Relatives who just don't get it

[BlueHouse]

I was ignored when I told people no visitors for the first month. Laughed at actually. Imagine waiting a whole month to see a baby! Ugh.

I consider it a win that DHs parents didn't come at the same time as my parents (they waited until week 3 to not overlap and were pissed about it), and that my parents were not at the hospital when I was in labor (they were with my sister.) Nor staring at me for a week before I went into labor.

My Mom wanted to be here 2 weeks before my due date "just in case" and I put a hell no on that. They came 2 days before, so 1 before I gave birth.

iowajes, first off, congrats on the baby and on surviving the family intrusions!  You are so much kinder and more polite than I would be. 

When my family has descended on me, I've done things like go to my bedroom and take a nap and then come out only when I felt like it.  Sit around and do nothing until someone else was very hungry.  People don't usually have the nerve to say something like "what are you making for me".  So I've even gone so far as to say "Ugh, I don't have much in the fridge...I suppose we could have PB&J or eggs".  But I'm pretty rude and self-centered so my family is used to bizarre behavior from me. 

Honestly, from what you've described, it sounds as if you're the perfect family to visit -- even when you've just had a baby -- because you go out of your way for your guests.  Those are the makings of great moms too!  :)    Best to you and your family!

[I'm a red panda]

Except.my friends have been bringing diapers and holding the baby for an hour so I can nap, since my husband cooks.

But none of our family is local, so they are coming for extended stays. And seem to think "helping" means something different than what I do.

That is hopeless, having to take care of visitors in additional to having a baby. Could you not sit down with them and have a talk. Tell them that you really appreciate them coming, but that it is a burden to be a host. As if they want to lift your burden by taking over some of your household chores, like grocery shopping, cooking, cleaning etc. Tell them that you are stressed out of your mind and really need some help.

Usually the easiest is to just say no. If you tell them ahead of the birth that you won't have any visitors until 6-12 weeks after the baby is born, it is much easier to loosen the rules afterwards. If they expect to almost take part in the birth, they will be disappointed if you ask them to wait one week before visiting. If they know from the start you want peace and quiet, they will be positively surprised if they get to see the baby already after two weeks.

With a newborn, usually the best help is to stay away (or bring food and leave).

Wow! All this seems a little harsh, not seeing a new grandchild for a couple of weeks?

Ok, you don't want to visit too long or inappropriately, but it seems a little cruel and unusual (maybe not so unusual!) to exclude the grandparents (who probably love the child the most next to the parents) and treat them with such disdain.

Knowing how much you love your children, how do you think you'd feel treated like this when your time came to be grandparents?

I think it would have been a lot easier if they were local and could have stopped by for a few hours, or even semi local and could have stopped by For a day. But when they live 20 hours away and therefore stop by for a week it becomes very difficult.

I was so stressed I went to the emergency room from my daughter's first pediatrician appointment because I was having chest pains and the pediatrician made me promise I would go. as expected those chest pains were entirely from Stress and Anxiety. Babies don't do much the first week anyway waiting until they're a little older they are a lot more fun

[marielle]

I'm glad I don't want kids...it seems like parents get especially crazy when you have your own kids, as if they're trying to "relive" their child raising days. The future parents in law are already crazy enough about us spending more time with them because they think we don't do anything but sit around on the weekends (I guess we're not old enough to have "adult" responsibilities in their mind). Is this normal? I mean, how must time should a couple in their 20s spend with their parents?

Same with weddings, everything has to be just right for THEM. No thanks, it's not your day and not your life, I'd rather spend that money on my future instead of a wedding. Thankfully this topic hasn't come up yet despite it being over 4 years now, but I'm sure it'll be a fun argument one day.

[Vindicated]

Is this normal? I mean, how must time should a couple in their 20s spend with their parents?

I see my parents quite a bit, but they live close, and always want to see my Son.  So, we're happy to have the willing baby sitters close by.  They take him either overnight, or for a few hours, just about every weekend.  He loves it.  They love it.  We love it.  Win-win-win!

[marielle]

Is this normal? I mean, how must time should a couple in their 20s spend with their parents?

I see my parents quite a bit, but they live close, and always want to see my Son.  So, we're happy to have the willing baby sitters close by.  They take him either overnight, or for a few hours, just about every weekend.  He loves it.  They love it.  We love it.  Win-win-win!

Yeah, I could definitely see that if you have kids. But a mid 20s couple without kids and their own lives, who both work full time? Every weekend definitely won't happen. We already feel like we don't have enough time to do everything we want or need to do without going to visit family. Their ideal frequency is somewhere between every weekend and once a month, not sure. Their judgmental attitude towards our lifestyle choices (mentioned some of this on the previous page) certainly doesn't make me want to do it!

[Cookie78]

Is this normal? I mean, how must time should a couple in their 20s spend with their parents?

I see my parents quite a bit, but they live close, and always want to see my Son.  So, we're happy to have the willing baby sitters close by.  They take him either overnight, or for a few hours, just about every weekend.  He loves it.  They love it.  We love it.  Win-win-win!

