Author Topic: Overheard at Work 2  (Read 1127563 times)

bbqbonelesswing

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 319
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Philly
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2950 on: December 30, 2020, 10:16:35 AM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.

TomTX

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5345
  • Location: Texas
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2951 on: December 30, 2020, 02:04:52 PM »

Me: "Take off the license plate and buy another car with cash?"



Is this a PA thing?  I thought most states registered licence plates to specific cars

It's both, sorta.  The plate belongs to the owner, and when you sell the car, you take your plate off.  Then when you go get the new car registered, you register your plate to the new vehicle.  (I'm in PA)

Texas does this as well.

Dave1442397

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1652
  • Location: NJ
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2952 on: December 30, 2020, 04:10:07 PM »

Me: "Take off the license plate and buy another car with cash?"



Is this a PA thing?  I thought most states registered licence plates to specific cars

It's both, sorta.  The plate belongs to the owner, and when you sell the car, you take your plate off.  Then when you go get the new car registered, you register your plate to the new vehicle.  (I'm in PA)

Texas does this as well.

NJ gives you the option of transferring the plate to a new car or just turning it in and getting a new plate. Depending on when you registered the old car, it can be cheaper to transfer the plate, which is what I did for our last two cars.

2sk22

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 1504
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2953 on: December 30, 2020, 04:36:55 PM »

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.

Absolutely! I bought lunch when I first started working (year ago) but soon stopped after I realized how much I was spending on eating out every day.

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 9930
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2954 on: December 31, 2020, 01:24:00 AM »

Me: "Take off the license plate and buy another car with cash?"



Is this a PA thing?  I thought most states registered licence plates to specific cars

Naw, it's the same way in Ontario.   The plate stays with the owner.

Glad to hear Ontario is finally a state!

Oooh, look who found some nits to pick over the holidays!

Thanks to COVID it’s not just for the holidays.  I’m actually doing it full time now. 

LennStar

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3690
  • Location: Germany
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2955 on: December 31, 2020, 08:34:12 AM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.
My favorite example from the forums is still the guy who went to Starbucks in the morning and midday for a 4$ coffee each time while he got free coffee from his work.
It's literally a fucking house during the "normal" work life that is going into bad coffee there.

bbqbonelesswing

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 319
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Philly
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2956 on: December 31, 2020, 08:43:23 AM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.
My favorite example from the forums is still the guy who went to Starbucks in the morning and midday for a 4$ coffee each time while he got free coffee from his work.
It's literally a fucking house during the "normal" work life that is going into bad coffee there.

Our office got a super nice coffee machine last year. It's huge; makes espresso, cappuccino, hot chocolate, you name it. This thing can even add a dash of vanilla or chocolate flavor if you're feeling fancy. It's always stocked and free to use. Still, people walk across the street to Starbucks every day. I'll never understand.

Adventine

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2425
  • Location: Memphis, USA
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2957 on: December 31, 2020, 08:57:47 AM »
In my previous non-Mustachian reincarnation, I was a daily Starbucks regular.

I did it to treat myself, to get out of the office, and away from a horrible commute, a job I disliked and coworkers I didn't really get along with. All these factors created an emotional void that wouldn't have been fulfilled by free coffee in the office, no matter how nice.

About a year of this nonsense, I found MMM and realized I was just undermining myself.
« Last Edit: December 31, 2020, 09:02:30 AM by Adventine »

bbqbonelesswing

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 319
  • Age: 31
  • Location: Philly
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2958 on: December 31, 2020, 11:13:33 AM »
In my previous non-Mustachian reincarnation, I was a daily Starbucks regular.

I did it to treat myself, to get out of the office, and away from a horrible commute, a job I disliked and coworkers I didn't really get along with. All these factors created an emotional void that wouldn't have been fulfilled by free coffee in the office, no matter how nice.

About a year of this nonsense, I found MMM and realized I was just undermining myself.

Good for you! When I need to get out, I usually just take the free coffee and go for a walk with a mug.

Adventine

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2425
  • Location: Memphis, USA
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2959 on: January 01, 2021, 02:53:09 AM »
In my previous non-Mustachian reincarnation, I was a daily Starbucks regular.

I did it to treat myself, to get out of the office, and away from a horrible commute, a job I disliked and coworkers I didn't really get along with. All these factors created an emotional void that wouldn't have been fulfilled by free coffee in the office, no matter how nice.

About a year of this nonsense, I found MMM and realized I was just undermining myself.

Good for you! When I need to get out, I usually just take the free coffee and go for a walk with a mug.

