Author Topic: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?  (Read 29930 times)

Dee18

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #50 on: September 05, 2013, 10:26:18 AM »
Mark B,
You might enjoy reading "How Starbucks Saved My Life" by Michael Gill.  He faced some of the same issues:  job loss and divorce at middle age.  Although not in that situation myself, I found the book inspiring and it made me approach my job (where I have been many years and about which I was a bit jaded) with new energy.

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #51 on: September 05, 2013, 01:53:38 PM »
Mark B,
You might enjoy reading "How Starbucks Saved My Life" by Michael Gill.  He faced some of the same issues:  job loss and divorce at middle age.  Although not in that situation myself, I found the book inspiring and it made me approach my job (where I have been many years and about which I was a bit jaded) with new energy.

Thanks Dee18, I'll definitely check this out (from the library, LOL). 

Just reading the synopsis, I can relate to this book, or at least relate to the fact that I have a ways to go before I get to the "joy and gratitude" stage. 

DoubleDown

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #52 on: September 05, 2013, 01:55:12 PM »
@Mark B - As much as it stinks having to re-enter the workforce, I think your plan is good to brush up on your skills and seek the highest paying position you can land, at least for a while. This will have two important benefits: It will give you the highest income possible, and it will also lay the groundwork for a potential reduction in alimony if appropriate. If you find a position paying as much or more than you used to make -- excellent! If you cannot find a position making that much (and please carefully document EVERYTHING you do to find another job) then you have all the evidence you need to support a reduction in your alimony payment. I agree that it could be difficult to get a reduction at this point, not until you have done something to regain your prior earning level, and day trading will not likely be viewed by the courts as a viable attempt. I paid alimony as well (though nowhere near as long as you but a much higher amount), and it sucks. Because of the iniquities in the system, after paying alimony to my ex, I literally was left with $100/month to support myself and two school-age daughters for three years.

YMMV, but I would not consult with a new divorce attorney until you have exhausted the job search and obtained the best salary you can get. Then you can go for a reduction with all the new circumstances at once, because as you likely know, you can't waltz into the court every time there's a minor change here and there. Make your next attempt count, you may not get another one. And if you are unable to command a high salary as before, your ex may be more willing to negotiate a reasonable settlement than you relying simply on trying to prove she's funneling money elsewhere. Her attorney will recognize you have a strong case that you have done everything you can to maximize your salary, and will counsel her as such. Also I would expect to impute a reasonable income to her, as everyone needs something to live. If she claims she has zero earnings, that should fall apart pretty easily.

Definitely do the math on the rent vs. keeping your house scenarios. If I'm understanding your expenses correctly, your out-of-pocket mortgage payment (after renters have offset some of it) is $1400-1500/month. Add in any additional insurance/maintenance/taxes/etc. costs, subtract any tax breaks from writing off interest and taxes, and determine if you could find a better alternative renting with your dogs. It may not be possible in SoCal, so maybe that will give you some comfort knowing the house may not be such a bad alternative after all. And of course you stand to gain from the increases the housing market right now and hopefully in the future, particularly in SoCal.

You've already heard it from others -- I'll pile on and say that day trading should be nowhere on your radar until you have enough money you would feel comfortable putting in a bag and setting it on fire. Stick to prudent investing. Then when you've accrued $1 million, decide if you want to venture back into day trading. As already pointed out, it worked for you -- until it didn't.

Good luck, keep us posted (maybe we should start a separate thread and not hijack this one for future updates)!

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #53 on: September 05, 2013, 02:16:52 PM »
About the trading--I know most of you have no experience with it, and looking at it from the outside it looks like gambling, but really it's not.  Yes, like gambling, you can lose money.  But you can also lose money, or not make any money by starting a business.  Is that gambling?

For the purpose of this exercise: Sure.  They're both gambling.   They're gambling in the sense they both have a very high risk/reward ratio.  And if I understand your situation: it sounds like you really don't have the cash to risk either.

In general, there are a ton of experienced day traders out there that are 100% convinced that they can time the market properly... up until the point that they cannot.

If you are going to do this: do it with money you can afford to lose.  Don't rely on this as your sole investment income.  Do it with the philosophy that you're 100% sure you are going to lose every penny and that you have enough money to cover if that is the case.  Don't do it on margin.

If you make money: awesome.  Take a good percentage off the table and move it into a lower risk vehicle like an index fund and try again -- still with the idea that you will lose it all.

Thanks for the input Spork. 

I tell you what, I'll post my daily trading results here, so you all can see me dig out of my hole, implode, or (???).  Starting yesterday, the first day of my new plan (Monday was a holiday and didn't trade Tuesday):

9/4/13:  +$336 (not sure how many trades, probaby 4-6)
9/5/13:  +$492 (five trades)

My daily goal is three tiered:  If I make less than $400, my day was a failure as I figure I need to make $100k/yr. to get by with a small cushion.  I shoot for $500/day, though, unless it's difficult day.  If the conditions are great, like today, I'll stop at the trade that gets me past $600.  I actually should have been trading instead of writing this post, conditions were very favorable today, but I just wanted to book a couple days in a row of profit.

I'll be honest about posting the losers, too.  Funny, posting my situation has been pretty cathartic.  I feel like my head is screwed on a little more securely today.  So, I'm thinking you guys will be surprised at my results.

The other parts of my plan are still on the table, of course.  BTW, the realtor who did the short sale of my "investment" property contacted me just this morning about selling my house.  I literally get about one realtor every other day contacting me asking if I want to sell it.  Not that it's so nice, it's just in that sweet spot for southern California homes--the $475k - $599k range, which around here are considered moderately priced.  Isn't that sick?  A $450k home is pretty much a starter around here.

DoubleDown

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #54 on: September 05, 2013, 02:58:56 PM »

I tell you what, I'll post my daily trading results here, so you all can see me dig out of my hole, implode, or (???).  Starting yesterday, the first day of my new plan (Monday was a holiday and didn't trade Tuesday):

9/4/13:  +$336 (not sure how many trades, probaby 4-6)
9/5/13:  +$492 (five trades)

My daily goal is three tiered:  If I make less than $400, my day was a failure as I figure I need to make $100k/yr. to get by with a small cushion.  I shoot for $500/day, though, unless it's difficult day.  If the conditions are great, like today, I'll stop at the trade that gets me past $600.  I actually should have been trading instead of writing this post, conditions were very favorable today, but I just wanted to book a couple days in a row of profit.


