Author Topic: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?  (Read 33085 times)

RootofGood

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #50 on: September 30, 2013, 08:28:05 AM »
I would settle on the price, then discuss financing.  No reason to confuse what you'll pay with how you will pay. 

If they benefit from financing, share the benefit with them!  If they make say $500 from financing you, agree to finance, take half of it as a price reduction, then pay off the loan the first month.  Assuming you won't pay ridiculous interest rates on the short term loan. 

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #51 on: September 30, 2013, 09:55:21 AM »
I know this is just a dream but how sweet would it be to pay with a CC. The rewards points would be awsome. Assuming you paid it off when you got home

I bought a $6500 car a couple months ago. I actually asked about the credit card and they said "Sure you can charge up to $2500 on a credit card!" So I used a card that got 2.2 points per dollar spent and ended up with $55 off the car. A personal check for the rest and I paid off the CC in full at the end of the month.

Hunny156

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #52 on: September 30, 2013, 02:56:03 PM »
I know this is just a dream but how sweet would it be to pay with a CC. The rewards points would be awsome. Assuming you paid it off when you got home

My friend's dad did this a long time ago. When the salesmen gave him guff, he threatened to pay with credit card unless he got 3% off. Somehow, my friend's dad got the 3% off. I think the transaction fee to the cc company would have been more than 3%.

I did this 2 years ago.  I planned to pay by check, but didn't think we'd find the right used car the first day out, so I forgot to bring the checkbook.  I didn't bring it up until we had an out the door price.  I figured I could just drive home and grab the checkbook, no big deal.  I jokingly suggested we put it on my card so I could get points, and they didn't flinch!  Paid it off a few days later, and got a nice bump in points.  Win Win!

dragoncar

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #53 on: September 30, 2013, 03:57:51 PM »
I know this is just a dream but how sweet would it be to pay with a CC. The rewards points would be awsome. Assuming you paid it off when you got home

My friend's dad did this a long time ago. When the salesmen gave him guff, he threatened to pay with credit card unless he got 3% off. Somehow, my friend's dad got the 3% off. I think the transaction fee to the cc company would have been more than 3%.

I did this 2 years ago.  I planned to pay by check, but didn't think we'd find the right used car the first day out, so I forgot to bring the checkbook.  I didn't bring it up until we had an out the door price.  I figured I could just drive home and grab the checkbook, no big deal.  I jokingly suggested we put it on my card so I could get points, and they didn't flinch!  Paid it off a few days later, and got a nice bump in points.  Win Win!

My instinct tells me that dealerships who take credit cards have an obscene profit margin (although you may have gotten a good deal)

Hunny156

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #54 on: October 01, 2013, 12:00:16 PM »
I know this is just a dream but how sweet would it be to pay with a CC. The rewards points would be awsome. Assuming you paid it off when you got home

My friend's dad did this a long time ago. When the salesmen gave him guff, he threatened to pay with credit card unless he got 3% off. Somehow, my friend's dad got the 3% off. I think the transaction fee to the cc company would have been more than 3%.

I did this 2 years ago.  I planned to pay by check, but didn't think we'd find the right used car the first day out, so I forgot to bring the checkbook.  I didn't bring it up until we had an out the door price.  I figured I could just drive home and grab the checkbook, no big deal.  I jokingly suggested we put it on my card so I could get points, and they didn't flinch!  Paid it off a few days later, and got a nice bump in points.  Win Win!

My instinct tells me that dealerships who take credit cards have an obscene profit margin (although you may have gotten a good deal)

It was a used car lot, so that may have been a factor - they started at $10K, and we talked them down to $7K OTD.  Not sure if a new car dealership would take payment for a $30K car on a CC, but I suspect not.

I've had the car for 2 years now, and she's been completely reliable.  Turns out the prior owner was the proverbial little old lady who just drove it to church and the supermarket.  She took really good care of it - the only negative was that she smoked.  :(  The dealer de-smoked it, and the smell is mostly gone.  On really hot days, you can get a faint whiff of it, but as an ex-smoker, I can smell that scent a mile away.

