No, I won't buy into your MLM

[Sugaree]

Has anyone noticed that a lot of life insurance companies are starting to sound more and more like MLMs every damn day.  An acquaintance from high school has been selling it for awhile now.  Lately her online posts are less "let me sell you a policy" and more "come work for me."

Primerica per chance? It's a full on pyramid scheme with no-one making real money.

An uncle took my parents for all their investment money decades ago that spooked them from the stock market. Took years to get them moved to Vanguard funds at Questrade instead.

Needless to say that side of the family ruined many relationships to barely make their house payments and lease a Mercedes to seem successful. The indoctrination runs deep though, they've signed their grandkids up in their downlines.

PS they think they're selling legit insurance and mutual funds, the insurance is overpriced by double other companies and the mutual funds have MER's above 5% (one was 7.5%). But fat commissions and deferred sales charges to lock you in for the max legal periods (they cycle these often enough to trigger charges and more commissions as well). It's all but criminal.

This doesn't seem to be Primerica.  At least not by that name.  I think it's called Family First. 

[Fomerly known as something]

Has anyone noticed that a lot of life insurance companies are starting to sound more and more like MLMs every damn day.  An acquaintance from high school has been selling it for awhile now.  Lately her online posts are less "let me sell you a policy" and more "come work for me."

Primerica per chance? It's a full on pyramid scheme with no-one making real money.

An uncle took my parents for all their investment money decades ago that spooked them from the stock market. Took years to get them moved to Vanguard funds at Questrade instead.

Needless to say that side of the family ruined many relationships to barely make their house payments and lease a Mercedes to seem successful. The indoctrination runs deep though, they've signed their grandkids up in their downlines.

PS they think they're selling legit insurance and mutual funds, the insurance is overpriced by double other companies and the mutual funds have MER's above 5% (one was 7.5%). But fat commissions and deferred sales charges to lock you in for the max legal periods (they cycle these often enough to trigger charges and more commissions as well). It's all but criminal.

This doesn't seem to be Primerica.  At least not by that name.  I think it's called Family First.

From their webpage,  “Agency Overrides
If you decide to start an Agency with FFL you would receive an override commission on any agent that you hire when they sell a policy. The override commission is equal to the difference of commission levels between you and your agents. The average override commission is 15% of the Annual Premium.”

Smells like an MLM.

[E16sean]

I had an interview with a German company that operates in a number of EU countries to work as a financial advisor. I have experience with funds (risk / finance background) so thought it may be worth trying.

The first stage was a group presentation with a  video showing young workers in an expensive office. They they told us that we would be provided with client list for our region and the company would support us to grow our local office.

There were some alarm bells (avoided any info on how we would be paid) but the website was professional and looked legitimate. Most information online like Glassdoor is very positive.

In the second interview they told be that I would self employed with no guarantee of income. No referrals from corporate and my network of friends, family and acquaintances would be my starting point. No fancy offices or macbook pro either.

They don't charge the client a fee so presumably they are commission-based and possibly trail comission (if it's still allowed). They changed the subject when I asked.

The way to make decent money would be to become a local manager responsible for a team, then a regional manager and finally national manger. I'd earn a percentage based on what my 'team' brings in.

At the end of the interview I was offered the job to start as a trainee on Monday. Another red flag, so I did a bit deeper research over the weekend showed similar stories to mine.

I turned them down. Close call.

[JAYSLOL]

Ok, yikes, I wasn’t sure about posting this, but I think some input from you all might be useful.  Earlier this year, a work colleague sent me an email about something crypto currency related, it looked like an email that was sent out to a large list of contacts and I thought his email had probably just been hacked and had sent out some spam without his knowledge, so I didn’t even click on it.  Well, a few months later he mentioned he wanted to get together and talk about investing in a “gold-backed crypto currency”.  I have no interest in buying into anything like that.  Was with our boss at the time and we both listened a bit, but shrugged it off.  Well, recently he mentioned it again and wants to get together to talk more about it, so out of morbid curiosity I went back to the original email to see what I could learn about it.  Oh man, it’s so much worse than just another pointless coin, it’s basically from a company that runs a terrible MLM scheme selling tiny gold bars to people at an absurd markup and there’s a huge pyramid based referral program to sign up other distributors at huge upfront cost.  I know the rational move is to politely decline a meeting because I’m not interested, but I can’t help but wonder if I can meet with him and ask questions in a way that helps him re-evaluate his investment.  (btw, he has 5 figures in these coins atm, so the stakes for him are pretty high).

