Author Topic: Overheard at Work 2  (Read 1117026 times)

hudsoncat

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2150 on: February 05, 2020, 01:00:03 PM »

We often poopoo people for not setting withholding to zero and missing out on that interest, but the interest gained is generally pretty insignificant. The average tax refund is $3k; assuming 2% interest and the fact that 1/12 of that is saved every month, the interest lost is only $28 or so. That's not worth arguing over.

That number came out a lot lower than I was expecting, so my math may be wrong, but I'm running out the door and can't check. Sorry if it's wrong.

I agree in that sense. It isn't much money to miss out on.But the lack of self discipline was what took me aback. I guess good on her to at least have self awareness and to find a way to force herself to save?

Davnasty

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2151 on: February 05, 2020, 01:03:16 PM »

We often poopoo people for not setting withholding to zero and missing out on that interest, but the interest gained is generally pretty insignificant. The average tax refund is $3k; assuming 2% interest and the fact that 1/12 of that is saved every month, the interest lost is only $28 or so. That's not worth arguing over.

That number came out a lot lower than I was expecting, so my math may be wrong, but I'm running out the door and can't check. Sorry if it's wrong.

I agree in that sense. It isn't much money to miss out on.But the lack of self discipline was what took me aback. I guess good on her to at least have self awareness and to find a way to force herself to save?

And for actually understanding how tax refunds work. I've spoken to several people who seem to think it's just a magical number that they have no control over.

ixtap

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2152 on: February 05, 2020, 01:12:45 PM »

We often poopoo people for not setting withholding to zero and missing out on that interest, but the interest gained is generally pretty insignificant. The average tax refund is $3k; assuming 2% interest and the fact that 1/12 of that is saved every month, the interest lost is only $28 or so. That's not worth arguing over.

That number came out a lot lower than I was expecting, so my math may be wrong, but I'm running out the door and can't check. Sorry if it's wrong.

I agree in that sense. It isn't much money to miss out on.But the lack of self discipline was what took me aback. I guess good on her to at least have self awareness and to find a way to force herself to save?

And for actually understanding how tax refunds work. I've spoken to several people who seem to think it's just a magical number that they have no control over.

It seems to be along the lines of "I hate taxes, the government is corrupt, but look at this bonus I get for following the rules!"

techwiz

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2153 on: February 05, 2020, 01:23:22 PM »


People do think it is free money and that becomes their reason to spend it on something they would not normally buy.  I hear this all the time during tax season "Getting a new TV... taking a vacation.. new video game console... with my refund cheque".  It is ok since the refund cheque is not restricted to any spending budgets or pay off debt schedule.  The tax refund cheque is a great logical loophole to financial responsibility!   

Imma

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2154 on: February 06, 2020, 03:01:04 AM »
I'm a tax professional and whenever people ask me what I do at a party or something, the first question is 'what are your tips and tricks to give me a bigger tax return?!'. My standard answer of paying more taxes during the year isn't what they are looking for. Even many well educated people have no idea how taxes work. They could if they tried to but they would rather bury their heads in the sand so they can say it's not their fault when they get into trouble.

Sugaree

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2155 on: February 06, 2020, 04:37:12 AM »
People do think it is free money and that becomes their reason to spend it on something they would not normally buy.  I hear this all the time during tax season "Getting a new TV... taking a vacation.. new video game console... with my refund cheque".  It is ok since the refund cheque is not restricted to any spending budgets or pay off debt schedule.  The tax refund cheque is a great logical loophole to financial responsibility!   

I must be doing it wrong.  While I am getting a substantial refund, it's going towards things like bumping up the sinking fund for the new HVAC unit that I'm going to need sooner rather than later. 



talltexan

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2156 on: February 06, 2020, 06:55:56 AM »
I think we should admit that setting money aside by complying with Federal law isn't the most efficient way of saving money, but at least it's saving (and not consumption).

mtn

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2157 on: February 06, 2020, 08:10:50 AM »

We often poopoo people for not setting withholding to zero and missing out on that interest, but the interest gained is generally pretty insignificant. The average tax refund is $3k; assuming 2% interest and the fact that 1/12 of that is saved every month, the interest lost is only $28 or so. That's not worth arguing over.

