Author Topic: Relatives who just don't get it  (Read 3464317 times)

Goldielocks

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5950 on: July 15, 2020, 05:35:34 PM »
If for some reason I absolutely had to get rid of my wood siding, I'd go with stucco instead.  It comes pre-tinted, so don't even have to paint it.

The more recent stucco is glorified papier-m‚chť over chicken wire. Nearly impossible to maintain especially on walls or parapets. Don't do it. Brick, for example, would be a far better choice.
Agree. This is "synthetic stucco" and is a major category of construction defects. Basically if it's not done perfectly, you're asking for mold.
I imagine it works great in arid climates.  (Arizona, parts of California and Nevada, etc).
« Last Edit: July 16, 2020, 09:26:23 AM by Goldielocks »

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5951 on: July 15, 2020, 08:43:23 PM »
If for some reason I absolutely had to get rid of my wood siding, I'd go with stucco instead.  It comes pre-tinted, so don't even have to paint it.

The more recent stucco is glorified papier-m‚chť over chicken wire. Nearly impossible to maintain especially on walls or parapets. Don't do it. Brick, for example, would be a far better choice.
Not true for commercial sites. Just find a good contractor that knows how to do stucco right and will do it in three steps. Done right, stucco lasts forever.

ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5952 on: July 15, 2020, 11:26:21 PM »
I didnít realize there was fake stucco out there. The house I grew up in has stucco and     at 40 years old has had zero maintenance aside from a paint job or two (for cosmetic purposes).

ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5953 on: July 15, 2020, 11:26:21 PM »
I didnít realize there was fake stucco out there. The house I grew up in has stucco and     at 40 years old has had zero maintenance aside from a paint job or two (for cosmetic purposes).

Dave1442397

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5954 on: July 16, 2020, 06:45:57 AM »
My friend lives in an early-2000s development with stucco exteriors. After noticing some moisture around window sills, he had it checked out. $70,000 later, his house was fixed.

It turned out that all the houses were having the same issue, and now there's a class action lawsuit against the builder, which will probably go nowhere. My friend stayed out of the lawsuit, and decided to just get it fixed.

Just Joe

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5955 on: July 16, 2020, 08:37:01 AM »
I'd like to tear the vinyl siding off of our house and put back wood or concrete siding despite the higher maintenance BUT one end of the house is three stories. I'm not climbing ladders that tall. If anything I'd rent a cherry picker or buy a set of scaffolding and store it in our barn.

I like the hardy-board planks because they don't rot.   Really easy to install and work with if you use the gecko clamps to hold the planks in the right spot.
We put them on part of the outside of one of our rentals.  They went up REALLY fast until I had to start climbing up the ladder.   So easy to do a good job with that people driving thru the neighborhood would stop and try to hire me to do their house.    If I didn't have a day job I could have effectively gotten that siding on my house for free. :)

If you don't want to do the work 3 stories up, consider doing all the work up to the height you feel comfortable at and hire the rest.

Good idea. If nothing else I think I might use hardy board on the dormers this year and work my way around the house with hardy-boards next year.

JoJo

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5956 on: July 17, 2020, 06:53:17 PM »
Holy Cow...   just discovered my sister, who's worked at a very good company for 20+ years, hasn't put a penny in 401K, Roth IRA,  any funds, etc.   She's 44 years old and literally has no clue what an index fund is.  Yet her "stay at home" husband of 20+ years has had plenty of money for guns, trucks, RVs they barely used, upgrading their house every few years, his start up mechanic garage (he wanted to fix cars but then was mad when people wanted to pick up their car at 9pm and gave that up after less than 2 years, didn't come close to breaking even on all the gear he bought), he recently spent $hundreds on fireworks for the 4th.    So... this guy who spends all day "studying" stuff on the internet... like about how bad immuizations are, how planned parenthood sells baby parts, how Christmas is a pagan holiday, that soon we will have a race war and they'll have to create a militia to fight against the government,  yadda, yadda, couldn't spend a couple hours learning about investments and setting a little bit of the money that she earned or my parents gifted them aside. 
Luckily, I was looking at her benefits and it looks like she has a pension.   But at 43, she is having health problems that may limit her ability to continue working there. 
The good news is that she asked for advice, so I'm trying to get her to do the 401K to matching and a Roth at Vangard or Fidelity if she has any left over.   But to think of the thousands of dollars of matching and gains she lost over 20 years makes me sad.

ixtap

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5957 on: July 17, 2020, 06:56:43 PM »
I don't think you want that gullible guy 'researching' what to do with money!

six-car-habit

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5958 on: July 17, 2020, 08:53:30 PM »
Holy Cow...   just discovered my sister, who's worked at a very good company for 20+ years, hasn't put a penny in 401K, Roth IRA,  any funds, etc.   She's 44 years old and literally has no clue what an index fund is.  Yet her "stay at home" husband of 20+ years has had plenty of money for guns, trucks, RVs they barely used, upgrading their house every few years, his start up mechanic garage (he wanted to fix cars but then was mad when people wanted to pick up their car at 9pm and gave that up after less than 2 years, didn't come close to breaking even on all the gear he bought), he recently spent $hundreds on fireworks for the 4th.    So... this guy who spends all day "studying" stuff on the internet... like about how bad immuizations are, how planned parenthood sells baby parts, how Christmas is a pagan holiday, that soon we will have a race war and they'll have to create a militia to fight against the government,  yadda, yadda, couldn't spend a couple hours learning about investments and setting a little bit of the money that she earned or my parents gifted them aside. 
Luckily, I was looking at her benefits and it looks like she has a pension.   But at 43, she is having health problems that may limit her ability to continue working there. 
The good news is that she asked for advice, so I'm trying to get her to do the 401K to matching and a Roth at Vangard or Fidelity if she has any left over.   But to think of the thousands of dollars of matching and gains she lost over 20 years makes me sad.