An update from just over a year later, I did mention my concerns to this co-worker, but he mostly shrugged it off and didn’t seem interested in my input, only signing me up to buy in.  He hasn’t brought up anything about this since, and from what I can tell of the price of this coin in the last year has completely collapsed - his $35k portfolio at the time of original post is now worth around $250 if he left everything as-is.  Hopefully he hasn’t put anything more in.

Ok, well another update, I noticed this same person now has stickers on their car for some kind of expensive therapy machine MLM now.  :(

Freaking stop the madness already. 

[OtherJen]

I don't seem to have so many friends shilling MLMs on my Facebook feed, now that Lularoe has been disgraced. I think the 31 Bags and Usborne Books reps finally gave up. A couple are still doggedly selling Colorstreet (some form of press-on nails).

[sparkytheop]

The dumpster fire that is Lularoe just refuses to die.  But, the good thing is that have a new documentary about it to watch soon (September 10th, on Amazon Prime). https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=nJgkwIHp1pc&feature=youtu.be

[Villanelle]

I'm in a facebook group for a specific dog breed.  periodically, we get posts about "this is the best breed ever and I love mine so much.  At first I wasn't sure about my relationship with DogName, but after getting her some great training though [website], we developed an amazing bond and I can't imagine ever owning another breed. "  The language is usually a bit off and it ends in a question about wondering if anyone else has considered using that training.

It just smelled funny the first time I saw it and google of the company turne dup that it is an MLM (though like so many MLMs, they do a decent job of keeping that info out of the early search results).  And a reverse image search of the dog they claimed was there showed it was from a Purina ad.

I reported and it was deleted.  Today, there was another nearly identical post.  Different photo (with more confusing search results, but still clearly an image that has appeared around the internet.)  I think all MLM posts contain an element of insincerity, but this is outright lying.  Gross!

[jinga nation]

an acquaintance told me that in his "product" training, there was a half day devoted to social media posting and gaming it to increase sales, how to "fix" complaints and reports, how to make variations of posts to get around filters.

dipshit was selling It Works nonsense. their green goblins took over downtown Tampa for a week, and didn't follow traffic laws, causing havoc. Was in the news, cops were tired of their crap.

told my BIL to stop giving our address to people who we don't know, and don't want to know, who wants to sell us shit we don't need. I told this dipshit in my house, when he offered us a drinks can that wasn't labeled with ingredients but was meant for weight loss and energy boosting, that I prefer to eat healthy and workout 4x/week, and walks most nights after dinner, instead of drinking this abomination. We hosted him the first time for a couple of nights as a courtesy; second time, politely texted him to stay away from us.

Fuck It Works! Fuck Amway! Fuck Quixstar! Fuck all MLMs! I've lost family and friendships over these toxic money-grabbing down-line generating ponzi fuckers.

[six-car-habit]

Ok, yikes, I wasn’t sure about posting this, but I think some input from you all might be useful.  Earlier this year, a work colleague sent me an email about something crypto currency related, it looked like an email that was sent out to a large list of contacts and I thought his email had probably just been hacked and had sent out some spam without his knowledge, so I didn’t even click on it.  Well, a few months later he mentioned he wanted to get together and talk about investing in a “gold-backed crypto currency”.  I have no interest in buying into anything like that.  Was with our boss at the time and we both listened a bit, but shrugged it off.  Well, recently he mentioned it again and wants to get together to talk more about it, so out of morbid curiosity I went back to the original email to see what I could learn about it.  Oh man, it’s so much worse than just another pointless coin, it’s basically from a company that runs a terrible MLM scheme selling tiny gold bars to people at an absurd markup and there’s a huge pyramid based referral program to sign up other distributors at huge upfront cost.  I know the rational move is to politely decline a meeting because I’m not interested, but I can’t help but wonder if I can meet with him and ask questions in a way that helps him re-evaluate his investment.  (btw, he has 5 figures in these coins atm, so the stakes for him are pretty high).