Thanks :) Sometimes I look back on those times and shake my head. But if I hadn't been a former consumerist, I wouldn't have the frugal convictions that I have today.

Kazyan

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 114
    • Books By Tanner Jacobi
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2960 on: January 01, 2021, 09:20:35 AM »
I used to have a Starbucks habit as well, which was during my a term (~3mo) of my first co-op. I didn't have the excuse of hating my job/commute/coworkers; I just liked the coffee and pumpkin bread. This, too, was before I dicovered MMM, and during my early college days. During a different term with the same employer, I also made a habit of walking to a Jimmy John's to get lunch every day.

That sure was some wasted cash. But looking back, it's certainly not the worst of the bad habits I've developed in my life.

Valley of Plenty

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 361
  • Age: 28
  • Location: Pennsylvania
  • Toss a Coin to Your Net Worth
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2961 on: January 01, 2021, 10:22:46 AM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.

Food is definitely the line item with the most room for improvement for me. I've optimized just about every other expense, but I still don't really do much cooking. I need to change that this year.

ixtap

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4574
  • Age: 51
  • Location: SoCal
    • Our Sea Story
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2962 on: January 01, 2021, 12:39:00 PM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.

Food is definitely the line item with the most room for improvement for me. I've optimized just about every other expense, but I still don't really do much cooking. I need to change that this year.

Come join us: https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/throw-down-the-gauntlet/january-2021-healthy-habits/

Just Joe

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6781
  • Location: In the middle....
  • Teach me something.
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2963 on: January 01, 2021, 06:06:03 PM »
Had a holiday conversation with a coworker this week that was so similar to ones written about here I kind of wanted to look for a hidden camera. Huge grocery bills, two car payments, one income, huge utility bills and nothing left over. As each layer of the onion was revealed - quick math showed how their choices were multiples of x2 and x3 of what we spend in the same city. And we don't have any car payments.

If we can do it, they can do it. With one spouse at home, there ought to be a spare moment or two between them to optimize some of their choices.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2021, 06:08:22 PM by Just Joe »

talltexan

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5344
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2964 on: January 07, 2021, 09:36:09 AM »
I'm part of a group at work who all log into our 401Ks the first day of the year and compare investment returns.

Sadly, I seem to be among the most risk-averse, with 20% of my account in bonds, so my 9.96% ROR for 2020 was not very competitive.

Just Joe

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6781
  • Location: In the middle....
  • Teach me something.
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2965 on: January 07, 2021, 09:45:24 AM »
Another chapter to my story above: already two car payments and now a desire to own a Tesla (actively shopping). Coworker makes similar money to me but is sole income earner at their house. Even basic mental math shows this would be nearly impossible without parental gifts. Whew.

talltexan

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5344
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2966 on: January 13, 2021, 08:14:11 AM »
I desire to own a tesla.

But my lifestyle at the moment would make it impossible to justify buying a second car if I hadn't already entered April 2020 having that second car. It's really getting more use for storage right now than it is for transportation.

Just Joe

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6781
  • Location: In the middle....
  • Teach me something.
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2967 on: January 13, 2021, 08:47:33 PM »
I'd love to have a Tesla S. Can't justify it with our 10 minute commute. Maybe a Chevy Bolt or Nissan Leaf someday. Don't need any more/newer cars right now.

Just Joe

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 6781
  • Location: In the middle....
  • Teach me something.
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2968 on: January 14, 2021, 10:46:57 AM »
I’m in law enforcement, we have lots of gun nuts.  I will never be one because I’m not willing to pay $500 plus for one.

That's where I'm at. I was in the military and would love to have a pistol like the one I carried on duty just as a toy to occasionally take out and target shoot with but I won't pay those prices.

I really don't NEED a gun of any type. The town where I live is very safe and I don't go other places that are unsafe. I a have several friends here that carry all the time. I don't see the point.

Cost, hassle, risk.

A little folding pocket knife to open boxes and and clean my fingernails is enough for me. ;) 
« Last Edit: January 14, 2021, 11:00:10 AM by Just Joe »

NorthernMonkey

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 200
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2969 on: January 14, 2021, 01:30:41 PM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.

I'd hate the hassle and stress of going out to eat every day. Going out 3 times a day? I'd not have any time to do anything else other than going out to eat.

Plina

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 663
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2970 on: January 15, 2021, 11:06:01 AM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.

I'd hate the hassle and stress of going out to eat every day. Going out 3 times a day? I'd not have any time to do anything else other than going out to eat.