Yeah, I could definitely see that if you have kids. But a mid 20s couple without kids and their own lives, who both work full time? Every weekend definitely won't happen. We already feel like we don't have enough time to do everything we want or need to do without going to visit family. Their ideal frequency is somewhere between every weekend and once a month, not sure. Their judgmental attitude towards our lifestyle choices (mentioned some of this on the previous page) certainly doesn't make me want to do it!

Geez, in my mid-20's my parents would be lucky to get a phone call once a month, and that's with a great relationship and no lifestyle judgements! But it's hard to compare, since I didn't live very close. I'm glad they didn't mind the lack of communication and visiting. I remember being stunned to hear that my cousin's mom would freak out if she didn't get a phone call from my cousin each day.

Now, late-30's, I'm rearranging my life and FIRE'ing perhaps TOO early so that I can spend more time with them. They might actually start to get sick of me being around so much (probably not).

[I'm a red panda]

Same with weddings, everything has to be just right for THEM. No thanks, it's not your day and not your life, I'd rather spend that money on my future instead of a wedding. Thankfully this topic hasn't come up yet despite it being over 4 years now, but I'm sure it'll be a fun argument one day.

My wedding would have been incredible fodder for this thread. I didn't care much about it, just wanted to get married. My Mom cared a lot, so after I realized everything I wanted was being vetoed, I just let her plan it and I showed up.

When she got the quote back from the flowers it was "too low" and she ordered twice as many!
I think I've mentioned my dress on this board- I went to David's bridal in hopes of saving some money on a boutique (which I did). But I picked one of the most expensive dresses in the store...  I also found a $99 sale dress that was "totally fine". My parents flipped at the idea of "totally fine" and insisted I get the "perfect" (which it was) dress that had a comma in its price.  They also paid $400 for veils I could have made for $15.
And my cake cost more than my dress.
I could go on...

[marielle]

Same with weddings, everything has to be just right for THEM. No thanks, it's not your day and not your life, I'd rather spend that money on my future instead of a wedding. Thankfully this topic hasn't come up yet despite it being over 4 years now, but I'm sure it'll be a fun argument one day.

My wedding would have been incredible fodder for this thread. I didn't care much about it, just wanted to get married. My Mom cared a lot, so after I realized everything I wanted was being vetoed, I just let her plan it and I showed up.

Yikes, I would never agree to this. I already know they want their son to have a Catholic wedding, but neither of us are religious so that is definitely NOT happening. Plus they would invite way too many people that I don't know, and that would be way too stressful. It would me like 100+ people from that side of the family and then...my mom on my side. Yeah no thanks. Just being a guest at a wedding on that side of the family is stressful enough.

I think my boyfriend's parents seem similar to yours. It's not about what something looks like or the quality, it's about the price. There is an expected price to pay for something and if it's too low it's junk. For example, they bought a car with about the same number of miles as my boyfriend did except theirs was MUCH more expensive and a nice "luxury" vehicle. They consider his car a beater because it was "cheap" and not because of expected longevity or condition.

[I'm a red panda]

I think my parents had as many friends at my wedding as I did. It's okay, they gave great gifts :)

I actually like my parents a lot, but we have different financial values.  That said, they are in no way irresponsible with money, they have plenty.
They don't give me a hard time about driving an Hyundai instead of a Lexus, or about not having cable; but they think I'm weird for it.

[Gray Matter]

...But we wanted our son and DIL to have a chance to settle in as their own little family first, and arrive when some help would be appreciated.  I knew from experience that at the one month stage, extra hands would be welcome.  It isn't OUR baby, it's their baby, and we will always try to do what's best for them first.  By doing so, we get a better relationship too. 

Shinplaster - I just want to commend you for this attitude.  I think supportive, helpful parents are often welcome, but so many are not like this.  My MIL called shortly after my first child was born and asked me, "And how is MY baby?"  I was like, "Um...he's at work.  Oh, did you mean MY baby?  He's napping right now."  I can't stand it when grandparents act like it's their child--nope, you had yours and you either have a good relationship with them or you don't, and chances are you had a lot of influence on whether you do or don't.

[HappierAtHome]

Shinplaster, you're awesome.

[mustachepungoeshere]

My MIL called shortly after my first child was born and asked me, "And how is MY baby?"  I was like, "Um...he's at work.  Oh, did you mean MY baby?  He's napping right now."

This is fantastic.

[firelight]

So true. My mom is super helpful with baby and so she will come and stay with us for two months to help with delivery and baby. My dad is good too but has a lot of rules for baby, so he visits when mom is there to manage him and never for a long time.

My in-laws, on the other hand, though they are good people, they expect a lot of hosting to be done. So they'll visit for short times (or we'll visit them) once we are settled down and ready to do the hosting.

[Shinplaster]

...But we wanted our son and DIL to have a chance to settle in as their own little family first, and arrive when some help would be appreciated.  I knew from experience that at the one month stage, extra hands would be welcome.  It isn't OUR baby, it's their baby, and we will always try to do what's best for them first.  By doing so, we get a better relationship too. 

Shinplaster - I just want to commend you for this attitude.  I think supportive, helpful parents are often welcome, but so many are not like this.  My MIL called shortly after my first child was born and asked me, "And how is MY baby?"  I was like, "Um...he's at work.  Oh, did you mean MY baby?  He's napping right now."  I can't stand it when grandparents act like it's their child--nope, you had yours and you either have a good relationship with them or you don't, and chances are you had a lot of influence on whether you do or don't.

