Author Topic: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...  (Read 23328 times)

Hunny156

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #50 on: April 09, 2015, 02:55:20 PM »
I've researched timeshares repeatedly over the years, especially when I was younger, because it sounded like a great idea, especially in the resale market.  I could never get the math to work, even with the free "take it off our hands" deals.  The maintenance fees usually kill the deal.

I got a $100 gc once, for agreeing to sit through a 1 hour phone pitch, which I planned while I was at work.  Luckily, when the sales person called, she asked me up front if I had any interest.  I said no, was doing it strictly for the GC, so she spared me the pitch and just sent me the card.  Score!

I had a friend join me on a business trip once, and she agreed to do a timeshare presentation in exchange for tour tickets.  She admitted being worried about actually buying it, so that morning, I stopped by her room, and asked her to hand over all her credit cards.  She got her free tour, and they didn't get a sucker sale.

In recent years, I've found the perfect compromise.  You can rent some really amazing ones for super cheap!  I've stayed on the beach in San Juan (dated but clean studio) and just off the strip in Las Vegas (Newly renovated 2BR lockout) for $250 for the week.  Orlando is the worst place to get a regular timeshare (not talking about the DWC ones), b/c they are a dime a dozen, so you can get a really nice 3 BR for very little money.  Over New Year's, we went to New Orleans w/another couple, and we scored an amazing 2 BR just outside the French Quarter for $500 for 4 nights.  Our friends are totally sold on renting timeshares, they refer to me as their travel agent.

mtn

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #51 on: April 09, 2015, 03:21:33 PM »
I've researched timeshares repeatedly over the years, especially when I was younger, because it sounded like a great idea, especially in the resale market.  I could never get the math to work, even with the free "take it off our hands" deals.  The maintenance fees usually kill the deal.

I got a $100 gc once, for agreeing to sit through a 1 hour phone pitch, which I planned while I was at work.  Luckily, when the sales person called, she asked me up front if I had any interest.  I said no, was doing it strictly for the GC, so she spared me the pitch and just sent me the card.  Score!

I had a friend join me on a business trip once, and she agreed to do a timeshare presentation in exchange for tour tickets.  She admitted being worried about actually buying it, so that morning, I stopped by her room, and asked her to hand over all her credit cards.  She got her free tour, and they didn't get a sucker sale.

In recent years, I've found the perfect compromise.  You can rent some really amazing ones for super cheap!  I've stayed on the beach in San Juan (dated but clean studio) and just off the strip in Las Vegas (Newly renovated 2BR lockout) for $250 for the week.  Orlando is the worst place to get a regular timeshare (not talking about the DWC ones), b/c they are a dime a dozen, so you can get a really nice 3 BR for very little money.  Over New Year's, we went to New Orleans w/another couple, and we scored an amazing 2 BR just outside the French Quarter for $500 for 4 nights.  Our friends are totally sold on renting timeshares, they refer to me as their travel agent.

How do you find the rentals? Craigslist?

mandy_2002

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #52 on: April 09, 2015, 04:32:43 PM »
Some friends of ours own a Disney timeshare. They have to go to Orlando every other year, can't use it anywhere else they said? So of course that means schlepping the whole family down, and of course must go in the parks every day and must dine with the characters and must eat at fancy restaurants. They just got back from a trip to Disney recently actually.

I'm not sure if they were lying to you, they said something a little different than you typed.  With the Disney set-up, you have the option of several places in Disney World, one beach in Florida, Hilton Head Island, One hotel at Disneyland, and One resort in Hawaii.  The problem is that with kids, you can't really travel during the low seasons.  You get more time to book your choices at your "home resort," so during those desirable times the people in the locations outside Orlando book them up and leave very little for others to reserve when the later booking times open up.  So they have the ability to book at any of these 5 locations, but they may not be able to take advantage of that option.

If they bought their DVC as a resale in recent years, then they can't use it for anywhere but WDW.  They changed the rules a few years back to make buying directly from Disney more attractive since it is much cheaper to buy resale.