I traveled for 6 months and after a couple of months I was so tired of making the decision were I would eat and what I should eat every day three times a day. I actually missed cooking and I don’t even like cooking.

mm1970

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 10923
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2971 on: January 15, 2021, 03:02:50 PM »
I have a coworker who is always complaining about money problems to me. I've been offering for years to help them with a budget but have never been taken up on it. This week, we were talking about how they only had a few hundred dollars to last until next paycheck, and I suggested they learn to cook in 2021. This person eats out for EVERY MEAL. Breakfast, lunch and dinner. The response I got was, "But eating out is so cheap. For $8 I can get a full meal..."

$8 is cheap?

Yesterday we had dinner at home which came out to $3 per person. Throughout the course of a year, eating 3 meals a day, $3/meal adds up to $3,285.00 vs  $8,760.00 for $8/meal. That's a difference of $5,475.00. Over the 4 years this coworker and I have been working together, that could have been a grand total of $21,900.00.

It's really amazing how much impact our eating habits have on our spending.

I'd hate the hassle and stress of going out to eat every day. Going out 3 times a day? I'd not have any time to do anything else other than going out to eat.
No kidding, blech.  We have been eating out once/ week because of COVID (getting takeout), which is 2 to 3x normal.  I don't like it!

I could improve our grocery bill, but honestly, with COVID, kids schooling at home, FT job...I just switched to Instacart, and that's going to increase my bill, and I just don't care.

$8670 a year though...for one person.  Our grocery bill last year for the 4 of us was $11,000 and change, then you have to add about $2k for eating out.

JAYSLOL

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2149
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2972 on: April 26, 2021, 09:40:44 AM »
New guy at work is probably late-30s, doing entry-level labor work.  Needed to take an advance on his paycheck just a couple days in, we don’t normally do that, but agreed to pay him early for the two days already worked.  He also said he couldn’t afford to get the proper work clothing etc right away.  Meanwhile he is driving a full-size truck, smokes and eats out every day for lunch.  He also complains about collections calling him as well as the money he figures he owes in taxes.  I found out he has been doing 20 hours a week of side work at $25/h, which he says is his “fun money” for smoking and eating out etc.  I said that sounds like a lot of work to maintain those habits.  $2k a month wasted while complaining about money.  I just can’t even. 

TheFrenchCat

  • Bristles
  • ***
  • Posts: 347
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2973 on: April 26, 2021, 09:47:23 AM »
2k a month on fun money, oh goodness.  That's our whole base budget, if you don't count what we spend/save on our daughter's education.  I can only image how fast he could reach FIRE if he buckled down.   I kind of hope he's not married and doesn't have kids.  I'd think even a more normal consumer would think that's excessive.

JAYSLOL

  • Handlebar Stache
  • *****
  • Posts: 2149
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2974 on: April 26, 2021, 10:28:07 AM »
2k a month on fun money, oh goodness.  That's our whole base budget, if you don't count what we spend/save on our daughter's education.  I can only image how fast he could reach FIRE if he buckled down.   I kind of hope he's not married and doesn't have kids.  I'd think even a more normal consumer would think that's excessive.

He’s divorced, no kids thankfully.  Yeah, our base expenses are $3k in semi-hcol area for our family of 3, and our “fun money” eating out, entertainment etc is barely 1/10 of his.  Shooting for a 50% savings rate this year.  I definitely wouldn’t spend a nickel on anything non-essential if I was even remotely broke.  Even a small setback like a vehicle breakdown or minor health issues and this guy’s whole life could literally unravel into homelessness with the way he manages things. 

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 9930
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2975 on: April 26, 2021, 12:09:05 PM »
No kidding, blech.  We have been eating out once/ week because of COVID (getting takeout)

I don’t follow this logic.  What about Covid makes you eat out more often?

I’ve eaten out far less during Covid because it’s such a pain in the ass to disinfect (I reheat everything to 165).  I am aware that there’s “no evidence” for food borne Covid spread, but I also don’t know what studies have been done to prove/disprove the hypothesis.  Whenever I see that there’s “no evidence” for something I ask what evidence might be Availabe.  For example, has someone innoculated food with Covid and fed it to 100 monkeys?  No.  Has someone done intense contact tracing of an unmasked symptomatic line cook to see if any of their customers has contracted Covid?  Maybe?  I haven’t seen that study.  I’m willing to accept that it’s an unlikely avenue for transmission but also know that restaurant back of house is and has always been filthy so I don’t really trust those guys to take any precautions unless I’ve personally visited the kitchen


Dee_the_third

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 557
  • Location: Podunk, Midwest
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2976 on: April 26, 2021, 01:57:47 PM »
We've been getting more takeout because we want to support our local restaurants. It's not like they're essential to our day to day lives, but they add essential character to our town and I want them to survive.