That number came out a lot lower than I was expecting, so my math may be wrong, but I'm running out the door and can't check. Sorry if it's wrong.

I agree in that sense. It isn't much money to miss out on.But the lack of self discipline was what took me aback. I guess good on her to at least have self awareness and to find a way to force herself to save?

And for actually understanding how tax refunds work. I've spoken to several people who seem to think it's just a magical number that they have no control over.

Eh... For some of us, it is. I have a degree in mathematics, and I've failed to correctly estimate my tax liability for the past 3 years despite ostensibly understanding how it works. Between all the pre/post tax advantaged accounts, student loan interest deduction, different side-gigs producing between 1-4 1099MISCs, not to mention the 3 W2's between my wife and I, we gave up and shoot for a hefty return refund each year. We figured it ended up being a lot less work and a lot less stress to withhold more from each paycheck, then we use the refund to pump it all into savings/debt (IRA, 401k, HSA, Student Loans... whatever the right flavor is each year).

Blah blah, interest free loan. Over the grand scheme of things, it isn't going to impact us much.

Edited because I said "return" when I meant "refund"
« Last Edit: February 06, 2020, 08:49:45 AM by mtn »

talltexan

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2158 on: February 06, 2020, 08:39:49 AM »
My wife's Roth is a one-time investment (we back-door), but all the rest, 401K, health savings acct., etc., are per pay-check for us.

Boll weevil

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2159 on: February 06, 2020, 02:00:11 PM »
I'm a tax professional and whenever people ask me what I do at a party or something, the first question is 'what are your tips and tricks to give me a bigger tax return?!'.

The dad answer is to blow it up with a photocopy machine. The greater the percentage, the larger the return. Works for paychecks too.

Dee18

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2160 on: February 06, 2020, 03:07:56 PM »
While waiting for a committee meeting to begin on campus, a colleague from another department said, “now that the university is freezing the pension, I’ll finally get around to signing up for a 403 account.  I kept meaning to do it.”  Me, “how long have you worked here?”  Him, “15 years.”

jps

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2161 on: February 06, 2020, 03:11:18 PM »
A colleague walked into my office today and said, "Do you like to make bad decisions?" Not knowing where he was going, I said "absolutely I do," and he showed me photos of a 15 year old Class-A RV that he was about to buy for $21K. Double kicker: it needs $6K of engine work as soon as he buys it.

We chatted about it for a while, and he told me that they needed something to spend their time on after they sold their house boat late last year: "we lost SO much money on that boat." I asked him what kinds of places he was looking to go RV'ing in, and he didn't have an answer. He said things like "well, if we ever drive over to [major metropolitan area 4 hours away], we can just take the RV!" and, "it'll be great to have if we need it!"

Just smile and wave, boys. Smile and wave.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2020, 04:41:50 PM by jps »

turketron

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2162 on: February 06, 2020, 03:56:55 PM »
That's nice and all, but there are just some things that don't necessarily need to be "smart" (like the smart kitchen faucet...just why?).  My laundry room is semi-detached, so sending an alert to my phone when it's done would be kind of nifty, but I've gone 10 years now just remembering to check on it after 30 or 40 minutes and I've lived.
I set the timer on the stove to remind about the dryer.

I stuck a NFC tag I had laying around to my washer so now I just scan it with my phone and it automatically starts a timer for 40 minutes

Gus

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2163 on: February 06, 2020, 10:05:15 PM »
While waiting for a committee meeting to begin on campus, a colleague from another department said, “now that the university is freezing the pension, I’ll finally get around to signing up for a 403 account.  I kept meaning to do it.”  Me, “how long have you worked here?”  Him, “15 years.”

This one was truly painful to read.

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2164 on: February 07, 2020, 07:45:46 AM »
A colleague walked into my office today and said, "Do you like to make bad decisions?" Not knowing where he was going, I said "absolutely I do," and he showed me photos of a 15 year old Class-A RV that he was about to buy for $21K. Double kicker: it needs $6K of engine work as soon as he buys it.

We chatted about it for a while, and he told me that they needed something to spend their time on after they sold their house boat late last year: "we lost SO much money on that boat." I asked him what kinds of places he was looking to go RV'ing in, and he didn't have an answer. He said things like "well, if we ever drive over to [major metropolitan area 4 hours away], we can just take the RV!" and, "it'll be great to have if we need it!"