Mr.Macinstache

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #55 on: October 01, 2013, 12:09:44 PM »
Take a bowl of vinegar and let it sit in there over night...do that a few dozen times and it should soak up all of that smoke smell.

kyleaaa

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #56 on: October 01, 2013, 03:32:33 PM »
Next time I'm in the market for a car, I'm going to waltz into the dealership with an armored briefcase full of $10 bills hand-cuffed to my arm.

dragoncar

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #57 on: October 01, 2013, 03:37:47 PM »
Next time I'm in the market for a car, I'm going to waltz into the dealership with an armored briefcase full of $10 bills hand-cuffed to my arm.


Dude, you never use your own wrist!  That's how you get a hand cut off!  Use one of your minions for this task.

Mr Mark

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #58 on: October 01, 2013, 03:42:31 PM »
To OP,

The salesmen get a  big commission on the finance deal (they've just manufactured a bond for wall street), and some second hand places rely on that to make a profit! It can be a pretty competitive business.

You need to know your state law. In many states, it's illegal to charge a different price for a financed car, so you can negotiate as if you're going to finance, and then once price and car is agreed you can change your mind and pay cash. But they won't like it, and don't go back!

Forcus

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #59 on: October 02, 2013, 08:19:21 AM »


Dude, you never use your own wrist!  That's how you get a hand cut off!  Use one of your minions for this task.

AHAHAHAHAHA

gimp

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #60 on: October 02, 2013, 12:07:44 PM »
In my limited experience, yes, car dealers prefer to loan money rather than have a cash sale.  Last car we bought was six years ago, and we definitely found that they were less interested in us once we said, "We're paying cash." 

My best advice on car buying: 

Do not mix test drives and money discussions.  Do your research, test drive, whatever.  But when you're ready to buy, come back and tell them, "I want to talk money about ____ car."  This is harder with used cars, but at big places like CarMax, it's possible.  Don't mix the decision-making process and the emotional desire to own the car with the financial discussion.  This also throws the salesmen off their game. 

Tell them that you want to talk about one number, one number only:  The total, out-the-door cost of the car.  Include taxes, fees, whatever.  This prevents them from adding on a bunch of money at the end, after you thought you were "done".  The salesmen hate this and will fight you on it.  They will constantly return to, "This feature is only X amount more per month."  Firmly but politely return to, "I want to talk about one number only:  The total, out-the-door cost of the car."  No matter how many times they try to distract you with other questions, return to that one number. 

Refuse to discuss financing.  When they ask how you're going to pay, respond with a vague, "I'm not ready to make that decision.  What I need to know today is the total, out-the-door cost of the car." 

Do not trade your car when you buy a new one.  Make it two separate transactions.  The simpler your transaction, the more transparent the numbers.  The salesmen like to include trades and lots of complicated numbers -- it confuses people, and they go away not knowing what they're really paid. 

They do this all day, every day.  If you allow them to start flipping around trade-ins, financing costs, etc., etc., etc., they will beat you.  So refuse to play their game.  Total, out-the-door cost.  Nothing else. 

Once you have the price you're willing to pay, THEN tell them you're going to pay cash.

This method has worked great for us.   

God yes. Hammer out a price. Everything is agreed on. Then when they start talking financing, you're paying cash.

If they complain too hard, get up and walk away. They'll fold [almost] every time.

Self-employed-swami

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #61 on: October 02, 2013, 12:31:13 PM »
This whole idea is CRAZY.  In my experience, here in Canada, cash buyers get the best discounts, and have the strongest negotiating position. 

gebraset

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #62 on: October 02, 2013, 03:28:46 PM »
Great thread really, after reading through all of the comments and replies. I never thought about paying with a credit card, what a great way to earn bonus points and rewards. I'm  not sure many dealers would actually do this though, for the reasons provided.

When we bought our two cars a few years back, we financed since we were just our of high school. Luckily, I had stellar credit for being 18 and, if I can remember correctly, got under 5.5% APR on each vehicle. my occupation treated me well too, and both card were paid off in one years time. With the financing, I went into the dealership with a check cut from the back on both vehicles, it was all too easy. Of course we had to get to an out the door price before I got my bank to mail me a check for the dealership, however, we were dealing with someone whom my family has been buying cars from for over 10 years. He wanted the business, and I wanted to help him in the process of getting some vehicles.