I don't want to get in a pissing match, because I definitely want you to succeed! I'll go ahead and ask, and hope you'll believe me that I am doing so in the spirit of trying to help and only with hoping your situation will get better no matter what -

1. What did you have to risk to get those gains (i.e., how much capital was at stake)?
2. What would your capital have earned just sitting in an index fund?

For comparison, I looked up my 401k values yesterday vs. the day before (yesterday's balance is the most recent available). Even though it's split 50/50 between indexed stocks and super-safe bonds/securities, it went up $1300 in that one day. Plus by being at work (not spending my time doing trades), I earned $600 yesterday. I didn't even look at non-401k investments, which also all went up with the rising markets yesterday, probably another $1000 - 2000. So all told, I earned somewhere around $3000 - 4000 yesterday with very little risk, and with the payroll earnings guaranteed.

Is averaging $500-600 a day in gains really sustainable and worth all that risk and volatility and emotional turmoil? What about the losses?

Spork

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #55 on: September 05, 2013, 03:15:48 PM »

I tell you what, I'll post my daily trading results here, so you all can see me dig out of my hole, implode, or (???).  Starting yesterday, the first day of my new plan (Monday was a holiday and didn't trade Tuesday):

9/4/13:  +$336 (not sure how many trades, probaby 4-6)
9/5/13:  +$492 (five trades)

My daily goal is three tiered:  If I make less than $400, my day was a failure as I figure I need to make $100k/yr. to get by with a small cushion.  I shoot for $500/day, though, unless it's difficult day.  If the conditions are great, like today, I'll stop at the trade that gets me past $600.  I actually should have been trading instead of writing this post, conditions were very favorable today, but I just wanted to book a couple days in a row of profit.


I don't want to get in a pissing match, because I definitely want you to succeed! I'll go ahead and ask, and hope you'll believe me that I am doing so in the spirit of trying to help and only with hoping your situation will get better no matter what -

1. What did you have to risk to get those gains (i.e., how much capital was at stake)?
2. What would your capital have earned just sitting in an index fund?

For comparison, I looked up my 401k values yesterday vs. the day before (yesterday's balance is the most recent available). Even though it's split 50/50 between indexed stocks and super-safe bonds/securities, it went up $1300 in that one day. Plus by being at work (not spending my time doing trades), I earned $600 yesterday. I didn't even look at non-401k investments, which also all went up with the rising markets yesterday, probably another $1000 - 2000. So all told, I earned somewhere around $3000 - 4000 yesterday with very little risk, and with the payroll earnings guaranteed.

Is averaging $500-600 a day in gains really sustainable and worth all that risk and volatility and emotional turmoil? What about the losses?

I don't really want to argue your position here (because I really agree with you: I think you're much better off not trying to time the market).

...but: you're stating unrealized gains.  He's stating realized gains.  You're not really up $4000 until you sell.  This is a good thing, because that also means you're not down $10,000 on one of those days where the market wets it's pants.  (And he is.)

Argyle

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #56 on: September 05, 2013, 03:38:43 PM »
There are two things about the day trading. 

The first is: not what are your gains per day, but what is your day-trading profit per year?  And per five-year period?  Are you actually making a sizeable profit over time?  I mean actual money in the bank, not theoretical returns.  If day trading is genuinely profitable, I don't understand why you're in the hole -- ?

The second thing is: how much money do you invest in day trading, which is to say, what amount of money could you lose?  Because the risk is there.  I wonder if you can afford to risk any money.  It sounds to me as if you're operating on the brink of solvency as it is.

I'd suggest that relying on day trading to make an income is indicative of a style of reckless decision-making which has gotten you into this situation in the first place.   Sure, your situation could be everyone else's fault and none of yours.  That sometimes happens.  But usually most of us contribute something of our own to the mix.

That's the face-punch part. 

pbkmaine

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #57 on: September 05, 2013, 04:58:55 PM »
+1 Argyle

I have been in finance for 33 years, and don't know any small investor who has been successful at day trading over the long term.  I do, however, know many, many broke people who day traded and will now be able to retire when hell freezes over.  When I think of the most successful active investors - Warren Buffett, Benjamin Graham, Joel Tillinghast of Fidelity Low-Priced Stock, Peter Lynch of Fidelity Magellan - they have been buy and hold, for the most part.  The few super active traders like Bill Gross of PIMCO have large research staffs, and sometimes get it very wrong anyway.  David Swensen of the Yale Endowment says that individual investors can't duplicate what his large staff does and says to buy index funds. My company advises on $35 billion in defined contribution funds.  What do the most experienced investment consultants in my firm hold? Index funds. Day to day, the financial markets are influenced by all kinds of events completely unrelated to intrinsic value. Over the long term, things tend to even out, but on any given day, it's the Wild West out there.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2013, 05:23:05 PM by pbkmaine »

Roland of Gilead

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #58 on: September 05, 2013, 05:04:29 PM »
I have done a little trading and been lucky with it, but not the day trading.  Well, my trading account was recently classified as a day trading account with a minimum requirement of $25,000...I still don't consider myself a "day trader".

I do maybe 5 to 10 trades a month.  Sometimes I will do 5 trades in a day, then no trades for weeks.  I think they may call this swing trading.

A recent example, I bought 15 Jan 2014 $38 VWO call options last week for $1.60 when it was trading at $37.20.  I thus had $2400 at risk.  (btw, this trade ticked me off because the low volumes meant I had to pay the exact ask price...but I wanted this emerging market fund for certain reasons).

Yesterday I sold 10 of them for $2.10 and today I sold Jan 2014 $40 call options against the other 5 for $1.40.  Thus I  now have $2800 in cash (minus about $20 in commissions) and I have a $38 $40 call spread expiring in Jan 2014 that could be worth another $1000 if it expires in the money.   $400 for three trades, with $2400 at risk, plus I have a free spread that is worth $550 right now and may be worth $1000 in a few months.

