by card which would have negated any benefit from the rewards.

jpo

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2014, 06:32:10 PM »
I put everything possible on my credit card, then pay that off monthly.

Electronic pay is preferred, but no autopay.

Nudelkopf

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2014, 01:13:49 AM »
I didn't know people even still used cheques! Do places even still accept them?

mrgrump

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2014, 01:29:32 AM »
Carolyn, my wife and I made the change as of January 1 and love it.  Originally I didn't want to make the transition because my system worked (the same system you use). However, after 3.5 months I regret not doing it sooner.

It was a bit time consuming at first to enter all the account information. For the bills that adjust I just click "Account at xyz company" enter the amount I want to pay and schedule the date. Takes about 30 seconds and saves the cost of a stamp or around $12 so far.

For the bills that don't change (internet, mortgage, car payment) I have set on autopay. If the bill is set to pay on the day the bank is closed it pays it on the business day ahead so I don't need to adjust anything.

I still get all the paper statements so I can glance at them and make sure no erroneous charges exist and then file them away. In a few months I imagine we will discontinue getting paper statements but lets not get ahead of ourselves. This move saves us time and money and we still have our monthly meeting.

Nothlit

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2014, 06:18:16 AM »
I didn't know people even still used cheques! Do places even still accept them?

The United States is a decade or more behind Europe, Australia, and the rest of the world when it comes to banking technology. Checks are declining in usage, but still common here. Most stores, business, etc. still accept them. There is no universal way to electronically send money to just anyone in the U.S. Yes, many entities (mostly utility companies, charities, and other places where you have an account that you pay on a regular basis) have the ability to do an electronic funds transfer (typically a "pull" rather than a "push"), but even that takes 1-3 business days. If I wanted to send money electronically to a friend or family member, I'd need to use a third-party service like PayPal or Square Cash.

smalllife

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #15 on: March 17, 2014, 06:38:41 AM »
The only time I use paper checks is for sports teams, which require reimbursement to the captain/sponsor (US is behind on this one and I don't like paying the PayPal fee).  All bills I have set up with Bill Pay at my bank - either reoccurring for the mortgage or I enter the amount every month to make sure it's right.   All but one I receive electronically.  The hold out only lets you go completely paperless by giving them approval to pull the money from my account, which I don't trust (peripherally work in banking).   It takes 30 seconds and my filing cabinet is much thinner than it would have been pre-internet :-)

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #16 on: March 17, 2014, 08:57:35 AM »
We still use paper checks for our monthly bills, for the reasons skekses posted.  In particular, shortly after we moved into our first house, we got an erroneously eye-poppingly huge (for us) phone bill.  It took AT&T three months to untangle that mess.  Ever since then, we've felt very uncomfortable allowing anyone to automatically extract money from our bank account.  That old saying about "posession is 9/10 of the law" has come in handy--when paying by check, you can dispute any amounts *before* they are removed from your account.

It also forces us to pay attention to the bill each month.  We watched Vonage's cost increase gradually each month to the point where we ditched them for Ooma.  We were painfully aware of how much our broken A/C was costing us until we got it replaced, and much more aware of how our water usage affected our bill.

pipercat

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #17 on: March 17, 2014, 09:13:15 AM »
We autopay everything.  I only write checks for the kids' school activities or other things like that.  There is no fee.  If your credit union charges a fee, go through the actual website of the vendor (i.e. electric company, CC, etc).  I don't think they would be a very competitive place to bank if they charged a fee! 

We've used autopay/electronic billing for so long that I can't even tell you the price of stamps right now!

Prairie Stash

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #18 on: March 17, 2014, 09:22:44 AM »
Paying bills with cheques is a small expense.  5 stamps, envelopes and cheques.  Roughly this should cost $3/month or $36/year. I really am that frugal, I hate sending mail if I can skip the cost.  This cost is the same reason my bank likes sending me electronic statements, they save about $1/statement (at least $12/year per customer).

Paying by electronic, not autopay, is free.  I still need to authorize payments, I just skip licking an envelope.

Autopay is awesome only for regular bills, I agree with you on checking over irregular bills.

I like your current system, it works.  I would just switch to electronic payments (every Saturday).