An update from just over a year later, I did mention my concerns to this co-worker, but he mostly shrugged it off and didn’t seem interested in my input, only signing me up to buy in.  He hasn’t brought up anything about this since, and from what I can tell of the price of this coin in the last year has completely collapsed - his $35k portfolio at the time of original post is now worth around $250 if he left everything as-is.  Hopefully he hasn’t put anything more in.

Ok, well another update, I noticed this same person now has stickers on their car for some kind of expensive therapy machine MLM now.  :(

Freaking stop the madness already.

 Well, when he approaches you in the future about buying into his "therapy machine" - you can ask if it helps with the mental anquish of losing $34,000+ 

[Alfred J Quack]

Well, when he approaches you in the future about buying into his "therapy machine" - you can ask if it helps with the mental anquish of losing $34,000+

That would be intentionally hurtful and rubbing in the loss. Let us know what he said though, JAYSLOL...

[JAYSLOL]

Well, when he approaches you in the future about buying into his "therapy machine" - you can ask if it helps with the mental anquish of losing $34,000+

That would be intentionally hurtful and rubbing in the loss. Let us know what he said though, JAYSLOL...

He hasn’t brought up the new MLM, I only noticed the sticker, and much like the day-trading/gambling folks that love to post about their wins, but stay silent on the losses, he hasn’t brought up the old crypto scam for going on 2 years now and I haven’t asked since I already know the answer anyway.  If he starts to push the new MLM though, I’ll play dumb and ask how his crypto is going.

[Travis]

Clearly this is original content from the poster:

"Happy Business Wednesday! My name is ------ and I’ve been with Monat for a little over two years. For those that don’t know, we are a naturally based, clinically backed, and scientifically proven that specialize in hair, skin & wellness products.
Business side, I’ve managed to grow all over the US, UK, and Ireland. We’ve recently expanded to Spain & Lithuania and are working to become global. This business has let me quit my full time corporate job, matched my income by 4x, save up for students loans, & have the financial freedom to live my life unapologetically.
I work from my phone/wifi so it’s extremely convenient come PCS season & living the military life.
If you want more info, please let me know & send me a message! 🦋
Feel free to check out my IG: @-------
*if Network Marketing isn’t for you, that’s okay! I do ask that you respect my post and if it does not interest you, then don’t comment. Thank you!"

Where do I begin? The FDA called bullshit on her first claim, and the company had to pay out for having a contaminated factory and getting people sick and injured.  This poster got here a year ago and the first thing she said was "I'm new and I need friends. Send me your Instagram accounts." She's already on Facebook with them, why IG if not to push her product? Earlier this year she posted about the free trip. She's hitting everything on the bingo card except for the free car.  They've been in the military for just a couple years and if she's taking credit for expanding into other countries it's because she's got other military spouses to peddle this stuff for her. Also calling bullshit on the "corporate job" that according to her in another post she was living paycheck to paycheck.

[Alfred J Quack]

*if Network Marketing isn’t for you, that’s okay! I do ask that you respect my post and if it does not interest you, then don’t comment. Thank you!"

So she can't handle having potential victims running away be someone exposing her MLM scheme for what it is?

[OtherJen]

*if Network Marketing isn’t for you, that’s okay! I do ask that you respect my post and if it does not interest you, then don’t comment. Thank you!"

So she can't handle having potential victims running away be someone exposing her MLM scheme for what it is?

Pretty much. It's fine to use false promises to scam someone desperate out of money they probably can't afford to lose, but it's SO MEAN to call them out on the scam.

[PMG]

I take that to mean that friends have been trying to rescue her from the MLM and she’s telling them to leave her alone.

[Travis]

I take that to mean that friends have been trying to rescue her from the MLM and she’s telling them to leave her alone.

