The Money Mustache Community
Around the Internet => Antimustachian Wall of Shame and Comedy => Topic started by: remizidae on September 03, 2017, 10:35:35 AM
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So I made a homemade dessert the other day, and it was okay. I would say 6/10, happy to eat it but will not make it again. And then I started thinking about how much it cost.
Ingredients:
Apples--3.00
Rhubarb--3.50
Almonds--3.50
Sage--1.00
Yogurt--1.00
Total: TWELVE DOLLARS! (Plus butter, brown sugar, an egg, and bread crumbs, but those are cheap things I always have.)
We could have gone to some of the best restaurants in our city and split a dessert made by a chef for $8-10. Or gone to 7-11 and gotten two ice cream sandwiches for $2. Eating out would have been cheaper.
Now, I'm sure you're thinking of all the things I did wrong here. I didn't have to pick a recipe with fancy ingredients like rhubarb and sage, and I could have gotten the almonds at Costco instead of Whole Foods.
But the broader point is, don't assume that you are being as frugal as you can be by cooking at home. Pay attention to the cost (in time and money) of homecooking too. And consider how recipes can be tweaked to make them cheaper. I tend to slavishly follow recipes, but I could have made this one with an extra apple instead of rhubarb, dried sage instead of fresh, and peanuts instead of almonds. Very similar result for less money.[/list]
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That is an interesting ingredient list - what was the dessert? Recipe? How many servings will you get from it? 4? 6? 8? 10? And really, you need to compare apples to apples, not a home-made baked (?) dessert to ice cream bars.
Rhubarb is a spring harvest, I only see it in the grocery store then. And it is expensive. The rest of the time people use frozen. It is really easy to grow in a cold climate.
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If you want to be fancy, then expect to pay fancy prices. If you want to save money, eat simpler. You cannot have it all and FIRE. You have to pick and choose. That's just how it is.
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I disagree WhiteTrashCash (and I believe you've said the opposite in the past as well). Many fancy foods can be made on a budget, as long as you are smart with where you buy the ingredients (OP, I promise you the restaurant doesn't buy ingredients at WF). I just made a two layer chocolate cake with filling, ganache, and marshmalllow fondant cover for under 10$/16 servings. Easily fits within our reasonable 4$/person/day food framework.
I don't understand how apples for one dessert cost 3$.
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For a treat, my wife and I will go to a taco place with fancy tacos for $5 to $7 each. They are over-sized and 2 tacos are a meal. No rice and beans needed.
We share our love of this place with another couple. However, the other couple claims, "You can make it at home this cheap."
I disagree. When make tacos at home, they are a little simpler. However, they are much cheaper than $5 to $7 each.
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I think this is one of the main reasons that people will often come here and post about how they can't possibly get their grocery bill down.
They think they're making great choices, and they must be saving money by cooking at home, but it reality, they have no idea what their price per meal and price per serving is.
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If you need fresh herbs, grow them in your garden (otherwise use the much cheaper dried stuff).
Rhubarb is a ridiculously easy weed to grow around here. We grow it, harvest it in the spring, and then freeze it for the rest of the year. When you buy things out of season they become stupid expensive . . . so don't!
What quantity of apples/almonds did you use? I suspect that you were buying small quantities of these items which makes them much more expensive than when you get 'em in bulk.
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That is an interesting ingredient list - what was the dessert? Recipe? How many servings will you get from it? 4? 6? 8? 10? And really, you need to compare apples to apples, not a home-made baked (?) dessert to ice cream bars.
Rhubarb is a spring harvest, I only see it in the grocery store then. And it is expensive. The rest of the time people use frozen. It is really easy to grow in a cold climate.
+1 You really need to compare the unit price of each dish. Doesn't make sense to compare the cost of, say, 4 servings to splitting a single serving.
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I'm stuck on the idea of putting sage in an apple crisp. That sounds awful.
But I planted sage 10 years ago, and now have a lifetime supply every year. And rhubarb is something that people give away in the spring.
Home cooking is cheap, but you've gotta be mindful of what's in season, and what's pricy.
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That is an interesting ingredient list - what was the dessert? Recipe? How many servings will you get from it? 4? 6? 8? 10? And really, you need to compare apples to apples, not a home-made baked (?) dessert to ice cream bars.
I compare it to the ice cream bars because the ice cream bars would have been better, not to mention cheaper! I would say my dessert was about 5 servings, so $2+ per serving. It was a rhubarb and apple pudding from the cookbook Plenty More.
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If you need fresh herbs, grow them in your garden (otherwise use the much cheaper dried stuff).
Rhubarb is a ridiculously easy weed to grow around here. We grow it, harvest it in the spring, and then freeze it for the rest of the year. When you buy things out of season they become stupid expensive . . . so don't!
What quantity of apples/almonds did you use? I suspect that you were buying small quantities of these items which makes them much more expensive than when you get 'em in bulk.
I don't have a garden. You're right that I was using a small quantity of apples and almonds. But buying in bulk would not have been a great option either, because I don't typically eat those things (and limited storage space).
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I think this is one of the main reasons that people will often come here and post about how they can't possibly get their grocery bill down.
They think they're making great choices, and they must be saving money by cooking at home, but it reality, they have no idea what their price per meal and price per serving is.
Yeah, I think you're seeing my point more than a lot of the other replies. As a rule of thumb, homecooking is cheaper than restaurant cooking. But you can spend a lot of money on food while cooking at home, too. And it's hard to keep track of how much home cooking costs, because you're often using a small fraction of a lot of ingredients you already have. The only reason I was able to (roughly) see how much this recipe cost is that I had to go out and buy a bunch of new ingredients.
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Although it costs $12.00 to make the dessert, you need to break it down to cost-per-serving.
If a dessert makes 8 servings, then your cost per each serving is $1.50. If you ordered a slice of pie in a restaurant, it would probably cost a lot more.
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I compare it to the ice cream bars because the ice cream bars would have been better, not to mention cheaper! I would say my dessert was about 5 servings, so $2+ per serving. It was a rhubarb and apple pudding from the cookbook Plenty More.
Can't remember the last time I paid $2 for a dessert including tip at a restaurant. Sounds more like a candy bar at a gas station to me....
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It can be expensive for home cooking the first time you make something, simply because you may be buying a bunch of ingredients. But the things you only use a little of (baking powder/soda, herbs and spices) get used over and over, so cost per use is low.
Recipes - sage in a rhubarb/apple pudding sounds odd. Sage is a savory herb, not a sweet one. I use sage in turkey stuffing. Now if you had used cinnamon/nutmeg/ginger, that would be a great pudding. If you are trying a new recipe, it is often a good idea to Google recipes and see what ingredients they have in common. If only one calls for sage, it is not a standard ingredient.
Apples - there are eating apples and cooking apples - cooking apples tend to be sold by the bag and are a lot less expensive. I am curious which apple variety was used. And rhubarb, like GuitarSteve said, is easy to grow in areas where there are cold winters - otherwise it is an expensive ingredient. I like rhubarb and grow it, but if I had to buy it I doubt I would cook with it much.
So, takeaway, think of your ingredients as things that need to be chosen for cost and appropriateness.
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I disagree WhiteTrashCash (and I believe you've said the opposite in the past as well). Many fancy foods can be made on a budget, as long as you are smart with where you buy the ingredients (OP, I promise you the restaurant doesn't buy ingredients at WF). I just made a two layer chocolate cake with filling, ganache, and marshmalllow fondant cover for under 10$/16 servings. Easily fits within our reasonable 4$/person/day food framework.
I don't understand how apples for one dessert cost 3$.
I stand by what I said. I know many ways to make meals less expensive, but some meals are not within reach if you want to FIRE. You have to give some things up to reach your goals. You can choose to either be really fancy like people in the movies, or you can choose to accept reality, make some sacrifices, and get rich. That's just how it is.
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HI! I put in here the Canadian best prices... I don't actually buy apples right now because they are not quite in season and very expensive, even at lower cost stores. Dairy and eggs are expensive here, too compared to USA.
The basic comment that OP made is that you need to calculate the price of your favorite recipes per serving. So true! I did this for the 10 common recipes at our house, and it really helps to see where one ingredient is a huge cost to the overall dish, and helped me to understand how expensive produce really is most of the year.
I think this is the same recipe (Plenty More).
Esme Old Fashioned Pudding
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This hot and sweet pudding, with its super-crusty almond topping, is normally cooked for hours in an Aga using windfall apples. Savour this romantic image even with my real-world adjustments. With thanks to Esme Robinson for remembering this from her childhood, and for letting me shake up the old school with the addition of rhubarb and sage. --
100g unsalted butter, softened (Approx 1/3 cup butter $0.78; don't substitute as butter gives a ton of flavour to the topping)
160g dark muscovado sugar (WTF? okay, just use brown sugar $0.25)
100g ground almonds ($1.28 to $1.68 per 100 g yes, canada sells in lb and kg! I have to do a lot of math here when I shop...)
1 egg ($0.27 each)
700g cooking apples, peeled, cored and roughly grated (550g) @ $1.30 per lb, =$2.00
250g trimmed and sliced rhubarb, cut into 2cm pieces (Free? or $2)
50g demerara sugar (?why why with the special sugars? $0.25)
40g fresh breadcrumbs (Free or from the stale bread sliced ends, $0.20 Buy day old bread and make your own, lasts a long time in your pantry)
10g sage leaves, roughly chopped (Sage lasts forever, tiny amount here... maybe $0.15 for dried? I find fresh too powerful to use in just about anything... I grew it one year and developed a dislike for fresh)
250g Greek yoghurt (Make own for $1.25; buy for $3)
Serves 4-6
Price:Total: $4.45 CDN to $9 CDN
Price per unit (assume 5 servings) $0.90 to $1.80
So, I would say that a combination of shopping choices and / or using the cost of the larger package, even though a smaller amount was used, may be the culprit. The restaurant dessert would NOT have a topping with 100% almonds instead of flour or oatmeal crumbs, plus greek yogurt plus a lot of fresh fruit, as they need to make money, too. Also, funny, is that the intro describes using windfallen (scrub / free) apples is the traditional way to use this dish.
From the costs breakout above, it is easy to see where the costs came from.
I recommend using white sugar in the fruit, brown in the topping, dried sage, and something other than greek yogurt for the creaminess (sour cream or creme fraiche is classic for fruit desserts). Watch out for produce seasonal pricing, and substitute a different fruit or more apples, use a granny smith green apple instead for the rhubarb if local supply is pricey. Find recipes that use EITHER expensive fruit OR Greek yogurt OR Almonds, etc. Oh, and regift that cookbook to someone who likes to spend money and would love to see "different" recipes.
TLDR: One expensive ingredient per dish is all that is needed to show off, and it will cut your cooking costs dramatically. Get to know what the expensive ingredients are....
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Goldielocks, great analysis. I find Bulk Barn is great for odd quantities. And small quantities of things like dark brown sugar.
Maybe those specialty sugars are common in the UK - it looks like a UK recipe?
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If you want to be fancy, then expect to pay fancy prices. If you want to save money, eat simpler. You cannot have it all and FIRE. You have to pick and choose. That's just how it is.
I can't imagine that $12 vs $9 for an occasional treat would delay FIRE by even a day.
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PizzaSteve,
I think the poster meaning was different from how you took it: " some meals are not within reach if you want to FIRE."
I took this to mean that you don't try to eat fresh raspberry dessert in the winter, abalone in the mid-west, rack of lamb when the fish is free, that sort of comment.
The OP's recipe book appears to be meant to delight a foodie with foods that are not in season at the same time, and have several expensive and unusual ingredients and pairings without regard to freshness or cost. (or in your terms "skill at cooking" "understanding", etc.)
I would agree with the poster that "some meals", "some ingredients" aka "some cookbooks" are not intended for the person trying to save money.... one needs to eat seasonally and thoughtfully.
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One of the key things in eating well and cheaply at home is local, seasonal fruits and vegetables. In Australia, for example, mangoes grow up north in the summer; so here in the south in winter they'll be expensive. In the summer they'll be cheaper, but whatever time of year they'll never be as cheap as apples and stonefruit, which are grown in our state.
Most regions you'll find will have a webpage with local and seasonal fruit and vegies. For example, here in Melbourne it's just turned spring. I google "Melbourne spring seasonal fruit vegetables" and get as the first result,
https://sustainabletable.org.au/all-things-ethical-eating/seasonal-produce-guide/
so now I know what to look for in the shops. And I can plan menus around that. You don't do your financial investments just by buying whatever stocks are cheap on the day and hoping for the best, nor should you just buy whatever fruit and vegies are cheap and try to make a meal of them. You plan.