I think next time I go for a purchase, I'm swinging for the CC method and then cash (IE: Check) for the rest of the amount.

Mr Mark

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #63 on: October 02, 2013, 10:19:38 PM »
This whole idea is CRAZY.  In my experience, here in Canada, cash buyers get the best discounts, and have the strongest negotiating position.

It's the kickbacks that are legal in the us, not Canada I'd bet. If you can get people into a finance deal that locks them in for above market rates, hey, well done!  Join the line of parasite businesses, like pay day loans, car title loans, free furniture ( hey, we'll throw in a free wide screen tv with that overpriced imported crap fake wood stuff)...

In the USA, exploiting naive ignorant low ( or high!)  income consumers is apparently a functioning business model. The car is just the bait, the debt is the objective. The fed will pretty much give you the cheap leverage, as long as the default rate is acceptable.

Psychstache

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #64 on: October 02, 2013, 10:38:13 PM »
This whole idea is CRAZY.  In my experience, here in Canada, cash buyers get the best discounts, and have the strongest negotiating position.

It's the kickbacks that are legal in the us, not Canada I'd bet. If you can get people into a finance deal that locks them in for above market rates, hey, well done!  Join the line of parasite businesses, like pay day loans, car title loans, free furniture ( hey, we'll throw in a free wide screen tv with that overpriced imported crap fake wood stuff)...

In the USA, exploiting naive ignorant low ( or high!)  income consumers is apparently a functioning business model. The car is just the bait, the debt is the objective. The fed will pretty much give you the cheap leverage, as long as the default rate is acceptable.

This.

I remember the eye opening experience of working at Nordstrom in college. I always wondered how they could have such a generous return policy. About a week into the job I realized they are just a bank that happens to have clothes you can borrow. Madness.

Ashcons

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #65 on: October 04, 2013, 11:28:49 AM »
Third party finances pay a reserve back to the dealership over a certain period of time at a certain rate (percentage of the interest income they expect to receive over the life of the loan). The dealership benefits from extra income without ANY risk exposure; the worst that can happen is the customer stops paying within the 1-2 years the bank amortizes and pays out the reserve and the dealer has to write it off. Obviously, there is a lot of incentive to push financing for extra revenue on the sale. The salesmen get a cut of the financing in their bonuses at some dealerships.

I'd just keep that ace in the hole for as long as possible. Get sales terms (what it will cost) hammered out before you even talk to the salesman about financing, then present your payment.

(Source: I work at a CPA firm and have performed financial statement audits on car dealerships in the past, so I got to peek behind the curtain)

The REAL crazy business model, though, is that in-house financing, high-risk used car lot. Imagine a business model where you take $3,500 auction cars, sell them on your lot for $7,000 @ 25% financing over 5 years, turn around and repossess them in less than a year, get court ordered repayment judgment against the borrower for the note value less fair value of the vehicle (estimated very low), then turn around to sell it again. You're making money out of thin air. I'm sure some of you have rental stories about the bad renter who is the target market for this business model...
« Last Edit: October 04, 2013, 11:46:54 AM by DebtStubble »

GreenGuava

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #66 on: October 04, 2013, 07:40:31 PM »
The REAL crazy business model, though, is that in-house financing, high-risk used car lot. Imagine a business model where you take $3,500 auction cars, sell them on your lot for $7,000 @ 25% financing over 5 years, turn around and repossess them in less than a year, get court ordered repayment judgment against the borrower for the note value less fair value of the vehicle (estimated very low), then turn around to sell it again. You're making money out of thin air. I'm sure some of you have rental stories about the bad renter who is the target market for this business model...

I can't decide:  is something wrong with me that my first thought was "that's brilliant"?

Christof

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #67 on: October 05, 2013, 12:23:08 AM »
repossess them in less than a year, get court ordered repayment judgment against the borrower for the note value less fair value of the vehicle (estimated very low)

One tiny difference in Germany that makes this whole business unattractive: Here you get the note value less the actual sales price of the vehicle, not the fair value. Which results in the court auction off any reposessed items to determine the actual sales value.

worms

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #68 on: October 05, 2013, 05:04:09 AM »
?..how sweet would it be to pay with a CC.

