Neighbor Bought a new Harley

[thepfluger]

Hello Everyone. I needed a place to vent, I've never posted to the forums only lurked around, but this was just too much.

My next door neighbors, who are absolutely the coolest people ever, just bought a brand new Harley Street Glide, financed for 84 months. I love bikes myself, and even have an old Honda CB750. But good lord! I did some quick research and Excel'ing, and saw that these people will be in the hole by about $27,000 compared to putting the same money at the same schedule into even a wimpy index fund. This is a dumb move thats hard to emotionally justify for someone with even with a cool Mil in investment funds. I don't think it would've been financed if they had that kind of money though...

When in the world did we get to financing things for 7 years, and should it hurt me so much just to see someone else do this?

Thanks for listening,
thepfluger

[vegasdude]

Being financed, comprehensive insurance will be a requirement. Liability only coverage is cheap for motorcycles, but full coverage is much more expensive. It can be more expensive than insuring a car with double the value of the bike. A lot of factors influence the rates, but I would be surprised if they got minimum coverage for under $1,200/yr.

[dragoncar]

I'm sorry for your ears

[greaper007]

I'm sorry for your ears

Ha Ha, loud pipes=lingering childhood insecurity.

[GuitarStv]

 . . . but did they get the leather pirate S+M outfit to go with it?  I'm pretty sure it's illegal to use a harley without that outfit.

[Jamesqf]

. . . but did they get the leather pirate S+M outfit to go with it?  I'm pretty sure it's illegal to use a harley without that outfit.

And the beer gut.  It's illegal for a male to ride a Harley unless they appear at least 7 months pregnant.

PS: You do need to realize that leather (minus the chains & decoration) is actually very practical for riding.  Unless you've ridden a bit, you don't really appreciate how cold a 65 mph wind can be.

[eil]

Harleys are like the Escalade of motorcycles. Big shiny expensive status symbols. Totally impractical for actual riding since they're heavy, slow, handle poorly, and have no ground clearance. Not to mention the more subjective traits like reliability (poor), maintenance costs (expensive), and fuel efficiency (utter crap).

I love riding, but I try to stick with vintage motorcycles from the late 70's and early 80's. They're cheap to buy in good condition, easy to maintain, extremely reliable, and fun to ride. (And I admit, owning any motorcycle is not very mustachian but my bike is part of who I am. I strictly control my spending on it and at least I'm able to commute on mine about 9 months out of the year.)

[Forcus]

. . . but did they get the leather pirate S+M outfit to go with it?  I'm pretty sure it's illegal to use a harley without that outfit.

lol!

Yeah, I just don't get the thinking that some Harley people have, where they believe they are independent free-thinking, grabbing-life-by-the-balls billy-bad-asses....... without realizing they got sucked in to the massive H-D marketing machine.

Nothing against the bikes themselves I just find it a little ironic.

[FunkyStickman]

I used to think Harleys were awesome.

Then I grew up got older and realized how annoying they are.

There are huge amounts of them around here. I think I could almost be okay with them (mileage is better than the standard-issue 4X4 truck) but dear god... my ears.

[paddedhat]

They had a fascinating market strategy going before the great recession. IIRC, they were acquiring huge piles of cash from venture capital sources and then doing their own financing. That way, you could be a junior Billy Bad Ass factory worker earning 25K a year and live your dream as a lone Wolf. The dealer would set you up with a $20K bike (at retail, no discounting for something that can only increase in value, LOL ) then give you an allowance for performance mods. and or clothing. It was nothing to have some dipshit roll out of the dealer with $20K "invested" in the bike, and another $3-4K in a pirate costume and high performance parts, all with little down.  Combine this with a so-so credit score, and long term, high rate financing, and this house of cards fell just like the home industry did. Not surprisingly, few saw issues with this business model, or anticipated it's rather certain collapse.

[Jamesqf]

I used to think Harleys were awesome.

Then I grew up got older and realized how annoying they are.

Maybe I was born old, but I've always disliked them (Harleys, that is), and preferred the Japanese bikes.  Especially mid-sized ones(750-850 cc or so) with decent mufflers.

[Exflyboy]

Well lets face it, a decent 400cc and up Jap sports bike will run rings around anything that comes with a Harley badge on it.