Just smile and wave, boys. Smile and wave.

Oh parking an RV in a metro area sounds like lots of fun. So does sleeping in parking lots... I'm a fan of incognito van campers though. Much easier to use. Possibly safer if a person did want to sleep in a parking lot.

OliveFI

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2165 on: February 07, 2020, 08:04:33 AM »
My coworkers and I were discussing the possibility of moving to a LCOL area with our company. I was like, it would be nice to have a lower tax burden and cheaper rent. My coworker was like "you'd just find new ways to spend that money, it doesn't really make a difference." I was like, I would actively try to NOT spend the difference, I do have control over that after all. His was response was just "really?"

I don't think he knows spending is something you can actively control and not just something that happens to you.

ixtap

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2166 on: February 07, 2020, 08:12:12 AM »
My coworkers and I were discussing the possibility of moving to a LCOL area with our company. I was like, it would be nice to have a lower tax burden and cheaper rent. My coworker was like "you'd just find new ways to spend that money, it doesn't really make a difference." I was like, I would actively try to NOT spend the difference, I do have control over that after all. His was response was just "really?"

I don't think he knows spending is something you can actively control and not just something that happens to you.

My parents are really rather frugal, but even my Mom always told me that expenses would find a way to meet your paycheck. Maybe she meant it as warning, but she stated it as a fact. Luckily, I had reached a decent level of satisfaction just before I met DH. Everything he contributed when he moved in with me went straight to savings.

ysette9

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2167 on: February 07, 2020, 08:15:25 AM »
My coworkers and I were discussing the possibility of moving to a LCOL area with our company. I was like, it would be nice to have a lower tax burden and cheaper rent. My coworker was like "you'd just find new ways to spend that money, it doesn't really make a difference." I was like, I would actively try to NOT spend the difference, I do have control over that after all. His was response was just "really?"

I don't think he knows spending is something you can actively control and not just something that happens to you.
Sounds like the type of person who would accidentally find themselves pregnant and not know how it happened.

jps

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2168 on: February 07, 2020, 09:19:13 AM »
My coworkers and I were discussing the possibility of moving to a LCOL area with our company. I was like, it would be nice to have a lower tax burden and cheaper rent. My coworker was like "you'd just find new ways to spend that money, it doesn't really make a difference." I was like, I would actively try to NOT spend the difference, I do have control over that after all. His was response was just "really?"

I don't think he knows spending is something you can actively control and not just something that happens to you.

My parents are really rather frugal, but even my Mom always told me that expenses would find a way to meet your paycheck. Maybe she meant it as warning, but she stated it as a fact. Luckily, I had reached a decent level of satisfaction just before I met DH. Everything he contributed when he moved in with me went straight to savings.

This would happen to me if I weren't mustachian, for sure. DW and I talk about how possessions are liquid, in that however big your house is, that's how much stuff you will usually grow to accumulate. I could see the same thing happening with expenses if you weren't privy to fighting the instinct to be a consuma sucka!

Dicey

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2169 on: February 07, 2020, 10:29:33 AM »
A guy where I work is planning on buying a nice but used $4200 BMW motorcycle, a $500 helmet, a $300 riding jacket and all the safety gear. This week. He doesnt even have his 6 month emergency fund built up fully yet.  Nor does he have a motorcycle license. Nor does he have a true need for the bike. It's a total midlife crisis move to stave off burnout and feeling like he is stuck in a rut. He already has both a pickup and an electric car. Lets not forget the increase in his Geico bill to cover the motorcycle. Facepalm.

I am that guy.
No, you are not. You are not buying a motorcycle, nor the helmet, jacket or all the other stuff. You instead are going to go outside for a nice long walk. Or run, either is acceptable. And then you are going to put all that money into your emergency fund.

Then you are going to sit down and look at your life, recognize that you're not happy, figure out what will make you happy (really happy, not just a bandaid), and then start working on a plan to get you to that point.
Funny, this dude made one other post the same day and nothing since. I'd like to think they listened to your wisdom, @Sibley. That's a much happier possibility than they actually did it, crashed the bike, and can no longer post...

merula

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2170 on: February 07, 2020, 10:45:04 AM »
I'm a tax professional and whenever people ask me what I do at a party or something, the first question is 'what are your tips and tricks to give me a bigger tax return?!'.

