Advice on helping girlfriend see FIRE is possible?

[grosvenor6]

My girlfriend and I have been dating for almost 5 years and we have both been pretty good at saving money.  I really want to retire from my full time job in 20 years or less as I am 20 right now and I do not like the office environment my current job is currently in, but the money is good so I figured I will stick it out.  My girlfriend is working part time while going to school full time for the next 2 and a half years.  Although she has saved up quite a bit of money, she still believes we should buy what we want now and not worry about money too much.  We are planning on getting married in a couple years and we want a house in around 5 years.  She doesn't like the fact that I would want to buy a cheaper/smaller house and fix it up to our likings, she would rather move into a 300k house where everything is move in ready.  Does anyone have any advice on how I can help her see the benefits of saving as much money as we can as well as ways I can help her see FIRE is achievable for us and that a smaller house will help us achieve it?

[chubbybunny]

The question I would really ask, is are you willing to compromise?  I'm sure you'll get some feedback from other folks with good numbers (show her the "shockingly simple" blog post).  My thought is really that not everyone is interested in FIRE.  If she's not, I don't know that you can force her.  Do you still want to get married even if she isn't interested?  Be prepared for the long haul.  I don't have a reference, but I read somewhere that the #1 cause of divorce is money arguments.  Make sure you two are on the same page before you make the commitment.  That might mean that you have to meet somewhere in the middle. 

My gosh, you're saying that you've been dating since you were 15, and you're only 20 now?  Your lives are just starting. She hasn't even joined the working world full time yet.  It's okay to figure this stuff out later, and nothing is stopping YOU from putting a good chunk of your income into savings.  If all you do is live on your current expenses and throw every single pay raise for the rest of your life into savings, you'll kill it. 

[kite]

What sort of work would you like to do?

You're on the right track as far as saving, etc.  But don't resign yourself to 20 years in a field you don't like because you'll be able to retire at age 40.  See if you can find work that is rewarding in such a way that some parts of it are psychologically fulfilling.  Two decades is a long time to spend in an environment you don't like. 
If buying a small place and fixing it up inspires you, do it now and see if you can try to turn that into a career. 
At 20, the world is your oyster.  What are your passions? 
Deckhand on a yacht?  Furniture refinishing?
Teaching children?  Working with animals?
Meeting people? Bartender?
Masonry? Electrician?
Did you like any subject in school?
Do you prefer the outdoors?  Surfing?  Flying helicopters?
What comes easy to you?

FIRE is possible, certainly.  But rather than slave away today so you can be free later, why not use this time of your life to explore.  The chances are excellent that you'll find something where you aren't counting the 1000 weeks until retirement.  The odds are also very good that it will pay more than what you are currently making, especially since you are a saver with a long range goal and not a slacker. 

To answer your question, however, "How do I convince someone else.....?"  The best way is with example.  Be the example.  I think one makes the most compelling case when one is working at their best towards a well defined dream.  I didn't get the sense there was anything you got out of the current job besides a paycheck, and you're counting down the time on your remaining sentence like an inmate waiting on parole, so I think you need to reconsider the kind of work you'll do in order to get to FIRE. 

[grosvenor6]

What sort of work would you like to do?

You're on the right track as far as saving, etc.  But don't resign yourself to 20 years in a field you don't like because you'll be able to retire at age 40.  See if you can find work that is rewarding in such a way that some parts of it are psychologically fulfilling.  Two decades is a long time to spend in an environment you don't like. 
If buying a small place and fixing it up inspires you, do it now and see if you can try to turn that into a career. 
At 20, the world is your oyster.  What are your passions? 
Deckhand on a yacht?  Furniture refinishing?
Teaching children?  Working with animals?
Meeting people? Bartender?
Masonry? Electrician?
Did you like any subject in school?
Do you prefer the outdoors?  Surfing?  Flying helicopters?
What comes easy to you?

FIRE is possible, certainly.  But rather than slave away today so you can be free later, why not use this time of your life to explore.  The chances are excellent that you'll find something where you aren't counting the 1000 weeks until retirement.  The odds are also very good that it will pay more than what you are currently making, especially since you are a saver with a long range goal and not a slacker. 

To answer your question, however, "How do I convince someone else.....?"  The best way is with example.  Be the example.  I think one makes the most compelling case when one is working at their best towards a well defined dream.  I didn't get the sense there was anything you got out of the current job besides a paycheck, and you're counting down the time on your remaining sentence like an inmate waiting on parole, so I think you need to reconsider the kind of work you'll do in order to get to FIRE.

Right now I am basically a designer using programs to design stuff, I am good at what I do but the work is slow.  I have always loved doing physical work, and I am also great with working with kids and I love animals.  I am finishing up my associates degree right now and I do not plan on going on to get a bachelors degree because I do not enjoy school and do not want to jump into student loans.  I coach sports on the side as well as helping family members do side jobs and I love doing both, so it is a nice break away from my day job.  I have always been into the renovating tv shows and would love to learn how to do it myself.  I do not know where I could look to find another type of career based on where I live though.