Done that!

worms

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #69 on: October 05, 2013, 05:15:07 AM »
What this thread reinforces is that it is always worth trying to figure out what business a company is really in - where the profit comes from - and it is not always the obvious!

Car dealers are as much about finance and servicing as car sales.  Car manufacturers are probably really in the finance and spare parts business.  Car rental businesses are about car sales and insurance.  Etc.

dragoncar

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #70 on: October 05, 2013, 03:02:19 PM »
repossess them in less than a year, get court ordered repayment judgment against the borrower for the note value less fair value of the vehicle (estimated very low)

One tiny difference in Germany that makes this whole business unattractive: Here you get the note value less the actual sales price of the vehicle, not the fair value. Which results in the court auction off any reposessed items to determine the actual sales value.

That's how I think it would work here too, with competent legal representation

Ashcons

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #71 on: October 06, 2013, 01:40:59 PM »
I cannot recall whether this is included on the invoices or not, but I am pretty sure that there is another bit of sneakiness that dealerships pull with regard to new vehicles:

Pretty much every one of their customers can pull up the invoice price for a vehicle and they know it, so do the manufacturers. They will tell give you a sob story about how they're selling to you practically at cost, but something the invoice does not show, if I recall correctly, is manufacturer's assistance on inventory - basically a couple - few hundred dollars' rebate on new vehicles.

It isn't that I think dealerships shouldn't have the opportunity to make a profit, especially with the capital tied up in their inventory, but man it's hard for me to feel anything but completely on the defensive when I'm in a dealership. They make their money in parts & service and in used car sales. I think the new vehicle sales are mostly a reliable way to get people in the American-consumer mindset in the door.

Ashcons

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #72 on: October 06, 2013, 01:43:05 PM »
repossess them in less than a year, get court ordered repayment judgment against the borrower for the note value less fair value of the vehicle (estimated very low)

One tiny difference in Germany that makes this whole business unattractive: Here you get the note value less the actual sales price of the vehicle, not the fair value. Which results in the court auction off any repossessed items to determine the actual sales value.

That's how I think it would work here too, with competent legal representation

That is how it works here in the US. The reason I stated it the way I did (should have explained my sarcasm) is by how the actual sales value is determine.

What happens is the repossessed vehicle goes back to a vehicle auction where the business has buyer agents pick it back up at a very low price (original note for 5,000 less 1-year in payments' principal, repurchased at auction for $2,250). It is assessed under the fair value this way in practice. I'm obviously pulling numbers out of...thin air, but I am not exaggerating the difference between how this should work on paper and how it plays out.

Here's how I've pieced together the way it works:

In-House Financing Dealership repossesses vehicle.
Vehicle goes to closed auction (only valid dealerships can attend)
Dealership's buying agent picks up the same vehicle at a value far below fair market (i.e. what it will bring on a used car lot)
In-House Financing Dealership shows documentation for vehicle sold at X, original signer/cosigner responsible for Note - X
In-House Financing Dealership puts car back on the lot for the next sucker customer (you guessed it, back up to FMV)
« Last Edit: October 06, 2013, 01:52:22 PM by DebtStubble »

Kira

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #73 on: October 06, 2013, 02:13:53 PM »
Had a similar experience when we had to buy a car suddenly in another city (car was not driveable back home after throwing a rod so we sold it to Husband's father to fix up, and bought another car so we could get home.) Since we were not planning on doing this, we went to the credit union ATM and withdrew $5,000 in cash. We took a picture of it cause it was so surreal to have $5k mostly in twenties.

The dealer was not concerned about the cash (he even had a cash counter in his office) but was really, really concerned about selling us the warranty. Dealer sez, "Well, what would you do if on the drive home the car blew $expensivepart?" Husband sez, "I would drive it back here and give you hell for selling us a car which couldn't even make it to the other end of the state without blowing something."

Then the dealer just sat there and stared at Husband with what clearly was his practiced 'stern' face with knitted eyebrows. Husband stared right back, and after several tense seconds, flared his nostrils and opened his eyes very wide. Dealer was taken aback and continued on with the transaction and did not mention the warranty again.