  Well at least your Brother-in-law has been living his life enjoying the best of 1st world "freedoms" these last 20 yrs.... at what sounds like minimal  physical or mental exertion on his part. Not much grinding him down over his working lifetime.
 

iris lily

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5959 on: July 18, 2020, 07:50:53 AM »
I'd like to tear the vinyl siding off of our house and put back wood or concrete siding despite the higher maintenance BUT one end of the house is three stories. I'm not climbing ladders that tall. If anything I'd rent a cherry picker or buy a set of scaffolding and store it in our barn.

I like the hardy-board planks because they don't rot.   Really easy to install and work with if you use the gecko clamps to hold the planks in the right spot.
We put them on part of the outside of one of our rentals.  They went up REALLY fast until I had to start climbing up the ladder.   So easy to do a good job with that people driving thru the neighborhood would stop and try to hire me to do their house.    If I didn't have a day job I could have effectively gotten that siding on my house for free. :)

If you don't want to do the work 3 stories up, consider doing all the work up to the height you feel comfortable at and hire the rest.

Unfortunately Cement Fibre planks and sheets do rot since they replaced the asbestos fibre with wood fibre, so make sure they get a good coat of paint!

I have original asbestos/cement siding on my 1941 cottage and Iím smack dab in the middle of deciding if Iíll rip it all off and put up Hardie board, or will keep it.  Money is not an issue, my decision point is aesthetics.

We are doing major renovations to the house and I will have to figure out something to match that siding  if I keep it. There are copies on the market so it shouldnít be impossible to match it aesthetically. Also for the dormer that weíre making at the back of the house, that could be Hardieboard because it is a new structure that juts out.

My main reason for wanting to keep the asbestos siding is that it is original cladding for this 1941 cottage and I like the idea of that. While  I donít especially like the aesthetics of it, Iím trying to train my brain to find it acceptable. It is used in this area on this era of house.

Our insurance company doesnít mind asbestos and actually gave us a refund when it learned we have asbestos siding rather than vinyl. It is impervious to hail damage.

Iíve done some googling to find articles to convince me to keep the siding for aesthetic purposes and have not found them. I suspect I need to get into ďthis old houseď  type sites that will sell me on the idea of keeping the original cladding because the cladding does add so much to the originality of a structure, and I am all about keeping the cottage aspect of this funny little house.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2020, 09:18:20 AM by iris lily »

SwordGuy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5960 on: July 18, 2020, 09:03:57 AM »
I'd like to tear the vinyl siding off of our house and put back wood or concrete siding despite the higher maintenance BUT one end of the house is three stories. I'm not climbing ladders that tall. If anything I'd rent a cherry picker or buy a set of scaffolding and store it in our barn.

I like the hardy-board planks because they don't rot.   Really easy to install and work with if you use the gecko clamps to hold the planks in the right spot.
We put them on part of the outside of one of our rentals.  They went up REALLY fast until I had to start climbing up the ladder.   So easy to do a good job with that people driving thru the neighborhood would stop and try to hire me to do their house.    If I didn't have a day job I could have effectively gotten that siding on my house for free. :)

If you don't want to do the work 3 stories up, consider doing all the work up to the height you feel comfortable at and hire the rest.

Unfortunately Cement Fibre planks and sheets do rot since they replaced the asbestos fibre with wood fibre, so make sure they get a good coat of paint!

I have original asbestos/cement siding on my 1941 cottage and Iím smack dab in the middle of deciding if Iíll rip it all off and put up hardy board, or will keep it.  Money is not an issue, my decision point is aesthetics.

We are doing major renovations to the house and I will have to figure out something to match that siding  if I keep it. There are copies on the market so it shouldnít be impossible to match it aesthetically. Also for the dormer that weíre making at the back of the house that could  Logically be Hardieboard because it is a new structure that juts out.

My main reason for wanting to keep the asbestos siding is that it is original cladding for this 1941 cottage and I like the idea of that. While  I donít especially like the aesthetics of it, Iím trying to train my brain to find it acceptable. It is used in this area on this era of house.

Our insurance company doesnít mind asbestos and actually gave us a refund when it learned we have asbestos siding rather than vinyl. It is impervious to hail damage.

Iíve done some googling to find articles to convince me to keep the siding for aesthetic purposes and have not found them. I suspect I need to get into ďthis old houseď  type sites that will sell me on the idea of keeping the original cladding bit. Because the cladding does add so much to the originality of a structure, and I am all about keeping the cottage aspect of this funny little house.

I know there are non-asbestos shingles that are made to look like asbestos shingles.    We used some on a recent flip house to make repairs, since some of the original shingles were broken.    Make sure you specify whether you need straight or wavy on the bottom edge.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2020, 09:56:22 AM by SwordGuy »

TomTX

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5961 on: July 18, 2020, 09:10:11 AM »
If for some reason I absolutely had to get rid of my wood siding, I'd go with stucco instead.  It comes pre-tinted, so don't even have to paint it.

The more recent stucco is glorified papier-m‚chť over chicken wire. Nearly impossible to maintain especially on walls or parapets. Don't do it. Brick, for example, would be a far better choice.

Agree. This is "synthetic stucco" and is a major category of construction defects. Basically if it's not done perfectly, you're asking for mold.

Are you referring to EIFS?  Modern installations should have a drainage plane to deal with any small infiltrations and does not need to be perfect.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exterior_insulation_finishing_system

Model96

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5962 on: July 18, 2020, 05:12:59 PM »
I'd like to tear the vinyl siding off of our house and put back wood or concrete siding despite the higher maintenance BUT one end of the house is three stories. I'm not climbing ladders that tall. If anything I'd rent a cherry picker or buy a set of scaffolding and store it in our barn.

I like the hardy-board planks because they don't rot.   Really easy to install and work with if you use the gecko clamps to hold the planks in the right spot.
We put them on part of the outside of one of our rentals.  They went up REALLY fast until I had to start climbing up the ladder.   So easy to do a good job with that people driving thru the neighborhood would stop and try to hire me to do their house.    If I didn't have a day job I could have effectively gotten that siding on my house for free. :)

If you don't want to do the work 3 stories up, consider doing all the work up to the height you feel comfortable at and hire the rest.