I have a friend who has a HD he refers to as "fast". Till I mention that my 1000CC Yamaha back in the UK was capable of 173mph.. and I hit 150mph every time i rode it.

Yeah.. HD's are not even bikes IMHO..

[thepfluger]

Well... I'd like to announce that the ability to buy lots of clothing (from their outfit "motorclothes" of course!) and put it on the financing for the bike is still in full swing. The neighbor came back with loads of accessories and clothing today, all financed on the bike... at 9.8%. Don't ask me why they tell me all the numeric details, I certainly don't ask them.

It seems like it hurts me more than it hurts them... today at least. I still just can't imagine ever signing up for something as long term as 84 months, let alone something that will be worth way less in the end.

Also, all who mentioned the love of older Japanese Bikes, I'm with you. I bought a 78' Honda CB750 when I was in college as my only vehicle. It's easily one of the simplest (and seemingly reliable) vehicles I've ever had. In the end, it's just a machine, and it probably should be sold so I can focus on the truly good things in life, and stash building.

thepfluger

[The_Dude]

I own a Harley.  I've owned two (bought for $5k and 13.5K ea).  Yeah there is lots of "image" associated with these bikes, good and bad.  At the end of the day I really enjoy riding it.  Yeah a sport bike will outperform it significantly and for less money but I don't want to ride a sport bike.  Yeah I like the loud exhaust.

Is it the most mustachian thing ever?  No.  But:
- I've owned it for over 13 years
- Gets 45mpg and I commute on it daily (before I started riding my bicycle 17 miles each way to work)
- I've only added oil and gas with changing the battery every 5 years or so for the past 57,000 miles.  Older Harley's may have sucked but my 2001 is trouble free.
- I own a Harley leather Jacket.  Same one I've owned since 1998. 

To each their own but not all Harley riders are pirate wannabes.

[odput]

It seems like it hurts me more than it hurts them... today at least. I still just can't imagine ever signing up for something as long term as 84 months, let alone something that will be worth way less in the end.

This baffles me as well.  In my pre-MMM days I bought a new car with 60 month 0% financing (facepunch, I know) and it still seems like an eternity.  7 years is SOOO long to finance a vehicle of any sort, let alone a toy.

[Eric]

Please tell me you live in an area where you can ride a motorcycle year round.  Because while 7 years of payments at 9.8% is just about the height of ridiculousness, if you can only use that bike 5 months a year, well.....  [head explodes]

[Jamesqf]

I have a friend who has a HD he refers to as "fast". Till I mention that my 1000CC Yamaha back in the UK was capable of 173mph.. and I hit 150mph every time i rode it.

You're effing nuts :-)  Just about all of my bikes (the largest was an 850 Suzuki) would go considerably faster than I ever wanted to (which was about 100 mph).

That 850 was also the most expensive bike I ever bought, at $1000: several years old, only about 1500 miles on it, and with a nice little touring trailer.

Yeah I like the loud exhaust.

Yeah, but you're not the one who has to listen to it at full volume.

[Thegoblinchief]

I live in Harley town. FUCK Harleys.

[ncornilsen]

I live in Harley town. FUCK Harleys.

FUCK you and whatever you choose to associate yourself with.

 See, I can be a cool-cause-I'm-an-angsty-contrarian too!  Did a Harley rider steal your girlfriend or something?

[warfreak2]

See, I can be a cool-cause-I'm-an-angsty-contrarian too!  Did a Harley rider steal your girlfriend or something?

FUCK cool-cause-you're-angsty contrarianism. (Except for MMM, he's OK.)

[BlueMR2]

I had a friend wanting to buy a new Camaro come up to me one day and go "did you know you can get EIGHT year car loans now?!"....unfortunately he was excited about the idea of paying for his toy (since he's still keeping his old car for normal driving) for eight years. He did end up buying one but I have no idea how long his loan is

Well, I've been thinking about it for a bit and it does sort of make sense.  Old cars you could only get 2-3 year loans because they only lasted that long before falling apart.  New ones will last 8 years (even with the typical owner who neglects them).  It's designed to make you feel good about a car lasting a longer time, while allowing you to buy more luxury, while still trapping you in permanent interest laden car payments.  :-)

[Forcus]

I own a Harley.  I've owned two (bought for $5k and 13.5K ea).  Yeah there is lots of "image" associated with these bikes, good and bad.  At the end of the day I really enjoy riding it.  Yeah a sport bike will outperform it significantly and for less money but I don't want to ride a sport bike.  Yeah I like the loud exhaust.

