Author Topic: Rep Duncan Hunter overdraws his bank account more than 1,100 times over 7 years.  (Read 6143 times)

frozen

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The 30 most astounding moments in Rep. Duncan Hunter's 47-page indictment

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/22/politics/duncan-hunter-indicted/index.html

1. "Throughout the relevant period, the Hunters spent substantially more than they earned. They overdrew their bank account more than 1,100 times in a seven-year period resulting in approximately $37,761 in 'overdraft' and 'insufficient funds bank' fees."
Holy crap! In a seven-year period, the Hunters allegedly overdrew their bank account more than 1,000 times! Also, according to the indictment, Hunter had less than $1,000 in reportable assets listed on his personal financial disclosure forms for each year between 2009 and 2016. Talk about living beyond your means!

EricL

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(Insert snarky but deserved liberal comment about conservative fiscal responsibility hypocrisy here.)

OtherJen

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(Insert snarky but deserved liberal comment about conservative fiscal responsibility hypocrisy here.)

I’ve had that thought many, many times with this Congress.

Kimera757

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Budget Line Item 2: Annual Bank Fees. $5,000.

Some people don't need payday lenders. They can let the bank screw them instead.

IsThisAGoodUsername

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1,100 times in 7 years:
=1,100 / (7*365)
=1,100 / 2,555
=Overdraft every 2.3 days.

ixtap

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1,100 times in 7 years:
=1,100 / (7*365)
=1,100 / 2,555
=Overdraft every 2.3 days.

They need a no spend week.

As Cohen pointed out, they can have free room and board in jail. I don't know about that, though. The prisoners are striking for more pay.

frozen

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He bought some shorts at a golf shop and tried to say they were golf balls for the wounded warriors? What the heck? In any large company you have to have an itemized receipt to submit an expense. And you would probably get fired for too many expense violations.
I wonder how pissed off his campaign donors are?
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 09:41:48 PM by frozen »

talltexan

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He's running for re-election in a Ruby Red district. Hunter has a good chance of continuing to serve us.

Just Joe

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So any guesses about where these people will be in a year? Will some Republican supporter (red to their core) bail them out, will one of them be working retail for $10 an hour, or will he be in jail?

eljefe-speaks

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Drain the swamp.

OtherJen

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He's running for re-election in a Ruby Red district. Hunter has a good chance of continuing to serve us.

Between this ass, Newt Gingrich, Trump, and so many others, this is why I laugh when people claim that the GOP is the party of social and fiscal conservatism and moral values.

Jon Bon

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Time to start the MMM party?

The platform would be all bike trails, public parks, and clean air?

ixtap

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Time to start the MMM party?

The platform would be all bike trails, public parks, and clean air?

Health care gets a lot of discussion time around here, as well.

OtherJen

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Time to start the MMM party?

The platform would be all bike trails, public parks, and clean air?

Health care gets a lot of discussion time around here, as well.

And infrastructure (roads, bridges, public transportation).

talltexan

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Some types of infrastructure are mustachian.

Not the roads. Unless they're toll roads, so the rest of us get money from those CARsuma-suckas.

OtherJen

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Some types of infrastructure are mustachian.

Not the roads. Unless they're toll roads, so the rest of us get money from those CARsuma-suckas.

I live in a state with legendarily terrible road surfaces. Better road maintenance would reduce police and medical (the roads are bad enough that they cause accidents and occasionally sinkholes), insurance, and repair costs and keep cars in better condition, thus allowing them to be driven longer.

I’m decidedly not libertarian, though, so YMMV.

better late

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Hunter signed an affidavit that his card was hacked and there were fraudulent charges that he was reimbursed for. Which apparently there weren't. Isn't that a whole 'nother kinda crime?
Wondering what his personal credit card statements look like....

talltexan

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I like the "my wife handles all of our finances" defense he's now trotting out.

I came of age during the Clinton-Bush campaign in 1992, and I remember the conservative refrain, "If [Bill Clinton's] wife can't trust him, why should we?"

Hunter should win re-election easily, but he'll have to trade up to a lobbyist job to make back the money that this upcoming divorce will cost him.

ixtap

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Hunter signed an affidavit that his card was hacked and there were fraudulent charges that he was reimbursed for. Which apparently there weren't. Isn't that a whole 'nother kinda crime?
Wondering what his personal credit card statements look like....

Eve did it. Not Adam, it was all Eve.

nouveauRiche

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Yes, he'll win reelection and continue to work until he's convicted.  Sounds like they have plenty on him.

