Update on our favorite WSJ writer (Spendy McSpend)

[SpendyMcSpend]

http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304558804579374970432960110?mg=reno64-wsj&url=http%3A%2F%2Fonline.wsj.com%2Farticle%2FSB10001424052702304558804579374970432960110.html

[SnpKraklePhyz]

She's insane.  I almost threw up at 14% on $10000! Isn't that worth it?

[sheepstache]

"I know how relatively lucky we are to have what we have. And I want to enjoy it. "

But she also wants to enjoy what they don't have.

[aj_yooper]

I feel for her husband and am grateful for my wife's rationality.

[Elyse]

John simply decided our relationship was too important to keep fighting over money. "It's not worth it," he says. "Financial stuff is one of the biggest things couples argue about and causes divorce, which we don't want. It's a mistake to get into financial arguments unless you're in deep trouble."

Because ignoring a problem is always the solution.

[MoneyCat]

"I'm feeling vindicated because it proves that we can survive a tight stretch and still enjoy the lifestyle I think we deserve and can afford."

When I read in the article that she grew up poor, it all began to make sense.  I grew up poor too and as an adult I tried to "make up for lost time" by spending all my money on the stuff I felt I had "missed out on".  This writer is doing the same.  She is trying to satisfy her inferiority complex from growing up poor by spending a lot of money, but it never really fills the hole.

[JPinDC]

It seems like her husband should be writing this column, not her.

[Elyse]

I haven't read her other articles, but in this one she did make her husband's point rather clear.  She also admitted the flaws in hers.

Are we sure she isn't purposefully writing a satire piece on herself?

[frugalecon]

"I'm feeling vindicated because it proves that we can survive a tight stretch and still enjoy the lifestyle I think we deserve and can afford."

When I read in the article that she grew up poor, it all began to make sense.  I grew up poor too and as an adult I tried to "make up for lost time" by spending all my money on the stuff I felt I had "missed out on".  This writer is doing the same.  She is trying to satisfy her inferiority complex from growing up poor by spending a lot of money, but it never really fills the hole.

I grew up poor too, as did my sisters. It is interesting that we have responded differently to that experience. I have always been very fearful of going back to poverty, which led me to be very careful to build savings and minimize debt. My sisters, on the other hand, are more in the Spendy McSpend camp. I could never live like them, but it doesn't seem to bother them very much. It just seems like it would be hard to manage a marriage where the partners had such different perspectives. It would gnaw at me if I were married to someone like one of my sisters, and I don't think that I could avoid a build-up of anger. Fortunately my spouse is frugal, though without a clue about how to manage investments.

[Mrs3F]

I find the psychology that she grew up poor very interesting.  It's something I see in my own marriage as well.  I grew up comfortably (though not rich), and "fancy" things were common enough that they don't impress me.   My husband, on the other hand, grew up with a lot less, and so he sees status symbols as markers of "making it."  We also have very differing views on how financially secure we are.  He sees our house in the suburbs and growing investment accounts and feels completely secure.  I look at the same things and see a mortgage (must kill it now!), and still not enough money to retire. 

Reading the article, I'm uncomfortable with the author's decisions, but at least she is aware of the rationalizations she's making.  She isn't oblivious or complainy. 

[Erica/NWEdible]

A couple at this stage of life, with this career success, with a rental, didn't have a *10K* emergency fund? Staggered. I'm just staggered. 10K is not really much at all for a family in their situation (a situation I am presuming, based on publicly available knowledge.) That's, what, *maybe* 1 or 2 months spending for her nice New York City life with the ski trips and dining out and what not? I just don't get it.

[rocksinmyhead]

I don't get it either. Her husband sounds like a total gem, though.

[trailrated]

"I'm feeling vindicated because it proves that we can survive a tight stretch and still enjoy the lifestyle I think we deserve and can afford."

Isn't the point here that they cannot afford it... This lady is delusional

[MidwestGal]

Wow...I feel terrible for her husband as well.  It sounds like he sacrifices quite a bit in order to help keep the family afloat, just reading the story and going through others' comments on the article.  Regardless of who the breadwinner is in the family, that's what a good parent/husband does.

For all their sakes, I hope she sees the light soon.  And it makes me sad that the children may potentially see Dad as the boring parent (for not joining in the fun spendy stuff) and the Mom as the fun one (and providing the spendy entertainment), which may lead to them trying to emulate her financial behavior.

[zataks]

"I'm feeling vindicated because it proves that we can survive a tight stretch and still enjoy the lifestyle I think we deserve and can afford."