You can't use it for non-DVC properties and cruises, but all DVC properties are fair game regardless of mode of purchase. 

RagingRanter

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #53 on: May 15, 2016, 12:42:37 PM »
My wife hates the presentations or we would do it more frequently for free/cheap stays. 

But on the story of a messed up visit.  We were staying free in Vegas at a Hilton Grand Vacations property.  Went to the time share presentation.  My wife had just split her head open in a pretty horrifying wakeboard accident and still had stiches. 

Towards the end of the 90 min required time i say alright lets wrap this up we're out of here.  So the bring in this other guy to close and i tell him we arent interested and their time is up.. He proceeds to turn to my wife and insinuate that i beat her by asking her "how did that really happen"  ... Just real class acts

Wow who do they hire for these things? Reminds me of Glengarry Glen Ross

A-B-C. A-Always, B-Be, C-Closing. Always be closing. ALWAYS BE CLOSING.

The woman who we got for a salesperson was almost as obnoxious. She started the presentation by telling us, "Sometimes I get couples where one of them wants to buy and the other one doesn't. I just want you to know in advance that if that should happen, I will still proceed with the sale. You're both independent adults, and neither of you has the right to stand in the way of the happiness of the other."

Now tell me, who was that aimed at? This was a female salesperson, keep in mind. Of course she was targeting my wife right from the opening salvo, sending the message that if she let me stop her or needed my agreement to buy a timeshare, she wasn't really an independent woman. I wonder how many divorces this woman caused by successfully creating exactly that scenario. These sales pitches are NEVER by accident. They are very carefully researched, planned, scripted, rehearsed, tested, and refined, and detailed stats are kept on the results.  The successful pitches are kept and honed further, the less successful ones discarded. This was obviously a successful strategy, and she was obviously very used to delivering it.

It just so happened that our salesperson was from Ottawa (like us), and had attended Carleton University. What a coincidence! She mentioned a couple generic Ottawa landmarks (don't you just love the Parliament Buildings?) before quickly getting on with her pitch. I also noticed the Asian couple had an Asian salesperson, the black couple had a minority salesperson, and the other white couple had a white guy salesperson (maybe from the same hometown as his clients?). What a sleazy industry. After sitting through 3.5 hours of valuable vacation time (yes, that long) I finally cut things off. Of course they offered me the last minute "deal of a life time", because "this unit just became available literally minutes ago" for about 1/4 of the price. I remember thinking, "No wonder the MiL got sucked in." She'd have been helpless in the face of such an onslaught. 75% off!!!!

LiveLean

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #54 on: May 15, 2016, 03:48:44 PM »
I have a Realtor friend who took over a business from her late mother specializing in re-selling DVC. She is wildly successful.

https://www.dvcbyresale.com/

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #55 on: May 15, 2016, 06:58:35 PM »
Having attended one time share presentation in Sedona (where I decided not to buy due to structural flaws in the property and the fact the numbers made no sense) I can definitely relate to the high pressure nonsense.

But I'm now wonder whether it's possible to actually get thrown out of one.

The idea's pretty appealing, but I'll need to accomplish this noble feat while still cashing in on whatever goodies they were offering. Maybe it'll be possible to make them pay me to leave.

Definitely my favorite Russian hat should make an appearance, and perhaps ankle boots with brightly colored leather gloves.

Villanelle

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #56 on: May 15, 2016, 07:51:59 PM »
My sister and BIL (who love Disney, and are child-free) have a DVC, and are considering upgrading to a larger package because they can sell the additional points for more than it costs them to buy.  No idea on the details, but they are generally savvy enough that I believe them on this.

Also, my parents have timeshare.  I guess it's more of a "club" in that there are multiple (probably a couple dozen) resorts from which to choose and they can go any time.  It's actually be a wonderful things for them and they have more than gotten their money out of it.  I think they have missed one year in about 20.  Our family vacations together (parents, 2 adult children and spouses) as often as possible, and many years extended family and friends are invited.  They timeshare allows my parents to book additional rooms for friends for pretty cheap, so people are often happy to get a cheap vacation, and it has created many wonderful memories.  Some years we had 20+ people.

