Author Topic: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.  (Read 458532 times)

TomTX

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1150 on: June 16, 2017, 04:34:22 PM »
I love that: hire a third party, hand all the children a check.

Unfortunately, people tend to feel strangely about houses. I hear a lot of people who call in (to Dave Ramsey, for example) wanting to save the family home/farm and keep it in the family.

This can be an interesting dumpster fire to watch. I know a couple in their early seventies, that live in voluntary poverty, barely squeaking by,  simply because they refuse to give up the family farm. They live in an old, worn out RV, spending winters in a very low cost location in the south, and summers close to home, volunteering in a location where they get a free campsite, and utilities paid. They have a son who occupies the farmhouse, and covers expenses on the house, but doesn't come close to paying market rental rates for the place. The son has no interest in farming, the other kids feel the same, and have zero interest in the place. The old guy splits the costs,losses and theoretical profit with another local farmer who actually works the ground. One recent year, the old guy lost thousands after a bad crop.
 
This could all end tomorrow and the couple could be living in a nice, paid off, home, with plenty of money to live their lives out, but doing so would involve selling sacred ground. The second the old guy dies, his wife will dump it. If they both spent the next ten-twenty years suffering in voluntary poverty, and pass, the kids will have it on the market before the grass sprouts on mom and dad's cemetery plots.

Good for them. They should sell. It sounds like the whole arrangement is terrible for everyone except the son living there.
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LeRainDrop

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1151 on: June 16, 2017, 06:34:41 PM »
I love that: hire a third party, hand all the children a check.

Unfortunately, people tend to feel strangely about houses. I hear a lot of people who call in (to Dave Ramsey, for example) wanting to save the family home/farm and keep it in the family.

This can be an interesting dumpster fire to watch. I know a couple in their early seventies, that live in voluntary poverty, barely squeaking by,  simply because they refuse to give up the family farm. They live in an old, worn out RV, spending winters in a very low cost location in the south, and summers close to home, volunteering in a location where they get a free campsite, and utilities paid. They have a son who occupies the farmhouse, and covers expenses on the house, but doesn't come close to paying market rental rates for the place. The son has no interest in farming, the other kids feel the same, and have zero interest in the place. The old guy splits the costs,losses and theoretical profit with another local farmer who actually works the ground. One recent year, the old guy lost thousands after a bad crop.
 
This could all end tomorrow and the couple could be living in a nice, paid off, home, with plenty of money to live their lives out, but doing so would involve selling sacred ground. The second the old guy dies, his wife will dump it. If they both spent the next ten-twenty years suffering in voluntary poverty, and pass, the kids will have it on the market before the grass sprouts on mom and dad's cemetery plots.

Good for them. They should sell. It sounds like the whole arrangement is terrible for everyone except the son living there.

Oh man, paddedhat, it's very sad that the dad won't just get rid of it now and instead makes himself and his wife suffer.

chrisgermany

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1152 on: June 16, 2017, 11:59:46 PM »
I have farmers in my family, trust me:
Farmers do not sell. It is in their DNA.

SwordGuy

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1153 on: June 17, 2017, 06:25:45 AM »
My grandparents were farmers.   I suspect they were good ones as they (a) made it thru the depression with the farm still in their hands and (b) were always on the lookout for more farmland (which implies a surplus of cash).  My parents and my uncle invested in additional farmland with my grandparents way back when.

My uncle, who has been managing the farm remotely (the land is rented out to another family that actually does the farm work), explained that good farmland only comes on the market once a century, so if you want to buy it, you buy it when it's available.  (Or wait another 3 generations.)

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1154 on: June 17, 2017, 07:33:05 AM »
My grandparents were farmers.   I suspect they were good ones as they (a) made it thru the depression with the farm still in their hands and (b) were always on the lookout for more farmland (which implies a surplus of cash).  My parents and my uncle invested in additional farmland with my grandparents way back when.

My uncle, who has been managing the farm remotely (the land is rented out to another family that actually does the farm work), explained that good farmland only comes on the market once a century, so if you want to buy it, you buy it when it's available.  (Or wait another 3 generations.)
I wonder if the same is not true of ranchers...