When I read in the article that she grew up poor, it all began to make sense.  I grew up poor too and as an adult I tried to "make up for lost time" by spending all my money on the stuff I felt I had "missed out on".  This writer is doing the same.  She is trying to satisfy her inferiority complex from growing up poor by spending a lot of money, but it never really fills the hole.

I grew up poor too, as did my sisters. It is interesting that we have responded differently to that experience. I have always been very fearful of going back to poverty, which led me to be very careful to build savings and minimize debt. My sisters, on the other hand, are more in the Spendy McSpend camp. I could never live like them, but it doesn't seem to bother them very much. It just seems like it would be hard to manage a marriage where the partners had such different perspectives. It would gnaw at me if I were married to someone like one of my sisters, and I don't think that I could avoid a build-up of anger. Fortunately my spouse is frugal, though without a clue about how to manage investments.

I'm actually in MoneyCat's camp here; grew up poor and once I started making money, I wanted to spend it and feel like I had money/was wealthy.  I took me a lot of years and getting into a lot of debt to realize that spending to feel wealthy was contradictory.  Luckily, I was beginning to realize this and then I found MMM and have really turned around my habits for the better!

[Mississippi Mudstache]

For all their sakes, I hope she sees the light soon.  And it makes me sad that the children may potentially see Dad as the boring parent (for not joining in the fun spendy stuff) and the Mom as the fun one (and providing the spendy entertainment), which may lead to them trying to emulate her financial behavior.

This was my thought as well. I hope the kids have good heads on their shoulders, because it would be easy to follow the wrong example here.

[MidwestGal]

Even if the kids are old enough and intelligent enought to think for themselves, it definitely helps if Dad gives them a gentle nudge now and then.  Sure, it's fun to go skiing and do extravagant things occasionally (if they're within the budget), but that doesn't make up for real and consistent quality time with someone who demonstrates good values.  This especially goes for the one who is old enough to be leaving for college soon and will have to make their own life choices.  Shopping for crap on weekends doesn't count.  It sounds like he's more willing to spend good time with them on a regular basis.

I'm sort of going through the same thing with my child's other parent (different household), so I really feel for the guy.

[Jamesqf]

I grew up poor too, as did my sisters. It is interesting that we have responded differently to that experience. I have always been very fearful of going back to poverty, which led me to be very careful to build savings and minimize debt.

I'm in your camp: not only grew up poor, but spent significant time being poor as an adult, so having money is a lot more important than spending it.

Besides, one useful side-effect of poverty was that I found a bunch of cheap-to-free things that give me as much or more enjoyment as the spendy stuff. as for instance cross-country/backcountry skiing versus expensive downhill skiing.

[Erica/NWEdible]

A couple at this stage of life, with this career success, with a rental, didn't have a *10K* emergency fund? Staggered. I'm just staggered. 10K is not really much at all for a family in their situation (a situation I am presuming, based on publicly available knowledge.) That's, what, *maybe* 1 or 2 months spending for her nice New York City life with the ski trips and dining out and what not? I just don't get it.

I read it as they put $10k on the credit cards after draining their savings accounts.

Oh, holy hell you're probably right. Woh. That's messed up - and a sign that the husband is right and they need a bigger emergency fund.

[magga]

A quote from the article
"In other words, as far as I'm concerned, we hit a crisis, and we are muddling through just fine. I know that paying 14% to carry $10,000 for a few months isn't smart. But the monthly interest fees seem trivial compared with some of the good times they pay for."

I find it odd how some people focus on "monthly interest" like they don't realize that the principal is still debt and must be paid off.

[warfreak2]

A quote from the article
"In other words, as far as I'm concerned, we hit a crisis, and we are muddling through just fine. I know that paying 14% to carry $10,000 for a few months isn't smart. But the monthly interest fees seem trivial compared with some of the good times they pay for."

I find it odd how some people focus on "monthly interest" like they don't realize that the principal is still debt and must be paid off.

Or they can just keep paying $1400/monthyear rent indefinitely, for "good times" they consumed long ago.

[Worsted Skeins]

I'm still trying to figure out what it means to "deserve" a certain life style. 

[Mississippi Mudstache]

I'm still trying to figure out what it means to "deserve" a certain life style.

Yes. To me, this was absolutely the most telling word in the whole article. How do you reason with someone who feels that they "deserve" a particular lifestyle?

[randymarsh]

The Wall Street Journal gives its target reader what they want: permission to spend and the assurance that more is better. All is right with the world...as long as the 6 (or 7!) figure paychecks keep rolling in and a new toy is available to buy.

