Overheard at Work

[lisahi]

So if you're insinuating that *I* don't know what I'm doing, then that's bunk. If I buy or sell or change my investment strategy, of course I will research before I make a move. That doesn't mean I could sit down and write out with precision the dictionary definitions of certain terms.

I don't think they're insinuating it, I think you said it.

If we're talking about the average Jane or Joe investing in their retirement account, I think it would be NICE if they did some research, but no, it's not necessary. Retirement accounts are made for dummies now, and I think that's the way it should be.

I entirely disagree. If they don't know their VTSAX from their elbow, how are they going to avoid signing up for a variable annuity with 3%-a-year fees when they finally do decide to put money away? Investors may not need to know the differences between MSCI and CRSP indices, but they need to know what exactly they're investing in, how it works, and what it costs - especially if their intermediaries are trying to make fee disclosures as opaque as possible and HR knows fuck-all about the plan they're offering.

I can see you didn't get what I was trying to say, but that could be my fault and that's fine. This is an argument not worth having and I'm not invested in what you think I did or didn't mean or do or don't know. So let's get back to the purpose of this thread.

[iris lily]

Our Mustachian friend moved into his parents home when he was in his 30's in order to save money--fast--for a house. It was fine with them and I doubt that he paid for anything because they had no debt (house and cars paid for--his father wanted to do all the yard work himself etc. being VERY Mustachian.)

DH lived with his parents, on their farm, into his 30's. He helped with farm work during the season. He saved up a nice 'stache doing so, and that initial 'stache propelled us into big 'stache territory 25 years later. And not surprisingly, DH's parents are very frugal and will die multi-Millionaires.

There's nothing wrong with responsible adult children living in the parental home, paying or not paying to stay there, when all parties agree it's a good thing.

[PeteD01]

All of these examples show a real lack of effort on the part of the US gvt to educate its citizens about simple financial matters.

It is not the US govts job to "educate" its citizenry.

But they are doing it anyways:

http://investor.gov/


Not a bad resource at all.

[Insanity]

Our Mustachian friend moved into his parents home when he was in his 30's in order to save money--fast--for a house. It was fine with them, I doubt that he paid for anything because they had no debt (house and cars paid for--his father wanted to do all the yard work himself etc. being VERY Mustachian themselves.)

DH lived with his parents, on their farm, into his 30's. He helped with farm work during the season. He saved up a nice 'stache doing so, and that initial 'stache propelled us into big 'stache territory 25 years later.

There's nothing wrong with responsible adult children living in the parental home, paying or not paying to stay there, when all parties agree it's a good thing.

Yep. It totally depends on the relationship. We have a loan with my parents where every payment they fight me on paying it back.  They wouldn't care if we lived with them and didn't pay any rent, food, or whatever. 

[Le0]

I have to weigh in here. My brother is in his second year of university. My mother works at the university, which is about a 20 min bike from home. She bikes when ever the weather lets her.

Because she works at the university my brother and sister get free tuition (GRRR I missed out). So you would think that my brother would live at home, work in the summer and save money while attending school. Maybe even buy a house once he gets a 'real' job. Nope he chooses to rent a house in town, about 20 mins on the other side of the university. Everything he makes goes to paying for his lifestyle, and to top it off, he missed a rent payment recently, and is talking about dropping out of school to work. (I am not against not going to school, but when its free its hard to argue against it)

Nothing I say can turn him around, he does what feels good.

One case where he should be living at home.

[MamaStache]

Conversation on Tuesday:
Me:   What did you guys do this weekend?
Co-worker: Went to the casino with my friend.   We lost.

Conversation on Wednesday:
Co-worker: OK, tell me if you think I'm a bad mom.  Stacy and Chad* (children's names changed) want to join soccer this summer.  It's costs $100 each for them to join.  If I pay by the end of next week, I can save 10%. 
Me: Oh cool...
Co-worker:  Well, I already told them they could play.  But I am thinking about it now that it is really expensive and they both got a $50 bill from Christmas that they didn't spend yet.  I think I am going to tell them they have to pay $50 each towards sign up costs if they want to play.
Me: That would be a good lession in priorities and money for them, but you already told them they could play.
Co-worker:  yeah but I can talk them into using their own money.
Me: At least don't make them pay all of their Christmas money.   They will be paying over 1/2..... and you already told them they could play!

I just feel bad that she feels that trips to the casino are affordable but investing in activities she promised her children are not.