I wouldn't call this day trading...day traders to me are people who close out their position each night, or at least each week.

edit:  I have had this account for 10 years, and I started it with $3000 (a Roth IRA).   It is worth a tad over $65,000 today.  I do it for fun though, not for living expenses.   It was very volatile early on, but I have enough cash now that I can limit each trade to no more than 5% of the portfolio.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2013, 05:07:34 PM by Roland of Gilead »

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #59 on: September 05, 2013, 05:26:28 PM »
I have done a little trading and been lucky with it, but not the day trading.  Well, my trading account was recently classified as a day trading account with a minimum requirement of $25,000...I still don't consider myself a "day trader".

I do maybe 5 to 10 trades a month.  Sometimes I will do 5 trades in a day, then no trades for weeks.  I think they may call this swing trading.

A recent example, I bought 15 Jan 2014 $38 VWO call options last week for $1.60 when it was trading at $37.20.  I thus had $2400 at risk.  (btw, this trade ticked me off because the low volumes meant I had to pay the exact ask price...but I wanted this emerging market fund for certain reasons).

Yesterday I sold 10 of them for $2.10 and today I sold Jan 2014 $40 call options against the other 5 for $1.40.  Thus I  now have $2800 in cash (minus about $20 in commissions) and I have a $38 $40 call spread expiring in Jan 2014 that could be worth another $1000 if it expires in the money.   $400 for three trades, with $2400 at risk, plus I have a free spread that is worth $550 right now and may be worth $1000 in a few months.

I wouldn't call this day trading...day traders to me are people who close out their position each night, or at least each week.

edit:  I have had this account for 10 years, and I started it with $3000 (a Roth IRA).   It is worth a tad over $65,000 today.  I do it for fun though, not for living expenses.   It was very volatile early on, but I have enough cash now that I can limit each trade to no more than 5% of the portfolio.

Roland (I love the Roland of Gilead books, BTW),

If you buy, then sell a stock or option within the same day four or more times in a five day period, then you'll be identified as a pattern day trader.  I didn't realize this includes options, but I guess so.

I know that sounds confusing, let me try to clarify: 

Monday:  Bought Microsoft.  Sold it the same day.
Tuesday:  Bought IBM.  Sold it the same day.
Wednesday:  Bought Intel.  Sold it the same day.

In this scenario, you can't buy and sell another stock within the same day until the following Monday.  It wouldn't matter if you bought/sold them all on Monday, or if you bought/sold one on Monday and the other two on Thursday.  Once you buy and sell the same stock in the same day, that's your first day trade, and the clock starts ticking from there.  And, it's a rolling five day period, which makes it more complicated and frustrating.

This rule wouldn't apply if you bought these stocks one day and sold them the next.  You can do all of that you want.

Roland of Gilead

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #60 on: September 05, 2013, 05:43:37 PM »
Right, thanks Mark.

I was confused in my post.  I did get the $25,000 minimum balance requirement notification of pattern day trading but that was in a taxable account.  My Roth account is a cash account (I don't think you can have margin in a IRA) so the pattern day trading rules don't apply. 

I should really try hard not to day trade for 3 months in my taxable account so I can get unclassified as a pattern day trader there.  If the market would just stop being so crazy volatile, then I wouldn't be doing things like buying VGT in the morning for $78, selling it midday for $78.90, then rebuying it near close for $78.10.  (I think that is one of the trades that caught me).

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #61 on: September 05, 2013, 05:59:38 PM »
There are two things about the day trading. 

The first is: not what are your gains per day, but what is your day-trading profit per year?  And per five-year period?  Are you actually making a sizeable profit over time?  I mean actual money in the bank, not theoretical returns.  If day trading is genuinely profitable, I don't understand why you're in the hole -- ?

The second thing is: how much money do you invest in day trading, which is to say, what amount of money could you lose?  Because the risk is there.  I wonder if you can afford to risk any money.  It sounds to me as if you're operating on the brink of solvency as it is.

I'd suggest that relying on day trading to make an income is indicative of a style of reckless decision-making which has gotten you into this situation in the first place.   Sure, your situation could be everyone else's fault and none of yours.  That sometimes happens.  But usually most of us contribute something of our own to the mix.

That's the face-punch part.

I am up about 400% year over year.  I'm just not up 720% like I was.  As I said in my last post, trading futures is not the same as trading stocks.  There is no amount of shares that you buy.  It's more like an agreement to buy at a certain price. 

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #62 on: September 05, 2013, 06:00:54 PM »
There are two things about the day trading. 

The first is: not what are your gains per day, but what is your day-trading profit per year?  And per five-year period?  Are you actually making a sizeable profit over time?  I mean actual money in the bank, not theoretical returns.  If day trading is genuinely profitable, I don't understand why you're in the hole -- ?

The second thing is: how much money do you invest in day trading, which is to say, what amount of money could you lose?  Because the risk is there.  I wonder if you can afford to risk any money.  It sounds to me as if you're operating on the brink of solvency as it is.

I'd suggest that relying on day trading to make an income is indicative of a style of reckless decision-making which has gotten you into this situation in the first place.   Sure, your situation could be everyone else's fault and none of yours.  That sometimes happens.  But usually most of us contribute something of our own to the mix.

That's the face-punch part.

Sorry, 490%.

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #63 on: September 05, 2013, 06:27:08 PM »
   Sure, your situation could be everyone else's fault and none of yours.  That sometimes happens.  But usually most of us contribute something of our own to the mix.

I've never blamed anyone for any of this. 

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #64 on: September 05, 2013, 06:45:43 PM »
There are two things about the day trading. 

The first is: not what are your gains per day, but what is your day-trading profit per year?  And per five-year period?  Are you actually making a sizeable profit over time?  I mean actual money in the bank, not theoretical returns.  If day trading is genuinely profitable, I don't understand why you're in the hole -- ?

The second thing is: how much money do you invest in day trading, which is to say, what amount of money could you lose?  Because the risk is there.  I wonder if you can afford to risk any money.  It sounds to me as if you're operating on the brink of solvency as it is.

I'd suggest that relying on day trading to make an income is indicative of a style of reckless decision-making which has gotten you into this situation in the first place.   Sure, your situation could be everyone else's fault and none of yours.  That sometimes happens.  But usually most of us contribute something of our own to the mix.

That's the face-punch part.