Now, I'm less willing to keep putting off the rewards of all our hard work. I know how relatively lucky we are to have what we have.

Holy cognitive dissonance batman! In one sentence their success is because of hard work. In the next it's because of luck. This is a classic poor person/scarcity mentality. Windfall? Better spend it! Who knows when we'll have money like this again! Little extra cash this month? Time to go out to eat! If we wait, something will come up and then we'll never ever get that experience.

With just a few months remaining before our oldest heads off to college, I've instead been looking for ways to make the most of our time together

Nothing says quality time with family quite like shopping.

[dragoncar]

The Wall Street Journal gives its target reader what they want: permission to spend and the assurance that more is better. All is right with the world...as long as the 6 (or 7!) figure paychecks keep rolling in and a new toy is available to buy.

Now, I'm less willing to keep putting off the rewards of all our hard work. I know how relatively lucky we are to have what we have.

Holy cognitive dissonance batman! In one sentence their success is because of hard work. In the next it's because of luck. This is a classic poor person/scarcity mentality. Windfall? Better spend it! Who knows when we'll have money like this again! Little extra cash this month? Time to go out to eat! If we wait, something will come up and then we'll never ever get that experience.

With just a few months remaining before our oldest heads off to college, I've instead been looking for ways to make the most of our time together

Nothing says quality time with family quite like shopping.

I work hard, but I'm lucky to be paid so much more than others who work equally hard

[randymarsh]

True. It's definitely a mix of both.

[sleepyguy]

Wow, do majority of the middle class think like things?  Unreal... wait until a "real" disaster hits like one of them losing their jobs then she'll change her "entitled" thinking.  Even though I haven't fully embraced the MMM lifestyle... but ever since I've moved in with my GF (9yrs ago) we've always said "let's budget so that if one of use loses our jobs we can still be fine".

"In other words, as far as I'm concerned, we hit a crisis, and we are muddling through just fine. I know that paying 14% to carry $10,000 for a few months isn't smart. But the monthly interest fees seem trivial compared with some of the good times they pay for.

While I worry plenty about the future, I never want that worry to paralyze my ability to live fully in the present. So I'll take the kids shopping and get dinner out. I'll pay for infrequent ski trips and theater tickets. And, on a coming family vacation (prepaid during better times), I'm hoping to finally get the kids snorkeling, a long-standing goal."

[nora]

A quote from the article
"In other words, as far as I'm concerned, we hit a crisis, and we are muddling through just fine. I know that paying 14% to carry $10,000 for a few months isn't smart. But the monthly interest fees seem trivial compared with some of the good times they pay for."

I find it odd how some people focus on "monthly interest" like they don't realize that the principal is still debt and must be paid off.

Or they can just keep paying $1400/month rent indefinitely, for "good times" they consumed long ago.

I think it's $1400 for a year, so about $116 for a month.

[arebelspy]

We've discussed this author before:
http://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/antimustachian-wall-of-shame-and-comedy/wow-this-journalist-thinks-her-husband-is-frugal-(posted-another-by-her)/

She's not too bright.

Also:

John simply decided our relationship was too important to keep fighting over money. "It's not worth it," he says. "Financial stuff is one of the biggest things couples argue about and causes divorce, which we don't want. It's a mistake to get into financial arguments unless you're in deep trouble."

The problem with this is that ignoring it and going into debt is what CAUSES the money problems that lead to divorce.  It's not communication over money that does so.

He's making it more likely that it will harm his relationship.

Of course, if you read that previous MMM discussion and linked article, it seems that the poor guy is pretty browbeat by his wife, at least when it comes to financial matters.

[warfreak2]

Wait, shouldn't it be $1400/year?

Uh... oops. Good call!

[Nords]

I'm still trying to figure out what it means to "deserve" a certain life style.

Yes. To me, this was absolutely the most telling word in the whole article. How do you reason with someone who feels that they "deserve" a particular lifestyle?

Hey hey hey, they had a hard day.  Several of them.  In a row. 

They've earned a break.

Once they've earned the break, they DESERVE the lifestyle.

There's no reasoning with that, as long as the bankruptcy lawyer gets paid first...

[Lian]

Like frugalecon & MoneyCat, I grew up poor & got carried away with spending once I had money.  I do wish my Spendy phase had been shorter, but fortunately moved past it. 

[TreeTired]

Overall... pathetic.    However,  I can somewhat relate to the idea of having a great relationship because we don't argue about money.  I have in the past said that is the key to my happy and longlasting marriage, but fortunately my wife has not spent frivolously. 

