Author Topic: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...  (Read 7289 times)

Jamesqf

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$60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« on: May 20, 2014, 11:07:48 PM »
...which apparently is newsworthy only because of construction defects:
A North Texas high school's $60 million stadium that has been shut down since February amid structural flaws will remain closed through the fall football season.

The Allen Independent School District on Tuesday announced consulting engineers found "significant" structural problems at Eagle Stadium.

Words fail me, but anyone want to explain again about how our education system is underfunded?

johnintaiwan

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #1 on: May 21, 2014, 07:22:09 AM »
The football team (and stadium) likely get a large majority of their funding privately through their boosters. People in texas really love their football and will pay a lot to the booster fund raisers. the school is not likely spending a dime on the stadium. The school probably has a very small budget for sports, but anything extra that the community wants to donate to extra curriculars is accepted. It is also usually the case that the school makes money off of the tickets and concessions that they sell. It normally works out well for the school. Someone else pays for a huge stadium which makes money for the school. Though I don't know the actually details of this stadium. But that is the way it worked at my high school.

I agree though that it would be nice if the community was that generous to actual school related matters.

Vorpal

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #2 on: May 21, 2014, 07:29:14 AM »
I agree though that it would be nice if the community was that generous to actual school related matters.

Exactly. Think of the world-class educational equipment that the school could purchase with $60MM... or the top-tier educators that could be lured to the school with higher pay.

thepokercab

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2014, 07:54:29 AM »
Actually, voters approved funding for the stadium through a Bond election in 2009.  It got 64% of the vote.

http://www2.allenisd.org/web/Newsletter/0509.ht

Local Democracy in action.. 

ketchup

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2014, 08:14:30 AM »
This really disgusts me too.  I saw in my high school.  While I was there, they added a fieldhouse and upgraded the football stadium, along with a bunch of other insanity.  It was madness, especially because the orchestra was still meeting in a chemistry room, and I know the teachers were still making what teachers make.

It irked my parents more though, as their property taxes had tripled in the previous 8 years of living there.

CarDude

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #5 on: May 21, 2014, 08:38:51 AM »
Actually, voters approved funding for the stadium through a Bond election in 2009.  It got 64% of the vote.

http://www2.allenisd.org/web/Newsletter/0509.ht

Local Democracy in action..

Yup, it looks like an uninformed population making an uninformed decision. A different site I read suggested they did it in hopes of turning the town into a one stop shop for people (e.g., planning for a population boom that might never come).

Keep in mind, this doesn't mean that education isn't underfunded; it just means that people often vote against their own interests (see: states with high unemployment electing Republican governors who promptly cut unemployment benefits upon election).

Ottawa

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2014, 08:59:09 AM »
Actually, voters approved funding for the stadium through a Bond election in 2009.  It got 64% of the vote.

http://www2.allenisd.org/web/Newsletter/0509.ht

Local Democracy in action..

Yup, it looks like an uninformed population making an uninformed decision. A different site I read suggested they did it in hopes of turning the town into a one stop shop for people (e.g., planning for a population boom that might never come).

Keep in mind, this doesn't mean that education isn't underfunded; it just means that people often vote against their own interests (see: states with high unemployment electing Republican governors who promptly cut unemployment benefits upon election).

This, unfortunately is too common.  Apparently affluence doesn't promote good decision making , since Allen has approximately twice the median household income, as compared to Texas.  I'm not sure why sports attract divert a disproportional amount of money away from things that would do much more for the community good. 

Quote
A different site I read suggested they did it in hopes of turning the town into a one stop shop for people (e.g., planning for a population boom that might never come).

Wow, this is lottery ticket mentality! 

ncornilsen

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #7 on: May 21, 2014, 09:21:32 AM »
Actually, voters approved funding for the stadium through a Bond election in 2009.  It got 64% of the vote.

http://www2.allenisd.org/web/Newsletter/0509.ht

Local Democracy in action..

Yup, it looks like an uninformed population making an uninformed decision. A different site I read suggested they did it in hopes of turning the town into a one stop shop for people (e.g., planning for a population boom that might never come).

Keep in mind, this doesn't mean that education isn't underfunded; it just means that people often vote against their own interests (see: states with high unemployment electing Republican governors who promptly cut unemployment benefits upon election).

Totally. Also see people voting unions into their workplace, etc. Now, it would be nice to see less of your political tripe on this forum, since there are plenty of other forums that get completely derailed on political tangents like that. It used to be that we didn't see a lot of political posts on this forum, but for the last 8 months or so, it seems it's been invaded.

Gin1984

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2014, 10:20:56 AM »
Actually, voters approved funding for the stadium through a Bond election in 2009.  It got 64% of the vote.

http://www2.allenisd.org/web/Newsletter/0509.ht

Local Democracy in action..