Her targets appear to be mostly other young military wives that she can hook.  Don't want anyone scaring them off...

In a different post she mentioned wanting to hold a meeting so she could talk about the business and "clear up myths and misperceptions about the company" or words to that effect.

[Evildunk99]

My in-laws fall into the category of "gullible quick buck chasers." 

SIL #1 has had 25 different jobs by age 30, most recently doing door dash. 
BIL #1 has been doing a sports podcast with his buddies for 6 hours / week for the past 4 years with zero viewership growth. 
BIL #2 is trying to make money by streaming his videogames on twitch.
SIL #2 has been doing the juice plus MLM and is now trying to sell this hydroponic tower garden thing that lets you grow your own vegetables for $500 - $1,000 up front cost.  I joke about it every time I go to aldi and buy hydroponically-grown lettuce for $3.

Predictably, none of them have any investment accounts and very little savings.

I shiver about the opportunity costs of simply getting a basic part time job with benefits, or going for higher education if they have all of these extra hours available in their lives.  Sigh. 

[mm1970]

My in-laws fall into the category of "gullible quick buck chasers." 

SIL #1 has had 25 different jobs by age 30, most recently doing door dash. 
BIL #1 has been doing a sports podcast with his buddies for 6 hours / week for the past 4 years with zero viewership growth. 
BIL #2 is trying to make money by streaming his videogames on twitch.
SIL #2 has been doing the juice plus MLM and is now trying to sell this hydroponic tower garden thing that lets you grow your own vegetables for $500 - $1,000 up front cost.  I joke about it every time I go to aldi and buy hydroponically-grown lettuce for $3.

Predictably, none of them have any investment accounts and very little savings.

I shiver about the opportunity costs of simply getting a basic part time job with benefits, or going for higher education if they have all of these extra hours available in their lives.  Sigh.

Are they the same company?  Because there's a dude here who does the same thing.  Juice + and the tower garden.

[Evildunk99]

My in-laws fall into the category of "gullible quick buck chasers." 

SIL #1 has had 25 different jobs by age 30, most recently doing door dash. 
BIL #1 has been doing a sports podcast with his buddies for 6 hours / week for the past 4 years with zero viewership growth. 
BIL #2 is trying to make money by streaming his videogames on twitch.
SIL #2 has been doing the juice plus MLM and is now trying to sell this hydroponic tower garden thing that lets you grow your own vegetables for $500 - $1,000 up front cost.  I joke about it every time I go to aldi and buy hydroponically-grown lettuce for $3.

Predictably, none of them have any investment accounts and very little savings.

I shiver about the opportunity costs of simply getting a basic part time job with benefits, or going for higher education if they have all of these extra hours available in their lives.  Sigh.

Are they the same company?  Because there's a dude here who does the same thing.  Juice + and the tower garden.

A quick google search indicates it is the same company but can't confirm.

[dreadmoose]

My in-laws fall into the category of "gullible quick buck chasers." 

SIL #1 has had 25 different jobs by age 30, most recently doing door dash. 
BIL #1 has been doing a sports podcast with his buddies for 6 hours / week for the past 4 years with zero viewership growth. 
BIL #2 is trying to make money by streaming his videogames on twitch.
SIL #2 has been doing the juice plus MLM and is now trying to sell this hydroponic tower garden thing that lets you grow your own vegetables for $500 - $1,000 up front cost.  I joke about it every time I go to aldi and buy hydroponically-grown lettuce for $3.

Predictably, none of them have any investment accounts and very little savings.

I shiver about the opportunity costs of simply getting a basic part time job with benefits, or going for higher education if they have all of these extra hours available in their lives.  Sigh.

Are they the same company?  Because there's a dude here who does the same thing.  Juice + and the tower garden.

A quick google search indicates it is the same company but can't confirm.

Can confirm, a girl from my high school hawks both and approached me awhile back about how she retired at 28 years old (though she seems to present at trade shows and has apparently went back to work now... so I think she'd built enough passive income through her downline that if it kept going she'd be good... but it did not.