Learning to eat frugally is like how you might wonder how poor people live with $X a week budgeted for transport, or electricity, or food or whatever. They learn strategies the well-off have never had to. In time you'll learn that it's not necessary to spend $12 on ingredients for a dessert.
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And the counterpart to eating local food in season is not eating standard (for your area) food when you do go out. I never order anything in a restaurant that I can make at home. Restaurants are for trying new dishes (before you spend on new ingredients/equipment), different ethnic cuisines, etc. Then if you find something you love, you can start to learn how to cook it at home as well.
For people just starting to cook at home, there are lots of basic cookbooks - ones aimed at students are good, because they assume zero knowledge and minimal cooking equipment. Thrift stores/Kijiji/Craig's list are good places to get cooking equipment. The library and second-hand book stores are good places for cook books.
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Part of the issue is just the quantities involved, e.g., I need to buy a tub of almonds if I need 1/4 c., or a whole packet of sage for a few leaves. For things like almonds it's fine, because they keep, but I hate buying a $2 packet of sage and throwing half of it away two weeks later. So one of the things that I try to do is group recipes together that use those same extras -- for ex, if I want to do lettuce wraps, which require about half a bunch of cilantro, maybe I'll also do fajitas and guacamole to use up more of it.
Of course, then you have to combine that with the seasonal issues (I haven't made guacamole in a couple of months, because avocados have been $1-1.25 each).
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Laura33, no Bulk Barn or equivalent for dry goods? I can buy as much or as little of an ingredient as I want. Fresh herbs are an issue, I agree - for some my grocery store carries plants, and I try to baby them along in the house all winter until my garden can produce again. My rosemary started looking sad and I rooted cuttings, they are happy and the mother plant is dead (it was definitely sad).
It's all individual choices, cilantro tastes soapy to me so I don't use it. I love ripe sweet peppers, but they have been expensive lately, so I am eating brassicas and other local vegetables instead. And of course every vegetable tastes better with butter (or cheese).
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Laura33, no Bulk Barn or equivalent for dry goods? I can buy as much or as little of an ingredient as I want.
Well, the only place I have found with bulk bins is Wegman's -- and if I go there, I am far more likely to drop more on prosciutto and lovely fruit tarts than I would save on almonds. ;-). So for me, it's safer to stick with whatever Aldi's offers, in whatever size they have available.
And on-topic, I am annoyed that the recipe my DH specifically requested this week calls for one pear, and Aldi's only had them in 3-lb bags. Guess it's time to look up some pear recipes.
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Laura33, no Bulk Barn or equivalent for dry goods? I can buy as much or as little of an ingredient as I want.
Well, the only place I have found with bulk bins is Wegman's -- and if I go there, I am far more likely to drop more on prosciutto and lovely fruit tarts than I would save on almonds. ;-). So for me, it's safer to stick with whatever Aldi's offers, in whatever size they have available.
And on-topic, I am annoyed that the recipe my DH specifically requested this week calls for one pear, and Aldi's only had them in 3-lb bags. Guess it's time to look up some pear recipes.
Ouch - shouldn't pears be almost in season now?
We have a chain called Bulk Barn, where you can buy in bulk, or in tiny. No fresh produce or meat, just dry bulk. I loved it when DD was small because I could rent fancy cake tins there.
http://www.bulkbarn.ca/en/Home (http://www.bulkbarn.ca/en/Home)
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Shopping with your middle finger applies to recipes too. Search for recipes that use what you have or can get cheaply (the Allrecipes app lets you search by ingredient, or just Google it). Skip over the ones that call for something expensive that you can't substitute.
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Some ingredients are expensive, but that doesn't make them cheaper at a restaurant than at home.
I like to cook, and am not much interested in restuarant food, so sometimes I splurge on a special ingredient - I hunted down a bottle of rose water this winter, for instance. It's still cheaper for us to eat at home than to go out.
Plus, I find that "fresh" food that isn't local/in season is not usually all that great anyway. I grew up eating fish that my dad and grandfather had caught and cleaned that very day, and was "shocked" to find that there really is no wonderful seafood in the midwest. Fresh makes a difference. So, I don't bother. I don't order that at restaurants, and I don't waste my money on it at the store.
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Part of the issue is just the quantities involved, e.g., I need to buy a tub of almonds if I need 1/4 c., or a whole packet of sage for a few leaves. For things like almonds it's fine, because they keep, but I hate buying a $2 packet of sage and throwing half of it away two weeks later. So one of the things that I try to do is group recipes together that use those same extras -- for ex, if I want to do lettuce wraps, which require about half a bunch of cilantro, maybe I'll also do fajitas and guacamole to use up more of it.
Of course, then you have to combine that with the seasonal issues (I haven't made guacamole in a couple of months, because avocados have been $1-1.25 each).
This is the argument places like Blue Apron use. It "saves" you money because you don't have to buy all the extra.
It fails for people who cook often and have well stocked pantries though.
We received a few deliveries when DH (the household's primary cook- I just boil stuff) was injured last year to "help" me (it's hard to mess it up when everything is planned for you). Each delivery something was broken, and while the company gave us refunds or shipped an extra box in the subscription, every time, I was able to reach into the pantry and get what we needed. Masa- we have it, pretty much any spice- got it, any type of vinegar- got that covered, need an herb- check the garden, etc
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Generally speaking, I don't put a spending limit on the grocery because in the fullness of time it will always cost less then going out. However, I have done a few facepunch-worthy home cooked meals. I recently wanted to make a crab & cheese casserole. Instead of using imitation, I used real crab. Lump not claw. And I need 2 16 oz. containers, not one. And I wanted some fresh mozzarella and sharp cheddar. And I got all my ingredients from "The Fresh Market" not from the more mundane common grocery. Cha-ching!!!
It was delicious.
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Some things just seem to be cheaper bought than homemade.
There is no way I could make a Costco rotisserie chicken for the price they sell them. I mean you have to account for oven electricity and washing the pans afterwards.
Same goes for the gigantic pumpkin pie they sell, especially when it is $2 off. It is around $5 for a pie that serves maybe 20 people.
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I make quite fancy stuff all the freaking time with ingredients bought for practically nothing. The idea that you have to give up on anything you enjoy to avoid spending too much money is false, you just have to shop better and plan better.
If you shop at places like Whole Foods for anything - that is just a giant facepunch right off the bat. That, along with buying generally expensive ingredients in the tiny convenience packets (like nuts or spices), and making things requiring fresh food out of season... yeah, facepunchy cooking.
For instance: I make pumpkin ravioli with browned butter, Parmesan cheese and roasted walnuts - gourmet AF - with pumpkin puree I bought on clearance for like 25¢ for a giant can because it was dented. I tend to find lots of these around October, so I stock up. Pies cost me under $2 and that's including the from scratch crust.
I shop the dented can section, ugly fruit & veggie sections, and the clearance sections and usually find stuff that is super expensive slashed to practically nothing. I get fancy cuts of meat, steaks, fancy cheeses... but mostly great deals on pantry staples.
Nuts are bought when they go on super sale, in bulk, then roasted in the oven and then frozen; they keep forever that way. You can even freeze butter. Most hard cheeses freeze well. I am pretty stoked about the number of things you can freeze if you're planning on using it to cook with.
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Some things just seem to be cheaper bought than homemade.
There is no way I could make a Costco rotisserie chicken for the price they sell them. I mean you have to account for oven electricity and washing the pans afterwards.
Same goes for the gigantic pumpkin pie they sell, especially when it is $2 off. It is around $5 for a pie that serves maybe 20 people.
Yes to the Costco chicken. I make a good roast chicken but have mostly switched to Costco at this point. For whatever reason Costco chicken bones make better stock than my roast chickens too.
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My POV is that bread pudding is a dish designed to use up stale bread and old or extra milk and eggs. Taking a yummy, delicious frugal dessert and adding expensive ingredients seems silly to me.
Also, your restaurant dessert comparison is skewed because you're not counting tax, tip and the likelihood that you're ordering it after a restaurant-priced meal.
If you want an expensive dessert, fine, but don't make a federal case thread out if it. Sheesh.
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Like others have said, on a per serving basis, it's likely much less expensive than a restaurant. The closest restaurants to me have $10/plate meals at minimum, and I have to bust out some super premium stuff to get to that level. When I cook standing rib roast for my in-laws, that can get up to like $12/head. I suppose if I start throwing in crap like bacon-wrapped scallop appetizers I can start rivaling the $20/head that UMC people spend on mid-tier restaurants.
I tend to find meals are pretty cheap, unless I start getting really into rubs and marinades and sauces, which tend to add considerably to the per-serving cost. I limit myself on those because doing them every night will get pricey. Like, I'll probably make coq au vin this Friday, but I use a LOT of red wine to marinate, enough to add probably $2-$2.50 per serving. It tastes realllllllllyyyyyy good, and all the rest of it is just chicken leg quarters and staple veggies (celery/onion/carrot), but that damned red wine keeps me from doing it very often.
Well, that, and it's time-intensive to braise.
Thankfully, the herb garden produces some good stuff which produce a lot of flavor. Roasting potatoes with rosemary is delicious. I could have that every day.
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Thankfully, the herb garden produces some good stuff which produce a lot of flavor. Roasting potatoes with rosemary is delicious. I could have that every day.
Yeah, I think the most Mustachian thing I've done cooking wise is growing my own herbs. I pulled up a couple of paving slabs and grow in the gaps: rosemary, sage, thyme, mint and lemon balm, which are buy once, neglect for years kind of plants, and basil, oregano and parsley, which you seem to have to buy/plant new seeds each year.
No luck with chive seeds so far.
Saves me a fortune over buying little packs of fresh herbs, and you've always got them on hand so never need to pop out for them. Brilliant for adding to potatoes, pasta and roasts - and mojitos!
The other stuff I've tried to grow is a bit of a wash in terms of cost/taste/effort, except courgettes/zucchini, which are happy being neglected in pots.
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I've had miserable luck with dwarf squash in a pot this year. They grow like crazy in the actual garden, but it dries out extremely quickly in the pot. I eventually just gave up.
Chives and rosemary and mint are all fantastic for pots. Mint for me is not very Mustachian, though....I only really use them for mojitos.
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Be careful about ignoring mint. It's invasive as hell. Put it in a pot, keep it far off the ground and check for runners religiously. Your future self will thank you profusely.
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I tend to find meals are pretty cheap, unless I start getting really into rubs and marinades and sauces, which tend to add considerably to the per-serving cost. I limit myself on those because doing them every night will get pricey. Like, I'll probably make coq au vin this Friday, but I use a LOT of red wine to marinate, enough to add probably $2-$2.50 per serving. It tastes realllllllllyyyyyy good, and all the rest of it is just chicken leg quarters and staple veggies (celery/onion/carrot), but that damned red wine keeps me from doing it very often.
I can buy a cooking quality red wine for not a huge amount of money ($6.45 CAN at the LCBO for a Pinot noir). If I wanted to do a lot of marinating I think I would head down to my local wine-making place and make my 28 750 ml bottles for $135 (using my saved bottles, of course) and end up with a nicer wine.
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Some things just seem to be cheaper bought than homemade.
There is no way I could make a Costco rotisserie chicken for the price they sell them. I mean you have to account for oven electricity and washing the pans afterwards.
Same goes for the gigantic pumpkin pie they sell, especially when it is $2 off. It is around $5 for a pie that serves maybe 20 people.
I saw an interview with someone high up in Costco where they specifically mention the rotisserie chicken and the hotdog combo as loss leaders that they keep around because it gets people in the door and they have sort of a reputation for them.
I still roast my own chickens because I like doing it, and fresh is better.
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I have heard that Costco loses a ton of money on the chickens.
But I'm not convinced hot dog + soda is a loss leader so much as just not a money maker.
Let's look at the price to BUY hot dogs at Costco. (And this is what they sell to customers at).
I had to use delivery zipcode 90210, because they don't deliver to any of the 8 other zipcodes I tried and that one popped into my head. Maybe it is more expensive than others, I don't know.
24 buns: 3.29
36 hot dogs: 14.39
So for 72 hot dogs (3 packs of buns, 2 packs of dogs) it costs: $67.43. That is $0.94 cents a hot dog. Which leaves 56 cents for the soda. Fountain soda is CHEAP. And that isn't Costco's cost for the food items, i'm just using their prices to compare.
Yes, there are staffing costs, but unless you want to tell me the entire food court is a loss leader on that (and it might be)- I'm not thinking the "famous" hot dog combo is losing them much.
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So for 72 hot dogs (3 packs of buns, 2 packs of dogs) it costs: $67.43. That is $0.94 cents a hot dog. Which leaves 56 cents for the soda. Fountain soda is CHEAP. And that isn't Costco's cost for the food items, i'm just using their prices to compare.
