Two Years of Nest Ownership Later...

[adam]

I was trying to figure out the best sub forum for this post and I think wall of shame is probably appropriate.

I received a Nest programmable thermostat for Christmas in 2012. Installed that month so starting January 2013 I have (one month less than) two years of statistics.

I've lost money.

Yeah there are a ton of variables to take into account, but the bottom line is I've spent more on electricity in the two years following than I did before I had a nest.  First, the excuses!

In 2013 we had 34 days where the temp went over 90 degrees, 164 over 80 degrees.  This is important because the bulk of my electrical usage is for AC in the summer months.

In 2014 we had 75 days where the temp went over 90 degrees, 177 over 80 degrees.

In 2015 we had 56 days where the temp went over 90 degrees, 161 over 80 degrees.  (minus December)

So you could say its been hotter.  June, July, and August are the only months that push us over 1000kwh.  In each year for those three months we used:
2013 = 3312
2014 = 3450
2015 = 3554

vs total yearly usage for reference:
2013 = 9259
2014 = 9343
2015 = 9959 (missing Dec, assumed 703kwh based on my previous avgs)

So 25% of the year uses 35%+ of my total yearly electricity.

In 2013 my wife worked more or less full time from what I remember, so two of us would be out of the house for 8 hours, allowing me to actually use the programability of the programmable thermostat to greater effect.  In 2014 she started working 4 hours a day.  She wasn't into me cranking up the temp in the summer when she was at home doing chores.  Who knew? (I would still program it to raise/lower the temp for the 4 hours she was gone, and at night, etc).

Maybe also we became a little more lax on 'putting up with' higher/lower temps in the house.  Hard to say there.  Maybe we got soft?  I don't know that we consciously changed any behaviors that caused the increased usage, so I'll just blame the higher temperature.

Excuse time over.  Whats the damage?

If you didn't do the math yourself from above:
2013 vs 2014: 84 more KWH (+$11.70 at today's rates)
2013 vs 2015: 705 more KHW (+$98.27 at today's rates)

Its not the end of the world, but maybe someone that wants to drop $200+ on a fancy t-stat should consider that it might not be the magic bullet to lowering your electricity bill.  It hasn't even paid for itself.

Your mileage may vary.



Note on temperature I found interesting:
-Both 2014 and 2015 were colder in the winter and hotter in the summer than 2013. Sometimes as much as 5-6 degrees difference as measured by the power company (avg local temp for the billing period).  Except this "winter".  Its was 5 degrees warmer this November and I imagine December will be the same.  My AC came on YESTERDAY (for all of 15 minutes, if I had known I would have just turned it off). It was 80 on Sunday.

[adam]

And just because I can track these too:
2014: 131 Nest Leafs earned
2015: 259 + 15 so far in December = 274 Nest Leafs earned as of 12.15.2015

[slugline]

Important question: What kind of thermostat did you have before the Nest? If it was also programmable I could easily see how this would be disappointing. I replaced the dumb thermostat that was in my home with a programmable one and the payback period was just a couple of months. It wasn't a Nest so I'm sure that accelerated the payback.

[AlanStache]

Does not matter how much smarts are behind turning the AC on, having the AC on uses power.  Only way to save power is to have the AC off and if someone is mostly home then the AC will be mostly on and you dont be saving much. 

We have a dumb thermostat that will be replaced someday after the much bigger fish are fried.

[adam]

Important question: What kind of thermostat did you have before the Nest? If it was also programmable I could easily see how this would be disappointing. I replaced the dumb thermostat that was in my home with a programmable one and the payback period was just a couple of months. It wasn't a Nest so I'm sure that accelerated the payback.

It was just a dumb t-stat that came with the house when I built it.  I typically just set it and forgot it, unless going out of town or something like that.

[robartsd]

For someone who would not program/manually adjust a thermostat, the Nest provides much (perhaps not all) the savings of programming/adjusting "automatically" - thus saving consumer suckas a bit of money over time. Mustachians would likely buy the cheapest programable thermostat that meats their needs (even if programing the dang thing is a PITA - you don't need to do it that often), super frugal people will just go with a cheap manually adjusted thermostat and religiously adjust the setting as they wake/retire and come/go.

[ABC123]

We have a "dumb" thermostat.  I have a normal, Monday through Friday standard hours job.  But he works at a hotel so his hours are all over the place.  When he leaves the house, he adjusts the thermostat.  When I get home, I change it back.  Since there are no set hours when the house is empty, there would not be any way to program it.  So really, this sort of thing is not for everyone.  But in any case, trying to compare this year's usage to last year's may not be overly helpful since the weather was so different.  Did having it programmed cause you to use less electricity than you would have used if it wasn't programmed?  Then you are saving money.  Have you saved $200 worth?  Who knows.  Since you said it was a gift, I would say you are ahead of the game even if you have only saved a little bit.

[Sid Hoffman]

For someone who would not program/manually adjust a thermostat, the Nest provides much (perhaps not all) the savings of programming/adjusting "automatically" - thus saving consumer suckas a bit of money over time. Mustachians would likely buy the cheapest programable thermostat that meats their needs (even if programing the dang thing is a PITA - you don't need to do it that often), super frugal people will just go with a cheap manually adjusted thermostat and religiously adjust the setting as they wake/retire and come/go.

I think that's a great assessment, except that the bar of entry for a programmable thermostat is so low.  I got a Honeywell 5-2 day programmable thermostat for $25 (currently $26) and I'm pretty sure that just in the two summers I've had it, it has saved me much more than its cost.  I installed it myself with the help of a friend who worked as an HVAC tech before, so there was no labor or install cost.