G-dog

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1155 on: June 17, 2017, 08:10:38 AM »
My grandparents were farmers.   I suspect they were good ones as they (a) made it thru the depression with the farm still in their hands and (b) were always on the lookout for more farmland (which implies a surplus of cash).  My parents and my uncle invested in additional farmland with my grandparents way back when.

My uncle, who has been managing the farm remotely (the land is rented out to another family that actually does the farm work), explained that good farmland only comes on the market once a century, so if you want to buy it, you buy it when it's available.  (Or wait another 3 generations.)
I wonder if the same is not true of ranchers...

I would guess that the same is true - land is the needed resource, limited, and rarely becomes available.  But I am just guessing.

Rural

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1156 on: June 17, 2017, 06:37:46 PM »
I couldn't imagine selling land. It's definitely a "had to sell" sort of tragedy when it happens.

Kitsune

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1157 on: June 17, 2017, 07:02:06 PM »
We maintain land that is currently owned by my in-laws and has been in the family for generations. Our house is built on a section of it (2 acres owned by us; 200-odd acres owned by my in laws). That land has been in the family since the early 1800s; we live in an area that bears the family name.

Honestly? We'd all, collectively, have to be utterly screwed to sell any of that land. Like. Work 2 jobs, never retire, work the land vs sell to a developer? No contest. None of us would sell.

There's something about land - either you get it or you don't. *shrugs* I read that story and I think, man, that poor old man, it must be heartbreaking seeing his kids not care.

geekette

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1158 on: June 17, 2017, 08:27:36 PM »
Anyone want some land in central NC?  It was owned by my DH's great aunt and uncle (one child, who died with no heirs a year ago February).  There are a couple dozen distant relatives who now "own" it, and I'm sure they'd all like to find a buyer.  Pine trees and not much else! 

Not all land is worth holding, sadly.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1159 on: June 17, 2017, 10:05:08 PM »
I live in NE Illinois, at the edge of the suburbs, so lots of farmland still around.  And lots of large tracts for sale.  Maybe it's only in certain areas that land is rarely sold?

Rural

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1160 on: June 18, 2017, 06:01:16 AM »
I live in NE Illinois, at the edge of the suburbs, so lots of farmland still around.  And lots of large tracts for sale.  Maybe it's only in certain areas that land is rarely sold?


Unfortunately, urban sprawl too often leads to tax increases to the point that farms and other land are lost. Sometimes the authorities realize we all have to eat and that open space/ woodlands are good for humans and environment, and there the agricultural tax rates are manageable. Some places greed takes over. In many cases in the past, tax rates were frozen for the current owner but not for heirs, so once sprawl happened, all the farms went up on the block as a generation died out and the children couldn't pay the tax. I think (hope) this is less common than it was in the 80s.


But the people selling may not have a choice. Plus sometimes the next generation doesn't want it, as in the OP, but that's less common. Also, sometimes sprawl means heirs can sell for many tens of millions and buy twice the acreage of good land somewhere else with money to spare - I've seen that happen once. It's hard to put a price on the house your great-grandfather raised, but eventually sprawl makes it nearly impossible to do things like get or make agricultural deliveries in what has become a congested suburb.


Sorry. The closest city to here exhibits a lot of these symptoms, and I have to look at what's happening to the people who've been there for generations when we're forced to go there. Fortunately for us, there's still a good 70 mile buffer between us and the exurbs.

iris lily

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1161 on: June 18, 2017, 06:40:36 AM »
I can understand complex feelings of obligation/responsibility/stewardship when land has been in a family for generations.  Fortunately, that isnt the case with DH's family farm in prime Iowa farmland. It is land purchased by  father over the years.

It's all in a trust, and when his father dies, it will be sold and the money divided among DH's siblings. It is a smallish family farm, as farms around there go, but it is still worth a couple of $ million.
« Last Edit: June 18, 2017, 09:56:39 AM by iris lily »

paddedhat

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1162 on: June 18, 2017, 07:49:07 AM »
I live in NE Illinois, at the edge of the suburbs, so lots of farmland still around.  And lots of large tracts for sale.  Maybe it's only in certain areas that land is rarely sold?

