Overheard on Facebook

[dividend]

A dear friend of mine posted this :

What would you do?
Car is paid for.
A/C completely hosed and will cost $2600+tax to repair ($2800). (Assuming a 2nd opinion will confirm this).
Trade-in Value for car WHEN working = $10,500.
Trade in value as-is - $8000.
Repair? Trade-In?

Now, she is receptive to mustachianism.  I sent her a blog link a while back and she got all excited and we had a really fun long discussion about cutting out things that don't add value.  So rest assured that she ultimately made a smart decision.  It's the replies that made me shake my head.  Keep in mind that this happened the month after she made the final payment on a 5 year loan.
Some choice examples :

Honestly, given how cheap financing is right now, I'm heavily biased toward buying new in most situations if you can handle the payment fairly easily.

vote Trade in car get new one ... Downhill mechanically from here ... Warrantee is always a good thing

Yeah, if someone will give you 8k for it I'd totally buy a low mileage used SUV. You could probably get something in the 20k mile range for $15k or so post trade.

My personal favorite :

I will say I kinda disagree with the premise that every car needs repairs. While it's true, I can't think of a single repair in the last decade that I've had to pay for because they've all been covered under warranty.

It's always a bit of a gamble but you're not trading $3k for a $15k loan, you're trading a *minimum* of $3k. I mean, yes, the current car can have another $12k of repairs before it equals the cost of buying something else. But, in those two scenarios you're left with still spending $15k but ending up with a new lower mileage vehicle in one of them. And that ignores any improvements in gas mileage, safety improvements and other technological advancements.

When you're dealing with negligible interest rates (total interest on $15k at 1.5% over 5 years is $578.90) there doesn't really seem to be much benefit to avoiding a car loan. *Personally* I'll choose paying an extra $600 over waiting 5 years before buying a car every time.

Oh, also, if the interest rate is below inflation, you actually lose more money saving it than you do borrowing it.

Then there was a slew of posts saying she should be sure to take a man with her when she went to buy a new car.

[fartface]

Woo hoo check is in! Half already gone to my mom for rent and bill coverage.....next step is activating smartphone, then donating to a campaign fund, making a few purchases for things I need, and the rest is mine. Love "payday"! LOL

Way to celebrate/advertise your absolute stupidity. Gosh. I'd be really embarrassed if that were my kid. No shame.
If this tool could see an interest calculator he might not be activating a smartphone or donating to politicians. WTH is wrong with people? Even my 11 and 14 year olds understand how debt and interest rates work.

[mm1970]

Standard joke/comment in Canada - we have 2 seasons, winter and road construction.

From a girl I knew in college:

"Ever road - EVERY. FRIGGIN. ROAD. Is under construction. I could bike to work faster."

Hmmm maybe she's on to something here...

My relatives in PA say the same thing.  Two seasons: winter and PENNDOT

[gooki]

A dear friend of mine posted this :

What would you do?
Car is paid for.
A/C completely hosed and will cost $2600+tax to repair ($2800). (Assuming a 2nd opinion will confirm this).
Trade-in Value for car WHEN working = $10,500.
Trade in value as-is - $8000.
Repair? Trade-In?

When I first read this, I was like, what why is she selling her car to fix her home A/C. Then I realised it was the cars A/C. Fucken hell, just don't repair it and drive without aircon if it's that much to fix.

[Paul der Krake]

Worrying about the resale value of depreciating assets, tut tut tut.

[EngineerMum]

Then there was a slew of posts saying she should be sure to take a man with her when she went to buy a new car.

Sadly, this is statistically likely to make a difference. My personal experience is that women are treated like idiots at the car yard. Sad but still true.

[DINK]

Standard joke/comment in Canada - we have 2 seasons, winter and road construction.

Same here in Minnesota.

And Sweden.

Texas doesn't have that, but we have construction year round which translates to a bunch of lane closures on construction sites that you rarely see anyone working on.

The joke in Texas is that our seasons are December, January, February, and Summer!

In Maine we have 4 seasons: almost winter, winter, still winter, and construction.

[forummm]

A relative just posted to Facebook about his "early in the week retirement as of this Monday!!"

He's 67.

Fixed this for him.

[Joggernot]

Then there was a slew of posts saying she should be sure to take a man with her when she went to buy a new car.

Sadly, this is statistically likely to make a difference. My personal experience is that women are treated like idiots at the car yard. Sad but still true.

A good friend of ours went down to buy a car.  She looked at several with the salesman and decided to buy one.  The salesman told her to come back with her husband to close the deal.  This was in North Carolina.  She, being originally from California, let the salesman have both barrels.  She bought the car without her husband being there.

[TheGrimSqueaker]

Then there was a slew of posts saying she should be sure to take a man with her when she went to buy a new car.