[OtherJen]

My husband and I are halfway through the 4-part documentary "LulaRich" on Amazon Prime. The LuLaRoe cult MLM was even nuttier than I suspected from all of the frenzied posts on my Facebook feed a few years ago.

[economista]

My husband and I are halfway through the 4-part documentary "LulaRich" on Amazon Prime. The LuLaRoe cult MLM was even nuttier than I suspected from all of the frenzied posts on my Facebook feed a few years ago.

I just finished it last night. It really is crazy and I was actually surprised about how young of a company they are. I knew their growth really exploded a few years ago, but I guess I figured the company had been around for awhile first. Apparently not.

[hooplady]

Just started watching the Lularoe doc on Amazon. In the first episode she talks about her earliest clothing parties where she was reselling designer dresses that she purchased from a swap meet at a fraction of the normal retail price. Um, so were they counterfeit or stolen? I guess that wasn't a concern, which says a lot about the mindset of the founders.

[OtherJen]

Just started watching the Lularoe doc on Amazon. In the first episode she talks about her earliest clothing parties where she was reselling designer dresses that she purchased from a swap meet at a fraction of the normal retail price. Um, so were they counterfeit or stolen? I guess that wasn't a concern, which says a lot about the mindset of the founders.

We wondered the same thing! At that quantity, I'd guess counterfeit. Cheap knockoffs are everywhere.

[iris lily]

My husband and I are halfway through the 4-part documentary "LulaRich" on Amazon Prime. The LuLaRoe cult MLM was even nuttier than I suspected from all of the frenzied posts on my Facebook feed a few years ago.

i binged that show coupla days  ago.

I thought early on when she bought the children’s dresses selling at $10 that those are not the same ones selling for $80, but now I’m not so sure. I remember going into one of those La Di Da boutique shops where grandmas shop for their tiny tot grandchildren, and looking over the merchandise, and those togs didn’t seem all that special to me as far as workmanship.They are frilly “dress up “garments heavy on velvet, diamond and peael buttons, and stiff organza. They are made to look luxe but are not.

Granted, in Europe when you buy European made children’s clothes those are super high end with good quality fabrics and good workmanship. I’m not sure those are made anymore, those baby Burberry pieces and etc.

I enjoyed the LulaRoe show, I knew what to expect, having seen other expose shows.

One of the sister wives from Kody  Brown’s tribe  is still hawking LuLaRoe.

[BlueHouse]

I was fascinated by the Lularoe documentary LuLaRich.  up until the last 30 seconds of the first episode, I thought it sounded like heaven!  (I would never do it, MLM isn't for me, but the pitch was very good and effective). 
Boy, I really feel for the people who fall into those traps.  It seemed as if everything they said and did was meant to control people in one way or another. 

Also, those designs are hideous and they always were.  But placing limits on availability was a genius method for starting a frenzy.  I guess the lesson should be that any time there's something trendy, stay away.  Good thing for me that everything I like is out of date and out of style!

[NaN]

I recently started working with one of my pledge bro's old teachers, Donald and his wife Sparkles [names changed for privacy]. They created a huge ongoing income that surpassed both their full-time jobs in their 30s. He just said they’re looking for a good candidate to work with. I really respect you and figured it wouldn't hurt to reach out even though we haven't talked in a while. Would be outside of what you got going on full time. Can’t promise anything but wanted to see if you were looking for other income sources?

My relative just messaged me this. First, he had me turned off at pledge bro. But it is not even his pledge bro who is in the MLM, it is one of their old teachers. I'm dying. I love how it ends with "can't promise anything but wanted to see if you were looking for other income sources". Like, I have a postgraduate degree with a fine paying job for years and this guy has the galls to message me about my income sources.

[Metalcat]

I recently started working with one of my pledge bro's old teachers, Donald and his wife Sparkles [names changed for privacy]. They created a huge ongoing income that surpassed both their full-time jobs in their 30s. He just said they’re looking for a good candidate to work with. I really respect you and figured it wouldn't hurt to reach out even though we haven't talked in a while. Would be outside of what you got going on full time. Can’t promise anything but wanted to see if you were looking for other income sources?