[AlanStache]

Conversation on Tuesday:
Me:   What did you guys do this weekend?
Co-worker: Went to the casino with my friend.   We lost.

Conversation on Wednesday:
Co-worker: OK, tell me if you think I'm a bad mom.  Stacy and Chad* (children's names changed) want to join soccer this summer.  It's costs $100 each for them to join.  If I pay by the end of next week, I can save 10%. 
Me: Oh cool...
Co-worker:  Well, I already told them they could play.  But I am thinking about it now that it is really expensive and they both got a $50 bill from Christmas that they didn't spend yet.  I think I am going to tell them they have to pay $50 each towards sign up costs if they want to play.
Me: That would be a good lession in priorities and money for them, but you already told them they could play.
Co-worker:  yeah but I can talk them into using their own money.
Me: At least don't make them pay all of their Christmas money.   They will be paying over 1/2..... and you already told them they could play!

I just feel bad that she feels that trips to the casino are affordable but investing in activities she promised her children are not.

dont have kids but that seems like a shit thing to do.  I will gamble a bit bit draw the line at 50$ a few times a year.  Just seems like changing the rules half way along, "O-you want to eat this week, well you remember that tooth fairy money...".
 
At some point would it be ok to tell your kids that they have say a 300$ per year (or some such) event/activity budget and that includes birthday parties and sports and holding them to that?

[grantmeaname]

Maybe she has work to get done? That's the most generous explanation.

[dragoncar]

Maybe she has work to get done? That's the most generous explanation.

Or maybe he's worried about UV exposure?

[bikebum]

Our Mustachian friend moved into his parents home when he was in his 30's in order to save money--fast--for a house. It was fine with them, I doubt that he paid for anything because they had no debt (house and cars paid for--his father wanted to do all the yard work himself etc. being VERY Mustachian themselves.)

DH lived with his parents, on their farm, into his 30's. He helped with farm work during the season. He saved up a nice 'stache doing so, and that initial 'stache propelled us into big 'stache territory 25 years later.

There's nothing wrong with responsible adult children living in the parental home, paying or not paying to stay there, when all parties agree it's a good thing.

Yep. It totally depends on the relationship. We have a loan with my parents where every payment they fight me on paying it back.  They wouldn't care if we lived with them and didn't pay any rent, food, or whatever.

I lived with my parents as a working professional for a while. I paid rent, but when I decided to save and buy a house, they said to not pay rent anymore and put it towards the down payment. That allowed me to get my own house really fast. It was a good thing for me.

[limeandpepper]

There's nothing wrong with responsible adult children living in the parental home, paying or not paying to stay there, when all parties agree it's a good thing.

+1

If the parents don't care about payment, not sure why a stranger should decide what's wrong for someone else's family matters.

[shortly]

A coworker just traded in a three-year-old car (3,000 miles on it, still upside down on its loan) and bought a new car. Payments on the new car are over $700 per month for who knows how long.

Yes, 3,000 miles is correct.

The really bad part? The aforementioned coworker and spouse both work (at the same place) with me and ride together everyday - in the spouse's car that also has a giant payment.

[greenmimama]

A coworker just traded in a three-year-old car (3,000 miles on it, still upside down on its loan) and bought a new car. Payments on the new car are over $700 per month for who knows how long.

Yes, 3,000 miles is correct.

The really bad part? The aforementioned coworker and spouse both work (at the same place) with me and ride together everyday - in the spouse's car that also has a giant payment.

Whoa, talk about overkill

[Latwell]

Ahh you reminded me of another terrible coworker.

Strike one:
This guy has a 1 bedroom apartment with his cat. He's super close with his parents so I thought it was stupid that he was moving out bc he claims he claims he has practically no savings and is paying off his student loan. As soon as his one car loan was about to be paid off, this guy chooses to trade it in and buy a NEW car. I ask him why but a new car, you were about to have no car payment at all. His response, "it was priced right". A new car is neverrrrr priced right.

I fail to see why it's a strike for an adult to stand on their own and not sponge of mom & dad any longer.  (Now yes, better to have a place where he can also save and to not buy a new car, but still, not making mom & dad foot his lifestyle is good.)

By the way, strike one wasn't him moving out of his parents house. The moving out part background leading to strike #2. Strike 1 was him buying a NEW car bc it's "priced right". Strike 2 was him seriously considering to upgrade his apartment from a 1 bedroom to 2 bedroom so his cat has more room.