Is it the most mustachian thing ever?  No.  But:
- I've owned it for over 13 years
- Gets 45mpg and I commute on it daily (before I started riding my bicycle 17 miles each way to work)
- I've only added oil and gas with changing the battery every 5 years or so for the past 57,000 miles.  Older Harley's may have sucked but my 2001 is trouble free.
- I own a Harley leather Jacket.  Same one I've owned since 1998. 

To each their own but not all Harley riders are pirate wannabes.

I think you are the exception rather than the rule. I know a few exceptions (personally) around here, I have no problem at all with the exceptions (nice guys, ride Harleys because they like the style, and how they ride, not because they need others' approval).

The guys that prove the rule, though, wow. (House) roof caving in, starving kids, but damned if they don't have the latest chrome trinket to bolt on. That doesn't even bother me that much (doesn't affect me personally). What does affect me is the loud pipes crowd. God, I hate them.

I like bikes that are art. Not overdone show bikes, but more like the art-deco 30's and 40's bikes, Indian motorcycles, etc. I'd park one in my living room if that was in any way acceptable (though I do have a pair of airline seats for movie night, so I'm almost there).

[greaper007]

I live in Harley town. FUCK Harleys.

FUCK you and whatever you choose to associate yourself with.

 See, I can be a cool-cause-I'm-an-angsty-contrarian too!  Did a Harley rider steal your girlfriend or something?

No, Harley riders just constantly steal my precious hearing and solitude.    My day shouldn't be ruined just because you didn't get enough attention from your mother as a child.   Plus I'm suspicious of anyone who feels the need to pursue their hobbies in groups with uniforms.   

Mostly though, Harley's suck because they're an exploitation of a previously organic, interesting subculture.    Post WWII riders were disaffected, disassociated people searching for meaning in a post modern world that didn't reflect reality.     Now they're people checking off a box that says "socially acceptable, barely fringe sub-culture that's easy to buy into."

But...put the baffles back in your exhaust and I'll look the other way on your midlife crisis.

[ncornilsen]

I don't even own a Harley, and wasn't all that offended, just wanted to match your level of intensity. I just am suspicious of anyone who feels the need to express their desire for authoritarian control over things other people do.

How do you handle all of life's other little annoyances?  Dogs barking, kids whining, industrial activity... I mean, do you move next to a racetrack that's been in operation for 50 years, then complain to the city council every week trying to get it shut down? Sounds like you might be. That guy bitched about Harleys too.  As for exploiting a previously organic subculture and checking off some kind of box... most of the Harley riders I know tend to not fit your stereotype, but perhaps it's easier for you to paint with a broad brush?
I'll continue riding my sport bike with loud exhaust (so cagers can hear my coming and might not run me over) and you can grow some skin.

[GuitarStv]

I don't even own a Harley, and wasn't all that offended, just wanted to match your level of intensity. I just am suspicious of anyone who feels the need to express their desire for authoritarian control over things other people do.

How do you handle all of life's other little annoyances?  Dogs barking, kids whining, industrial activity...

To compare a dog barking, or kids whining to the noise that a loud motorcycle produces is a bit disingenuous.  Motorcycles commonly read in excess of 100 dB at 2 meters.  That's much louder than a semi-truck accelerating on the highway.  I can close my windows if the noise of a dog or kids are bugging me, but will still be forced to listen to the guy down the street revving his motorcycle engine.

I'll continue riding my sport bike with loud exhaust (so cagers can hear my coming and might not run me over) and you can grow some skin.

If you're surprised at the number of people who treat motocyclists with suspicion, anger, and distaste, perhaps read your own response above for some clues as to where that's coming from.

[greaper007]

Nope, I've never bought a house next to a racetrack, airport or train tracks.    If I did, I'd accept the noise.    I'm not a total nimby, I just want people to keep their vices away from me.    I love legal mj in Colorado because you have to consume it in your home.     If I had to deal with people blowing bong rips in a restraunt I wouldn't support the legislation.

