Author Topic: Anchoring too high in job hunting?  (Read 8414 times)

norabird

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Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« on: March 24, 2016, 11:03:10 AM »
I had a very positive interview Monday and yesterday an HR rep emailed to schedule a call with me and also asked the dreaded 'what is your salary requirement' question. I thought about dodging it but ended up giving a fairly aggressive anchor (15% above the highest salary for the position and company on glassdoor) while stating it was negotiable. Some of the other places I've interviewed do seem to have higher salaries listed on glassdoor, so it's not out of line for the market. I asked for 3/4k more than the averages on Payscale and the BLS. But now there's no response yet about setting up a call. I honestly expect to take less than the number I gave, but want to get the most I can. I know they might be getting internal approval or might have another candidate lined up, but I'm feeling paranoid that I shot myself in the foot. Then again, I don;t know how to fix it! I may drop a quick note to my interviewer tomorrow saying that I look forward to speaking with HR soon once they finalize a time but am at a loss otherwise. I know they need to get someone in the door ASAP so they have an incentive to not let the grass grow...

Any HR types with advice or input?

Tjat

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #1 on: March 24, 2016, 11:15:32 AM »
I would never answer that question with a number. I suggest your response be

I'm not holding myself to a specific figure and in considering your offer, would evaluate the total compensation package, which includes salary, benefits, work environment, career path, etc."

If they continue to press, hold firm with:

"I'm sorry, but I don't think we're at the point yet to name a specific figure. I will say that I've been in the industry for a number of years and have demonstrated strong performance. When considering the salary continuum of this role for this area and across the industry, I would expect that experience to be reflected."



mozar

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #2 on: March 24, 2016, 11:18:37 AM »
I'm not in HR but I've talked to them a lot. If they are interested but they thought you asked for too much they will say so. Another option is they might not have a problem with the amount but then want you to justify it (your sales record is higher than anyone elses in the region for ex.) The best way imo to get more money is to play other companies off eachother i.e. this company offers x can you go higher?
If you really want to email them again, I would wait till Monday.
If anything put them off I would guess it's because you said the salary was negotiable which makes you sound insecure.
Also, what Tjat said has never worked for me.

norabird

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2016, 11:19:52 AM »
Sigh. I did think about evading, it's just hard to avoid the feeling of being rude by not answering a question! Lesson learned I guess. It also hasn't been all that long....but radio silence does not seem good. All of the advice is so conflicting also! I would not at all feel comfortable naming a reach number without expressing that it is negotiable.

mskyle

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2016, 11:38:13 AM »
I think you need to listen to the question carefully and explain yourself - if you say you "require" a salary of $X, to me that means "$X is the minimum I will accept." So if that number is well out of their range, there's no real point in going forward from the company's perspective. I would go for something more like, "I'm looking for something in the range of $X-Y but I would want to see the full compensation package including benefits before I make a final decision."

Also it really depends on the industry/individual company.

Axecleaver

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2016, 11:58:15 AM »
Never answer that question directly with the HR person. Always answer it directly with the hiring manager, especially if he has the courtesy to anchor first (I usually do as the hiring manager). Many places will use HR to negotiate for them. I always hated that, but you have to work with what you get.

At this point, follow up on the regular (1-2x a week) until you get a decision. If you can call the hiring manager directly, do that. HR is the worst. The most likely thing that has happened is that you are being compared to other candidates, with salary requirements being one of those things. Usually, 3-4k is not going to matter, and they'll choose the candidate that the manager liked best. If you're not close, they may be working with someone else first before they come back to you. Salary requirements can, and do, rule people out, so you have to be careful when negotiating for salary.

Tjat's approach is one that the millenials seem to be following, and as a Gen-X'r, it drives me up the wall. I find it indirect and evasive. I don't mind if you want me to go first and name our salary - I will! I even post them in ads sometimes! But once I do that, stop telling me you need more information before you react to the salary I quoted. Just tell me what you want so we can move forward.

