Author Topic: Overheard on Facebook  (Read 6510216 times)

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7000 on: December 31, 2017, 05:28:58 PM »
@Kyle Schuant

I absolutely agree that some people have privileges and charities are a noble way to give.  However, you lose me at "you should give".  Mandating such gifts, IMO, completely defeats the purpose.  Going down that path leads to "how much am I obligated to give to be a good person?", etc.  Maybe I just don't understand because I'm a dumb American.  I could send you my bank account info if you'd like to help someone who doesn't understand nuance and subtlety.  You really should help me.

I draw a distinction between "you should give" and "you should give to me (or my charity of choice)". Generally when people say the former, they mean the latter and are trying to apply social pressure. I usually punish such solicitations with the Eyebrow Of Death.

My personal opinion, and there are indeed people who disagree with me, is that the possibility of losing donor or volunteer support is the only reliable incentive that ensures money is used responsibly. If you're not allowed to say "no", your "yes" is meaningless. When your "yes" is meaningless the person asking for it is fully aware of the fact he or she is entitled to the results, and is indulging in an obvious social fiction.

To my way of thinking, the consent of the donor and the ability of each donor to withhold the donation are vital. This means that each person needs to be in control of when, how much, and even "if" he or she gives. Some will give late, or sparingly, or not at all. If they aren't free to do this without penalty, then what we would have is not a donation but a tax.

I'm not against taxation per se, and am not trying to lead the discussion in that direction, however it produces different results from voluntary donations that can be withheld at the discretion of the donor. Why? Because tax dollars are routinely used for things that don't directly benefit the individual taxpayer but that improve the quality of life for people overall. Nobody can say, for example, "I want my taxes to be used exclusively for education" and expect that request to be honored. This means that there will always be some expenditures that a given taxpayer regards as a waste. There will always be some individuals who benefit more than they contribute.

Charitable giving is different from taxation. With a charitable donation, be it to an individual or to an organization, the donor has a specific intent and goal as to the general purpose of the contribution. If I were to donate to an animal shelter, I would expect a significant part of my donation to result in animals being fed and cared for, with some reserved for administration and advertising. Should the money be spent on something unrelated, such as political lobbying for issues unrelated to animal welfare or for as an extended "seminar" (aka tropical vacation) for the Executive Director, I would be within my rights to throw a snit fit and withhold future donations even if the expenditures fell within the letter of what the law allows. I could do that even if my personal interests suddenly diverged from the charity's and I decided to fund youth sports instead.

When large numbers of donors make individual decisions about where, when, and how to donate, the aggregate result disproportionately rewards people and charities who are effective in (a) using a gift to make a long-term improvement, and/or (b) exciting an emotional reaction in the donor.

If donors are not free to identify differences between a good cause and a bad cause (or, in the case of individuals, a worthy or unworthy recipient), and if donors are not free to withhold support from what they perceive to be bad causes or unworthy recipients, then there's absolutely no incentive for prospective recipients (charities or otherwise) to manage themselves well, to make effective use of what they are given, or to go out of their way to create or maintain an emotional connection to the giver.

Exactly how much an individual is disposed to give, and the form the giving should take, depends a lot on the culture in which he or she was raised. Social and economic class are factors. Religion is a factor, and so are age and family status. In all my years of charitable activity I have yet to find a one-size-fits-all categorical imperative that works quite as well as encouraging everyone to do his or her own thing.

Sibley

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7001 on: December 31, 2017, 07:47:35 PM »
...
I draw a distinction between "you should give" and "you should give to me (or my charity of choice)". Generally when people say the former, they mean the latter and are trying to apply social pressure. I usually punish such solicitations with the Eyebrow Of Death.
...

Agreed. And I would love to see the Eyebrow of Death, just not directed at me.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7002 on: January 01, 2018, 08:25:54 AM »
...
I draw a distinction between "you should give" and "you should give to me (or my charity of choice)". Generally when people say the former, they mean the latter and are trying to apply social pressure. I usually punish such solicitations with the Eyebrow Of Death.
...