Unfortunately Cement Fibre planks and sheets do rot since they replaced the asbestos fibre with wood fibre, so make sure they get a good coat of paint!

I have original asbestos/cement siding on my 1941 cottage and Iím smack dab in the middle of deciding if Iíll rip it all off and put up Hardie board, or will keep it.  Money is not an issue, my decision point is aesthetics.

We are doing major renovations to the house and I will have to figure out something to match that siding  if I keep it. There are copies on the market so it shouldnít be impossible to match it aesthetically. Also for the dormer that weíre making at the back of the house, that could be Hardieboard because it is a new structure that juts out.

My main reason for wanting to keep the asbestos siding is that it is original cladding for this 1941 cottage and I like the idea of that. While  I donít especially like the aesthetics of it, Iím trying to train my brain to find it acceptable. It is used in this area on this era of house.

Our insurance company doesnít mind asbestos and actually gave us a refund when it learned we have asbestos siding rather than vinyl. It is impervious to hail damage.

Iíve done some googling to find articles to convince me to keep the siding for aesthetic purposes and have not found them. I suspect I need to get into ďthis old houseď  type sites that will sell me on the idea of keeping the original cladding because the cladding does add so much to the originality of a structure, and I am all about keeping the cottage aspect of this funny little house.

If the asbestos is in good condition and not crumbling it is probably best to leave it alone for the sake of originality especially if it adds value to the home.
If it's in poor condition or of no value, I would change it out before the cost of disposal goes crazy in your area. It's also an opportunity to improve the structure with a vapor permeable barrier and noise & thermal insulation etc

iris lily

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5963 on: July 18, 2020, 06:42:11 PM »
I'd like to tear the vinyl siding off of our house and put back wood or concrete siding despite the higher maintenance BUT one end of the house is three stories. I'm not climbing ladders that tall. If anything I'd rent a cherry picker or buy a set of scaffolding and store it in our barn.

I like the hardy-board planks because they don't rot.   Really easy to install and work with if you use the gecko clamps to hold the planks in the right spot.
We put them on part of the outside of one of our rentals.  They went up REALLY fast until I had to start climbing up the ladder.   So easy to do a good job with that people driving thru the neighborhood would stop and try to hire me to do their house.    If I didn't have a day job I could have effectively gotten that siding on my house for free. :)

If you don't want to do the work 3 stories up, consider doing all the work up to the height you feel comfortable at and hire the rest.

Unfortunately Cement Fibre planks and sheets do rot since they replaced the asbestos fibre with wood fibre, so make sure they get a good coat of paint!

I have original asbestos/cement siding on my 1941 cottage and Iím smack dab in the middle of deciding if Iíll rip it all off and put up Hardie board, or will keep it.  Money is not an issue, my decision point is aesthetics.

We are doing major renovations to the house and I will have to figure out something to match that siding  if I keep it. There are copies on the market so it shouldnít be impossible to match it aesthetically. Also for the dormer that weíre making at the back of the house, that could be Hardieboard because it is a new structure that juts out.

My main reason for wanting to keep the asbestos siding is that it is original cladding for this 1941 cottage and I like the idea of that. While  I donít especially like the aesthetics of it, Iím trying to train my brain to find it acceptable. It is used in this area on this era of house.

Our insurance company doesnít mind asbestos and actually gave us a refund when it learned we have asbestos siding rather than vinyl. It is impervious to hail damage.

Iíve done some googling to find articles to convince me to keep the siding for aesthetic purposes and have not found them. I suspect I need to get into ďthis old houseď  type sites that will sell me on the idea of keeping the original cladding because the cladding does add so much to the originality of a structure, and I am all about keeping the cottage aspect of this funny little house.

If the asbestos is in good condition and not crumbling it is probably best to leave it alone for the sake of originality especially if it adds value to the home.
If it's in poor condition or of no value, I would change it out before the cost of disposal goes crazy in your area. It's also an opportunity to improve the structure with a vapor permeable barrier and noise & thermal insulation etc

I suspect it does not add to the value of this house, although the asbestos tiles are in decent condition, only a handful are cracked.

I had not thought about how new siding would offer better barriers. Iím sure DH and the contractor wouldíve addressed that though. I was considering it thoroughly from the point of view of aesthetics since I know neither one of them will consider that.

But you are probably right that taking the $79,000 cottage, dumping 150,000+  into it, Not improving these barriers may be silly so now Iím back to yes letís put up Hardieboard.

ixtap

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5964 on: July 18, 2020, 07:20:59 PM »
So now orange foam contains asbestos?

Just Joe

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5965 on: July 20, 2020, 07:37:08 AM »
I don't think you want that gullible guy 'researching' what to do with money!

Buy these "rare" gold (plated) coins. Just $XXX and $29.95 shipping and handling... Each month we'll send you the next coin in this 250 theme coin collection. If you buy all of them we'll send you for free the cardboard display case. Call now! But wait... If you call now... Don't wait!

Its a shame that they spend their days goofing off rather than helping their spouse earn a living. Maybe they have some mental health issues? I have a relative that is surely dealing with mild depression that seems to prevent keeping a job.

Njdealguy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5966 on: July 20, 2020, 01:47:48 PM »
Have a brother in law who pays 6% interest on a mortgage with about 15 years remaining and refuses to refinance even though can easily get 2.5% interest 15 year fixed rate mortgage now with no closing costs.  Reason is thinks that besides the "hassles" is he gets to deduct more interest on his tax return on what is paying now while ignoring when I explained that even with the tax deduction is still paying a lot more overall every year.

Besides this also paid $60 per person for a family of 3 for some premium lounge access at Hong Kong airport while transitting even though has a priority pass card from one of his credit cards that would've included access to the exact same freaking lounge at no cost (And argued with me, wouldn't listen when I explained this once again). 