The dad answer is to blow it up with a photocopy machine. The greater the percentage, the larger the return. Works for paychecks too.

I want you to know that I appreciate your humor, pedantry and knowledge of the most misused tax term.

OtherJen

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2171 on: February 07, 2020, 10:46:06 AM »
My coworkers and I were discussing the possibility of moving to a LCOL area with our company. I was like, it would be nice to have a lower tax burden and cheaper rent. My coworker was like "you'd just find new ways to spend that money, it doesn't really make a difference." I was like, I would actively try to NOT spend the difference, I do have control over that after all. His was response was just "really?"

I don't think he knows spending is something you can actively control and not just something that happens to you.
Sounds like the type of person who would accidentally find themselves pregnant and not know how it happened.

Yep. It amazes me that some people don't seem to realize that they can control various aspects of their lives.

SunnyDays

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2172 on: February 07, 2020, 03:02:16 PM »
A guy where I work is planning on buying a nice but used $4200 BMW motorcycle, a $500 helmet, a $300 riding jacket and all the safety gear. This week. He doesnt even have his 6 month emergency fund built up fully yet.  Nor does he have a motorcycle license. Nor does he have a true need for the bike. It's a total midlife crisis move to stave off burnout and feeling like he is stuck in a rut. He already has both a pickup and an electric car. Lets not forget the increase in his Geico bill to cover the motorcycle. Facepalm.

I am that guy.
No, you are not. You are not buying a motorcycle, nor the helmet, jacket or all the other stuff. You instead are going to go outside for a nice long walk. Or run, either is acceptable. And then you are going to put all that money into your emergency fund.

Then you are going to sit down and look at your life, recognize that you're not happy, figure out what will make you happy (really happy, not just a bandaid), and then start working on a plan to get you to that point.
Funny, this dude made one other post the same day and nothing since. I'd like to think they listened to your wisdom, @Sibley. That's a much happier possibility than they actually did it, crashed the bike, and can no longer post...

Well, doctors do call them “donorcycles” ........





AMandM

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2173 on: February 07, 2020, 03:32:43 PM »
Yep. It amazes me that some people don't seem to realize that they can control various aspects of their lives.

I wish I had a dollar for every time I've heard someone say with a shrug, "Well, what can you do" about something they can, in fact, do something about.

Goldielocks

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2174 on: February 07, 2020, 11:47:00 PM »
I'm a tax professional and whenever people ask me what I do at a party or something, the first question is 'what are your tips and tricks to give me a bigger tax return?!'. My standard answer of paying more taxes during the year isn't what they are looking for. Even many well educated people have no idea how taxes work. They could if they tried to but they would rather bury their heads in the sand so they can say it's not their fault when they get into trouble.
Make less money.
Have kids.

LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2175 on: February 08, 2020, 12:01:32 AM »
Yep. It amazes me that some people don't seem to realize that they can control various aspects of their lives.

I wish I had a dollar for every time I've heard someone say with a shrug, "Well, what can you do" about something they can, in fact, do something about.

Yes, they always forget to add "without doing anything".

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2176 on: February 10, 2020, 08:13:36 AM »
Buy a "project bike". That way you get all the benefits of having a motorcycle - except the riding it part... You can stand around and admire it, polish it, brag about it, and spend money on it. It won't move under it's own power so it is absolutely safe and no insurance or license is required.

Aegishjalmur

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2177 on: February 10, 2020, 12:02:49 PM »
Overheard via Text:

Friend: I was doing a balance transfer from one card to two others to get 0% and I hit the button too many times so the balance transferred was actually twice what it should have been. I called all the card companies and they said they can't reverse it at this time so I will have to wait until it is complete to request an overage check. It may turn out to be a good thing though as I will use the check to pay off another card that's leaving the 0% period soon.

Us: *Facepalm*

sherr

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2178 on: February 10, 2020, 01:38:54 PM »
Overheard via Text:

Friend: I was doing a balance transfer from one card to two others to get 0% and I hit the button too many times so the balance transferred was actually twice what it should have been. I called all the card companies and they said they can't reverse it at this time so I will have to wait until it is complete to request an overage check. It may turn out to be a good thing though as I will use the check to pay off another card that's leaving the 0% period soon.