This part knocked me over: 

With just a few months remaining before our oldest heads off to college, I've instead been looking for ways to make the most of our time together.

I was working at night during the Spring of my younger son's senior year in high school, and I had one of the most enjoyable times of my life attending his high school track meets and watching him perform.  He wasn't a star, but scored points and advanced to the regional competition.  I didn't have to buy him any fancy presents or take exotic trips.  It was mostly just time we were able to spend together.

[mm1970]

I'm still trying to figure out what it means to "deserve" a certain life style.

Yes. To me, this was absolutely the most telling word in the whole article. How do you reason with someone who feels that they "deserve" a particular lifestyle?

Hey hey hey, they had a hard day.  Several of them.  In a row. 

They've earned a break.

Once they've earned the break, they DESERVE the lifestyle.

There's no reasoning with that, as long as the bankruptcy lawyer gets paid first...

The "deserve" always made me wonder.  You deserve what you can afford.

[Ambergris]

Thanks for this.  An interesting article about a single father with three children: one little boy, 8, and two little girls, 12 and 42.

[Travis]

Overall... pathetic.    However,  I can somewhat relate to the idea of having a great relationship because we don't argue about money.  I have in the past said that is the key to my happy and longlasting marriage, but fortunately my wife has not spent frivolously. 

This part knocked me over: 

With just a few months remaining before our oldest heads off to college, I've instead been looking for ways to make the most of our time together.

I was working at night during the Spring of my younger son's senior year in high school, and I had one of the most enjoyable times of my life attending his high school track meets and watching him perform.  He wasn't a star, but scored points and advanced to the regional competition.  I didn't have to buy him any fancy presents or take exotic trips.  It was mostly just time we were able to spend together.

DW has never been a big spender (she was once embarrassed at spending $100 at a bookstore for herself and bought new clothes last week for the first time in 4 years) and my son's imagination is worth a fortune.  Most of the toys we buy him come from the Dollar Store or something equivalent.  He's four years old and he still gets hours of entertainment from a stick he finds at the park.  His grandparents buy the more complex and expensive stuff, and we make a habit out of taking a few underused items to Goodwill every year.  He loves going outside and it doesn't matter what he's doing.  I took him to the park a few days before I shipped out and he climbed into my lap and lamented that we don't get to spend a lot of time together.  I think even when he gets older he won't need expensive trips, but just time hanging out doing something enjoyable.

The author seems to be the kind of person who can justify any kind of spending and treats her husband's frugality as a cute experiment rather than a way of life. DW hasn't completely bought into the mustachian changes I've made in our household this last year, but at least she's not fighting me on them either. 

[The Hamster]

"I'm feeling vindicated because it proves that we can survive a tight stretch and still enjoy the lifestyle I think we deserve and can afford."

When I read in the article that she grew up poor, it all began to make sense.  I grew up poor too and as an adult I tried to "make up for lost time" by spending all my money on the stuff I felt I had "missed out on".  This writer is doing the same.  She is trying to satisfy her inferiority complex from growing up poor by spending a lot of money, but it never really fills the hole.

I grew up poor too, as did my sisters. It is interesting that we have responded differently to that experience. I have always been very fearful of going back to poverty, which led me to be very careful to build savings and minimize debt. My sisters, on the other hand, are more in the Spendy McSpend camp. I could never live like them, but it doesn't seem to bother them very much. It just seems like it would be hard to manage a marriage where the partners had such different perspectives. It would gnaw at me if I were married to someone like one of my sisters, and I don't think that I could avoid a build-up of anger. Fortunately my spouse is frugal, though without a clue about how to manage investments.

I'm actually in MoneyCat's camp here; grew up poor and once I started making money, I wanted to spend it and feel like I had money/was wealthy.  I took me a lot of years and getting into a lot of debt to realize that spending to feel wealthy was contradictory.  Luckily, I was beginning to realize this and then I found MMM and have really turned around my habits for the better!

Me three,

While we were never "poor" growing up we sure weren't keeping up with the Joneses due to my mum being on disability pension so a one wage family.  As soon as I started working and making my own money I spent it on expensive clothes and things I knew "wealthy" people owned mainly to look like I was rich.  Even after I woke up to myself and started investing I still spent much more on "stuff" than I should.  Wish I had found this site a lot sooner.

[The Hamster]

Oh, and also, I have just read 3 of this lady's articles through following links from post to post and you know what?  I actually think she is a great financial writer!  I think she is writing satirical pieces about her money attitudes v her husband's money attidudes as reverse psychology so regular people can more easily recognise that being a Spendy McSpend is not a good thing.  If her stories make her readers rethink their own spending habits then that is great IMO.  People actually can learn alot from reading about how other people stuff things up (or pretend to).