Agreed. And I would love to see the Eyebrow of Death, just not directed at me.
I suspect it looks something akin to "The Look" from Home improvement.

Sibley

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7003 on: January 01, 2018, 11:56:15 AM »
...
I draw a distinction between "you should give" and "you should give to me (or my charity of choice)". Generally when people say the former, they mean the latter and are trying to apply social pressure. I usually punish such solicitations with the Eyebrow Of Death.
...

Agreed. And I would love to see the Eyebrow of Death, just not directed at me.
I suspect it looks something akin to "The Look" from Home improvement.

I've been told that I've got quite the Look as well. I'm very pleased with this, since I aspire to be one of those older women who does not give a fuck and will tell you whatever it is that you need to hear (constructively, I don't want to cause problems for people who don't deserve it).

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7004 on: January 01, 2018, 12:53:55 PM »
https://9gag.com/gag/aVP8Vjn/the-eyebrow-of-death

I hear if you get the DGAF "look" practiced just right you don't even have to explain yourself. People have spontaneous epiphanies all over the room.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2018, 12:55:46 PM by Just Joe »

Rollin

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7005 on: January 07, 2018, 03:33:10 PM »
I always read the 'Overheard on/at' threads with such joy and shock and am thankful, though curious that I never get much negative feedback/options/excuses about financially responsible ways. Well today I actually posted a finance related article and holy fuck! I had no idea some of my good friends were so negative!

The worst part was this: 'there's a whole lot of people who are already living in "clipping every coupon" mode. They don't have the fiscal wiggle room to even get to that first $100k. Plus they may have to sacrifice some quality of life to get to that point (ex: live in a high-crime or poor-school neighbourhood). At that point you really have to ask whether it's even worth trying to chase this particular dream. This sort of investing concept really only works for a small (ie: elite) subset of the population.'

Yikes.

FTR, the article I posted was no big extreme deal
http://www.fourpillarfreedom.com/charlie-munger-the-first-100000-is-a-btch/

I'm so glad that you were quoting someone outside the forum, not making that point yourself!

I'm constantly surprised how vehemently people will fight to discredit any idea that's put forth as something that would improve someone's circumstances.   They absolutely, negatively have have **HAVE** to discredit any idea, immediately, without thought or investigation.   No concept of "Hmm.  That worked for someone else.  How could I modify it to work for my circumstances?" is ever considered.  It just has to be turned down and, more importantly, discredited in anyone else's eyes.

Drives me up the friggin' wall.

I don't care if someone chooses to make piss-poor financial decisions and pay the consequences.

But it's just plain evil to teach people they can't possibly succeed when it's been proven that people can.

When people start teaching others to fail, I point out they are wrong.   For repeat offenders I've simply quit trying to be super polite about it.  I don't care if they don't like it or it annoys them.  If one person out there gets the right info to turn their life around, it will have been time well spent.

Have you ever seen a bucket full of crabs? They climb all over each other and try to get out. One might just reach the top and the others pull him/her back in. Same thing here (although some might call it part of the ego or even the pain body) with humans.

barbaz

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7006 on: January 08, 2018, 12:46:17 AM »
Have you ever seen a bucket full of crabs? They climb all over each other and try to get out. One might just reach the top and the others pull him/her back in. Same thing here (although some might call it part of the ego or even the pain body) with humans.
There’s even a Wikipedia article on this https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crab_mentality

Kashmani

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7007 on: January 08, 2018, 07:33:59 AM »
This is untrue. A realist would point out that their glass is dirty or small. A pessimist would complain that they're probably going to drop and break it tomorrow. You can be both a realist and an optimist at the same time (Yes I have a small glass, but I can still work to fill it!). There is nothing wrong with meeting people where they're at and helping them work up from there, which is actually exactly what you are describing in your running example.

An engineer would point out that the glass has adequate redundancy to provide a sufficient margin of safety.

Metta

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7008 on: January 08, 2018, 12:20:26 PM »
One of my friends paid for DNA ancestry tests for her dogs and posted the family trees on Facebook. She's a nice person and generally frugal, so I'm not sure what to think. Doggie DNA: Crazy Consumerism or Responsible Dog Ownership?