They are trying to replace Chris Collins on the ballot in NY.  I read that Hunter's name can't be replaced on the ballot. 

I wasn't able to find out what happens to his house seat if (when?) he's convicted.

GuitarStv

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Some types of infrastructure are mustachian.

Not the roads. Unless they're toll roads, so the rest of us get money from those CARsuma-suckas.

I ride my bike on roads.

Pigeon

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ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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My favorite was the $600 plane ticket for a rabbit.

Pigeon

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My favorite was the $600 plane ticket for a rabbit.

You wouldn't want the poor bunny to fly coach.

robartsd

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Yes, he'll win reelection and continue to work until he's convicted.  Sounds like they have plenty on him.

They are trying to replace Chris Collins on the ballot in NY.  I read that Hunter's name can't be replaced on the ballot. 

I wasn't able to find out what happens to his house seat if (when?) he's convicted.
A seat in the House of Representatives can only be filled by an elected representative - so the seat would be vacant until an election is held. If there is enough time left in the term (usually a full year, but specific rules for calling the special election vary from state to state), a special election would be held; otherwise, the seat would be left vacant until the next congress is sworn into office.

EricL

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My favorite was the $600 plane ticket for a rabbit.

You wouldn't want the poor bunny to fly coach.

Have you heard what United Airlines does to bunnies?

frozen

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The latest is that Congressman  Duncan Hunter is blaming his wife! His wife Margret now has her own legal team! Can you imagine being married to this man?

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/24/politics/duncan-hunter-margaret-hunter/index.html

YttriumNitrate

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A seat in the House of Representatives can only be filled by an elected representative - so the seat would be vacant until an election is held. If there is enough time left in the term (usually a full year, but specific rules for calling the special election vary from state to state), a special election would be held; otherwise, the seat would be left vacant until the next congress is sworn into office.
When Jesse Jackson Jr. was elected while staying in a mental hospital (I wish I was kidding), a primary and then a general election was held within the span of about 5 months.

Abe

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There is no plan for a special election before the planned general election. California doesn't allow for write-in candidates. The only other contender is Mr. Campa-Najjar, who worked as a campaign person for President Obama but otherwise has minimal political experience. Barring him being indicted for a felony also, he'll be the next representative from that district. A good question is who the Republicans will put up to run against him in 2020, as that person will likely be the next long-term representative of that district (Hunter and his father were representatives for over a quarter century).

Catbert

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There is no plan for a special election before the planned general election. California doesn't allow for write-in candidates. The only other contender is Mr. Campa-Najjar, who worked as a campaign person for President Obama but otherwise has minimal political experience. Barring him being indicted for a felony also, he'll be the next representative from that district. A good question is who the Republicans will put up to run against him in 2020, as that person will likely be the next long-term representative of that district (Hunter and his father were representatives for over a quarter century).

Oh, how I wish this was true.  Hunter will be on the ballot and almost 100% chance will be re-elected. 
Certainly not the only indicted congress member to be re-elected from both parties.  That district would probably re-elect a dead Republican. 

California has a top-two-regardless of party system.  The Republicans were well aware that indictment was a possibility.  All they had to do in June was provide a bit of support to one of the other Republicans running in the primary and he would have come in second place and been on the ballo along with Hunter.  The vote was something like:  Hunter 49%, Campa-Najjar 15%, other Republican 13%.  (I'm too lazy to look up the exact numbers, but as a San Diegan have followed the story.)

maizeman

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1,100 times in 7 years:
=1,100 / (7*365)
=1,100 / 2,555
=Overdraft every 2.3 days.

Presumably what happened was the bank acount went into the red, and items continued to post to it for a while before someone figured it out and transferred money (or a new paycheck showed up). If you have $60 in the bank and debts of $20, $30, $1, and $100 post in that order you have one overdraft, but if they post in the order $100, $1, $30, $20, you have three distinct overdrafts.

So could be that they actually ran out of money a couple of times a month rather than 3x a week.

Ridiculous either way though.

SupersavingMMM

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I appreciate me being a Brit may both preclude me from fully appreciating the situation in terms of how your elections etc work...and also, well we certainly have our own issues here that raise eyebrows (anyone for Brexit? 😡).........but.....

How does this even happen that someone can be so blatant and obvious and not be forced to resign? I read the link above, and a couple,of others, and I was flabbergasted. Astonished.  We have our own ‘safe seats’ and areas that are unlikely to ever ‘turn’ (also, some of the more lurid gossip about e.g Boris Johnson raises both eyebrows!)...but I like to think that if an MP here was this obviously fraudulent, there would be consequences other than denying it and carrying on with an elections as if it was a minor inconvenience.

