Author Topic: No, I won't buy into your MLM  (Read 639034 times)

Hunny156

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #950 on: November 05, 2018, 12:31:07 PM »
Wasn't there a big trend about a generation ago where MLM companies like Scamway would require their devotees to buy a "book of the month" which was invariably some bullshit rah-rah artist telling them how everything will be pie in the sky by and by if they just believe and pray hard enough? Some of the authors of those books were actually MLM honchos, or else people who owed their "best-selling author" status to the MLM. In exchange for the push they'd come and speak at MLM events.

Robert Kiyosaki owes much of his early success to being picked up by Scamway. 

Scamway also did create a bunch of monthly tapes that their minions were forced to pay for and listen to, but there was some internal scam revealed when it became clear that some uplines were generating much of their profit from selling their "knowledge" to their poor downlines, and the success wasn't from the actual products.  Same for the many seminars they insisted the downlines attended; much of the ticket cost went straight into the uplines pocket.

These trends don't seem to stop though, Rachel Hollis is the latest MLM God, with her book Girl Wash Your Face.  She's the guest speaker at many of the MLM conventions right now.

englishteacheralex

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #951 on: November 05, 2018, 02:24:40 PM »
A heartbreaking victim of MLMs has been flying beneath my radar for about twenty years. This thread, along with the "The Dream" podcast, has made me see her story in a new light...

It's an interesting and very sad story, and it makes me furious at MLMs.

I first met her while I was in high school. She and her husband hung out at the rockclimbing gym where I worked after school, and they befriended me. They were in their midtwenties, hip, fun, cool people and they took me rockclimbing sometimes. I also had dinner at their place occasionally. I really looked up to them.

I kept in touch a little bit throughout my post-high school, post-college and beyond life. They never had kids. She was a super triathlete, always training for Ironman races and looking for official sponsorship. I also noticed that she was incredibly self promotional. She sent me her newsletter every week, and I followed it in a living vicariously sort of way.

She sold every MLM I'd ever heard of. Called me up now and again to ask how I was doing and see if I was interested in any of her MLMs. I live in Hawaii, mind you, and she was in Colorado. Her newsletter was full of Dave Ramsey and her "bizes"--that's how she referred to them.

About two years ago the newsletter mentioned she had gotten divorced. Last year she was pregnant. Just had a baby girl. She's 45. Then a newsletter that she's starting over on Dave Ramsey baby step #1 but this time it's going to work because of all her bizes.

OMG. The whole thing started to make sense. MLMs have completely bankrupted this woman and her husband couldn't take it anymore.

Soul sucking scams. Tragic. 


Just Joe

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #952 on: November 12, 2018, 04:15:26 PM »
I fell into Amway hole around 2012. I was new to the area. Someone greeted me while shopping at Walmart and told my face is very familiar and had some conversations. In short, he got my phone number, called me a few days after and told there is a side gig and if I wanted to work on it.

I remember I had only $300 in my account at that time. I said yes, he took me to some meeting that had people in suits. They had music, motivational talk...bla...bla...bla...I was brainwashed (or I was naive) and ended up signing up for it. After 2 months of horrifying experience, finally came out of it. They asked me to go and meet random people at Walmart and exchange phone numbers. Asked us to call those people on Sundays and convince them to attend meetings.

Not only that, they asked me to contact my friends & friends of friends circle and convince them. It was one of the worst mistakes of my life.

I never knew such crude and selfish people existed. I'm allergic to Amway since then.

Oh yeah, Amway people are awful. Husband and I got tricked into meeting another couple (friends of our friend) for what we thought was a coffee date with potential new friends. Instead, they spent 2 hours pitching Amway to us. We got out by promising to consider it, told them we weren’t interested when they called us later, and never heard from them again. Good riddance.
I grew up in Amway land. It is truly awful how deceptive people can be in trying to trick you into hearing your sales pitch. My parents had it happen to them a couple times and even I suffered through a "let's meet for coffee" thing with a colleague early in my career.

Isn't there some overlap between the Amway leadership people and part of the political establishment in the USA? Now there is a bad situation...
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 04:24:08 PM by Just Joe »

OtherJen

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #953 on: November 12, 2018, 08:57:04 PM »
I fell into Amway hole around 2012. I was new to the area. Someone greeted me while shopping at Walmart and told my face is very familiar and had some conversations. In short, he got my phone number, called me a few days after and told there is a side gig and if I wanted to work on it.

I remember I had only $300 in my account at that time. I said yes, he took me to some meeting that had people in suits. They had music, motivational talk...bla...bla...bla...I was brainwashed (or I was naive) and ended up signing up for it. After 2 months of horrifying experience, finally came out of it. They asked me to go and meet random people at Walmart and exchange phone numbers. Asked us to call those people on Sundays and convince them to attend meetings.