I think it is the flexibility in time and location that has made it so great for may parents.  They own a certain number of years, but can also pull years forward in case we have a crowd.  The "own" at the level of a large suite, or they can take it as 3 regular rooms, so they can pull forward a week and get 6 rooms, or book friends under "bonus time", which is maybe 50% off the regular hotel rate.

They just got back from a week in Cabo San Lucas and are headed back to Mexico in a few weeks with my sister and me and our husbands.  My parents are extremely frugal so this purchase was way out of character for them, but I'm so happy for them that the did it, as it has been a very good thing for them.

I would never buy a timeshare, but I don't think they are always a horrible idea for everyone.  I would never sit through a pitch though.  I am super uncomfortable with that kind of thing.  I'm a terrible haggler, and I put it in kind of the same category.  I could probably say no if I had to (and when tens of thousand of dollars are on the line, I'd have to!), but it would be super painful to me.  Part of the joy of begin financially responsible is, to me, not having to do stuff like that to get a free meal and a night in a hotel. I'd happily pay for that if I wanted it, rather than *earn* it doing something super unpleasant for me.  But for people more assertive, I can see why it is worth it. 

dandarc

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #57 on: May 16, 2016, 07:54:08 AM »
My sister and BIL (who love Disney, and are child-free) have a DVC, and are considering upgrading to a larger package because they can sell the additional points for more than it costs them to buy.  No idea on the details, but they are generally savvy enough that I believe them on this.
Every time I run the numbers on that, the return just isn't that great.  You can get between $11 and $13 per point renting them out fairly easily these days, and the annual fees vary from like $5.00 to $8.50 per point, both depending on the resort you buy into.  Clear that you can make money renting those points.  The purchase price generally hasn't been low enough to get more than a 6% cash-flow every time I've gotten an itch to do this - and that is buying on the resale market.

And that doesn't take into consideration the fact that DVC are long-term leases or any tax-implications.  The lease aspect is a good thing IMO for a timeshare - the annual fee isn't forever.  "Just" 40-50 years.  But if the lease doesn't extend, the price will fall precipitously - the points depreciate to 0 (maybe depletion is the better concept - you have X points per year times however many years to the end of the lease).  And if it does extend, you'll certainly have to pay Disney something for that privilege.

tipster350

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #58 on: May 16, 2016, 08:15:57 AM »
I wouldn't buy a timeshare for myself, but what is the big deal if someone else does? To the OP, if your parents can afford it, and won't expect you to pay their bills in the future, what is the problem?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2016, 08:18:26 AM by tipster350 »

deadlymonkey

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #59 on: May 16, 2016, 08:57:25 AM »
My best friend's parents, who I've known for 30+ years are retired and own a timeshare through RCI  (not originally through them I think, but mergers etc...).  They bought theirs 20+ years ago from a resale from someone who was retired and couldn't travel anymore.  In that time they have learned all the secrets to timeshares and actually never use "their" location, but only trade the points since it is in Florida somewhere and highly desirable.  They frequently travel everywhere and anywhere on through the timeshare program and only pay for the points they need which is way below market value.  They frequently rent rooms for us for vacation and we just reimburse them for the cost.  It works out really well for all involved, but their cardinal rule to us was NEVER buy a timeshare.

I think since their ownership stake is so old, they are grandfathered in on some very generous terms that new buyers would never get, and while they love their program now, if asked to rebuy today would absolutely refuse.

StarBright

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #60 on: May 16, 2016, 09:48:26 AM »
My parents bought into DVC over 20 years ago and it has been so great for them (and by extension for me and my brother and our families). I feel like people who lose money on DVC aren't really using it maybe?