Sadly, this is statistically likely to make a difference. My personal experience is that women are treated like idiots at the car yard. Sad but still true.

It is indeed true. That's one of the reasons I only buy vehicles from people I know now. At least when you're doing business with someone you know, you will actually receive the items and services you pay for and there won't be any extra "surprises" on the bill. You also won't be forced to wait for several hours while they "talk to the boss" or try to manipulate you into getting a bunch of add-ons you don't need, don't want, and can't use.

[RWD]

Then there was a slew of posts saying she should be sure to take a man with her when she went to buy a new car.

Sadly, this is statistically likely to make a difference. My personal experience is that women are treated like idiots at the car yard. Sad but still true.

A good friend of ours went down to buy a car.  She looked at several with the salesman and decided to buy one.  The salesman told her to come back with her husband to close the deal.  This was in North Carolina.  She, being originally from California, let the salesman have both barrels.  She bought the car without her husband being there.

If she really wanted to make a point she should have bought a car from a different dealer after telling the salesman's manager why he lost the sale... As a side note, it's usually better to go with another person when buying a car to help keep yourself from making impulsive decisions.

[aussiesaver]

"Thanks (finance company) for our brand new car!" They actually tagged their finance broker in the post.  Car is crazy expensive and they have only just got themselves out of some serious financial trouble and always complain that she has to work full time instead of part time like other mum friends of hers.

[cerebus]

If she really wanted to make a point she should have bought a car from a different dealer after telling the salesman's manager why he lost the sale...

+1. Just to make a point, she gave him a nice big commission for his rudeness.

[theadvicist]

If she really wanted to make a point she should have bought a car from a different dealer after telling the salesman's manager why he lost the sale...

+1. Just to make a point, she gave him a nice big commission for his rudeness.

Yeah it could have been a massive reverse-psychology trick. "Hmmm, she's from Cali. I bet if I imply she can't make a decision without her husband she'll try to prove me wrong!".

I would have taken my business elsewhere.

[ShoulderThingThatGoesUp]

When my wife and I moved cross-country after college, a friend of South Asian descent helped us out by driving with us. We had dinner one night at a Waffle House in Chattanooga, and Dusty the waitress was clearly pretty bothered to have a brown man in her restaurant. For some reason what felt right was to give her a big tip to show how little we cared about what she thought. As we walked out we saw her jaw drop.

But I wouldn't do that with something as big as a car.

(A big tip at Waffle House in Chattanooga is $5.)

[cerebus]

When my wife and I moved cross-country after college, a friend of South Asian descent helped us out by driving with us. We had dinner one night at a Waffle House in Chattanooga, and Dusty the waitress was clearly pretty bothered to have a brown man in her restaurant. For some reason what felt right was to give her a big tip to show how little we cared about what she thought. As we walked out we saw her jaw drop.

But I wouldn't do that with something as big as a car.

(A big tip at Waffle House in Chattanooga is $5.)

If I meet you I'll pretend to be all racist and stuff so that you can disdainfully throw money at me :D

[faithless]

"When I feel like crap- I spend money...  This past weekend I got us a brand new couch, new guest room furniture, and a trip booked to the Bahamas... So you can only imagine how terrible I've been feeling LOL."

Jeesh, even counselling would be cheaper. And stand a chance of solving their underlying issues about spending to make themselves feel better.

[zephyr911]

"Thanks (finance company) for our brand new car!" They actually tagged their finance broker in the post.  Car is crazy expensive and they have only just got themselves out of some serious financial trouble and always complain that she has to work full time instead of part time like other mum friends of hers.

At least they didn't do it at Christmas time and thank "Santa" for their new car debt... :P

[Gen Y Finance Journey]

Has anybody mentioned an Irish Goodbye? I just learned that one.

Is that like a Persian Goodbye? :)

[zolotiyeruki]

Nah, I think you're thinking about an Oklahoma Hello....

[MgoSam]

When my wife and I moved cross-country after college, a friend of South Asian descent helped us out by driving with us. We had dinner one night at a Waffle House in Chattanooga, and Dusty the waitress was clearly pretty bothered to have a brown man in her restaurant. For some reason what felt right was to give her a big tip to show how little we cared about what she thought. As we walked out we saw her jaw drop.

But I wouldn't do that with something as big as a car.

(A big tip at Waffle House in Chattanooga is $5.)

As someone of South Asian descent, I would have been quite happy to walk out of there. I keep hearing that the South is not as bad of bigoted northerners make it out to be, but I have never had anyone get bothered by me in the north. I have had issues in Arkansas, TN, and NC.

