Author Topic: Relatives who just don't get it  (Read 2700110 times)

partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6350 on: April 08, 2021, 07:13:33 AM »
Honestly one of my dream type houses are 1950s brick ranches. Low maintenance, but still roomy enough, cozy and simple.  My lil brother once owned one and I loved it.

Uturn

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6351 on: April 08, 2021, 09:11:25 AM »
Before I can reply my mother who owes $10k in credit card debt says I need to enjoy my money and my life a little more.

I have a family member who used to call me cheap and tell me I need to treat myself.  I finally got fed up and said, "you know what's a treat?  I am debt free and have a year's worth of expenses in the bank.  That means no company, boss, bill collector, or layoff list has any power over me."  We never had a treat yourself conversation again. 

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6352 on: April 08, 2021, 09:16:28 AM »
Before I can reply my mother who owes $10k in credit card debt says I need to enjoy my money and my life a little more.

I have a family member who used to call me cheap and tell me I need to treat myself.  I finally got fed up and said, "you know what's a treat?  I am debt free and have a year's worth of expenses in the bank.  That means no company, boss, bill collector, or layoff list has any power over me."  We never had a treat yourself conversation again.

I like it, I like it!

Sandi_k

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6353 on: April 08, 2021, 01:42:43 PM »
Oooof. Just got word that a family member just got laid off. The only earner for a family of 5, and they have a BIG lifestyle.

They hit the wall in 2009, lost a job, and had to move cross-country for another, and negotiate a short sale of their house. I had hoped they had learned from that experience...

Nope. Exactly the same circumstances this time, but now they have three teenagers. The only ray of light is that they are done with the big renovation/expansion project on their house, and they are not upside down. So if they do sell, they'll have a stash, instead of debt....

So yeah - FI really matters. I've been slow, and conservative, and careful. But here I am, able to retire if I have to, and I will never have had the big swings in income and circumstance. For which I am very grateful.

ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6354 on: April 08, 2021, 04:49:59 PM »
My husband has an older sister and an older brother, each of whom has a child. A couple
Of years before starting our own family we offered each of them to open up a 529 for their kids. One said yes and then never followed up with providing their kid’s SSN to be named beneficiary. The second shared some stuff about not wanting to reduce possible student aid eligibility in the future and preferred to be given cash to keep under the mattress. Which of course we did not agree to. So neither of them took us up on our offer.

We now have three sprogs of our own so are busy with their 529s.

partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6355 on: April 10, 2021, 03:23:48 PM »
My husband has an older sister and an older brother, each of whom has a child. A couple
Of years before starting our own family we offered each of them to open up a 529 for their kids. One said yes and then never followed up with providing their kid’s SSN to be named beneficiary. The second shared some stuff about not wanting to reduce possible student aid eligibility in the future and preferred to be given cash to keep under the mattress. Which of course we did not agree to. So neither of them took us up on our offer.

We now have three sprogs of our own so are busy with their 529s.
that was very nice of you. Otoh I had 529s opened for both kids, shared the info with the grandparents the account info, how to contribute. Also when asked "what should I get for xmas, etc?" Grandparents (or other relatives) never contributed directly, main reasons being "it's boring" "I want them to have something they can open up", etc. Sigh. When the kids got older I did give them the option that if they took bday money etc and put it in their 529, I would match it, so that's what we did instead.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2021, 06:43:13 AM by partgypsy »

charis

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6356 on: April 10, 2021, 06:03:41 PM »
My husband has an older sister and an older brother, each of whom has a child. A couple
Of years before starting our own family we offered each of them to open up a 529 for their kids. One said yes and then never followed up with providing their kid’s SSN to be named beneficiary. The second shared some stuff about not wanting to reduce possible student aid eligibility in the future and preferred to be given cash to keep under the mattress. Which of course we did not agree to. So neither of them took us up on our offer.

We now have three sprogs of our own so are busy with their 529s.
that was very nice of you. Otoh I had 529s opened for both kids, shared the info with the grandparents the account info, how to contribute. Also when asked "what should I get for xmas, etc?" Grandparents (or other relatives)  contributed directly, main reasons being "it's boring" "I want them to have something they can open up", etc. Sigh. When the kids got older I did give them the option that if they took bday money etc and put it in their 529, I would match it, so that's what we did instead.

My parents offered to open up an education account for our children and we declined, but offered that they could contribute to the accounts that we had established. My parents have a history of trying to manipulate relationships with money and I want no part of that.  I also did not want them to have the kids SS#s because they make questionable financial decisions and routinely have computer security breaches.

rockstache

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6357 on: April 10, 2021, 06:17:26 PM »
My husband has an older sister and an older brother, each of whom has a child. A couple
Of years before starting our own family we offered each of them to open up a 529 for their kids. One said yes and then never followed up with providing their kid’s SSN to be named beneficiary. The second shared some stuff about not wanting to reduce possible student aid eligibility in the future and preferred to be given cash to keep under the mattress. Which of course we did not agree to. So neither of them took us up on our offer.