Yup, it looks like an uninformed population making an uninformed decision. A different site I read suggested they did it in hopes of turning the town into a one stop shop for people (e.g., planning for a population boom that might never come).

Keep in mind, this doesn't mean that education isn't underfunded; it just means that people often vote against their own interests (see: states with high unemployment electing Republican governors who promptly cut unemployment benefits upon election).

Totally. Also see people voting unions into their workplace, etc. Now, it would be nice to see less of your political tripe on this forum, since there are plenty of other forums that get completely derailed on political tangents like that. It used to be that we didn't see a lot of political posts on this forum, but for the last 8 months or so, it seems it's been invaded.
ROFL, unions increases wage on average and protect workers.  The idea that unions being voted in is against the WORKERS interest is hilarious.

Eric

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2014, 10:23:22 AM »
I read the topic headline and thought "that's gotta be in Texas".  Good to know some things still work like they're supposed to.

Eric

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2014, 10:41:13 AM »
Now, it would be nice to see less of your political tripe on this forum, since there are plenty of other forums that get completely derailed on political tangents like that. It used to be that we didn't see a lot of political posts on this forum, but for the last 8 months or so, it seems it's been invaded.

Or, you know, you could just let it go.  It's not like every political comment needs a response from an opposing viewpoint.

As an avid user of this forum, I see very few political posts compared to non-political posts.  And normally they're contained within easy to spot threads so they're easy to avoid if you so choose.  If you feel like the forum's been invaded with politics, maybe you're reading the wrong threads.  Ignore those and I bet you'll find it's a much more pleasant space.

ArbitraryGuy

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2014, 12:11:47 PM »
Actually, voters approved funding for the stadium through a Bond election in 2009.  It got 64% of the vote.

http://www2.allenisd.org/web/Newsletter/0509.ht

Local Democracy in action.. 

Television shows and anecdotes from acquaintances, who happen to be Texans, suggest to me that Texans really like their high school football.  This confirms that.

Jamesqf

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2014, 12:35:20 PM »
Keep in mind, this doesn't mean that education isn't underfunded; it just means that people often vote against their own interests (see: states with high unemployment electing Republican governors who promptly cut unemployment benefits upon election).

One could argue that 1) The employed (who are the majority) are voting in their own interests; and 2) Some of the unemployed might think their interests are better served by increased* job opportunities.  Or that it makes more sense to pay high unemployment benefits when unemployment rates are low...

*Admittedly this relies on them believing politicians' promises :-)

infogoon

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2014, 03:16:16 PM »
From the Deadspin thread on this stadium:

"Here's your problem. See this support column? Looks like it was designed by a guy who learned calculus at a school which spent its money on a football stadium instead of a decent teacher."

Ottawa

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2014, 03:18:28 PM »
From the Deadspin thread on this stadium:

"Here's your problem. See this support column? Looks like it was designed by a guy who learned calculus at a school which spent its money on a football stadium instead of a decent teacher."
lol

Vorpal

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #15 on: May 21, 2014, 03:23:03 PM »
From the Deadspin thread on this stadium:

"Here's your problem. See this support column? Looks like it was designed by a guy who learned calculus at a school which spent its money on a football stadium instead of a decent teacher."

Genius.

DeepEllumStache

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #16 on: May 21, 2014, 03:33:55 PM »
Frighteningly this is a suburb of Dallas that is known for having a better public education system than the city itself.  $60M would probably do some great things for the quality of the Dallas school system. 

Instead there are people (including an impressive number of my coworkers) who voluntarily choose to live there and commute an hour each way to work downtown.  And they say they do this so their kids can go to school in this specific suburb.

But at least they have a fancy football stadium...


LalsConstant

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #17 on: May 21, 2014, 05:16:49 PM »
As a native Texan, I can't really defend this, but I can try to explain it.

There are towns and cities in Texas where every time there's a home game, the stores, restaurants, gas stations, the movie theaters, and motels all fill up.  This is, culturally, a big thing.  Sure you can mock it, but I'd rather see people get excited about some young people in their communities doing something than get that excited about some fake professional team staffed by millionaires who aren't even from your region.

Also, it makes people rally behind a common point of interest.  It makes communities feel like, well, communities.

I'm not saying it's a completely good thing either.  I was a nerdy kid.  I drilled computer science and math and English as much as the athletes threw balls around, and no one ever came to my meets.  Granted my meets weren't fun to watch either.

But because it is what it is, a lot of communities, for right or wrong, see these high school football stadiums as "investments".  To a degree that's sort of true, my own high school football stadium was used at least once a week for some other event and at certain times it was open to the community.  And it does drum up some local business.  But rarely does the community that paid for the stadium actually see a positive return on its investment.