I am up about 400% year over year.  I'm just not up 720% like I was.  As I said in my last post, trading futures is not the same as trading stocks.  There is no amount of shares that you buy.  It's more like an agreement to buy at a certain price.

One last figure correction--forgot to subtract my initial principal from my high figure when I did the calculation in Excel, so at my high point I was up 620%, not 720%, from a little under 10k to a little over 70k in about 10 months.  For a long time I went weeks without a single losing trade.  Sorry, not used to being called names so my figures were a little hasty.  The 490% current figure is about right.  And yes, it's true. 

Let's pretend I don't day trade--I've already mentioned that I'm looking for a regular gig.  I opened up my life to a group of strangers to get feedback about how to best position myself for the rest of my life, so if anyone has any constructive, non-name calling, non-judgmental feedback I'm all ears. 

Roland of Gilead

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #65 on: September 05, 2013, 07:19:57 PM »
You say Network engineer...do you know C#?  My wife here in Seattle makes an obscene amount a year as a software engineer and there are several firms hiring.  She could be making a lot more if she were willing to play the games, be useless and get into management.  She likes being productive though and so is stuck at the highest level a developer can get.

She has a few male friends who are your age and get contract work or go full time.  For some reason there are still very few female developers.

$1800 a month in alimony though...ouch.   We don't even spend that much money as a couple per month.

Mark B

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #66 on: September 05, 2013, 08:27:35 PM »
You say Network engineer...do you know C#?  My wife here in Seattle makes an obscene amount a year as a software engineer and there are several firms hiring.  She could be making a lot more if she were willing to play the games, be useless and get into management.  She likes being productive though and so is stuck at the highest level a developer can get.

She has a few male friends who are your age and get contract work or go full time.  For some reason there are still very few female developers.

$1800 a month in alimony though...ouch.   We don't even spend that much money as a couple per month.

Thanks for the idea Roland, but nope, I'm a Cisco switch and router guy.

smedleyb

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #67 on: September 05, 2013, 08:37:32 PM »
1. Start upgrading my skills by studying for some industry certifications.
2. Start looking for a job (f*ck!).
3. Continue to trade every morning.
4. The house...I had wanted take advantage of the rising market for a little while longer while also paying down the mortage a bit, but I guess I should sell it.  It's gonna take me a little while to be able to pull the trigger on this one though, I've been in this house for a long time.
5. Do a consultation with another divorce attorney.

Good list, but I would avoid 3 for now.  Not gonna take ya where you need to go emotionally and financially, just reading between the lines. 

worms

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #68 on: September 06, 2013, 01:03:14 PM »
Psychomoustache, a couple of thoughts...

I presume that your turnover for each year that is being investigated is above the French VAT threshold, which is currently about €32k per year?

I also hope that you are maximising the amount that is put through the business books and deducting all the input VAT?  Keeping things all decent and above board, you might still be able to justify quite a lot of things as business expenses that would otherwise be paid out of domestic expenditure.  For example your, son could be doing your books for you, hence his need for the VAT deductible laptop and phone that you lend him while he is away at college...

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #69 on: September 07, 2013, 09:09:00 AM »
neat thought, Worms : )
Well, my son needed some school stuff, so that of course was also needed in my business.

Yes, last year my business grossed 45K-ish euros, and the years prior were well over the 32K-ish threshold as well...
have a patient coming, will be back in a bit

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #70 on: September 07, 2013, 09:57:13 AM »
so yeah... with my type of business I have very few VAT-deductible expenses. Practically none, to be honest, aside from some office supplies or occasional meals. Other businesses (as you must know) like building supply companies etc. come out way ahead - or beauty salons, etc.

And yes we keep very careful books.

The latest is the following - my accountant thinks we can get by (and take the risk) of just NOT paying the VAT for the next few years while I go back to school and get the psychologist title in France. I put the VAT aside in my accounts all the same, but he feels that in spite of the risk, we might as well not wake up the dragon (who could ask me for 10K Euros in back tax !) So, we are going that route for now, even given the risk. I am small potatoes, so I think I'll be okay, and if I'm not, well there will be some penalties - on the other hand I'm showing good faith in going back to school.

Voilà - I had forgotten about this thread (that I started !) now I have to go back and read it  ; ) !
« Last Edit: September 07, 2013, 01:14:49 PM by psychomoustache »

Peony

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #71 on: September 07, 2013, 12:28:01 PM »
Mark B, I think you should start a journal or a thread about your situation. You will no doubt get some serious feedback about day trading (sorry), but also encouragement and useful suggestions crowdsourced from the MMM community, some of whom may have knowledge of California divorce laws as well as your occupation(s). Your case is pretty unusual and I, for one, am very curious to know how it turns out over time. I would like to see you prevail in getting out from under these obligations; your vision of your "coworkers finding my 76 year old body in my worker bee cubicle, slumped over my computer" is just a bit too vivid for comfort! I, too, hated-hated-hated my time in the corporate world, so I can relate.

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #72 on: September 07, 2013, 12:49:45 PM »
Psychomoustache, one thing that jumps out at me is the 600 euros you pay for your office. Isn't it possible for you to have your office--yes, including the room where you see clients--in your own house? Especially since your house is larger than you need, and is also located in such a convenient area--I assume if it's convenient for you to get from home to shopping/town, it's probably also convenient for others to get to your house.

Perhaps some rearranging of furniture and/or minor renovations might be necessary to make this workable, but especially since your children are in school and your husband works--in other words if I understand correctly the house is empty much of the day--couldn't you save a lot of money (600 euros/month, to be exact) by seeing your clients there? Such an arrangement is permitted even in the US, which has much more draconian zoning laws than France does.

As for US taxes, I remember having to file when I lived in France, and not paying because (you are correct) they don't double-tax. There is an amount of income--not gross income--that is excluded every year, in other words if you make less than that amount (which these days is around $90,000) there is not even a possibility that you would owe any US income tax. And if you make more than that, then the taxes paid in France would be credited against any tax you could theoretically owe in the US, so you're once again generally not going to owe anything. This is a very simplistic sketch but hopefully it will help reassure you somewhat.

Hi

My office rent costs about 450 euros a month... 600 (I didn't look at my numbers again) includes maybe electricity, and phone, etc.