[HairyUpperLip]

When my wife and I moved cross-country after college, a friend of South Asian descent helped us out by driving with us. We had dinner one night at a Waffle House in Chattanooga, and Dusty the waitress was clearly pretty bothered to have a brown man in her restaurant. For some reason what felt right was to give her a big tip to show how little we cared about what she thought. As we walked out we saw her jaw drop.

But I wouldn't do that with something as big as a car.

(A big tip at Waffle House in Chattanooga is $5.)

As someone of South Asian descent, I would have been quite happy to walk out of there. I keep hearing that the South is not as bad of bigoted northerners make it out to be, but I have never had anyone get bothered by me in the north. I have had issues in Arkansas, TN, and NC.

Also South Asian.

I mostly grew up in the "South" - metro Atlanta. I also spent some time in and near Savannah.

I'd say the most racist place I've been in America is probably the midwest. I couldn't walk down the street without getting stared down.

[wenchsenior]

When my wife and I moved cross-country after college, a friend of South Asian descent helped us out by driving with us. We had dinner one night at a Waffle House in Chattanooga, and Dusty the waitress was clearly pretty bothered to have a brown man in her restaurant. For some reason what felt right was to give her a big tip to show how little we cared about what she thought. As we walked out we saw her jaw drop.

But I wouldn't do that with something as big as a car.

(A big tip at Waffle House in Chattanooga is $5.)

As someone of South Asian descent, I would have been quite happy to walk out of there. I keep hearing that the South is not as bad of bigoted northerners make it out to be, but I have never had anyone get bothered by me in the north. I have had issues in Arkansas, TN, and NC.

Also South Asian.

I mostly grew up in the "South" - metro Atlanta. I also spent some time in and near Savannah.

I'd say the most racist place I've been in America is probably the midwest. I couldn't walk down the street without getting stared down.

I feel fairly safe making a really sweeping generalization that racism is absolutely thriving in all rural areas of this country, regardless of region. The level of racism then recedes, roughly in correlation with increasing density of population, but is still present. 

[Joggernot]

I feel fairly safe making a really sweeping generalization that racism is absolutely thriving in all rural areas of this country, regardless of region. The level of racism then recedes, roughly in correlation with increasing density of population, but is still present.

That is an absolutely pathetic statement with nothing to support it.

[wenchsenior]

I feel fairly safe making a really sweeping generalization that racism is absolutely thriving in all rural areas of this country, regardless of region. The level of racism then recedes, roughly in correlation with increasing density of population, but is still present.

That is an absolutely pathetic statement with nothing to support it.

I agree it's definitely pathetic. And I'm pretty sure it's also true. Note that I didn't say that I think every individual in rural areas is racist, or that all people in cities aren't. I've lived rural areas, small cities, and large cities, in three different regions of the country (though not the South) and I think the country is making slow but steady progress. But I still think racism is thriving.

I was actually sort of defending the South, which gets a terrible rep. I think my home region (Midwest) is also very racist, but it is kept more on the down-low there because of socio-cultural expectations...Midwestern 'nice' and so on. My husband's from the West, and his impression is that it's thriving there, as well.

But if you have stats to make me less cynical, I'd be very happy to see them. I do tend to assume the worst when it comes to humanity LOL.

[Gen Y Finance Journey]

Nah, I think you're thinking about an Oklahoma Hello....

There's at least one other mustachian with knowledge of musical theatre! Yay!

[La Bibliotecaria Feroz]

I feel fairly safe making a really sweeping generalization that racism is absolutely thriving in all rural areas of this country, regardless of region. The level of racism then recedes, roughly in correlation with increasing density of population, but is still present.

That is an absolutely pathetic statement with nothing to support it.

I agree it's definitely pathetic. And I'm pretty sure it's also true. Note that I didn't say that I think every individual in rural areas is racist, or that all people in cities aren't. I've lived rural areas, small cities, and large cities, in three different regions of the country (though not the South) and I think the country is making slow but steady progress. But I still think racism is thriving.

I was actually sort of defending the South, which gets a terrible rep. I think my home region (Midwest) is also very racist, but it is kept more on the down-low there because of socio-cultural expectations...Midwestern 'nice' and so on. My husband's from the West, and his impression is that it's thriving there, as well.

But if you have stats to make me less cynical, I'd be very happy to see them. I do tend to assume the worst when it comes to humanity LOL.

I lived in the Deep South--south Georgia. In my admittedly limited experience, the St. Louis area was more racist and more segregated than south Georgia. I taught community college both places, and the mix in Georgia reflected the area--about 60/40 racial mix, with a few private school grads. But 30 miles west of St. Louis, I taught three classes each semester for a whole year and saw--not taught, but SAW--exactly zero black people.