My relative just messaged me this. First, he had me turned off at pledge bro. But it is not even his pledge bro who is in the MLM, it is one of their old teachers. I'm dying. I love how it ends with "can't promise anything but wanted to see if you were looking for other income sources". Like, I have a postgraduate degree with a fine paying job for years and this guy has the galls to message me about my income sources.

priceless

[OtherJen]

One of my acquaintances apparently has stopped selling 31 Bags. She’s started talking up Epicure on her social media, so I assume that party invites are coming. Sigh. I have no idea why I should want to pay $7 for a tiny jar of a spice blend when I can buy all of the basic components for roughly the same price and make a load of the spice blend.

[Travis]

I recently started working with one of my pledge bro's old teachers, Donald and his wife Sparkles [names changed for privacy]. They created a huge ongoing income that surpassed both their full-time jobs in their 30s. He just said they’re looking for a good candidate to work with. I really respect you and figured it wouldn't hurt to reach out even though we haven't talked in a while. Would be outside of what you got going on full time. Can’t promise anything but wanted to see if you were looking for other income sources?

My relative just messaged me this. First, he had me turned off at pledge bro. But it is not even his pledge bro who is in the MLM, it is one of their old teachers. I'm dying. I love how it ends with "can't promise anything but wanted to see if you were looking for other income sources". Like, I have a postgraduate degree with a fine paying job for years and this guy has the galls to message me about my income sources.

About 75% of that was probably cut and paste from a script he was given.

[prudent_one]

Not the typical MLM story I guess, but when I was 17 I did occasional babysitting for a family up the street. The husband was a long-haul trucker and often gone for 5 days at a crack, and the wife was a second-shift worker who usually had her good friend babysit when the wife worked. In the summer there were days when the friend wasn't available and I would cover until the wife got home from work. A few times she would have some wine when she got home, the kids were sleeping, and she would get a little familiar. The dream of every 17yo boy.  Anyway, before long they got divorced and she moved to another neighborhood.

Three years later, she calls me out of the blue and invites me over for dinner. Imagine my imagination.  Got to her house, have dinner, sit down in the living room, a little chit-chat, then "By the way, prudent_one, I'm going to be rich. Do you want to come along?"

Wait, is this night going to be even better than I was thinking?

No, it was a pitch for selling Amway. That's all. Nothing else. I passed. Did not hear from her again.

[Dicey]

Oh, you guys are going to love this, especially some of the comments. FWIW, I've been following The Frugal Girl since the beginning. Pete was probably still working a j-o-b then. Her site was a great help to me when I was counting every penny.

https://www.thefrugalgirl.com/my-thoughts-on-lularich-and-mlms-as-a-whole/

[kite]

Oh, you guys are going to love this, especially some of the comments. FWIW, I've been following The Frugal Girl since the beginning. Pete was probably still working a j-o-b then. Her site was a great help to me when I was counting every penny.

https://www.thefrugalgirl.com/my-thoughts-on-lularich-and-mlms-as-a-whole/

Just saw the first episode.  Yikes! One LLR rep I know personally has moved over to selling Ziya athletic wear. 

[LifeHappens]

Just saw the first episode.  Yikes! One LLR rep I know personally has moved over to selling Ziya athletic wear.

I've seen this trend as well.

[pachnik]

Oh, you guys are going to love this, especially some of the comments. FWIW, I've been following The Frugal Girl since the beginning. Pete was probably still working a j-o-b then. Her site was a great help to me when I was counting every penny.

https://www.thefrugalgirl.com/my-thoughts-on-lularich-and-mlms-as-a-whole/

Thanks Dicey for this link.  I hadn't heard of the Frugal Girl before.  I like her style!

[Tigerpine]

There was an article in the Washington Post about Lularoe and Mormonism recently.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2021/10/04/allure-companies-like-lularoe-latter-day-saint-women/

[Miss Piggy]

Yesterday, I saw an explanation of what MLM really stands for: Moms Losing Money.

Seems accurate. (And it may already be in this thread somewhere...)