ZiziPB

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #19 on: March 17, 2014, 10:26:03 AM »
I have my mortgage and HOA set up on autopay (same amount every month, so less of a chance for a problem).  I pay the monthly bills (utilities, credit cards, etc.) through electronic bill pay system from my bank (which is free).  I use paper checks occassionally for one off bills, donations, etc.

cochranjd

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #20 on: March 17, 2014, 11:24:05 AM »
You can auto pay and still stay on top of things.  We have all of our bills that allow free autopay set up to do so and those that don't we have set up on our google calendar that we check daily.

We also use YNAB to track everything and try to avoid going more than 2-3 days without updating our budget's current status.

We still write checks to some smaller organizations (Church, kid's sports, etc.) that don't have an easy way to take our cards or when we're paying friends (for instance, we're going on vacation with some families, so we wrote a check to cover our portion to a friend) and the reason I hate doing that is that you are at their mercy as far as when they cash it.  Obviously, you can write it down and keep track of it like that, but I like to update YNAB and make sure the balances match what the bank is reporting.

In any event, I'd say do what works for you.  At the end of the day, in my opinion financial workflows are similar to working out physically - there are any number of options and differing opinions, but for 99% of people, the best option is "the one you'll do" and if you have a system you are using and it works for you, I wouldn't worry too much.

BlueHouse

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #21 on: March 17, 2014, 11:53:17 AM »
I use Paytrust, which was bought by Intuit a few years ago.  I love the service, but Intuit does a horrible job of marketing IMO.  I pay $8/month for this service, even though banks can do much of the same for free.  BUT I am so uncomfortable with the idea of authorizing my service providers to reach into my bank account.  So Paytrust is a third party that acts independently as a middle-man between me and my bank. 

What am I really paying for?
Auto-pay vs. auto-grab
Keeping my account "hands off" from my vendors. 
Ability to easily move my bank account without having to change every bit of vendor information linked to it.  I can move my bank account today and only one change at Paytrust is needed -- to tell it which account to debit. 
Searchable reports of bills and a yearly CD of every bill received over the past year, categorized.
Using a PO box in SD for some of my paper bills -- vendors who do not yet have electronic billing (still a few out there).

I love it and wish more people knew it existed.  I hate that the only options for paying certain things are to relinquish all control over my accounts!

Milspecstache

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #22 on: March 17, 2014, 12:03:00 PM »
I did a lot of paper checks until USPS started losing my mail.  The last straw was a mortgage payment which has never showed up.  After that I avoid sending any checks by mail.  Thankfully the bank allowed me the one mistake without penalty.

Dr.Vibrissae

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #23 on: March 17, 2014, 02:47:09 PM »
I'm not sure, but it seems like there is a little confusion/ambiguity on the terms being used.

When I say autopay I mean an automatic 'pull' withdrawl from my bank account by a third party vendor.  I rarely allow this (except in cases where there is a rate reduction for setting up this payment option eg my student loans).

When I say electronic payment, I mean using the service through my credit union which allows me to set and pay bills at the time of my choosing from my account, without granting third party access.  My CU appears to do both 'push' funds transfers or sending actual checks for vendors that do not accept electronic funds (used to have it set up to send my monthly rent check, just had to put in the address of the company.)  I can set up recurring payments through this system for regular bills (but I do not consider this autopay). 

I still use paper checks for one time donations, fees, reimbursing/paying friends or in stores that give a discount for using cash/check (I rarely carry cash).

Maybe it has to do with the overall low number of bills I have, but I wouldn't pay $8 a month for the service since most banks offer for free, I can pull up all my old paid bills and electronic bills, and the convenience of being able to switch banks with only 1 change of account info doesn't seem worth $96/year; especially since I'm not bank hopping all that often.  But like I said, I have relatively few recurring bills overall, so maybe it would be worth it to others.

BlueHouse

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #24 on: March 17, 2014, 02:58:37 PM »
Maybe it has to do with the overall low number of bills I have, but I wouldn't pay $8 a month for the service since most banks offer for free
Makes me want to review all of my recurring bills.  I seem to have a lot of auto-pays.  Maybe too many. 

Eric

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #25 on: March 17, 2014, 04:15:17 PM »
When I say electronic payment, I mean using the service through my credit union which allows me to set and pay bills at the time of my choosing from my account, without granting third party access.  My CU appears to do both 'push' funds transfers or sending actual checks for vendors that do not accept electronic funds (used to have it set up to send my monthly rent check, just had to put in the address of the company.)  I can set up recurring payments through this system for regular bills (but I do not consider this autopay).