He keeps getting the latest IPhones for himself and wife every year and keeps all the old ones (not sell or trade in) as claims somehow all their personal data can somehow be extracted even if does a factory reset on the phones. 

Pays for premium gas for a Honda Accord (car will "run better" as per him).  This is besides a bunch of other things I've observed them do over the years, somehow finds ways to spend money I didnt think possible, and believes that everything is automatically better by spending more money in any case! 

All this on less than a third of our annual income which for them is barely above 6 figures.

ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5967 on: July 20, 2020, 02:29:48 PM »
Wow. It would be so hard to not want to just bang your head against the wall for stupid stuff like that.

Njdealguy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5968 on: July 20, 2020, 02:39:23 PM »
Have a brother in law who pays 6% interest on a mortgage with about 15 years remaining and refuses to refinance even though can easily get 2.5% interest 15 year fixed rate mortgage now with no closing costs.  Reason is thinks that besides the "hassles" is he gets to deduct more interest on his tax return on what is paying now while ignoring when I explained that even with the tax deduction is still paying a lot more overall every year.

Besides this also paid $60 per person for a family of 3 for some premium lounge access at Hong Kong airport while transitting even though has a priority pass card from one of his credit cards that would've included access to the exact same freaking lounge at no cost (And argued with me, wouldn't listen when I explained this once again). 

He keeps getting the latest IPhones for himself and wife every year and keeps all the old ones (not sell or trade in) as claims somehow all their personal data can somehow be extracted even if does a factory reset on the phones. 

Pays for premium gas for a Honda Accord (car will "run better" as per him).  This is besides a bunch of other things I've observed them do over the years, somehow finds ways to spend money I didnt think possible, and believes that everything is automatically better by spending more money in any case! 

All this on less than a third of our annual income which for them is barely above 6 figures.

Forgot to mention another good one, for a weekend family trip rented a minivan from his local Hertz car rental for about $650 (plus probably a whole bunch more to buy their insurance as thinks the credit card ones wont cover his ass) for I think 4 or 5 days while a Alamo place about 15 miles from his home had the same type of car for same period available for about $250.  Difference was Hertz would pick up/drop off from his home while Alamo did not.....so just refused to be hassled in any way, couldve taken a uber ride to Alamo and still came out ahead.   Gives almost no regards to costs and will pay anything if means avoiding the slightest of hassles!  If I owned a business, would love to get customers like him :)
« Last Edit: July 20, 2020, 02:42:11 PM by Njdealguy »

Roadrunner53

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5969 on: August 09, 2020, 04:57:58 PM »
This is something I may have mentioned a while back but there are too many pages to look back so I will just repeat myself if I did. Some relatives, years ago, were approached to buy into a freezer plan. I am sure this doesn't exist anymore. So they buy into this. The plan delivers a upright freezer and they were grilled on what they eat, how much per week and then presented with the cost of the meat and a finance plan. The meat in the freezer was supposed to last maybe 6-8 weeks. I am not sure of the details. Well, the freezer gets delivered, the meat arrives and the freezer is filled to the brim. They must have thought they went to hog heaven and began devouring the meat like starving animals. They were cooking steaks for breakfast! They gobbled up all the meat in maybe 3 weeks time or less. So now the food that was supposed to last 6 or 8 weeks was gone. They then had 5 weeks before the next delivery would come and they had to still pay for the meat and freezer in monthly payments. So, they had to go to the grocery store to buy more food. I don't know all the details but I am sure they didn't keep up with the payments. Not sure if the freezer was repo'd or not but probably! These are the same people that frittered their money away in other stupid ways and didn't pay their electric bill or oil bill and would run out of oil and got the electric shut off. OMG! Really...eating steak for breakfast when you can't pay your electric bill! They would eat at the local diner all the time later on in life when they could have been frugal to eat at home! It just never ended! One of their children had to try to get them out of debt and I think it was a home equity loan but they never, ever changed their ways.

Dicey

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5970 on: August 09, 2020, 09:30:16 PM »
Have a brother in law who pays 6% interest on a mortgage with about 15 years remaining and refuses to refinance even though can easily get 2.5% interest 15 year fixed rate mortgage now with no closing costs.  Reason is thinks that besides the "hassles" is he gets to deduct more interest on his tax return on what is paying now while ignoring when I explained that even with the tax deduction is still paying a lot more overall every year.

Besides this also paid $60 per person for a family of 3 for some premium lounge access at Hong Kong airport while transitting even though has a priority pass card from one of his credit cards that would've included access to the exact same freaking lounge at no cost (And argued with me, wouldn't listen when I explained this once again). 

He keeps getting the latest IPhones for himself and wife every year and keeps all the old ones (not sell or trade in) as claims somehow all their personal data can somehow be extracted even if does a factory reset on the phones. 

Pays for premium gas for a Honda Accord (car will "run better" as per him).  This is besides a bunch of other things I've observed them do over the years, somehow finds ways to spend money I didnt think possible, and believes that everything is automatically better by spending more money in any case! 

All this on less than a third of our annual income which for them is barely above 6 figures.
For your own sanity, just look away. Really, you need to stop noticing this shit. It isn't worth the aggravation it's causing you. He's never going to change, and you have a million things better to spend every iota of your life energy on.

I understand the purpose of this thread. Perhaps I'm wrong, but it seems this idiot's idiocy gets under your skin a bit. Don't let it.

Just Joe

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5971 on: August 10, 2020, 01:09:10 PM »
Sometimes feels good to unload though. Sort of a "do you see what I see?" moment. ;)

onehair

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5972 on: August 18, 2020, 11:26:05 AM »
Ahhh new entries.  I haven't been posting since this forum was saved at my work computer and I just now got back to work..partially..Covid has really put a crimp in plans in general hasn't it?  Anyway I have been still living with my financial that doesn't get it..and after a nearly a year and a half of paying no bills at all he paid $1000 towards our current rent of $1303.  Ironically that put us into credit status since I had prepaid $703 of it during the month of July. 