[ReadySetMillionaire]

Part of me is thinking, "Wow, it's great that you're this financially aware at age 20...you're lightyears ahead of where I was at that age."  The other part of me is saying, "Dude, you're 20, slow down."

I mean, eight years ago I was a junior at Ohio State and getting a degree in journalism, absolutely loved being single, swore I would always rent, and thought I'd never return home (thought I'd stay in Columbus or move to Cleveland). Now, I'm a practicing attorney, am in a great relationship with my girlfriend (2+ years), moved back home, and actually just bought a house about a month ago.

Point is that your life is going to change a lot more than you think. Yes, you should communicate your goals and aspirations with your GF, but don't be so obsessed with your financial life that it dictates your career and/or your relationship.

So my advice is to save up. Be an example for your girlfriend. Buy Millioniare Next Door and like books and leave them around the apartment. Let her figure out if she wants ER as well (my mom will work until she's 70 because she wants to). But at such a young age, absolutely do not let finances dominate your life.

[arebelspy]

Sit down with her and together build a picture of what you want your lives to look like.

The best way to get there might be for both of you to FIRE as soon as possible. Or it may be for one of you to keep working. Or whatever.

But start with that vision--together.

[Scandium]

If buying a $300k house is your only issue I think you're doing pretty well. I don't get the hate for "expensive" houses here (definition of which will of course vary by location). Your payment is after all forced savings, the value is usually stable/rising (peak 2008/florida/vegas excepted) and the interest is only 4% now. So as long as you can comfortably make the payments, the market isn't crazy, and even if you just see inflation growth in equity it's really far from the worst thing you can do. Sure, you could maybe have done better investing that cash, but after decades of living in a nice, big house in a nice neighborhood you can sell and take out lots of saved up equity. Hardly a terrible outcome IMO.

I see buying expensive cars as a far, far bigger drag on middle class families finances. Maybe the biggest drain. Spending something like $50k every 6 years on a depreciating assets make almost any house purchase look like a great idea.

[OctaviusIII]

The advice to talk about the ideal life is a good one. "If money were no object" kind of talk, or, "If you didn't have to work anymore..." But be willing to compromise. She has an idea of what life ought to be that you might not share. If you want to get married, then it's important that you both compromise. What are her reasons for not wanting to retire early? What are her feelings on the subject? Can you step inside her shoes and really understand it? What makes her happy, really?

FIRE is a great goal, and one you should pursue, but perhaps more important is a happy, loving, and mutually supportive marriage. Do that second thing first, and keep an ongoing conversation about what you both want in life. Pursue one another's happiness.

[Gone Fishing]

A lot of people have a hard time with the RE part of FIRE.  You might do better just focusing on the FI part (control, flexibility, freedom) and leave the RE part out there just as a possibility you may decide to do at some point if the time is right.   

I'm not too much into pessimism and scare tactics, but she might need a little dose of reality before it really sinks in.  Not having worked full time in a career type job, your girlfriend probably has no clue what it is really like.  Right now, in her mind, the job that she has worked so hard for in school will be awesome, and if it isn't, she'll just find another one.  Maybe, but maybe not.  A few years in the working world will almost surely change her perspective. 

She was probably in her early teens when the last economic down cycle came around, maybe too young for it to make an impression, especially if her parents were not affected. 

Growing up, both my parents worked in the public sector and there was NEVER even speak of a layoff or relocation. Layoff/relocation announcements in the news meant absolutely NOTHING to me until around 4 years into my first job when the small family like business I worked for was sold to a larger company.  I still remember when my first coworker was laid off.  This was 2007, right before everything tanked, it was a terrible time to get laid off.  I was shocked into reality by the experience.  The reality was, that at any time, your world could get turned upside down by events totally out of your control, all you can do is be prepared.  At the time, I was still a long ways off from FI, but in the event I had been laid off, unemployment would have easily covered most of our expenses, as well as having a decent stache to dip into if needed.  Over the next few years, my wife was laid off 3 times, yet financially, it was barely a hiccup as we did not depend on her income at all.   

This is a fragile time, get it right, and you have a huge jumpstart on your financial life. Get it wrong, and you might be towing around that boat anchor for a long time.


This is what I tell people just starting out:

You may love your job now, but 5 years down the road you may not.  Save money to give yourself flexibility if that time comes.

When a recession, merger, acquisition, restructure, etc. comes around, people (even the good ones) lose their jobs.  Recent hires are often the first to go.  Be ready.  Don't box yourself in with high expenses thinking the gravy train will go on forever, because many times, it doesn't.

If kids are in the picture, your are going want every bit of financial flexibility you can possibly get.

Good luck!