Author Topic: Spouse wants luxury SUV!  (Read 16375 times)

Radagast

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #200 on: February 04, 2022, 10:49:32 AM »
Iím a slow one here so bear with me. Why does a family of four mean a minivan? We are a family of five in a GTI (Golf).
We really don't. An eGolf would be perfect. You are more badass than me though. I would definitely get a minivan for a family of 5!

elaine amj

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #201 on: February 04, 2022, 09:03:22 PM »
Yeah Iím annoyed by lack of a spare tire in my minivan. The plan was to add one aftermarket. But so far weíve had the van a year and a half and still havenít gotten around to it. Soon DH will say the van is ďtoo oldĒ to be worth it.


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Radagast

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #202 on: February 04, 2022, 10:19:49 PM »
Yeah I'm curious as well the second hand market is incredibly affordable.
I hazard a guess that you haven't looked at the second hand minivan market recently, as 2020 Chrysler Pacificas with 12,000 miles are selling for the MSRP of brand new 2022's.

Radagast

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #203 on: February 04, 2022, 10:28:54 PM »
Iím a slow one here so bear with me. Why does a family of four mean a minivan? We are a family of five in a GTI (Golf).
OP started off with a spouse that wanted a luxury SUV, which, around here, is considered to be a tremendously vulgar waste of money.  Getting the spouse to agree to a minivan represents tremendous progress.  Sure, their needs could be met with a sedan, but we recognize the progress that has been made :)
Ok, ok. I just have a visceral dislike of minivans on principle. Personally Iíd go back to the luxury SUV before going down minivan territory. Hell, Iíd ride a cargo bike with a bike trailer attached to the back before a minivan.
I LOVE minivans.  I WANT a minivan.

I am seriously considering a small SUV.

But alas, in reality, as crappy as it is, my 2006 Matrix just won't die.

---

Why do I want a minivan?  Leg room.  Road trip storage.  Hauling stuff for home improvement.  TOWING a camper/ trailer. 

All those things we don't do...but would we?  Would we actually like camping more if we didn't have to stuff 4 people + a dog's gear in the back of a Matrix and into a Thule box?
I mean, we could have more room.  We could camp in a camper not a tent... 

Would we go on longer road trips if either my teenager or I didn't have to sit scrunched in the back seat?  Scrunching does not help the 2 of us (him and I) who get carsick.
---

I do like that tight turning radius on the Matrix tho...
FWIW, I've seen lots of instances where people make purchases (often large ones!), hoping it will help them change.  For example, gym memberships and treadmill sales spike in January.  From what I've seen, if someone really wants something, they'll find ways of doing it, with or without the extra purchase.  Lack of motivation is a much stronger inhibitor than inconvenience.  Without that intrinsic motivation, that aspirational treadmill purchase rapidly turns into a very expensive clothing rack.

If you're already camping regularly, then sure, a camper may increase your enjoyment.  If you already take road trips, then a car with more leg room will make a difference.

If you're looking for a more comfortable vehicle for longer trips, you might consider a mid-size or larger sedan.  A Camry or Accord will be way more comfortable for a long trip, albeit with less baggage space.  Or maybe even go for an Avalon--I've heard they are positively heavenly for longer drives.
BTW I recently had a ride in a high end Honda Accord, and it was amazing. The inside was as large and well appointed as a Cadillac, and the hybrid version gets 47 miles per gallon. I made a strong argument for one, but spouse doesn't want a car, and lets not kid ourselves that a van is way more practical.

Radagast

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #204 on: February 04, 2022, 10:34:07 PM »
Iím a slow one here so bear with me. Why does a family of four mean a minivan? We are a family of five in a GTI (Golf).
OP started off with a spouse that wanted a luxury SUV, which, around here, is considered to be a tremendously vulgar waste of money.  Getting the spouse to agree to a minivan represents tremendous progress.  Sure, their needs could be met with a sedan, but we recognize the progress that has been made :)
Ok, ok. I just have a visceral dislike of minivans on principle. Personally Iíd go back to the luxury SUV before going down minivan territory. Hell, Iíd ride a cargo bike with a bike trailer attached to the back before a minivan.
It really comes down to value. A Fit or Matrix has basically about as much utility as any 5-passenger car or SUV in existence, but is less expensive to buy and operate. Above that, a minivan is much larger and more expensive, but is also the only thing that adds proportional utility to its price compared to a hatchback. Sure a van is an excessive purchase if you don't need it, but you get what you pay for. As an example, a Honda Pilot and Odyssey are basically the same price with front wheel drive, but the minivan offers way more space, the space is much more configurable, and is gets better fuel economy. A hatchback, a wagon, and a minivan are the top of the value curve, while SUVs and sedans are not. Really the whole point of an SUV or sedan is to show you can afford to waste money (but especially the SUV).

boarder42

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #205 on: February 05, 2022, 03:03:58 AM »
Yeah I'm curious as well the second hand market is incredibly affordable.
I hazard a guess that you haven't looked at the second hand minivan market recently, as 2020 Chrysler Pacificas with 12,000 miles are selling for the MSRP of brand new 2022's.