Yes, there are staffing costs, but unless you want to tell me the entire food court is a loss leader on that (and it might be)- I'm not thinking the "famous" hot dog combo is losing them much.
You're also forgetting the cost of heating/cooling/storing/spoilage for the ingredients, the cost of the napkins, plates, cups, and other things, the cost of employing workers (also gotta include payroll, insurance), and the overhead (insurance, ect). Then you also have to factor in equipment and depreciation and many more things. I don't know how most restaurants figure it, but if you're selling an item for $1.50 and your cost of ingredients is around a buck, then yes you are losing money on each sale once you add in everything else.
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So for 72 hot dogs (3 packs of buns, 2 packs of dogs) it costs: $67.43. That is $0.94 cents a hot dog. Which leaves 56 cents for the soda. Fountain soda is CHEAP. And that isn't Costco's cost for the food items, i'm just using their prices to compare.
Yes, there are staffing costs, but unless you want to tell me the entire food court is a loss leader on that (and it might be)- I'm not thinking the "famous" hot dog combo is losing them much.
You're also forgetting the cost of heating/cooling/storing/spoilage for the ingredients, the cost of the napkins, plates, cups, and other things, the cost of employing workers (also gotta include payroll, insurance), and the overhead (insurance, ect). Then you also have to factor in equipment and depreciation and many more things. I don't know how most restaurants figure it, but if you're selling an item for $1.50 and your cost of ingredients is around a buck, then yes you are losing money on each sale once you add in everything else.
My understanding from a culinary arts class some years ago: The rough rule of thumb for restaurants is just under 1/3 of the price covers ingredients, a little under 1/3 labor, and again just under 1/3 overhead (rent, insurance, ...). Profit margins are thin, in the 2-5% range. Restaurants buy wholesale so they get ingredients for less but then they also need to make a profit, so an equivalent dish prepared at home will always be 1/3 the cost unless it's a loss leader.
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How much is a medium onion cost, because you have not seen someone crank that onion grinder on their Costco hotdog until you have witnessed my wife at it.
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I tend to find meals are pretty cheap, unless I start getting really into rubs and marinades and sauces, which tend to add considerably to the per-serving cost. I limit myself on those because doing them every night will get pricey. Like, I'll probably make coq au vin this Friday, but I use a LOT of red wine to marinate, enough to add probably $2-$2.50 per serving. It tastes realllllllllyyyyyy good, and all the rest of it is just chicken leg quarters and staple veggies (celery/onion/carrot), but that damned red wine keeps me from doing it very often.
I can buy a cooking quality red wine for not a huge amount of money ($6.45 CAN at the LCBO for a Pinot noir). If I wanted to do a lot of marinating I think I would head down to my local wine-making place and make my 28 750 ml bottles for $135 (using my saved bottles, of course) and end up with a nicer wine.
From what I recall, I generally use economy wines that come out to 8.99 for 1.75 ML. But I entirely cover chicken quarters with red wine, which (again from memory) takes me about a bit more than half the bottle when I am making leg quarters for my wife and I. It averages out to about $5/wine, or $2.50/head. There's enough chicken left over (usually) for one more meal, so call it $1.67 per meal.
I mean, I'm okay with it once every 6 months (which is why I can't remember any of this crap off the top of my head), especially since the rest of the ingredients are cheap (French mirepoix, garlic, and chicken leg quarters). It'd add up if I start doing this once a week or something.
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My understanding from a culinary arts class some years ago: The rough rule of thumb for restaurants is just under 1/3 of the price covers ingredients, a little under 1/3 labor, and again just under 1/3 overhead (rent, insurance, ...). Profit margins are thin, in the 2-5% range. Restaurants buy wholesale so they get ingredients for less but then they also need to make a profit, so an equivalent dish prepared at home will always be 1/3 the cost unless it's a loss leader.
Do restaurants still put "loss leader" items on their menus?
Restaurant food has gone up so much in recent years. I haven't wanted to dine out lately after several negative experiences. My spouse and I enjoyed a Cuban restaurant for a while, but the waiter would always bring the check to the table while we were still eating and chewing our food, and try subtle ways to pressure us to leave, literally as soon as we started eating our food. He also refused to serve coffee or dessert after dinner, always saying "we're all out, sorry". So we do not go there anymore. I feel like restaurants cost too much to put up with that. I'd rather cook my own food. I saw a news report recently about some restaurant workers caught chopping food on the sidewalk behind the restaurant, in the alley, with dead rats nearby. My kitchen would be far more likely to pass a health inspection than a lot of these restaurant kitchens are.
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I grew up eating fish that my dad and grandfather had caught and cleaned that very day, and was "shocked" to find that there really is no wonderful seafood in the midwest.
While it is true that there's no ocean seafood in the midwest, there's TONS of freshwater seafood. My brother goes salmon fishing on Lake Michigan frequently, and if you spend any time in Minnesota, you'll have more panfish, pike, walleye, and bass than you can shake a stick at. Hell, we've even got freshwater snails that people make escargot out of.
I grew up on fresh panfish out of the lake in my backyard, so I understand the disappointment over what's in the stores and restaurants. But don't sell the midwest short, you just don't know the right people. ;-)
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And I do love good, fresh walleye - but again, it's seasonal, plus the worry about contamination , means it's a very, very occasional treat.
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Ok, your first mistake is not telling us how many servings were in the dessert and working out the cost per serving. The second is ignoring the fact that restaurants deal in economies of scale - they make 100 desserts at a time and buy in bulk which saves money. Third is that restaurants plan their menus around what they're been able to buy cheap, usually because it's in season. Did you? And the fourth mistake is that restaurants also have to factor in such things as rent and staffing costs, while you don't.
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So for 72 hot dogs (3 packs of buns, 2 packs of dogs) it costs: $67.43. That is $0.94 cents a hot dog. Which leaves 56 cents for the soda. Fountain soda is CHEAP. And that isn't Costco's cost for the food items, i'm just using their prices to compare.
Yes, there are staffing costs, but unless you want to tell me the entire food court is a loss leader on that (and it might be)- I'm not thinking the "famous" hot dog combo is losing them much.
You're also forgetting the cost of heating/cooling/storing/spoilage for the ingredients, the cost of the napkins, plates, cups, and other things, the cost of employing workers (also gotta include payroll, insurance), and the overhead (insurance, ect). Then you also have to factor in equipment and depreciation and many more things. I don't know how most restaurants figure it, but if you're selling an item for $1.50 and your cost of ingredients is around a buck, then yes you are losing money on each sale once you add in everything else.
But -I- can get the ingredients for less than a buck. Surely Costco pays way less than that.
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Home cooking is always cheaper than eating out, but only if you compare items of equal quality.
I can purchase a $25 steak at the butcher and it's true that I'll have spent $25 on one meat serving. However, steak is often marked up around 150% in restaurants, so that same steak at a good steakhouse would cost $75. It's not fair to compare the cost of a $25 homemade steak with a steak dinner from a chain restaurant that's far inferior in quality.
You can spend a huge amount of money cooking at home if you pay no regards to luxury items versus inexpensive staples. People who randomly choose new recipes and then buy a bunch of ingredients to make each new meal often overspend and get the impression that home cooking isn't that great of a deal. Meal planning is just a skill that involves strategically planning menus while keeping a nicely stocked kitchen that eliminates the need to purchase high price items in small quantities over and over again.
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One other thing I think you just can't beat by making it at home is the Papa Murphy's Tuesday special any large pizza for $10. You can get the stuffed crust pizza with everything on it and that sucker seriously can feed 4 to 5 people. Even if you made your own dough/crust I do not think you could buy the sauce, cheese and all of the veggies and meats that thing has on it.
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I think of cooking as having three different tiers. Tier 1 is full-on Mustachian cooking--lots of cheap staples and in-season produce, inexpensive proteins judicially used, planning recipes and menus to use available ingredients, never wasting food, no convenience foods, making staples like yogurt from scratch, perhaps leveraging sales, coupons, outlet stores, etc. to buy as cheaply as possible.
Tier 2 is mid-range cooking. You probably use a few of Tier 1 strategies, but you don't feel bound to follow all of them.
Tier 3 is cooking whatever you want whenever you want, shopping at very expensive stores, tossing leftovers, etc.
You can always save money by dropping down a tier, but the costs in terms of skill, time and family buy-in rise at the same time. And it's harder to drop from Tier 2 to Tier 1 than from Tier 3 to Tier 2. Personally, I am totally capable of cooking at Tier 1, and have (as a poor grad student), but frankly I don't want to any more. I like being able to whip up a batch of chocolate-chip cookies whenever I want. There may be a few people who are at Tier 2 because they don't know about Tier 1, but I think most people are making rational decisions based on their personal circumstances. (See that other thread about spouses who refuse to cooperate with various money-saving strategies on groceries.)
The original recipe cited in this thread could be either Tier 2 or Tier 3 depending on how often you cook like that, how many servings, and where the ingredients were obtained. So it could be either a rational treat, or it could be a symptom of grocery ridiculousness.
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One other thing I think you just can't beat by making it at home is the Papa Murphy's Tuesday special any large pizza for $10. You can get the stuffed crust pizza with everything on it and that sucker seriously can feed 4 to 5 people. Even if you made your own dough/crust I do not think you could buy the sauce, cheese and all of the veggies and meats that thing has on it.
I got curious because I make pizza at home, and I found on this blog, that two cheese pizzas can be made at home for $3.25, or $1.62 per pizza. Of course, that's without adding meat, which I don't eat anyway. But I think even if you add some meat toppings, it would still come out far less than $10.00.
Little Caesar's has one topping, ready to go pizza for $6.00 and that is usually what we get, if we buy pizza instead of making it at home.
CiCi's all you can eat pizza buffet is very cheap, also and kids age 2 and under, eat free.
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Again, to make a fair comparison, you have to realize exactly how big the large stuffed crust with everything pizza is. I think it is around 5 pounds. Normal price is $17 or $18 so $10 is a real discount.
We cut it in half and cook half each day. Even doing that we are probably eating double what we should eat. It is a sometimes food for sure, not every week or even every month.
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My understanding from a culinary arts class some years ago: The rough rule of thumb for restaurants is just under 1/3 of the price covers ingredients, a little under 1/3 labor, and again just under 1/3 overhead (rent, insurance, ...). Profit margins are thin, in the 2-5% range. Restaurants buy wholesale so they get ingredients for less but then they also need to make a profit, so an equivalent dish prepared at home will always be 1/3 the cost unless it's a loss leader.
+1
From someone who has spent years in the food industry: rule of thumb is the menu cost is ~1/3 the ingredient cost at service restaurants. For "white linen" (aka high-end) places the ratio is more like 1/4, as have more a higher ratio of staff to clients. Restaurants have to take so many shortcuts to get consistent meals in front of their clients in a timely manner. With just a modicum of skill one can cook similar meals at home for a fraction of the cost.
Despite popular perception that restaurants are buying the "highest quality ingredients" or are somehow getting mad wholesale discounts from distributors, restaurants are basically buying the same stuff available to the home cook.
Go into any CostCo when it opens on Thursday and note the half dozen men (and they are almost always men) with 100lb+ of meat in a cart. They are chefs at small independent restaurants. Chain restaurants and larger restaurants generally get meat and produce delivered directly, but they are saving time, not cost. When I worked the distribution end and sold seafood to both the public and restaurants our biggest customers payed just 15% less with standing $1,000+ bi-weekly orders than Joe-Shmoe who walked up and wanted to buy half a pound of shrimp.
What good restaurants do brilliantly is put everything to use. Chowders and stews are popular specials on Mondays because they gobble up any unsold and soon-to-spoil meat and fish. Carrot tops and onion peels go into "the pot" to make stock (almost every good kitchen has one).
And ultimately, chefs buy ingredients based on what is cheap and what can give them a good return on their investment.
All of these are tricks home cooks can also employ.
By and large we eat like kings in our household, and the per-plate cost to us is typically under $3.
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^ I was in line at Costco (Ottawa) once behind a couple who run a restaurant outside of Ottawa. Lots of meat in their cart. Regular Costco price.
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A trip to Gordon Food Service is also instructive.
I buy the giant cans of pizza sauce there and freeze it in individual pizza sizes. Also pepperoni is incredibly inexpensive. It probably adds 25 cents to the price of a large pizza.
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Do restaurants still put "loss leader" items on their menus?
I never worked in one that did. The real profit was in drinks. A bottle of wine cost the restaurant $10, and would make 5 glasses, sold for $4.50 each, so $2 profit per glass. Coke came from a box of syrup mixed with soda water through a machine, was sold for $2 and cost about $0.25 to make. And so on. Ten years later that product cost would be lower while the retail cost is higher.