Us: *Facepalm*

This actually doesn't sound too bad to me. Intentionally credit-card-hacking to give yourself a 0% loan can actually be pretty Mustachian, depending on what you do with the money. More work than I'm willing to put in, but some people here do.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2020, 02:44:35 PM by sherr »

Aegishjalmur

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2179 on: February 10, 2020, 01:57:03 PM »
it would be one thing if it was on purpose, but this was completely accidental. Then there is the issue that they had to split one card onto two others because of balances, and the implication that they have a fourth card that they will be using to pay off/pay down. This was the same person who told me that they couldn't save $7500 for a down payment for a home when they make over $70K a year(probably closer to $80K). Knowing this person they are not likely making much more than minimum payments so the transfer fees are eating an interest rate savings.

TomTX

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2180 on: February 11, 2020, 08:02:33 AM »
Overheard via Text:

Friend: I was doing a balance transfer from one card to two others to get 0% and I hit the button too many times so the balance transferred was actually twice what it should have been. I called all the card companies and they said they can't reverse it at this time so I will have to wait until it is complete to request an overage check. It may turn out to be a good thing though as I will use the check to pay off another card that's leaving the 0% period soon.

Us: *Facepalm*

This actually doesn't sound too bad to me. Intentionally credit-card-hacking to give yourself a 0% loan can actually be pretty Mustachian, depending on what you do with the money. More work than I'm willing to put in, but some people here do.

Usually those 0% loans come with a 3-5% balance transfer fee.

alienbogey

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2181 on: February 11, 2020, 03:08:31 PM »
Buy a "project bike". That way you get all the benefits of having a motorcycle - except the riding it part... You can stand around and admire it, polish it, brag about it, and spend money on it. It won't move under it's own power so it is absolutely safe and no insurance or license is required.

That could be a good plan, but only if you already have a motorcycle for riding.

Threshkin

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2182 on: February 11, 2020, 04:31:26 PM »
Buy a "project bike". That way you get all the benefits of having a motorcycle - except the riding it part... You can stand around and admire it, polish it, brag about it, and spend money on it. It won't move under it's own power so it is absolutely safe and no insurance or license is required.
This sounds vaguely like my ex-BF ;-).

You had a project BF?  :D

Kris

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2183 on: February 11, 2020, 04:40:02 PM »
Buy a "project bike". That way you get all the benefits of having a motorcycle - except the riding it part... You can stand around and admire it, polish it, brag about it, and spend money on it. It won't move under it's own power so it is absolutely safe and no insurance or license is required.
This sounds vaguely like my ex-BF ;-).

You had a project BF?  :D

Ha — many of us have had those... we just didn’t know it for a while! :D

TVRodriguez

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2184 on: February 11, 2020, 04:53:16 PM »
Buy a "project bike". That way you get all the benefits of having a motorcycle - except the riding it part... You can stand around and admire it, polish it, brag about it, and spend money on it. It won't move under it's own power so it is absolutely safe and no insurance or license is required.

That could be a good plan, but only if you already have a motorcycle for riding.
But but but....that means it'll get dirty and we can't have that now can we. I mean if we are talking clown motorcycles then they must be shiny and bug free ALL the time or how will people know you are so rich ;-).

I use to commute to my job on an old beater motorcycle which was apparently not fancy enough for the fancy Harley guys I worked with. Oh well. I FIREd and could ride whenever I wanted, for as long as I wanted, and they are still taking their 2 week vacation at Sturgis and doing the 9 to 5 the rest of the year with their bikes sitting unused in their garages. But they are shiny!

And Sturgis is fun.  But definitely filled with lots of shiny bikes.  I have no bike but happened to be visiting the Black Hills on a road trip during the Sturgis bike event.  I was there in an old Toyota Camry.

Wrenchturner

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2185 on: February 11, 2020, 08:45:52 PM »
A couple weeks ago my employer had an investment guy come in and talk to us about basic saving/investing, as well as the company RRSP matching program.  I work at an RV dealership.

It wasn't very informative since it was very general, but I learned some tax stuff.  Anyway, the first slide and first ten minutes were spent talking about how debt is terrible, and the guy called it "cancer" probably six or seven times.  The air got pretty thick in the room for that bit.  He was talking about how car loans, credit card debts and financing too much stuff are terrible for your finances and I found it refreshing to hear this attitude inside the walls of my dealership. 