[Hedge_87]

Today a young coworker was complaining about retirement to an older coworker. The conversation went something like this
Young cw "I'll never be able to retire thanks to Obama and the nazis blah blah blah"
Old cw "if I was your age I would just try and save one dollar everyday and put that in a savings account you would be set by the time you retire"

[NeverWasACornflakeGirl]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."

Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving. 

[Hedge_87]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."

Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving.

HOLY CRAP!!!! Good for you! Let them be all pissy lol. It's alway amazes me how some people can have such resentment for somebody who has achieved their goals.

[ncornilsen]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."

Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving.

HOLY CRAP!!!! Good for you! Let them be all pissy lol. It's alway amazes me how some people can have such resentment for somebody who has achieved their goals.

You retiring is just holding up a big mirror that makes them see how little they've been doing... so they feel guilty, and transmit that back as the jealousy, etc... it's funny isn't it?

[nikki]

Today a young coworker was complaining about retirement to an older coworker. The conversation went something like this
Young cw "I'll never be able to retire thanks to Obama and the nazis blah blah blah"
Old cw "if I was your age I would just try and save one dollar everyday and put that in a savings account you would be set by the time you retire"

That's almost as good as my mom telling my sister to save 1% of her income for retirement--as though it were good advice. For the record, my sister earned around $11,000 last year.

Unfortunately, I don't think she even saved 1%.

[Hedge_87]

yea I didn't bother to explain that $1x365x working careerX0.01% interest (he specifically said savings account) = not very much at all by the time you retire.

[trailrated]

yea I didn't bother to explain that $1x365x working careerX0.01% interest (he specifically said savings account) = not very much at all by the time you retire.

Enough to fully fund a 401k for 1 year.... if the limit does not go up at all for 40 years...

[Twenty4Me]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."

Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving.

Congratulations!!!

[Redgreen]

My first post, hello all :)

Last year a woman I work with had been trying to save for a new motorcycle, she bought a used car for around $800.00 in great condition and very low milage (good move on her part).

She got the bike at the end of the summer and last week bought a used truck with the trade in on her paid off Bronco, another loan.

This conversation we had yesterday.
Me; So, how much did you pay for the bike?
CW; 11k
Me; Oh, so you paid up on it or about done?
CW; (After hearty laugh) No way.
Me; But you where saving for it, how much did you put down on it?
CW; $1.500.00, (laughing) I'm in so much debt, but you know, you can't take it with you. When you retire, you might be withered and old not able to enjoy it, so you might want to enjoy it while you can.
Me; True, but, what if you retire and are perfectly healthy and don't have anything left?

The subject then turned to my relatives and hers that are way past retirement and enjoying life. I think it made her think but not sure it sunk in all the way.

There are so many at work that I could start my own thread here.   

[Nords]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."
Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving.

Retirement has a way of separating your friends from your co-workers...

[mm1970]

     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

I would struggle to verbally answer the question as to the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account. I know somewhat, but not enough to try and articulate it. That said, all I care about is whether I'm getting a good return and whether my investments are diversified at the risk level I'm willing to accept at this point in my life. You don't actually need to know a whole lot about the specifics of investing to achieve that through your retirement account. Most retirement investing through employer-provided accounts allows you to pick funds by answering a few questions about what you want and where you want to be at retirement. You then choose the funds which are recommended, and ignore it until you need the money. While I'm sure educating yourself and picking investments for maximum return may be a challenge some people want to take on, you don't need to get into specifics to be able to achieve a decent return on your retirement accounts. The important thing is that you're contributing sufficiently.

Obviously, if you want to invest beyond what is provided by your employer, then you should work to educate yourself on more specifics of choosing funds, diversifying, managing risk, etc.

With all due respect to you...one of the cardinal rules of investing is "if you dont understand what you are investing in, dont invest in it". You are leaving too much in the hands of others. This info is not complicated and is all over the web. Good luck

Or, you pay someone else to do the work for you.
I know, I know, not exactly mustachian. I have a very good friend who makes a living as an investment advisor. 

[mm1970]

I find it interesting that most other social conventions get challenged on this site, but "working adults must live separately from their parents" seems to get assumed and defended a fair bit. There's still an undertone of shame or extreme circumstances when that choice is discussed.

Perhaps it's because the hot chicks are reluctant to spend the night at the bachelor pad of a guy who lives in his mother's basement...