I think it also creates a race to the bottom, because everyone tries to outdo the other.

Also, Texas or not, you will always have better luck getting people to financially support something they understand and like, and the more common the interest is the more money it's going to attract.  Let me put it to you this way: I appreciate the pressure and intensity of competitive calculus and I like a nice football game once in a while too.  But for every 1 of me, there's 1000 who like the football, a lot more than I do, and think calculus is a store that sells adding machines.

They're just as nutty about other things in other places.  One word: Lacrosse.  Lacrosse people make Texas high school football culture tame by comparison.  There are places in Europe where they're insane for soccer.  You also have to realize we don't have the winter sports in high schools either, so the others get that much more attention.

This is pretty bad though.  I used to be a stadium official both as a volunteer and for a little extra cash, and I've been in PLENTY of Texas high school stadiums that aren't nearly that pricey that still get the job done just fine.  I'm not from Allen but I've always perceived it to be an opulent Dallas suburb full of rich yuppies.

Fireman

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2014, 06:18:43 PM »
Fun fact:  if each of the 18,000 seats cost $10 and all that money went to debt service, it would take over 330 years to recoup the cost.

I read the topic headline and thought "that's gotta be in Texas".  Good to know some things still work like they're supposed to.

Yep, same here!

Psychstache

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #19 on: May 22, 2014, 06:19:02 AM »
Fun fact:  if each of the 18,000 seats cost $10 and all that money went to debt service, it would take over 330 years to recoup the cost.

I read the topic headline and thought "that's gotta be in Texas".  Good to know some things still work like they're supposed to.

Yep, same here!

Even more fun fact: the tickets were only $6 if bought in advance, then became $8 at the gate.

I live just outside of the Allen area and remember when this ridiculousness was announced. Just pitiful.

(I better keep my voice down lest I get caught criticizing high school football, the national religion of the great Republic of Texas).

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There are towns and cities in Texas where every time there's a home game, the stores, restaurants, gas stations, the movie theaters, and motels all fill up. 


Allen is not one of those small town pride Texas towns. This was done for the same reason everything in the Dallas-Fort Worth Area is done: to let people know we have money and we will accept only the biggest and best money will buy. Much like a smaller version of Jerryworld (new Cowboys stadium), many of the people go to these as a 'be seen' social event, not because they care about the team.

"Pony Excess", the ESPN documentary about SMU's college football shenanigans that led to them receiving the NCAA's "death penalty" has an accurate aside that talks about how Dallas developed this culture and attitude (available on Netflix).

LalsConstant

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2014, 07:42:09 AM »
Wow.  I am depressed that the negative opinion of Allen (one of clueless city slickers abounding in misspent wealth and pretentiousness) I have heard trumpeted for so long may have some validity.

I so wanted that to be an unfair assessment based on the sour grapes of those in less affluent areas of the state.

libertarian4321

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #21 on: May 22, 2014, 07:59:39 AM »
Actually, voters approved funding for the stadium through a Bond election in 2009.  It got 64% of the vote.

http://www2.allenisd.org/web/Newsletter/0509.ht

Local Democracy in action..

Yup, it looks like an uninformed population making an uninformed decision. A different site I read suggested they did it in hopes of turning the town into a one stop shop for people (e.g., planning for a population boom that might never come).

Keep in mind, this doesn't mean that education isn't underfunded; it just means that people often vote against their own interests (see: states with high unemployment electing Republican governors who promptly cut unemployment benefits upon election).

Well, Texas certainly doesn't have an unemployment problem, it's unemployment rate is far below the national average, and if you discount the regions along the Mexican border, which tend to have a very large percentage of poor immigrants who may not even speak English, the unemployment rate is ridiculously low.

Though I'm appalled at the waste in this football stadium.

But I suspect it's like every other school bond issue, anywhere in the USA.  The bond is proposed, those who will make money from the bond issue (teachers, administrators, building contractors, etc) all show to vote "yes" on the bond, while the average taxpayer probably doesn't show up to vote (they tend to hold these elections on non-standard dates- like a Tuesday in the middle of May- just to keep the casual voters away).

On the rare chance this strategy fails, knock $200 off the $60 million bond, and force another vote.  Rinse and repeat until the "nay" voters are worn down, and the thing passes.


Kaminoge

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Re: $60 Million High School Football Stadium...
« Reply #22 on: May 22, 2014, 08:21:19 AM »
Has anyone every read "Friday Night Lights" (or maybe watched it, I think they made a movie of it). It made me weep for humanity. And basically explains this kind of insanity.