I very much doubt they are as hard up as she makes it seem.  If hubby is selling mediaeval manuscripts and buying houses in cash and making $100,000 profits I'm sure they have a tonne of money stashed somewhere we don't know about *winky wink.  But why let the truth get in the way of a good story?

[SpareChange]

Like frugalecon & MoneyCat, I grew up poor & got carried away with spending once I had money.  I do wish my Spendy phase had been shorter, but fortunately moved past it.

Was poor many times growing up. I think it taught me how to value material things differently than most. We were very financially unstable, so at times we had "decent" furniture, and at other times I spent years sleeping on the floor and had no running water. To me, beyond a few basics, "stuff" had pretty strong diminishing returns. We often lived paycheck to paycheck, and had creditors calling 4-5 times a day for awhile. I think I intuitively began to really see the value of money as, not in exchanging it for as much stuff as possible, but in just having it sacked away and available. That there's value in not having a Damoclean sword of debt above you, or that when emergencies or opportunities arise, finances will be a secondary issue.  Sometimes our parents teach us much more about how NOT to live life, than how to live it.

[Waternstone]

It seems like her husband should be writing this column, not her.

lol...YES! +1 on that comment. Can't believe she gets published in the Journal...then, again, prob fits their average reader's scenario.

[Kaminoge]

I very much doubt they are as hard up as she makes it seem.  If hubby is selling mediaeval manuscripts and buying houses in cash and making $100,000 profits I'm sure they have a tonne of money stashed somewhere we don't know about *winky wink.  But why let the truth get in the way of a good story?

This. I think there's a bit of creativity going on here to spin a good story.

[odput]

I very much doubt they are as hard up as she makes it seem.  If hubby is selling mediaeval manuscripts and buying houses in cash and making $100,000 profits I'm sure they have a tonne of money stashed somewhere we don't know about *winky wink.  But why let the truth get in the way of a good story?

This. I think there's a bit of creativity going on here to spin a good story.

Problem with that is, over the internet, people can't really pick up on whether or not you are telling a tall-tale so to speak or just putting out your actual experience.  Especially in a place like WSJ.

I mean, look at the way we the mustachians reacted to it...beating it down as ridiculous spendypants drivel.  An average Joe coming across an article like that in a "reputable" publication will likely just take it as further validation that being $10k in debt is normal and not a big deal.

[The Hamster]

I very much doubt they are as hard up as she makes it seem.  If hubby is selling mediaeval manuscripts and buying houses in cash and making $100,000 profits I'm sure they have a tonne of money stashed somewhere we don't know about *winky wink.  But why let the truth get in the way of a good story?

This. I think there's a bit of creativity going on here to spin a good story.

Problem with that is, over the internet, people can't really pick up on whether or not you are telling a tall-tale so to speak or just putting out your actual experience.  Especially in a place like WSJ.

I mean, look at the way we the mustachians reacted to it...beating it down as ridiculous spendypants drivel.  An average Joe coming across an article like that in a "reputable" publication will likely just take it as further validation that being $10k in debt is normal and not a big deal.

No doubt some will, but I read the comments on all three of her articles and pretty much all of them were in the same vein as the comments on this thread - that having that much debt and spending money you don't have because you "deserve it" is worth multiple facepunches.  Surely not all the readers of her articles are moustachian types, there must be regular Joe's that read her and realise that her money management as portrayed in the articles is ridonkulous.  Just my take on but may just be reading too much between the lines.

I would love to know more about selling/buying antique manuscripts though, sounds like an interesting side hustle.

[Elyse]

Oh, and also, I have just read 3 of this lady's articles through following links from post to post and you know what?  I actually think she is a great financial writer!  I think she is writing satirical pieces about her money attitudes v her husband's money attidudes as reverse psychology so regular people can more easily recognise that being a Spendy McSpend is not a good thing.  If her stories make her readers rethink their own spending habits then that is great IMO.  People actually can learn alot from reading about how other people stuff things up (or pretend to).

This is what I was thinking.

The entire piece screamed satire to me.  She did a great job of putting her husband's habits in a good light.  If you are trying to prove your own point, that isn't a good thing to do.  She's a good writer.  She would have known how to write a properly persuasive piece.  The fact that she didn't suggests that she is trying to write it in her husband's favor. 

I'm pretty sure no one here noticed that she is such a great satire artist.

The comments on the articles highly suggest that her plan is working.  The point was to make people write comments about how stupid it was to live like that.  Her plan worked.