I'm not saying that it's right or wrong, only that it's difficult to procreate those genes to future generations.

Ha!  You know, I *just* finished The Way We Never Were by Stephanie Coontz (on your recommendation, I think?) and that was an interesting part of the book.  How we moved towards this "nuclear family" model and it doesn't always work out best.

I have, in the past, thought "you still live with your parents?"  But I have a younger coworker who is 27 and lives with his parents.  That kid is saving BANK.  He brings his lunch every day, and his "fun" is fishing and camping.  My step dad lived with his parents until he married my mom, at 43.

[NeverWasACornflakeGirl]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."
Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving.

Retirement has a way of separating your friends from your co-workers...

Thanks so much for all of the support, all!  My MIL can be a pain at times, but she summed it up:  "Fuck them!  We'll have cake and our own celebration!"  :-)

[Zamboni]

They've only had 1 retirement celebration at my offices the whole time I've been working.  The one time was for a guy in his 80's.  They didn't do much (a cake and some balloons and a little gathering), but it was something.  Generally there were no parties at that place, but one of the admin assistants really liked him so she organized it.

Then a few months later another guy (in his 70's) retired.  Nada.  He made a comment to me about it later.  That was when I realized how sucky we were at that particular place about retirements and life transitions in general (like babies, graduations, etc.)

But two people made their retirements a celebration day in their own way:  both times by walking around and ceremoniously giving their "stuff" away to other individuals at work. 

The first guy I barely knew because I was just a co-op student at the time, but we did say "hi" when we passed in the hallway frequently and sometimes sat in the same meetings.  One day he was working on something and I heard him say "If this doesn't work right tomorrow morning, then that's it, I'm going to retire." The next afternoon he approached me in my lab holding his stapler in both hands and said "Zamboni, you've been really pleasant to work with this year, and I'm hoping you'll appreciate having my stapler since I won't be needing it anymore."  So I took the stapler, thanked him for being a nice co-worker, wished him well, and we shook hands.  Apparently he did the same thing with various people with his scissors, tape dispenser, cup full of pens, etc.  It sounds corny, but we all became possessive of those items.  "Hey, hey, don't touch that stapler!  It's the one Jim gave me!"

Another time (different place) a woman was retiring.  This was pre-MMM, and she seemed too young to retire to me and everyone else.  Her last day she also gave away a bunch of her stuff individually and ceremoniously, but this time she brought in stuff like "work clothes" from home as well.  For example, she gave me her briefcase, which I had complimented one day when we were on a business trip together.  Hilariously, she gave my colleague her work stash of pads and tampons (ceremoniously.)  I think she brought in a few things targeting people but then tried to give everybody something.

[Anatidae V]

When an older lady retired recently, the bosses' PA organised for two baby orangutans to be adopted in her name and we had cake. We actually are a fairly celebratory group, though, and have "10 rules of cake" which dictate when you must bring in snacks to share, and have previously had Xmas decoration competitions while the other floors in our building (all the same company) just put up a single corporate decorated Xmas tree.

[Joggernot]

So, I've retired twice from the same place.  The first time I got NADA.  Nothing.  No one took me to lunch, so I just left.  Later they called me back to work part time.  After three years of that I sent in my second retirement letter.  About a month later I got a nice plaque and a card signed by the people who were working there at the time.  Of course it came by mail...

[Albert]

In my work place retirements are celebrated extensively. How extensively depends a bit from the final position in the department. When one of the project leaders retired (he was 62) we had a celebratory lecture by him followed by a small party with cakes, beer, wine and presents for the guy. We all collected some money for presents (cake and wine are brought by the guy leaving), head of the department gave a speech etc. When a lab technician retires he/she usually invites people they have worked with during the years and generally people they like to a small party in the coffee corner again providing food and drinks, but collecting presents in return. Not mandatory of course, but almost all people do. In fact almost everyone does it when they leave, doesn't necessarily have to be retirement. If it's someone really important then it would be organised officially with everyone invited.

Actually we are quite good at celebrating things here. For every major achievement (new product on the market, for example) or just a stage gate there would be a picnic organised on company grounds, the core team might be invited for a dinner to a fancy restaurant etc. Sometimes they would also distribute extra vouchers one could spend in local shops (non-food).

[CarDude]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."

Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving.

Congratulations! At the very least, the experience shows you (if you didn't already know) who the good ones were.