Chris22

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3770
  • Location: Chicago NW Suburbs
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2977 on: April 26, 2021, 03:36:24 PM »
No kidding, blech.  We have been eating out once/ week because of COVID (getting takeout)

I don’t follow this logic.  What about Covid makes you eat out more often?

I’ve eaten out far less during Covid because it’s such a pain in the ass to disinfect (I reheat everything to 165).  I am aware that there’s “no evidence” for food borne Covid spread, but I also don’t know what studies have been done to prove/disprove the hypothesis.  Whenever I see that there’s “no evidence” for something I ask what evidence might be Availabe.  For example, has someone innoculated food with Covid and fed it to 100 monkeys?  No.  Has someone done intense contact tracing of an unmasked symptomatic line cook to see if any of their customers has contracted Covid?  Maybe?  I haven’t seen that study.  I’m willing to accept that it’s an unlikely avenue for transmission but also know that restaurant back of house is and has always been filthy so I don’t really trust those guys to take any precautions unless I’ve personally visited the kitchen

That sound exhausting, and frankly anti-mustachian*/anti-math. We’ve been doing this for more than a year. If there were cases of people catching Covid from takeout food we’d have heard about it by now.  You’re far more likely to get e.coli or similar than Covid from food


*anti-mustachian in the sense of expending time/effort to insure against things they have a microscopic chance of happening.

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 9930
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2978 on: April 26, 2021, 07:11:11 PM »
No kidding, blech.  We have been eating out once/ week because of COVID (getting takeout)

I don’t follow this logic.  What about Covid makes you eat out more often?

I’ve eaten out far less during Covid because it’s such a pain in the ass to disinfect (I reheat everything to 165).  I am aware that there’s “no evidence” for food borne Covid spread, but I also don’t know what studies have been done to prove/disprove the hypothesis.  Whenever I see that there’s “no evidence” for something I ask what evidence might be Availabe.  For example, has someone innoculated food with Covid and fed it to 100 monkeys?  No.  Has someone done intense contact tracing of an unmasked symptomatic line cook to see if any of their customers has contracted Covid?  Maybe?  I haven’t seen that study.  I’m willing to accept that it’s an unlikely avenue for transmission but also know that restaurant back of house is and has always been filthy so I don’t really trust those guys to take any precautions unless I’ve personally visited the kitchen

That sound exhausting, and frankly anti-mustachian*/anti-math. We’ve been doing this for more than a year. If there were cases of people catching Covid from takeout food we’d have heard about it by now.  You’re far more likely to get e.coli or similar than Covid from food


*anti-mustachian in the sense of expending time/effort to insure against things they have a microscopic chance of happening.

Says the guy who said he has been eating out once a week “because of Covid” but doesn’t answer why Covid makes him eat out more.

Ecoli is also a great reason to reheat your takeout food, so It’s just a win win.  It too much trouble so I cook my own food as much as possible, which is far more mustachian from both a math and philosophical point of view

I also personally think it’s super mustachian to insure against things that are low-probability but high-cost.  I have liability insurance in case I run someone over because I cannot afford that payout.  I have fire insurance in case my home burns down because the price of rebuilding will seriously impact my savings.  I microwave my food for 2 minutes and wear a mask because no amount of money will bring me back from the dead
« Last Edit: April 26, 2021, 07:17:12 PM by dragoncar »

Chris22

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3770
  • Location: Chicago NW Suburbs
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2979 on: April 26, 2021, 09:55:40 PM »
No kidding, blech.  We have been eating out once/ week because of COVID (getting takeout)

I don’t follow this logic.  What about Covid makes you eat out more often?

I’ve eaten out far less during Covid because it’s such a pain in the ass to disinfect (I reheat everything to 165).  I am aware that there’s “no evidence” for food borne Covid spread, but I also don’t know what studies have been done to prove/disprove the hypothesis.  Whenever I see that there’s “no evidence” for something I ask what evidence might be Availabe.  For example, has someone innoculated food with Covid and fed it to 100 monkeys?  No.  Has someone done intense contact tracing of an unmasked symptomatic line cook to see if any of their customers has contracted Covid?  Maybe?  I haven’t seen that study.  I’m willing to accept that it’s an unlikely avenue for transmission but also know that restaurant back of house is and has always been filthy so I don’t really trust those guys to take any precautions unless I’ve personally visited the kitchen

That sound exhausting, and frankly anti-mustachian*/anti-math. We’ve been doing this for more than a year. If there were cases of people catching Covid from takeout food we’d have heard about it by now.  You’re far more likely to get e.coli or similar than Covid from food


*anti-mustachian in the sense of expending time/effort to insure against things they have a microscopic chance of happening.