We now have three sprogs of our own so are busy with their 529s.
that was very nice of you. Otoh I had 529s opened for both kids, shared the info with the grandparents the account info, how to contribute. Also when asked "what should I get for xmas, etc?" Grandparents (or other relatives)  contributed directly, main reasons being "it's boring" "I want them to have something they can open up", etc. Sigh. When the kids got older I did give them the option that if they took bday money etc and put it in their 529, I would match it, so that's what we did instead.

My parents offered to open up an education account for our children and we declined, but offered that they could contribute to the accounts that we had established. My parents have a history of trying to manipulate relationships with money and I want no part of that.  I also did not want them to have the kids SS#s because they make questionable financial decisions and routinely have computer security breaches.
We did this with my in laws. They were not happy that we wouldn’t give them the kids socials but oh well. As a parent, it’s my job to protect them and I feel like that includes their identity, at least to the best of my ability. They won’t contribute to the 529 we set up because they want control of it. Lol nope.

partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6358 on: April 11, 2021, 06:46:47 AM »
I meant to say, never contributed directly. To contribute they didn't need the social, just the name and account number. But never took us up on it.
I don't think any of the grandparents would have done anything bad with social security numbers or been untrustworthy in that way.

rockstache

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6359 on: April 11, 2021, 07:14:31 AM »
I meant to say, never contributed directly. To contribute they didn't need the social, just the name and account number. But never took us up on it.
I don't think any of the grandparents would have done anything bad with social security numbers or been untrustworthy in that way.
Ours wouldn’t steal it directly, but they’re rather careless with leaving paperwork around/out in the open. One relative with a known drug problem has open access to their house, so....no. Once the SSN is given away there’s no getting it back.

ender

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6360 on: April 11, 2021, 08:32:43 AM »
Can't 529s be transferred to someone else anyways?

Why not tell grandparents to put the 529 in their name and then transfer it to the kiddo when they are college age?

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6361 on: April 11, 2021, 08:58:01 AM »
Can't 529s be transferred to someone else anyways?

Why not tell grandparents to put the 529 in their name and then transfer it to the kiddo when they are college age?

It may be a control thing.    Some people would use it to blackmail the kids into doing what they want instead of what the kid wants.

iluvzbeach

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6362 on: April 11, 2021, 10:26:05 AM »
I meant to say, never contributed directly. To contribute they didn't need the social, just the name and account number. But never took us up on it.
I don't think any of the grandparents would have done anything bad with social security numbers or been untrustworthy in that way.
Ours wouldn’t steal it directly, but they’re rather careless with leaving paperwork around/out in the open. One relative with a known drug problem has open access to their house, so....no. Once the SSN is given away there’s no getting it back.

I help my mother manage her finances and several years back she emailed (!!!) me a Word document that she used to track all of her website logins, passwords, secret questions & answers, etc. Not only was I horrified she maintained the data in this format & sent it by email, but even moreso when I found she had all of MY personal identifying data recorded on it, including my SSN. At some point she’d probably asked for my SSN to list me as a beneficiary on one of her accounts, never did I dream she’d record it in a Word doc and send it via email. Facepalm.

I realize my SSN is in all sorts of places that anyone who really wants to find it can get to it, but I never thought my own parent would (innocently) be so careless with it. I totally understand others’ decision not to share their own children’s SSNs with family members.

charis

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6363 on: April 11, 2021, 12:20:53 PM »
I meant to say, never contributed directly. To contribute they didn't need the social, just the name and account number. But never took us up on it.
I don't think any of the grandparents would have done anything bad with social security numbers or been untrustworthy in that way.
Ours wouldn’t steal it directly, but they’re rather careless with leaving paperwork around/out in the open. One relative with a known drug problem has open access to their house, so....no. Once the SSN is given away there’s no getting it back.

Same here (a sibling's boyfriend who had free access to the house was the problem).  I meant to reply to the other poster who said that their relatives turned down their offer of a 529.  I am not clear what the implication was (it seemed like a criticism of the relatives).  I think it's somewhat reasonable that they might not be comfortable with the idea, for a variety of reasons.

ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6364 on: April 11, 2021, 02:01:24 PM »
Can't 529s be transferred to someone else anyways?

Why not tell grandparents to put the 529 in their name and then transfer it to the kiddo when they are college age?
I believe you lose some of the tax benefits when you pass a 529 down two generations like that.

BFive55

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6365 on: April 12, 2021, 05:19:17 PM »
My brother has been living in a ~2400 square foot house for ~4 years.  About a year and half ago he got married.  They just announced they're moving into a 3800 square foot house.  He's an engineer, and she will be when she graduates, so they can afford it, but I just don't understand.  When he got the 2400 sqft house, he had two or three good friends move in with him, so it didn't seem so bad.  Our dad retired early, so it's not like the idea is alien to him. 

I just want to ask WHHHHHHHHYYYYY?  Everything was finalized before I learned about it, so there's not much point in having a conversation about it.  I wish them the best.  It's just my brain hurts when I think about it.

My house is about 1,200-1,300 square feet, can't recall exactly. But where I am it was cheaper to buy a home than continue to rent an apartment in any decent building. My rent for my last apartment was like $400 more a month than my house in an apartment building I would rate as "nice" but hardly luxury. Even mid-tier apartments here would be upwards of $1,200-$1,400 a month.