When my kids make a loud scene in public, I take them home.    When I had a dog that barked, I scolded her and brought her inside.

I shouldn't have my sleep ruined because you have a desperate need for attention that wasn't received in your childhood.    I'd suggest that your money would be better spent on therapy than a motorcycle.

Harley Riders don't fit a box?    Really?    Is that why everything they own has to have a Fortune 500 company logo on it?   Oh, what a rebel.    Harley Davidson is to rebellion as KISS is to punk.

[Jamesqf]

I'll continue riding my sport bike with loud exhaust (so cagers can hear my coming and might not run me over) and you can grow some skin.

Sorry, but that is just a bullshit excuse for people who like to make loud noises, and have zero consideration for others.  (And I say this as someone who's been riding motorcycles - quiet ones! - for close to four decades.)  Start with the plain, simple fact that when you're driving a car, you can't tell where the obnoxiously loud noise is coming from, so you're about as likely to run over the bike as avoid it ('cause the noise startled you into swerving or something).  Then figure the contribution to incivility: if other people - the bikers - make it obvious that they have no consideration for you, how likely is it that you're going to go out of your way to show consideration for them?

[Thegoblinchief]

Live through the anniversary celebrations in Milwaukee and tell me you like loud pipes.

[MilwaukeeStubble]

Live through the anniversary celebrations in Milwaukee and tell me you like loud pipes.

I hate straight pipes as much as the next guy but I don't think complaining about Harleyfest is fair.  Yes, from the perspective of volume it's absurd - my office on the sixth floor had a constant rumble for 2 days - but it's a once-every-five-years festival that lasts for one long weekend.

Where are you in the city?  My office is right across the street from the freeway and parking lot where the bikes parked during the festival and my apartment is in Yankee Hill near several hotels (about a mile from the festival grounds).  I'm sure there's worse areas to be (I've heard some of the dealerships had things going way into the night) and it was always loud and busy by me but it wasn't much more disruptive than any other festival.

Again, it's a long weekend that happens ONCE EVERY FIVE YEARS.  It's not a huge disruption, and frankly it's kind of cool.  Your situation might be a special case but otherwise I have to say "stop whining and enjoy it"

[James]

My brother had a harley for years, I finally got to take it out a couple years ago and had a blast. Love the rumble, torque, etc. Wouldn't want to own one, but I can see why they are enjoyed.


A new co-worked did the same as your neighbor, financed a brand new harley right out of school. Crazy thing was his neighbor offered to sell him his used harley, but it wasn't quite right. Then I realized why, he couldn't afford to pay cash for the neighbors bike, but financing was easy... crazy... also financed a brand new wakeboarding boat... and a new buick... and his 5 year old truck is "getting old"...

[dragoncar]

Live through the anniversary celebrations in Milwaukee and tell me you like loud pipes.

I hate straight pipes as much as the next guy but I don't think complaining about Harleyfest is fair.  Yes, from the perspective of volume it's absurd - my office on the sixth floor had a constant rumble for 2 days - but it's a once-every-five-years festival that lasts for one long weekend.

Where are you in the city?  My office is right across the street from the freeway and parking lot where the bikes parked during the festival and my apartment is in Yankee Hill near several hotels (about a mile from the festival grounds).  I'm sure there's worse areas to be (I've heard some of the dealerships had things going way into the night) and it was always loud and busy by me but it wasn't much more disruptive than any other festival.

Again, it's a long weekend that happens ONCE EVERY FIVE YEARS.  It's not a huge disruption, and frankly it's kind of cool.  Your situation might be a special case but otherwise I have to say "stop whining and enjoy it"

When the air show comes to town, there's a week or two where they practice by buzzing my office building all day.  Stupid fighter jets -- put your baffles back in!

[notquitefrugal]

I hate straight pipes as much as the next guy...

Me too. On motorcycles, diesel pickups, 18 wheelers, Mustangs, and pretty much any other vehicle where people view it as a status symbol to make it as loud as possible.

[greaper007]

Live through the anniversary celebrations in Milwaukee and tell me you like loud pipes.

I hate straight pipes as much as the next guy but I don't think complaining about Harleyfest is fair.  Yes, from the perspective of volume it's absurd - my office on the sixth floor had a constant rumble for 2 days - but it's a once-every-five-years festival that lasts for one long weekend.