Update: It looks like the cost is $75 per dog. That seems like crazy consumerism to me.
« Last Edit: January 08, 2018, 12:23:29 PM by Metta »

ketchup

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7009 on: January 08, 2018, 01:31:21 PM »
One of my friends paid for DNA ancestry tests for her dogs and posted the family trees on Facebook. She's a nice person and generally frugal, so I'm not sure what to think. Doggie DNA: Crazy Consumerism or Responsible Dog Ownership?

Update: It looks like the cost is $75 per dog. That seems like crazy consumerism to me.
Apparently they're basically bullshit too.  Databases nowhere near complete enough.  You might DNA test a pure-bred golden retriever and have the test say it's 30% beagle.

RidetheRain

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7010 on: January 08, 2018, 01:44:43 PM »
One of my friends paid for DNA ancestry tests for her dogs and posted the family trees on Facebook. She's a nice person and generally frugal, so I'm not sure what to think. Doggie DNA: Crazy Consumerism or Responsible Dog Ownership?

Update: It looks like the cost is $75 per dog. That seems like crazy consumerism to me.
Apparently they're basically bullshit too.  Databases nowhere near complete enough.  You might DNA test a pure-bred golden retriever and have the test say it's 30% beagle.

Yeah, they're pretty much scams. My old roommate has a tiny little Yorkie (like 6lbs) with all the genetic problems of poor breeding to keep it "pure". When she (weirdly) decided to get her dog tested it came back as a significant percentage of American Pit Bull Terrier. I'm pretty sure a pit bull's head is bigger than this dog.

Lyngi

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7011 on: January 08, 2018, 10:45:21 PM »
<bracing for face punches> I had my stray shelter pet DNA tested  She is gorgeous.  Long, black and white fur.  I wanted to know what to look for if I want to get another dog like her.  She ended up being 3/4 pomeranian 1/4 chihuahua.  In justification,   I have no debt,  max all tax advantaged accounts.  Yah. 

dragoncar

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7012 on: January 09, 2018, 12:30:44 AM »
I made my dog Pay for his own DNA testing.  I’m teaching him fiscal responsibility

Mr Griz

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7013 on: January 09, 2018, 05:38:52 AM »
We had ours fixed so his DNA is pretty irrelevant now...

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7014 on: January 09, 2018, 08:59:12 AM »
I'm pretty sure our dog is related to wolves if you back far enough. That's all we need to know.

Now my kids and relatives - there are some questions there. The kids might be from another planet and my relatives - I must have adopted them when I was younger.

economista

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7015 on: January 09, 2018, 09:23:49 AM »
My brother and his girlfriend got their dog's DNA tested.  They thought he was pure-bred husky but it turns out he is 25% akita.  So now all of her facebook/instagram posts don't end with #huskies of instragram, they all end with #huskies of instagram #akitas of instagram (and about another 10 hashtags each time).  I'm pretty sure adding another hashtag is the only beneficial thing they've found out by paying for the DNA testing.  But then again, they take their dog to a psychiatrist, so maybe the psychiatrist is using the results for something?

ducky19

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7016 on: January 09, 2018, 10:48:48 AM »
My brother and his girlfriend got their dog's DNA tested.  They thought he was pure-bred husky but it turns out he is 25% akita.  So now all of her facebook/instagram posts don't end with #huskies of instragram, they all end with #huskies of instagram #akitas of instagram (and about another 10 hashtags each time).  I'm pretty sure adding another hashtag is the only beneficial thing they've found out by paying for the DNA testing.  But then again, they take their dog to a psychiatrist, so maybe the psychiatrist is using the results for something?