We had our own MP expenses scandals a few years ago...much was gotten away with and there were definitely far too few consequences for people milking the system but there was a level of ambiguity around salary and expenses rules here (along with the expectation that it was ‘normal’ to claim for duck houses and moat cleaning on expenses) that ‘allowed’ it to happen.  I don’t doubt that we have our issues here that cause pain...home ‘flipping’ and MPs claiming for the smallest of things as an expense, come to mind, along with undeclared interests and the involvement of family members in business/industry etc.  It still seems extraordinary to me that this guy could still get elected though.

Anyway, I am definitely going to follow this story with interest now -despite never hearing of him before today!

maizeman

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I think that political parties are a lot stronger relative to individual MPs in the UK than political parties are relative to individual congresspeople/senators in the USA.

Also keep in mind that US elections take a long time relative to those in the UK.

-In the UK, the whole process from deciding to have an election to selecting candidates to the final election is two months.

-In the USA people start running for their party's nominations a year or more before the final date of the election, and in some states the elections for which candidates will be nominated by which party happen as early as March for an election in November (eight months).

As a result, there is a much bigger window for either party to find themselves in the situation like the one the republican party finds themselves in with Hunter, where a major scandal breaks, but it's too late for them to switch out their candidate for someone less corrupt. In these situations the party leadership has the choice between standing behind their corrupt candidate (and maybe losing), or abandoning their candidate (and also risking losing the seat, but also risking that  the candidate they abandoned doesn't lose, resulting in years and years of having to work closely with a person who feels personally betrayed by their party and will find all sorts of ways to be a problem for the party leadership).

SupersavingMMM

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Thanks for your input, Maizeman.  I don’t know a whole lot about American politics but it seems like a very interesting area to do some reading on.  A year! A lot can happen in a year!


maizeman

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Happy I could shed a little light on the topic! Yes, all sorts of surprises can pop up over the course of a year, and in lots of cases one or both parties go into the election with a candidate who never would have won the nomination if people had the same information during the primary election and they did by the time of the general.

Once of my favorite elective classes back in college was the comparative world government one as prior to that I hadn't really thought much about how small differences in how different democratic countries handle election can have such big downstream consequences. (And the USA and UK are probably more similar than most, we don't use any form of proportional representation.)

frozen

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This article says his salary was $174K, plus perks.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/08/indicted-pol-blames-wife-complains-about-usd174-000-salary.html

Rep. Duncan Hunter, R-Calif., who has pleaded not guilty to charges of misusing campaign money to pay for personal items, said Thursday his $174,000 annual salary does not provide him with enough money to live in his Southern California congressional district.

“I mean, $174,000 per year is what a member of Congress makes. Do you think they should make more than that, is it not enough to live on?” Fox News host Martha MacCallum asked Hunter in his first TV interview since charges were filed Tuesday.

“It depends where you live. It’s difficult to live in a place like San Francisco or San Diego or New York or D.C.,” said Hunter, whose district includes part of San Diego. “It’s probably easier to live in Kansas or Missouri, so it’s all relative.”

ShoulderThingThatGoesUp

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For what it’s worth his party leadership wants him to resign and is stripping him of all of his committee assignments. That’s about all they can do, as I understand it. It’s extremely difficult to kick out an elected official.

Kimera757

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I appreciate me being a Brit may both preclude me from fully appreciating the situation in terms of how your elections etc work...and also, well we certainly have our own issues here that raise eyebrows (anyone for Brexit? 😡).........but.....

In Canada, the system seems stronger than in the US but weaker than in the UK. In Canada, a party leader can drive someone out of their party, but they still sit as an MP, since they were elected, and so can't be fired from that position.

In the US, a Rep/Senator's boss are the primary voters. Primaries are somewhat open "nomination meetings" that determine who will run for a party in a particular district, and the party bosses have little to no control over there. Primary voters are a very small subset of the population, and are usually highly motivated by only one or two topics (called "single issue voters"). So a primary voter might vote for whichever Democrat running for District A is anti-gun control. (Most Democrats are pro-gun control, but in conservative areas they tend not to be.) Enough vote and that Democrat wins. Meanwhile the local Republican who won the election is also against gun control. So it doesn't matter which Rep you vote for, you get someone opposed to gun control. Single issue voters won't care if the primary candidate is a criminal, because that's less important to them than their (stated) views on religion, gun control, welfare, immigration, etc... whatever the single issue is.