Not only that, they asked me to contact my friends & friends of friends circle and convince them. It was one of the worst mistakes of my life.

I never knew such crude and selfish people existed. I'm allergic to Amway since then.

Oh yeah, Amway people are awful. Husband and I got tricked into meeting another couple (friends of our friend) for what we thought was a coffee date with potential new friends. Instead, they spent 2 hours pitching Amway to us. We got out by promising to consider it, told them we weren’t interested when they called us later, and never heard from them again. Good riddance.
I grew up in Amway land. It is truly awful how deceptive people can be in trying to trick you into hearing your sales pitch. My parents had it happen to them a couple times and even I suffered through a "let's meet for coffee" thing with a colleague early in my career.

Isn't there some overlap between the Amway leadership people and part of the political establishment in the USA? Now there is a bad situation...

Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #954 on: November 13, 2018, 02:02:40 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #955 on: November 13, 2018, 06:02:41 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?

Not sure how the department of ed can end Common Core since it was never a federal initiative...
States all have the ability to adopt their own standards. (Most have 'adapted' Common Core.)

LifeHappens

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #956 on: November 13, 2018, 07:21:45 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?
The DeVos family also are major investors in SoFi. Betsy has been working to relax lending standards for student loans, ease restrictions on for-profit colleges (more loans) and pull back promises of loan forgiveness. Basically, she would like all students to graduate with crippling amounts of debt, which can then be re-financed with SoFi.

Just Joe

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #957 on: November 13, 2018, 07:54:50 AM »
MLM top level ethics and politicians. There is a fine combination.

merula

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #958 on: November 13, 2018, 09:09:47 AM »
One of the most recent episodes of The Dream (#7) dove into exactly that issue. When Amway was under investigation by the FTC, the two co-founders Richard DeVos and Jay Van Andel were finance chair of the RNC and chair of the US Chamber of Commerce, respectively. Both were also personal friends of then-president Gerald Ford, as they were all from Grand Rapids, MI, and had a private meeting with Ford at the White House in the midst of the FTC investigation.

Betsy DeVos is Richard Devos' daughter-in-law, married to his son Dick DeVos, who was a former chairman of Amway. Current chairman is Steve Van Andel (son of Jay), and current president is Doug DeVos, brother of Dick and BIL to Betsy.

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #959 on: November 13, 2018, 11:19:00 AM »
MLM top level ethics and politicians. There is a fine combination.

It seems to me a natural fit: politicians are such a corrupt, venial, and self-serving lot that other kinds of financial predators fit right in.

My fellow Yankistani voters seem to like it this way. Because apparently it's an unwritten rule that you have to vote for either the right-wing wackos or the left-wing wackos, a politician who's privileged enough and who is plugged in with a major party clique, or who can tap into the most vile and turpitudinous aspects of the voting public, can generally expect to get elected.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #960 on: November 14, 2018, 02:11:49 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?

Not sure how the department of ed can end Common Core since it was never a federal initiative...
States all have the ability to adopt their own standards. (Most have 'adapted' Common Core.)
Well, it was a "hey, adopt Common Core and we'll give you money" sort of deal, as I understand it.  Aaaanyway, back to the topic at hand...

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #961 on: November 14, 2018, 06:10:14 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?

Not sure how the department of ed can end Common Core since it was never a federal initiative...
States all have the ability to adopt their own standards. (Most have 'adapted' Common Core.)
Well, it was a "hey, adopt Common Core and we'll give you money" sort of deal, as I understand it.  Aaaanyway, back to the topic at hand...

Yeah, and then they all "got rid of" Common Core (while actually keeping it, but rebranding it. Hence adapting, no longer adopting.)

sparkytheop

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #962 on: November 14, 2018, 07:35:03 AM »
The lady who runs "mommygyver" and spent a lot of effort showing Lularoe for what it is has been in a long legal fight (they are trying to get her sources for the information she has been given, and, as a journalist, she's fighting it).  You can still read at least some of her posts on LLR on her site, but it's not as easy to get to as it was before.

https://www.mommygyver.com/mommyblog-1/category/LuLaRoe/page/8  I linked to the older posts so you can work your way through the timeline if interested.

Sugaree

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #963 on: November 14, 2018, 07:42:49 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?

Not sure how the department of ed can end Common Core since it was never a federal initiative...
States all have the ability to adopt their own standards. (Most have 'adapted' Common Core.)
Well, it was a "hey, adopt Common Core and we'll give you money" sort of deal, as I understand it.  Aaaanyway, back to the topic at hand...