#helpmepickmyjawupoffthefloor

partgypsy

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7017 on: January 09, 2018, 10:51:57 AM »
Facepunch me but I had my rescue mixed breed dna tested. It was worth it for the infotainment alone. I did it because he had certain behaviors and I wanted to see where they were coming from. For example extremely loud barking, breaking out of our backyard by jumping/climbing out of a 6 foot fence where the tree met it, or after that part was reinforced, digging underneath it to run off; killer instinct for "vermin"; and an incredible nose. He came out at 50% fox terrier, 25% coonhound, and 25% German shepherd. We just wanted to know where the crazy was coming from. He would have been a better farm/working dog than a simple animal companion but we did the best we could.

Nudelkopf

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7018 on: January 09, 2018, 11:49:03 AM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

MrsDinero

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7019 on: January 09, 2018, 11:53:12 AM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

I suppose some people do, but it is an incredibly racist/derogatory term. Don't use it.

Dollar Slice

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7020 on: January 09, 2018, 12:03:34 PM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

The "coon" in coonhound refers to raccoons, which the dogs were bred to hunt. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coon_hunting

MrsDinero is correct about it being very racist and offensive when applied to humans.

boyerbt

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7021 on: January 09, 2018, 12:05:00 PM »
Facepunch me but I had my rescue mixed breed dna tested. It was worth it for the infotainment alone. I did it because he had certain behaviors and I wanted to see where they were coming from. For example extremely loud barking, breaking out of our backyard by jumping/climbing out of a 6 foot fence where the tree met it, or after that part was reinforced, digging underneath it to run off; killer instinct for "vermin"; and an incredible nose. He came out at 50% fox terrier, 25% coonhound, and 25% German shepherd. We just wanted to know where the crazy was coming from. He would have been a better farm/working dog than a simple animal companion but we did the best we could.

What does he look like? Did you have any guesses prior to sending off the DNA test?

FrugalToque

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7022 on: January 09, 2018, 12:25:54 PM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

Not sure why this got flagged to me, but yes, Americans consider use of the term 'coon, with or without apostrophe, to refer to black people, as racist.

I think someone referred to the previous president that way (or was it a coyote in the white house?)

Definitely not polite.

I imagine "coonhound" could have some problems too, as I'm picturing this as a slang term up there with "cougar" for middle-aged women who go after younger men.  But it's probably also a legitimate term used by dog breeders.

Toque.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2018, 12:30:53 PM by FrugalToque »

Dollar Slice

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7023 on: January 09, 2018, 12:31:33 PM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

Not sure why this got flagged to me, but yes, Americans often use the term 'coon, with or without apostrophe, to refer to black people.

I don't think it's right to say Americans "often" use that term that way. I've literally never heard someone say this in my entire life, because it's despicable. Which is probably why someone flagged it. I'm not sure where foreigners are getting the idea that this is common usage.

FrugalToque

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7024 on: January 09, 2018, 12:45:20 PM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

Not sure why this got flagged to me, but yes, Americans often use the term 'coon, with or without apostrophe, to refer to black people.

I don't think it's right to say Americans "often" use that term that way. I've literally never heard someone say this in my entire life, because it's despicable. Which is probably why someone flagged it. I'm not sure where foreigners are getting the idea that this is common usage.

I agree ... I reworded what I wrote once I realized how I wrote it.  I meant that it's considered racist in the U.S., whereas other places in the world might not know anything about the word.

Toque.

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7025 on: January 09, 2018, 01:01:29 PM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

Not sure why this got flagged to me, but yes, Americans often use the term 'coon, with or without apostrophe, to refer to black people.

I don't think it's right to say Americans "often" use that term that way. I've literally never heard someone say this in my entire life, because it's despicable. Which is probably why someone flagged it. I'm not sure where foreigners are getting the idea that this is common usage.

I agree ... I reworded what I wrote once I realized how I wrote it.  I meant that it's considered racist in the U.S., whereas other places in the world might not know anything about the word.

Toque.

It's considered racist by the rest of Australia too, but unfortunately it's still a brand of cheese.

Quote

Toowoomba academic Stephen Hagan ... said he would now focus his time and effort on fighting Dairy Farmers’ Coon cheese.

“Initially, Dairy Farmers said it was named after Edward Coon, who revolutionised the speeding process of making cheese,” he told AAP.