Note: Husband says just now, "I think we got a good deal, based on how unhappy they were by the time we left."

Jack

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #74 on: October 06, 2013, 08:50:54 PM »
I remember the eye opening experience of working at Nordstrom in college. I always wondered how they could have such a generous return policy. About a week into the job I realized they are just a bank that happens to have clothes you can borrow. Madness.

That would make a good thread all on it's own.  What do you mean by it's like a bank?

I'm guessing that Nordstrom's customers mostly buy using the store credit card and the company makes most of its profit on finance charges.

eyePod

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #75 on: October 07, 2013, 01:24:43 PM »
I always feel uneasy with these generalizations, because usually they aren't true.

I love the generalization about generalizations.  Now I have this question: Is your generalization that generalizations usually aren't true right or wrong? This seems like some sort of logic game...

Christof

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #76 on: October 07, 2013, 04:18:57 PM »
The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few; or the one. ;)

paddedhat

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #77 on: October 07, 2013, 07:23:27 PM »
The REAL crazy business model, though, is that in-house financing, high-risk used car lot. Imagine a business model where you take $3,500 auction cars, sell them on your lot for $7,000 @ 25% financing over 5 years, turn around and repossess them in less than a year, get court ordered repayment judgment against the borrower for the note value less fair value of the vehicle (estimated very low), then turn around to sell it again. You're making money out of thin air. I'm sure some of you have rental stories about the bad renter who is the target market for this business model...

I know a local dealer who takes this to the next level. He installs a remote kill switch ( controlled by a SIM card, just like a phone) before the customer leaves with the car. The victim pays the weekly note, on time, in cash, or the car gets turned off. Don't think it's important to stop by the office this week with your pile of coin? No worries. The next time you attempt to start the car, it doesn't.  The owner has dozens of these arrangements on the road. He listens to all the drama and crying, then tells them to get their sorry ass to the office with the cash, and the car will start again. No, "well if you don't turn it on, I can't drive to you to pay the money". Tough shit, get your grandma to motor you butt here, and all will be well. At this point his repossession level is nearly zero, and he is making a fortune. Don't mistake this as an endorsement of these practices, personally I couldn't do this to my fellow man. But it is one hell of a lucrative way to make a living.

Christof

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #78 on: October 07, 2013, 11:30:37 PM »
I'd say he's lucky that nothing happened yet... Turning off a car without seeing where the car is at the moment sounds like a recipe for disaster to me.

Albert

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #79 on: October 07, 2013, 11:36:13 PM »
Such a system doesn't actually turn off the car, instead it doesn't allow to start it again after it has been turned off. Sure it could be standing in the gas station...

dragoncar

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #80 on: October 07, 2013, 11:57:04 PM »
Such a system doesn't actually turn off the car, instead it doesn't allow to start it again after it has been turned off. Sure it could be standing in the gas station...

Maybe that's why we hear those reports of people who leave their cars running 24/7 :-)

Christof

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #81 on: October 08, 2013, 02:32:08 AM »
Such a system doesn't actually turn off the car, instead it doesn't allow to start it again after it has been turned off. Sure it could be standing in the gas station...
more likely on an intersection now that modern cars turn the engine off automatically when the car stops... Anyone copying the approach should talk with their liability insurance company first, though, and check the laws, because I'm pretty sure that this is illegal in Germany.

Spork

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #82 on: October 08, 2013, 08:00:39 AM »

I know a local dealer who takes this to the next level. He installs a remote kill switch ( controlled by a SIM card, just like a phone) before the customer leaves with the car. The victim pays the weekly note, on time, in cash, or the car gets turned off. Don't think it's important to stop by the office this week with your pile of coin? No worries. The next time you attempt to start the car, it doesn't.  The owner has dozens of these arrangements on the road. He listens to all the drama and crying, then tells them to get their sorry ass to the office with the cash, and the car will start again. No, "well if you don't turn it on, I can't drive to you to pay the money". Tough shit, get your grandma to motor you butt here, and all will be well. At this point his repossession level is nearly zero, and he is making a fortune. Don't mistake this as an endorsement of these practices, personally I couldn't do this to my fellow man. But it is one hell of a lucrative way to make a living.