SunnyDays

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5973 on: August 18, 2020, 05:16:25 PM »
This is something I may have mentioned a while back but there are too many pages to look back so I will just repeat myself if I did. Some relatives, years ago, were approached to buy into a freezer plan. I am sure this doesn't exist anymore. So they buy into this. The plan delivers a upright freezer and they were grilled on what they eat, how much per week and then presented with the cost of the meat and a finance plan. The meat in the freezer was supposed to last maybe 6-8 weeks. I am not sure of the details. Well, the freezer gets delivered, the meat arrives and the freezer is filled to the brim. They must have thought they went to hog heaven and began devouring the meat like starving animals. They were cooking steaks for breakfast! They gobbled up all the meat in maybe 3 weeks time or less. So now the food that was supposed to last 6 or 8 weeks was gone. They then had 5 weeks before the next delivery would come and they had to still pay for the meat and freezer in monthly payments. So, they had to go to the grocery store to buy more food. I don't know all the details but I am sure they didn't keep up with the payments. Not sure if the freezer was repo'd or not but probably! These are the same people that frittered their money away in other stupid ways and didn't pay their electric bill or oil bill and would run out of oil and got the electric shut off. OMG! Really...eating steak for breakfast when you can't pay your electric bill! They would eat at the local diner all the time later on in life when they could have been frugal to eat at home! It just never ended! One of their children had to try to get them out of debt and I think it was a home equity loan but they never, ever changed their ways.

Some people just canít think beyond the present moment.

Dicey

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5974 on: August 19, 2020, 05:57:18 AM »
Ahhh new entries.  I haven't been posting since this forum was saved at my work computer and I just now got back to work..partially..Covid has really put a crimp in plans in general hasn't it?  Anyway I have been still living with my financial that doesn't get it..and after a nearly a year and a half of paying no bills at all he paid $1000 towards our current rent of $1303.  Ironically that put us into credit status since I had prepaid $703 of it during the month of July.
Not sure what you mean by "my financial", but pretty sure it's not something good for you...

Bettersafe

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5975 on: August 19, 2020, 12:25:16 PM »
Ahhh new entries.  I haven't been posting since this forum was saved at my work computer and I just now got back to work..partially..Covid has really put a crimp in plans in general hasn't it?  Anyway I have been still living with my financial that doesn't get it..and after a nearly a year and a half of paying no bills at all he paid $1000 towards our current rent of $1303.  Ironically that put us into credit status since I had prepaid $703 of it during the month of July.
Not sure what you mean by "my financial", but pretty sure it's not something good for you...

I second Dicey on this....

Plina

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5976 on: August 19, 2020, 01:15:59 PM »
Ahhh new entries.  I haven't been posting since this forum was saved at my work computer and I just now got back to work..partially..Covid has really put a crimp in plans in general hasn't it?  Anyway I have been still living with my financial that doesn't get it..and after a nearly a year and a half of paying no bills at all he paid $1000 towards our current rent of $1303.  Ironically that put us into credit status since I had prepaid $703 of it during the month of July.
Not sure what you mean by "my financial", but pretty sure it's not something good for you...

I second Dicey on this....

I guessed it was her fiance, that she seems to be supporting. Based on that he doesnít pay for anything I can agree on the not good part.

Model96

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5977 on: August 19, 2020, 04:20:26 PM »
Ahhh new entries.  I haven't been posting since this forum was saved at my work computer and I just now got back to work..partially..Covid has really put a crimp in plans in general hasn't it?  Anyway I have been still living with my financial that doesn't get it..and after a nearly a year and a half of paying no bills at all he paid $1000 towards our current rent of $1303.  Ironically that put us into credit status since I had prepaid $703 of it during the month of July.
Not sure what you mean by "my financial", but pretty sure it's not something good for you...

I second Dicey on this....

I guessed it was her fiance, that she seems to be supporting. Based on that he doesnít pay for anything I can agree on the not good part.

'Fiance' or 'financial'.........auto correct strikes again or is it a Freudian?? LoL

marty998

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5978 on: August 19, 2020, 04:28:30 PM »
Ahhh new entries.  I haven't been posting since this forum was saved at my work computer and I just now got back to work..partially..Covid has really put a crimp in plans in general hasn't it?  Anyway I have been still living with my financial that doesn't get it..and after a nearly a year and a half of paying no bills at all he paid $1000 towards our current rent of $1303.  Ironically that put us into credit status since I had prepaid $703 of it during the month of July.
Not sure what you mean by "my financial", but pretty sure it's not something good for you...

I second Dicey on this....

I guessed it was her fiance, that she seems to be supporting. Based on that he doesnít pay for anything I can agree on the not good part.

'Fiance' or 'financial'.........auto correct strikes again or is it a Freudian?? LoL

ďLiabilityĒ works as a nickname here!

LetItGrow

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5979 on: September 13, 2020, 08:02:19 PM »
Sis and I received a low six figure inheritance in 2004. Her husband recently remarked (with a bit of attitude) 'you probably still have every dollar' I didnít reply but thought 'true, and every one of those dollars now has a couple friends around'.

I think they are decently smart, but not sure. And most importantly I donít care. I only talk to them when I have to, which is not often.

SwordGuy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5980 on: September 13, 2020, 08:08:47 PM »
Sis and I received a low six figure inheritance in 2004. Her husband recently remarked (with a bit of attitude) 'you probably still have every dollar' I didnít reply but thought 'true, and every one of those dollars now has a couple friends around'.

I don't care when people want to spend their money on things they enjoy rather than save and invest it. 

But it's annoying as hell to get the jealous attitude from folks who did that and grudge that you didn't.

AMandM

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5981 on: September 14, 2020, 08:57:24 AM »
Sis and I received a low six figure inheritance in 2004. Her husband recently remarked (with a bit of attitude) 'you probably still have every dollar' I didn’t reply but thought 'true, and every one of those dollars now has a couple friends around'.