I'm going to stay off topic for just a minute to say that as much shit as people talked about it, my kid is in Kindergarten and I love the Common Core worksheets that he brings home, especially the math worksheets.  I think a big part of the problem was the implementation.  You can't spend 5 years teaching kids one method and then expect that the next year everyone will magically know how to use the "new" method.  It should have been introduced in Kindergarten one year, first grade the next, then second grade, etc. so that the kids get the basis of it.  I suspect that states that didn't really want to adopt CC did a piss-poor job of implementing the change so that they could then go back and say "Hey, this is crap.  See how bad our standardized test scores are now."

I'm a red panda

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #964 on: November 14, 2018, 08:01:23 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?

Not sure how the department of ed can end Common Core since it was never a federal initiative...
States all have the ability to adopt their own standards. (Most have 'adapted' Common Core.)
Well, it was a "hey, adopt Common Core and we'll give you money" sort of deal, as I understand it.  Aaaanyway, back to the topic at hand...

I'm going to stay off topic for just a minute to say that as much shit as people talked about it, my kid is in Kindergarten and I love the Common Core worksheets that he brings home, especially the math worksheets.  I think a big part of the problem was the implementation.  You can't spend 5 years teaching kids one method and then expect that the next year everyone will magically know how to use the "new" method.  It should have been introduced in Kindergarten one year, first grade the next, then second grade, etc. so that the kids get the basis of it.  I suspect that states that didn't really want to adopt CC did a piss-poor job of implementing the change so that they could then go back and say "Hey, this is crap.  See how bad our standardized test scores are now."

We can start a new thread if you want, but the biggest issue most people have with Common Core isn't actually the standards, but curriculum that was designed to meet the standards; which is an entirely separate thing and dozens and dozens of curriculums exist, and none of them were officially put out by the NGA that put out CC.  There is almost nothing in Common Core math that approaches methods of how it has to be taught. (In fact, as far as multiplication goes- standard algorithm is the only one that officially has to be taught, but other methods, like partial products can help support the understanding required in other standards.)


As for MLMs- I'm shockingly not seeing a lot of them on my facebook lately. I think people gave up on me.

onlykelsey

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #965 on: November 14, 2018, 08:13:42 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #966 on: November 14, 2018, 08:16:45 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

Sadly, this doesn't work for me. I have a friend with a PhD in medicinal chemistry hawking essential oils.
And tons of friends with college degrees selling overpriced mascara.  And lots and lots of friends selling shakes of various sorts.

Sugaree

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #967 on: November 14, 2018, 08:31:37 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

Sugaree

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #968 on: November 14, 2018, 08:42:07 AM »
Yep. Betsy DeVos is the US Secretary of Education despite not having attended public schools, not having any background in education, not having sent her children to public schools, and continually undermining public education in her home state by undermining teacher’s unions and shilling for corporate charter schools to line her own pocketbook. As a Michigander, I apologize for the fact that she’s been inflicted on the rest of the country.
At the risk of pulling this thread off topic, I know there was a lot of hoopla when she was first appointed, but other than ending Common Core, I haven't heard much lately from/about from the Dept. of Ed.  Has there been anything coming out of DC on that front?

Not sure how the department of ed can end Common Core since it was never a federal initiative...
States all have the ability to adopt their own standards. (Most have 'adapted' Common Core.)
Well, it was a "hey, adopt Common Core and we'll give you money" sort of deal, as I understand it.  Aaaanyway, back to the topic at hand...

I'm going to stay off topic for just a minute to say that as much shit as people talked about it, my kid is in Kindergarten and I love the Common Core worksheets that he brings home, especially the math worksheets.  I think a big part of the problem was the implementation.  You can't spend 5 years teaching kids one method and then expect that the next year everyone will magically know how to use the "new" method.  It should have been introduced in Kindergarten one year, first grade the next, then second grade, etc. so that the kids get the basis of it.  I suspect that states that didn't really want to adopt CC did a piss-poor job of implementing the change so that they could then go back and say "Hey, this is crap.  See how bad our standardized test scores are now."

We can start a new thread if you want, but the biggest issue most people have with Common Core isn't actually the standards, but curriculum that was designed to meet the standards; which is an entirely separate thing and dozens and dozens of curriculums exist, and none of them were officially put out by the NGA that put out CC.  There is almost nothing in Common Core math that approaches methods of how it has to be taught. (In fact, as far as multiplication goes- standard algorithm is the only one that officially has to be taught, but other methods, like partial products can help support the understanding required in other standards.)


As for MLMs- I'm shockingly not seeing a lot of them on my facebook lately. I think people gave up on me.

https://forum.mrmoneymustache.com/off-topic/so-common-core/

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #969 on: November 14, 2018, 08:59:26 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

Sugaree

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #970 on: November 14, 2018, 09:07:45 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

Yeah, I know.

I wear makeup maybe three times a year (which is probably what saves me from a lot of these pitches) so I don't really know a whole lot about it other than what I've read and that's that it's a pretty good product, but expensive. 