Maybe your brother and his wife are planning on having a few kids and want to buy now when the rates are good? It could be a good long term decision even if it doesn't make sense right now. Is housing in demand there? Or it is a hot market?

Imma

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6366 on: April 13, 2021, 01:48:13 AM »
My brother has been living in a ~2400 square foot house for ~4 years.  About a year and half ago he got married.  They just announced they're moving into a 3800 square foot house.  He's an engineer, and she will be when she graduates, so they can afford it, but I just don't understand.  When he got the 2400 sqft house, he had two or three good friends move in with him, so it didn't seem so bad.  Our dad retired early, so it's not like the idea is alien to him. 

I just want to ask WHHHHHHHHYYYYY?  Everything was finalized before I learned about it, so there's not much point in having a conversation about it.  I wish them the best.  It's just my brain hurts when I think about it.

My house is about 1,200-1,300 square feet, can't recall exactly. But where I am it was cheaper to buy a home than continue to rent an apartment in any decent building. My rent for my last apartment was like $400 more a month than my house in an apartment building I would rate as "nice" but hardly luxury. Even mid-tier apartments here would be upwards of $1,200-$1,400 a month.

Maybe your brother and his wife are planning on having a few kids and want to buy now when the rates are good? It could be a good long term decision even if it doesn't make sense right now. Is housing in demand there? Or it is a hot market?

Well, sure, but we are mustachians. If the brother lives in a 2400 square ft. house right now, that's already a large family home. 3800 square ft is just insanely big, unless they're planning to have 10 kids that house is just unmustachian.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6367 on: April 13, 2021, 10:17:43 AM »
My brother has been living in a ~2400 square foot house for ~4 years.  About a year and half ago he got married.  They just announced they're moving into a 3800 square foot house.  He's an engineer, and she will be when she graduates, so they can afford it, but I just don't understand.  When he got the 2400 sqft house, he had two or three good friends move in with him, so it didn't seem so bad.  Our dad retired early, so it's not like the idea is alien to him. 

I just want to ask WHHHHHHHHYYYYY?  Everything was finalized before I learned about it, so there's not much point in having a conversation about it.  I wish them the best.  It's just my brain hurts when I think about it.

My house is about 1,200-1,300 square feet, can't recall exactly. But where I am it was cheaper to buy a home than continue to rent an apartment in any decent building. My rent for my last apartment was like $400 more a month than my house in an apartment building I would rate as "nice" but hardly luxury. Even mid-tier apartments here would be upwards of $1,200-$1,400 a month.

Maybe your brother and his wife are planning on having a few kids and want to buy now when the rates are good? It could be a good long term decision even if it doesn't make sense right now. Is housing in demand there? Or it is a hot market?

Well, sure, but we are mustachians. If the brother lives in a 2400 square ft. house right now, that's already a large family home. 3800 square ft is just insanely big, unless they're planning to have 10 kids that house is just unmustachian.

On the one hand, yes, there is no justification for it. On the other hand, my grandmother lives alone in a house that is larger than that and... it doesn't make sense, but she can afford it and for now she is able to take care of herself there. I have an aunt who also lives alone in an enormous house, but she has 7 grown children plus their spouses and kids and maybe she wants to have room for lots of visitors? I dunno. Some people choose to spend their money in ways that seem odd to me.

Imma

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6368 on: April 13, 2021, 12:17:05 PM »
My brother has been living in a ~2400 square foot house for ~4 years.  About a year and half ago he got married.  They just announced they're moving into a 3800 square foot house.  He's an engineer, and she will be when she graduates, so they can afford it, but I just don't understand.  When he got the 2400 sqft house, he had two or three good friends move in with him, so it didn't seem so bad.  Our dad retired early, so it's not like the idea is alien to him. 

I just want to ask WHHHHHHHHYYYYY?  Everything was finalized before I learned about it, so there's not much point in having a conversation about it.  I wish them the best.  It's just my brain hurts when I think about it.

My house is about 1,200-1,300 square feet, can't recall exactly. But where I am it was cheaper to buy a home than continue to rent an apartment in any decent building. My rent for my last apartment was like $400 more a month than my house in an apartment building I would rate as "nice" but hardly luxury. Even mid-tier apartments here would be upwards of $1,200-$1,400 a month.

Maybe your brother and his wife are planning on having a few kids and want to buy now when the rates are good? It could be a good long term decision even if it doesn't make sense right now. Is housing in demand there? Or it is a hot market?

Well, sure, but we are mustachians. If the brother lives in a 2400 square ft. house right now, that's already a large family home. 3800 square ft is just insanely big, unless they're planning to have 10 kids that house is just unmustachian.

On the one hand, yes, there is no justification for it. On the other hand, my grandmother lives alone in a house that is larger than that and... it doesn't make sense, but she can afford it and for now she is able to take care of herself there. I have an aunt who also lives alone in an enormous house, but she has 7 grown children plus their spouses and kids and maybe she wants to have room for lots of visitors? I dunno. Some people choose to spend their money in ways that seem odd to me.