Ha- that made me laugh out loud.

Shinplaster, you're awesome.

   
Oh, I'm not perfect - I'm sure there have been a few rolled eyes along the way.  I look at what my MIL does, and then don't do that.  : )    It helps that I like as well as love the man my son has become, and love the woman he chose to marry.  My parents set a great example - DH always says they are the best in-laws ever.  I have examples of both roads, and choose to take the one that makes us all happy.

[wenchsenior]

Wow, the portion of the thread dealing with grandparents reacting to babies (or dealing with visitors when you have new babies in general) is like reading about an alien ritual.  Very interesting, since I have had virtually no contact with babies or even anyone having any since I was ....maybe 10 or 11? (can't remember).  I always thought the taking care of the baby part would be exhausting, but I never even considered the added element of the family/social stuff! 

[marielle]

Just saw this article pop up and laughed immediately...

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/04/27/most-wish-theyd-listened-to-mom-and-dad-about-money.html

Basically, millennials wish they listened to their parents and saved more money.

If we listened to my boyfriend's parents we would save LESS and be working until our 50s at the minimum. His dad says that we should not "go backwards"...whatever that means. Because we're engineers we're supposed to live and act a certain way, drive certain cars, etc and not live like we're poor or eat "peasant" food like rice. I'm starting to think it's a social status thing and they're embarrassed by us around their rich friends and other family members.

On another note, his sister just bought a brand new Rav4 because she "wants to ride higher" and used to hit the curb leaving work with her Camry. Also, she needs reliability despite having the option of working from home (and she barely drives as it is). Also, reliability is important because she's a girl. What!? She said she would never buy a car private party, I immediately said I would never buy from a dealership!
She's going to have negative net worth well into her 30s now with the car and student loans. Did I mention it snows maybe once a year here?

[ysette9]

Basically, millennials wish they listened to their parents and saved more money.

I guess it is hard to speak in generalities, but aren't the parents of Millennials the Boomers, who have a reputation for not having saved enough for retirement?

In my own family, my sister and I (old Millennials) oddly both ended up more frugal than our parents. Looking back on it, we got some good financial education from our mother, but I actually think I would be richer today if I hadn't gone along with some of the things she had advocated in the past.

[solon]

Millennials are no different than anybody else. ALL generations, since the beginning of time, wish they listened to their parents about some things.

[Vindicated]

Millennials are no different than anybody else. ALL generations, since the beginning of time, wish they listened to their parents about some things.

That reminds me of one of my favorite VSauce videos.

Juvenoia

Video: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwi737rl_cfTAhWI3YMKHaUaAqkQyCkIKTAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DLD0x7ho_IYc&usg=AFQjCNEm8SWy7_RBR4OCeDWaB7APDibndQ&sig2=xRZTU6h3IPFeqAVapZsZ-g

Transcript: https://sites.google.com/site/vsaucetranscripts/scripts/juvenoia

[Taran Wanderer]

I read all these parent stories and am thankful for my parents and my in-laws. We live next door to one and a mile from the other. We drop in on them, they drop in on us. We cook then dinner, they cook us dinner. They watch our kids and dog, we watch their dog. We share the cat.

When our kids were born, they were there for us. After ours kids were born, they were there to support us. As they get older, we will be there to support them. They offer us advice when we ask, and occasionally, but rarely, when we don't. And usually the unsolicited advice is sound and well timed.

I truly don't know what we would do without them.

[shelivesthedream]

Basically, millennials wish they listened to their parents and saved more money.

I guess it is hard to speak in generalities, but aren't the parents of Millennials the Boomers, who have a reputation for not having saved enough for retirement?

In my own family, my sister and I (old Millennials) oddly both ended up more frugal than our parents. Looking back on it, we got some good financial education from our mother, but I actually think I would be richer today if I hadn't gone along with some of the things she had advocated in the past.

Do as I say, not as I do. Everyone's a personal finance expert IN THEORY, just like every football fan is a genius football coach IN THEORY.

[kayvent]

Basically, millennials wish they listened to their parents and saved more money.

I guess it is hard to speak in generalities, but aren't the parents of Millennials the Boomers, who have a reputation for not having saved enough for retirement?

In my own family, my sister and I (old Millennials) oddly both ended up more frugal than our parents. Looking back on it, we got some good financial education from our mother, but I actually think I would be richer today if I hadn't gone along with some of the things she had advocated in the past.

If a person who smokes tells me to not take up smoking because it is highly addictive, costs a fortune, and has severe medical downsides, I listen to them. That is not them being a hypocrite. That is them saying with firsthand experience the effects of what they are advocating against.

Millennials are people boom between 1980 to 2000. Baby Boomers 1943-1960, Gen X between 1960 to the 1980. Being born in 91, someone born in 1943 is a grandparent to me.

[Fomerly known as something]

My co-worker's retired parents just traded up their perfectly nice 2013 vehicle for another 2013 vehicle, except this one is "fully loaded".    Co-worker:   "Well, it's spring.    Gotta buy SOMETHING."

Huh, and here I thought Christmas was the time of year you were supposed to spend money!