NoStacheOhio

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2016, 12:04:05 PM »
Tjat's approach is one that the millenials seem to be following, and as a Gen-X'r, it drives me up the wall. I find it indirect and evasive. I don't mind if you want me to go first and name our salary - I will! I even post them in ads sometimes! But once I do that, stop telling me you need more information before you react to the salary I quoted. Just tell me what you want so we can move forward.

It seems like very few job postings have any sort of compensation information these days. My wife has gone through interviews and ended up with offers that were way, way low for what they wanted and her experience. Sometimes it's difficult trying to determine whether something is worth applying to or not, because they don't give you the slightest hint what the pay range is.

norabird

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2016, 12:15:49 PM »
I so wish there were more standardization in this area. Or I need to become more of a jedi about it. I don't like the word 'requirement' either--but it's their word!

Tjat

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2016, 12:34:18 PM »
Tjat's approach is one that the millenials seem to be following, and as a Gen-X'r, it drives me up the wall. I find it indirect and evasive. I don't mind if you want me to go first and name our salary - I will! I even post them in ads sometimes! But once I do that, stop telling me you need more information before you react to the salary I quoted. Just tell me what you want so we can move forward.

It is evasive. But the whole point of you as a hiring manager asking is to quickly determine if you can offer this person a job for under your authorization budget. How about you come up front with the position and say "This role is a grade X, which has a salary range of A to B." That way, you'll self select the people for which that range is okay.

Crossing your fingers and hoping someone is insecure enough to lowball themselves is not a way to find a quality employee. Job interviews should be relatively open and transparent about the position. Asking this question (especially without providing an anchor) is absurd.

mozar

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2016, 01:27:10 PM »
I think becoming a mind jedi is the best option here. I've also tried saying I make x and I wouldn't leave for less than a 15% raise and that works too. I wish that salary negotiations were fair and open too. But instead of sitting around pining for a better world, I beat them at their own game. If they don't give a salary range, I see it as game on.

DebtFreeBy25

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2016, 02:04:13 PM »
It seems like very few job postings have any sort of compensation information these days. My wife has gone through interviews and ended up with offers that were way, way low for what they wanted and her experience. Sometimes it's difficult trying to determine whether something is worth applying to or not, because they don't give you the slightest hint what the pay range is.

This has been my experience as well. I've been on interviews for positions that require at least a bachelor's degree and five years of experience but only pay $15/hour. Very few employers hiring full-time W-2 employees post their salary range or provide it up-front. The few that do typically state it because their compensation is well below market.

The salary expectation conversation is a game of chicken, and as the employee you don't want to be the first one to give a number. I hate job applications that force the user to enter a number. I've entered "0" in the past to avoid topic; I don't know if that's viewed as better or wrong than entering a figure that's "too high".

Personally I don't even want to discuss numbers until at least the first interview. Why? Sometimes I'll interview for positions that I know are below my experience level. I don't want that specific job; I want to talk to HR and perhaps be put into consideration for a more appropriate role. Sometimes those roles aren't posted, may not have been something I would have found or considered on my own or wouldn't have been viewed as a match based on my application alone. Best case scenario, the employer gives the range or a starting number once they're already interested. If possible, I try to avoid talking numbers until the offer stage. It's much easier to negotiate a higher salary if you're already the chosen candidate.

In reference to the OP's question: If it would have been weird to dodge the question, I would have stated a range with the low end being in line with what the salaries posted on glassdoor. So if the range indicated online is $64,000-73,000, I would have responded with $72,000-80,000. Unfortunately many employers view your number as a requirement and not a negotiation, so if that number's too high they'll stop contacting you. I had a similar situation this week. I had a great interview, but I don't think I'll receive an offer because my most recent salary is too high for this position. My most recent salary was the most neutral and objective response I could give. I strongly suspect that this company pays much less, but I'd still be interested in hearing their offer.

mozar

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #11 on: March 24, 2016, 06:57:41 PM »
There are jobs out there that pay whatever the industry standard is. If they lowball you, just move on.
After one job interview I had, they contacted me to say I didn't get the job. A month later they contacted me again and asked if I was still looking and would I consider a lower salary (they were hoping I was still unemployed and more desperate). Pretty low in my book. Fortunately I had already started my new awesome job that pays more than the industry norm (which I negotiated for).