This may have changed in the last 5 years (I doubt it), but I dealt with payments from banks like this for a while at my last job.  The "electronic payments" or bill pay services that your bank offers are really just checks.  We, as the vendor, would receive the checks in the mail, they were just from the bank instead of from you directly.  And here's the problem with this.  The bank deducts that amount from your account right away when it sends the check.  However, you have no way of knowing^ that your payment was actually received.  I dealt with upset customers on a not infrequent basis who claimed they paid but of course we had not received the payment.  Their experience of trying to get confirmation that the payment was sent and the check was cashed was unenviable.  I specifically don't use these programs because of that experience.  Just be aware what you're getting into. 

^No way of proactively knowing anyway, I'm sure once the non-payment notices, cancellations, or late fees start rolling in you'll notice

seattlecyclone

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #26 on: March 17, 2014, 04:33:41 PM »
I have all of my bills set for "pull" autopay, where the bill collector directly charges my credit card or checking account for the full amount of the bill. This way there are no stamps to buy, no need to remember to write a check or schedule a payment each month, and no chance of a payment getting lost in the mail. For the utilities that allow me to charge my bill to a credit card for no extra fee, I get 2% cash back from the credit card for paying that way. I regularly monitor my credit card and bank websites to make sure nobody is charging me more than I expect them to, and it works out well.

pipercat

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #27 on: March 17, 2014, 05:12:19 PM »
I'm not sure, but it seems like there is a little confusion/ambiguity on the terms being used.

When I say autopay I mean an automatic 'pull' withdrawl from my bank account by a third party vendor.  I rarely allow this (except in cases where there is a rate reduction for setting up this payment option eg my student loans).

When I say electronic payment, I mean using the service through my credit union which allows me to set and pay bills at the time of my choosing from my account, without granting third party access.  My CU appears to do both 'push' funds transfers or sending actual checks for vendors that do not accept electronic funds (used to have it set up to send my monthly rent check, just had to put in the address of the company.)  I can set up recurring payments through this system for regular bills (but I do not consider this autopay). 

I still use paper checks for one time donations, fees, reimbursing/paying friends or in stores that give a discount for using cash/check (I rarely carry cash).

Maybe it has to do with the overall low number of bills I have, but I wouldn't pay $8 a month for the service since most banks offer for free, I can pull up all my old paid bills and electronic bills, and the convenience of being able to switch banks with only 1 change of account info doesn't seem worth $96/year; especially since I'm not bank hopping all that often.  But like I said, I have relatively few recurring bills overall, so maybe it would be worth it to others.
I was also a little confused by the terminology of "auto-pay" vs. "electronic payment".  In my mind (whether correct or not), it is essentially the same thing.  I can either set it up so that my bank initiates the payment on my behalf (I have very few of those) OR I can arrange for each individual vendor to remove their payment from my account when it is due.  I refer to both in the same way.  I mostly have the vendors removing the required amounts from my account.

I am aware that there are bill pay services, which are a completely separate entity, but I don't really see the advantage of using them.

The bottom line, though, is that you have to use whatever system you feel most comfortable with.  If it ain't broke, don't fix it!

Threshkin

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2014, 05:28:50 PM »
I use electronic bill pay.  It is virtually the same as writing a check except that I can delay the delivery of a payment, i.e. pay a bill on the first but schedule it to go out on the fifteenth.  This means I do not forget to pay a bill.  I just set up the payment when the bill comes in and schedule it to be sent out a few days before the due date.  This also saves me the cost of stamps and checks.  It has worked flawlessly except once when the bank had a system wide glitch where the bill showed as paid and debited from my account but was never actually sent.  VERY bad but the bank was all over it, notified me, offered to pay any later fees or interest and apologized profusely and repeatedly.  Their response to the issue was so good that I liked them better after it happened, not less.

I do not like autopay at all.  Essentially autopay authorizes your the creditor to take funds from your account without your authorization.  I want to control my own money, not give up control to someone else.  Yes, this means I have to pay my own bills every month but that is easy and if I ever have a payment dispute I keep my money and decide when or how much to pay.  Much better than asking for money back IMO.