[solon]

I lived in the Deep South--south Georgia. In my admittedly limited experience, the St. Louis area was more racist and more segregated than south Georgia. I taught community college both places, and the mix in Georgia reflected the area--about 60/40 racial mix, with a few private school grads. But 30 miles west of St. Louis, I taught three classes each semester for a whole year and saw--not taught, but SAW--exactly zero black people.

St Louis is racist because you didn't SEE any black people? I think you have a different definition of racism than I do.

[fb132]

I feel fairly safe making a really sweeping generalization that racism is absolutely thriving in all rural areas of this country, regardless of region. The level of racism then recedes, roughly in correlation with increasing density of population, but is still present.

That is an absolutely pathetic statement with nothing to support it.

I agree it's definitely pathetic. And I'm pretty sure it's also true. Note that I didn't say that I think every individual in rural areas is racist, or that all people in cities aren't. I've lived rural areas, small cities, and large cities, in three different regions of the country (though not the South) and I think the country is making slow but steady progress. But I still think racism is thriving.

I was actually sort of defending the South, which gets a terrible rep. I think my home region (Midwest) is also very racist, but it is kept more on the down-low there because of socio-cultural expectations...Midwestern 'nice' and so on. My husband's from the West, and his impression is that it's thriving there, as well.

But if you have stats to make me less cynical, I'd be very happy to see them. I do tend to assume the worst when it comes to humanity LOL.

How is that racist??? Does St-Louis prevent black people from entering the city or something??? It has nothing to do with racism.

I lived in the Deep South--south Georgia. In my admittedly limited experience, the St. Louis area was more racist and more segregated than south Georgia. I taught community college both places, and the mix in Georgia reflected the area--about 60/40 racial mix, with a few private school grads. But 30 miles west of St. Louis, I taught three classes each semester for a whole year and saw--not taught, but SAW--exactly zero black people.

[AlanStache]

When my wife and I moved cross-country after college, a friend of South Asian descent helped us out by driving with us. We had dinner one night at a Waffle House in Chattanooga, and Dusty the waitress was clearly pretty bothered to have a brown man in her restaurant. For some reason what felt right was to give her a big tip to show how little we cared about what she thought. As we walked out we saw her jaw drop.

But I wouldn't do that with something as big as a car.

(A big tip at Waffle House in Chattanooga is $5.)

As someone of South Asian descent, I would have been quite happy to walk out of there. I keep hearing that the South is not as bad of bigoted northerners make it out to be, but I have never had anyone get bothered by me in the north. I have had issues in Arkansas, TN, and NC.

Also South Asian.

I mostly grew up in the "South" - metro Atlanta. I also spent some time in and near Savannah.

I'd say the most racist place I've been in America is probably the midwest. I couldn't walk down the street without getting stared down.

As a middle-class-hetero-white-dude race intolerance seems to be more correlated to community size and local diversity than north/south/midwest/etc.  my 0.02$

[justajane]

I feel fairly safe making a really sweeping generalization that racism is absolutely thriving in all rural areas of this country, regardless of region. The level of racism then recedes, roughly in correlation with increasing density of population, but is still present.

That is an absolutely pathetic statement with nothing to support it.

I agree it's definitely pathetic. And I'm pretty sure it's also true. Note that I didn't say that I think every individual in rural areas is racist, or that all people in cities aren't. I've lived rural areas, small cities, and large cities, in three different regions of the country (though not the South) and I think the country is making slow but steady progress. But I still think racism is thriving.

I was actually sort of defending the South, which gets a terrible rep. I think my home region (Midwest) is also very racist, but it is kept more on the down-low there because of socio-cultural expectations...Midwestern 'nice' and so on. My husband's from the West, and his impression is that it's thriving there, as well.

But if you have stats to make me less cynical, I'd be very happy to see them. I do tend to assume the worst when it comes to humanity LOL.

I lived in the Deep South--south Georgia. In my admittedly limited experience, the St. Louis area was more racist and more segregated than south Georgia. I taught community college both places, and the mix in Georgia reflected the area--about 60/40 racial mix, with a few private school grads. But 30 miles west of St. Louis, I taught three classes each semester for a whole year and saw--not taught, but SAW--exactly zero black people.

I grew up in the Deep South and have lived in St. Louis for 20 years, so I think I can speak to this, although I wouldn't claim to be an expert. St. Louis is quite segregated. It is quite true that very few black individuals live in certain parts of the metro area, particularly in the south and the west. But like others, I don't think it's fair to automatically conclude that just because demographics aren't mixed that people are racist. Mind you, I imagine a certain amount of people are racist and have chosen to live in certain areas because they are homogenous (i.e. white). But why would you assume that? It makes no sense.