Says the guy who said he has been eating out once a week “because of Covid” but doesn’t answer why Covid makes him eat out more.

Ecoli is also a great reason to reheat your takeout food, so It’s just a win win.  It too much trouble so I cook my own food as much as possible, which is far more mustachian from both a math and philosophical point of view

I also personally think it’s super mustachian to insure against things that are low-probability but high-cost.  I have liability insurance in case I run someone over because I cannot afford that payout.  I have fire insurance in case my home burns down because the price of rebuilding will seriously impact my savings.  I microwave my food for 2 minutes and wear a mask because no amount of money will bring me back from the dead

I never said anything about eating out due to Covid, that was someone else.

Unless you are elderly or have significant other issues, the odds of dying of Covid are infinitesimal.  I had Covid back in October, it was an extremely mild cold, lasted for a day. Aside from loosing smell for a week, it was a total non issue.

gooki

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2917
  • Location: NZ
    • My FIRE journal
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2980 on: April 26, 2021, 10:24:24 PM »
Quote
We’ve been doing this for more than a year. If there were cases of people catching Covid from takeout food we’d have heard about it by now.

Quote
I had Covid back in October

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 9930
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2981 on: April 26, 2021, 10:32:14 PM »
Quote
We’ve been doing this for more than a year. If there were cases of people catching Covid from takeout food we’d have heard about it by now.

Quote
I had Covid back in October

I’d like to hear about the contact tracing that was done

dragoncar

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 9930
  • Registered member
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2982 on: April 26, 2021, 10:41:49 PM »
My bad on the name mixup

There’s a lot we don’t know because nobody in power wants to know. 

My gut does say take out is a small risk so I’m willing to put a small effort into avoiding that risk

If we want to be anecdotal, I got sick a lot more when I was eating more takeout food
« Last Edit: April 26, 2021, 10:44:03 PM by dragoncar »

Chris22

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3770
  • Location: Chicago NW Suburbs
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2983 on: April 27, 2021, 07:09:35 AM »
Quote
We’ve been doing this for more than a year. If there were cases of people catching Covid from takeout food we’d have heard about it by now.

Quote
I had Covid back in October

I’d like to hear about the contact tracing that was done

My in laws went to a wedding, outside, and caught it from a guest. Then they came to my house and gave it to us because their fucking moron doctor told them “it’s only a sinus infection.”  Thank God they gave it to us and not the other way around because if I gave it to them I’d never hear the end of it.

TheGrimSqueaker

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2607
  • Location: A desert wasteland, where none but the weird survive
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2984 on: April 27, 2021, 08:04:16 AM »
Now I know why the squeaker is so grim

In other news, my manager was just promoted. We've got a new bungee boss who is deferring to our absentee team lead and absorbing his lack of clue.

I, however, have a job offer in a different division and my last day is in mid-May. It sucks to leave my crew but I cannot abide this level of dysfunctional incompetence.

TheGrimSqueaker

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2607
  • Location: A desert wasteland, where none but the weird survive
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2985 on: April 27, 2021, 08:09:11 AM »
2k a month on fun money, oh goodness.  That's our whole base budget, if you don't count what we spend/save on our daughter's education.  I can only image how fast he could reach FIRE if he buckled down.   I kind of hope he's not married and doesn't have kids.  I'd think even a more normal consumer would think that's excessive.

He’s divorced, no kids thankfully.  Yeah, our base expenses are $3k in semi-hcol area for our family of 3, and our “fun money” eating out, entertainment etc is barely 1/10 of his.  Shooting for a 50% savings rate this year.  I definitely wouldn’t spend a nickel on anything non-essential if I was even remotely broke.  Even a small setback like a vehicle breakdown or minor health issues and this guy’s whole life could literally unravel into homelessness with the way he manages things.

That mentality could explain why he's divorced. People can seldom be financially irresponsible well into their twenties or thirties unless they have an enabler. But even married people eventually get tired of wiping butt.

SwordGuy

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 8963
  • Location: Fayetteville, NC
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2986 on: April 27, 2021, 09:07:49 AM »
Now I know why the squeaker is so grim

In other news, my manager was just promoted. We've got a new bungee boss who is deferring to our absentee team lead and absorbing his lack of clue.

I, however, have a job offer in a different division and my last day is in mid-May. It sucks to leave my crew but I cannot abide this level of dysfunctional incompetence.
@TheGrimSqueaker ,
Last day as in taking the new job offer or retiring for good?