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #971 on: November 14, 2018, 09:46:22 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

It could make sense for someone who "does makeup" as a significant side gig. I'm thinking about people who own boutiques, who sell makeup services to the Wedding Industrial Complex, who want a reason to up-charge because the mainstream stuff from a beauty supply company doesn't make the bride feel special enough.

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #972 on: November 14, 2018, 10:12:55 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

It could make sense for someone who "does makeup" as a significant side gig. I'm thinking about people who own boutiques, who sell makeup services to the Wedding Industrial Complex, who want a reason to up-charge because the mainstream stuff from a beauty supply company doesn't make the bride feel special enough.

I was just pointing out that consultants don't buy from MLMs at "wholesale" prices. Consultants are the main customers. The profit is made by the company when they sell to the consultant.

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #973 on: November 14, 2018, 10:24:44 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

It could make sense for someone who "does makeup" as a significant side gig. I'm thinking about people who own boutiques, who sell makeup services to the Wedding Industrial Complex, who want a reason to up-charge because the mainstream stuff from a beauty supply company doesn't make the bride feel special enough.

I was just pointing out that consultants don't buy from MLMs at "wholesale" prices. Consultants are the main customers. The profit is made by the company when they sell to the consultant.

You have a point.  Maybe "buying at a discount" is a better term.  Though, I might argue that pretty much any business that buys a product with a profit margin of less than 100% is also not paying "wholesale." 

Davnasty

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #974 on: November 14, 2018, 12:04:03 PM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

It could make sense for someone who "does makeup" as a significant side gig. I'm thinking about people who own boutiques, who sell makeup services to the Wedding Industrial Complex, who want a reason to up-charge because the mainstream stuff from a beauty supply company doesn't make the bride feel special enough.

I was just pointing out that consultants don't buy from MLMs at "wholesale" prices. Consultants are the main customers. The profit is made by the company when they sell to the consultant.

You have a point.  Maybe "buying at a discount" is a better term.  Though, I might argue that pretty much any business that buys a product with a profit margin of less than 100% is also not paying "wholesale."

I thought wholesale was any purchase made with the intent of reselling, as in, not retail? That would make the usage here correct. However, sellers almost certainly are not getting the deal they think they're getting. Some people seem to think wholesale = cost to manufacture + a small margin. In reality it's like any other sale; they charge as much as they think you'll pay.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #975 on: November 14, 2018, 12:12:29 PM »
The lady who runs "mommygyver" and spent a lot of effort showing Lularoe for what it is has been in a long legal fight (they are trying to get her sources for the information she has been given, and, as a journalist, she's fighting it).  You can still read at least some of her posts on LLR on her site, but it's not as easy to get to as it was before.

https://www.mommygyver.com/mommyblog-1/category/LuLaRoe/page/8  I linked to the older posts so you can work your way through the timeline if interested.
FWIW, MAP (Minimum Advertised Pricing, the topic of mommygyver's post on that page) gets a lot of negative comments, but it's actually really important to a manufacturer.  Because if you allow a dealer to sell below MAP, it reduces *all* dealers' ability to make a profit, and so all those dealers won't want to carry your product.  If you're a manufacturer trying to gain market penetration, taking care of your dealers is critical.  An extreme example would be a large retailer with slim margins (say, Amazon or Walmart) undercutting all the mom & pop stores.

MgoSam

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #976 on: November 14, 2018, 12:26:28 PM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

It could make sense for someone who "does makeup" as a significant side gig. I'm thinking about people who own boutiques, who sell makeup services to the Wedding Industrial Complex, who want a reason to up-charge because the mainstream stuff from a beauty supply company doesn't make the bride feel special enough.

I was just pointing out that consultants don't buy from MLMs at "wholesale" prices. Consultants are the main customers. The profit is made by the company when they sell to the consultant.

You have a point.  Maybe "buying at a discount" is a better term.  Though, I might argue that pretty much any business that buys a product with a profit margin of less than 100% is also not paying "wholesale."

I thought wholesale was any purchase made with the intent of reselling, as in, not retail? That would make the usage here correct. However, sellers almost certainly are not getting the deal they think they're getting. Some people seem to think wholesale = cost to manufacture + a small margin. In reality it's like any other sale; they charge as much as they think you'll pay.

I'm a wholesaler, buying someone 'wholesale,' essentially just means that you are buying it from a wholesaler. Generally speaking it is in a wholesaler's advantage to sell their products to distributors and retailers at a discount from the retail price, thus they can make a profit selling it and come back for more.

Way too many people think 'wholsale pricing,' is necessarily good.

Just Joe

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #977 on: November 16, 2018, 07:52:04 AM »
That podcast is really interesting. Well done too. I'm on the third episode.