If I have to travel for an extended time, I just schedule the recurring payments in advance.  For variable payments like credit cards or utilities, just check the amount due in Mint or the vendor's website.

I rarely use checks but keep some around for the rare situation where a check is better than cash and a CC is not an option.

I like the suggestion about using a CC to pay the bill to get mileage.  I will investigate that.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2014, 05:31:10 PM by Threshkin »

Nothlit

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2014, 05:33:24 PM »
This may have changed in the last 5 years (I doubt it), but I dealt with payments from banks like this for a while at my last job.  The "electronic payments" or bill pay services that your bank offers are really just checks.  We, as the vendor, would receive the checks in the mail, they were just from the bank instead of from you directly.  And here's the problem with this.  The bank deducts that amount from your account right away when it sends the check.  However, you have no way of knowing^ that your payment was actually received.  I dealt with upset customers on a not infrequent basis who claimed they paid but of course we had not received the payment.  Their experience of trying to get confirmation that the payment was sent and the check was cashed was unenviable.  I specifically don't use these programs because of that experience.  Just be aware what you're getting into. 

^No way of proactively knowing anyway, I'm sure once the non-payment notices, cancellations, or late fees start rolling in you'll notice

This depends on the bank and the recipient. Some banks can send funds electronically to certain recipients, especially if the recipient is a big-name nationwide company. However, when that fails, they do mail a check instead. But even that behavior varies. One of my credit unions does as you say: they debit my account and then mail a check drawn on the bank's account. I have to dig through their web interface to find out whether the check has cleared.

My other credit union mails a check printed with my account number at the bottom (and my address at the top), so the funds don't actually get withdrawn from my account until the recipient deposits it.

MKinVA

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #30 on: March 17, 2014, 05:51:25 PM »
I use electronic pay through my bank for free. Meaning I go onto bank website and pay my bills, setting the date from them to send the money. Some vendors accept an electronic transfer(so that's what the bank does) and some only accept a check( so the bank sends them a check). I would love to use my credit card to get the 1.5% cash back, but only a few of my accounts take a credit card without charging a 1 to 2 % fee. It really makes me mad that the power company should charge that much just to receive a bill. I mean they no longer have those teller windows where you could pay in person, but 1% per transaction? That's robbery.
« Last Edit: March 17, 2014, 05:53:09 PM by MKinVA »

DaveSch

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #31 on: March 17, 2014, 07:32:42 PM »
I've used Autopay to pay my combined electric/gas bill for over 30 years. I while back I estimated the savings in just postage and it was around $150. I was never late paying a bill as they took the money out on the day before it would be past due.  I have one other bill on Autopay and the rest are done via credit card. I only have to write 6 checks per year.

Dave

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #32 on: March 17, 2014, 07:45:21 PM »
I didn't know people even still used cheques! Do places even still accept them?

The United States is a decade or more behind Europe, Australia, and the rest of the world when it comes to banking technology. Checks are declining in usage, but still common here. Most stores, business, etc. still accept them. There is no universal way to electronically send money to just anyone in the U.S. Yes, many entities (mostly utility companies, charities, and other places where you have an account that you pay on a regular basis) have the ability to do an electronic funds transfer (typically a "pull" rather than a "push"), but even that takes 1-3 business days. If I wanted to send money electronically to a friend or family member, I'd need to use a third-party service like PayPal or Square Cash.

Wow. That's incredible.  I have a chequebook, but I've used it maybe 3 times in the last 12 months.  Electronic funds transfer is seamless and beautiful :) 

My advice is to check your bank fees and weigh up how much it is costing you (including envelopes and postage to anywhere without a freepost).

For us, anything that the bank deems to be a 'manual' transaction has fees up the wazoo - cheques and teller transactions are costly, whereas anything electronic is cheaper.

Cheapest for us is to pay as much as possible on the credit card (no transaction fees) and pay the card off in full monthly via a 'pull' direct debit authority arrangement.

Metta

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #33 on: March 21, 2014, 07:26:43 AM »
Thanks everyone! This has been a really useful discussion for us. I'm impressed with how many people are using electronic bill paying.

I've been to the Credit Union and spoken to someone there. Apparently as long as we're ok with electronic statements (we are), the e-bill pay is free. So we're going to step into the 21st century. (Though we've propped open the door of the time machine just in case we need to flee back to 1973.) Our plan is to put recurring bills that are fairly constant on the credit card, pay the credit cards with e-bill pay and lose our dependence upon stamps and paper checks.