There are tons of articles online about how to negotiate. Employers aren't going to tell you how to get more money out of them!


FrugalZony

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #12 on: March 24, 2016, 08:52:08 PM »
A work for a large corporation and the way it works here is I send in a job description for the position through HR and they Band it using
Hay points.
So we have very little room in dictating a budget and such.
I can influence a bit by how I word things, but generally speaking they come back with a band and a number in between which we'd have to pay for that position.

I was lucky and had several high caliber candidates interview for this position, all of whom were within our range.
We ended up offering the job to the guy, whom I found to be the best fit and offered him quite a bit more than what he asked for.

Now it took us a while wrapping up things, that had nothing to do with him or the salary he asked for or anything.
He probably was wondering like you did...what did I say.....was it my salary expecations etc....
But sometimes companies need time to sort out stuff internally, so I try to be not so concerned....especially with a long weekend coming up.....certain decision makers may be out etc...

When I am hiring, I am trying to be courteous and will let people know, how long it may take. I also touched base with my two top candidates when it was obvious, we needed more time. But I know not all hiring managers will do that.
Most likely, lack of reaction has nothing to do with you!

Felicity

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #13 on: March 25, 2016, 08:14:19 AM »
I think you need to listen to the question carefully and explain yourself - if you say you "require" a salary of $X, to me that means "$X is the minimum I will accept." So if that number is well out of their range, there's no real point in going forward from the company's perspective. I would go for something more like, "I'm looking for something in the range of $X-Y but I would want to see the full compensation package including benefits before I make a final decision."

Also it really depends on the industry/individual company.

I would agree with this as well, and it mirrors advice given on Ask a Manager (love this site)

Main site: http://www.askamanager.org/2013/08/how-to-answer-questions-about-your-salary-expectations.html
Linked Article: http://money.usnews.com/money/blogs/outside-voices-careers/2013/08/26/how-to-answer-questions-about-your-salary-expectations

daymare

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #14 on: March 25, 2016, 08:24:31 AM »

norabird

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #15 on: March 25, 2016, 08:51:43 AM »
I think I probably should have better expressed an openness to a lower number. Lesson learned for next time--though next time they may have a higher budget anyway! Or potentially they had a first-priority candidate in the mix. I do wish there were more standards for openness in these discussions! Asking me to name a number without expressing what's in their budget feels like setting me up for failure.

norabird

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2016, 10:34:41 AM »
So I did follow up to express more interest/flexibility, and heard back that their range was below my number. Well duh, you didn't tell me your range and so I gave you my ideal case! Am not sure if they moved ahead in the interim with someone else. Will put a sock in it next time. I'm open to an offer if they still make one, but may have missed my chance. D'oh. They are a bit under the industry norm, I think, but there are no recruiters in my field, so it's hard to say with any certainty. Hopefully if I don't get this one I'll end up at a place higher in the range. I am frustrated with the tactic I chose but also for having been placed in the position of accidentally eliminating myself. Ended up telling them 10k more than their top number and I guess they took that as solid not as a starting point for negotiation (which is partly my fault for not using more open phrasing or for avoiding the question wholly).

mozar

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2016, 11:27:21 AM »
I really want you to stop blaming yourself OP. If they were interested they could have easily come up another 10k, or told you they can't do that, can you accept x. You're going in circles in your mind about something that doesn't really matter. If they ask, state the industry standard. Then negotiate later (I want x more money because I'm awesome ).
If you accidentally eliminated yourself it's more likely that your offer of more flexibility sounds like you are begging them for a job. Which is a turn off. The more confident you are in what you can offer and how much money you require  (because you're so great) the more interested employers will be.

lhamo

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #18 on: March 25, 2016, 11:33:04 AM »
I agree that you shouldn't beat yourself up, norabird.  You are looking for new jobs because you want to be properly compensated, right?  And you are still in line for a potential promotion at your current gig.  So don't agonize about asking for what you are worth from a company that most likely isn't willing to compensate you at that level.  You wouldn't have been doing yourself a favor by accepting a lateral transfer at this point.  I think you should aim for a significant raise (which you potentially can ask your current employer to match) or else wait and see how the promotion works out.  I know it is hard to wait, but jumping ship at this point to another vessel that is more or less the same as the one you are on doesn't really make sense.

norabird

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #19 on: March 25, 2016, 11:36:37 AM »
Sigh. The problem is it really would have been a non-lateral move and a big bump in pay for me, if I had finagled the offer. But I am definitely beating myself up in ways that are not useful.