So - as far as seeing people in my house... I did that for four years. It was hard (noise an issue when you have three sons and you're trying to do therapy) and we had work done on our house in the meantime which would make doing that now impossible. My practice grew exponentially when I left the house behind. I think I can concentrate better, and it seems a lot more professional.

That being said, maybe in the future we could think about switching the house back to a therapy-friendly professional space - when the kids are much older. But I don't think so - only because our whole downstairs is now one room - it would be very complicated... and probably lower the value of the house. But thank you for your suggestion.

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #73 on: September 07, 2013, 12:59:32 PM »
Don't know if you decided to go back to school or not, but I wanted to suggest perhaps changing professions. Not completely but maybe using your education for a job without those practice restrictions (and maybe more income). What about a life counselor at university? Or general counseling at a retirement community? I'm using counseling in the broadest possible terms, obviously.

Overall, I look at my challenge as traveling down the road. Does this purchase move me toward retirement or hold me back? Look even at the small expenditures. They may not be a lot of money, but saving even a small amount is motivating. I'm spending the entire holiday weekend cleaning out closets, getting rid of stuff (mostly donations and trash). Very liberating and inspiring which prevents me from wanting to bring any more junk into my life.

By the way, I'm 53, two in college, and I pretty good shape to retire in five years (with a pension).

Hey , yes I decided to go back to school : )

The system here is really quite different - much more strict. I am NOT ALLOWED to work in a university or retirement home or anything as a counselor or therapist with my foreign degrees. Luckily here going back to school costs next to nothing (at least comparitively). For example my coming year, the undergrad portion (I have a couple of undergrad classes I MUST take in order to have the title of "psychologist" in France. Just don't ask - it's a freakin' mess) will cost us about 300 to 400€. Yes, for a YEAR of SCHOOL. My eldest son is starting college - and his costs about the same.

I thought about changing professions but the only other thing I'm able to do here is teach English. Been there done that, got the very skimpy T-Shirt (because it's an f-ing GHETTO system that pays NOTHING - unless of course you pass the Specialized English Degree Diploma that Allows you to make money - I am Not Kidding). (Said Diploma is also a Master's degree that takes two years). In any case it would be a hell of a lot more painful to give up the work I love to teach English at this point.

Advice - don't move to France unless you don't mind teaching English for peanuts, or you have an amazing degree not in a specialized (read: health care) field that lets you do whatever you want. Just sayin'.

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #74 on: September 07, 2013, 01:02:58 PM »
Me!  I'm 41 and my husband's 43.  I just discovered MMM a couple weeks ago and have been reading like crazy.  I've never understood money and my husband and I have been tragically bad at managing it.  We have a lonnnnng way to go.  So I don't know about retiring early but at least now retirement at a normal retirement age seems possible.  We haven't really started saving much yet, but I signed up for mint and am tracking where the money goes to make better decisions in the near future.  We decided to sell our financed 2012 minivan (of course!) and my husband even agreed to sell his classic car that I never thought he'd let go. We both bought used bikes and I'm going to be commuting to work on mine.  I want to cry when I think of how wasteful and stupid we've been, but what's done is done.  Better late than never, right?

I realize the original post was from this past winter.  How are things going for you, psycho?

Still very Psycho, Freckles - thank you for asking. If you wish, you can keep up with me in my very Exciting Journal. If you do, I will try to do the same for Your Exciting Journal.   : )

In other news:

I am battling Diet Coke/Coke Zero addiction. It's ODAAT, but I'm better than I was. There should be a place where I could go dry out. Bummer.
Other than that, Mustachianism has truly saved our poor little Psycho-French butts. I am so happy to be here, albeit sometimes not as frequently as I'd like.

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #75 on: September 07, 2013, 01:19:45 PM »
BTW Mark B

I too feel for you - I hope you can start a journal thread where we can follow your progress - nah I don't care that you hijacked this one - it just gets confusing - a few things going on at once - two different conversations... like being at a table where the person next to you is talking to the person on the other side of you. But it's all good, I'm glad you got some good feedback (that I myself couldn't have given you).

And thanks to all the hopeful older souls who are catching up with me.

And YES - we are filing our taxes in the States now. Thank you.

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #76 on: September 07, 2013, 02:28:53 PM »
I found this site at age 40.

I had spent the last few years digging myself out of credit card debt, and was looking for the next goal to focus on to keep me from back sliding.  This forum is one of the few personal finance strategies that appealed to me, because it attacks what I believe is the core issues around why people overspend, and offers a basic philosophy that supports a low consumption lifestyle.  I feel like a lot of personal finance people are just parroting "Stop spending money!", but if there is no analysis of why you are spending and what you can do to fill the gap, the behaviors just creep back in.

It sounds stupid, but just the idea that one can be happier spending less was very alien to me.  I grew up in an extreme high consumption household.  My parents had high paying careers, but bought new luxury cars every few years, and even built new luxury homes at the rate of one every few years. 

So I developed a habit of using money to soothe myself when I was upset, just like they did, and I still struggle with it.  In my 20's I was really bad.  I would stop at the mall after work almost every day and buy something useless.  I ate out 2-4 times per week.  In my 30's when I stayed home with my kids, I also spent money when I was bored.  I also stayed out of work a few years too long, hence the cc debt.  It was never a huge amount, topping out at around $17K.  I went back to work 2 years ago and just finished paying it off, which feels really good.  We have decent retirement funds luckily (the pay yourself first thing was my one saving grace throughout my younger years).   My goal now is to be FI and retire by age 55 or earlier.  I will be done with my mortgage by 2025 or so, and after that, my expenses will go down dramatically. 

I don't think it is ever to late to make a new goal.  I do envy the youngsters on this board who discovered this early enough to be retired by my age.

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #77 on: September 07, 2013, 02:37:01 PM »
Better late than never, golden.

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #78 on: September 07, 2013, 03:33:12 PM »
I just found mmm this summer. I'm 42 and Dh is 44. We are not in a bad financial situation, but we want to improve it to achieve our goals of FI. I have been a mostly SAHM for 19 + years, and will be applying for graduate school spring of 2014. It's funny to me to hear people want to RE, when I am trying to get into my career finally!  Since this summer, we have been optimizing and scaling back our lifestyle. Ive always been a penny pincher, but I've now put that together with more anti-consumerism. I used to buy things because I found a great deal. Now I only buy when we need something. 