“But I’ve questioned the authenticity of that story.

Mr Hagan claims the cheese, formerly manufactured by Kraft, used to have a black wraparound and was named Coon as a joke.

“I want Dairy Farmers to show me the evidence of Edward Coon being honoured an honorary doctorate and what year he received that honorary doctorate,” he said.

“If they can prove to me that Edward Coon was a famous cheesemaker, I will drop my campaign.

https://www.sunshinecoastdaily.com.au/news/activist-targets-coon-cheese/343670/

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7026 on: January 09, 2018, 02:29:43 PM »
25% coonhound
Okay, I had to google this. Do you guys not use coon for black people too?

Not sure why this got flagged to me, but yes, Americans often use the term 'coon, with or without apostrophe, to refer to black people.

I don't think it's right to say Americans "often" use that term that way. I've literally never heard someone say this in my entire life, because it's despicable. Which is probably why someone flagged it. I'm not sure where foreigners are getting the idea that this is common usage.

Go further south. I've heard a couple of old timers (long dead now) use the term to stir up problems.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2018, 02:32:00 PM by Just Joe »

katscratch

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7027 on: January 09, 2018, 02:35:54 PM »
Coonhound as was said earlier is a group of breeds in the larger hound group of dogs - bred for game hunting, specifically raccoons. Nothing to do with the other phrase.

When the dog DNA tests first came out they were only accurate for mixed breed dogs due to the particular genetic markers they were looking for. I worked at a veterinary hospital and companies would let us send ours in to test against their database. I have a Miniature Pinscher that was from a show breeder and had documentation of generations of lineage back to when they were still used for hunting. His result came back with a tiny smidge of Shih Tzu hahahaha - we joke all the time that the Shih Tzu would've been that one crazy uncle that's always drunk at family gatherings. Every time my dog does something dumb and un-terrier-like we blame it on "Uncle Bob" :)

Dollar Slice

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7028 on: January 09, 2018, 03:05:14 PM »
Go further south. I've heard a couple of old timers (long dead now) use the term to stir up problems.

Most of my family is in, and from, the deep south. I've been in FL, AL, TN, GA, TX, LA, etc. Never heard it. It is not a thing that people commonly say. I'm not really counting "long dead" people. ;-) 

Thanks for the clarification @FrugalToque - I posted while you were editing, I guess.

To the topic (or at least the current tangent) a Facebook friend of mine did her dog DNA thing and it came back half and half chihuahua and pit bull... they tell people they have a Chia Pit.

ketchup

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7029 on: January 09, 2018, 03:23:21 PM »
Go further south. I've heard a couple of old timers (long dead now) use the term to stir up problems.

Most of my family is in, and from, the deep south. I've been in FL, AL, TN, GA, TX, LA, etc. Never heard it. It is not a thing that people commonly say. I'm not really counting "long dead" people. ;-) 

Thanks for the clarification @FrugalToque - I posted while you were editing, I guess.

To the topic (or at least the current tangent) a Facebook friend of mine did her dog DNA thing and it came back half and half chihuahua and pit bull... they tell people they have a Chia Pit.
I rescind my previous scorn of this practice.  That makes it 100% worth it.

Rural

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7030 on: January 09, 2018, 07:07:34 PM »
I've not heard the derogatory use of "coon" in years, I'm happy to report. I did hear it, frequently, three and more decades ago, so things are better on that front.


"Coon" is still a very common word, referring to racoons. Or coonhounds.


Speaking of which, coonhounds are crazy, I can confirm. Do not keep as pets (or try to). They can climb chain-link fences and dig under anything at all. They'd very much like to please people, are incredibly sweet, and just. can't. help. themselves. Not meant for pets. Not their fault.

geekette

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7031 on: January 09, 2018, 09:25:41 PM »
And then there are these kids...

Quote
(T)he team from Kings Mills, Ohio, ... was named “The Wet Dream Team.” They also noticed that the names on the backs of the high-school-aged boys’ jerseys included phrases like “Knee Grow” and “Coon.”