Being from urban Europe, I don't think I've ever even been in a house that big. There are 10 homes 3800 square ft or bigger for sale in my city and there are several million € homes. They look like castles to me.

Sure, if people can afford it and can look after themselves and the property, it's their choice and good luck to them. It just feels like a colossal waste of space and resources to build, maintain, heat etc a house like that.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6369 on: April 13, 2021, 12:49:18 PM »
My brother has been living in a ~2400 square foot house for ~4 years.  About a year and half ago he got married.  They just announced they're moving into a 3800 square foot house.  He's an engineer, and she will be when she graduates, so they can afford it, but I just don't understand.  When he got the 2400 sqft house, he had two or three good friends move in with him, so it didn't seem so bad.  Our dad retired early, so it's not like the idea is alien to him. 

I just want to ask WHHHHHHHHYYYYY?  Everything was finalized before I learned about it, so there's not much point in having a conversation about it.  I wish them the best.  It's just my brain hurts when I think about it.

My house is about 1,200-1,300 square feet, can't recall exactly. But where I am it was cheaper to buy a home than continue to rent an apartment in any decent building. My rent for my last apartment was like $400 more a month than my house in an apartment building I would rate as "nice" but hardly luxury. Even mid-tier apartments here would be upwards of $1,200-$1,400 a month.

Maybe your brother and his wife are planning on having a few kids and want to buy now when the rates are good? It could be a good long term decision even if it doesn't make sense right now. Is housing in demand there? Or it is a hot market?

Well, sure, but we are mustachians. If the brother lives in a 2400 square ft. house right now, that's already a large family home. 3800 square ft is just insanely big, unless they're planning to have 10 kids that house is just unmustachian.

On the one hand, yes, there is no justification for it. On the other hand, my grandmother lives alone in a house that is larger than that and... it doesn't make sense, but she can afford it and for now she is able to take care of herself there. I have an aunt who also lives alone in an enormous house, but she has 7 grown children plus their spouses and kids and maybe she wants to have room for lots of visitors? I dunno. Some people choose to spend their money in ways that seem odd to me.

Being from urban Europe, I don't think I've ever even been in a house that big. There are 10 homes 3800 square ft or bigger for sale in my city and there are several million € homes. They look like castles to me.

Sure, if people can afford it and can look after themselves and the property, it's their choice and good luck to them. It just feels like a colossal waste of space and resources to build, maintain, heat etc a house like that.

This.  Just because they can afford it does not mean they should.  There are costs to society and the planet if not themselves of one or two people maintaining a house that big.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6370 on: April 13, 2021, 01:07:01 PM »
I just can't imagine using all that space.  Let alone heating it and cooling it and cleaning it.  What is the point.  We live in a relatively large apartment (150 square meters - 4 people) and it feels perfect to me.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6371 on: April 13, 2021, 01:14:24 PM »
My mother insists on staying in the far too large family home partly due to inertia (too much trouble to move) and partly due to fear of change (too many questions about what life in a new location would look like).  Until she dies or changes her mind, she feels it’s worth heating, cooling & cleaning the space to avoid having to make a decision.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6372 on: April 13, 2021, 01:25:46 PM »
My in-laws still live in the 3000-sf home where they raised seven kids. They do intend to downsize in a few years, but a major obstacle is that it's the only house big enough for all 49 kids, spouses, grandkids, and great-grandkids to gather for Christmas and other holidays--which we do, multiple times a year, and which is extremely precious to my MIL especially.

partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6373 on: April 13, 2021, 02:03:18 PM »
Hula hoop yes. The guy I see, has multiple houses; rentals and also 2 separate house residences. Hes expressed more than wanting to custom build a house, and yes the bigger the better. I'm going to refrain from commenting on his desire, but I don't really understand it, other than maybe it is an aspirational thing. And he also points out that building a bigger house is not that much more expensive than custom building a smaller house. Anyways I'm just going to say anything any more on the subject, bc it's not my money and it makes me feel like I'm pissing in his cheerios to point out the wastefulness of it. What is interesting is he is very mustachian pretty much in all other aspects of life.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2021, 02:42:20 PM by partgypsy »

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6374 on: April 13, 2021, 02:15:33 PM »
A 2400 sq ft house is a really good size for a regular family.  Plenty of room to spread out when you need to (if properly designed) but not excessively large.

Our last two homes have been 3500 sq feet, but we didn't buy them because they were that much bigger.   We bought them for a bunch of other things that we needed or wanted in a house and the extra sq footage came with it.   We actually put most of it to use but then we're not an average family, we have a wood shop, pottery studio, glass studio, metal studio and enamel studio and sewing room and a whole lot of books in our library, most of which get used.   Plus we like to entertain and teach classes in our home, so we put most of the space to good use.

ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6375 on: April 13, 2021, 04:34:48 PM »
I grew up in a 2100 ft^2 house as a kid for two adults and two kids. Our dining room was almost never used. We had a family room and a living room and only one of the two was ever in service. One bedroom usually wasn’t used until I reached my teenage years and stopped sharing a room with my sister.