One of the better deals with DVC was that until 1999 or 2000 you got free passes to the parks. We probably went to WDW more than we naturally would have between 1992-2000 but it more than made up for my parent's initial costs. My parents still go to the park every other year or so but spend most of their other points at the other resorts (Vero Beach and Hilton Head). They've also been able to give trips as gifts to family members and friends and rented them out in the rare instance that they or my brother or I are unable to use them.

We figured last year that with their yearly maintenance rate, if we take trips in off seasons and stay in the smallest rooms you end up with 3-4 weeks of hotel rooms at around $50 a night. That is a great deal to stay on property.

Like @Deadlymonkey's friends - my parents might not rebuy if they had to do it with the new 2016 terms but they got a great deal at the time and were luckily at a place in their life where it made sense (two young children the right age being a plus) and they had the financial ability to pull it off (no time share mortgage). Now we're blessed to take our own children to WDW (with the grandparents!). There is a solid resale market for probably another 10 years if they ever get tired of it or they can rent the point out.

ringer707

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #61 on: May 16, 2016, 10:33:47 AM »
I used to work in the court system and spent a looooot of time watching divorce court. I'll never forget the advice I got from one judge: "don't ever buy a timeshare." Every single couple I saw in court who owned a timeshare wasn't arguing over who got to keep it, but who was going to take it over and put up with all the fees on it. We often assigned a value to particular items when dividing a couple's assets. With all but a few cases (DVC actually comes to mind), the assigned value of the timeshare was zero.

SimplyMarvie

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #62 on: May 16, 2016, 11:41:24 AM »
My husband's parents have timeshares. They recently let us know that they'd increased their 'investment' so that they'd be able to leave it equally to us and to my brother in law, who works in a pot brownie shop in Colorado and would never be able to afford the fees. My response was a scream of "NO!" that would have done Luke Skywalker in Empire proud.

On the other hand, we did do a timeshare presentation on our recent vacation -- we were pushing the top of our budget and had just had to cancel our next National Parks camping stop because temperatures were so low at the altitude we would be at that there was a substantially non-zero chance that the three year old would freeze to death in the tent. Las Vegas was the only place reasonably close, and Hilton was willing to put us up for nearly-free in exchange for attending a presentation.

They took some lovely pictures of us on the roof, gave us a very sweet tour, and then asked us what our ideal family vacation would be. I answered (actually truthfully) that I was hoping to go to Ethiopia and Chernobyl in the next year or so, and really couldn't wait until the kids were old enough to hike the Appalachian trial. After that, I don't think they really knew what to do with us...

steviesterno

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #63 on: May 16, 2016, 01:45:43 PM »
my dad had a great time at a gated community sales pitch. he had friends he was visiting that already lived there, and he was not going to get land there no matter what. He just wanted the $500 in free golf clubs for my brother, who was starting to play seriously.

so they met at the friends house, and got hammered on whiskey. left their wallets at the house, went in with pitches of Jameson and Ginger ale, and just made jokes the whole time.

ended up spending most of the presentation giggling in the back of the room and leaving to pee. couldn't and wouldn't sign anything, showed them empty pockets at the end, and walked out with free clubs.



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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #64 on: May 16, 2016, 02:27:58 PM »
my dad had a great time at a gated community sales pitch. he had friends he was visiting that already lived there, and he was not going to get land there no matter what. He just wanted the $500 in free golf clubs for my brother, who was starting to play seriously.

so they met at the friends house, and got hammered on whiskey. left their wallets at the house, went in with pitches of Jameson and Ginger ale, and just made jokes the whole time.

ended up spending most of the presentation giggling in the back of the room and leaving to pee. couldn't and wouldn't sign anything, showed them empty pockets at the end, and walked out with free clubs.

I'm going to have difficulty topping this, and SimplyMarvie's Ethiopia/Chernobyl comment.