More recently, Democrats and Republicans have effectively become a "tribe". So "every" Democrat has certain views, and "every" Republican has certain views, even though some of the "mandatory" views on both sides are stupid. Primary voters want the whole package; even if a voters believes that particular view is stupid, they see the view as a tribal marker. If a primary candidate goes against these mandatory views, the primary voters vote against them, picking a candidate sticking to those views.

Just Joe

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The latest is that Congressman  Duncan Hunter is blaming his wife! His wife Margret now has her own legal team! Can you imagine being married to this man?

https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/24/politics/duncan-hunter-margaret-hunter/index.html

So his political career is more important to him than his marriage. Great guy!

talltexan

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I shared many of the details with Mrs. TallTexan. Her positions:

  • She knew she was right all along about having a $1,000 cushion in our checking account
  • You shouldn't do this to your wife unless you're expecting a divorce
  • Hunter apparently went through a lot of effort to grant Mrs. Hunter a purchasing card/authority in the campaign to begin with
  • I'm now in charge of all family financial stuff so that she's not criminally liable. Uh, Yay?

simonsez

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I mean, when you've been quoted as saying

"Nobody really knows the cause ... It could be caused by carbon dioxide or methane. Maybe we should kill the cows to stop the methane, or stop breathing to stop the CO2 ... Thousands of people die every year of cold, so if we had global warming it would save lives ... We ought to look out for people. The earth can take care of itself."

maybe you believe if you run out of money you can always just go get that pot of gold at the end of a rainbow.  Man, what a clown.

FireHiker

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This article says his salary was $174K, plus perks.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/08/indicted-pol-blames-wife-complains-about-usd174-000-salary.html

Rep. Duncan Hunter, R-Calif., who has pleaded not guilty to charges of misusing campaign money to pay for personal items, said Thursday his $174,000 annual salary does not provide him with enough money to live in his Southern California congressional district.

“I mean, $174,000 per year is what a member of Congress makes. Do you think they should make more than that, is it not enough to live on?” Fox News host Martha MacCallum asked Hunter in his first TV interview since charges were filed Tuesday.

“It depends where you live. It’s difficult to live in a place like San Francisco or San Diego or New York or D.C.,” said Hunter, whose district includes part of San Diego. “It’s probably easier to live in Kansas or Missouri, so it’s all relative.”

I am relatively local to his district (not my district but one very close by; I know MANY people in his district, all of whom are horrified and won't be voting for him...but sadly he'll probably still get re-elected). If he can't live on a salary of 174k a year then he absolutely deserves to be mocked in this part of the board. I guarantee 174k is much higher of an individual salary than most of his constituents, so if he's saying it isn't enough to live on in his area, is he advocating for higher salaries or anything in his district? I doubt it. It's just not enough for him to live in his spendypants world...And I am so over corrupt politicians, regardless of their side of the fence.

maizeman

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Okay, just to play devil's advocate: as a congressperson you generally end up having to support two residences, one in your district, one in Washington DC (which is extraordinarily expensive). This is why you see a number of representatives who are sleeping in their offices rather than trying to pay high rental rates in DC in addition to in their home districts.* If it were up to me I'd just have a taxpayer funded barracks somewhere close to the capital building to eliminate this partial excuse for where part of the relatively general congressional salary goes.

Anyway, even with that taken into account, you clearly CAN support yourself on $175,000/year, so I'm not trying to defend Hunter in form. Carry on.

*And then see other congressional representatives trying to sue to keep people from sleeping in their offices.

robartsd

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A seat in the House of Representatives can only be filled by an elected representative - so the seat would be vacant until an election is held. If there is enough time left in the term (usually a full year, but specific rules for calling the special election vary from state to state), a special election would be held; otherwise, the seat would be left vacant until the next congress is sworn into office.
When Jesse Jackson Jr. was elected while staying in a mental hospital (I wish I was kidding), a primary and then a general election was held within the span of about 5 months.
I didn't mean imply that the election process might take a year, just that different states have different thresholds for how much of the current term would need to be left after completing a special election in order to decided to go through with the special election. The information I've seen indicates all states consider a full year of the term left to be worth running the special election (I haven't been able to find the specifics for California).