That said, the five of us are in a 1800 ft^2, three-level townhouse now and I want more space! Mostly because we are all home all the time but also because being split up over so many levels means the space isn’t well utilized.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6376 on: April 13, 2021, 11:25:58 PM »
Hula hoop yes. The guy I see, has multiple houses; rentals and also 2 separate house residences. Hes expressed more than wanting to custom build a house, and yes the bigger the better. I'm going to refrain from commenting on his desire, but I don't really understand it, other than maybe it is an aspirational thing. And he also points out that building a bigger house is not that much more expensive than custom building a smaller house. Anyways I'm just going to say anything any more on the subject, bc it's not my money and it makes me feel like I'm pissing in his cheerios to point out the wastefulness of it. What is interesting is he is very mustachian pretty much in all other aspects of life.

I can understand the wish to custombuild even though I don’t understand the bigger the better. I would like to have one of the plus energy houses that produces more energy than it uses.

partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6377 on: April 14, 2021, 06:18:25 AM »
Hula hoop yes. The guy I see, has multiple houses; rentals and also 2 separate house residences. Hes expressed more than wanting to custom build a house, and yes the bigger the better. I'm going to refrain from commenting on his desire, but I don't really understand it, other than maybe it is an aspirational thing. And he also points out that building a bigger house is not that much more expensive than custom building a smaller house. Anyways I'm just going to say anything any more on the subject, bc it's not my money and it makes me feel like I'm pissing in his cheerios to point out the wastefulness of it. What is interesting is he is very mustachian pretty much in all other aspects of life.

I can understand the wish to custombuild even though I don’t understand the bigger the better. I would like to have one of the plus energy houses that produces more energy than it uses.

there was this guy who had a column that was all about houses esp stuff about making more energy efficient etc. air flow, ambient heated floors, etc. Anyways a book compiled of his columns (which I can't find now) had articles about geothermal houses which if I ever custom built a house in an area that made sense, want to try. If not, as least mostly passive solar.

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6378 on: April 14, 2021, 03:35:56 PM »
there was this guy who had a column that was all about houses esp stuff about making more energy efficient etc. air flow, ambient heated floors, etc. Anyways a book compiled of his columns (which I can't find now) had articles about geothermal houses which if I ever custom built a house in an area that made sense, want to try. If not, as least mostly passive solar.

There are some excellent resources on high-efficiency houses. Green Building Advisor (GBA) is one of my favourites, although very USA/Canada oriented:
https://www.greenbuildingadvisor.com/blogs

In Europe, the Passivhaus standard has been quite successful:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive_house

For general building science, Joe Lstiburek has been writing great stuff for years:
https://www.buildingscience.com/document-search?term=&field_doc_topic_tid=All&type%5B%5D=8

If I had to recommend one book:
https://www.amazon.com/Musings-Energy-Nerd-Toward-Energy-Efficient/dp/1631862561
Martin Holladay was the main editor at Greenbuilding advisor for many years.





partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6379 on: April 15, 2021, 07:03:38 AM »
Thanks for the resources! I think my info is probably 20 years out of date. Though I do also like the book the "not so big house" (which are not particularly tiny) because of the good ideas for making a house very functional and user friendly even in smaller footprints.


UpNAtom

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6381 on: April 15, 2021, 01:59:27 PM »
Before I can reply my mother who owes $10k in credit card debt says I need to enjoy my money and my life a little more.

I have a family member who used to call me cheap and tell me I need to treat myself.  I finally got fed up and said, "you know what's a treat?  I am debt free and have a year's worth of expenses in the bank.  That means no company, boss, bill collector, or layoff list has any power over me."  We never had a treat yourself conversation again.

Not a family member: an ex (you'll see why quickly) had said she was more used to someone who spent more money on her. The kicker was, weeks earlier she was complaining that her ex had left her with ~8k in credit card debt (aka they had a joint card, and that was how 'he' was spending money on her).
« Last Edit: April 15, 2021, 02:08:06 PM by UpNAtom »

SwordGuy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6382 on: April 15, 2021, 02:33:23 PM »
Before I can reply my mother who owes $10k in credit card debt says I need to enjoy my money and my life a little more.

I have a family member who used to call me cheap and tell me I need to treat myself.  I finally got fed up and said, "you know what's a treat?  I am debt free and have a year's worth of expenses in the bank.  That means no company, boss, bill collector, or layoff list has any power over me."  We never had a treat yourself conversation again.

Not a family member: an ex (you'll see why quickly) had said she was more used to someone who spent more money on her. The kicker was, weeks earlier she was complaining that her ex had left her with ~8k in credit card debt (aka they had a joint card, and that was how 'he' was spending money on her).

Wow.   Some people simply can't connect the dots.

Uturn

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6383 on: April 16, 2021, 06:12:02 AM »
Not a family member: an ex (you'll see why quickly) had said she was more used to someone who spent more money on her. The kicker was, weeks earlier she was complaining that her ex had left her with ~8k in credit card debt (aka they had a joint card, and that was how 'he' was spending money on her).