Gronnie

  • Pencil Stache
  • ****
  • Posts: 630
  • Age: 38
  • Location: MN
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2987 on: April 27, 2021, 09:17:18 AM »
I'm jumping off a sinking ship. Manager at new company has verbally confirmed an offer is forthcoming.

Current job can't for the life of them figure out why all the best employees are leaving.

jinga nation

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2706
  • Age: 247
  • Location: 'Murica's Dong
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2988 on: April 27, 2021, 10:13:46 AM »
I'm jumping off a sinking ship. Manager at new company has verbally confirmed an offer is forthcoming.

Current job can't for the life of them figure out why all the best employees are leaving.

Perhaps you could offer some "consultancy services" to study the brain drain for 30 days, for a fee of course, after you're gone. :p

zolotiyeruki

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 5622
  • Location: State: Denial
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2989 on: April 27, 2021, 10:19:08 AM »
Now I know why the squeaker is so grim
In other news, my manager was just promoted. We've got a new bungee boss who is deferring to our absentee team lead and absorbing his lack of clue.
For our collective edification, can you elaborate on what you mean by "bungee boss"?  I can imagine a few different definitions, but I'm not sure how you define it.

I'm jumping off a sinking ship. Manager at new company has verbally confirmed an offer is forthcoming.

Current job can't for the life of them figure out why all the best employees are leaving.
Potential "Epic FU Story" ahead?

jinga nation

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2706
  • Age: 247
  • Location: 'Murica's Dong
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2990 on: April 27, 2021, 10:28:49 AM »
When I switched employers in 2017, I made it a point to attempt to train my replacement. But that transition didn't happen well. I offered free help for the the first month after I left (new job was in building opposite to old job). No questions were asked. The following month, started getting questions. Offered two options:
1. Pay me directly per hour as a 1099
2. Hire my new employer for professional services, who'd send me in.

They wouldn't do #1 because they couldn't pass that cost to their D0D customer. They mulled #2, then gave up because "fees are too high". It took them over a year to fill my old seat. And my replacement disappears all the time due to Reserves duty.

Bumped into my old manager a year after I left, he said I was doing the job of 2 engineers. Came home, looked at what I was doing at my present employer, realized I was going above and beyond my role, parlayed that into a $25k instant-ish raise.

Then COVID struck. Many don't want to go in to the customer site. Those of us who do have become invaluable. Then add those who've left to switch to FinTech to work from home full time. So I'm doing the work of 1.5-2 humans. Have asked for a substantial raise, have been told it will happen because I carried extra burden last year, same for my team. (Employer is very generous, pays more than competitors, and doesn't have layers of money-sucking overhead management. Company owned by, run by, full of engineers and IT people.)

jinga nation

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2706
  • Age: 247
  • Location: 'Murica's Dong
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2991 on: April 27, 2021, 10:36:22 AM »

TheGrimSqueaker

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2607
  • Location: A desert wasteland, where none but the weird survive
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2992 on: April 27, 2021, 12:20:58 PM »
@zolotiyeruki
Bungee Boss: https://dilbert.com/strip/1994-09-07

Exactly this.

I've been at this company 22 years and am on manager number 22. Most of them have been within the past fifteen years. This is only my second voluntary transfer. To get promoted, you have to have the same manager for at least two years back to back.

Michael in ABQ

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 2654
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2993 on: April 27, 2021, 01:20:44 PM »
My boss is leaving for a new job (promotion) in a few weeks. Another person in our department of 20-30 also just left for another organization (promotion I think, maybe lateral). I am planning on leaving by the end of the year. I work with a lot of contractors and their management is all worthless and that trickles down to the folks on the ground. I feel like most of my time is spent trying to get something out of them and then documenting how they failed to do their job - meanwhile picking up the critical tasks that they failed to do. A new contract starts in several months, but this will be the third contractor in my ~3 years and they just hire the same people from the old contract so nothing really changes. It's still the same broken culture that has an attitude of "well that's how we've always done it" even if it's wrong and contrary to written guidelines and regulations. I have zero confidence the new contractor will do much better - though at least they won't get paid for empty seats

I should have probably 7-10 trained people to do the task at hand but instead I've got 2 semi-trained people, 3 brand new ones, and one new manager over all of them who is just making things worse. Plus the contractor fired the most productive person for a BS reason. I'm actively working to hire her - partially because she does good work, and partially to jab a thumb in their eye for being a-holes. Even with a fully trained and fully manned staff that would only be enough to handle the new work, not fix all the problems that decades of outsourcing have caused.