You're not looking old enough

RetiredAt63

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #206 on: February 05, 2022, 06:25:58 AM »
Really the whole point of an SUV or sedan is to show you can afford to waste money (but especially the SUV).

My next vehicle may be a small SUV (crossover?) simply because I will sit higher.  So many SUVs and trucks and minivans in my city means I get a lot of headlights straight in my eyes when I drive at night.

boarder42

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #207 on: February 05, 2022, 06:41:25 AM »
Really the whole point of an SUV or sedan is to show you can afford to waste money (but especially the SUV).

My next vehicle may be a small SUV (crossover?) simply because I will sit higher.  So many SUVs and trucks and minivans in my city means I get a lot of headlights straight in my eyes when I drive at night.

I'm 6'4 I don't like getting down into cars.

ysette9

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #208 on: February 05, 2022, 08:32:54 AM »
Iím a slow one here so bear with me. Why does a family of four mean a minivan? We are a family of five in a GTI (Golf).
OP started off with a spouse that wanted a luxury SUV, which, around here, is considered to be a tremendously vulgar waste of money.  Getting the spouse to agree to a minivan represents tremendous progress.  Sure, their needs could be met with a sedan, but we recognize the progress that has been made :)
Ok, ok. I just have a visceral dislike of minivans on principle. Personally Iíd go back to the luxury SUV before going down minivan territory. Hell, Iíd ride a cargo bike with a bike trailer attached to the back before a minivan.
I LOVE minivans.  I WANT a minivan.

I am seriously considering a small SUV.

But alas, in reality, as crappy as it is, my 2006 Matrix just won't die.

---

Why do I want a minivan?  Leg room.  Road trip storage.  Hauling stuff for home improvement.  TOWING a camper/ trailer. 

All those things we don't do...but would we?  Would we actually like camping more if we didn't have to stuff 4 people + a dog's gear in the back of a Matrix and into a Thule box?
I mean, we could have more room.  We could camp in a camper not a tent... 

Would we go on longer road trips if either my teenager or I didn't have to sit scrunched in the back seat?  Scrunching does not help the 2 of us (him and I) who get carsick.
---

I do like that tight turning radius on the Matrix tho...
FWIW, I've seen lots of instances where people make purchases (often large ones!), hoping it will help them change.  For example, gym memberships and treadmill sales spike in January.  From what I've seen, if someone really wants something, they'll find ways of doing it, with or without the extra purchase.  Lack of motivation is a much stronger inhibitor than inconvenience.  Without that intrinsic motivation, that aspirational treadmill purchase rapidly turns into a very expensive clothing rack.

If you're already camping regularly, then sure, a camper may increase your enjoyment.  If you already take road trips, then a car with more leg room will make a difference.

If you're looking for a more comfortable vehicle for longer trips, you might consider a mid-size or larger sedan.  A Camry or Accord will be way more comfortable for a long trip, albeit with less baggage space.  Or maybe even go for an Avalon--I've heard they are positively heavenly for longer drives.
BTW I recently had a ride in a high end Honda Accord, and it was amazing. The inside was as large and well appointed as a Cadillac, and the hybrid version gets 47 miles per gallon. I made a strong argument for one, but spouse doesn't want a car, and lets not kid ourselves that a van is way more practical.
I think it comes down to a matter of taste. To me bigger equals worse. Harder to park and maneuver, super unpleasant to drive. A Cadillac is the epitome of everything I dislike in a vehicle with the nausea-inducing boat-on-the-high-seas suspension. I once drove a truck (company vehicle) and it was like steering a Jell-O shot on wheels. Why anyone would choose such disfunction blew my mind. But clearly lots of people like that and choose it willingly so I just chalk it up to different taste.