I'm a red panda

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #978 on: November 16, 2018, 07:57:07 AM »
Is there anyone else who doesn't run into MLM stuff really ever? I have seen about 5 cars with ads on, and once someone gave me a card after we chatted at a playground. Is it because I'm not on Facebook? The stats say so many Americans are involved, I'm not sure how I've avoided them. Speculation?

I think class background matters.  Exactly one of my college-educated friends has made a spiel for a MLM to me, but probably 1/3-1/2 of my high school-educated friends and family are involved.

I agree.  I have a few people on FB who sell various make up products.  A few of them have straight up said that they only sell so that they can buy at wholesale prices.  I don't know how well that's working out for them.  I'm a little afraid that another one is being sucked into something that's going to be really bad for her.  She's the classic target.  She and her son's dad can't afford for her to work and pay daycare, so she stays home.  She sees this as a way for her to contribute to the household.  I also thinks she sees it as a way that she can justify getting out of the house and using their one car in the evenings/weekends and have actual adult conversations.  I've posted a few things about how MLMs are scams, but haven't actually tagger her in anything.  Just hoping she reads the articles.

"wholesale"

:(

It could make sense for someone who "does makeup" as a significant side gig. I'm thinking about people who own boutiques, who sell makeup services to the Wedding Industrial Complex, who want a reason to up-charge because the mainstream stuff from a beauty supply company doesn't make the bride feel special enough.

I was just pointing out that consultants don't buy from MLMs at "wholesale" prices. Consultants are the main customers. The profit is made by the company when they sell to the consultant.

You have a point.  Maybe "buying at a discount" is a better term.  Though, I might argue that pretty much any business that buys a product with a profit margin of less than 100% is also not paying "wholesale."

I thought wholesale was any purchase made with the intent of reselling, as in, not retail? That would make the usage here correct. However, sellers almost certainly are not getting the deal they think they're getting. Some people seem to think wholesale = cost to manufacture + a small margin. In reality it's like any other sale; they charge as much as they think you'll pay.

I would assume the wholesaler is the person selling the product to the MLM, who then sells it to the distributors.

Also, if you are just buying for the discount, you aren't buying with intent to resell. So the usage doesn't seem right.


zolotiyeruki

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #980 on: November 20, 2018, 02:30:26 PM »
So... poor quality, receiving lawsuits, people leaving in droves, not paying their bills...   Are we sure LulaRoe isn't the State of Illinois? :P

jinga nation

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #981 on: November 21, 2018, 09:09:59 PM »
if any MMMers are IT admins, here's an uplifting article to help humanity from the MLM scum:

https://www.reddit.com/r/antiMLM/comments/9z4vp4/i_am_in_charge_of_our_web_and_spam_filters_at_work/

Fomerly known as something

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #982 on: November 27, 2018, 05:29:21 PM »
Irony, listening to "The Dream" on an airplane going home, then getting off the plane and walking under a "Welcome" sign from one of the biggest MLMs in the world.  Yup my thoughts on the company are "it's complicated."  The actual company and it's founders other business, not the MLM part, are a huge economic driver in my town.

Channel-Z

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #983 on: November 28, 2018, 07:48:43 PM »
I started listening to The Dream a couple of months ago, then caught up over the weekend. The episode about the Limelight convention, the people sharing stories about economic despair, the tightrope that is their lives, even potential suicide, it's alarming. The Dream has one episode left to publish, I believe.

OtherJen

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #984 on: November 28, 2018, 07:58:12 PM »
Irony, listening to "The Dream" on an airplane going home, then getting off the plane and walking under a "Welcome" sign from one of the biggest MLMs in the world.  Yup my thoughts on the company are "it's complicated."  The actual company and it's founders other business, not the MLM part, are a huge economic driver in my town.

I bet I can guess where you live. I've never been in that airport, but the downtown area drives home your point very nicely (although it is a very nice downtown).

Just Joe

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #985 on: November 29, 2018, 08:02:24 AM »
I've long been a little fascinated by how MLM big wigs can take advantage of the people recruited to work for the company and still take pride in their wealth and what their wealth afforded them.

"Look at my house, look at my cars, look at my boats!"

Yeah but look at all the people screwed over to generate the cash flow to buy these things. How can a person have pride in that?

Can apply to politicians, religious leaders, corporate leaders, MLM leaders, etc. 

sparkytheop

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #986 on: December 01, 2018, 12:08:59 AM »
Lularoe, the ugly leggings MLM, has had a lawsuit filed against them from their former supplier.  There is a link to a pdf of the lawsuit here: https://www.facebook.com/groups/defective/permalink/1590805307732714/

From the lawsuit (owner of LLR to the supplier, MyDyer):

"Look guys, I am not going to pay you guys a f***ing dime unless a judge orders me to pay it, and DeAnne and I will take our two to three hundred million dollars to the Bahamas and f*** everything."

Lawsuit is for upwards of $48 million owed.