Last week a coworker asked me if I had started my Easter shopping yet. My response: I don't understand the question.

Last year, maybe the year prior, my daughter asked me how much she was getting for Easter.....I looked at her dumbfounded and explained that Easter is not a present giving holiday. Easter is the only holiday I observe. Apparently it is quite common for people to go shopping and buy presents and toys on top of the chocolate.

I am so fed up of "present-giving" holidays. But it is so hard to get out of them completely. Obviously in December it was Christmas, then my mother's birthday is in February, and now it's Mother's Day on Sunday. WTF am I supposed to get her that she could possibly want that she doesn't already have? Rinse and repeat for the next thirty years. That's ninety shitty future presents I have to buy. But my mother will care if I don't get her anything and she will remember and be hurt if I buy her the same thing every year. I try to buy consumables so they won't add to the drifts of crap in the house already, but at some point about five years ago I ran out of ideas and of fuck-giving-ness. I have giving presents, I hate getting presents, I hate the whole idea of presents. It's not a present if it's for a "present-giving holiday", it's just a piece of obligatory crap. It's not thoughtful, no matter what it is. You bought it because you have to buy something because that time of the calendar has rolled around again. The exchange of material goods at set times is a fucking ridiculous thing to do in this day and age, and it drives me ballistic that it's accelerating. Valentines day chocolates for teachers, wedding registries for people who already have two adult households to merge, "Here, have a present every year because you gave birth to me one time". And especially the idea of "Here, have some piece of crap that you don't want (because if you did you'd have bought it yourself) but you'll have to keep forever because for some reason getting rid of it will symbolise getting rid of our relationship, much as me going out and spending twenty quid on this thing and a piece of folded card to go with it symbolises the fact that I care about you - but just saying that would apparently not be caring enough so I have to divest myself of money to burden you with this piece of crap too".

/rant

I am so thankful that my Mom thinks me shipping her fancy chocolate is awesome.

[nnls]

Basically, millennials wish they listened to their parents and saved more money.

I guess it is hard to speak in generalities, but aren't the parents of Millennials the Boomers, who have a reputation for not having saved enough for retirement?

In my own family, my sister and I (old Millennials) oddly both ended up more frugal than our parents. Looking back on it, we got some good financial education from our mother, but I actually think I would be richer today if I hadn't gone along with some of the things she had advocated in the past.

If a person who smokes tells me to not take up smoking because it is highly addictive, costs a fortune, and has severe medical downsides, I listen to them. That is not them being a hypocrite. That is them saying with firsthand experience the effects of what they are advocating against.

Millennials are people boom between 1980 to 2000. Baby Boomers 1943-1960, Gen X between 1960 to the 1980. Being born in 91, someone born in 1943 is a grandparent to me.

yes but someone born in 1959 could be your parent. I am a millenial (born 1987) and both my parents are Baby Boomers, which would be the case for quite a few of us

What are the age group after millennials called? the 2000-now

[Kitsune]

I read all these parent stories and am thankful for my parents and my in-laws. We live next door to one and a mile from the other. We drop in on them, they drop in on us. We cook then dinner, they cook us dinner. They watch our kids and dog, we watch their dog. We share the cat.

When our kids were born, they were there for us. After ours kids were born, they were there to support us. As they get older, we will be there to support them. They offer us advice when we ask, and occasionally, but rarely, when we don't. And usually the unsolicited advice is sound and well timed.

I truly don't know what we would do without them.

Let's put it this way:
- we live next door to our in-laws. They call before coming over, are super helpful but not pushy, give (good!) advice but only when asked, don't comment on what we chose to do with our house and yard, and they help when we need (with the kids...) and we help when they need (aging takes a physical Toll). Like: they have a key to our house, and have used it once in 2 years, because a package got left on the porch and would be getting rained on so they tucked it inside and locked the place back up.
- my parents are lovely but require firm boundary re-setting on a regular basis. I love them, they adore our kids, we're super close, but seeing my mother more than once a week leads to Clashes during the second visit (she treats me like I'm 15 and tells me how to manage my life... or even better, tried to tell me how to parent, but she has an anxiety disorder so her advice is more like "if you're not worried about *x improbable thing* you're not parenting right)... yeah, we live 45 minutes away, and she doesn't have a key. And we see her every week or two but definitely never more than that.
- my best friend has a mother who consistently criticizes everything about her life, appearance, and profession, and then expects her to drop everything when she needs help. She now lives across the Atlantic, and apparently a phone call every 2 months is the right amount of contact for the best relationship they've ever managed.

In short: you can have a close relationship... but not with everyone. Some people need a bit of distance to be able to be close.

[LeRainDrop]

What are the age group after millennials called? the 2000-now

Generation Z

[TheGrimSqueaker]

I read all these parent stories and am thankful for my parents and my in-laws. We live next door to one and a mile from the other. We drop in on them, they drop in on us. We cook then dinner, they cook us dinner. They watch our kids and dog, we watch their dog. We share the cat.

When our kids were born, they were there for us. After ours kids were born, they were there to support us. As they get older, we will be there to support them. They offer us advice when we ask, and occasionally, but rarely, when we don't. And usually the unsolicited advice is sound and well timed.