HipGnosis

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #20 on: March 25, 2016, 12:10:46 PM »
Sometimes I'll interview for positions that I know are below my experience level. I don't want that specific job; I want to talk to HR and perhaps be put into consideration for a more appropriate role. Sometimes those roles aren't posted, may not have been something I would have found or considered on my own or wouldn't have been viewed as a match based on my application alone.
Fascinating strategy.  Can it work the other way too?

sonjak

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #21 on: March 25, 2016, 01:32:47 PM »
I work in HR and would suggest that you NOT refuse to answer or totally sidestep.  My suggestion would be that you say, "I would want to start negotiating around XYZ but would obviously consider the entire benefit/compensation package during that discussion."  By doing that, you are communicating what you'd like (and you can go a bit high for that number as you did) but also expressing that you understand that compensation is more than just pay.  It also communicates a higher understanding than a lot of people have with those things, your flexibility and that you are open to negotiation. 

Don't kick yourself for this one if it doesn't work out.

DebtFreeBy25

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #22 on: March 25, 2016, 06:15:10 PM »
Sometimes I'll interview for positions that I know are below my experience level. I don't want that specific job; I want to talk to HR and perhaps be put into consideration for a more appropriate role. Sometimes those roles aren't posted, may not have been something I would have found or considered on my own or wouldn't have been viewed as a match based on my application alone.
Fascinating strategy.  Can it work the other way too?

I'm not sure what you mean by "the other way". Personally I'm rarely able to get interviews for positions if I don't fully meet the qualifications. In those rare circumstances, I assume that if the organization is interviewing me that they're potentially willing to hire me. I've had friends who've applied for positions that were a major reach for their experience, and I haven't heard any success stories from those applications.

Applying for position that I know is below my level is typically a strategy I only use with large employers who have multiple open positions at any given time. Often it is much easier to get an initial interview for a job that you wouldn't actually accept than to get the interview for a position you actually want. If I had not spoken with a recruiter, there's no chance I would have even applied for my last job because my skills and experience didn't fit the posting at all. This strategy is also highly dependent on the recruiter being internal and knowledgeable about many different postings across the organization. Sticking with my specific example, the employer has since outsourced recruiting, and the contracted recruiters are likely far less proactive.

starguru

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #23 on: March 28, 2016, 04:40:46 PM »
I don't work in HR, but making the first move in salary negotiations should work to your advantage.  I think I read you asked for 10-15% more than what you saw on glass door.  I think that should be fine.  I don't think they would look at that sum and disqualify you.  First, GlassDoor, at least from what Ive seen, is not accurate.  Second, if you asked for too much, and they want to hire you, they will just tell you they can't go that high.

I wouldn't beat yourself up over it.  I think you made a good negotiating move. 

Inaya

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #24 on: March 28, 2016, 05:40:36 PM »
Tjat's approach is one that the millenials seem to be following, and as a Gen-X'r, it drives me up the wall. I find it indirect and evasive. I don't mind if you want me to go first and name our salary - I will! I even post them in ads sometimes! But once I do that, stop telling me you need more information before you react to the salary I quoted. Just tell me what you want so we can move forward.
I'm an elderly (borderline) millennial, and every piece of advice I've ever gotten (e.g., from AAM or What Color is your Parachuteesque job hunting books) basically amounts to, "Whoever names the first number loses." If HR folks want candidates to stop being evasive, they need to stop being evasive and tell us what their range is. It goes both ways. I don't think I've ever seen a realistic salary range posted with a job ad, nor has anyone ever responded to my asking what range they'd be willing to offer except with, "Well, what's YOUR range?"