Just Joe

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #987 on: December 03, 2018, 09:27:22 AM »
Such nice people... People to be admired and celebrated. True American success stories.

Hunny156

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #988 on: December 04, 2018, 11:45:45 AM »
With LLR, the episode of American Greed just writes itself!  The company culture is so toxic too, it might as well be a cult.  When the lawsuit article broke on Saturday morning, the remaining top sellers and mentors all spouted the same lies.  Many of them were headed to CA for Facebook training for the day, and all big companies get hit w/lawsuits, no big deal.  Furthermore, LLR didn't pay those bills b/c the product was defective, they changed suppliers and this was sour grapes!

Umm, the FB training is something you can do online, so they obviously were headed to corporate offices to scheme some more lies to keep their consultants in line.

As for the lawsuit, if you order cheap fabrics and pay for low quality assembly, then that's what you get.  Can't blame the supplier for supplying you with crap product, when that's what you ordered.  Furthermore, in most cases, LLR determined that these products were not defective when the consultants noticed the issues.  You can't have it both ways.  You didn't pay the supplier b/c it was crap, but you charged your consultants to buy the crap, and then opted to counsel the consultants to blame their clients when things went wrong! 

Your leggings popped a huge hole on the very first wear?  You didn't order the right size.  The fabric disintegrated in the wash?  Why would you assume you could wash them like normal clothing?  Oh no, you have to hand wash and airy dry, like a fine pair of nylon stockings!

As someone who has never been involved in LLR in any way, it's been an interesting education in the inner workings of this one MLM, and I am rooting for the ship to go down, soon.  Unfortunately, the ones left holding the bag will be the ones least able to afford it, and the ones who should be held criminally responsible will get off mostly unscathed, likely with most of their stolen proceeds intact.

4alpacas

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #989 on: December 04, 2018, 12:08:41 PM »
Irony, listening to "The Dream" on an airplane going home, then getting off the plane and walking under a "Welcome" sign from one of the biggest MLMs in the world.  Yup my thoughts on the company are "it's complicated."  The actual company and it's founders other business, not the MLM part, are a huge economic driver in my town.

I bet I can guess where you live. I've never been in that airport, but the downtown area drives home your point very nicely (although it is a very nice downtown).
I have also been to that airport and grew up close to that area.

I also loved "The Dream" podcast.  I would highly recommend it to anyone frustrated with MLMs.

Cpa Cat

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #990 on: December 05, 2018, 06:08:08 AM »
Furthermore, in most cases, LLR determined that these products were not defective when the consultants noticed the issues.

The Dream dropped me down a rabbit hole of MLM podcasts, and the LLR story is fascinating. They may legitimately have a case for not paying their supplier if half of what consultants were saying was true - product arriving stinking, wet, torn, or otherwise damaged. Low quality items that tear upon first use.

But Hunny156 is right. LLR's response was that the consultants were wrong and that the defects were isolated. They basically acted like it wasn't true. Instead of responding swiftly to correct the supplier quality control issue and make things rights in order to protect their reputation, LLR's corporate office basically assisted in destroying their own reputation. They kept shipping from that supplier and blamed their customer instead.

What's more, LLR refused to refund the cost of the low-quality clothes to the consultants. So they sold the clothes, and didn't pay their supplier. You can't have your cake and eat it too.

englishteacheralex

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #991 on: December 05, 2018, 07:27:46 AM »
More MLM podcasts? Share them! The Dream was amazing and I'm thirsty for more!

OneStep

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #992 on: December 05, 2018, 03:12:13 PM »
I also enjoyed The Dream podcast until the last 2 episodes. I really wish they would have continued to focus on the specific MLMs and their practices and those who have been hurt by them. Listening to that last interview was a bit unbearable. I don't know any reasonable journalist who would start off an interview but stating that they think the other person is going to lie to them. Started the whole thing off on a bad point and you could tell the guy was defensive from the beginning. It felt like the 2 different interviews were just being combative and leaning on their investigation of that specific company and other witness interviews. It seemed like too much anecdotal evidence and seemed to loose credibility in how it was presented during that interview. I personally hate MLMs and would love to see them go away because they do cause much more harm than good, but I wish they would have kept talking about the structure of the companies more and provide more insight on how the practice is setup to hurt people instead of help them.

englishteacheralex

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #993 on: December 05, 2018, 03:22:15 PM »
I also enjoyed The Dream podcast until the last 2 episodes. I really wish they would have continued to focus on the specific MLMs and their practices and those who have been hurt by them. Listening to that last interview was a bit unbearable. I don't know any reasonable journalist who would start off an interview but stating that they think the other person is going to lie to them. Started the whole thing off on a bad point and you could tell the guy was defensive from the beginning. It felt like the 2 different interviews were just being combative and leaning on their investigation of that specific company and other witness interviews. It seemed like too much anecdotal evidence and seemed to loose credibility in how it was presented during that interview. I personally hate MLMs and would love to see them go away because they do cause much more harm than good, but I wish they would have kept talking about the structure of the companies more and provide more insight on how the practice is setup to hurt people instead of help them.