We experimented and found that putting extra salt in food raised drink sales 25%, ie at a table of 4, one person would order an extra drink as a result.
rdanlee0 expressed it well in saying that if you just buy a bunch of random ingredients for one recipe you've never done before, you'll get the impression home cooking is expensive. The comparison with restaurants is useful: restaurants have a menu and a plan, and in so doing they rely on a few basic perishable ingredients, plus a lot of less-used but non-perishable ingredients, and they carefully choose how much of each to buy so as to minimise food wastage.
Restaurants have a menu and a stocklist. Do you?
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Do restaurants still put "loss leader" items on their menus?
I never worked in one that did. The real profit was in drinks. A bottle of wine cost the restaurant $10, and would make 5 glasses, sold for $4.50 each, so $2 profit per glass. Coke came from a box of syrup mixed with soda water through a machine, was sold for $2 and cost about $0.25 to make. And so on.
The real loss-leaders are the things they don't charge for at all - the basket of bread and the salty (always salty!) barsnacks designed to increase patrons' thirst.
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Now, I'm sure you're thinking of all the things I did wrong here. I didn't have to pick a recipe with fancy ingredients like rhubarb and sage, and I could have gotten the almonds at Costco instead of Whole Foods.
Yeah, I am thinking that. I'm also thinking that for that much money you must've made a dessert large enough for the family to enjoy for several days ... that doesn't stack up against a one-serving purchase from a restaurant.
I just made a two layer chocolate cake with filling, ganache, and marshmalllow fondant cover for under 10$/16 servings. Easily fits within our reasonable 4$/person/day food framework.
Yes, for "everyday" I often make doctored-up cake mixes in a bundt pan /no icing ... that tends to run $3-4 for a cake, which lasts a week. Not a big expense at all.
I stand by what I said. I know many ways to make meals less expensive, but some meals are not within reach if you want to FIRE. You have to give some things up to reach your goals. You can choose to either be really fancy like people in the movies, or you can choose to accept reality, make some sacrifices, and get rich. That's just how it is.
Eh, if you say "some meals are not within reach ON A REGULAR BASIS if you want to reach FIRE", then I'll agree. We cook really excellent steaks or swordfish (accompanied by fresh vegetables and my homemade cheesecake, which beats Cheesecake Factory on their best day) on special occasions -- Valentine's Day, our anniversary, maybe Mother's Day. These are expensive meals, but less expensive than going out to dinner for those holidays. Now, if we cooked with those expensive ingredients every weekend -- yeah -- I'd say it would be an obstacle to long-term success, but occasionally it's a reasonable splurge.
It's all individual choices, cilantro tastes soapy to me so I don't use it.
My Chemist SIL says that's in your DNA. To me, cilantro tastes like freshness and springtime; I'd eat a whole bowl of the stuff -- and I can't think of another food I'd describe with that phrase. But if you're in the DNA group for whom it tastes like soap, it'll always be that way for you -- it's not about the recipe or the preparation.
There is no way I could make a Costco rotisserie chicken for the price they sell them. I mean you have to account for oven electricity and washing the pans afterwards.
True, but I can make a much, much better roasted chicken. The same is true of lasagna: I can make a better lasagna, but (on sale at least) Stouffers beats me on price.
Do restaurants still put "loss leader" items on their menus?
I don't know about that, but I've read that people are most likely to order #3 on the menu ... so restaurants put their highest-profit item as the third item on the menu. I've looked over various menus with this in mind, and I think it's true -- at least for big chains whose menu is created at the regional/national level, probably not true for Mom & Pop's diner.
rdanlee0 expressed it well in saying that if you just buy a bunch of random ingredients for one recipe you've never done before, you'll get the impression home cooking is expensive.
Whereas, if you're looking at a recipe for "good old home cooking", you may already have everything you need. For example, today I was trolling Pinterest and came across a White Chicken Chili recipe I thought looked good -- yep, I already had everything in my pantry: Frozen chicken, it called for White Northern Beans but I had Canelllis, can of green chilis, and some spices. DONE.
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It's all individual choices, cilantro tastes soapy to me so I don't use it.
My Chemist SIL says that's in your DNA. To me, cilantro tastes like freshness and springtime; I'd eat a whole bowl of the stuff -- and I can't think of another food I'd describe with that phrase. But if you're in the DNA group for whom it tastes like soap, it'll always be that way for you -- it's not about the recipe or the preparation.
Oh, I know - it just means that if there is cilantro in the recipe, it isn't in my version. Just like I don't like anise (or black licorice). So I don't grow them or use them.
Part of the home-cooking trick is to know which ingredients you/your family like or avoid, so you don't end up making something you don't like, or your family won't eat.
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What I have seen, is that restaurants price most of their entree items, around the same. So if you're a vegetarian, you will still pay almost as much as a person buying steak. Which is one reason I don't like restaurants anymore. I feel forced into spending X amount of money, no matter what. I totally understand, as a business, they need to earn profits, but they have gotten pretty aggressive in recent years towards their customers. And service isn't always that great.
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What I have seen, is that restaurants price most of their entree items, around the same. So if you're a vegetarian, you will still pay almost as much as a person buying steak. Which is one reason I don't like restaurants anymore. I feel forced into spending X amount of money, no matter what. I totally understand, as a business, they need to earn profits, but they have gotten pretty aggressive in recent years towards their customers. And service isn't always that great.
I must admit, I'm curious about your recent experiences with eating out and which restaurants you are visiting (and how you are finding them). For certain the place that gave you your cheque while you were still eating and refused to serve you coffee was run by an owner who was overly concerned with 'turnover' and should be avoided.
The complaint about vegetarian meals costing almost as much as ones with meat is one I hear a lot, and honestly I think the outrage is misguided. Very little of what you are paying for is the cost of the ingredients. Regardless of what you order your dishes must be cleaned, a server must bring them to you and the fixed costs (rent, electricity, decor, payroll etc) don't change. To be sure a $14 salad costs less and takes less time to prepare than a steak, but some dishes (looking at you veggie risotto!) actually take more effort in the kitchen than the steak.
FWIW and despite my previous employment (or perhaps because of it?) we rarely go out anymore either. when we do we make an effort to eat at places that will give us experiences we value, which the opposite of places that are obsessed with turnover or that make dishes we frquently make at home. YMMV.
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What I have seen, is that restaurants price most of their entree items, around the same. So if you're a vegetarian, you will still pay almost as much as a person buying steak. Which is one reason I don't like restaurants anymore. I feel forced into spending X amount of money, no matter what. I totally understand, as a business, they need to earn profits, but they have gotten pretty aggressive in recent years towards their customers. And service isn't always that great.
I must admit, I'm curious about your recent experiences with eating out and which restaurants you are visiting (and how you are finding them). For certain the place that gave you your cheque while you were still eating and refused to serve you coffee was run by an owner who was overly concerned with 'turnover' and should be avoided.
The complaint about vegetarian meals costing almost as much as ones with meat is one I hear a lot, and honestly I think the outrage is misguided. Very little of what you are paying for is the cost of the ingredients. Regardless of what you order your dishes must be cleaned, a server must bring them to you and the fixed costs (rent, electricity, decor, payroll etc) don't change. To be sure a $14 salad costs less and takes less time to prepare than a steak, but some dishes (looking at you veggie risotto!) actually take more effort in the kitchen than the steak.
I don't really agree that you're paying for the cost of service when you buy food at a restaurant. The service is paid for separately as a tip to the waiter, so that's not really worked into the food costs. The businesses around here pay waiters $2.17 an hour (which is nothing) and they have to earn tips, which they have to share with the bus boys, cooks, etc. Some restaurants pay their waiters nothing because they hire what they call "interns" from local high schools to work for so-called "job training". They even have to buy their own uniforms.
I'm not outraged at the cost of the food, I just don't buy it anymore from restaurants. I don't see why a plate of spaghetti with tomato sauce should cost $22.00 and a meat entree with shrimp or lobster cost $22.50. That just seems strange.
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of course you are paying for service. There's a lot more that goes into your meal than the server who brings it to you. The hostess who takes your reservation and seats you, the dishwasher who makes sure everything is clean, the prep-cook(s) & pantry girl/boy & line cook that all play a hand in actually cooking and plating your meal, the maître d'hotel/manager who makes things run smoothly, the cleaners who wipe every single surface before & after every service... there's a lot of service that goes into a meal where everything is brought to you and everything is cleaned up afterward.
Roughly a third of your meal goes towards paying all those people ("payroll"). Those costs, along with the overhead (rent, utilities, decor) are basically fixed regardless of what you order.
Yes, the runners and servers often make crap wages and rely on tips, but the whole kitchen doesn't (except in rare cases where the house splits all tips).
don't see why a plate of spaghetti with tomato sauce should cost $22.00 and a meat entree with shrimp or lobster cost $22.50. That just seems strange.
Well - I've never seen *that* big of a price discrepancy before (or lobster that cheap outside of Maine in the summer)- but ~2/3 of the cost of every plate has nothing to do with the ingredients. That's the major reason why dishes all cluster around a price point for a given establishment. If its house-made pasta and sauce, yes that ought to cost a similar amount to other meat dishes. If its not... well don't order it. Anywhere. Ever. (just my 2¢ about dried pasta in general).
IMO a better question to ask yourself is this: Is this meal of spaghetti with tomato sauce worth the price I pay given the experience? If the answer is no, well then you have your answer. Many restaurants aren't worth the price but its an individual decision.
Just to be clear, i'm not trying to be harsh or attack anyone; hopefully my resposnes explain some common how restaurants run as a business.
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Put another way, you are not paying for the nutritional value or taste of the food so much as you are paying for the experience - the food presentation, the chairs and tables, the music, the atmosphere or the place, someone else cleans up, and so on.
The last proper restaurant meal I had was at an upmarket pub. I had the roo steak and my friend had a parmagiana, we each had a Guinness. It was I think $72 in all. I had a nice lunch and a nice adult conversation with a friend, it was worth it. Now, I can't afford to do that every day, but...
I don't begrudge them the money. The limit on my restaurant spending is not my wallet, it's my children. With a 6yo at school and a 1yo at home, and working from home while my wife does a 9-5, I just don't get out often.
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The last proper restaurant meal I had was at an upmarket pub. I had the roo steak and my friend had a parmagiana, we each had a Guinness. It was I think $72 in all. I had a nice lunch and a nice adult conversation with a friend, it was worth it. Now, I can't afford to do that every day, but...
Why the teeny-tiny font Kyle? I couldn't even read it until clicked "respond".
Odd - I've never eaten 'Roo before (guessing that's Kangaroo?). That surprises me as I've tried a lot of different critters. What does it taste like?
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Again, to make a fair comparison, you have to realize exactly how big the large stuffed crust with everything pizza is. I think it is around 5 pounds. Normal price is $17 or $18 so $10 is a real discount.
We cut it in half and cook half each day. Even doing that we are probably eating double what we should eat. It is a sometimes food for sure, not every week or even every month.
I agree with you on the value of this pizza. I did the same math, and used to get one of the stuffed-crust pizzas about twice a month on Tuesdays. It fed my whole family of 4 that night, plus lunch leftover for a couple of us the next day. Both of the Papa Murphy's near us closed in the last 2 years. :(
It's very good re-heated - why do you only bake half of it at a time? Heating the oven costs $, you know! ;)
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It's very good re-heated - why do you only bake half of it at a time? Heating the oven costs $, you know! ;)
Only during the summer for us cold-climate folks.
:-P
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Well, a lot of people criticize Starbuck's coffee saying it's over priced, but they don't realize that it's not coffee off a burner. Each drink is individually hand-made, that's why it costs so much. The milk has to be foamed, most of the drinks are espresso based and therefore espresso machines are needed to make them.
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Well, a lot of people criticize Starbuck's coffee saying it's over priced, but they don't realize that it's not coffee off a burner. Each drink is individually hand-made, that's why it costs so much. The milk has to be foamed, most of the drinks are espresso based and therefore espresso machines are needed to make them.
Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
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Well, a lot of people criticize Starbuck's coffee saying it's over priced, but they don't realize that it's not coffee off a burner. Each drink is individually hand-made, that's why it costs so much. The milk has to be foamed, most of the drinks are espresso based and therefore espresso machines are needed to make them.
Yup. Another good example of how the ingredients are actually a minor portion of the total cost. Beans and milk probably cost <$1 per drink. But then you have 3 employees working (payroll), a good location (rent) with nice decor (overhead);etc.