The fired contractor still passes along unsolicited information to me from the current batch of contractors including how their management is bad-mouthing me behind my back. Really looking forward to buying a business and running that full-time.

mm1970

  • Senior Mustachian
  • ********
  • Posts: 10923
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2994 on: April 27, 2021, 04:14:08 PM »
No kidding, blech.  We have been eating out once/ week because of COVID (getting takeout)

I don’t follow this logic.  What about Covid makes you eat out more often?

I’ve eaten out far less during Covid because it’s such a pain in the ass to disinfect (I reheat everything to 165).  I am aware that there’s “no evidence” for food borne Covid spread, but I also don’t know what studies have been done to prove/disprove the hypothesis.  Whenever I see that there’s “no evidence” for something I ask what evidence might be Availabe.  For example, has someone innoculated food with Covid and fed it to 100 monkeys?  No.  Has someone done intense contact tracing of an unmasked symptomatic line cook to see if any of their customers has contracted Covid?  Maybe?  I haven’t seen that study.  I’m willing to accept that it’s an unlikely avenue for transmission but also know that restaurant back of house is and has always been filthy so I don’t really trust those guys to take any precautions unless I’ve personally visited the kitchen
@Dee_  called it.

There's no evidence for COVID transmission through food, and if I were doing what you were doing, I wouldn't bother getting takeout either.

Essentially, primarily, we've done it to support our local restaurants.
We've done it because the kids have gotten bored with our food.
We've done it as a "treat" (for the kids, not us really) - where typically it would be 1-2x a month.

Honestly, it was a full year of working FT at home, never leaving the COUNTY (no vacations), in a 3 room house with 4 people and a dog (both kids doing zoom school).  We needed something "different" to look forward to each week.  Also, feeding 4 people 3-4 times a day and preparing that amount of food sucks DONKEY BALLS.

Now that the kids are back in school (mostly) full time, but we are still working from home, we are actually eating out a bit less (but still more than pre-COVID) because life without zoom school is less stressful.  In addition to having more time to work at home in peace, the kids eat lunch at school, so the amount of food prep we have to do is also down.

BlueHouse

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 4142
  • Location: WDC
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2995 on: April 27, 2021, 04:38:28 PM »
Just in case you're not familiar with it, the "AR" doesn't stand for "Assault Rifle."  It stands for "ArmaLite Rifle"--Armalite is the company that originally developed it.  Generally speaking, the term "assault rifle" only includes weapons capable of automatic fire or burst fire, and the AR-15 doesn't fall into that category.
I find the people who call this these semantics are generally the ones that are trying to change the subject from the most recent mass shooting by pointing out that someone else is "ignorant" of actual weapons classifications.  Generally, people will call a weapon that was created and used for assault, an assault-weapon or an assault rifle.  And it's not incorrect.  But by changing the subject from something seriously fucked up (mass murder) to something so esoteric (do we know what the initials stand for), gun advocates succeed in changing the narrative.  I also notice that Armalite has become the most well-known gun manufacturer ever since this tactic was developed.  I'm sure they're very pleased that you are advertising their mass-killing machines. 


And of course it is the individual states that regulate how someone can carry and own guns not (generally) the feds. In Calif open carry is illegal and gun ownership restricted. Other states are more lenient.
You may remember when open carry in CA became illegal -- and why.  It's because the Black Panthers did exactly what the nutcases in Michigan did when they open-carried into a state capital.  Panthers walked into Sacramento armed with long guns and it scared the bejesus out of all the white people.  If we really want to get serious about gun control, I think all we have to do is give a bunch of black people guns and let them open-carry.  White people will shit themselves. 

Chris22

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3770
  • Location: Chicago NW Suburbs
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2996 on: April 27, 2021, 07:00:41 PM »
One of the best, most outspoken, and my favorite 2A spokesman is a man named Colion Noir.  He was a prominent NRA spokesman for a while. 

https://www.mrcolionnoir.com/

Pretty sure the gun community is happy to have any law abiding spokesman they can, especially if they are young and not white, thus widening the appeal of the community.

Chris22

  • Magnum Stache
  • ******
  • Posts: 3770
  • Location: Chicago NW Suburbs
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2997 on: April 27, 2021, 07:05:23 PM »

I find the people who call this these semantics are generally the ones that are trying to change the subject from the most recent mass shooting by pointing out that someone else is "ignorant" of actual weapons classifications.  Generally, people will call a weapon that was created and used for assault, an assault-weapon or an assault rifle.  And it's not incorrect.  But by changing the subject from something seriously fucked up (mass murder) to something so esoteric (do we know what the initials stand for), gun advocates succeed in changing the narrative.  I also notice that Armalite has become the most well-known gun manufacturer ever since this tactic was developed.  I'm sure they're very pleased that you are advertising their mass-killing machines. 