You're right! That last episode was brutal. Lame journalism that hurt the rest of the series, which is a real shame because arg I want MLMs to GO DOWN!!!

4alpacas

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #994 on: December 05, 2018, 03:29:17 PM »
I also enjoyed The Dream podcast until the last 2 episodes. I really wish they would have continued to focus on the specific MLMs and their practices and those who have been hurt by them. Listening to that last interview was a bit unbearable. I don't know any reasonable journalist who would start off an interview but stating that they think the other person is going to lie to them. Started the whole thing off on a bad point and you could tell the guy was defensive from the beginning. It felt like the 2 different interviews were just being combative and leaning on their investigation of that specific company and other witness interviews. It seemed like too much anecdotal evidence and seemed to loose credibility in how it was presented during that interview. I personally hate MLMs and would love to see them go away because they do cause much more harm than good, but I wish they would have kept talking about the structure of the companies more and provide more insight on how the practice is setup to hurt people instead of help them.

You're right! That last episode was brutal. Lame journalism that hurt the rest of the series, which is a real shame because arg I want MLMs to GO DOWN!!!
I also agree.  Episode 11 was a disappointment on many levels.  However, I'm very interested in the MLM industry.  Are there any books that anyone can recommend?

sparkytheop

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #995 on: December 05, 2018, 04:04:24 PM »
I also enjoyed The Dream podcast until the last 2 episodes. I really wish they would have continued to focus on the specific MLMs and their practices and those who have been hurt by them. Listening to that last interview was a bit unbearable. I don't know any reasonable journalist who would start off an interview but stating that they think the other person is going to lie to them. Started the whole thing off on a bad point and you could tell the guy was defensive from the beginning. It felt like the 2 different interviews were just being combative and leaning on their investigation of that specific company and other witness interviews. It seemed like too much anecdotal evidence and seemed to loose credibility in how it was presented during that interview. I personally hate MLMs and would love to see them go away because they do cause much more harm than good, but I wish they would have kept talking about the structure of the companies more and provide more insight on how the practice is setup to hurt people instead of help them.

You're right! That last episode was brutal. Lame journalism that hurt the rest of the series, which is a real shame because arg I want MLMs to GO DOWN!!!
I also agree.  Episode 11 was a disappointment on many levels.  However, I'm very interested in the MLM industry.  Are there any books that anyone can recommend?

Disclaimer: I have not read this!

One that completely fascinates me is Amway.  Mostly because I don't know enough about it to figure out how the hell anyone expects to make any money.  But, I know enough about it that they force "training" on people, and that seems to be how some of them make money (by creating and selling the training material).  But I really just don't get it.  Why are people so convinced they can get rich and quit their jobs.

This was recommended to me, and I want to read it, but I'm an extremely slow reader and already in the middle of two other books right now.

https://archive.org/details/MerchantsOfDeception

There is a pdf you can download (the kindle version didn't work for me).  It's legible (unlike the version shown on the computer when you just go to the link).  It's written by a man who was deep into amway (and one of the top people).

Quote
...My wife and I were recruited by friends and quickly rose through the ranks and found ourselves in the top 1/25th of 1% of the multi-billion dollar Amway Corporation. For nearly a decade, we developed a “business” that expanded from North America to Europe, South America, and the Philippines. We spoke to thousands from stage and worked intimately with the Kingpin distributors through whom as much as 90% of Amway's $4-5 billion dollars in annual revenue flows. My wife and I spent personal time with the company's billionaire founder Rich DeVos.
To make a long story short, at the highest level, I inadvertently discovered what documentation now appears to reveal as two decades of systematic, global fraud running into sums far in excess of twenty billion dollars. When I initially discovered the deception, I naively thought it only involved Kingpin level distributors in the field. I immediately reported it to Amway senior management with nearly 50 pages of corroborating documentation.
Their response was more shocking than what I had discovered. Instead of taking action against the Kingpin level distributors that were clearly defrauding the masses, they began to make threats of taking punitive action against me. Fortunately, I had them do it all in writing...

4alpacas

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #996 on: December 05, 2018, 04:42:23 PM »
I also enjoyed The Dream podcast until the last 2 episodes. I really wish they would have continued to focus on the specific MLMs and their practices and those who have been hurt by them. Listening to that last interview was a bit unbearable. I don't know any reasonable journalist who would start off an interview but stating that they think the other person is going to lie to them. Started the whole thing off on a bad point and you could tell the guy was defensive from the beginning. It felt like the 2 different interviews were just being combative and leaning on their investigation of that specific company and other witness interviews. It seemed like too much anecdotal evidence and seemed to loose credibility in how it was presented during that interview. I personally hate MLMs and would love to see them go away because they do cause much more harm than good, but I wish they would have kept talking about the structure of the companies more and provide more insight on how the practice is setup to hurt people instead of help them.