I don't care when people want to spend their money on things they enjoy rather than save and invest it. 

But it's annoying as hell to get the jealous attitude from folks who did that and grudge that you didn't.

I assumed the attitude was contempt, not jealousy. Which is also annoying.

SwordGuy

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5982 on: September 14, 2020, 10:04:40 AM »
Sis and I received a low six figure inheritance in 2004. Her husband recently remarked (with a bit of attitude) 'you probably still have every dollar' I didnít reply but thought 'true, and every one of those dollars now has a couple friends around'.

I don't care when people want to spend their money on things they enjoy rather than save and invest it. 

But it's annoying as hell to get the jealous attitude from folks who did that and grudge that you didn't.

I assumed the attitude was contempt, not jealousy. Which is also annoying.

Wow.   Anyone that petulantly stupid quickly
 goes on on my "don't give a damn about" list.    Shame about your sister being married to him.

jinga nation

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5983 on: September 17, 2020, 02:25:32 PM »
Sis and I received a low six figure inheritance in 2004. Her husband recently remarked (with a bit of attitude) 'you probably still have every dollar' I didnít reply but thought 'true, and every one of those dollars now has a couple friends around'.

I don't care when people want to spend their money on things they enjoy rather than save and invest it. 

But it's annoying as hell to get the jealous attitude from folks who did that and grudge that you didn't.

I assumed the attitude was contempt, not jealousy. Which is also annoying.

Wow.   Anyone that petulantly stupid quickly
 goes on on my "don't give a damn about" list.    Shame about your sister being married to him.

If I were @LetItGrow, and if the sister was within earshot, I'd say "It's a shame that she married someone dumber than a bag of rocks. At least rocks can be polished."

YYK

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5984 on: September 21, 2020, 04:27:42 PM »
Have a brother in law who pays 6% interest on a mortgage with about 15 years remaining and refuses to refinance even though can easily get 2.5% interest 15 year fixed rate mortgage now with no closing costs.  Reason is thinks that besides the "hassles" is he gets to deduct more interest on his tax return on what is paying now while ignoring when I explained that even with the tax deduction is still paying a lot more overall every year.

Besides this also paid $60 per person for a family of 3 for some premium lounge access at Hong Kong airport while transitting even though has a priority pass card from one of his credit cards that would've included access to the exact same freaking lounge at no cost (And argued with me, wouldn't listen when I explained this once again). 

He keeps getting the latest IPhones for himself and wife every year and keeps all the old ones (not sell or trade in) as claims somehow all their personal data can somehow be extracted even if does a factory reset on the phones. 

Pays for premium gas for a Honda Accord (car will "run better" as per him).  This is besides a bunch of other things I've observed them do over the years, somehow finds ways to spend money I didnt think possible, and believes that everything is automatically better by spending more money in any case! 

All this on less than a third of our annual income which for them is barely above 6 figures.

I know someone who has a similar attitude, though not nearly to the same degree. "This costs a lot of money, so it's better!" ???

TomTX

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5985 on: September 21, 2020, 07:01:41 PM »
"You would rather pay the bank $3 to avoid paying $1 in taxes? How does that work out?"

gatortator

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5986 on: September 22, 2020, 07:09:18 PM »
"You would rather pay the bank $3 to avoid paying $1 in taxes? How does that work out?"

Tax wise but fee foolish.

 We have family who are shining examples of this thought process.  23 year old me paid attention and learned from their mistakes but sadly they never did.

Silverwood

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5987 on: September 25, 2020, 01:52:28 PM »
My brother lost his license and the guy who drives him to work is sick this week. So he messaged me asking if i wanted to make some money. Cab ride is $20 one way.  I figured if he gave me $20 which would pay for gas thatd be good enough. Family discount and all that.

Well today is Friday and i have yet to see any money. I drove him to the bank to deposit money after work. Didnt see a dime then. Drove him to McDonald's for food. He complained about our dollar compared to the States  after ordering $300 in vitamins. Last night he cabbed home after going out for wings with the boys. Complained about wasting food from his $80 dollar/week food delivery box.

Did i mention im on mat leave and am budgeted down to the last dollar.  Im not asking for  the money. Id even be ok if he said hed help me out on the weekend with some projects im finishing. But nope he will end up being too busy.

Last time I fall for this. Its  because im excited to see him. Im bored at home and its not a big deal to drive him. But i cant handle his entitlement and lack of self awareness anymore.

sherr

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5988 on: September 25, 2020, 02:35:09 PM »
My brother lost his license and the guy who drives him to work is sick this week. So he messaged me asking if i wanted to make some money. Cab ride is $20 one way.  I figured if he gave me $20 which would pay for gas thatd be good enough. Family discount and all that.

Well today is Friday and i have yet to see any money. I drove him to the bank to deposit money after work. Didnt see a dime then. Drove him to McDonald's for food. He complained about our dollar compared to the States  after ordering $300 in vitamins. Last night he cabbed home after going out for wings with the boys. Complained about wasting food from his $80 dollar/week food delivery box.

Did i mention im on mat leave and am budgeted down to the last dollar.  Im not asking for  the money. Id even be ok if he said hed help me out on the weekend with some projects im finishing. But nope he will end up being too busy.

Last time I fall for this. Its  because im excited to see him. Im bored at home and its not a big deal to drive him. But i cant handle his entitlement and lack of self awareness anymore.