I live in one of the most racially diverse areas of the St. Louis region, and I have to tell you, just because there's a mixed population doesn't mean a place is somehow magically less racist. I have heard multiple stores about our mayor saying thinly veiled racist things to people. He's the freaking mayor! I would say, however, that he's thankfully in the minority in my community, despite his leadership position. He's older and will not run again, so I look forward to a new day.

FWIW, my husband grew up in rural Illinois where there were zero minorities (except for the Chinese family who ran the restaurant and the Indian doctor), and he is 100% not racist.

Another thing about the South - I think in many respects Southerners learned that it was socially unacceptable to express what they really thought. In that sense, racism in the South has gone heavily underground or been re-articulated more "politely" (Confederate flags, etc). That doesn't mean it disappeared, but when you live in a place notorious for its former racism and viewed as a national embarrassment till this day (my hometown can't ever forget those hoses and that church bombing), you kinda learn to temper it a bit. I grew up around a ton of good ole boys, and I rarely if ever heard racist jokes. Homophobic jokes, on the other hand, were de rigueur. Because this area of the Midwest didn't have as high profile of a racist past, perhaps they feel more comfortable sharing what they really think?

Anyhow, that's my perspective on the South versus the lower Midwest. Of course it goes without saying that hidden racism and overt racism are both destructive.

[Goldielocks]

Has anybody mentioned an Irish Goodbye? I just learned that one.

A SAHD I know "checks in" on Facebook almost every day at a coffee shop or restaurant with his two kids. Photos of his coffee drink or food is often included. This is in between checking a pools, children's museums, etc. He must spend a fortune on food and entertainment for them during the day. As far as I know he's almost never with his wife - she must be putting in extra hours to pay for all this!

Minus the photos, I think that was my husband for a few years there!   

[HairyUpperLip]

When my wife and I moved cross-country after college, a friend of South Asian descent helped us out by driving with us. We had dinner one night at a Waffle House in Chattanooga, and Dusty the waitress was clearly pretty bothered to have a brown man in her restaurant. For some reason what felt right was to give her a big tip to show how little we cared about what she thought. As we walked out we saw her jaw drop.

But I wouldn't do that with something as big as a car.

(A big tip at Waffle House in Chattanooga is $5.)

As someone of South Asian descent, I would have been quite happy to walk out of there. I keep hearing that the South is not as bad of bigoted northerners make it out to be, but I have never had anyone get bothered by me in the north. I have had issues in Arkansas, TN, and NC.

Also South Asian.

I mostly grew up in the "South" - metro Atlanta. I also spent some time in and near Savannah.

I'd say the most racist place I've been in America is probably the midwest. I couldn't walk down the street without getting stared down.

As a middle-class-hetero-white-dude race intolerance seems to be more correlated to community size and local diversity than north/south/midwest/etc.  my 0.02$

I agree. I don't think the midwest is racist because of it's location in America. I think it's more racist because there is very little diversity.

When I lived in the midwest it was very very obvious that the town was segregated. The black people lived in one shitty part and the latinos lived in the other shitty part. The white people all lived in "suburban" part of the town in the nice houses. And the white people that actually lived intown were consider trashy and local lingo was to call them "river rats".

I was in the midwest due to an IT company setting up shop there in a town of about 60,000. The company created a need for employees with skills so a bunch of us folks of of color were imported from around America to setup shop.

The influx of Indians, Africans, traditional looking Muslims, etc definitely upset the local people.

A Lebanese co-worker got assaulted  in the street by a man with a gun who kept throwing "wet back" type comments at him and waving his gun telling him to go back home type of crap. Cop came. No recourse, didn't even give a fuck about the guy with the gun.

I was "stopped" by the police (an off duty cop in his personal vehicle) for walking through an EMPTY parking lot at night. Literally walking from the office to my apartment in an area that's commonly walked through by people.

Local shop owners were happy to refer to the blacks as ni**ers, which was shocking since I'm not even white.

A local "friend" I made would often complain to me that his parents can't sell their house that was listed due to the fact that neighborhood had gone to shit now that there was so much black pepper living there.

I don't think it was the physical location again, I believe the reason everyone was hostile was that the town is 99% white according to the US Census report. I don't think the people knew how to react to color. To have so many educated colored people in their town must have really thrown them off.

I met a black man that is married to a white lady (town native) and they did quite well with real estate. He was able to purchase one of the rich people houses and gave me a private tour. He showed me how the house had slave staircases and he took a lot of pride in the fact that he was the first non-white person to own the house. All previous owners of the house had been white doctors.

Anyways, I'm kind of rambling but just sharing my side of the story.

[HairyUpperLip]

FWIW, my husband grew up in rural Illinois where there were zero minorities (except for the Chinese family who ran the restaurant and the Indian doctor), and he is 100% not racist.