[blackomen]

My fiancee had this conversation with a coworker shortly after we got engaged -

Coworker: Congrats!  I hope he's financially secure.  What car does he drive?
Fiancee: A 1999 Honda Civic.
Coworker: What???  That doesn't look really good.  So what kind of work does he do?
Fiancee: He's a analyst for a Hedge Fund.

The coworker was speechless after that...

And no, contrary to what you might read in the media, I only make roughly the median US salary.

[Nords]

In my work place retirements are celebrated extensively.

Military retirement ceremonies are such a big deal that my spouse and I actually found them to be too stressful.  When our turns came, we politely declined... and then disappeared early on our last day in the office.

Some of our chains of command were insistent about following the tradition, or that we'd change our minds and resent the bosses for not talking us into having a ceremony, or that we were missing a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity, or that we were somehow disrespecting their professional skill at executing a retirement ceremony.  We had several lectures about "closure" and "paying respects" and "saying goodbyes".  I saw the whole thing as a huge time-wasting hassle, and there was no way that I wanted to be up on a stage in dress whites spending hours of my valuable liberty following a script instead of having fun.

Besides, I'd seen one or two steely-eyed killers of the deep get just a little teary-eyed from the sound track and the emotional impact of the moment.  I wasn't going to take that risk, either...

You know, I *just* finished The Way We Never Were by Stephanie Coontz (on your recommendation, I think?) and that was an interesting part of the book.  How we moved towards this "nuclear family" model and it doesn't always work out best.

Glad you enjoyed it!  That was a real eye-opener on our short-term appreciation for cultural history.

[AlanStache]

We have only had a few people leave (voluntarily) while I have been at my current employer, was always a good lunch out attended by everyone and a nice gift or two.  I imagine my perfect retirement day would be the group lunch then bumming a ride to the airport to start a round the world trip paid for with airline miles staying in hostels and only taking what I could carry on my back.  That feeling of freedom would have to be off the carts, then to have your first-post-career-morning be in Fiji....

[eyesonthehorizon]

Thanks so much for all of the support, all!  My MIL can be a pain at times, but she summed it up:  "Fuck them!  We'll have cake and our own celebration!"  :-)

Congrats!!! Too bad for your (former!) coworkers that they can't be glad about it or at least take some inspiration to better their own situation. I'm slowly beginning to realize a big part of being happy in life is knowing how to have your own party and disregard the personal inability of others to participate in being happy with you. Enjoy the cake!!

Re: thread topic: I hear some pretty defeatist things at work about how much a person 'needs', i.e. about lifestyle inflation. My previous job at a fancy grocery paid quite a lot less, and my coworkers then still somehow scraped by. If I admit what I budget for food, people gape and assume I'm starving ($95 means not only do I not starve, I have an imported cheese affinity I still get to indulge.) The other day in line I heard a coworker telling another he 'needed' $300-500/mo. for groceries for himself alone and lamenting how expensive food has gotten - turns out he shops almost exclusively at my aforementioned former workplace.

The lack of perspective among the relatively high-income is what baffles me - do you think it's ever occurred to him or the masses like him that the people working where he shops, living in the same area, make maybe half as much and still, somehow, eat?

[Travis]

Military retirement ceremonies...

One more mandatory formation...

[trailrated]

Sorry for my rant if I just "don't get it" being young. But it seems like some posters are upset they did not get a retirement party or recognition at work before they left. I guess my POV is you finally achieved FI, and all they other people at work have not...therefore they are still working. So you expect people that do not have FI to spend money on you? I don't get it.

Although I would understand some nice words or a card after years of working with people.

[dragoncar]

     I've been talking to the guys at work about finances lately and I've come to realize that out of the 40 or so regular people I work with there are exactly 2 that I know of that have even a clue about the subject of investing. So, recently at a Union meeting I brought up that I'd like to have a financial representative from our annuity plan come in and give a presentation on how the plan works and what you can invest in.
     Many people balked at the idea because no one really understands it. I said that I understood it and so should everyone else. I then asked for a show of hands as to who knew the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account....not one hand went up. Some of these guys have been contributing for over 20 years and have no clue where their money is invested! They were mortified to find out that investing is one of those things that you must self educate yourself about.