There is no plan for a special election before the planned general election. California doesn't allow for write-in candidates. The only other contender is Mr. Campa-Najjar, who worked as a campaign person for President Obama but otherwise has minimal political experience. Barring him being indicted for a felony also, he'll be the next representative from that district. A good question is who the Republicans will put up to run against him in 2020, as that person will likely be the next long-term representative of that district (Hunter and his father were representatives for over a quarter century).
Of course there won't be a special election before the general election. Even if Hunter is removed from office before the general election, there's always the theoretic possibility that the Democrat candidate would win negating any need for a special election. Only after Hunter is removed from office and the upcoming general election is complete will the process of calling the special election begin.

wonkette

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Okay, just to play devil's advocate: as a congressperson you generally end up having to support two residences, one in your district, one in Washington DC (which is extraordinarily expensive). This is why you see a number of representatives who are sleeping in their offices rather than trying to pay high rental rates in DC in addition to in their home districts.* If it were up to me I'd just have a taxpayer funded barracks somewhere close to the capital building to eliminate this partial excuse for where part of the relatively general congressional salary goes.

Anyway, even with that taken into account, you clearly CAN support yourself on $175,000/year, so I'm not trying to defend Hunter in form. Carry on.

*And then see other congressional representatives trying to sue to keep people from sleeping in their offices.

Cost of living here is high. That's why some Democrats piled into a row house to save money. There's some great stories about it, I especially enjoy the sign "When last person leaves house set AC to 80 degrees, utilities go up, rent goes up" The real party of fiscal responsibility? https://www.cnn.com/2013/12/04/politics/real-alpha-house/index.html

Not There Yet

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Just wondering if Hunter is an Evangelical.  I've noticed many Evangelicals believe the "Prosperity Gospel", which preaches earthly riches are a sign of God's favor.  I've also noticed that these believers tend to engage in conspicuous consumption and frequently live beyond their means.  An example - I was behind a woman in traffic yesterday who was driving a very expensive sedan.  Her "In God We Trust" vanity plates read "BLEYST".  I guess she didn't want anyone to have any doubts that God likes her best.

gaja

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Okay, just to play devil's advocate: as a congressperson you generally end up having to support two residences, one in your district, one in Washington DC (which is extraordinarily expensive). This is why you see a number of representatives who are sleeping in their offices rather than trying to pay high rental rates in DC in addition to in their home districts.* If it were up to me I'd just have a taxpayer funded barracks somewhere close to the capital building to eliminate this partial excuse for where part of the relatively general congressional salary goes.

Anyway, even with that taken into account, you clearly CAN support yourself on $175,000/year, so I'm not trying to defend Hunter in form. Carry on.

*And then see other congressional representatives trying to sue to keep people from sleeping in their offices.

Cost of living here is high. That's why some Democrats piled into a row house to save money. There's some great stories about it, I especially enjoy the sign "When last person leaves house set AC to 80 degrees, utilities go up, rent goes up" The real party of fiscal responsibility? https://www.cnn.com/2013/12/04/politics/real-alpha-house/index.html

That article was incredible - thank you for sharing!

Abe

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There are decent houses to be had for ~$500k in Hunter's home town (Alpine, CA). Not a mansion, but nothing in the Constitution guarantees representatives that. The cost of living in his home town is not equivalent to downtown San Diego, etc.

EricL

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Just wondering if Hunter is an Evangelical.  I've noticed many Evangelicals believe the "Prosperity Gospel", which preaches earthly riches are a sign of God's favor.  I've also noticed that these believers tend to engage in conspicuous consumption and frequently live beyond their means.  An example - I was behind a woman in traffic yesterday who was driving a very expensive sedan.  Her "In God We Trust" vanity plates read "BLEYST".  I guess she didn't want anyone to have any doubts that God likes her best.

So no reference to having His one and only begotten son living in poverty and nailed to a cross?

MgoSam

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Okay, just to play devil's advocate: as a congressperson you generally end up having to support two residences, one in your district, one in Washington DC (which is extraordinarily expensive). This is why you see a number of representatives who are sleeping in their offices rather than trying to pay high rental rates in DC in addition to in their home districts.* If it were up to me I'd just have a taxpayer funded barracks somewhere close to the capital building to eliminate this partial excuse for where part of the relatively general congressional salary goes.

Anyway, even with that taken into account, you clearly CAN support yourself on $175,000/year, so I'm not trying to defend Hunter in form. Carry on.

*And then see other congressional representatives trying to sue to keep people from sleeping in their offices.

Cost of living here is high. That's why some Democrats piled into a row house to save money. There's some great stories about it, I especially enjoy the sign "When last person leaves house set AC to 80 degrees, utilities go up, rent goes up" The real party of fiscal responsibility? https://www.cnn.com/2013/12/04/politics/real-alpha-house/index.html

That article was incredible - thank you for sharing!

Great article! I enjoyed the show Alpha House though it could have been far far better with some better writers and more of a direction.