Racism isn't a hereditary trait. I'm glad your husband did not get sucked into the local antics. :)

[forummm]

I live in a metro Atlanta suburb in a very mixed area (mostly black in this section), and some white neighbors (age 65+) on my street have said several openly racist things in the very small amount of time I've actually spoken to them. I'm white.

[Sibley]

People are frightened by the unknown and by change, though they're not going to call it that or realize it. When you live in an area that is primarily white, or black, or purple, then they're going to naturally be frightened by someone different coming in. It happens with "race", religion, nationality, lifestyle - basically anything that makes you different.

If there's a small enough number of the "different" people, then all is well because they're clearly in the minority and are not a threat. When the number of the "different" people grows too large or becomes too prominent, then the fear kicks in and it can get very unpleasant.

Given time, things will calm down and people will learn to be accepting and tolerant. There are ways to speed up or slow down that process. Local officials, who are dealing with the same fear, are often guilty of making things worse before they can get better.

[vivophoenix]

oh boy. has this really turned into a thread in which we pat each other on the back for being not racist, but we point out other people(regions, states, etc) who are,  with fun stories. and then offer our made up theories for why that is so?

almost zero people going back and forth actually understand what racism is, or its historical influence,  based on these comments.
 there is way more to racism then talking shit about neighbors, co workers and acquaintances, this thread is now just a huge circle jerk.

[justajane]

oh boy. has this really turned into a thread in which we pat each other on the back for being not racist, but we point out other people(regions, states, etc) who are,  with fun stories. and then offer our made up theories for why that is so?

almost zero people going back and forth actually understand what racism is, or its historical influence,  based on these comments.
 there is way more to racism then talking shit about neighbors, co workers and acquaintances, this thread is now just a huge circle jerk.

If you and only you on this thread knows what racism is, please enlighten us then, instead of ranting about how ignorant everyone else is.

[vivophoenix]

oh boy. has this really turned into a thread in which we pat each other on the back for being not racist, but we point out other people(regions, states, etc) who are,  with fun stories. and then offer our made up theories for why that is so?

almost zero people going back and forth actually understand what racism is, or its historical influence,  based on these comments.
 there is way more to racism then talking shit about neighbors, co workers and acquaintances, this thread is now just a huge circle jerk.

If you and only you on this thread knows what racism is, please enlighten us then, instead of ranting about how ignorant everyone else is.

 i said zero going back and forth. not sero in this thread.

sure ill tell you:  its years of institutionally making sure that one ethnic group doesn't get ahead and always has less then the reigning group. so to be honest most brown people don't give  damn what you think about them, or even say. but they care when you make sure  that they have less.

and before someone jumps up and claims they dont do that. perhaps you should research redlining, and other systematic slights

[HairyUpperLip]

oh boy. has this really turned into a thread in which we pat each other on the back for being not racist, but we point out other people(regions, states, etc) who are,  with fun stories. and then offer our made up theories for why that is so?

almost zero people going back and forth actually understand what racism is, or its historical influence,  based on these comments.
 there is way more to racism then talking shit about neighbors, co workers and acquaintances, this thread is now just a huge circle jerk.

lol - you have to elaborate more if you are going to shit on everything everyone said and then offer up some weak definition...

 i said zero going back and forth. not sero in this thread.

sure ill tell you:  its years of institutionally making sure that one ethnic group doesn't get ahead and always has less then the reigning group. so to be honest most brown people don't give  damn what you think about us, or even say. but we care when you make sure  that we have less.

and before someone jumps up and claims they dont do that. perhaps you should research redlining, and other systematic slights

I don't even understand what point you are trying to say or make?

Are you claiming to have a superior understanding of racism just because our stories fall short of public lynchings? If so, I saw Obama speak in a park where they used to have KKK rallies. How many racism points do I win for that one?

[justajane]

oh boy. has this really turned into a thread in which we pat each other on the back for being not racist, but we point out other people(regions, states, etc) who are,  with fun stories. and then offer our made up theories for why that is so?

almost zero people going back and forth actually understand what racism is, or its historical influence,  based on these comments.
 there is way more to racism then talking shit about neighbors, co workers and acquaintances, this thread is now just a huge circle jerk.

If you and only you on this thread knows what racism is, please enlighten us then, instead of ranting about how ignorant everyone else is.

 i said zero going back and forth. not sero in this thread.

sure ill tell you:  its years of institutionally making sure that one ethnic group doesn't get ahead and always has less then the reigning group. so to be honest most brown people don't give  damn what you think about us, or even say. but we care when you make sure  that we have less.

and before someone jumps up and claims they dont do that. perhaps you should research redlining, and other systematic slights

I think most of us discuss what people say and the jokes they tell, because it can be a marker for whether or not someone is prejudiced. I.e. if you tell a racist joke, it's very, very unlikely that you don't harbor a deep seated view of certain people as lesser. And it's what's in the hearts of a large group of people that led to the institutional racism of which you speak. Just because people haven't talked about the issue in terms that you recognize doesn't mean we aren't aware of the institutional issues.