TomTX

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #34 on: March 22, 2014, 04:42:43 PM »
I have all of my bills set for "pull" autopay, where the bill collector directly charges my credit card or checking account for the full amount of the bill. This way there are no stamps to buy, no need to remember to write a check or schedule a payment each month, and no chance of a payment getting lost in the mail. For the utilities that allow me to charge my bill to a credit card for no extra fee, I get 2% cash back from the credit card for paying that way. I regularly monitor my credit card and bank websites to make sure nobody is charging me more than I expect them to, and it works out well.

" or checking account" is the point where I go "Oh, FUCK no!"

No vendor gets pull access to my bank accounts.  All it takes is a one-digit slip on their end, and your accounts are drained - and you can't pay your bills while it is being straightened out. HUGE hassle. Some companies (cable comes to mind) are notorious for continuing to charge for months (or years!) after you ended your service.

If they want to pull, they can hit the credit card and pay me 1.5% - and if they fuck up the amount, I dispute it. The hassle for me is minimal.

Otherwise - yep, almost everything we do is electronic. Schedule outgoing payments to the credit cards monthly, review utilities on the credit card statement, et cetera.

We do a paper check once a year - for property taxes.

annann

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #35 on: March 22, 2014, 05:07:43 PM »
When I say electronic payment, I mean using the service through my credit union which allows me to set and pay bills at the time of my choosing from my account, without granting third party access.  My CU appears to do both 'push' funds transfers or sending actual checks for vendors that do not accept electronic funds (used to have it set up to send my monthly rent check, just had to put in the address of the company.)  I can set up recurring payments through this system for regular bills (but I do not consider this autopay).

This may have changed in the last 5 years (I doubt it), but I dealt with payments from banks like this for a while at my last job.  The "electronic payments" or bill pay services that your bank offers are really just checks.  We, as the vendor, would receive the checks in the mail, they were just from the bank instead of from you directly.  And here's the problem with this.  The bank deducts that amount from your account right away when it sends the check.  However, you have no way of knowing^ that your payment was actually received.  I dealt with upset customers on a not infrequent basis who claimed they paid but of course we had not received the payment.  Their experience of trying to get confirmation that the payment was sent and the check was cashed was unenviable.  I specifically don't use these programs because of that experience.  Just be aware what you're getting into. 

^No way of proactively knowing anyway, I'm sure once the non-payment notices, cancellations, or late fees start rolling in you'll notice

I use NFCU and the money DOES NOT come out of my account until the company actually receives the money.  This is nearly immediately for fund transfers and sometimes nearly 2 weeks for my water bill.

lbdance

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Re: Paper Checks vs Autopay vs Electronic Bill Pay
« Reply #36 on: March 22, 2014, 05:23:25 PM »
I didn't know people even still used cheques! Do places even still accept them?

The United States is a decade or more behind Europe, Australia, and the rest of the world when it comes to banking technology. Checks are declining in usage, but still common here. Most stores, business, etc. still accept them. There is no universal way to electronically send money to just anyone in the U.S. Yes, many entities (mostly utility companies, charities, and other places where you have an account that you pay on a regular basis) have the ability to do an electronic funds transfer (typically a "pull" rather than a "push"), but even that takes 1-3 business days. If I wanted to send money electronically to a friend or family member, I'd need to use a third-party service like PayPal or Square Cash.

Wow. That's incredible.  I have a chequebook, but I've used it maybe 3 times in the last 12 months.  Electronic funds transfer is seamless and beautiful :) 

My advice is to check your bank fees and weigh up how much it is costing you (including envelopes and postage to anywhere without a freepost).

For us, anything that the bank deems to be a 'manual' transaction has fees up the wazoo - cheques and teller transactions are costly, whereas anything electronic is cheaper.

Cheapest for us is to pay as much as possible on the credit card (no transaction fees) and pay the card off in full monthly via a 'pull' direct debit authority arrangement.

In NZ also, the last time I used a cheque was in June 2011 to pay for a conference with a charity organisation. Every thing is electronic here, esp when as mentioned above the fees for doing it otherwise are exorbitant. There are good systems here though where if you dispute a bill it doesn't automatically get paid etc.