I find that the people who intentionally obfuscate assault rifles and then yell “semantics” are intentionally blurring the lines between what a true assault rifle is, an automatic weapon which are highly regulated and largely illegal, and a common semi-automatic like an AR-15, because they want them outlawed. And outlawing them is easier if people think “assault rifle” = automatic weapon. Politicians and gun control advocates absolutely try and confuse the two to engender support for banning all of it.

It’s disingenuous and dishonest.

Sibley

  • Walrus Stache
  • *******
  • Posts: 7449
  • Location: Northwest Indiana
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2998 on: April 27, 2021, 07:21:39 PM »

I find the people who call this these semantics are generally the ones that are trying to change the subject from the most recent mass shooting by pointing out that someone else is "ignorant" of actual weapons classifications.  Generally, people will call a weapon that was created and used for assault, an assault-weapon or an assault rifle.  And it's not incorrect.  But by changing the subject from something seriously fucked up (mass murder) to something so esoteric (do we know what the initials stand for), gun advocates succeed in changing the narrative.  I also notice that Armalite has become the most well-known gun manufacturer ever since this tactic was developed.  I'm sure they're very pleased that you are advertising their mass-killing machines. 

I find that the people who intentionally obfuscate assault rifles and then yell “semantics” are intentionally blurring the lines between what a true assault rifle is, an automatic weapon which are highly regulated and largely illegal, and a common semi-automatic like an AR-15, because they want them outlawed. And outlawing them is easier if people think “assault rifle” = automatic weapon. Politicians and gun control advocates absolutely try and confuse the two to engender support for banning all of it.

It’s disingenuous and dishonest.

And then there's people like me who are pissed that there's gun control debate starting in the Overheard at Work thread. Take it to Off Topic please, where it belongs.

a1pharm

  • Stubble
  • **
  • Posts: 101
Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2999 on: April 27, 2021, 07:25:09 PM »
No kidding, blech.  We have been eating out once/ week because of COVID (getting takeout)

I don’t follow this logic.  What about Covid makes you eat out more often?

I’ve eaten out far less during Covid because it’s such a pain in the ass to disinfect (I reheat everything to 165).  I am aware that there’s “no evidence” for food borne Covid spread, but I also don’t know what studies have been done to prove/disprove the hypothesis.  Whenever I see that there’s “no evidence” for something I ask what evidence might be Availabe.  For example, has someone innoculated food with Covid and fed it to 100 monkeys?  No.  Has someone done intense contact tracing of an unmasked symptomatic line cook to see if any of their customers has contracted Covid?  Maybe?  I haven’t seen that study.  I’m willing to accept that it’s an unlikely avenue for transmission but also know that restaurant back of house is and has always been filthy so I don’t really trust those guys to take any precautions unless I’ve personally visited the kitchen

That sound exhausting, and frankly anti-mustachian*/anti-math. We’ve been doing this for more than a year. If there were cases of people catching Covid from takeout food we’d have heard about it by now.  You’re far more likely to get e.coli or similar than Covid from food


*anti-mustachian in the sense of expending time/effort to insure against things they have a microscopic chance of happening.

Says the guy who said he has been eating out once a week “because of Covid” but doesn’t answer why Covid makes him eat out more.

Ecoli is also a great reason to reheat your takeout food, so It’s just a win win.  It too much trouble so I cook my own food as much as possible, which is far more mustachian from both a math and philosophical point of view

I also personally think it’s super mustachian to insure against things that are low-probability but high-cost.  I have liability insurance in case I run someone over because I cannot afford that payout.  I have fire insurance in case my home burns down because the price of rebuilding will seriously impact my savings.  I microwave my food for 2 minutes and wear a mask because no amount of money will bring me back from the dead

Dragoncar - you are my hero.  You have figured out that taking unnecessary risks with unknown consequences is dumb, and a huge percentage of our country seems incapable of doing this (but life is hard.... waaaaah... I don't want to make food for myself... waaah... you don't have any evidence, therefore I get to do whatever I feel... waaaaaaaah...).

Keep fighting the good fight.

And in case you were still interested, the risk of contracting COVID is literally 100% higher in Americans who go to restaurants.  There have been no studies showing foodborne COVID transmission does (or does not) exist.  There have been no contact tracing studies done to prove anything.  We still don't even know if you can catch COVID from a door knob.  The lack of clarity on transmission is depressing, but at least anyone who wants a vaccine and is > 16 y/o can get one now.

If you have questions about any evidence, reply to this post, and I'll chime in whenever I have a few minutes to share it.