I truly don't know what we would do without them.

What you will end up doing is paying it forward by having just such a relationship with your own children, when it's time. After having spent a lifetime modeling what a healthy, respectful extended-family relationship will look like, you will have given your children the equivalent of a family owner's/operator's manual. You've got a lot to live up to.

Filling in for the previous generation actually feels right, appropriate, and OK when it's at the normal time. A person feels, well, more ready to accept the more senior role. I suppose that, as humans, we grow into it.

[Just Joe]

Let's put it this way:
- we live next door to our in-laws. They call before coming over, are super helpful but not pushy, give (good!) advice but only when asked, don't comment on what we chose to do with our house and yard, and they help when we need (with the kids...) and we help when they need (aging takes a physical Toll). Like: they have a key to our house, and have used it once in 2 years, because a package got left on the porch and would be getting rained on so they tucked it inside and locked the place back up.
- my parents are lovely but require firm boundary re-setting on a regular basis. I love them, they adore our kids, we're super close, but seeing my mother more than once a week leads to Clashes during the second visit (she treats me like I'm 15 and tells me how to manage my life... or even better, tried to tell me how to parent, but she has an anxiety disorder so her advice is more like "if you're not worried about *x improbable thing* you're not parenting right)... yeah, we live 45 minutes away, and she doesn't have a key. And we see her every week or two but definitely never more than that.
- my best friend has a mother who consistently criticizes everything about her life, appearance, and profession, and then expects her to drop everything when she needs help. She now lives across the Atlantic, and apparently a phone call every 2 months is the right amount of contact for the best relationship they've ever managed.

In short: you can have a close relationship... but not with everyone. Some people need a bit of distance to be able to be close.

THAT! I agree. A little distance helps us alot.

I think my boyfriend's parents seem similar to yours. It's not about what something looks like or the quality, it's about the price. There is an expected price to pay for something and if it's too low it's junk. For example, they bought a car with about the same number of miles as my boyfriend did except theirs was MUCH more expensive and a nice "luxury" vehicle. They consider his car a beater because it was "cheap" and not because of expected longevity or condition.

I've encountered this too. Then your "beater" turns out to be far less trouble than the luxury marque and lasts twenty easy years... Yay for the basic wheels!

[UnleashHell]

What are the age group after millennials called? the 2000-now

Generation Z

More like Generation Why?

Why do I have to......etc etc

[Pooperman]

What are the age group after millennials called? the 2000-now

Generation Z

More like Generation Why?

Why do I have to......etc etc

Yeah, 'cause a lot of 'em are still 2 years old :D.

[TomTX]

It's such a shame that people don't respect boundaries. WE never had any problems with my parents or the in-laws. If I had family like some of you guys I would not even tell them I was pregnant until a month after the baby was born:))   Of course this only works if you live in different towns.

Seriously already thinking about how long we can keep the news from my mother if we ever have children - of both birth and pregnancy. Mainly because we have a precarious entente which is largely built upon never saying anything other than small talk, and I can see how we'd get into deeper conversation pretty quickly about children. She'd ask about the birth plan, I'd obfuscate but eventually have to tell her, she'd make some passive-aggressive but deniable veiled criticism, I have to decide whether to play nice to keep the peace or enforce boundaries and start an argument and be accused of criticising HER... Oh man. (And iowajes, I sympathise with struggling to enforce boundaries - no one wants to pour petrol onto embers if the embers will just keep glowing quietly by themselves, but you still get burned by embers.) If I could keep the entire pregnancy and existence of the child secret from her forever, I would.

Just as a datapoint, we're closing in on 4 years of keeping the news from my MIL.  We do live a long way away, and communication is intentionally limited.

And I'm not going to get into all of her crazy, nasty stuff over the years. That would be for my wife to tell.

[TomTX]

Except.my friends have been bringing diapers and holding the baby for an hour so I can nap, since my husband cooks.

But none of our family is local, so they are coming for extended stays. And seem to think "helping" means something different than what I do.

That is hopeless, having to take care of visitors in additional to having a baby. Could you not sit down with them and have a talk. Tell them that you really appreciate them coming, but that it is a burden to be a host. As if they want to lift your burden by taking over some of your household chores, like grocery shopping, cooking, cleaning etc. Tell them that you are stressed out of your mind and really need some help.

Usually the easiest is to just say no. If you tell them ahead of the birth that you won't have any visitors until 6-12 weeks after the baby is born, it is much easier to loosen the rules afterwards. If they expect to almost take part in the birth, they will be disappointed if you ask them to wait one week before visiting. If they know from the start you want peace and quiet, they will be positively surprised if they get to see the baby already after two weeks.

With a newborn, usually the best help is to stay away (or bring food and leave).

Wow! All this seems a little harsh, not seeing a new grandchild for a couple of weeks?

Ok, you don't want to visit too long or inappropriately, but it seems a little cruel and unusual (maybe not so unusual!) to exclude the grandparents (who probably love the child the most next to the parents) and treat them with such disdain.

Knowing how much you love your children, how do you think you'd feel treated like this when your time came to be grandparents?

You sound awfully entitled. New parents get to set the boundaries. Deal with it.