I don't want to be evasive, but I also don't want to shoot myself in the foot. In my current position I "won" because I refused to give the first number. The salary they offered was 25-30k higher than I would have asked for (and I think I have to credit the headhunter for this--I got the impression she tried to get them to go even higher). Part of it was a shift from a very LCOL area to very HCOL one. Part of it was the position involves a LOT more responsibility than the job ad indicated--but I had NO way of knowing that from my position as an applicant.

ender

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #25 on: March 28, 2016, 06:30:56 PM »
Sigh. I did think about evading, it's just hard to avoid the feeling of being rude by not answering a question! Lesson learned I guess. It also hasn't been all that long....but radio silence does not seem good. All of the advice is so conflicting also! I would not at all feel comfortable naming a reach number without expressing that it is negotiable.

One good response to this is to ask something like, "if you let me know the range of the position, I can let you know if we're in the right ballpark" or something like that.

For my current job the VP of my division was requiring me to give a specific number as part of the final step of the process. He mentioned that in the in-person interview that he wanted a specific number (not a range, etc) and so I asked him point-blank what the range for the position was.

Made it a lot easier for me.

Stachetastic

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #26 on: March 29, 2016, 06:26:57 AM »
Years ago, I showed up for an interview and the interviewer immediately stated, "Stachetastic, I don't know what you're doing here. I can't come close to what you're making with a master's degree at your current company."  I was speechless, but politely pointed out that I had no way of knowing the salary range for this new position without applying for it. Needless to say, it was a waste of my time. (And his, but he at least knew that when he scheduled the interview.)

Also related: it turns out the position I was interviewing for was an entry-level customer service position, but again, this was not clear in the job posting. It's so common to give every position a fancy pants title that in no way indicates what that position really is or does.

DebtFreeBy25

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #27 on: March 29, 2016, 08:04:16 AM »
Years ago, I showed up for an interview and the interviewer immediately stated, "Stachetastic, I don't know what you're doing here. I can't come close to what you're making with a master's degree at your current company."  I was speechless, but politely pointed out that I had no way of knowing the salary range for this new position without applying for it. Needless to say, it was a waste of my time. (And his, but he at least knew that when he scheduled the interview.)

Also related: it turns out the position I was interviewing for was an entry-level customer service position, but again, this was not clear in the job posting. It's so common to give every position a fancy pants title that in no way indicates what that position really is or does.

That was definitely poor screening on their part. The employer should have known you were over-qualified before they even called you.

I had a similar situation about a month ago with a mental health organization. They call me and set up an interview who giving any hint of the pay rate for the position. I sat through the entire interview only to find out at the end that it's a $12/hour job. (That's literally about a third of my most recent salary.) I have a masters degree and a solid work history of full-time, professional roles. It wouldn't have been too difficult to surmise that their compensation was way below what I would consider.

norabird

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #28 on: March 29, 2016, 08:05:13 AM »
I like the idea of asking what the range is and turning the tables! I think I just need to step more carefully next time.

dreams_and_discoveries

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #29 on: March 29, 2016, 08:08:33 AM »
A good topic.... I'm currently looking for a new contract, and working out how to approach this.

I've avoided naming a figure successfully for one job, and have been invited in for a chat. However I'm now wondering if it's worth asking before, in case they aren't willing to go high enough?

Sorry to hear norabird that you feel you've gone in too high - do you think you'll hear back from them, or are they discounting you as too expensive?

norabird

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #30 on: March 29, 2016, 08:14:12 AM »
They wrote me off! Womp womp. But without even trying me for their actual range (it was 10k less than my number, but of course I didn't actually expect to get my number or know what their range was...).

Fishindude

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #31 on: March 29, 2016, 08:26:46 AM »
I've not been in this position for a while, but I do a fair amount of hiring.
From the hiring point of view, i like to get them money out on the table fairly early in discussions so we don't waste a bunch of time interviewing, then find out we are miles apart.  At least talk about a salary range.

dreams_and_discoveries

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #32 on: March 29, 2016, 08:44:25 AM »
They wrote me off! Womp womp. But without even trying me for their actual range (it was 10k less than my number, but of course I didn't actually expect to get my number or know what their range was...).