Inaya

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7032 on: January 10, 2018, 06:48:59 AM »
And then there are these kids...

Quote
(T)he team from Kings Mills, Ohio, ... was named “The Wet Dream Team.” They also noticed that the names on the backs of the high-school-aged boys’ jerseys included phrases like “Knee Grow” and “Coon.”
Okay, teens pushing boundaries, etc., I get it.  But wtf were the adults who paid for and approved the jerseys thinking?!

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7033 on: January 10, 2018, 07:41:37 AM »
Go further south. I've heard a couple of old timers (long dead now) use the term to stir up problems.

Most of my family is in, and from, the deep south. I've been in FL, AL, TN, GA, TX, LA, etc. Never heard it. It is not a thing that people commonly say. I'm not really counting "long dead" people. ;-) 


I currently live in Georgia, but have previously lived in MS, SC, and FL. I haven't used the term in question used as a racial epithet since high school. High schoolers are shitheads everywhere, not just in the South (consider the article referenced immediately above as Exhibit A).

RidetheRain

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7034 on: January 10, 2018, 10:03:08 AM »
Speaking of which, coonhounds are crazy, I can confirm. Do not keep as pets (or try to). They can climb chain-link fences and dig under anything at all. They'd very much like to please people, are incredibly sweet, and just. can't. help. themselves. Not meant for pets. Not their fault.

Oh that's sad. My roommate has a coonhound that is just the sweetest best-behaved thing I've ever seen. But, he does have a tail like a steel bar. Don't get behind him while he's happy and wagging his tail or you might just get kneecapped. Many a coffee table has been cleared by that tail.

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7035 on: January 10, 2018, 01:17:43 PM »
Go further south. I've heard a couple of old timers (long dead now) use the term to stir up problems.

Most of my family is in, and from, the deep south. I've been in FL, AL, TN, GA, TX, LA, etc. Never heard it. It is not a thing that people commonly say. I'm not really counting "long dead" people. ;-) 

Thanks for the clarification @FrugalToque - I posted while you were editing, I guess.

To the topic (or at least the current tangent) a Facebook friend of mine did her dog DNA thing and it came back half and half chihuahua and pit bull... they tell people they have a Chia Pit.

No, you own't hear it today much but I've heard it. Also spent time with a 60-ish fellow a couple of weeks ago who thinks nothing of using the "N" word n casual conversation. They are rare even in my world here in the south but they pop up occasionally. Cringe worthy.

Worth a chuckle to look at the mild mannered family tail wagger and realize that he/she is related to the wolves and coyotes on the Nat Geo specials.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2018, 01:25:17 PM by Just Joe »

Miss Piggy

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7036 on: January 10, 2018, 07:04:29 PM »
I've not heard the derogatory use of "coon" in years, I'm happy to report.

I have never heard the term "coon" used in a derogatory way. This is new to me. (And I'm not a spring chicken.)

ixtap

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7037 on: January 10, 2018, 07:16:57 PM »
I've not heard the derogatory use of "coon" in years, I'm happy to report.

I have never heard the term "coon" used in a derogatory way. This is new to me. (And I'm not a spring chicken.)

I have only ever read it in the context of coon hunting, which was a grotesque euphemism. As a child, I was naive enough to think they were after trash pandas.

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7038 on: January 10, 2018, 10:13:52 PM »
I've not heard the derogatory use of "coon" in years, I'm happy to report.

I have never heard the term "coon" used in a derogatory way. This is new to me. (And I'm not a spring chicken.)

I have only ever read it in the context of coon hunting, which was a grotesque euphemism. As a child, I was naive enough to think they were after trash pandas.

They may have been.

As a kid I actually didn't spend all my time composing music or finding ways to get away with fighting in public. Once I went out with some of my dad's Texan relatives hunting raccoons. Raccoon hunting really is a thing. It's like fox hunting but far less expensive because you don't need horses or special attire.