[Taran Wanderer]

I read all these parent stories and am thankful for my parents and my in-laws. We live next door to one and a mile from the other. We drop in on them, they drop in on us. We cook then dinner, they cook us dinner. They watch our kids and dog, we watch their dog. We share the cat.

When our kids were born, they were there for us. After ours kids were born, they were there to support us. As they get older, we will be there to support them. They offer us advice when we ask, and occasionally, but rarely, when we don't. And usually the unsolicited advice is sound and well timed.

I truly don't know what we would do without them.

Let's put it this way:
- we live next door to our in-laws. They call before coming over, are super helpful but not pushy, give (good!) advice but only when asked, don't comment on what we chose to do with our house and yard, and they help when we need (with the kids...) and we help when they need (aging takes a physical Toll). Like: they have a key to our house, and have used it once in 2 years, because a package got left on the porch and would be getting rained on so they tucked it inside and locked the place back up.
- my parents are lovely but require firm boundary re-setting on a regular basis. I love them, they adore our kids, we're super close, but seeing my mother more than once a week leads to Clashes during the second visit (she treats me like I'm 15 and tells me how to manage my life... or even better, tried to tell me how to parent, but she has an anxiety disorder so her advice is more like "if you're not worried about *x improbable thing* you're not parenting right)... yeah, we live 45 minutes away, and she doesn't have a key. And we see her every week or two but definitely never more than that.
- my best friend has a mother who consistently criticizes everything about her life, appearance, and profession, and then expects her to drop everything when she needs help. She now lives across the Atlantic, and apparently a phone call every 2 months is the right amount of contact for the best relationship they've ever managed.

In short: you can have a close relationship... but not with everyone. Some people need a bit of distance to be able to be close.

There is a little more to the story. My father and his very opinionated wife live half the country away from us. That works fine and dandy. I can completely understand those that have difficulties. I'm just thankful that the worst we get from our nearby relations is a tree trimmer ad taped to our cabinets after the hints about our trees blocking FIL's view haven't generated action.

[TheGrimSqueaker]

It's such a shame that people don't respect boundaries. WE never had any problems with my parents or the in-laws. If I had family like some of you guys I would not even tell them I was pregnant until a month after the baby was born:))   Of course this only works if you live in different towns.

Seriously already thinking about how long we can keep the news from my mother if we ever have children - of both birth and pregnancy. Mainly because we have a precarious entente which is largely built upon never saying anything other than small talk, and I can see how we'd get into deeper conversation pretty quickly about children. She'd ask about the birth plan, I'd obfuscate but eventually have to tell her, she'd make some passive-aggressive but deniable veiled criticism, I have to decide whether to play nice to keep the peace or enforce boundaries and start an argument and be accused of criticising HER... Oh man. (And iowajes, I sympathise with struggling to enforce boundaries - no one wants to pour petrol onto embers if the embers will just keep glowing quietly by themselves, but you still get burned by embers.) If I could keep the entire pregnancy and existence of the child secret from her forever, I would.

Just as a datapoint, we're closing in on 4 years of keeping the news from my MIL.  We do live a long way away, and communication is intentionally limited.

And I'm not going to get into all of her crazy, nasty stuff over the years. That would be for my wife to tell.

You successfully kept a 3-year-old hidden from the in-laws? The logistics alone sound like a good story. (/fetches popcorn)

[cloudsail]

Except.my friends have been bringing diapers and holding the baby for an hour so I can nap, since my husband cooks.

But none of our family is local, so they are coming for extended stays. And seem to think "helping" means something different than what I do.

That is hopeless, having to take care of visitors in additional to having a baby. Could you not sit down with them and have a talk. Tell them that you really appreciate them coming, but that it is a burden to be a host. As if they want to lift your burden by taking over some of your household chores, like grocery shopping, cooking, cleaning etc. Tell them that you are stressed out of your mind and really need some help.

Usually the easiest is to just say no. If you tell them ahead of the birth that you won't have any visitors until 6-12 weeks after the baby is born, it is much easier to loosen the rules afterwards. If they expect to almost take part in the birth, they will be disappointed if you ask them to wait one week before visiting. If they know from the start you want peace and quiet, they will be positively surprised if they get to see the baby already after two weeks.

With a newborn, usually the best help is to stay away (or bring food and leave).

Wow! All this seems a little harsh, not seeing a new grandchild for a couple of weeks?

Ok, you don't want to visit too long or inappropriately, but it seems a little cruel and unusual (maybe not so unusual!) to exclude the grandparents (who probably love the child the most next to the parents) and treat them with such disdain.

Knowing how much you love your children, how do you think you'd feel treated like this when your time came to be grandparents?

You sound awfully entitled. New parents get to set the boundaries. Deal with it.

Most Asian grandparents seem to have this kind of attitude. My in-laws were staying with us when I was due with my first, and when I went into labor they followed us to the hospital. My husband and I didn't know about it until after the baby was born, because it was a very quick labor and delivery. I guess it was partly our fault for not expressly telling them that we didn't want them there, but honestly I never thought that it needed to be said. I mean, who follows a couple in labor to the hospital without being asked? Surely if we had wanted them there they could've just come along in the car with us.