I had an ex break up with me over money after dating for about 6 months.  She figured out that we both spent about the same annually but I made a little over twice what she did.  She said that me hoarding money like that was just greedy and she thought she was dating someone with a better sense of the purpose of money.  Wow, and here I thought my $42k/yr spend rate created quite the cushy life.

Adventine

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6384 on: April 16, 2021, 06:39:19 AM »
All these money break up stories remind me of an ex.

One of my ex-boyfriends came from a wealthy family. As in, living-in-the-richest-area-in-the-country-since-birth wealthy.

His mother hated me because she thought I was just a golddigger, en though at the time, I was fully self-supporting, was saving around 50% of my salary, and always insisted on splitting the bill evenly with her son whenever we would go out.

I broke up with the guy because he knew all this about me and yet didn't defend me from his mom, even when she tried to embarrass me in front of him and their extended family. As in, at my ex's birthday lunch with family, the mom told my ex to tell me to sit on a certain chair, which turned out to be broken (!) and I fell through the chair (!!) and both the mom and my ex ignored me even though they were only seated a few feet away from me (!!!). A couple of decent minded family members helped me up and found me a new chair.

Spineless POS.

The happy ending was, I broke up with that ex shortly after, in a spectacular he-deserved-to-be-yelled-at-in-public fashion.

The bittersweet coda, a few years later, the ex messages me to say that his mom is dying of cancer and wants to apologize to me for her bad behavior. And I refused. Because not once did my ex ever apologize to me for his own bad behavior, and for his role in allowing his mom to treat me so badly. Knowing how spineless my ex was, he probably only reached out because his mom told him to (and likely because there was a giant inheritance riding on doing exactly as his mom said).

It feels nice to get that off my chest. That ex and his mom were two people who simply. Did. Not. Get. It.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2021, 06:51:45 AM by Adventine »

partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6385 on: April 16, 2021, 09:42:43 AM »
I had the opposite situation is the guy I was married to, my mil liked me better than her own son, saying things since the divorce like "I don't understand him; he's never had any sense; we did not raise him that way" and his father while not telling him this, said he was disappointed in him and if he asked for help like moving in with them he's not going to help him.... The one awkwardness is there have been times I've hung out with my former mother in law with my kids say at a neighborhood block party, she will introduce me to other people as her daughter in law. Which forces me to either say nothing and people having the wrong idea, or me correct the statement (in case they couldnt figure out me being there solo and not wearing wedding band). And, the mil is not fond of the new wife. Both her background, how they got together, and the fact that while ex took the majority of his divorce settlement and used it for a down payment for a house, they have a written agreement in case death or divorce she gets 100% of the house.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2021, 10:16:08 AM by partgypsy »

Taran Wanderer

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6386 on: April 16, 2021, 10:28:16 AM »
I had the opposite situation is the guy I was married to, my mil liked me better than her own son, saying things since the divorce like "I don't understand him; he's never had any sense; we did not raise him that way" and his father while not telling him this, said he was disappointed in him and if he asked for help like moving in with them he's not going to help him.... The one awkwardness is there have been times I've hung out with my former mother in law with my kids say at a neighborhood block party, she will introduce me to other people as her daughter in law. Which forces me to either say nothing and people having the wrong idea, or me correct the statement (in case they couldnt figure out me being there solo and not wearing wedding band). And, the mil is not fond of the new wife. Both her background, how they got together, and the fact that while ex took the majority of his divorce settlement and used it for a down payment for a house, they have a written agreement in case death or divorce she gets 100% of the house.

Well that’s awkward.

Dicey

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6387 on: April 16, 2021, 12:16:31 PM »
My husband has an older sister and an older brother, each of whom has a child. A couple
Of years before starting our own family we offered each of them to open up a 529 for their kids. One said yes and then never followed up with providing their kid’s SSN to be named beneficiary. The second shared some stuff about not wanting to reduce possible student aid eligibility in the future and preferred to be given cash to keep under the mattress. Which of course we did not agree to. So neither of them took us up on our offer.

We now have three sprogs of our own so are busy with their 529s.
I did a similar thing with my twin Goddaughters. I didn't want to waste money on plastic crap, so from the time they were babies, I said instead of quickly forgotten Christmas and Birthday gifts, I'd pay for a trip to Europe when they graduated from High School. Despite the fact that their dad is an actual financial planner (now over 50 and severely underemployed), the necessary information to set up accounts for this was never forthcoming, despite multiple asks. Perhaps their father didn't want to have someone else contributing money into accounts on his daughters' behalf, but I know (knew?) them well enough that they easily could have said so or proposed an alternative.

Fast forward many years. Communication is less frequent, but still semi-regular. The girls graduated without any mention of this to me. (OMG, they grow up so fast, lol!) I guess graduation announcements aren't a "thing" any more? Once I realized they were past graduation, I struggled with how much to give them, because I'm a woman of my word. I knew the family was facing some economic difficulties, so I sent a check for $5k* and told the mom to use it as best suited their family's needs.

Eventually, she said she was going to give the girls "some of the money" for their birthday. Subsequently, I got a - wait for it - thank you text from them. I have no idea what they got and damned if I'm going to ask.