Not really deriding anyone in this post, as is the tradition for this thread, but it was an interesting moment and I'm glad someone else was finally around to tell me the financial equivalent of "gravity is real", after years of hearing how it isn't.

I hope some of the people in the room learned something and left feeling more empowered in their financial situation.

LennStar

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2186 on: February 12, 2020, 04:31:39 AM »
It wasn't very informative since it was very general, but I learned some tax stuff.  Anyway, the first slide and first ten minutes were spent talking about how debt is terrible, and the guy called it "cancer" probably six or seven times. 

hm... I somehow had "sound of silence" spring up in my mind. Maybe someone could make a song "Sound of Debt"?
"Debt like a cancer grows
Hear my words so that I might teach you..."

MissNancyPryor

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2187 on: February 12, 2020, 06:49:49 AM »
The irony of that is funny-  I would bet the majority of the RVs are sold there with debt attached so it is kind of like a company health consultant coming into Budweiser declaring to the employees how alcohol is pure poison.  Their consultant rails against the thing the company has to deliver daily, that had to be awkward.

Wrenchturner

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2188 on: February 12, 2020, 11:56:14 AM »
The irony of that is funny-  I would bet the majority of the RVs are sold there with debt attached so it is kind of like a company health consultant coming into Budweiser declaring to the employees how alcohol is pure poison.  Their consultant rails against the thing the company has to deliver daily, that had to be awkward.

As the advisor said, debt is okay if it's readily serviceable.  I wouldn't pay interest on toys, but that's just me.  You're right though, tons of debt in rvs.  20+ year terms have kept the industry going, to my benefit.

happyuk

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2189 on: February 16, 2020, 05:51:43 AM »
Overheard at work during lunch

Colleague 1: "I always take out a loan for a new car"
Colleague 2: "Me too.  I've always taken out loans when I needed a new car"
Colleague 1: "I don't know anyone who has never taken out a loan for a new car"
Colleague 2: "I don't know anyone who has actually paid the full amount for a new car"
Colleague 1: "It was 35 grand for the Model 3 Tesla, waiting for it to be shipped from San Francisco"

And so on and so on, with slight variations on the main topic theme of taking out loans for new cars.

What makes it doubly perplexing is that people I am talking and with whom I work every day are not fools, being in senior technical positions and used to tackling difficult engineering problems.

I didn't chime in by saying I never take out loans for cars (or indeed anything) and never will.  They would have looked at me like I'm from Venus or something.  I'm simply glad I was able to happily sit and listen with respectful indifference to their anecdotes of finance deals, interest rates, payback "deals" and so forth.

I often feel sometimes like I was put on the wrong planet.  Do others feel the same?
« Last Edit: February 16, 2020, 06:05:42 AM by happyuk »

Imma

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2190 on: February 16, 2020, 09:01:49 AM »
Yes, absolutely @happyuk .

I work with people who are in senior finance positions and have degrees in finance / accounting / economics etc. For some reason, even though these people work with large sums of company money every single day and perfectly understand concepts like interest calculation, many seem to be totally incapable of applying them to their own private life.

We were discussing health insurance a while back. In my country the standard deductible is about €400, but you can choose a higher deductible of up to €800 and then you get a discount on your premium. The break-even point is two years. My partner is in very good health and has had a high deductible for 10 years. That means he saves €400 on health insurance premiums. As several coworkers are also in very good health (I'm not) I asked them if they had a high deductible. They looked at me as if I had 3 heads when I told them about my partner's choice. "But what if he gets a health issue?" Well, then we pay €800. "But where would you get the money so quickly?" Well, we've saved €400 every year over the past couple of years so it's not an issue. "But what if he gets a long term illness?" Then he will choose not have a high deductible next year. In the end, they couldn't understand me, I couldn't understand them, they just walked off shaking their heads at my financial irresponsibility - I am known for that, since we also both work parttime and we don't have a car. [FYI: we just did a back of the envelope calculation and if we include the value of our home and resell value of our business equipment, our joint NW is now officially in 6-figure territory. I'm 29]. It's like they somehow think money evaporates when it's not being spent.