The goal in raccoon hunting is to reduce the number of raccoons in the immediate area while having fun in the process. Raccoons are absolute geniuses at raiding chicken coops, destroying trash cans, or occasionally even tunneling under a building slab or into an attic, where they were hard to eradicate and the stench created by their droppings and their half-eaten food required expensive renovation to fix. They aren't indigenous to the southern or western United States, and are an example of an animal from another region that adapted very well to being around humans and that was able to out-compete (or just plain eat) the local wildlife including some very endangered quail. The only way to save the indigenous animals was to get rid of the intruders. Naturally, someone found a way to make this into a sport.

There was also briefly a market for "Davy Crockett" style raccoon-skin caps for children. To satisfy the market required a good supply of dead raccoons. This demand dovetailed nicely with the interests of farmers who were tired of having their eggs stolen and their barn cats disemboweled. A person with a brace of "coon hounds" could sometimes earn an extra few dollars, at a time when cash was otherwise hard to come by. The market for raccoon-skin caps has since mostly dried up but the sport will probably never die.

To go raccoon hunting, one requires a set of "coon hounds": nose dogs good at following a scent who are assertive enough to chase the animal up a tree and yappy enough to let you know where they are. It's like fox hunting, except there aren't any horses and it's done at night. One therefore also needs a flashlight and (if playing for keeps) a firearm. The dogs are trained to give voice when they find the scent. They would find the raccoon and start chasing it, hoping to eventually chase it up a tree. Before this happens the animal generally runs for a while. Everyone therefore goes sprinting and leaping through the bush chasing the dogs and hoping we wouldn't trip over something and break our necks. When I went out with these distant relatives of mine, it was supposed to be more of a "sport" kind of outing, so my dad's brother did not actually shoot the raccoons that were treed. We just shone our lights on the ones that were treed. They all had a vaguely annoyed expression. Wild animals were therefore inconvenienced but not actually harmed. However a generation or so before, the trash pandas would have been toast.

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7039 on: January 10, 2018, 10:29:54 PM »
Coonhound as was said earlier is a group of breeds in the larger hound group of dogs - bred for game hunting, specifically raccoons. Nothing to do with the other phrase.
This is what I was confused about. I've never heard of racoons being called just coons, so when I saw a dog breed called coonhound (& you guys are from the US) I assumed it was a dog bred to hunt people back in the day. And I thought that was weird that you'd still call those dogs coonhounds.

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7040 on: January 10, 2018, 10:42:00 PM »
Coonhound as was said earlier is a group of breeds in the larger hound group of dogs - bred for game hunting, specifically raccoons. Nothing to do with the other phrase.
This is what I was confused about. I've never heard of racoons being called just coons, so when I saw a dog breed called coonhound (& you guys are from the US) I assumed it was a dog bred to hunt people back in the day. And I thought that was weird that you'd still call those dogs coonhounds.

I started listening to a hunting podcast recently and had no idea what a coon was. Eventually I asked my favorite American what it was and all the pieces finally clicked into place. But until this thread I had no idea it was also a racial slur!

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7041 on: January 11, 2018, 05:44:38 AM »
Coonhound as was said earlier is a group of breeds in the larger hound group of dogs - bred for game hunting, specifically raccoons. Nothing to do with the other phrase.
This is what I was confused about. I've never heard of racoons being called just coons, so when I saw a dog breed called coonhound (& you guys are from the US) I assumed it was a dog bred to hunt people back in the day. And I thought that was weird that you'd still call those dogs coonhounds.

I understand your confusion, but Google is your friend in situations like this. To be sure, if you talk about coons, coon-hunting, or coonhounds anywhere in the southern U.S., the immediate assumption will be that you are referring to raccoons. As noted by many people above, the term is known, but not commonly used, as a racial epithet. I have been coon-hunting myself, and my great-grandfather had an entire wall of trophies in his home from decades of competitive coon-hunting. He was well-known in the state as a top-notch coonhound breeder.

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7042 on: January 11, 2018, 05:47:39 AM »
Coonhound as was said earlier is a group of breeds in the larger hound group of dogs - bred for game hunting, specifically raccoons. Nothing to do with the other phrase.
This is what I was confused about. I've never heard of racoons being called just coons, so when I saw a dog breed called coonhound (& you guys are from the US) I assumed it was a dog bred to hunt people back in the day. And I thought that was weird that you'd still call those dogs coonhounds.