The MMM thing to do of course is make your own at home - much like meals.
Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
Consider the coffee shop as a business for a minute though. How much would you charge to earn a reasonable profit? The drip coffee costs almost nothing in the way of ingredients - just water and two tablespoons of coffee (roughly 30 servings per pound, bought wholesale for ~$5 is about 25¢.
So if a customer only buys that drip coffee you're taking in $1.80. It's a very high percentage but a very low absolute amount. Right off the bat there is LESS profit on that $2.05 "short drip" than a latte. Drop the price to, say, $1 and you're left with only two profitable choices - sell in volume or hope your customers also buy some food. Sounds like strategies a lot of other places use, no?
Yeah, it takes a lot less time but you still have to pay your employees. It would be nice if you could serve more customers per employee this way, but unless you change your entire concept you're still keeping the same number on staff to make all the more complicated drinks. Youv'e still got the same expensive overhead and that customer may be just as likely to occupy an overstuffed chair blogging, preventing another customer from doing the same.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, the cost of ingredients are a minor portion of the purchase price.
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Why the teeny-tiny font Kyle? I couldn't even read it until clicked "respond".
On my screen, everyone's post has the same sized font. Must be something wacky your end.
Odd - I've never eaten 'Roo before (guessing that's Kangaroo?). That surprises me as I've tried a lot of different critters. What does it taste like?
It's just a normal red game meat, like deer or the like. Rich flavour, but lean - so you have to eat it rare, or marinade it. The beasts have to be culled regularly anyway, so after decades as pet food they've made their way into supermarkets.
Relevant media discussion about food and other costs,
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-09-13/how-to-save-on-household-expenses/8936088
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There are two important things I've learnt in the kitchen that save me a fortune and keep grocery costs way down:
- Buy what's in season. If it's out of season, it's not going to be cheap
- Plan a menu. If I'm cooking something that has tomatoes and fresh basil as an ingredient you better believe those will show up in another meal later in the week
Both of these used to be basic 'home economics', and we used to eat seasonally as it was the only option. Both correctly applied will provide delicious eating for the rest of your life at a low cost.
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Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
Consider the coffee shop as a business for a minute though. How much would you charge to earn a reasonable profit? The drip coffee costs almost nothing in the way of ingredients - just water and two tablespoons of coffee (roughly 30 servings per pound, bought wholesale for ~$5 is about 25¢.
So if a customer only buys that drip coffee you're taking in $1.80. It's a very high percentage but a very low absolute amount. Right off the bat there is LESS profit on that $2.05 "short drip" than a latte. Drop the price to, say, $1 and you're left with only two profitable choices - sell in volume or hope your customers also buy some food. Sounds like strategies a lot of other places use, no?
Yeah, it takes a lot less time but you still have to pay your employees. It would be nice if you could serve more customers per employee this way, but unless you change your entire concept you're still keeping the same number on staff to make all the more complicated drinks. Youv'e still got the same expensive overhead and that customer may be just as likely to occupy an overstuffed chair blogging, preventing another customer from doing the same.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, the cost of ingredients are a minor portion of the purchase price.
Yes. My "insane markup" doesn't mean pure profit, it means anything above what you'd pay at home (basically, coffee beans). Labor, equipment, rent, and of course the profit. To me, paying $2.05 for a cup of coffee that I could probably make at home for $.15 is an insane markup that I'm not usually willing to pay.
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Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
Consider the coffee shop as a business for a minute though. How much would you charge to earn a reasonable profit? The drip coffee costs almost nothing in the way of ingredients - just water and two tablespoons of coffee (roughly 30 servings per pound, bought wholesale for ~$5 is about 25¢.
So if a customer only buys that drip coffee you're taking in $1.80. It's a very high percentage but a very low absolute amount. Right off the bat there is LESS profit on that $2.05 "short drip" than a latte. Drop the price to, say, $1 and you're left with only two profitable choices - sell in volume or hope your customers also buy some food. Sounds like strategies a lot of other places use, no?
Yeah, it takes a lot less time but you still have to pay your employees. It would be nice if you could serve more customers per employee this way, but unless you change your entire concept you're still keeping the same number on staff to make all the more complicated drinks. Youv'e still got the same expensive overhead and that customer may be just as likely to occupy an overstuffed chair blogging, preventing another customer from doing the same.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, the cost of ingredients are a minor portion of the purchase price.
Yes. My "insane markup" doesn't mean pure profit, it means anything above what you'd pay at home (basically, coffee beans). Labor, equipment, rent, and of course the profit. To me, paying $2.05 for a cup of coffee that I could probably make at home for $.15 is an insane markup that I'm not usually willing to pay.
You should bear in mind that they aren't trying to sell to you, nor to me, but instead to the people that will pay whatever to get coffee fix.
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Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
Consider the coffee shop as a business for a minute though. How much would you charge to earn a reasonable profit? The drip coffee costs almost nothing in the way of ingredients - just water and two tablespoons of coffee (roughly 30 servings per pound, bought wholesale for ~$5 is about 25¢.
So if a customer only buys that drip coffee you're taking in $1.80. It's a very high percentage but a very low absolute amount. Right off the bat there is LESS profit on that $2.05 "short drip" than a latte. Drop the price to, say, $1 and you're left with only two profitable choices - sell in volume or hope your customers also buy some food. Sounds like strategies a lot of other places use, no?
Yeah, it takes a lot less time but you still have to pay your employees. It would be nice if you could serve more customers per employee this way, but unless you change your entire concept you're still keeping the same number on staff to make all the more complicated drinks. Youv'e still got the same expensive overhead and that customer may be just as likely to occupy an overstuffed chair blogging, preventing another customer from doing the same.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, the cost of ingredients are a minor portion of the purchase price.
Yes. My "insane markup" doesn't mean pure profit, it means anything above what you'd pay at home (basically, coffee beans). Labor, equipment, rent, and of course the profit. To me, paying $2.05 for a cup of coffee that I could probably make at home for $.15 is an insane markup that I'm not usually willing to pay.
Do you have an espresso machine and a milk foamer?
I can't make Starbucks drinks at home because I don't have those things in my kitchen. Cappuccinos and lattes are espresso based drinks with foamed milk on top. They aren't just an ordinary cup of coffee. Each drink is made individually so it's totally fresh. Sure, you can buy an espresso maker but a halfway decent one costs at least $200, new.
And sure, you could go to the 7-11 and buy a cup of ordinary coffee, but it's likely been sitting on a burner for hours and has turned into goo. That kind of stuff grosses me out. It's not worth any money to me.
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Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
Consider the coffee shop as a business for a minute though. How much would you charge to earn a reasonable profit? The drip coffee costs almost nothing in the way of ingredients - just water and two tablespoons of coffee (roughly 30 servings per pound, bought wholesale for ~$5 is about 25¢.
So if a customer only buys that drip coffee you're taking in $1.80. It's a very high percentage but a very low absolute amount. Right off the bat there is LESS profit on that $2.05 "short drip" than a latte. Drop the price to, say, $1 and you're left with only two profitable choices - sell in volume or hope your customers also buy some food. Sounds like strategies a lot of other places use, no?
Yeah, it takes a lot less time but you still have to pay your employees. It would be nice if you could serve more customers per employee this way, but unless you change your entire concept you're still keeping the same number on staff to make all the more complicated drinks. Youv'e still got the same expensive overhead and that customer may be just as likely to occupy an overstuffed chair blogging, preventing another customer from doing the same.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, the cost of ingredients are a minor portion of the purchase price.
Yes. My "insane markup" doesn't mean pure profit, it means anything above what you'd pay at home (basically, coffee beans). Labor, equipment, rent, and of course the profit. To me, paying $2.05 for a cup of coffee that I could probably make at home for $.15 is an insane markup that I'm not usually willing to pay.
Do you have an espresso machine and a milk foamer?
I can't make Starbucks drinks at home because I don't have those things in my kitchen.
Heads up, you can make a perfectly great espresso with an Aeropress, they are around $25 on Amazon. I'm guessing a milk foamer wouldn't cost all that much more.
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Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
Consider the coffee shop as a business for a minute though. How much would you charge to earn a reasonable profit? The drip coffee costs almost nothing in the way of ingredients - just water and two tablespoons of coffee (roughly 30 servings per pound, bought wholesale for ~$5 is about 25¢.
So if a customer only buys that drip coffee you're taking in $1.80. It's a very high percentage but a very low absolute amount. Right off the bat there is LESS profit on that $2.05 "short drip" than a latte. Drop the price to, say, $1 and you're left with only two profitable choices - sell in volume or hope your customers also buy some food. Sounds like strategies a lot of other places use, no?
Yeah, it takes a lot less time but you still have to pay your employees. It would be nice if you could serve more customers per employee this way, but unless you change your entire concept you're still keeping the same number on staff to make all the more complicated drinks. Youv'e still got the same expensive overhead and that customer may be just as likely to occupy an overstuffed chair blogging, preventing another customer from doing the same.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, the cost of ingredients are a minor portion of the purchase price.
Yes. My "insane markup" doesn't mean pure profit, it means anything above what you'd pay at home (basically, coffee beans). Labor, equipment, rent, and of course the profit. To me, paying $2.05 for a cup of coffee that I could probably make at home for $.15 is an insane markup that I'm not usually willing to pay.
Do you have an espresso machine and a milk foamer?
I can't make Starbucks drinks at home because I don't have those things in my kitchen.
Heads up, you can make a perfectly great espresso with an Aeropress, they are around $25 on Amazon. I'm guessing a milk foamer wouldn't cost all that much more.
I was just pointing this out for those who understand how drip coffee is different from espresso-based drinks.
But I will look at the Aeropress out of interest because I might buy one some day. But in the meantime, I don't feel like I'm wasting money to buy a $2.00 espresso, especially since I don't buy one every day. There are places in my area that charge $3.00 for an espresso and more money for other coffee drinks than starbucks' does.
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Starbucks sells drip coffee, although they don't want you to know it. It literally isn't on the menu board any more at the Starbucks in my area. But you can still buy it. A "short" (8 oz) is $2.05 which is as insanely marked up as their $5 espresso drinks considering it has very little labor cost and no expensive espresso machine.
Consider the coffee shop as a business for a minute though. How much would you charge to earn a reasonable profit? The drip coffee costs almost nothing in the way of ingredients - just water and two tablespoons of coffee (roughly 30 servings per pound, bought wholesale for ~$5 is about 25¢.
So if a customer only buys that drip coffee you're taking in $1.80. It's a very high percentage but a very low absolute amount. Right off the bat there is LESS profit on that $2.05 "short drip" than a latte. Drop the price to, say, $1 and you're left with only two profitable choices - sell in volume or hope your customers also buy some food. Sounds like strategies a lot of other places use, no?
Yeah, it takes a lot less time but you still have to pay your employees. It would be nice if you could serve more customers per employee this way, but unless you change your entire concept you're still keeping the same number on staff to make all the more complicated drinks. Youv'e still got the same expensive overhead and that customer may be just as likely to occupy an overstuffed chair blogging, preventing another customer from doing the same.
At the risk of sounding like a broken record, the cost of ingredients are a minor portion of the purchase price.
Yes. My "insane markup" doesn't mean pure profit, it means anything above what you'd pay at home (basically, coffee beans). Labor, equipment, rent, and of course the profit. To me, paying $2.05 for a cup of coffee that I could probably make at home for $.15 is an insane markup that I'm not usually willing to pay.
Do you have an espresso machine and a milk foamer?
I can't make Starbucks drinks at home because I don't have those things in my kitchen.
Heads up, you can make a perfectly great espresso with an Aeropress, they are around $25 on Amazon. I'm guessing a milk foamer wouldn't cost all that much more.
Here's two options:
Epica Automatic Electric Milk Frother and Heater Carafe http://a.co/bjmPdAI
PowerLix Milk Frother http://a.co/4rlSqZ5
I don't like Starbucks lattes/cappuccino/macchiato/fufushito; if there's no choice to avoid, I get their Pike's Place drip coffee, but half the time it's burnt so I don't pay and have to pour it to ground.
There's a reason I prefer to grind my beans in weekly batches and make a fresh French Press daily.
You are what you drink.
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You are what you drink.
Huh? What is that supposed to mean?
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You are what you drink.
Huh? What is that supposed to mean?
That people who drink alcohol are poisonous.
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You are what you drink.
Huh? What is that supposed to mean?
That people who drink alcohol are poisonous.
...but the conversation was about drip coffee and espresso. I have not idea what this means.
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You are what you drink.
Huh? What is that supposed to mean?
That people who drink alcohol are poisonous.
...but the conversation was about drip coffee and espresso. I have not idea what this means.
The original poster isn't entirely wrong as the human body is over 50% water.