I would struggle to verbally answer the question as to the difference between a mutual fund, an index fund and a money market account. I know somewhat, but not enough to try and articulate it. That said, all I care about is whether I'm getting a good return and whether my investments are diversified at the risk level I'm willing to accept at this point in my life. You don't actually need to know a whole lot about the specifics of investing to achieve that through your retirement account. Most retirement investing through employer-provided accounts allows you to pick funds by answering a few questions about what you want and where you want to be at retirement. You then choose the funds which are recommended, and ignore it until you need the money. While I'm sure educating yourself and picking investments for maximum return may be a challenge some people want to take on, you don't need to get into specifics to be able to achieve a decent return on your retirement accounts. The important thing is that you're contributing sufficiently.

Obviously, if you want to invest beyond what is provided by your employer, then you should work to educate yourself on more specifics of choosing funds, diversifying, managing risk, etc.

With all due respect to you...one of the cardinal rules of investing is "if you dont understand what you are investing in, dont invest in it". You are leaving too much in the hands of others. This info is not complicated and is all over the web. Good luck

Or, you pay someone else to do the work for you.
I know, I know, not exactly mustachian. I have a very good friend who makes a living as an investment advisor.

Hope his name isn't madoff...

[randymarsh]

Sorry for my rant if I just "don't get it" being young. But it seems like some posters are upset they did not get a retirement party or recognition at work before they left.

I think it's less wanting a big party or lots of recognition and more expecting people not to be resentful/negative.

[NeverWasACornflakeGirl]

Sorry for my rant if I just "don't get it" being young. But it seems like some posters are upset they did not get a retirement party or recognition at work before they left. I guess my POV is you finally achieved FI, and all they other people at work have not...therefore they are still working. So you expect people that do not have FI to spend money on you? I don't get it.

Although I would understand some nice words or a card after years of working with people.

I'm 45 (is that oldish?) and I agree. I couldn't care less if I get a card or recognition when I finally quit at FI (in about 4 years, I hope). But then I don't socialize much with my coworkers. I guess it depends on the work environment. To me, retirement ceremonies make sense for something like the military (if you want one), because you are actually ending at a recognized date (20 years) and are receiving the official perks of "retiring." Plus, the military for all its flaws does have some nice traditions (being piped out when you retire, tough men crying and thanking their wives, I love it).

Nevertheless, I can't imagine the awkwardness of people celebrating my "retirement" when I leave work and others are struggling with past money issues or other issues that I don't have to deal with (medical, supporting older parents, etc.). So, I'll gently go, perhaps with a link to MMM stuck on my desk (if MMM is still active then!) or a list of books if someone asks me, but a party? No way.

Perhaps you're just one of the engineer types that just doesn't get involved with your coworkers.  ;-) 

In most workplaces it's traditional for coworkers to celebrate important milestones together:  baby showers, 10 and 20 year work anniversaries, weddings, retirement, etc.  It doesn't have to involve an outlay of cash.  Often the employer organizes a celebration if it's work-related, like work anniversaries and retirement, and sometimes co-workers organize it if it's more personal (weddings, baby showers, etc.). 

When you're part of a group that celebrates things together, it can be hurtful when one of your very important milestones is ignored, or, worse, when it incites jealousy, bitterness, etc.  This is one of the many occasions when I find it helpful not to take things personally.  :-)

I think it's less wanting a big party or lots of recognition and more expecting people not to be resentful/negative.

Yes. 

[Albert]

Sorry for my rant if I just "don't get it" being young. But it seems like some posters are upset they did not get a retirement party or recognition at work before they left. I guess my POV is you finally achieved FI, and all they other people at work have not...therefore they are still working. So you expect people that do not have FI to spend money on you? I don't get it.

Although I would understand some nice words or a card after years of working with people.

It's not about money or presents at all, it's about recognition from people with whom you have worked for years (sometimes decades). Some double as friends anyway… I believe it's good for general morale and positive working environment for those not leaving. I've never heard anyone expressing jealousy about it. Albeit I haven't seen anyone here retire early either. People are leaving either for a standard retirement (60+) or for other jobs.

[Rollin]

Monday is my last day (hooray!) and I am officially retiring.  Yesterday one of my coworkers told me, "You'll be back in a month begging for your job back because you'll be so bored."  My (tightly restrained) response:  "I don't think so."
Really surprised by the jealousy, nastiness, gloom, and general pessimism my retirement has stirred up at my work place.  One person took me out to lunch.  Everyone else seems to be pretending it's not happening.  Makes me even happier to be leaving.