Wait, did you ask for $20, or just assume that he'd give it to you? I mean I guess that if he asked you if you "wanted to make some money" then he ought to give you something sometime. But beyond that I'd say you're 49% to blame here for not specifying things beforehand and then being mad when your expectations are not met. Next time just be specific and communicate your expectations and it won't blow up into a whole "thing".
« Last Edit: September 25, 2020, 03:05:23 PM by sherr »

Silverwood

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5989 on: September 25, 2020, 02:59:07 PM »
We talked about it. He told me cabs are $20.  He was the one who texted me asking if i wanted to make some money for this week.  He said hed rather pay me than pay a cab


Also its not a thing. Its not worth it to me to make it a big deal. I was mostly venting here because he just doesnt get it. Hes 35.  I said i would do it.  I thought he would give me something because of the way he worded it.  Since he didnt, i just adjust for next time. Meaning i wont do it.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2020, 03:03:35 PM by Silverwood »

chrisgermany

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5990 on: September 26, 2020, 12:24:55 AM »
Ask him for the money. You also should have told him you'd be happy for the leftovers of the food box.
Give him the chance to improve.
 It is not a big thing to nicely remind him next time you see him.

alienbogey

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5991 on: October 04, 2020, 09:37:03 AM »
This post is to provide some follow up to the post quoted below that I made some time ago. 

The original is long, so Cliff Notes:  Financially responsible son marries financially horribly irresponsible woman, she prevails, they rack up tens of thousands in debt and end up in a significantly negative monthly cash flow situation.  We rescue them and set them up in a living situation that will allow them to save their sinking financial ship, if they will only do so.

Note:  This saga from parental rescue to today takes place over 2.5 years.

I could write a long essay but instead I'll give the cliff notes.

Son (young 20's, no debt, savings, paid cash for used car) marries woman with issues but he loves her.  His call.  He has a strange inability to say no to her and she introduces him to spending.  It's like watching someone go from a gateway drug to harder stuff as they buy all kinds of crap including starting a collection of old video games.  He's in the service and they have a new child, he's getting out in a few weeks without a solid job lined up, AND THEY BUY A NEW CAR.

DIL quote #1:  "We bought it now because we know that no one will finance us once we get out of the military in two weeks."

Evil Manipulative Mother In Law (EMMIL) had visited for the birth of the child (staying in our home for 3 weeks) and now she begins an intensive campaign of manipulative emotional hostage taking along with outright factual lies to get the young family to move across the country to be closer to her.  It works, and they spend a crap ton of money (financed by selling son's paid-for car) to move to where education and job prospect pies-in-the-sky have been promised by EMMIL.  More poor financial decisions on housing (a too big house is rented), schooling (GI Bill tuition wasted), training for non-existent job prospects (lies by both PIL), etc. etc. 

Throughout this debacle we have offered our opinions when asked, sometimes not when asked, and then shut our mouths and watched the train wreck.  DIL has consistently ignored us and instead acted on her mother's advice.

Young family finally clues in about EMMIL and moves 5 states away, both taking low paying jobs but getting away from the poison. 

DIL quote #2:  "I guess we shouldn't have been taking financial advice from people [her parents] who have been bankrupt four times." 

 [And ignoring advice from her parents in law, us, who paid for college for kids with no loans required, have paid off their mortgage, have zero debt of any kind, and can retire any time they please.]

They finally start listening to us and opening their financial books.  Tons of debt (half student debt brought into the marriage), a monthly cash flow of -$500 and no way to fix that, behind on rent, utilities, etc.  They'll be living under an overpass in 6 months.

We bail them out enough to bring them home and get them into a living situation.  Son gets job and starts looking for a better one.  DIL re-passes her state boards and starts working part time.  They start listening to us on money.  A decision is made to not declare bankruptcy.  They work out repayment plans with creditors.  Credit cards save one are paid off and they're working on the last one.

And, lo & behold, it's DIL who has taken charge of the family finances and is doing all this.  There have been a few relapses (a $200 Christmas gift for hubby) but, by and large, she's shopping at thrift stores, clipping coupons, accumulating a small emergency fund, etc. etc.

DIL quote #3:  "I think in a few years we'll be able to start saving for a down payment."


There have been missteps along the way.  From another post of mine here on MMM from their narrative:

"Relatives:  Well into 5 digits of debt, at current income/spending levels will take approximately forever to pay off, husband recently couldn't get security clearance for significantly better job due to debt status.  Upon hearing our made-gently-as-possible suggestion that perhaps they don't need to go through case after case of carbonated, lightly flavored canned water, and that wife maybe doesn't actually NEED to buy enough ugly Christmas sweaters that she has a different one for each day of December (her stated goal), this was the reply:

"But we want to enjoy life." "

So, let's get caught up, shall we?  (I'll try to be brief.)

DIL was running the family finances and doing much, much better, but has a self-confessed impulse shopping/spending problem.  [Insert gigantic parental eye-roll here]  Finally, son re-assumed the Chancellor of the Exchequer role and things improved further.

DIL got a new and better paying job.  It's been a challenge for her, but she's doing well.  She recently passed her 90 day review with good comments from her boss.

They have been making all their payments, debt has steadily decreased, credit score is way, way up, and two weeks ago they closed on their first house.  They actually bought the place for $20k less than their maximum financed amount!  The trailer we had bought to house them on our property is cleaned up and for sale on craigslist.

We were at their new house for grandson's 5th birthday party and DIL was heard mentioning their overall budget, the amount she was allowed* to spend on party decorations, and regretted that she could only afford 2 balloons for the party.

*Note:  "Allowed" may sound patronizing but, believe me, this woman very, very, very much needs someone to corral her spending impulses. 

So, we're cautiously optimistic that they've patched the leaks, pumped the ship mostly dry, and will live happily ever after.




SunnyDays

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5992 on: October 04, 2020, 10:19:34 AM »
Hmmm.  Well, I hate to pop those two balloons, but chances are that DIL will feel increasingly resentful over time that she's being "allowed" to only spend so much on anything when she has her own income.  Unless she puts some effort into controlling her impulses herself and not just relying on your son to do it for her.  So far, so good, but only time will tell long term.

FlytilFIRE

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5993 on: October 04, 2020, 01:13:48 PM »
Hmmm.  Well, I hate to pop those two balloons, but chances are that DIL will feel increasingly resentful over time that she's being "allowed" to only spend so much on anything when she has her own income.  Unless she puts some effort into controlling her impulses herself and not just relying on your son to do it for her.  So far, so good, but only time will tell long term.