My only complaint about his forum, is that 40's is SO old!  I feel like I'm in my twenties and have hope and excitement for he future!  My SIL is getting her PhD at age 56, after years of SAHM. Life isn't over after 40!!
« Last Edit: September 07, 2013, 04:04:53 PM by Crazyfun »

avonlea

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #79 on: September 07, 2013, 03:38:15 PM »
I just found mmm this summer. I'm 42 and Dh is 44. We are not in a bad financial situation, but we want to improve it to achieve our goals of FI. I have been a mostly SAHM for 19 + years, and will be applying for graduate school spring of 2014. It's funny to me to hear people want to RE, when I am trying to get into my career finally!  Since his summer, we have been optimizing and scaling back our lifestyle. Ive always been a penny pincher, but I've now put that together with more anti-consumerism. I used to buy things because I found a great deal. Now I only buy when we need something. 

My only complaint about his forum, is that 40's is SO old!  I feel like I'm in my twenties and have hope and excitement for he future!  My SIL is getting her PhD at age 56, after years of SAHM. Life isn't over after 40!!

+1 
Preach it! :)

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #80 on: September 07, 2013, 03:44:34 PM »
Crazyfun, for me it's inspiring to hear about your mid-50s SIL and her PhD! I am 51 with a rapidly emptying nest and am toying with the idea of an advanced degree, or of learning some completely new skill (like the bane-of-my-existence math which I actually think I might be able to do if I truly apply myself, or coding). It is hard to stay optimistic that it is not too late ... But it isn't, is it?

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #81 on: September 07, 2013, 04:01:28 PM »
I found this site at age 40.

I had spent the last few years digging myself out of credit card debt, and was looking for the next goal to focus on to keep me from back sliding.  This forum is one of the few personal finance strategies that appealed to me, because it attacks what I believe is the core issues around why people overspend, and offers a basic philosophy that supports a low consumption lifestyle.  I feel like a lot of personal finance people are just parroting "Stop spending money!", but if there is no analysis of why you are spending and what you can do to fill the gap, the behaviors just creep back in.

It sounds stupid, but just the idea that one can be happier spending less was very alien to me.  I grew up in an extreme high consumption household.  My parents had high paying careers, but bought new luxury cars every few years, and even built new luxury homes at the rate of one every few years. 

So I developed a habit of using money to soothe myself when I was upset, just like they did, and I still struggle with it.  In my 20's I was really bad.  I would stop at the mall after work almost every day and buy something useless.  I ate out 2-4 times per week.  In my 30's when I stayed home with my kids, I also spent money when I was bored.  I also stayed out of work a few years too long, hence the cc debt.  It was never a huge amount, topping out at around $17K.  I went back to work 2 years ago and just finished paying it off, which feels really good.  We have decent retirement funds luckily (the pay yourself first thing was my one saving grace throughout my younger years).   My goal now is to be FI and retire by age 55 or earlier.  I will be done with my mortgage by 2025 or so, and after that, my expenses will go down dramatically. 

I don't think it is ever to late to make a new goal.  I do envy the youngsters on this board who discovered this early enough to be retired by my age.

Yes, Golden1 , I think what separates MMM from more conventional PF people is the emphasis on low consumerism. 

I really thought I was doing well until I met Mr. Money Mustache. Before I followed the advice of saving 10% and I did do this (thank God) through my 20's , 30's and 40's (am 49 now).  I never had credit card debt but I just spent thoughtlessly on little things which added up over decades of my working life.   These days I am happy spending less.

And I agree, it is never too late to make a new goal or to turn over a new leaf.  My goal is to get a permanent job (I quit my old job a few months ago and have been doing contract work since) and then my next goal is to put a higher percentage of my money into my retirement account.  I hope to be retired in 10 - 11 years at 60 or so. 


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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #82 on: September 07, 2013, 05:47:33 PM »
I really thought I was doing well until I met Mr. Money Mustache.

I'm 40 now and just recently found MMM. I also thought that I was doing really well but the truth is that I've wasted a lot and made some poor big ticket decisions.

I also love the low consumerism lifestyle My happiness has never been dependent on buying stuff although in the past when I got a bonus I just figured spend it on something.

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #83 on: September 07, 2013, 09:11:04 PM »
Mark B, I think you should start a journal or a thread about your situation. You will no doubt get some serious feedback about day trading (sorry), but also encouragement and useful suggestions crowdsourced from the MMM community, some of whom may have knowledge of California divorce laws as well as your occupation(s). Your case is pretty unusual and I, for one, am very curious to know how it turns out over time. I would like to see you prevail in getting out from under these obligations; your vision of your "coworkers finding my 76 year old body in my worker bee cubicle, slumped over my computer" is just a bit too vivid for comfort! I, too, hated-hated-hated my time in the corporate world, so I can relate.

Thanks for the support, Peony.  I think I'll do that.  I'm already making some progress on all of my list items. 

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #84 on: September 08, 2013, 08:03:44 AM »
Wow, I love the PhD at age 56 too.

OK on this forum maybe the 40's are old - but here in France, it's freakin' ancient. People don't attempt new things the way they do in the States in their 40's, or very rarely.

I agree that what makes this board so helpful is the focus on what one *can* do - on the anti-consumerism - on focusing on how lucky most of us are to have as much as we have. I too made a lot of dumb decisions in my 20's, 30's... but soothing myself with money was really an addiction (and can still be tempting)... and I only have today to fix what I can. I kind of like the 12 step philosophy (though I'm not in any programs) for dealing with life and money. I can just do what I can do with this 24 hours. For me -it's staying away from Diet Coke. I kid you not. (and certain tempting sites and places of course)

Gotta start somewhere...

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #85 on: September 08, 2013, 09:45:14 AM »
Me!  I'm 41 and my husband's 43.  I just discovered MMM a couple weeks ago and have been reading like crazy.  I've never understood money and my husband and I have been tragically bad at managing it.  We have a lonnnnng way to go.  So I don't know about retiring early but at least now retirement at a normal retirement age seems possible.  We haven't really started saving much yet, but I signed up for mint and am tracking where the money goes to make better decisions in the near future.  We decided to sell our financed 2012 minivan (of course!) and my husband even agreed to sell his classic car that I never thought he'd let go. We both bought used bikes and I'm going to be commuting to work on mine.  I want to cry when I think of how wasteful and stupid we've been, but what's done is done.  Better late than never, right?