My basic program was to run 78 overnight for comfort sleeping, and since it's easiest for it to cool to that temperature at night since there's no solar heating and the temperature difference is lowest at night.  Then set to 80 from 5am to 1pm, 83 from 1pm to 8pm, back down to 80 from 8-9, and finally the 78 degrees from 9pm until 5am the next morning.  I'm on a utility plan that offers cheap pricing most of the time and a much higher rate weekdays from 1pm to 8pm in the 6 months of hot temps.  From my estimates, the program saves a minimum of $40/year and I plan to move after having lived here for 3 years total.  So $24 spent, $120 saved, for a net savings of $96.  It would have taken MUCH longer to reach payback if I had a $200 thermostat instead of a $26 one.

[rencelas]

I've found the Nest to be worth every penny. If I'm cold in bed, I can turn on the heat from bed. That alone made it worth the money.

That said, I haven't noticed a big difference since installing it, either. No more than the old cheapo programmable.

[Baron235]

I've found the Nest to be worth every penny. If I'm cold in bed, I can turn on the heat from bed. That alone made it worth the money.

That said, I haven't noticed a big difference since installing it, either. No more than the old cheapo programmable.

Or get another blanket since heating the whole house up for use in one room makes a lot of sense.

[rencelas]

We live in a studio.

[Rubic]

OP, thanks for your data points.

I'm getting a Nest for Christmas and expect it to pay for itself.  I currently have a simple thermostat.  Last winter I would sometimes forget to lower the thermostat when I left town and it would drive me crazy.  Knowing that I can remotely adjust the settings will provide some piece of mind.

[Daley]

We live in a studio.

And this invalidates Baron's point how exactly...?

[robartsd]

We live in a studio.

And this invalidates Baron's point how exactly...?

The one room the person is in is basically the only room. Of course the heat is only needed arround the person who is not moving, so further localizing the solution (an extra blanket) is still a much more mustachian solution than using a fancypants phone to adjust your fancypants thermostat.

[Daley]

We live in a studio.

And this invalidates Baron's point how exactly...?

The one room the person is in is basically the only room. Of course the heat is only needed arround the person who is not moving, so further localizing the solution (an extra blanket) is still a much more mustachian solution than using a fancypants phone to adjust your fancypants thermostat.

Exactly.

[I'm a red panda]

We have a "dumb" thermostat.  I have a normal, Monday through Friday standard hours job.  But he works at a hotel so his hours are all over the place.  When he leaves the house, he adjusts the thermostat.  When I get home, I change it back.  Since there are no set hours when the house is empty, there would not be any way to program it. 

We really like the auto-away feature.  If the Nest doesn't detect motion, it sets the temperature to what we have set as our "away" temps (55 degrees in the winter, 82 in the summer).

The only problem is when I am downstairs in the craft room in the winter (summer isn't an issue) and no one is upstairs, and it gets really really cold, but then I will usually just put a space heater on.

We didn't pay for the Nest, but I've found it better than our old programmable- way more 'data points' to program; love the auto-away, and really love that when I travel in the dead of winter I can turn the heat on from the airport.

[robartsd]

If the auto-away feature is the only way you (or your non Mustashian housemates) would be bothered to have the thermostat adjust for when you're not home, then the Nest will save you money. Depending on your climate and home efficiency, it might even pay for itself. On the other hand, if it is merely a convienence that you no longer change/program a thermostat, then you're merely enjoing consumer sucka hedonic addaptation. The other luxuries that the Nest provides are simply additional opportunities for consumer sucka hedonic addaptation. (No this does not mean that I still would not like a Nest, just that I recognize that I can't use "saving money" as justification to gratify this want).

[zephyr911]

OP, thanks for your data points.

I'm getting a Nest for Christmas and expect it to pay for itself.  I currently have a simple thermostat.  Last winter I would sometimes forget to lower the thermostat when I left town and it would drive me crazy.  Knowing that I can remotely adjust the settings will provide some piece of mind.

This meshes pretty well with my generalization. NEST is good technology but most of what it does is just a substitute for mindfulness. The value in that, accordingly, depends on personality and many other situational factors.

[I'm a red panda]

If the auto-away feature is the only way you (or your non Mustashian housemates) would be bothered to have the thermostat adjust for when you're not home,

The Nest just adjusts MORE than the old programmable used to.

In my old house I had it set to be "away" during business hours.  But the NEST notices if I don't come home when I normally would. 

There wouldn't have been a way to "bother" to adjust the old one.  Was I supposed to tell my boss I need to run home to change the heater setting since I'd be working an extra 3 hours?

It also notices on the weekends if we don't get out of bed at our normal time. I set the heat to come on at 7:30 on the weekends; but if we are able to laze in bed until 9, the NEST keeps the away feature on.  If I had to get up to change the thermostat to turn the heat off because we were still in bed, it kind of defeats the purpose of staying in bed.

[Arktinkerer]

I use a programmable and I'm sure it pays off.  But I seem to be more aggressive than most of the posters here.  I set it at about 60 when we are out of the house during winter and in the 80s during summer.  But I have it go to more reasonable setting about 45 minutes before I would expect to be home.  I also let it get much colder during winter nights and warm up 30 minutes before we would normally rise. I am not so frugal in the summer--my wife and I both like it cooler at night so I set it to get colder right before bed and then go higher about a half hour before we rise.  End result is that the system typically runs only about half the time during the most extreme parts of the year and much less most of the year.

I think I posted the odd drop in our bills when we ran a room AC for one of our children who needed a colder room for medical reasons.  Not sure why but that seemed to have dropped the overall bill for the house.  Maybe that was letting cooler air into the hallway and keeping the system from running as much in summer.  Never did figure that one out to my satisfaction.