At least I have the consolation of knowing that I didn't add a bunch of pink plastic crap to the environmental slag heap.

*I have no idea how much a trip for two to Europe costs, but I do know how hard I worked for $5k, as opposed to investing a smaller amount when they were very young and letting them watch it grow. I wanted the girls to have the thrill of watching it grow and planning a trip together with "their" money. Ah, well. Water under the bridge.

And one more thing. I used to visit frequently, even though they live several hundred miles away, because I was single and carefree and I love them to pieces. Fast forward to me finally getting married and then inheriting a MIL with ALZ. I had little freedom to visit during those caregiving years and thus the bonds of our friendship had loosened, but there was no way I was going to forget my promise to them.

Plina

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6388 on: April 16, 2021, 01:58:50 PM »
My husband has an older sister and an older brother, each of whom has a child. A couple
Of years before starting our own family we offered each of them to open up a 529 for their kids. One said yes and then never followed up with providing their kid’s SSN to be named beneficiary. The second shared some stuff about not wanting to reduce possible student aid eligibility in the future and preferred to be given cash to keep under the mattress. Which of course we did not agree to. So neither of them took us up on our offer.

We now have three sprogs of our own so are busy with their 529s.
I did a similar thing with my twin Goddaughters. I didn't want to waste money on plastic crap, so from the time they were babies, I said instead of quickly forgotten Christmas and Birthday gifts, I'd pay for a trip to Europe when they graduated from High School. Despite the fact that their dad is an actual financial planner (now over 50 and severely underemployed), the necessary information to set up accounts for this was never forthcoming, despite multiple asks. Perhaps their father didn't want to have someone else contributing money into accounts on his daughters' behalf, but I know (knew?) them well enough that they easily could have said so or proposed an alternative.

Fast forward many years. Communication is less frequent, but still semi-regular. The girls graduated without any mention of this to me. (OMG, they grow up so fast, lol!) I guess graduation announcements aren't a "thing" any more? Once I realized they were past graduation, I struggled with how much to give them, because I'm a woman of my word. I knew the family was facing some economic difficulties, so I sent a check for $5k* and told the mom to use it as best suited their family's needs.

Eventually, she said she was going to give the girls "some of the money" for their birthday. Subsequently, I got a - wait for it - thank you text from them. I have no idea what they got and damned if I'm going to ask.

At least I have the consolation of knowing that I didn't add a bunch of pink plastic crap to the environmental slag heap.


I have opened an investment account in my name with my niece as a beneficiary and will do the same for future nieces or nephews. That way I can control the money until they are old enough to deal with it themselves if I don’t die before that.

For birthdays and Christmas I make a deposit instead of buying some crap. She actually likes books so maybe I will end up buying presents sometimes but I prefer this way. I tell my sister that I have deposited money into the account.

marion10

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6389 on: April 16, 2021, 04:03:48 PM »
We opened 529 accounts for my nephews after my BIL cashed savings bond we had given to them to buy a hunting dog. That did it. We put small amounts in at birthday and Christmas and came to about $1500 for each. They both went to college and we had it sent directly to their school. Only got a thank you from one of them.

Imma

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6390 on: April 17, 2021, 02:51:39 AM »
I am so surprised that you guys didn't even get thank you's from your nieces/nephews. I have never received anything more expensive than a book for my birthday from my aunts and uncles. And since my birthday is in summer, half of the time we didn't host a party so we got nothing at all. Even now I'm 30 and have some money of my own, I wouldn't even know what to say if a family member gave me $1500 or $5000. My own mother gave me €2000 when I bought my own house and I have probably thanked her a million times for that. I know lots of people get 6 figures from their parents but I know how hard my mum saved to give me that.

@Dicey not sure what happened between your goddaughters and their parents but could it be that the parents never told them you gave them so much? Or are they such spoiled brats? I can imagine that if they think you didn't keep your promise, they're a bit angry. "All those years aunt Dicey promised to take us to Europe after graduation, and all we got was a $25 giftcard!" It's odd they didn't mention their graduation to you though. I have never heard of an official graduation announcement, maybe that's an American thing? When I graduated I called my closest family to tell them (mother, grandparent, siblings) and with everyone else I would just mention it the next time I met them. I was only allowed to take two people to the ceremony anyway.

DadJokes

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6391 on: April 17, 2021, 06:28:20 AM »
Y'all are much more generous than me. My wife and I have seven nieces and nephews, ranging from newborn to graduating high school this year. Neither the nieces/nephews nor their parents know this yet, but our plan is to give $500 as a graduation present. One of my sisters might react similarly to the way Dicey's friends did (we never got along), but I'm also not doing it for a thank you.

Step37

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6392 on: April 17, 2021, 10:42:21 AM »
Thanks for the resources! I think my info is probably 20 years out of date. Though I do also like the book the "not so big house" (which are not particularly tiny) because of the good ideas for making a house very functional and user friendly even in smaller footprints.