I realize the original post was from this past winter.  How are things going for you, psycho?

Still very Psycho, Freckles - thank you for asking. If you wish, you can keep up with me in my very Exciting Journal. If you do, I will try to do the same for Your Exciting Journal.   : )

In other news:

I am battling Diet Coke/Coke Zero addiction. It's ODAAT, but I'm better than I was. There should be a place where I could go dry out. Bummer.
Other than that, Mustachianism has truly saved our poor little Psycho-French butts. I am so happy to be here, albeit sometimes not as frequently as I'd like.

I will check out your journal, Pscho.  I need to start one of my own.  Time to start putting all my new-found knowledge to work.

I'm working on a sugar addiction, myself.  I've got myself drinking my coffee without sugar now, which was a big step for me.  I'm not drinking soda, but I still struggle to resist treats when offered.  I work at an elementary school so I get offered little treats a lot- chocolates at staff meetings, cookies left in the office by parents, that kind of thing.  Must muster will power!

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #86 on: September 08, 2013, 09:49:24 AM »
I introduced myself upthread--I am 52 and have just recently completely adopted the mustachian lifestyle.  Just this morning, as I was getting some cash out of my wallet for my trip to the coffee shop (I know, but I only spend $3 there, and it gets me out of my house and among people--which is important for a recluse/introvert/shy person like me), I noticed how the cash in my wallet just stays in there these days.  I also have $100 in cash on a shelf in my house, and it just stays there.  I love NOT spending money!  I wish I had reached this mindset waaaaaay back in my 30's.  But not beating myself up about learning late.

pachnik

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #87 on: September 08, 2013, 11:47:35 AM »
I can relate so much to what I am reading on this thread that I just have to chime in again! 

I think the reason those SAHMs who are out getting new careers, PhDs later in life are doing this is because they needed a change/ or a new challenge, however you want to look at it.  They've been caring for their kids for maybe a decade or 2 and now are looking forward to doing something else.  It is the reverse of my situation - a non-parent who has worked for 25 years.   

Durangostash94 - I think exactly the same thing about my wallet too.  For years, I have been taking out $200.00 cash per week for groceries and the crap I used to buy before I got here.  Anyway, no crap buying for the last 4 months and the money just sits in my wallet.  I don't have mid-week trips to the cash machine - even over a long weekend- anymore.  I wish I had come to this mindset 20 years ago too.

Psychomoustache - You are correct in that  following the MMM program as I like to call it is a lot like working a 12-step program, from what i understand about it.  If I screw up, I just pick myself up, and carry on.  One day at a time. 

Maybe we got here later in life than some of these lucky young'uns but we can still learn and improve our lives. 

« Last Edit: September 08, 2013, 01:00:36 PM by pachnik »

avonlea

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #88 on: September 08, 2013, 12:04:33 PM »
I think the reason those SAHMs who are out getting new careers, PhDs later in life are doing this is because they needed a change/ or a new challenge, however you want to look at it.  They've been caring for their kids for maybe a decade or 2 and now are looking forward to doing something else.  It is the reverse of my situation - a non-parent who has worked for 25 years.

Yes, I think you are right.  I have nothing against people choosing ER.  It's a great option to have.  I loved Crazyfun's post because I am a SAHM, and have been since my mid-twenties.  I haven't yet decided what I want to do when my kids grow up--attend grad school, find a job right away, start a small business, etc.--and sometimes that uncertainty makes me a bit anxious.  My husband once told me, "I don't care if you ever work again.  I just want you to be excited about the future.  I want you to look forward to it." (sweet guy, that man o' mine)  I am inspired to hear about women in this situation who are enthusiastically turning over a new leaf. :) 

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #89 on: September 08, 2013, 01:14:13 PM »
I introduced myself upthread--I am 52 and have just recently completely adopted the mustachian lifestyle.  Just this morning, as I was getting some cash out of my wallet for my trip to the coffee shop (I know, but I only spend $3 there, and it gets me out of my house and among people--which is important for a recluse/introvert/shy person like me), I noticed how the cash in my wallet just stays in there these days.  I also have $100 in cash on a shelf in my house, and it just stays there.  I love NOT spending money!  I wish I had reached this mindset waaaaaay back in my 30's.  But not beating myself up about learning late.

I love it...! Don't beat yourself up, we are all still learning. That's what makes life still interesting, n'est-ce-pas?

Today I went out to a flea market with the youngest Psycho (age 11) and found him some 5 euro sneakers, two pairs of pants ( a euro each) and some stuff for Eldest Psycho's college studio (glasses, forks and knives). So no the money didn't stay in the wallet, but gosh I love that kind of shopping...


Yes, I think you are right.  I have nothing against people choosing ER.  It's a great option to have.  I loved Crazyfun's post because I am a SAHM, and have been since my mid-twenties.  I haven't yet decided what I want to do when my kids grow up--attend grad school, find a job right away, start a small business, etc.--and sometimes that uncertainty makes me a bit anxious.  My husband once told me, "I don't care if you ever work again.  I just want you to be excited about the future.  I want you to look forward to it." (sweet guy, that man o' mine)  I am inspired to hear about women in this situation who are enthusiastically turning over a new leaf. :) 

Yeah, your guy is great - I have one like him too -  : )
I for one believe that you gotta keep things fresh and guard against getting too comfy. I so love being all comfy - but I use my mother as a cautionary tale. She loves her comfort so much, and was so afraid to trust herself and try new things, that today she is twice-divorced (married the second time for money) and living off what's left of her nest-egg, (200K)... but what kills me is she spends most of her time in her apartment sitting on the couch with her cat in front of the TV. She's about 50 pounds overweight, always has been, but especially is just scared of challenges - whether they be intellectual or physical. Part of my decision to work - even if I don't "need to" - is to make sure that I do what I need to remain engaged with life.