This isn't new.  I remember reading a story of a dealer that got this system hacked...  Someone shut down years worth of sold cars with a click of a mouse.

JR

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #83 on: October 08, 2013, 08:37:06 AM »
Such a system doesn't actually turn off the car, instead it doesn't allow to start it again after it has been turned off. Sure it could be standing in the gas station...
more likely on an intersection now that modern cars turn the engine off automatically when the car stops... Anyone copying the approach should talk with their liability insurance company first, though, and check the laws, because I'm pretty sure that this is illegal in Germany.

How many car models actually do this though? The Insight and Prius are the only models I can think of. The cars being sold at those type of buy here pay here lots are not this modern.
« Last Edit: October 08, 2013, 08:40:32 AM by JR »

Mr.Macinstache

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #84 on: October 08, 2013, 11:26:14 AM »
I just got some grief buying a car using financing from my credit union. The dealer tried to make me fill out a credit app and I refused. They said even though I had financing, they still had to run it through THEIR bank so they could rely that info to my credit union.. and that is was government required? Ha. I called BS. I got the purchase order from the dealer, drove to my credit union and they cut me a check to buy the car.

So yes, car dealers are just another form of banks letting people borrow cars until the note is paid.

Psychstache

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #85 on: October 08, 2013, 12:17:14 PM »
I remember the eye opening experience of working at Nordstrom in college. I always wondered how they could have such a generous return policy. About a week into the job I realized they are just a bank that happens to have clothes you can borrow. Madness.

That would make a good thread all on it's own.  What do you mean by it's like a bank?

I'm guessing that Nordstrom's customers mostly buy using the store credit card and the company makes most of its profit on finance charges.

Exactly this. The most extreme example was a woman who came into the store to make a payment. She handed me a $100 bill as I pulled up her account........the current balance was $19,000........and after the payment was processed, she made a B-line for the shoes without a care in the world. Madness.

Sorry for the threadjack. Carry on.

Mr.Macinstache

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #86 on: October 08, 2013, 12:21:20 PM »
This whole idea is CRAZY.  In my experience, here in Canada, cash buyers get the best discounts, and have the strongest negotiating position.

It's the kickbacks that are legal in the us, not Canada I'd bet. If you can get people into a finance deal that locks them in for above market rates, hey, well done!  Join the line of parasite businesses, like pay day loans, car title loans, free furniture ( hey, we'll throw in a free wide screen tv with that overpriced imported crap fake wood stuff)...

In the USA, exploiting naive ignorant low ( or high!)  income consumers is apparently a functioning business model. The car is just the bait, the debt is the objective. The fed will pretty much give you the cheap leverage, as long as the default rate is acceptable.

This.

I remember the eye opening experience of working at Nordstrom in college. I always wondered how they could have such a generous return policy. About a week into the job I realized they are just a bank that happens to have clothes you can borrow. Madness.

That's REALLY a great way to explain it.

ritchie70

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #87 on: October 09, 2013, 10:29:36 PM »
Yes, dealerships will take checks.  There are numerous check verification systems they use to be comfortable with it.  They could also do an ACH transfer (which is the closes we have to EU style transfers, but takes a few days to clear ... You'd probably have to wait to pick up the car).   

Source: I was present when a family member bought a porche with a personal check a few years ago.

I doubt you'd have to wait to get the car. I bought my current car with a check for around $19K (I've face punched myself enough already, thanks, although for the car it was a good price) and they held the check for a few days for me so I could get money moved out of brokerage account to bank account and generally keep the check from turning to rubber.

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #88 on: October 12, 2013, 06:39:00 PM »
I haven't car shopped since 2006, but I have experienced car dealers *refusing* to sell us cars if we did not finance.  Totally serious.  2006 was in the midst of the debt bubble and I found we made salesmen extremely flustered with our cash/price limit mentality.  We were very young, which probably didn't help (obviously we'd be easy to sucker into a car payment).  IT's really the best I can explain it - they got flustered and they made poor judgements.  Like yelling at us when we wouldn't do what they wanted us to do.  (There are some dealerships I would *never* step foot in again).