I learned about this when I was a kid after reading "Where the Red Fern Grows".

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7043 on: January 11, 2018, 09:18:49 AM »
Well, you're more than welcome to visit me and significantly reduce or eliminate the population of raccoons.

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7044 on: January 11, 2018, 09:41:42 AM »
Apparently there is even more nuance to the term:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=coon

Nudelkopf

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7045 on: January 11, 2018, 11:20:37 AM »
I understand your confusion, but Google is your friend in situations like this.
Did you even read the original comment that started this conversation?

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7046 on: January 11, 2018, 11:57:43 AM »
Coonhound as was said earlier is a group of breeds in the larger hound group of dogs - bred for game hunting, specifically raccoons. Nothing to do with the other phrase.
This is what I was confused about. I've never heard of racoons being called just coons, so when I saw a dog breed called coonhound (& you guys are from the US) I assumed it was a dog bred to hunt people back in the day. And I thought that was weird that you'd still call those dogs coonhounds.

I learned about this when I was a kid after reading "Where the Red Fern Grows".

You know, I always think I never read this book, but I wonder if I read it when one of my brothers had to read it. I often stole their books, as the librarians kept shooing me back to the children's section. I just have this vivid memory of "what do trash pandas have to do with any of this" (although I didn't call them trash pandas back then).

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7047 on: January 11, 2018, 12:03:27 PM »
Coonhound as was said earlier is a group of breeds in the larger hound group of dogs - bred for game hunting, specifically raccoons. Nothing to do with the other phrase.
This is what I was confused about. I've never heard of racoons being called just coons, so when I saw a dog breed called coonhound (& you guys are from the US) I assumed it was a dog bred to hunt people back in the day. And I thought that was weird that you'd still call those dogs coonhounds.

I learned about this when I was a kid after reading "Where the Red Fern Grows".

You know, I always think I never read this book, but I wonder if I read it when one of my brothers had to read it. I often stole their books, as the librarians kept shooing me back to the children's section. I just have this vivid memory of "what do trash pandas have to do with any of this" (although I didn't call them trash pandas back then).

It's a great book. It still makes me cry when I read it.

It's where I learned that racoons can be trapped just by getting them stuck- they will close their fist on something and then not have the wherewithall to let go if they can't get their arm out of the hole they reached it in.  That's apparently true.

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7048 on: January 11, 2018, 12:53:40 PM »
Please don’t use the term “trash panda” I have panda relatives who find it offensive

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Re: Overheard on Facebook
« Reply #7049 on: January 11, 2018, 01:34:18 PM »
Back to overheard on FB.

Some of you may have heard of our recent wildfire, then our more recent rains and terrible mudslides.  They are still looking for missing people.

Due to the slides, the highway is closed to the south.  For many many days.  So, nobody who lives there can get to work.

Well I've read at least one complaint about the 2 boat companies (who usually do day trips or whale watching) who have set up ferries to get people to and from.  For approx $32 each way.  The complaint is "that is too expensive", "people cannot afford that", "they could build good will by offering the services for free".

Well.
Gas isn't free.
I'm assuming the employees that work for the boating companies don't work for free.
"They could donate their time."
They are paid by the hour, and probably not that much.
These companies lost tens of thousands of dollars in December due to the fires - resulting in ZERO money coming in from tourists.
20,000 people do this commute every day.  At best these boats can serve a few hundred.  How do you choose?

(The answer is that I'm fairly sure our local hospital system is booking, and paying for, their employees to get to work).

These are not large, multi-million dollar national companies.  For all I know they are working at cost.

I tell you, this whole process has shown me the reason to have food and water on hand, how to be ready to go at any time, and how to determine what is REALLY an emergency.  I have the kind of job that when push comes to shove, is completely unnecessary on any given day.

 

Wow, a phone plan for fifteen bucks!