And as for FIRE vs ER...I'm just aiming for FI. I stopped my career as a therapist for 8 years, moving to France and having babies, and teaching English as a money-making side-show. I picked up doing therapy again because I was so sick of teaching English and didn't see myself doing it for the rest of my life - I really missed what I was trained to do. I didn't expect my practice to take off as well as it did -but so much the better. I don't see myself stopping until I'm pretty old - why would I? I don't have a commute, I don't have a boss....OK I don't make a lot of money right now, but heading back to school for the French psych degree makes it a lot better financially speaking.

There's an article in the Business section of the NY Times on women/gender issues at Harvard Business School, with a link to a video of the commencement speech by a young woman graduate. It's good stuff - about courage, leadership... I think it applies to any of us.

And it makes me think 'thank GOD I never went to Harvard Business School' (nor any other Business School for that matter) - I would have been freakin' miserable. Personally.

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #90 on: September 09, 2013, 12:52:37 PM »
Bonjour avonlea

oops still in French sorry... I think your mom's piano is great. I also kind of exagerated my mom's situation - she *does* try a little to get out... she goes certainly to a lot of movies, but she also  has signed up for classes at the University...

I HAD HUGE news today - I am admitted directly into the second year of the Master's program!! THere were only 15 sure slots for about 100+ people - and I squeaked in at 15th place! Yay me! Going to write it in my journal.

I am therefore soon going to be disgustingly horribly busy, and neglectful of my family (who's supporting me, but still...)

It's amazing and worth it though - I will finally not have to worry about my future financial life in Fuh-fuh France. Y'know. Enough said.

Simple Abundant Living

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #91 on: September 09, 2013, 04:55:59 PM »
Wow, I love the PhD at age 56 too.


You'll like also that she's getting her PhD as a Psychiatric Nurse Practitioner.  She finished her Masters this spring and was accepted to the PhD program.  She wants to counsel children and adolescents.  She'll be great at it!  She was a fabulous mom to six kids and now a fabulous Grandma to 14(at my last count)!!

I love to read about your life as an expat!  I love to watch a HGTV show over here called "House Hunters International", which totally has me romanticizing life outside the US.  It's great to hear a bit about the real side of life abroad.  And as I think about your counseling practice, I like to imagine Chief Inspector Dreyfus (Pink Panther movies) with his eye twitch.  ;)

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #92 on: September 10, 2013, 02:11:39 AM »

I love to read about your life as an expat!  I love to watch a HGTV show over here called "House Hunters International", which totally has me romanticizing life outside the US.  It's great to hear a bit about the real side of life abroad.  And as I think about your counseling practice, I like to imagine Chief Inspector Dreyfus (Pink Panther movies) with his eye twitch.  ;)

YEah my mom is obsessed with that show - she tells me all about the housing prices in Paris, Nantes, Nice... because obviously here I have no access to that information, deprived as I am of that particular reality TV show.

Yeah I try to control the twitch while practicing.... and the Tourette's... ooops sorry the screen is covered in spit now...

(NO OFFENSE TO *real* Tourettes Sufferers Please !)

Simple Abundant Living

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #93 on: September 10, 2013, 07:40:21 AM »
What I meant was I picture you in session with Dreyfus, randomly shouting out "Clouseau!" to see if he gets in a murderous rage! ;)

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #94 on: September 10, 2013, 10:53:24 AM »
I HAD HUGE news today - I am admitted directly into the second year of the Master's program!! THere were only 15 sure slots for about 100+ people - and I squeaked in at 15th place! Yay me! Going to write it in my journal.

Fantastic! Magnifique! Felicitations! That's wonderful!

avonlea

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #95 on: September 10, 2013, 11:27:10 AM »
I HAD HUGE news today - I am admitted directly into the second year of the Master's program!! THere were only 15 sure slots for about 100+ people - and I squeaked in at 15th place! Yay me! Going to write it in my journal.

Fantastic! Magnifique! Felicitations! That's wonderful!

Way to go, Psychomoustache!

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #96 on: September 11, 2013, 01:42:27 AM »
Yeah - someone said to me yesterday "well, one *almost* wants to congratulate you!" This is b/c now things are very complicated. But I don't want to cracher dans la soupe as we say in French ("spit in the soup!" means be ungrateful for something great). Anyway I don't want to complicate this thread with my other business - I like that Over Forty people stop by and say that they are here too.

That's this thread...We are Old, and We are Here. LOL. (I guess...)  : b

Theadyn

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #97 on: September 11, 2013, 06:19:29 AM »
I am 42 and basically starting with nothing. 

The late hubby and I got out of debt a few years back and am still out of debt, except my little mortgage.  He fought cancer for 2 years and lost, and the mess it leaves isn't fun.  So here I am now, still no debt, but nothing in retirement.  It may take me a while longer as my income isn't the huge amounts like others here.  I work part time, good pay per hour, doing a job I love at a place that is a 3 minute walk from my house, and that is okay with me.  Since I am part time, I get no benefits.  So it is up to me to save for retirement myself.  Luckily, my mortgage is small and I live cheap!  It allows me to save every month.  I do have a second part time job that is a few hours here and there, can work more if I need it.  I consider my third job saving money at home, lol.  Hey, if you aren't spending it, then you're saving it, I call that earnings, right?

I've reduced and paired down and have zero interest in the consumerism lifestyle.  This outlook will keep with me years later when achieving FI, as the need for 'stuff' just won't appeal to me.  That means, to me, there won't be a need to invest an obscene amount.  Which is good on my smaller income, lol.   It's all relative, no?  :)   May take me 10 years, but I'm cool with that as right now I'm not working my tail off at a high stress, tons of hours type of high earning job.  Will probably keep working this part time job even after reaching FI, I love helping my patients.

psychomoustache

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Re: anyone over 40 and trying to catch up?
« Reply #98 on: September 11, 2013, 08:05:00 AM »
Wow, Theadyn I'm so sorry for your loss.
What do you do? It sounds a bit like me - I too have a job I love that doesn't make a whole lot, but is close to home and gives me time to pursue other things...
Yeah I think a good perspective is also living in today - not having to postpone the day when one can actually be happy in one's life... that is to day not working in a cubicle is a very good thing, for me. I did it for awhile back in the States - I was working for a managed care company and my job was to approve contracts for people to get psychotherapy. A very inhuman way to deal with a painful human need, IMHO. But that was then... thank goodness.