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You are what you drink.
Huh? What is that supposed to mean?
That people who drink alcohol are poisonous.
...but the conversation was about drip coffee and espresso. I have not idea what this means.
The original poster isn't entirely wrong as the human body is over 50% water.
Bit that doesn't mean you're coffee, unless..
Bleach is healthy. It's mostly water. And we are mostly water. Therefore, we are bleach.
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You are what you drink.
Huh? What is that supposed to mean?
That people who drink alcohol are poisonous.
...but the conversation was about drip coffee and espresso. I have not idea what this means.
The original poster isn't entirely wrong as the human body is over 50% water.
Bit that doesn't mean you're coffee, unless..
Bleach is healthy. It's mostly water. And we are mostly water. Therefore, we are bleach.
This thread reminds me of something I saw on Facebook
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Bleach is healthy. It's mostly water. And we are mostly water. Therefore, we are bleach.
hahaha
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I don't like Starbucks lattes/cappuccino/macchiato/fufushito; if there's no choice to avoid, I get their Pike's Place drip coffee, but half the time it's burnt so I don't pay and have to pour it to ground.
They give you a refund if the coffee tastes bad?
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And sure, you could go to the 7-11 and buy a cup of ordinary coffee, but it's likely been sitting on a burner for hours and has turned into goo. That kind of stuff grosses me out. It's not worth any money to me.
I prefer drip to espresso, so I am fine making my coffee at home. And just for the record, Tim Horton's makes fresh coffee every 20 minutes. Of course mine is fresher, but theirs is not bad. Can't speak for other stores, of course.
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I don't like Starbucks lattes/cappuccino/macchiato/fufushito; if there's no choice to avoid, I get their Pike's Place drip coffee, but half the time it's burnt so I don't pay and have to pour it to ground.
They give you a refund if the coffee tastes bad?
Yes. Most customers are just scared/lazy to provide instant feedback.
Some Starbucks will ask me to wait while they brew a fresh batch after I tell them they served me the perfect yuck (not those words).
Some Starbucks don't even have drip coffee brewing until I ask.
If forced by co-workers to take a walk to the coffee shop, I make them walk to the farthest one: a Dunkin Donuts over half mile away, on our AF base. This Dunkin has never poured a bad one for me in the 5+ years I've worked here.
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That people who drink alcohol are poisonous.
So... in small doses I'm a relaxant, and in large doses I'm intoxicating? Great! :)
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I don't like Starbucks lattes/cappuccino/macchiato/fufushito; if there's no choice to avoid, I get their Pike's Place drip coffee, but half the time it's burnt so I don't pay and have to pour it to ground.
They give you a refund if the coffee tastes bad?
Yes. Most customers are just scared/lazy to provide instant feedback.
I'll have to try that if I ever get bad coffee there.
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Apples - there are eating apples and cooking apples - cooking apples tend to be sold by the bag and are a lot less expensive. I am curious which apple variety was used.
Since you asked about the apples, they were Gala. Cheapest I could find at that store (but I probably could have found a cheaper store!).
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HI! I put in here the Canadian best prices... I don't actually buy apples right now because they are not quite in season and very expensive, even at lower cost stores. Dairy and eggs are expensive here, too compared to USA.
The basic comment that OP made is that you need to calculate the price of your favorite recipes per serving. So true! I did this for the 10 common recipes at our house, and it really helps to see where one ingredient is a huge cost to the overall dish, and helped me to understand how expensive produce really is most of the year.
I think this is the same recipe (Plenty More).
Esme Old Fashioned Pudding
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This hot and sweet pudding, with its super-crusty almond topping, is normally cooked for hours in an Aga using windfall apples. Savour this romantic image even with my real-world adjustments. With thanks to Esme Robinson for remembering this from her childhood, and for letting me shake up the old school with the addition of rhubarb and sage. --
100g unsalted butter, softened (Approx 1/3 cup butter $0.78; don't substitute as butter gives a ton of flavour to the topping)
160g dark muscovado sugar (WTF? okay, just use brown sugar $0.25)
100g ground almonds ($1.28 to $1.68 per 100 g yes, canada sells in lb and kg! I have to do a lot of math here when I shop...)
1 egg ($0.27 each)
700g cooking apples, peeled, cored and roughly grated (550g) @ $1.30 per lb, =$2.00
250g trimmed and sliced rhubarb, cut into 2cm pieces (Free? or $2)
50g demerara sugar (?why why with the special sugars? $0.25)
40g fresh breadcrumbs (Free or from the stale bread sliced ends, $0.20 Buy day old bread and make your own, lasts a long time in your pantry)
10g sage leaves, roughly chopped (Sage lasts forever, tiny amount here... maybe $0.15 for dried? I find fresh too powerful to use in just about anything... I grew it one year and developed a dislike for fresh)
250g Greek yoghurt (Make own for $1.25; buy for $3)
Serves 4-6
Price:Total: $4.45 CDN to $9 CDN
Price per unit (assume 5 servings) $0.90 to $1.80
So, I would say that a combination of shopping choices and / or using the cost of the larger package, even though a smaller amount was used, may be the culprit. The restaurant dessert would NOT have a topping with 100% almonds instead of flour or oatmeal crumbs, plus greek yogurt plus a lot of fresh fruit, as they need to make money, too. Also, funny, is that the intro describes using windfallen (scrub / free) apples is the traditional way to use this dish.
From the costs breakout above, it is easy to see where the costs came from.
I recommend using white sugar in the fruit, brown in the topping, dried sage, and something other than greek yogurt for the creaminess (sour cream or creme fraiche is classic for fruit desserts). Watch out for produce seasonal pricing, and substitute a different fruit or more apples, use a granny smith green apple instead for the rhubarb if local supply is pricey. Find recipes that use EITHER expensive fruit OR Greek yogurt OR Almonds, etc. Oh, and regift that cookbook to someone who likes to spend money and would love to see "different" recipes.
TLDR: One expensive ingredient per dish is all that is needed to show off, and it will cut your cooking costs dramatically. Get to know what the expensive ingredients are....
Cool! I think you get my point. Although I don't get free shit as often as you :)
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Ok, your first mistake is not telling us how many servings were in the dessert and working out the cost per serving.
I did work out the cost per serving, if you've read my posts. But, it matters less to me. When I make a dessert, the goal is to create a dessert that will satisfy my craving. Because I'm a gym rat, I prefer not to eat desserts every day, so for me having leftovers is not a plus. So, I understand that other people might want to maximize the number of desserts they get, that is not true for me.
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I think of cooking as having three different tiers. Tier 1 is full-on Mustachian cooking--lots of cheap staples and in-season produce, inexpensive proteins judicially used, planning recipes and menus to use available ingredients, never wasting food, no convenience foods, making staples like yogurt from scratch, perhaps leveraging sales, coupons, outlet stores, etc. to buy as cheaply as possible.
Tier 2 is mid-range cooking. You probably use a few of Tier 1 strategies, but you don't feel bound to follow all of them.
Tier 3 is cooking whatever you want whenever you want, shopping at very expensive stores, tossing leftovers, etc.
You can always save money by dropping down a tier, but the costs in terms of skill, time and family buy-in rise at the same time. And it's harder to drop from Tier 2 to Tier 1 than from Tier 3 to Tier 2. Personally, I am totally capable of cooking at Tier 1, and have (as a poor grad student), but frankly I don't want to any more. I like being able to whip up a batch of chocolate-chip cookies whenever I want. There may be a few people who are at Tier 2 because they don't know about Tier 1, but I think most people are making rational decisions based on their personal circumstances. (See that other thread about spouses who refuse to cooperate with various money-saving strategies on groceries.)
The original recipe cited in this thread could be either Tier 2 or Tier 3 depending on how often you cook like that, how many servings, and where the ingredients were obtained. So it could be either a rational treat, or it could be a symptom of grocery ridiculousness.
I love that description. And, hey, given a minimum level of frugality, food is not a huge expense.
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That people who drink alcohol are poisonous.
So... in small doses I'm a relaxant, and in large doses I'm intoxicating? Great! :)
In very large doses you cause vomiting and liver damage. Possibly best to warn close family members. :P
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Ok, your first mistake is not telling us how many servings were in the dessert and working out the cost per serving.
I did work out the cost per serving, if you've read my posts. But, it matters less to me. When I make a dessert, the goal is to create a dessert that will satisfy my craving. Because I'm a gym rat, I prefer not to eat desserts every day, so for me having leftovers is not a plus. So, I understand that other people might want to maximize the number of desserts they get, that is not true for me.
Most recipes are made for more than one serving, especially desserts. If you are cooking for one and don't eat desserts much, you need to find a cookbook that does single servings. Or learn to scale recipes down. That recipe looks like it would be easy to make as a single serving, just divide everything by 4 or 5, depending on the size you want. If you really like it, you could also scale up for when you have guests.
Galas are eating apples, so they are priced as such. A bag of Macintosh or Cortland will be less expensive, and they don't turn to mush when they cook. Even sold as single apples they are usually less expensive.
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Most recipes are made for more than one serving, especially desserts. If you are cooking for one and don't eat desserts much, you need to find a cookbook that does single servings. Or learn to scale recipes down. That recipe looks like it would be easy to make as a single serving, just divide everything by 4 or 5, depending on the size you want. If you really like it, you could also scale up for when you have guests.
Galas are eating apples, so they are priced as such. A bag of Macintosh or Cortland will be less expensive, and they don't turn to mush when they cook. Even sold as single apples they are usually less expensive.
This is true. Organic apples will cost even more.
Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Same thing with groceries. People who live alone don't want to buy a five pound bag of potatoes, and get frustrated when that's the only size they can find at the store.
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Most recipes are made for more than one serving, especially desserts. If you are cooking for one and don't eat desserts much, you need to find a cookbook that does single servings. Or learn to scale recipes down. That recipe looks like it would be easy to make as a single serving, just divide everything by 4 or 5, depending on the size you want. If you really like it, you could also scale up for when you have guests.
Galas are eating apples, so they are priced as such. A bag of Macintosh or Cortland will be less expensive, and they don't turn to mush when they cook. Even sold as single apples they are usually less expensive.
This is true. Organic apples will cost even more.
Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Same thing with groceries. People who live alone don't want to buy a five pound bag of potatoes, and get frustrated when that's the only size they can find at the store.
I find student cookbooks are best for singletons, they assume students are on their own or with maybe a room-mate.
Package size depends so much on the person and where they live - larger quantities are fine if they will get used or can be stored, otherwise smaller quantities need to be purchased. I buy meat at Costco, but most of it goes immediately into the freezer. I buy fruit and vegetables mostly locally, because I can't store large quantities (I am cooking for one, but I love planned-overs = leftovers).
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Most recipes are made for more than one serving, especially desserts. If you are cooking for one and don't eat desserts much, you need to find a cookbook that does single servings. Or learn to scale recipes down. That recipe looks like it would be easy to make as a single serving, just divide everything by 4 or 5, depending on the size you want. If you really like it, you could also scale up for when you have guests.
Galas are eating apples, so they are priced as such. A bag of Macintosh or Cortland will be less expensive, and they don't turn to mush when they cook. Even sold as single apples they are usually less expensive.
This is true. Organic apples will cost even more.
Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Same thing with groceries. People who live alone don't want to buy a five pound bag of potatoes, and get frustrated when that's the only size they can find at the store.
Nooo. . . . don't cook for one! Cook for four, five, or six and freeze the leftovers so that you have a ready supply of quick meals. Use up all your groceries and freeze the stuff you don't want to eat! After a few weeks of doing this you'll have amassed several months of ready made dinners, will use exponentially less dishes and will be tripping over the huge amount of free time you have.
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Most recipes are made for more than one serving, especially desserts. If you are cooking for one and don't eat desserts much, you need to find a cookbook that does single servings. Or learn to scale recipes down. That recipe looks like it would be easy to make as a single serving, just divide everything by 4 or 5, depending on the size you want. If you really like it, you could also scale up for when you have guests.
Galas are eating apples, so they are priced as such. A bag of Macintosh or Cortland will be less expensive, and they don't turn to mush when they cook. Even sold as single apples they are usually less expensive.
This is true. Organic apples will cost even more.
Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Same thing with groceries. People who live alone don't want to buy a five pound bag of potatoes, and get frustrated when that's the only size they can find at the store.
Nooo. . . . don't cook for one! Cook for four, five, or six and freeze the leftovers so that you have a ready supply of quick meals. Use up all your groceries and freeze the stuff you don't want to eat! After a few weeks of doing this you'll have amassed several months of ready made dinners, will use exponentially less dishes and will be tripping over the huge amount of free time you have.