You're right! That last episode was brutal. Lame journalism that hurt the rest of the series, which is a real shame because arg I want MLMs to GO DOWN!!!
I also agree.  Episode 11 was a disappointment on many levels.  However, I'm very interested in the MLM industry.  Are there any books that anyone can recommend?

Disclaimer: I have not read this!

One that completely fascinates me is Amway.  Mostly because I don't know enough about it to figure out how the hell anyone expects to make any money.  But, I know enough about it that they force "training" on people, and that seems to be how some of them make money (by creating and selling the training material).  But I really just don't get it.  Why are people so convinced they can get rich and quit their jobs.

This was recommended to me, and I want to read it, but I'm an extremely slow reader and already in the middle of two other books right now.

https://archive.org/details/MerchantsOfDeception

There is a pdf you can download (the kindle version didn't work for me).  It's legible (unlike the version shown on the computer when you just go to the link).  It's written by a man who was deep into amway (and one of the top people).

Quote
...My wife and I were recruited by friends and quickly rose through the ranks and found ourselves in the top 1/25th of 1% of the multi-billion dollar Amway Corporation. For nearly a decade, we developed a “business” that expanded from North America to Europe, South America, and the Philippines. We spoke to thousands from stage and worked intimately with the Kingpin distributors through whom as much as 90% of Amway's $4-5 billion dollars in annual revenue flows. My wife and I spent personal time with the company's billionaire founder Rich DeVos.
To make a long story short, at the highest level, I inadvertently discovered what documentation now appears to reveal as two decades of systematic, global fraud running into sums far in excess of twenty billion dollars. When I initially discovered the deception, I naively thought it only involved Kingpin level distributors in the field. I immediately reported it to Amway senior management with nearly 50 pages of corroborating documentation.
Their response was more shocking than what I had discovered. Instead of taking action against the Kingpin level distributors that were clearly defrauding the masses, they began to make threats of taking punitive action against me. Fortunately, I had them do it all in writing...
Thanks!  I'll have to check it out.

Villanelle

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #997 on: December 06, 2018, 01:26:01 AM »
I had an extremely awkward interation with a coworker re: Amway (or whatever it's called these days.)  She took some time off with her husband to travel to a conference for "their business", which I learned from other coworkers was Amway.  This woman and I were work friends--lunch together more often than not, but we had only hung out one time outside of work as part of a large group.  So she returns from her conference and a couple days later comes and sits down in my cube.  That in and of itself was a bit weird.  As soon as she started talking, I could tell she was nervous.  So she starts telling me about what a great opportunity having their own business has been for her and her husband, and wouldn't I love to have that freedom?  (Or something like that; this was years ago).  I told her that DH and I are super busy and didn't have time for anything else, or something along those lines.  Of course she didn't take no for an answer, so she then told me that it takes almost no time, and blah blah blah.  Thankfully, she was pretty terrible at it because I suck at saying now (although there is no way I would have every said yes to that, but it probably would have gotten very awkward).  It was pretty obvious that she was using scripts she'd been given to counter various arguments, but after a few attempts, she gave up and left it with telling me to contact her if I changed my mind and ever wanted to be able to quit work and run my own business. 

I considered reporting her to management, but it would have gotten super awkward in a fairly small workplace, so I didn't. 

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #998 on: December 06, 2018, 07:15:39 AM »
More MLM podcasts? Share them! The Dream was amazing and I'm thirsty for more!

Was it the sort of production you can listen to, that contains content, and that delivers it in an intelligent way?

I have to admit that I've tried a few podcasts and TED talks only to delete them early because the people on them simply can't communicate verbally. My personal rule is that if no new information is communicated within the first three minutes, I switch it off. Mostly I've found podcasts to be mumble-mumble, jargon, throat clearing, lip smacking, "well you know", and people interrupting each other or laughing about some kind of inside joke the audience isn't part of. TED talks are even worse because they're one-sided emotional bubblings that simply don't deliver any content. Sitting around wasting ten minutes of bandwidth for something that could have been communicated in thirty seconds or less isn't my idea of a good time. So I haven't done any podcasts in years.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 12:37:15 PM by TheGrimSqueaker »

englishteacheralex

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Re: No, I won't buy into your MLM
« Reply #999 on: December 06, 2018, 07:18:16 AM »
Do you like This American Life? It was along those lines. Pretty informative, almost like a nonfiction book. I actually don't generally love TED talks or super conversational podcasts, myself, but to me The Dream was more substantive.