Radagast

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #209 on: February 05, 2022, 12:47:51 PM »
Yeah I'm curious as well the second hand market is incredibly affordable.
I hazard a guess that you haven't looked at the second hand minivan market recently, as 2020 Chrysler Pacificas with 12,000 miles are selling for the MSRP of brand new 2022's.

You're not looking old enough
I'm not really seeing anything that looks like a great deal. Some that might be OKish at best. If we assume linear depreciation, for example an Odyssey lasts 200,000 miles, and thus should lose 5% of its value every 10,000 miles, then everything right now is higher priced than that line. Prices are almost mirrored across that line from how it used to be (which seems more logical I admit).

On carmax the best thing I casually see is a 2014 Sienna LE with 126,000 miles (half gone) for $19,000. A brand new one is $36,000 and uses 1/3 less fuel per mile. It is still financially better to get the older van considering opportunity cost on a $20,000 vehicle is less than on a $40,000 vehicle, but the used car market did not historically consider opportunity cost.

Radagast

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #210 on: February 05, 2022, 12:51:56 PM »
Really the whole point of an SUV or sedan is to show you can afford to waste money (but especially the SUV).

My next vehicle may be a small SUV (crossover?) simply because I will sit higher.  So many SUVs and trucks and minivans in my city means I get a lot of headlights straight in my eyes when I drive at night.

I'm 6'4 I don't like getting down into cars.
I admit there is a reasonable case for the 2-row cross over, like a RAV4, CRV, or Forester, which are basically just tall Corollas, Civics, and Imprezas. They are at a better height, but at the cost of higher price and reduced fuel economy. Longer than that though, and a minivan is the better choice.

LD_TAndK

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #211 on: February 06, 2022, 04:51:08 AM »
I admit there is a reasonable case for the 2-row cross over, like a RAV4, CRV, or Forester, which are basically just tall Corollas, Civics, and Imprezas. They are at a better height, but at the cost of higher price and reduced fuel economy. Longer than that though, and a minivan is the better choice.

I find the 2-row crossovers, as compared to my civic, are actually a bit bigger in the interior, more driver and passenger legroom/width, a bit more trunk volume. It's not a huge improvement but it could make the difference to someone 6'4" or who needs just a little more storage, but doesn't want to go all the way to minivan. I feel bad putting adults in the back of my civic, but not so in my relative's forester.

Of course a full size sedan (camry, accord, etc) probably fills those space requirements with better fuel economy at a similar price point.

economista

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #212 on: February 06, 2022, 06:59:04 AM »
Since this thread has a lot of people who have thought about the SUV vs minivan debate - We recently found out that we are expecting our third child. We are a one-vehicle family (my husband is blind so he canít drive) and we have a 2019 Mitsubishi Outlander. Current children are 1 and 2, so we will have 3 of them in car seats all at the same time. I would like to just put 3 car seats across in our current car but I think we need to buy new car seats. The ones they currently have will not fit 3 across. We would also have to share anchors, as the middle seat doesnít have them. It is possible to share anchors and get thinner car seats that will fit 3 across, or do we really need to find a minivan? Iím worried about the low inventory right now for used and new vehicles.

Chris22

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #213 on: February 06, 2022, 06:23:40 PM »
Iím 100% sure that the guidance will be sharing anchors is forbidden, but I have no idea if thatís real, or just CYA. Youíd want to, at minimum, understand the total weight on each anchor and ensure you are not exceeding the weight rating.

20957

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #214 on: February 06, 2022, 07:04:09 PM »
Yeah, sharing anchors is a no. You need to install with a seatbelt in the middle where there are no anchor points. As long as you do it right it's just as safe. I highly recommend the car seat lady website to give you all the nitty gritty on what models for what seats.

mm1970

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #215 on: February 07, 2022, 02:25:30 PM »
Quote
FWIW, I've seen lots of instances where people make purchases (often large ones!), hoping it will help them change.  For example, gym memberships and treadmill sales spike in January.  From what I've seen, if someone really wants something, they'll find ways of doing it, with or without the extra purchase.  Lack of motivation is a much stronger inhibitor than inconvenience.  Without that intrinsic motivation, that aspirational treadmill purchase rapidly turns into a very expensive clothing rack.
Or as I like to put it "inertia is a powerful force".

Or, our most powerful force.  Do I want a bigger house?  Yes, but too lazy to move.  A bigger car?  Sure, but this one isn't broken.

I sold car #1 when I moved cross country and we went down to 1 car.
Sold that car (DH's car, car #0) when it got unreliable and replaced with car #2.  Still a 1 car family.
Bought a 2nd car (Car #3) when DH graduated from PhD and got a job.
Bought car #4 and got rid of Car #2 when it became unreliable (it was an early 90's Saturn)
Bought car #5 when car #3 was totaled (T-boned).