Oh, I agree, but OP seems to not like left-overs planned-overs, at least for dessert.
A good batch of meat sauce is many meals - spaghetti sauce, chili, tacos, . . . .
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Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Is it beyond people's mathematical ability to halve numbers? Like, turn 1 cup of flour into 1/2 cup?
Do people living alone not have friends and relatives to invite over for dinner from time to time?
Could not they make a recipe for dinner, eat 1 serve and put the rest away in the freezer for a day they can't be bothered cooking?
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Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Is it beyond people's mathematical ability to halve numbers? Like, turn 1 cup of flour into 1/2 cup?
Do people living alone not have friends and relatives to invite over for dinner from time to time?
Could not they make a recipe for dinner, eat 1 serve and put the rest away in the freezer for a day they can't be bothered cooking?
Sure they can portion out recipes. But that still doesn't solve the problem of grocery stores selling bulk food items that aren't appropriate for a one-person household.
And to be honest, when I was single, I didn't really host dinner parties in my home. I did that maybe once or twice.
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I have a "Cooking for Two" cookbook that I bought in the 1970's, when there was just the two of us. I doubled or tripled some of those recipes when the kids were at home, and now I'm back to using the original amounts....
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Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Is it beyond people's mathematical ability to halve numbers? Like, turn 1 cup of flour into 1/2 cup?
Do people living alone not have friends and relatives to invite over for dinner from time to time?
Could not they make a recipe for dinner, eat 1 serve and put the rest away in the freezer for a day they can't be bothered cooking?
Is there an app for that?
Americans and Math. Two words that shouldn't be... you know the refrain.
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Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Is it beyond people's mathematical ability to halve numbers? Like, turn 1 cup of flour into 1/2 cup?
Do people living alone not have friends and relatives to invite over for dinner from time to time?
Could not they make a recipe for dinner, eat 1 serve and put the rest away in the freezer for a day they can't be bothered cooking?
Sure they can portion out recipes. But that still doesn't solve the problem of grocery stores selling bulk food items that aren't appropriate for a one-person household.
And to be honest, when I was single, I didn't really host dinner parties in my home. I did that maybe once or twice.
What bulk-food items are you finding difficult to parse out into smaller portions?
Certainly there are a few, more perishable items that will spoil before a one-person household can consume them all, but I haven't found many.
Perhaps that's a key lesson here; choose your ingredients carefully and not everything can scale to be cost effective. Agree with RetiredAt63's suggestion to seek out the numerous singles cookbooks that focus both on quantity and cost of meals.
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Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Is it beyond people's mathematical ability to halve numbers? Like, turn 1 cup of flour into 1/2 cup?
Full disclosure - I've ruined a couple meals by modifying all the ingredient numbers but one. Not really a math thing, just a forgetfulness thing. I write out the updated ingredient list before hand to prevent this from happening any more. :P
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Another good reason to cook by weight - it lets you increase the size by 10%, 25% etc more easily. If you're working in cups it gets to be annoying quickly.
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Another good reason to cook by weight - it lets you increase the size by 10%, 25% etc more easily. If you're working in cups it gets to be annoying quickly.
Cooking by weight is indeed the way to go, and it annoys me to no end that so few recipes use that option.
Regarding dividing imperial measurements, that's one of the unsung strengths of the imperial (vs. metric) system. Most everything in the old system is divisible by 2 and 4, which is easy to do by eye with good precision. Metric gets a lot messier; think about taking a recipe that calls for 125mL of flour. It's doable if you have measuring cups with the appropriate markings, but with imperial one cup becomes one quarter cup.
I use metric for all my work (I'm in science) but there are good points to the old imperial system as well.
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Another good reason to cook by weight - it lets you increase the size by 10%, 25% etc more easily. If you're working in cups it gets to be annoying quickly.
Cooking by weight is indeed the way to go, and it annoys me to no end that so few recipes use that option.
Regarding dividing imperial measurements, that's one of the unsung strengths of the imperial (vs. metric) system. Most everything in the old system is divisible by 2 and 4, which is easy to do by eye with good precision. Metric gets a lot messier; think about taking a recipe that calls for 125mL of flour. It's doable if you have measuring cups with the appropriate markings, but with imperial one cup becomes one quarter cup.
I use metric for all my work (I'm in science) but there are good points to the old imperial system as well.
I don't think such recipes are common - if they are metric they are more likely to use weight, at least for dry ingredients, and measuring whatever weight of flour is easy with a scale assuming you can calculate 125/4.
The (biggest) problem with US customary units is that there are way too many of them, I need to remember how many cups are in a pint/quart/gallon/hogshead. For example, no one has a '1/8 qt' measuring cup. And what about multiplying recipes instead of dividing them? How does one possibly measure 12 Tbsp if they do not remember the conversion?
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How does one possibly measure 12 Tbsp if they do not remember the conversion?
The magic of The Google?
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The (biggest) problem with US customary units is that there are way too many of them, I need to remember how many cups are in a pint/quart/gallon/hogshead. For example, no one has a '1/8 qt' measuring cup. And what about multiplying recipes instead of dividing them? How does one possibly measure 12 Tbsp if they do not remember the conversion?
True. It requries some basic knowledge and terminology. I learned this in primary school and now it's just natural (to me). Though I've yet to ever use a hogshead measurement for anything.
FWIW most of the measurements follow a x2 or x4 pattern. For example, A cup is 8 ounces, and a pint is 2 cups. A quart is 2 pints. A gallon is 4 quarts (which came from the word "quarter" - makes sense, no?). An ounce is two tablespoons. So 4x12T = 48 tablespoons or 6 cups.
Yes, I see how that's more confusing than base-10 systems, until you are halving or quartering numbers. That's basically how/why the imperial system evolved.
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How does one possibly measure 12 Tbsp if they do not remember the conversion?
The magic of The Google?
I just scoop twelve times with a tablespoon. There's a better way?
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How does one possibly measure 12 Tbsp if they do not remember the conversion?
The magic of The Google?
I thought this thread implicitly assumed one wasn't utilizing a calculator or internet. Otherwise GuitarStv wouldn't forget to halve an ingredient (same thing happens to me if I don't have technological help).
Nowadays, the recipe plug-ins in many food blogs have a feature for changing the number of servings such as in this post (https://www.dailysurprises.co.uk/teriyaki-beef-stir-fry-how-to/) (no affiliation, can't attest that recipe is any good).
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How does one possibly measure 12 Tbsp if they do not remember the conversion?
The magic of The Google?
I just scoop twelve times with a tablespoon. There's a better way?
Well, sure, if you want to be old school. Or you could do 3-1/4c. measures, or one 1/2 c. and one 1/4 c. Or you could use my DD's Measuring Cups for People Who Can't Math and use the 3/4 c. measuring cup.
I thought this thread implicitly assumed one wasn't utilizing a calculator or internet. Otherwise GuitarStv wouldn't forget to halve an ingredient (same thing happens to me if I don't have technological help).
Nowadays, the recipe plug-ins in many food blogs have a feature for changing the number of servings such as in this post (https://www.dailysurprises.co.uk/teriyaki-beef-stir-fry-how-to/) (no affiliation, can't attest that recipe is any good).
I've done the same thing as GuitarStv. Usually I make the conversion just fine in my head -- I just forget to do it for one of the ingredients.
Probably I should join the 21st century and use those new-fangled recipes that change the quantities for you. But then my brain cells would atrophy because I am allowing modern technology to do the work for me, and y'all would boot me out of the forum. :-)
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Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Is it beyond people's mathematical ability to halve numbers? Like, turn 1 cup of flour into 1/2 cup?
Full disclosure - I've ruined a couple meals by modifying all the ingredient numbers but one. Not really a math thing, just a forgetfulness thing. I write out the updated ingredient list before hand to prevent this from happening any more. :P
Same here. I've just forgotten. That's why I think we need cookbooks that have recipes for smaller meals. Even with my family of 5, I don't like it when I see that a recipe "serves 6". I think it's a holdover from a time period when people had much larger families.
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Same here. I've just forgotten. That's why I think we need cookbooks that have recipes for smaller meals. Even with my family of 5, I don't like it when I see that a recipe "serves 6". I think it's a holdover from a time period when people had much larger families.
On some of my recipe cards I have the adjusted quantities for doubling or halving a recipe. Otherwise it is easy to forget to adjust one ingredient.
"serves 6" really doesn't mean a lot. 6 adults? 2 adults and 4 kids? 2 adults, 2 kids and 2 teenagers? Family of 4 and left-overs for lunch? Whole chicken? Whole pie?
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Most recipe books aren't up to date on the times we live in. One out of four people lives alone. That means they cook for one person, not four, five or six.
Is it beyond people's mathematical ability to halve numbers? Like, turn 1 cup of flour into 1/2 cup?
Do people living alone not have friends and relatives to invite over for dinner from time to time?
Could not they make a recipe for dinner, eat 1 serve and put the rest away in the freezer for a day they can't be bothered cooking?
While this is great in theory, sometimes cooking times and such might throw something off to have a dish not turn out right.
I mostly ran into this problem with crock-pot dishes before I learned.
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I thought this thread implicitly assumed one wasn't utilizing a calculator or internet. Otherwise GuitarStv wouldn't forget to halve an ingredient (same thing happens to me if I don't have technological help).
Nowadays, the recipe plug-ins in many food blogs have a feature for changing the number of servings such as in this post (https://www.dailysurprises.co.uk/teriyaki-beef-stir-fry-how-to/) (no affiliation, can't attest that recipe is any good).
I've done the same thing as GuitarStv. Usually I make the conversion just fine in my head -- I just forget to do it for one of the ingredients.
Probably I should join the 21st century and use those new-fangled recipes that change the quantities for you. But then my brain cells would atrophy because I am allowing modern technology to do the work for me, and y'all would boot me out of the forum. :-)
As MMM would say: would you like a bedpan and catheter to go with that?
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What bulk-food items are you finding difficult to parse out into smaller portions?
Certainly there are a few, more perishable items that will spoil before a one-person household can consume them all, but I haven't found many.
Perhaps that's a key lesson here; choose your ingredients carefully and not everything can scale to be cost effective. Agree with RetiredAt63's suggestion to seek out the numerous singles cookbooks that focus both on quantity and cost of meals.
A whole cabbage... although it keeps, it is hard to buy smaller quantities of, and then you eat cabbage every week for 4 weeks.
Potatoes, carrots, onions are under half price in bulk bags..
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What bulk-food items are you finding difficult to parse out into smaller portions?
Certainly there are a few, more perishable items that will spoil before a one-person household can consume them all, but I haven't found many.
Perhaps that's a key lesson here; choose your ingredients carefully and not everything can scale to be cost effective. Agree with RetiredAt63's suggestion to seek out the numerous singles cookbooks that focus both on quantity and cost of meals.
A whole cabbage... although it keeps, it is hard to buy smaller quantities of, and then you eat cabbage every week for 4 weeks.
Potatoes, carrots, onions are under half price in bulk bags..
Nearly all problems are solved by soup. Cabbage and stock plus whatever else, makes a month of lunches in our soup pot, just add freezer and plastic containers.
Plus, once you know how to cook, recipes are only vague guidelines. Build those taste buds and get creative.
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What bulk-food items are you finding difficult to parse out into smaller portions?
Certainly there are a few, more perishable items that will spoil before a one-person household can consume them all, but I haven't found many.
Perhaps that's a key lesson here; choose your ingredients carefully and not everything can scale to be cost effective. Agree with RetiredAt63's suggestion to seek out the numerous singles cookbooks that focus both on quantity and cost of meals.
A whole cabbage... although it keeps, it is hard to buy smaller quantities of, and then you eat cabbage every week for 4 weeks.
Potatoes, carrots, onions are under half price in bulk bags..
I could probably think of a lot more examples when it comes to produce that will go bad before it can be consumed. And when I live in an apartment, I only had a very small freezer space in my fridge. So there are definitely some challenges with living alone and trying to be conservative and frugal with food buying. Not that they can't be overcome, but the challenges are there.
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What bulk-food items are you finding difficult to parse out into smaller portions?
Certainly there are a few, more perishable items that will spoil before a one-person household can consume them all, but I haven't found many.
Perhaps that's a key lesson here; choose your ingredients carefully and not everything can scale to be cost effective. Agree with RetiredAt63's suggestion to seek out the numerous singles cookbooks that focus both on quantity and cost of meals.
A whole cabbage... although it keeps, it is hard to buy smaller quantities of, and then you eat cabbage every week for 4 weeks.
Potatoes, carrots, onions are under half price in bulk bags..