Actually, our last car purchase we offered to finance up front.  Instead of kicking us out and arguing, they practically rolled out the red carpet.  They gave us $500-off for financing, and I paid it off the second I could (within a week or so).  So, I would probably just finance again in the future.  It was a lot nicer experience.

I generally prefer to buy private party, but our last two vehicles were exceptional deals.  So, I am a little more open to the dealer bullcrap.  It's not exactly fun, so we try to keep our cars for 15 or 20 years.   All our other cars had been private party deals, but we also had never paid more than $5k for a car.  So, when spending a lot more than that, I do feel more comfortable just going through a dealer.   I was hoping next time we car shopped that cash would get a little more respect.  (In 2001 we found a dealership that gladly took our cash, so that helped.  If not, I would probably never go to any dealership again)

Car dealerships will take checks and even wait for you to transfer money while you drive off with the car (As someone else mentioned).  They of course check your credit first.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2013, 06:42:41 PM by Alexandria »

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #89 on: October 13, 2013, 12:37:20 AM »
If I am paying cash, there is no way I would consent to a credit check!  You get just enough information about me, to fill out a bill of sale (name, address, phone number) but that's it!  Clearly I am already awesome enough, by being able to pay cash, you don't need to peek up my skirt too.

madgeylou

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #90 on: October 13, 2013, 07:10:40 AM »
This whole idea is CRAZY.  In my experience, here in Canada, cash buyers get the best discounts, and have the strongest negotiating position.

It's the kickbacks that are legal in the us, not Canada I'd bet. If you can get people into a finance deal that locks them in for above market rates, hey, well done!  Join the line of parasite businesses, like pay day loans, car title loans, free furniture ( hey, we'll throw in a free wide screen tv with that overpriced imported crap fake wood stuff)...

In the USA, exploiting naive ignorant low ( or high!)  income consumers is apparently a functioning business model. The car is just the bait, the debt is the objective. The fed will pretty much give you the cheap leverage, as long as the default rate is acceptable.

This.

I remember the eye opening experience of working at Nordstrom in college. I always wondered how they could have such a generous return policy. About a week into the job I realized they are just a bank that happens to have clothes you can borrow. Madness.

That's REALLY a great way to explain it.

I think this is how most stores are now, unfortunately. Last week I went to Williams Sonoma to get refills for my SodaStream, and the lady behind the counter was giving me the hard sell on getting the credit card -- "Why wouldn't you want 5% off today?"

Then when she asked me for my email address and I declined, she about went apoplectic. "But but but this is how you will be informed of our one-day sales over Christmas!" Like there's really something wrong with me if I'm not interested in that.

The thing that got me was how intense she was about it. Sure, your company makes you ask, I get it ... But why do you care so much? Weird.


arebelspy

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #91 on: October 13, 2013, 08:48:38 AM »
This whole idea is CRAZY.  In my experience, here in Canada, cash buyers get the best discounts, and have the strongest negotiating position.

It's the kickbacks that are legal in the us, not Canada I'd bet. If you can get people into a finance deal that locks them in for above market rates, hey, well done!  Join the line of parasite businesses, like pay day loans, car title loans, free furniture ( hey, we'll throw in a free wide screen tv with that overpriced imported crap fake wood stuff)...

In the USA, exploiting naive ignorant low ( or high!)  income consumers is apparently a functioning business model. The car is just the bait, the debt is the objective. The fed will pretty much give you the cheap leverage, as long as the default rate is acceptable.

This.

I remember the eye opening experience of working at Nordstrom in college. I always wondered how they could have such a generous return policy. About a week into the job I realized they are just a bank that happens to have clothes you can borrow. Madness.

That's REALLY a great way to explain it.

I think this is how most stores are now, unfortunately. Last week I went to Williams Sonoma to get refills for my SodaStream, and the lady behind the counter was giving me the hard sell on getting the credit card -- "Why wouldn't you want 5% off today?"

Then when she asked me for my email address and I declined, she about went apoplectic. "But but but this is how you will be informed of our one-day sales over Christmas!" Like there's really something wrong with me if I'm not interested in that.