Where are you in the city?  My office is right across the street from the freeway and parking lot where the bikes parked during the festival and my apartment is in Yankee Hill near several hotels (about a mile from the festival grounds).  I'm sure there's worse areas to be (I've heard some of the dealerships had things going way into the night) and it was always loud and busy by me but it wasn't much more disruptive than any other festival.

Again, it's a long weekend that happens ONCE EVERY FIVE YEARS.  It's not a huge disruption, and frankly it's kind of cool.  Your situation might be a special case but otherwise I have to say "stop whining and enjoy it"

When the air show comes to town, there's a week or two where they practice by buzzing my office building all day.  Stupid fighter jets -- put your baffles back in!

Ok, now I'm going to get ridiculed.   I absolutely love to have fighters buzzing anywhere I am.    My dad was an F-14 pilot along with various other navy fighters.   Some of my best childhood memories were getting to put on his helmet and sit in the cockpit of an F-4.    Anytime I smell jet fuel I instantly get transported back to 5 years old.

[FunkyStickman]

I hate straight pipes as much as the next guy...

Me too. On motorcycles, diesel pickups, 18 wheelers, Mustangs, and pretty much any other vehicle where people view it as a status symbol to make it as loud as possible.

This is where I've ended up. At a race track, I can see straight pipes... but 99.9% of the time, it's an ego thing. And man, do I get tired of hearing everybody else's egos. Trucks, cars, bikes, stereos, whatever. I'm just over it.

[senecando]

I'm not a total nimby, I just want people to keep their vices away from me.

Your comment was reasonable throughout, but this is hilarious.

[Jamesqf]

When the air show comes to town, there's a week or two where they practice by buzzing my office building all day.  Stupid fighter jets -- put your baffles back in!

Ever stop to think about how much money goes into trying to develop stealth aircraft?  Which includes low noise, since a (subsonic) aircraft can be tracked & targeted by its acoustic emissions.

[Zamboni]

And the beer gut.  It's illegal for a male to ride a Harley unless they appear at least 7 months pregnant.

;-)  I too have noticed that fitter people tend to be on Ducatis, Japanese racing bikes, or bikes without motors.  (And yes, I have observed the exceptions in every category.)

[dragoncar]

When the air show comes to town, there's a week or two where they practice by buzzing my office building all day.  Stupid fighter jets -- put your baffles back in!

Ever stop to think about how much money goes into trying to develop stealth aircraft?  Which includes low noise, since a (subsonic) aircraft can be tracked & targeted by its acoustic emissions.

Typical government waste - I could have given them my baffles for free!

[GuitarStv]

 . . . or maybe we could just focus less on blowing people up.

[greaper007]

. . . or maybe we could just focus less on blowing people up.

What do you really think happened to the hijacked plane over PA?    That alone is a good reason to keep supersonic fighters flying over the country.    That and the fact that China and Russia still have large enough air forces.

When it comes to defense spending.   I generally support reasonable spending levels that go towards keeping the worlds shipping lanes free from things like pirates (Navy) and the skies safe.   Beyond that, yes I completely agree with you.   Having large expeditionary forces and organizations like JSOC that exist with secret kill lists and an itchy trigger finger are bad for everyone.

[dragoncar]

. . . or maybe we could just focus less on blowing people up.

What do you really think happened to the hijacked plane over PA?    That alone is a good reason to keep supersonic fighters flying over the country.    That and the fact that China and Russia still have large enough air forces.

When it comes to defense spending.   I generally support reasonable spending levels that go towards keeping the worlds shipping lanes free from things like pirates (Navy) and the skies safe.   Beyond that, yes I completely agree with you.   Having large expeditionary forces and organizations like JSOC that exist with secret kill lists and an itchy trigger finger are bad for everyone.

I say we spend more money on flying in a diamond formation

MAXIMUM SPEED, MINIMUM SEPARATION

[Purple Economist]

I love legal mj in Colorado because you have to consume it in your home.     If I had to deal with people blowing bong rips in a restraunt I wouldn't support the legislation.

Would there be some requirement that you go to these restaurants?

[luigi49]

27k for a motorcycle wow.

[GuitarStv]

. . . or maybe we could just focus less on blowing people up.