When my parents found out that they weren't the first guardians for our children in our will, they completely flipped out. Again, I was totally unprepared for their reaction, or I would never have told them. In hindsight I should've been able to guess, but I guess growing up in North America has made me a little blind to a lot of Asian cultural norms.

[Ann]

When my parents found out that they weren't the first guardians for our children in our will, they completely flipped out. Again, I was totally unprepared for their reaction, or I would never have told them.

I'm sorry it didn't go well. If they were going to flip out, it is definitely better you told them, though (assuming they are somebody you want in your children's lives).  If the worst should happen, you don't want, best case, your parents dealing with the unanswered questions of why they weren't chosen on top of mourning the loss of their child.  Worst case would be some sort of custody battle.  You might have skipped the repercussions because, well, you'd be dead, but your children wouldn't.

[shelivesthedream]

It's such a shame that people don't respect boundaries. WE never had any problems with my parents or the in-laws. If I had family like some of you guys I would not even tell them I was pregnant until a month after the baby was born:))   Of course this only works if you live in different towns.

Seriously already thinking about how long we can keep the news from my mother if we ever have children - of both birth and pregnancy. Mainly because we have a precarious entente which is largely built upon never saying anything other than small talk, and I can see how we'd get into deeper conversation pretty quickly about children. She'd ask about the birth plan, I'd obfuscate but eventually have to tell her, she'd make some passive-aggressive but deniable veiled criticism, I have to decide whether to play nice to keep the peace or enforce boundaries and start an argument and be accused of criticising HER... Oh man. (And iowajes, I sympathise with struggling to enforce boundaries - no one wants to pour petrol onto embers if the embers will just keep glowing quietly by themselves, but you still get burned by embers.) If I could keep the entire pregnancy and existence of the child secret from her forever, I would.

Just as a datapoint, we're closing in on 4 years of keeping the news from my MIL.  We do live a long way away, and communication is intentionally limited.

And I'm not going to get into all of her crazy, nasty stuff over the years. That would be for my wife to tell.

You successfully kept a 3-year-old hidden from the in-laws? The logistics alone sound like a good story. (/fetches popcorn)

Yes. Please please please explain how you actually do this while still having some contact with her. And how the "Hey, guess we should tell MIL about the baby" - "You know, we don't actually have to..." converation went. Does anyone else on that side of the family know, and how have they not told her?

[RetiredAt63]

DD hasn't got around to reproducing, but when (if) she does, we will discuss all this ahead of time.  The fact that we are a few 100 km apart means we will have to plan it, it is not as if I live next door.  I can certainly see popping down to see my grandchild soon after birth but only for a day (i.e. drive there and stay in a hotel overnight, see baby evening and morning, drive home), and then going later for a longer visit when their schedule has settled a bit.  But she will know what works best for them.

[former player]

I wonder whether all this "must see baby immediately" is a cultural hang-over from the days (which are within living memory) when the chances were high of mother or baby, or both, dying within a few days of the birth.

It's an explanation though, not an excuse.

[MrMoogle]

What are the age group after millennials called? the 2000-now

Generation Z

More like Generation Why?

Why do I have to......etc etc

Actually, the Millennial generation was called Generation Y, and Generation Why, before settling on Mellinnial.  If I recall correctly, both of those terms were used in the 90's.  I'm guessing we won't have a final name for the generation being born now for another 10-15 years.

[shelivesthedream]

I wonder whether all this "must see baby immediately" is a cultural hang-over from the days (which are within living memory) when the chances were high of mother or baby, or both, dying within a few days of the birth.

It's an explanation though, not an excuse.

Yeah. I've genuinely been thinking throughout this discussion, "What do you even need to see them FOR?" You can find out that mother and baby are both well by phone. You can get pictures over email if you're that desperate to check your grandchild looks like every other baby ever. It's not like the baby will even acknowledge your existence for months. The ONLY reason to dash down there is to genuinely help with stuff like cooking and cleaning and changing nappies. There is no other reason to visit the baby immediately.

[zolotiyeruki]

I wonder whether all this "must see baby immediately" is a cultural hang-over from the days (which are within living memory) when the chances were high of mother or baby, or both, dying within a few days of the birth.

It's an explanation though, not an excuse.

Yeah. I've genuinely been thinking throughout this discussion, "What do you even need to see them FOR?" You can find out that mother and baby are both well by phone. You can get pictures over email if you're that desperate to check your grandchild looks like every other baby ever. It's not like the baby will even acknowledge your existence for months. The ONLY reason to dash down there is to genuinely help with stuff like cooking and cleaning and changing nappies. There is no other reason to visit the baby immediately.

Well, there *is* the emotional experience of holding a newborn as well.  There's nothing else quite like it :)

[I'm a red panda]

What are the age group after millennials called? the 2000-now

Generation Z

More like Generation Why?

Why do I have to......etc etc

Actually, the Millennial generation was called Generation Y, and Generation Why, before settling on Mellinnial.  If I recall correctly, both of those terms were used in the 90's.  I'm guessing we won't have a final name for the generation being born now for another 10-15 years.

I went to a seminar that called them Generation Edge.

It took me a long time to realize I was a millennial (1982) because I fit so few of the characteristics and grew up as generation Y.  That same seminar called people like me "cuspers".