It's not going to be enough to just sit through the presentation and get the goodies; I want to be actually thrown out. Maybe if I start undermining some of the other possible sales?

paddedhat

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #65 on: May 16, 2016, 03:29:30 PM »
My husband's parents have timeshares. They recently let us know that they'd increased their 'investment' so that they'd be able to leave it equally to us and to my brother in law, who works in a pot brownie shop in Colorado and would never be able to afford the fees.

Wow, sometimes truth is way stranger than fiction. I previously posted of my Mom's failed attempt to present the DW and I with her failed timeshare "investment" as a wedding gift, and how I had to weasel my way out of it, at that point,  AND when it was time to be her estate executor.  You sir, clearly trump my silly tale. The in laws not only are planning to screw you after they pass by leaving you the damn thing, but are wanting to double down, while the BIL is a pot salesman, who would probably walk away, leaving you two to sweep up the mess.

 Damn, that's downright evil, LOL.

mm1970

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #66 on: May 16, 2016, 04:30:50 PM »
Quote
On the other hand, we did do a timeshare presentation on our recent vacation -- we were pushing the top of our budget and had just had to cancel our next National Parks camping stop because temperatures were so low at the altitude we would be at that there was a substantially non-zero chance that the three year old would freeze to death in the tent. Las Vegas was the only place reasonably close, and Hilton was willing to put us up for nearly-free in exchange for attending a presentation.

Ha ha where?  We visited Utah National Parks in March (with our three year old!) but didn't camp.  Somehow, when we do camp with the boys, the 3 year old ALWAYS ends up curled in my sleeping bag with me (from the age of 1.5 on...)

I camped once in Joshua Tree when it was about 28 degrees at night.  Ice on the inside of the tent.  Sleeping bags rated to 30-32F.  Dang.  And I was pregnant, and had to pee 2x in the middle of the night.  Pretty brutal.  When I planned the trip, I didn't realize that the typical "low" of 40F was at the park ENTRANCE, and it was 13 degrees colder at the higher altitude campsites.  The silver lining (which we learned later), was that the 6 year old had head lice, and it was too cold for them to hatch.  So at least I didn't get them!

SimplyMarvie

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Re: My parents, ladies and gentlemen...
« Reply #67 on: May 17, 2016, 11:59:49 AM »
Quote
On the other hand, we did do a timeshare presentation on our recent vacation -- we were pushing the top of our budget and had just had to cancel our next National Parks camping stop because temperatures were so low at the altitude we would be at that there was a substantially non-zero chance that the three year old would freeze to death in the tent. Las Vegas was the only place reasonably close, and Hilton was willing to put us up for nearly-free in exchange for attending a presentation.

Ha ha where?  We visited Utah National Parks in March (with our three year old!) but didn't camp.  Somehow, when we do camp with the boys, the 3 year old ALWAYS ends up curled in my sleeping bag with me (from the age of 1.5 on...)

I camped once in Joshua Tree when it was about 28 degrees at night.  Ice on the inside of the tent.  Sleeping bags rated to 30-32F.  Dang.  And I was pregnant, and had to pee 2x in the middle of the night.  Pretty brutal.  When I planned the trip, I didn't realize that the typical "low" of 40F was at the park ENTRANCE, and it was 13 degrees colder at the higher altitude campsites.  The silver lining (which we learned later), was that the 6 year old had head lice, and it was too cold for them to hatch.  So at least I didn't get them!

We were in Zion and had planned to head up to Great Basin National Park, which I'd been wanting to do forever. It was looking like it would snow and then get down into the high 20's, and we were sleeping on air mattresses with blankets, rather than proper sleeping bags for various reasons. We had the three year old cuddled in between my husband (who is basically a living heater) under all the blankets and he would still wake up with blue lips. The week that we didn't go to Great Basin was the same week that the weird weather blew through the area creating flash floods in Zion and bad snow up in Great Basin, so we were glad we were seduced into a trip to Vegas.

Still, we may be the only people who went to Las Vegas, did absolutely no gambling, and visited entirely for the Children's Museum and the Balkan foods restaurant. We had a totally fantastic time. :)