I just would hate for you to get a sense that we are all idiots just based on what has been said here. You can certainly think whatever you like, but I don't think it's fair to paint everyone with such a broad brush based on one isolated conversation on here about what areas of the country might have more racists per capita and why, based on our experiences.

[vivophoenix]

oh boy. has this really turned into a thread in which we pat each other on the back for being not racist, but we point out other people(regions, states, etc) who are,  with fun stories. and then offer our made up theories for why that is so?

almost zero people going back and forth actually understand what racism is, or its historical influence,  based on these comments.
 there is way more to racism then talking shit about neighbors, co workers and acquaintances, this thread is now just a huge circle jerk.

If you and only you on this thread knows what racism is, please enlighten us then, instead of ranting about how ignorant everyone else is.

 i said zero going back and forth. not sero in this thread.

sure ill tell you:  its years of institutionally making sure that one ethnic group doesn't get ahead and always has less then the reigning group. so to be honest most brown people don't give  damn what you think about us, or even say. but we care when you make sure  that we have less.

and before someone jumps up and claims they dont do that. perhaps you should research redlining, and other systematic slights

I think most of us discuss what people say and the jokes they tell, because it can be a marker for whether or not someone is prejudiced. I.e. if you tell a racist joke, it's very, very unlikely that you don't harbor a deep seated view of certain people as lesser. And it's what's in the hearts of a large group of people that led to the institutional racism of which you speak. Just because people haven't talked about the issue in terms that you recognize doesn't mean we aren't aware of the institutional issues.

I just would hate for you to get a sense that we are all idiots just based on what has been said here. You can certainly think whatever you like, but I don't think it's fair to paint everyone with such a broad brush based on one isolated conversation on here about what areas of the country might have more racists per capita and why, based on our experiences.

i see your point, however i disagree.using the racist joke indicator isnt good enough, not really to change anything.


 i do recognize the terms people are using, but i find often these terms are used to minimize a problem than actually talk about.

also shouldn't we attempt to view  racism from the eyes of the victims? not a series of 'thank god my husband escaped being a racist"  and ' this one time at band camp, these other white people said something racists to me' remarks?

im not painting everyone. im remarking to those who have said insensitive , ignorant things .

[vivophoenix]

oh boy. has this really turned into a thread in which we pat each other on the back for being not racist, but we point out other people(regions, states, etc) who are,  with fun stories. and then offer our made up theories for why that is so?

almost zero people going back and forth actually understand what racism is, or its historical influence,  based on these comments.
 there is way more to racism then talking shit about neighbors, co workers and acquaintances, this thread is now just a huge circle jerk.

lol - you have to elaborate more if you are going to shit on everything everyone said and then offer up some weak definition...

 i said zero going back and forth. not sero in this thread.

sure ill tell you:  its years of institutionally making sure that one ethnic group doesn't get ahead and always has less then the reigning group. so to be honest most brown people don't give  damn what you think about us, or even say. but we care when you make sure  that we have less.

and before someone jumps up and claims they dont do that. perhaps you should research redlining, and other systematic slights

I don't even understand what point you are trying to say or make?

Are you claiming to have a superior understanding of racism just because our stories fall short of public lynchings? If so, I saw Obama speak in a park where they used to have KKK rallies. How many racism points do I win for that one?

and you i believe are just being flippantly obtuse for the hell of it

[Beaker]

This racism debate is wonderful, and I'm sure exactly why everyone reads this thread. Can we talk about gun control next?

/s

[Chris22]

I think most of us discuss what people say and the jokes they tell, because it can be a marker for whether or not someone is prejudiced. I.e. if you tell a racist joke, it's very, very unlikely that you don't harbor a deep seated view of certain people as lesser.

100% disagree.  I'll tell racist jokes all day long (what's black and doesn't work??*) because I find stereotypes to be funny.  But when it comes to things that actually matter, such as hiring people, giving them business, etc, I'm 100% colorblind.  I've hired and worked with/for/above black, white, brown, yellow, Jewish, female, etc.  Never had a problem with anyone, I think all of them would agree that I was 100% fair in all my dealings.  This is also why most people consider racism amongst the upper class in New England to be much worse than racism in the deep south.  If some poor white trash redneck calls a black man a n*****, what does that really do?  The redneck isn't any better off than the black man and holds pretty much zero power over him.  But if a wealthy northerner (BTW, I'm from New England) gives lip service to policital correctness and would never dream of using a racial slur, all while avoiding doing business with minorities, etc, THAT is where the real harm comes from.