Not necessarily. Being able to sleep at night, knowing your bills are paid can be highly addictive. Hooray for them! At this stage, frequent positive reinforcement is encouraged, reminding the couple of how far they've come, and how proud of them you are.

There's no mention of a monthly "fun money" amount, which can also be really helpful. If she knows she'll have a certain amount to blow any way she wants, it can help ensure the rest of the budget stays intact.

Thanks for the update. So glad that things are moving forward.

DadJokes

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5994 on: October 04, 2020, 04:20:29 PM »
Hmmm.  Well, I hate to pop those two balloons, but chances are that DIL will feel increasingly resentful over time that she's being "allowed" to only spend so much on anything when she has her own income.  Unless she puts some effort into controlling her impulses herself and not just relying on your son to do it for her.  So far, so good, but only time will tell long term.

Yep, that's how I read that as well.

If she feels like they are deprived, then it's not going to last.

Kris

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5995 on: October 04, 2020, 04:25:31 PM »
Hmmm.  Well, I hate to pop those two balloons, but chances are that DIL will feel increasingly resentful over time that she's being "allowed" to only spend so much on anything when she has her own income.  Unless she puts some effort into controlling her impulses herself and not just relying on your son to do it for her.  So far, so good, but only time will tell long term.

Yep, that's how I read that as well.

If she feels like they are deprived, then it's not going to last.

Truth. She was either totally teasing, or not so much.

If itís the latter, I think that feeling will only get worse.

elaine amj

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5996 on: October 04, 2020, 09:31:01 PM »
I remember your stories about your son and DIL and am so very glad to hear the latest update that the ship continues to sail on calmer seas.

Sent from my VCE-AL00 using Tapatalk


ysette9

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5997 on: October 05, 2020, 01:44:17 PM »
It is nice to hear a positive update. Thanks for sharing.

Ideally I think each half of a couple should be responsible adults and have access and knowledge about the household finances. That is how it works between my husband and me.

But realistically I understand that some people arenít capable of that. With my parents my mother controls the money and my father gets a okay money allowance. They do discuss major things and make decisions together, but it was long ago decided that if he ran the finances they would be in debt, the way he was when the two of them met. Similarly my FIL had the impulse control and understanding of a child, so he got an allowance and my MIL controls it all. I am happy to be married to a more responsible person but I canít fault people for finding workarounds if their spouse has strengths elsewhere.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5998 on: October 05, 2020, 01:46:55 PM »
It is nice to hear a positive update. Thanks for sharing.

Ideally I think each half of a couple should be responsible adults and have access and knowledge about the household finances. That is how it works between my husband and me.

But realistically I understand that some people arenít capable of that...
There's also the matter of time--if one spouse is sufficiently responsible, the other can simply let them handle it, with period joint reviews, of course.

Zoot

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Re: Relatives who just don't get it
« Reply #5999 on: October 05, 2020, 03:13:00 PM »
Ideally I think each half of a couple should be responsible adults and have access and knowledge about the household finances. That is how it works between my husband and me.

But realistically I understand that some people arenít capable of that. With my parents my mother controls the money and my father gets a okay money allowance. They do discuss major things and make decisions together, but it was long ago decided that if he ran the finances they would be in debt, the way he was when the two of them met. Similarly my FIL had the impulse control and understanding of a child, so he got an allowance and my MIL controls it all.

This reminds me of a character from Jane Austen's Persuasion: Sir Walter Elliot, whose wife had, during her lifetime, managed the household efficiently and within-budget; upon her death, Sir Walter soon found himself in dire financial straits.  Rather than "retrench" (i.e., reduce expenses) in some thoughtful way, they think of MAYBE cutting off some charities, not re-doing the drawing room, or not giving the usual gift to the family middle daughter, Anne (the heroine of the novel): 

Quote from: Jane Austen
The Kellynch property was good, but not equal to Sir Walter's apprehension of the state required in its possessor. While Lady Elliot lived, there had been method, moderation, and economy, which had just kept him within his income; but with her had died all such right-mindedness, and from that period he had been constantly exceeding it. It had not been possible for him to spend less; he had done nothing but what Sir Walter Elliot was imperiously called on to do; but blameless as he was, he was not only growing dreadfully in debt, but was hearing of it so often, that it became vain to attempt concealing it longer, even partially, from his daughter. He had given her some hints of it the last spring in town; he had gone so far even as to say, "Can we retrench? Does it occur to you that there is any one article in which we can retrench?" and Elizabeth, to do her justice, had, in the first ardour of female alarm, set seriously to think what could be done, and had finally proposed these two branches of economy, to cut off some unnecessary charities, and to refrain from new furnishing the drawing-room; to which expedients she afterwards added the happy thought of their taking no present down to Anne, as had been the usual yearly custom. But these measures, however good in themselves, were insufficient for the real extent of the evil, the whole of which Sir Walter found himself obliged to confess to her soon afterwards. Elizabeth had nothing to propose of deeper efficacy. She felt herself ill-used and unfortunate, as did her father; and they were neither of them able to devise any means of lessening their expenses without compromising their dignity, or relinquishing their comforts in a way not to be borne.

There was only a small part of his estate that Sir Walter could dispose of; but had every acre been alienable, it would have made no difference. He had condescended to mortgage as far as he had the power, but he would never condescend to sell. No; he would never disgrace his name so far. The Kellynch estate should be transmitted whole and entire, as he had received it.

Their two confidential friends, Mr Shepherd, who lived in the neighbouring market town, and Lady Russell, were called to advise them; and both father and daughter seemed to expect that something should be struck out by one or the other to remove their embarrassments and reduce their expenditure, without involving the loss of any indulgence of taste or pride.

(edit: spelling, syntax)
« Last Edit: October 05, 2020, 03:21:51 PM by Zoot »