[Britan]

Yesterday, I saw an explanation of what MLM really stands for: Moms Losing Money.

Seems accurate. (And it may already be in this thread somewhere...)

This, I think, is what makes me the most angry about MLMs. At least here in the US, mothers get two sets of conflicting messages: your value to home and society is staying home with kids, and your value to home and society are based in how many dollar bills you bring in. MLMs prey on the anxiety that this contradiction presents. This kind of “anxiety manufacture” where someone intentionally feeds anxiety in someone else (oh, you aren’t bringing in any money for the household with all your ‘free time’?) so that they can swoop in with the solution (join my MLM!) is one of my rage face triggers.

[zolotiyeruki]

Yesterday, I saw an explanation of what MLM really stands for: Moms Losing Money.

Seems accurate. (And it may already be in this thread somewhere...)

This, I think, is what makes me the most angry about MLMs. At least here in the US, mothers get two sets of conflicting messages: your value to home and society is staying home with kids, and your value to home and society are based in how many dollar bills you bring in. MLMs prey on the anxiety that this contradiction presents. This kind of “anxiety manufacture” where someone intentionally feeds anxiety in someone else (oh, you aren’t bringing in any money for the household with all your ‘free time’?) so that they can swoop in with the solution (join my MLM!) is one of my rage face triggers.

That's really a good point--it's important to remember that a SAHP provides a whole lot of value, only some of which is easy to calculate.  When I start figuring how much it would cost to outsource all the things my wife does, it's staggering.

[sparkytheop]

The FTC has sent out some new warning letters.  There is a link within this link to all the companies that received the warning.  29 pages, with many names I recognize (amway, beach body, amsoil, mary kay, avon, thirty-one gifts (I think that's the same as thirty-one that sells bags?), avon) and so many more I don't.

Though I do wonder what "Andy's Burgers Shakes & Fries" did to attract the FTC's attention.  (ETA: I'm guessing it's some kind of franchise... I'd never heard of it, just thought it was funny to see a name like that on the list.)

https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/press-releases/2021/10/ftc-puts-businesses-notice-false-money-making-claims-could-lead?fbclid=IwAR3EpHXeBTUaD8bQ_BWRnHmrQwANuwDCEM-AJ9RYcagrrfgl-jJr14JTPGo

[AMandM]

That's really a good point--it's important to remember that a SAHP provides a whole lot of value, only some of which is easy to calculate.  When I start figuring how much it would cost to outsource all the things my wife does, it's staggering.

When I was a SAHM and homeschooling the kids, DH and I had term life insurance policies and mine was as much as his. We figured the loss of my labour would cost him as much to substitute as the loss of his income would cost me.

[Chris Pascale]

For those haven't seen, there's some good AntiMLM stuff on Reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/antiMLM/

[Chris Pascale]

Specifically for moms - https://www.reddit.com/r/antiMLM/comments/rhcosd/its_a_trap/

[Zikoris]

Man, here's a new weird place to get "prospected". I'm part on an local online vegan mentoring thing where people who are new vegans or have questions can talk with someone more experienced if they're having trouble. Perfect place to spam the volunteers with MLM crap! I did find it funny how the guy tried to tie it into veganism, so props for that at least:

I wanted to talk to you about something else too.

I've recently started a side hustle of mine in financial literacy. I'm being trained by a great entrepreneur friend of mine who's been doing this for some time now, adding a lot of great value to people's lives and making a lot of beautiful difference all at no cost!

I once was on the receiving side of his service and realized how so many people need to learn about these information and opportunities and hopped on the wagon myself to spread the awareness and am extending my invitations to my conscious vegan community cause we all deserve the better!

I can tell you more about how I help people if you’re interested in learning more ?

[Chris Pascale]

Man, here's a new weird place to get "prospected". I'm part on an local online vegan mentoring thing where people who are new vegans or have questions can talk with someone more experienced if they're having trouble. Perfect place to spam the volunteers with MLM crap! I did find it funny how the guy tried to tie it into veganism, so props for that at least:

I wanted to talk to you about something else too.

