A bit of a sad story...I wish there was a way I could help but the tentative suggestions I've made have met with strong resistance.
A coworker with a preschool toddler at home is *desperate* to be able to stay home and raise her child. She likes her job but *hates* having to come into work every day and not be with her child. I think she is truly somewhat depressed and unhappy because of it. She wishes she did not *have* to work. Her and her husband keep separate finances. I suggested that maybe if she stayed home, they could cut expenses enough to afford it i.e. drop a car and therefore a car payment, insurance, gas, cook more, less eating out, less child car,etc etc. I asked how much her cell phone bill was since that is an area where most folks *vastly* overpay by hundreds of $/month. Her response....."I don't know, he pays that bill".
She has absolutely no idea what their total monthly expenses are but is 100% convinced there is no way for her to stay home and not work. It's tragic because being able to do so would be life changing. I suspect that if her and her spouse got on the same page and drilled down the true details of all their expenses, there's a good chance she could probably stay home. It boggles my mind that this is literally probably the most important issue in her life, but she isn't willing to put in the slightest amount of effort to see if it would actually be feasible.
Another coworker was complaining about barely treading water and picking up a 2nd job for extra money. As a couple they make six figures in a low-normal COL area. Mid 30's, kids. I suggested the $15 monthly cell phone plans to free up a bunch of money as they spend hundreds on their plan. Response....."I can't afford to buy the phone out from the contract I'm on".
She owes ~$500 on her cell phone. Mid 30's, six figure income, literally do not have $500 to their name to buy a cell phone and lower their monthly payments by $200/month forever. I wish there was a way to help people like this, but I realize they have to be willing to help themselves.
I sometimes think about printing up 100 business cards with the top 10 FIRE blogs/forums. Just hand these out to people who express frustration about any matters financial. I've tried to make constructive suggestions but without the whole picture, its never very good quality information. Plus, you never know when people are being honest or spinning their stories.
I'm wasting my breath. I don't want to be anyone's financial counselor. I already do that for people and their cars and their computers. Their financial situation is really none of my business. I do want them to know that being a "typical consumer" is not their only option in life nor is it optimal.
I also don't want to load the forums with people who will never take the topic seriously. Those folks probably belong on some other forum for a moment or two first.
Every single professional advice giver will tell you the same thing, it's not about the value or veracity of the information, it's about the readiness of the person to absorb it.
People who do things that we perceive as illogical or irrational are actually acting
entirely rational according to their own internal logic.
I was having this conversation yesterday about a couple who fight A LOT and are currently spending obscene amounts of money on a wedding that one family perceives as batshit insane and the other perceives as absolutely necessary.
I spent a lot of yesterday explaining the internal logic of the in-laws who believe it's necessary to the in-laws who believe it's insane. One side perceives financial irresponsibility to be profoundly shameful and the other side perceives failing to keep up with the social norms and failing to provide their children with luxuries they never had to be profoundly shameful.
Everyone believes that their own priorities are somehow perfectly "logical" because their internal logic is geared to whatever they are most afraid of and most hopeful for, so it *feels* entirely rational to behave according to certain priorities.
But other people are driven by different fears and hopes. Not everyone is conditioned to fear or be embarrassed by debt and financial foolishness.
Being financially responsible only feels "logical" to folks who have somehow been conditioned to care more about that than other priorities that would drive excessive spending.
It's really not hard to raise humans who worry less about having money and more about how much money they *appear* to have.
Raise a bunch of humans who base their entire self-worth on the external evaluations of others within a consumerist market and you're pretty much guaranteed to generate a massive population of folks who are terrified of not impressing people with their ability to buy things.
They're not illogical at all, they're perfectly logical and aligned with their priorities according to their most powerful fears and aspirations. Our social pressures just give them a really toxic set of fears and aspirations.
Financial responsibility often requires having a mindset that is comfortable rebelling against the norm, so it's no surprise that financially responsible people are a rarer breed.
Virtually any form of health and happiness requires active rebellion against the norm. In a sick system, you have to reject the dominant discourse to be healthy.
If people aren't psychologically ready to subvert their own paradigms of "normal" then they won't be in a state to receive the "logic" of a system that rejects them.
Topic: Overheard at Work 2 (Read 1317755 times)