Also, interest is a big thing. Some coworkers have talked about aggressively paying off their student loans, because everyone knows student loans are baaaad. While paying off loans is at least better than spending money on consumer crap, I really don't get why 0% interest student loans have such a bad reputation while they happily get new car loans and higher mortgages. This financially irresponsible Milennial has applied for the maximum loan I could get to pay for grad school tuition because the government's offer is so good: 0% interest, income based repayment over 30 years, even though I had the money in my bank account. I have just signed a quote for further insulation of our old house which I will pay from my savings instead.

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2191 on: February 16, 2020, 10:24:48 AM »
I didn't chime in by saying I never take out loans for cars (or indeed anything) and never will.

I once took out a 53€ "loan" for 3 weeks (unluckyly 2 bigger things got broken at nearly same time and the money just wasn't enough) since I was too lazy to go to the bank and put my cash reserves on the account. Cost me 34 cent in interest until next money came in. (I shudder every time I think about people who always live in that dispo credit area.) 

Since I still remember that from 10 years ago you may be able to guess how many other loans I had ;)


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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2192 on: February 16, 2020, 11:05:24 AM »
Overheard at work during lunch

Colleague 1: "I always take out a loan for a new car"
Colleague 2: "Me too.  I've always taken out loans when I needed a new car"
Colleague 1: "I don't know anyone who has never taken out a loan for a new car"
Colleague 2: "I don't know anyone who has actually paid the full amount for a new car"
Colleague 1: "It was 35 grand for the Model 3 Tesla, waiting for it to be shipped from San Francisco"

And so on and so on, with slight variations on the main topic theme of taking out loans for new cars.

What makes it doubly perplexing is that people I am talking and with whom I work every day are not fools, being in senior technical positions and used to tackling difficult engineering problems.

I didn't chime in by saying I never take out loans for cars (or indeed anything) and never will.  They would have looked at me like I'm from Venus or something.  I'm simply glad I was able to happily sit and listen with respectful indifference to their anecdotes of finance deals, interest rates, payback "deals" and so forth.

I often feel sometimes like I was put on the wrong planet.  Do others feel the same?

A wise woman on here once said "My Mustachian Person Problem is that sometimes I wish I could go back in the Matrix." It's definitely isolating to be financially (or otherwise) countercultural.

happyuk

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2193 on: February 16, 2020, 01:07:55 PM »
Overheard at work during lunch

Colleague 1: "I always take out a loan for a new car"
Colleague 2: "Me too.  I've always taken out loans when I needed a new car"
Colleague 1: "I don't know anyone who has never taken out a loan for a new car"
Colleague 2: "I don't know anyone who has actually paid the full amount for a new car"
Colleague 1: "It was 35 grand for the Model 3 Tesla, waiting for it to be shipped from San Francisco"

And so on and so on, with slight variations on the main topic theme of taking out loans for new cars.

What makes it doubly perplexing is that people I am talking and with whom I work every day are not fools, being in senior technical positions and used to tackling difficult engineering problems.

I didn't chime in by saying I never take out loans for cars (or indeed anything) and never will.  They would have looked at me like I'm from Venus or something.  I'm simply glad I was able to happily sit and listen with respectful indifference to their anecdotes of finance deals, interest rates, payback "deals" and so forth.

I often feel sometimes like I was put on the wrong planet.  Do others feel the same?

A wise woman on here once said "My Mustachian Person Problem is that sometimes I wish I could go back in the Matrix." It's definitely isolating to be financially (or otherwise) countercultural.

Ah yes.  Of course!  Mustachians are the ones that have decided to swallow the red pill and see the world as it is in all it awfulness.  We don't want to be comfortably numb.

Fish Sweet

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2194 on: February 16, 2020, 07:20:43 PM »
I recently left my job with nothing lined up.  The not-quite-truth I told the company is that I was returning to school full time to pursue a change of career.  The actual truth is more complicated, but the gist of it is that I was tired of working and wanted to take a break, had the savings to do so, wanted to focus on my art & growing my tiny business, and did want to go back to school and change careers... eventually, when I felt like it.