*decaf coffee you racist ;)

[justajane]

This racism debate is wonderful, and I'm sure exactly why everyone reads this thread. Can we talk about gun control next?

/s

I agree. Let's move on to more flippant things. In other words, what this thread is meant for.

I will say that this underscores why I almost never talk about these things in the first place. Too bad, though -- not that discussion alone can solve our problems, but I'm not sure how trying to make commenters feel stupid (not you Beaker, I'm talking about vivaphoenix), especially when people are just sharing their experiences, helps matters either. 

[justajane]

Has anybody mentioned an Irish Goodbye? I just learned that one.

A SAHD I know "checks in" on Facebook almost every day at a coffee shop or restaurant with his two kids. Photos of his coffee drink or food is often included. This is in between checking a pools, children's museums, etc. He must spend a fortune on food and entertainment for them during the day. As far as I know he's almost never with his wife - she must be putting in extra hours to pay for all this!

Minus the photos, I think that was my husband for a few years there!

Yeah, as a SAHM myself, I really get it, but I'm just overwhelmed by the volume of visits he posts on Facebook. It must really add up financially. I think the pools, museums, etc. are much more valuable than the food. I've tried to pack sandwiches and stuff to eliminate the temptation to eat out.

[vivophoenix]

This racism debate is wonderful, and I'm sure exactly why everyone reads this thread. Can we talk about gun control next?

/s

I agree. Let's move on to more flippant things. In other words, what this thread is meant for.

I will say that this underscores why I almost never talk about these things in the first place. Too bad, though -- not that discussion alone can solve our problems, but I'm not sure how trying to make commenters feel stupid (not you Beaker, I'm talking about vivaphoenix), especially when people are just sharing their experiences, helps matters either.

youre right!

lets move onto more positive talk:  making fun of our friends, coworkers and family members behind their backs after they share  their experiences.

[mm1970]

I feel fairly safe making a really sweeping generalization that racism is absolutely thriving in all rural areas of this country, regardless of region. The level of racism then recedes, roughly in correlation with increasing density of population, but is still present.

That is an absolutely pathetic statement with nothing to support it.

I agree it's definitely pathetic. And I'm pretty sure it's also true. Note that I didn't say that I think every individual in rural areas is racist, or that all people in cities aren't. I've lived rural areas, small cities, and large cities, in three different regions of the country (though not the South) and I think the country is making slow but steady progress. But I still think racism is thriving.

I was actually sort of defending the South, which gets a terrible rep. I think my home region (Midwest) is also very racist, but it is kept more on the down-low there because of socio-cultural expectations...Midwestern 'nice' and so on. My husband's from the West, and his impression is that it's thriving there, as well.

But if you have stats to make me less cynical, I'd be very happy to see them. I do tend to assume the worst when it comes to humanity LOL.

I wonder sometimes too.  I grew up in a rural area, and my area was all white.  Then I moved to the bigger town (pop 6000), and the school had one black kid and two Asians.  I never really considered the town terribly racist, but then, there weren't really other races.

Then I went back after living in bigger cities like Pittsburgh and DC.  And wow, yeah, the town really is racist, including many of my family members.  Who thought it was okay to use the "N" word, because they weren't referring to ALL black people just the bad ones.  WTF??

Of course now most of my interactions are via facebook, and many of my small town friends are constantly posting racist things - although now it's the "damn Mexicans".  And the thing is, there STILL aren't many (if any) Latinos in my home town (though we opened a Walmart, and there are actually black people!)  So, the only experience these people have with Latinos and their "taking our jobs" and "living on welfare" are what they hear on Fox News.  I posted something in response to our local paper - which had a racist photo/ comment about the illegals lining up to get drivers' licenses.  They showed a line at the DMV with a lot of Latinos.  One of my small town friends says "well it's true".  Newsflash, this CALIFORNIA.  We don't have a white majority - a good 45% of the people in this town are "brown" and they aren't illegal, they are American!!

Anyway, just another observation.

[HairyUpperLip]

also shouldn't we attempt to view  racism from the eyes of the victims? not a series of 'thank god my husband escaped being a racist"  and ' this one time at band camp, these other white people said something racists to me' remarks?

im not painting everyone. im remarking to those who have said insensitive , ignorant things .

I was the victim in one of my stories. Did you see it from my eyes?

and you i believe are just being flippantly obtuse for the hell of it

No, not at all. I thought it was an amazing thing. First time I saw a President in real life which was really cool itself. He stood in the park where there used to be KKK rallies and gave a re-election speech.

In the 90's, 20/20 specifically did a special on the town and how they openly did not want black residents.