What do you really think happened to the hijacked plane over PA?    That alone is a good reason to keep supersonic fighters flying over the country.    That and the fact that China and Russia still have large enough air forces.

When it comes to defense spending.   I generally support reasonable spending levels that go towards keeping the worlds shipping lanes free from things like pirates (Navy) and the skies safe.   Beyond that, yes I completely agree with you.   Having large expeditionary forces and organizations like JSOC that exist with secret kill lists and an itchy trigger finger are bad for everyone.

I say we spend more money on flying in a diamond formation

MAXIMUM SPEED, MINIMUM SEPARATION

Probably an easier sell than MAXIMUM FUEL EFFICIENCY, ACCEPTABLE SPEED.

[FunkyStickman]

Was riding home yesterday (on my pedal-powered bike) and discovered yet another idiot on my street bought an extremely loud motorcycle... and he let me know, revved it quite a bit as I passed. It was a trike, too.. Lol. Looked brand new.

HOLY freaking BALLS was it loud. I'm convinced you pretty much cannot own a vehicle that loud without being a complete asshole. You could hear it half a mile away just sitting at a stop sign.

As much as I like being around people, I'd seriously consider moving out to the middle of nowhere if it means I don't have to listen to asshole motorcycle and truck/car drivers who have no concern for people around them. Maybe I'm just getting old and cranky, but geez, man... there has to be some law against that.

As an afterthought, it doesn't matter if there was a law against it... the police here only arbitrarily pursue tickets if they think they can 1. find some illegal substance on you, or 2. make up a complete b.s. reason to pull you over.

[Tempe]

I live in an apartment complex and there is an asshole with a loud motorcycle. Sometimes he sits for 10 minutes while he fiddles with his gloves, texts, or other things while I'm trying to sleep. One of the days I'm not so exhausted I'm going to walk out in my pj's and ask him wtf? at 9 am he doesn't need to be doing that. I wouldn't care as much if he was driving off right away, but it sits and vibrates the windows.

[BlueHouse]

As much as I like being around people, I'd seriously consider moving out to the middle of nowhere if it means I don't have to listen to asshole motorcycle and truck/car drivers who have no concern for people around them. Maybe I'm just getting old and cranky, but geez, man... there has to be some law against that.

I live in DC and we have to deal with Rolling Thunder (1Million Harleys) every year.  There is a law -- it's 83 decibels.  NOT enforced.  The noise is deafening.  If the district just set up noise meters on the bridges coming in and fined everyone with a bike over 83 db, we'd probably wipe out our deficit!

[greaper007]

I love legal mj in Colorado because you have to consume it in your home.     If I had to deal with people blowing bong rips in a restraunt I wouldn't support the legislation.

Would there be some requirement that you go to these restaurants?

I haven't been in a bar you can smoke cigarettes in, in over a decade.    That's sort of an arbitrary argument.    One's vice shouldn't invade another person's sanctity.   

[BlueMR2]

I live in an apartment complex and there is an asshole with a loud motorcycle. Sometimes he sits for 10 minutes while he fiddles with his gloves, texts, or other things while I'm trying to sleep. One of the days I'm not so exhausted I'm going to walk out in my pj's and ask him wtf? at 9 am he doesn't need to be doing that. I wouldn't care as much if he was driving off right away, but it sits and vibrates the windows.

Takes my bike about 10-15 minutes of warmup before it'll play nicely in traffic.  Not terribly safe to ride before then as it surges under power and likes to die at stop signs/lights.  Probably the same deal with this guy unless it's a brand new FI bike.  Air/oil cooled and carbureted engines, which most motorcycles are, don't work as nicely as automobiles with cooling systems and fuel injection.

Also, at 9am the day's half over?  Why aren't you already busy doing things where you don't car?  ;-)  ;-)

[the fixer]

+1 for hating loud motorcycles. I used to live in a house on a street corner in the downtown historic district of a small town, near a traffic light. At random times late at night or early in the morning, motorcycles make the most awful noise accelerating from that light. Those people are inconsiderate assholes, no question about it. Sometimes it was trucks or modded cars waking me up, but the worst was the Harleys.

This is a historic district. The house was there before the Harleys were.

http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episodes/s13e12-the-f-word