That sucks - can't believe they wrote you off immediately. Usually places try to tell you about the great working environment and the 'package'...

As you are in NYC, I'm sure the next one will come along shortly :)

dreams_and_discoveries

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #33 on: March 31, 2016, 07:19:50 AM »
I'm in a different position as I'm not looking to increase my day rate, just maintain it.

Gave my day rate out in the interview, and didn't get any feedback, either good or bad... So I may have priced myself out, but won't know until next week.

Chranstronaut

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #34 on: March 31, 2016, 08:08:37 AM »
They wrote me off! Womp womp. But without even trying me for their actual range (it was 10k less than my number, but of course I didn't actually expect to get my number or know what their range was...).

This seems like such a small difference to eliminate someone, many people I know ask for about that much more than they would accept.  I have!  My current job doesn't have an exact market, but area pay for my experience at the larger companies earns $70-75k.  My current job offered me 15k below this at the start of negotiation and I told them they'd have to get closer to 70k for me to accept.  We spent a few days figuring it out together, which built my trust in them even though they knew their offer and range were low.

My guess is there are other factors at play or that company might struggle with hiring.  This might have been a bullet dodged if they didn't try to woo you with "benefits" like dream_and_discoveries said...

Runrooster

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #35 on: March 31, 2016, 09:10:00 AM »
I have psychological issues with negotiating.  If a job offers me 10k less than what I think is fair market value for my skills, they are probably cheap in other ways.  If I negotiate them into a higher figure, they will probably find ways to delay raises or expect a comparable amount of overtime.  Usually I have a good idea what the job is worth, whether I'm going to take a month or a year to get up to speed, how I compare to average candidates.  During the recession I reapplied for a mediocre federal job that I had left for better pay, and they thought they could offer me less than what I had earned when i left.  I know my competition, there werent other workers with that specific work experience and with the credentials to be legally hired, even in the recession.  Either these managers don't appreciate my value or they want something for nothing. Oh, right, that's why I left the first time.

From am employers point of view, if you ask for 20k more, they can negotiate you down but you might do a lower quality job.  I certainly had times when managers would say I had teaching experince and would I mind mentoring of the younger folks paid at my level. Um, sure, I'll do your job when you pay me accordingly.

I recently took an apartment from a friend without doing research into market value.  A month later, I realize I'm probably overpaying by 10-20%, and I have to decide if living with a friend is worth paying more, and it might be.  But aside from hurting her feelings in asking for a rent drop, I'm guessing she will be less generous with letting me use the garage or living room.  I'm more likely to move out than to ask to  adjust her rent.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2016, 09:33:45 AM by Runrooster »

Tyler

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Re: Anchoring too high in job hunting?
« Reply #36 on: March 31, 2016, 10:35:49 AM »
It's important to read the situation, but my default technique is to anchor on my current salary and put the ball in their court to convince me to switch. 

For example: "I currently make $X in total compensation, but money is not my primary motivator.  I'm excited about talking to (company name) because I think we'd be a great mutual fit.  If you agree, I'm confident your offer will reflect that and the numbers will work themselves out."

I've had good luck with that sort of honesty and positive confidence that reinforces your capabilities while remaining respectful of their needs, yet applies just enough pressure to have them really think about what they're willing to offer.  I also believe that by deflecting from straight money talk to how you can help the company, the hiring manager (that likely doesn't enjoy negotiation either) will be a lot more likely to go to bat for you with the finance guys.  Once you have an actual offer on the table from a manager who believes you're the best person for the job, the final negotiation is a lot more straightforward. 

BTW, I also have found that doing your salary research ahead of time is way better than playing the blind negotiating game.  When you have data to support what is fair and have a reasonable number in mind, just say so and be prepared to respectfully decline their offer if they can't meet it.  IMHO, too many people "negotiate" simply because they don't really know what they're worth.  Figure that out ahead of time, and it makes the process a lot easier. 
« Last Edit: March 31, 2016, 12:54:01 PM by Tyler »