I've recently started a side hustle of mine in financial literacy. I'm being trained by a great entrepreneur friend of mine who's been doing this for some time now, adding a lot of great value to people's lives and making a lot of beautiful difference all at no cost!

I once was on the receiving side of his service and realized how so many people need to learn about these information and opportunities and hopped on the wagon myself to spread the awareness and am extending my invitations to my conscious vegan community cause we all deserve the better!

I can tell you more about how I help people if you’re interested in learning more ?

"If you have something more full-time, meat-based, and product-oriented, let me know."

[Dicey]

I stumbled on this post and thought it was great, so I'm sharing it here:

https://runliftmompod.com/dirty-details-about-how-i-left-zyia-active/

[snowball]

I stumbled on this post and thought it was great, so I'm sharing it here:

https://runliftmompod.com/dirty-details-about-how-i-left-zyia-active/

Interesting how she almost seems to understand how problematic MLMs are but keeps veering away from fully acknowledging it to herself.  I imagine it's because she's working a corporate headquarters MLM job now;  her salary depends on still drinking the MLM kool-aid to some extent...plus she clearly doesn't want to think poorly of her former upline, so there's another incentive for these mental gymnastics.

I went back to full-time work in Summer 2021 so my salary is way better than my ZYIA paycheck ever was.
...
Also, I don’t need to post about how #blessed I am to get a paycheck (wouldn’t that be hilarious on LinkedIn?!) or buy things I don’t need.

ZYIA is fast fashion a pyramid scheme and nobody will ever convince me otherwise.

Fixed that for her, lol.  She ALMOST, almost got there! but no.  Hope she does manage to fully disentangle herself eventually; she seems like a nice enough person.

[Travis]

I stumbled on this post and thought it was great, so I'm sharing it here:

https://runliftmompod.com/dirty-details-about-how-i-left-zyia-active/

Interesting how she almost seems to understand how problematic MLMs are but keeps veering away from fully acknowledging it to herself.  I imagine it's because she's working a corporate headquarters MLM job now;  her salary depends on still drinking the MLM kool-aid to some extent...plus she clearly doesn't want to think poorly of her former upline, so there's another incentive for these mental gymnastics.

I went back to full-time work in Summer 2021 so my salary is way better than my ZYIA paycheck ever was.
...
Also, I don’t need to post about how #blessed I am to get a paycheck (wouldn’t that be hilarious on LinkedIn?!) or buy things I don’t need.

ZYIA is fast fashion a pyramid scheme and nobody will ever convince me otherwise.

Fixed that for her, lol.  She ALMOST, almost got there! but no.  Hope she does manage to fully disentangle herself eventually; she seems like a nice enough person.

She goes into quite a bit of detail about how she's working for a bullshit company, but as you said, she can't quite get over the finish line. That "#blessed" was tongue-in-cheek about how silly the MLM social media presence can be. She pokes fun at it on several levels, but holds back.

https://runliftmompod.com/why-i-stopped-being-a-zyia-active-rep/

In this companion article, she goes into a ton of detail about how the bulk of her "business" was recruiting other people, that she definitely wasn't compensated for the amount of effort put in (despite being an early adopter), but has nothing bad to say about the industry.  Apparently she had an epiphany about selling hyped-up cheap sweatshop-made clothing.  She probably realized that the podcast and blog she's built (using her MLM customers as a fan base) is more profitable than earning the equivalent of minimum wage from her MLM.

[SpeedReader]

This morning I started reading Cultish: The Language of Fanaticism by Amanda Montell.  One of the sections is specifically about MLMs.  The author is not saying that MLMs are cults; only that they use some of the same language/manipulation methods that cults do.  So far, it's a fascinating read.

[onehair]

Surge Travel? Or known as SG360 Travel too I think.   Anyone heard of it? I was sent a Zoom link so I watched it out of politeness.  It appears you pay $79 to get in plus an additional $480 and if you haven't gotten sales you allegedly get your money back after a year no questions asked.  I didn't do it because I no longer do MLMs and I was concerned about the downtick in travel due to Covid.
And I don't want to bug my friends to create a downline.