We bought a nearby lot and are planning a to custom build next year. It’s just two of us and we are not planning to go bigger than the 1400sf we’ve very been comfortably living in for 20 years (only a layout that will work better). It will have a basement suite and a garage suite and those will more than cover any ongoing living costs. My parents (mostly my dad) will be utterly confused by this. They added on to their ~1800sf bungalow when my sister and I were in high school and still live in their ~6500sf space. Utterly absurd.

partgypsy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6393 on: April 17, 2021, 07:27:37 PM »
I had the opposite situation is the guy I was married to, my mil liked me better than her own son, saying things since the divorce like "I don't understand him; he's never had any sense; we did not raise him that way" and his father while not telling him this, said he was disappointed in him and if he asked for help like moving in with them he's not going to help him.... The one awkwardness is there have been times I've hung out with my former mother in law with my kids say at a neighborhood block party, she will introduce me to other people as her daughter in law. Which forces me to either say nothing and people having the wrong idea, or me correct the statement (in case they couldnt figure out me being there solo and not wearing wedding band). And, the mil is not fond of the new wife. Both her background, how they got together, and the fact that while ex took the majority of his divorce settlement and used it for a down payment for a house, they have a written agreement in case death or divorce she gets 100% of the house.

Well that’s awkward.

I was in the role for much of the relationship of defending him to others. I thought people were too critical of him, including his Dad, and were overlooking his good qualities. Turns out while I was doing that, he was gaining sympathy from others by throwing me under the bus in how he described me. The parents only told me those things to me post break-up when they were really exasperated with him and the situation.     
« Last Edit: April 17, 2021, 07:29:15 PM by partgypsy »

Mighty Eyebrows

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6394 on: April 17, 2021, 08:17:44 PM »
We opened 529 accounts for my nephews...

As a Canadian, I always read sentences like this and immediately think "Why so many?"


;-)

AMandM

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6395 on: April 17, 2021, 09:13:50 PM »
Y'all are much more generous than me. My wife and I have seven nieces and nephews, ranging from newborn to graduating high school this year. Neither the nieces/nephews nor their parents know this yet, but our plan is to give $500 as a graduation present. One of my sisters might react similarly to the way Dicey's friends did (we never got along), but I'm also not doing it for a thank you.

You are much more generous than we are. My husband and I wouldn't give $500 to our grandchildren, let alone nieces and nephews.  They get presents like books when they graduated from high school. But our family is generally a low-gift-budget one.

Dicey

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6396 on: April 17, 2021, 10:00:32 PM »

@Dicey not sure what happened between your goddaughters and their parents but could it be that the parents never told them you gave them so much? Or are they such spoiled brats? I can imagine that if they think you didn't keep your promise, they're a bit angry. "All those years aunt Dicey promised to take us to Europe after graduation, and all we got was a $25 giftcard!" It's odd they didn't mention their graduation to you though. I have never heard of an official graduation announcement, maybe that's an American thing? When I graduated I called my closest family to tell them (mother, grandparent, siblings) and with everyone else I would just mention it the next time I met them. I was only allowed to take two people to the ceremony anyway.
I wasn't taking them to Europe, the money was for them to go together. Yes, graduation announcements are a thing in the US, but maybe Facebook has eaten away at that. They live a few hundred miles away from me, and I was caring for my MIL w/ALZ, so there's no way I could have attended their graduation anyway. Plus, graduation announcements are not the same as invitations to the actual graduation. I guess my only hope is that my gift helped the whole family during tough times.
What I really wanted was for the girls to learn about compound interest, budgeting and the anticipation of planning a big trip. Oh, well. They're good girls and they've worked hard in community college, with plans to transfer to a four year program, so they are clearly making good decisions, which makes me happy.

Plina

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6397 on: April 17, 2021, 11:47:18 PM »
Y'all are much more generous than me. My wife and I have seven nieces and nephews, ranging from newborn to graduating high school this year. Neither the nieces/nephews nor their parents know this yet, but our plan is to give $500 as a graduation present. One of my sisters might react similarly to the way Dicey's friends did (we never got along), but I'm also not doing it for a thank you.

You are much more generous than we are. My husband and I wouldn't give $500 to our grandchildren, let alone nieces and nephews.  They get presents like books when they graduated from high school. But our family is generally a low-gift-budget one.

At least for me the point is to not give gifts during 18-19 years so if you add that up it will probably be about 3000 USD in the end with market gains.

Gronnie

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6398 on: April 18, 2021, 01:21:06 PM »
I'm confused -- why would you send the money to the parent(s) instead of the now adult directly?

Segare

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #6399 on: April 19, 2021, 09:18:35 AM »
Not a family member: an ex (you'll see why quickly) had said she was more used to someone who spent more money on her. The kicker was, weeks earlier she was complaining that her ex had left her with ~8k in credit card debt (aka they had a joint card, and that was how 'he' was spending money on her).

I had an ex break up with me over money after dating for about 6 months.  She figured out that we both spent about the same annually but I made a little over twice what she did.  She said that me hoarding money like that was just greedy and she thought she was dating someone with a better sense of the purpose of money.  Wow, and here I thought my $42k/yr spend rate created quite the cushy life.

Wow, I would think someone with a little bit of intelligence would start to think of the value of your savings going down the road.  I bet you are grateful you didn't end up with her.