I could probably think of a lot more examples when it comes to produce that will go bad before it can be consumed. And when I live in an apartment, I only had a very small freezer space in my fridge. So there are definitely some challenges with living alone and trying to be conservative and frugal with food buying. Not that they can't be overcome, but the challenges are there.
There are always challenges with any sized family. One disadvantage larger families have is adjusting to things certain members can't or won't eat.
If you can give us other examples of the challenges you've been facing we can probably help. Cooking-for-one is a pretty common theme around here; I do it about 4 months out of the year.
Re: carrots, potatoes and onions - all are 'root-celler' veggies that can keep for months with proper storage. Some great life-hacks for keeping those, even when you buy a 10lb bag.
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Root vegetables keep. Others - get used to disguising excess in soups and stews (winter is coming). Or just "pig out" on a vegetable, I can easily eat a huge pile of broccoli at one sitting. I am not filling up on another vegetable or starch though, the broccoli (or cauliflower, or fresh peas, or beans, or whatever) is the vegetable du jour.
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But I will look at the Aeropress out of interest because I might buy one some day. But in the meantime, I don't feel like I'm wasting money to buy a $2.00 espresso, especially since I don't buy one every day. There are places in my area that charge $3.00 for an espresso and more money for other coffee drinks than starbucks' does.
If you want the "real deal" buy one of these:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moka_pot
Mine is going on 25 years old now. Was given mine by an Italian friend when I lived there for several years.
They come in different sizes. It is worthwhile to poke the pressure relief valve occasionally with a bent staple or similar just to make sure it is functional.
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How does one possibly measure 12 Tbsp if they do not remember the conversion?
The magic of The Google?
I just scoop twelve times with a tablespoon. There's a better way?
3/4 cup.
Sticklers use weights, though. Me, I'm lazy. 3/4 coup of flour, not xxx grams of flour!
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When I got married, my husband said he didn't want to dine out at restaurants because it costs too much. However, he'd go to the grocery store and impulsively buy lots of food, for no particular reason, and lots of fresh produce in bulk quantities, that would rot before we could use it. Like great, big bags of potatoes, gallons of milk when half-gallon would have been better, dozens of eggs at a time... Tons of money was wasted every month. We would have been okay dining out occasionally, if we could get his grocery shopping under control. It took me a long time to drive home this point with him. He'd often buy things we already had in stock in our fridge or pantry. So we'd have duplicates of things, like spices, that we didn't need. I started taking things back to stores for refunds. Finally I told him, that it would be better if he let me do grocery shopping and banned him from the stores for a while.
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When I got married, my husband said he didn't want to dine out at restaurants because it costs too much. However, he'd go to the grocery store and impulsively buy lots of food, for no particular reason, and lots of fresh produce in bulk quantities, that would rot before we could use it. Like great, big bags of potatoes, gallons of milk when half-gallon would have been better, dozens of eggs at a time... Tons of money was wasted every month. We would have been okay dining out occasionally, if we could get his grocery shopping under control. It took me a long time to drive home this point with him. He'd often buy things we already had in stock in our fridge or pantry. So we'd have duplicates of things, like spices, that we didn't need. I started taking things back to stores for refunds. Finally I told him, that it would be better if he let me do grocery shopping and banned him from the stores for a while.
A close friend of mine has a similar situation - he calls it "refrigerator blindness". His fridge is always bulging-to-overflowing, and when someone finally does clean it out its discovered that for every fresh herb, block of cheese or carton of cream in front there's at least one more in the back that spoiled weeks ago. Tupperware containers start a game of 'guess the leftover and the week'. Sadly they're often so foul he tosses the entire container in the trash, adding to the waste.
'Clean out the fridge' has become a weekly mantra of ours, and we've gotten into the habit of selecting meals around whatever needs to get used up. 'Planned-overs' are our lunches the following day. As a result its rare we ever throw food out (and we have the tastiest lunches in the breakroom)
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I'm not sure food waste has been the biggest obstacle to lowering food spending. I can toss out 5 lbs of chicken and it'll cost me $10.
Bigger problems come when buying premium items. Like, I bought a rack of ribs on sale at $3.99/lb. But a 2.5 lb rack is going to feed 2 people (a lot of the weight is bone). So it's actually $10, or $5/person, or a luxury meal.
I see this being a bigger problem for a lot of households. My parents like to buy steaks that are "on sale" at $8.99/lb, and then eat them every night for dinner. That's where you can start getting into territory "my home cooking costs more than a restaurant!"
Especially when you start adding in seafood, expensive spices, and just buy stuff as you need it instead of buying stuff on sale. I still have a lot of friends that are in that boat, as they are young and haven't quite figured out these "grocery shopping" or "buying in bulk" or "buying on sale" things. Some of this is just experience, too. My Wife prefers to buy on sale, but she can't tell the difference between a good sale price and a fake sale price at our stores. I've finally gotten her to look at unit prices, too, instead of just looking at the final price tag. Doesn't matter if a single bottle is cheaper when it's half the size.
Wanting fancy expensive ingredients is definitely my downfall. Spanish paella looks so good until I start thinking about all the seafood.... :(
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A close friend of mine has a similar situation - he calls it "refrigerator blindness". His fridge is always bulging-to-overflowing, and when someone finally does clean it out its discovered that for every fresh herb, block of cheese or carton of cream in front there's at least one more in the back that spoiled weeks ago. Tupperware containers start a game of 'guess the leftover and the week'. Sadly they're often so foul he tosses the entire container in the trash, adding to the waste.
'Clean out the fridge' has become a weekly mantra of ours, and we've gotten into the habit of selecting meals around whatever needs to get used up. 'Planned-overs' are our lunches the following day. As a result its rare we ever throw food out (and we have the tastiest lunches in the breakroom)
I started freezing leftovers more often. I've also found that when leftovers are packed away in containers, it's hard to see what's in them, so easier to forget about.
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I see this being a bigger problem for a lot of households. My parents like to buy steaks that are "on sale" at $8.99/lb, and then eat them every night for dinner. That's where you can start getting into territory "my home cooking costs more than a restaurant!"
Yes, that and shopping at Whole Foods can wind up costing more than just eating a simple meal at a restaurant.
My dad and his wife decided at Thanksgiving, they wanted to serve prime rib. And wanted everyone in the family to pitch in $20 to attend the Thanksgiving meal. We declined to attend. For one thing, I'm a vegetarian and my husband doesn't eat a lot of red meat. And also, my dad and his wife and her entire family, have had life long compulsive spending habits, and in their older years, have no money saved for retirement. We would have gladly brought over some home-cooked potluck meals, though. But that's not what they wanted. They literally said "turkey is boring". In other words, they are too high-falutin' for ordinary food.
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A close friend of mine has a similar situation - he calls it "refrigerator blindness". His fridge is always bulging-to-overflowing, and when someone finally does clean it out its discovered that for every fresh herb, block of cheese or carton of cream in front there's at least one more in the back that spoiled weeks ago. Tupperware containers start a game of 'guess the leftover and the week'. Sadly they're often so foul he tosses the entire container in the trash, adding to the waste.
'Clean out the fridge' has become a weekly mantra of ours, and we've gotten into the habit of selecting meals around whatever needs to get used up. 'Planned-overs' are our lunches the following day. As a result its rare we ever throw food out (and we have the tastiest lunches in the breakroom)
I started freezing leftovers more often. I've also found that when leftovers are packed away in containers, it's hard to see what's in them, so easier to forget about.
Sharpie + painters tape worked for us (particularly before they go into the 'deep freeze'). YMMV.
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I see this being a bigger problem for a lot of households. My parents like to buy steaks that are "on sale" at $8.99/lb, and then eat them every night for dinner. That's where you can start getting into territory "my home cooking costs more than a restaurant!"
Yes, that and shopping at Whole Foods can wind up costing more than just eating a simple meal at a restaurant.
My dad and his wife decided at Thanksgiving, they wanted to serve prime rib. And wanted everyone in the family to pitch in $20 to attend the Thanksgiving meal. We declined to attend. For one thing, I'm a vegetarian and my husband doesn't eat a lot of red meat. And also, my dad and his wife and her entire family, have had life long compulsive spending habits, and in their older years, have no money saved for retirement. We would have gladly brought over some home-cooked potluck meals, though. But that's not what they wanted. They literally said "turkey is boring". In other words, they are too high-falutin' for ordinary food.
Oooo, jeez, that's a nightmare. Sorry your Dad doesn't have a nest egg. :(
I told my parents that I wouldn't mind them living in my house, but they'll be eating what I eat, which means chicken and whatever vegetables are on sale, hehehehehe.
I'll cop to splurging on a rib roast last weekend. It hit $6.99/lb. We have a 8.5 lb roast, so $60/total. 8-10 for my friend circle. Assuming my in-laws come over for Christmas, there will be 9 meat-eaters total. I couldn't imagine trying to feed the Thanksgiving crowd with Prime Rib...I sent the invitations last weekend and we have 28 people on the list.
Yeah, you'll get turkey and like it!
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Oooo, jeez, that's a nightmare. Sorry your Dad doesn't have a nest egg. :(
His own fault.
Now I am learning from his mistakes and don't want to wind up in the same situation.
My lunch today was a PB and J sandwich and an apple.
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A close friend of mine has a similar situation - he calls it "refrigerator blindness". His fridge is always bulging-to-overflowing, and when someone finally does clean it out its discovered that for every fresh herb, block of cheese or carton of cream in front there's at least one more in the back that spoiled weeks ago. Tupperware containers start a game of 'guess the leftover and the week'. Sadly they're often so foul he tosses the entire container in the trash, adding to the waste.
'Clean out the fridge' has become a weekly mantra of ours, and we've gotten into the habit of selecting meals around whatever needs to get used up. 'Planned-overs' are our lunches the following day. As a result its rare we ever throw food out (and we have the tastiest lunches in the breakroom)
I started freezing leftovers more often. I've also found that when leftovers are packed away in containers, it's hard to see what's in them, so easier to forget about.
Sharpie + painters tape worked for us (particularly before they go into the 'deep freeze'). YMMV.
Yep, that's what we do.
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Also, I will absolutely throw stuff out if it's been in the fridge too long. I won't risk food poisoning or anyone in my family getting sick. Some of the worst offenders are soft foods like potato salad, refried beans, casserole type dishes. If it's been in the fridge longer than 3 days, it gets tossed. I'm pretty strict about it. Food poisoning can kill.
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Also, I will absolutely throw stuff out if it's been in the fridge too long. I won't risk food poisoning or anyone in my family getting sick. Some of the worst offenders are soft foods like potato salad, refried beans, casserole type dishes. If it's been in the fridge longer than 3 days, it gets tossed. I'm pretty strict about it. Food poisoning can kill.
Sure, food poisoning is really, really bad. But why let it get to this point? What is preventing you from using up already-cooked meals within three days? Seems there should be at least a half a dozen opportunities to consume left-overs within this time frame. If you're still struggling this suggests a lack of a meal plan.
Bringing this discussion back to the OP - all successful restaurants put a lot of thought into how not to waste food. Weekday specials are a way to repackage ingredients from other dishes. Scraps get turned into stock. If a portion of a dish routinely comes back uneaten they either adjust serving portions or re-think the dish. These techniques should be applied at home as well.
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A close friend of mine has a similar situation - he calls it "refrigerator blindness". His fridge is always bulging-to-overflowing, and when someone finally does clean it out its discovered that for every fresh herb, block of cheese or carton of cream in front there's at least one more in the back that spoiled weeks ago. Tupperware containers start a game of 'guess the leftover and the week'. Sadly they're often so foul he tosses the entire container in the trash, adding to the waste.
'Clean out the fridge' has become a weekly mantra of ours, and we've gotten into the habit of selecting meals around whatever needs to get used up. 'Planned-overs' are our lunches the following day. As a result its rare we ever throw food out (and we have the tastiest lunches in the breakroom)
I started freezing leftovers more often. I've also found that when leftovers are packed away in containers, it's hard to see what's in them, so easier to forget about.
Sharpie + painters tape worked for us (particularly before they go into the 'deep freeze'). YMMV.
Yep, that's what we do.
Good call on the painters tape, I will do that. I've been meal prepping and freezing half the meals, and realized now that it makes it very hard to identify them and kept forgetting to buy labels, but I do have painter's tape.
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In a pinch you can just write directly on the container. I've found that Sharpie isn't permanent on most plastics after hard scrubbing.
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We do everything in quart sized or gallon sized baggies, then flatten out as much as possible and free on a baking sheet so its flat. All necessary info is written directly on the baggie with sharpie.
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In a pinch you can just write directly on the container. I've found that Sharpie isn't permanent on most plastics after hard scrubbing.
rubbing alcohol will remove a lot of sharpie