My coworkers were lovely, supportive people, but some of them were clearly very worried about me.  One of them even asked, "but how will you survive??"  I'm pretty sure she thought of the both of us as being in similar financial boats (student debt, car loan, paycheck to paycheck, tons of expenses, barely able to make minimum contributions to retirement), and I've never given her any reason to think otherwise.  I smiled and told her that I had saved up some money and would take out student loans as needed to cover the rest (I won't be taking out any student loans) and her look of shock was.... I don't know.   Not to get up on some snooty MMM high horse, but it just made me feel bad for her. 

Just Joe

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2195 on: February 17, 2020, 08:41:29 AM »
I worked at a place where some people were unhappy but didn't feel they could survive the more or less month between the old and new employer's paychecks. It was really sad. Its a good education for a new employee to see. Its an important topic I share with young folks when I get the opportunity. Savings = freedom.

Wrenchturner

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2196 on: February 17, 2020, 10:20:39 AM »
I recently left my job with nothing lined up.  The not-quite-truth I told the company is that I was returning to school full time to pursue a change of career.  The actual truth is more complicated, but the gist of it is that I was tired of working and wanted to take a break, had the savings to do so, wanted to focus on my art & growing my tiny business, and did want to go back to school and change careers... eventually, when I felt like it.

My coworkers were lovely, supportive people, but some of them were clearly very worried about me.  One of them even asked, "but how will you survive??"  I'm pretty sure she thought of the both of us as being in similar financial boats (student debt, car loan, paycheck to paycheck, tons of expenses, barely able to make minimum contributions to retirement), and I've never given her any reason to think otherwise.  I smiled and told her that I had saved up some money and would take out student loans as needed to cover the rest (I won't be taking out any student loans) and her look of shock was.... I don't know.   Not to get up on some snooty MMM high horse, but it just made me feel bad for her. 


Overheard at work during lunch
*snip*
I didn't chime in by saying I never take out loans for cars (or indeed anything) and never will.  They would have looked at me like I'm from Venus or something.  I'm simply glad I was able to happily sit and listen with respectful indifference to their anecdotes of finance deals, interest rates, payback "deals" and so forth.

I often feel sometimes like I was put on the wrong planet.  Do others feel the same?

I understand the reason to behave this way around others, but I generally try to avoid doing this.  If people are making bad decisions, they might benefit from the suggestion that they have other options.  Especially when many people in my experience tend to finance stuff because "everyone else is doing it".  Those people need to hear your story!

Obviously you have to be cautious about how you do it.  I don't judge people but I also try to avoid materialistic thinking.  Many people I work with can tell I'm frugal, so they're not surprised when I say I'm willing to spend a lump sum on occasion, like buying a new car or taking a trip somewhere.  But I don't show up with fancy clothes or a fancy car or anything like that.  If it's obvious you're not spending a lot of money, you might inspire others to do similarly.

You might invite resentment, but that's coming from someone's insecurity, not your personal inadequacy, so you can treat it like a symptom, not a disease.

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2197 on: February 17, 2020, 10:47:01 AM »
Wrench, I agree that people need to be honest and maybe it will help others.

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2198 on: February 17, 2020, 04:59:27 PM »
Just overheard a couple of workmates bitching behind my back about what a cruel parent I am/was. I unwisely opened my mouth during a conversation about pocket money. I used to give my son $100 in cash, in small notes, every week. Every week he would hand back money to be banked for savings, as well as for rent, power, phone, food, medical, clothing, transportation etc etc. He'd be left with $10 or so at ten years old. Sometimes there were tearful arguments about paying things next week, because he wanted to buy something, but he learned he would have to save up. Imagine the cruelty of preparing your progeny for life in the actual world, and not some lovely bubble of  "everyone is special" childhood!

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Re: Overheard at Work 2
« Reply #2199 on: February 17, 2020, 05:05:35 PM »
Just overheard a couple of workmates bitching behind my back about what a cruel parent I am/was. I unwisely opened my mouth during a conversation about pocket money. I used to give my son $100 in cash, in small notes, every week. Every week he would hand back money to be banked for savings, as well as for rent, power, phone, food, medical, clothing, transportation etc etc. He'd be left with $10 or so at ten years old. Sometimes there were tearful arguments about paying things next week, because he wanted to buy something, but he learned he would have to save up. Imagine the cruelty of preparing your progeny for life in the actual world, and not some lovely bubble of  "everyone is special" childhood!

I think this is brilliant.