-----------------------
Nothing like holding a newborn, nope. There isn't. But it isn't about the grandparents.
There are about 50 photos of my newborn with her grandparents in the recovery room. There is ONE of me and the baby.

Grandparents posted photos of themselves with baby on facebook as soon as Dad announced the birth (to be fair, that was good waiting. Husband's parents posted the baby's birth and stats before he did!). Photo of me didn't make it until day 2. (Birth being day 0). The first comment was "I thought Jessi was there too!".

It was all about "look at us being grandparents of the year". Let the parents enjoy their new baby for a bit!

(My SIL didn't even get to hold 2 of her children before her mother who took them while she was in recovery. I had told my husband and the nurses that no one touches the baby except DH before I do. But they saw her before me.)

[I'm a red panda]

Oh, and just as an anti mustachian rant...
MIL bought like $200 worth of clothes for the baby. After seeing that her closet is so full she can never wear all this.

Including outfits for Halloween and Christmas! Who knows what size she'll even be then! Or whether I'm going to want to make her something special to wear.

This is someone who doesn't have money to spend!

[gaja]

Oh, and just as an anti mustachian rant...
MIL bought like $200 worth of clothes for the baby. After seeing that her closet is so full she can never wear all this.

Including outfits for Halloween and Christmas! Who knows what size she'll even be then! Or whether I'm going to want to make her something special to wear.

This is someone who doesn't have money to spend!

Can you return those clothes to the shop for a refund or store credit? They grow very fast, and most grandparents relax on the clothes buying mania when the babies approach 12 months. Those store credits might come to good use then. As for the Halloween and Christmas clothes, I would definitely return them, and if the question comes up explain that they were (unfortunately) the wrong size.

If you can't return them, donate to goodwill or someone else, or sell them.

[I'm a red panda]

No, they aren't from stores I have around here :(

I'll eventually donate them.

Oh, I forgot another fun shopaholic story- she used to buy things for my SIL. Give them to her kids, unwrap them, use them, and then give SIL a bill! My SIL finally threw a fit and refused to pay when it was a new bedroom set!  I would have refused at the first 99 cent toy!

[AlanStache]

Oh, I forgot another fun shopaholic story- she used to buy things for my SIL. Give them to her kids, unwrap them, use them, and then give SIL a bill! My SIL finally threw a fit and refused to pay when it was a new bedroom set!  I would have refused at the first 99 cent toy!

WHAT!!! Please elaborate!  How in what world is this a thing?

[Just Joe]

That's INSANE!

[I'm a red panda]

Oh, I forgot another fun shopaholic story- she used to buy things for my SIL. Give them to her kids, unwrap them, use them, and then give SIL a bill! My SIL finally threw a fit and refused to pay when it was a new bedroom set!  I would have refused at the first 99 cent toy!

WHAT!!! Please elaborate!  How in what world is this a thing?

I guess my SIL is a bit of a pushover, but also needed MIL to be on good terms as she was their childcare. So she just out up with it. The kidsbwould day "granny got us stuffed animals", then on Monday SIL would be told she owed her $10, or whatever.

The furniture went back. Who the hell buys someone furniture without asking?
(MIL did rearrange my basement furniture. My husband noticed everything is about 2 ft to the left. And our chair is now diagonal rather than square to the wall. Once either of us can lift things we will have to put it all back.)

[Abundant life]

Except.my friends have been bringing diapers and holding the baby for an hour so I can nap, since my husband cooks.

But none of our family is local, so they are coming for extended stays. And seem to think "helping" means something different than what I do.

That is hopeless, having to take care of visitors in additional to having a baby. Could you not sit down with them and have a talk. Tell them that you really appreciate them coming, but that it is a burden to be a host. As if they want to lift your burden by taking over some of your household chores, like grocery shopping, cooking, cleaning etc. Tell them that you are stressed out of your mind and really need some help.

Usually the easiest is to just say no. If you tell them ahead of the birth that you won't have any visitors until 6-12 weeks after the baby is born, it is much easier to loosen the rules afterwards. If they expect to almost take part in the birth, they will be disappointed if you ask them to wait one week before visiting. If they know from the start you want peace and quiet, they will be positively surprised if they get to see the baby already after two weeks.

With a newborn, usually the best help is to stay away (or bring food and leave).

Wow! All this seems a little harsh, not seeing a new grandchild for a couple of weeks?

Ok, you don't want to visit too long or inappropriately, but it seems a little cruel and unusual (maybe not so unusual!) to exclude the grandparents (who probably love the child the most next to the parents) and treat them with such disdain.

Knowing how much you love your children, how do you think you'd feel treated like this when your time came to be grandparents?

You sound awfully entitled. New parents get to set the boundaries. Deal with it.

Not at all, I have no grandchildren. Neither am I Asian :) but I have seen the pain these sort of issues have caused others. Perhaps I'm just expecting people to share this exciting milestone with their families?

Something has changed, it used to be normal to visit a new baby in hospital, while the parents got to show off their newborn. A photo is fine in extenuating circumstances, but it's not the same as holding a newborn. I'm with zolotiyeruki:

Well, there *is* the emotional experience of holding a newborn as well.  There's nothing else quite like it :)