Retirement has a way of separating your friends from your co-workers...

Thanks so much for all of the support, all!  My MIL can be a pain at times, but she summed it up:  "Fuck them!  We'll have cake and our own celebration!"  :-)

You should be proud of yourself breaking away from the herd like that.  I gave a retirement lunch for a CWr Friday and another recently retired CWr was there too.  She thanked me so much for encouraging her to check out retiring.  I told her what to look for and said "you can do it!"  She did and still can't get that grin off her face.  She says she is so very happy.

My problem though in encouraging them is that I have had 5 retirements in 4 years, from an office with only 6 left!  Pretty soon I won't have any left.  I'm next though!!!!

[iris lily]

I am dreading whatever retirement event my work will feel obligated to provide.

I am utterly sick of the retirement events for others leaving and I would just like to leave without a party. But I also recognize that, generally speaking, a simple retirement event is part of work life. And what I mean by "simple " is a sheet cake, purchased by the company, and where a few people come to chat and say goodbye. I am pleased to see that at my work we are finally scaling these things down to a 2 hour party with cake. At one time it was a BIG GIANT event with a dinner at a restaurant that I had to pay for and attend on my own time. No, I don't think that's appropriate.

I had one employee who I liked well enough to honor his request for no party. That's the only person I've ever honored that way. Everyone else is required to have a small event, tiny though it may be. :) and of course there are the attention hogs who have to have a party. One jerk "retired" and had a big party with tons of presents, and then the following week went to his new full time job. I never understood that other than he was an attention hog.

I think it is great when people throw their own retirement party for freinds, family, and co-workers at their own expense, that seems very nice. But to put that burden on managers at work (I are one!) no no no no nope, don't do that to me.

No freaking presents, for god's sake. ugh.

[greenmimama]

The company or boss should give a present as an appreciation for the employees hard work, not coworkers??

[iris lily]

The company or boss should give a present as an appreciation for the employees hard work, not coworkers??

Yes, but you would be surprised at the number of coworkers who give presents to the retiree here. I think that is silly.

[Insanity]

The company or boss should give a present as an appreciation for the employees hard work, not coworkers??

Yes, but you would be surprised at the number of coworkers who give presents to the retiree here. I think that is silly.

I don't think so, but then again, I'm not always for giving a gift because one has to.

[Stacey]

I've been enjoying this thread for a while and thought I'd pipe in.  So many come to mind, but a classic one happened a few years ago.  I was an associate at a large law firm and a senior associate, making in the mid- to high- 200 thousands was complaining about the dismal bonuses.  Hers was probably in the range of $40-50k that year.  She didn't know how she was going to make all of her payments and decided to take out a loan to cover her living expenses.  Mind you, she was married to another working lawyer with no children.  I'm not sure where all of that cash was going- - but I almost had a heart attack when she was complaining about bonuses.  Perspective, people!

[Gray Matter]

I've been enjoying this thread for a while and thought I'd pipe in.  So many come to mind, but a classic one happened a few years ago.  I was an associate at a large law firm and a senior associate, making in the mid- to high- 200 thousands was complaining about the dismal bonuses.  Hers was probably in the range of $40-50k that year.  She didn't know how she was going to make all of her payments and decided to take out a loan to cover her living expenses.  Mind you, she was married to another working lawyer with no children.  I'm not sure where all of that cash was going- - but I almost had a heart attack when she was complaining about bonuses.  Perspective, people!

(emphasis above added)

I agree with you that people in certain high-paying industries and with big bonuses lose perspective.  For the past 12 years, I have worked in one of those industries and every year at bonus time, I calculate how long someone making minimum wage would have to work to earn my bonus.  It's sobering and helps me remain grateful, even in lean(er) bonus years.

Of course, this is my last week before moving to the non-profit world, so goodbye bonuses!  It was fun while it lasted.

[plainjane]

I agree with you that people in certain high-paying industries and with big bonuses lose perspective.  For the past 12 years, I have worked in one of those industries and every year at bonus time, I calculate how long someone making minimum wage would have to work to earn my bonus.  It's sobering and helps me remain grateful, even in lean(er) bonus years.

It would be great if that came automatically on the pay stub, much like the credit card statements now say "if you only paid the minimum, it would take you 5 years to pay this off".

(My bonuses lately have been in the mid 4 figures after tax, so they don't really impact my overall financial life, though they've probably cumulatively shortened the mortgage by about a year.)