The thing that got me was how intense she was about it. Sure, your company makes you ask, I get it ... But why do you care so much? Weird.

When you've bought into something, others not doing so can often be threatening, as it potentially invalidates what you believe.  She'll just see you as "some nut" though and move on and be happy when the next customer whips out their W&S credit card and gab about the awesome emails with sales.
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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #92 on: October 13, 2013, 10:06:35 AM »
I think this is how most stores are now, unfortunately. Last week I went to Williams Sonoma to get refills for my SodaStream, and the lady behind the counter was giving me the hard sell on getting the credit card -- "Why wouldn't you want 5% off today?"

Then when she asked me for my email address and I declined, she about went apoplectic. "But but but this is how you will be informed of our one-day sales over Christmas!" Like there's really something wrong with me if I'm not interested in that.

The thing that got me was how intense she was about it. Sure, your company makes you ask, I get it ... But why do you care so much? Weird.

I would guess that it's because in her mind opening another credit card has zero ramifications, the only thing you are trading for that 5% off is your time.

dragoncar

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #93 on: October 13, 2013, 01:30:41 PM »
I think this is how most stores are now, unfortunately. Last week I went to Williams Sonoma to get refills for my SodaStream, and the lady behind the counter was giving me the hard sell on getting the credit card -- "Why wouldn't you want 5% off today?"

Then when she asked me for my email address and I declined, she about went apoplectic. "But but but this is how you will be informed of our one-day sales over Christmas!" Like there's really something wrong with me if I'm not interested in that.

The thing that got me was how intense she was about it. Sure, your company makes you ask, I get it ... But why do you care so much? Weird.

I would guess that it's because in her mind opening another credit card has zero ramifications, the only thing you are trading for that 5% off is your time.

Also at many places (not sure about WS), there is an incentive program for getting customers to sign up for the card.

Not sure about email addresses, but possibly for that too.

But the real question is why you are shopping at WS... I can't imagine they have the best price for anything.

Psychstache

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #94 on: October 13, 2013, 03:06:02 PM »
I think this is how most stores are now, unfortunately. Last week I went to Williams Sonoma to get refills for my SodaStream, and the lady behind the counter was giving me the hard sell on getting the credit card -- "Why wouldn't you want 5% off today?"

Then when she asked me for my email address and I declined, she about went apoplectic. "But but but this is how you will be informed of our one-day sales over Christmas!" Like there's really something wrong with me if I'm not interested in that.

The thing that got me was how intense she was about it. Sure, your company makes you ask, I get it ... But why do you care so much? Weird.

I would guess that it's because in her mind opening another credit card has zero ramifications, the only thing you are trading for that 5% off is your time.

Also at many places (not sure about WS), there is an incentive program for getting customers to sign up for the card.

Not sure about email addresses, but possibly for that too.

But the real question is why you are shopping at WS... I can't imagine they have the best price for anything.

Fact. We got bonuses for every CC application someone filled out, another if they had a card and upgraded to super mega platinum or other such nonsense, and another one if they were approved for any card.

madgeylou

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Re: Why is it so hard to buy a car cash?
« Reply #95 on: October 13, 2013, 04:03:08 PM »
I think this is how most stores are now, unfortunately. Last week I went to Williams Sonoma to get refills for my SodaStream, and the lady behind the counter was giving me the hard sell on getting the credit card -- "Why wouldn't you want 5% off today?"

Then when she asked me for my email address and I declined, she about went apoplectic. "But but but this is how you will be informed of our one-day sales over Christmas!" Like there's really something wrong with me if I'm not interested in that.

The thing that got me was how intense she was about it. Sure, your company makes you ask, I get it ... But why do you care so much? Weird.

I would guess that it's because in her mind opening another credit card has zero ramifications, the only thing you are trading for that 5% off is your time.

Also at many places (not sure about WS), there is an incentive program for getting customers to sign up for the card.

Not sure about email addresses, but possibly for that too.

But the real question is why you are shopping at WS... I can't imagine they have the best price for anything.

Haha, I thought that might come up! Actually their price on SodaStream canisters is the exact same as Target, but Target was out of refills that day, and WS is pretty close to my place.