Likewise with jobs, post college.
Job #1 - I was in the Navy, and I did my 5 years, and they basically kick you out after that (where I was)
Job #2 - company went bankrupt.
Job #3 - company shut down my group and offered to transfer me to a different group.  I didn't like those terms.
Job #4 - 13 years and counting...

I like camping but I'm the only one, and so our vacations of late tend to be road trips with mostly hotel/ AirBNB stays, because it makes everyone happy.  It doesn't help that California has a LOT of people, and to get a campsite you have to book 6 months in advance.  That adds another layer of difficulty.  And the dog.  Sigh.
« Last Edit: February 09, 2022, 11:13:17 AM by mm1970 »

elaine amj

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #216 on: February 09, 2022, 10:39:27 AM »
Since this thread has a lot of people who have thought about the SUV vs minivan debate - We recently found out that we are expecting our third child. We are a one-vehicle family (my husband is blind so he canít drive) and we have a 2019 Mitsubishi Outlander. Current children are 1 and 2, so we will have 3 of them in car seats all at the same time. I would like to just put 3 car seats across in our current car but I think we need to buy new car seats. The ones they currently have will not fit 3 across. We would also have to share anchors, as the middle seat doesnít have them. It is possible to share anchors and get thinner car seats that will fit 3 across, or do we really need to find a minivan? Iím worried about the low inventory right now for used and new vehicles.
No - you cannot share anchors. As far as I remember (my car seat days are long over so I am not up to date anymore), all u should have to do is install 2 seats with anchors and the 3rd in the middle with the seatbelts. Just learn how to install seats with a seatbelt and it should be very secure.

I know there are specific slimmer models of car seats that you can get that will fit 3 across so you donít have to upsize your car if you donít want to.

OP - I did the math between used and new too when I bought my minivan. I found used priced pretty high and it was only slightly more to buy new, which then gave me peace of mind with the warranty. Still I found it useful when shopping to consider both used and new and negotiate with each dealer for final prices so I knew where I stood.


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NorthernIkigai

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #217 on: February 12, 2022, 12:05:32 AM »
Since this thread has a lot of people who have thought about the SUV vs minivan debate - We recently found out that we are expecting our third child. We are a one-vehicle family (my husband is blind so he canít drive) and we have a 2019 Mitsubishi Outlander. Current children are 1 and 2, so we will have 3 of them in car seats all at the same time. I would like to just put 3 car seats across in our current car but I think we need to buy new car seats. The ones they currently have will not fit 3 across. We would also have to share anchors, as the middle seat doesnít have them. It is possible to share anchors and get thinner car seats that will fit 3 across, or do we really need to find a minivan? Iím worried about the low inventory right now for used and new vehicles.
No - you cannot share anchors. As far as I remember (my car seat days are long over so I am not up to date anymore), all u should have to do is install 2 seats with anchors and the 3rd in the middle with the seatbelts. Just learn how to install seats with a seatbelt and it should be very secure.

I know there are specific slimmer models of car seats that you can get that will fit 3 across so you donít have to upsize your car if you donít want to.

OP - I did the math between used and new too when I bought my minivan. I found used priced pretty high and it was only slightly more to buy new, which then gave me peace of mind with the warranty. Still I found it useful when shopping to consider both used and new and negotiate with each dealer for final prices so I knew where I stood.


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My car seat days are in the relatively recent past, and there might be geographical differences in car seat styles and laws, but in my experience using the anchors at all makes this puzzle harder, since they are placed where they are and thereís no changing that.

Car seats with anchors tend to get better safety reviews because itís almost impossible to mess up their placement in the car, but if you know what youíre doing (and there are always YouTube videos for the specific model to guide you), using the seatbelt is just as safe. And if you always travel with the same car and the same children, even better, just leave them in (the seats, not the childrenÖ).

So Iíd look into using seatbelts for your existing car seats as well, and see how much space that leaves you in the middle and what models are available. And even if youíd have to get 3 new car seats, thatís a lot cheaper and easier than a new car.

SailingOnASmallSailboat

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Re: Spouse wants luxury SUV!
« Reply #218 on: February 12, 2022, 06:39:26 AM »
On carseats - at least when our kids were small, the fire department would install your carseats for you. Took a lot of the guesswork out of it. Might be worth checking to see if that's available where you are.