Interestingly, the farm I discussed in in IL.  I also met a retired doctor who speculates on the Chicagoland urban sprawl market. He buys and holds farms that are in prime crop country, but 3-4 hours drive away from the sprawl edge. He rents to, and partners with, nearby farmers to keep the farms active, then markets them to farmers that are looking to stay in the game, but want out of the Chicagoland mess. They sell to developers for big dollars, then relocate to equal or better cropland, for a fraction of the price, and the doc. makes a sweet ROI.

Capsu78

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1163 on: June 19, 2017, 09:56:38 AM »
Here is a current case study full of ID from the Bogleheads forum:

https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=221324

Pooperman

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1164 on: June 29, 2017, 08:05:33 AM »
Anyone want some land in central NC?  It was owned by my DH's great aunt and uncle (one child, who died with no heirs a year ago February).  There are a couple dozen distant relatives who now "own" it, and I'm sure they'd all like to find a buyer.  Pine trees and not much else! 

Not all land is worth holding, sadly.

So you're saying they have timberland? That's still worth about 3k/acre.

TartanTallulah

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1165 on: June 29, 2017, 12:57:35 PM »
I've been binge-reading this thread from the beginning with a ghoulish fascination.

We've had nothing more than minor inheritance f*ckwittery in my family. Nobody's ever left enough to justify a drama, I've got into my fifties without ever inheriting anything from anyone, and my parents like the moral high ground better than they like money so if there's ever been any dispute about money or heirlooms they've said, "You can take the lot and we hope it brings you joy," and walked away.








abner

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1166 on: July 01, 2017, 08:45:07 PM »
Binge reading for several nights.

Not as entertaining as other stories but I do have one.
My only sibling (sister) passed away app 5 years ago. She never married. Then my dad passed app 3 years ago, then lastly my mom passed app 1-1/2 year ago. Made the very little inheritance very easy. The story is that my dad had a terminal illness for the last 3 years of his life. So in the end he was wanting to give me, friends, long distance relatives whatever they wanted. ( wasn't much of any monetary value). His gun collection however was very eclectic if not very valuable. Me (only son) had grown up and to this day am not really a "gun" guy. I think they are neat but raising 4 small kids I just didn't want them in the house. My dad took this as "my son just doesn't want the guns". Quite the opposite! Some are 100+ years old and goodness the stories behind them. I just didn't know where to store them until kids are grown. One day as I was visiting and running errands for them he informed me a friend was coming to get one or two. I had to put the brakes on that! When I told him I wanted them it made his day as I have 3 sons that he wanted me to one day give to them.
Just a lack of communication.

A side note I have to tell.
I remember as a kid him winning a Remington 1100 shotgun in a raffle in 1973. I bet that gun hadn't been fired more than 50 shells thru it. After he passed I was cleaning out his belongings and actually found the winning ticket that he presented to claim the prize!
I have it with the gun in a case. Hopefully this will be passed on for generations.

fredbear

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1167 on: July 03, 2017, 05:58:25 AM »
...
A side note I have to tell.
I remember as a kid him winning a Remington 1100 shotgun in a raffle in 1973. I bet that gun hadn't been fired more than 50 shells thru it. After he passed I was cleaning out his belongings and actually found the winning ticket that he presented to claim the prize!
I have it with the gun in a case. Hopefully this will be passed on for generations.

I write stories about either the people I got the gun from, or notable hunts it was on, and put them under the foam in the dedicated gun case for that rifle.  I learned this from a friend who brokered me the sale of an Anschutz that had been a favorite of CL, who burst upon the competition scene in our state, won in many disciplines, and died suddenly and young in a construction accident.  His tale goes with his rifle. 

MrMoogle

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1168 on: July 05, 2017, 12:09:59 PM »
...
A side note I have to tell.
I remember as a kid him winning a Remington 1100 shotgun in a raffle in 1973. I bet that gun hadn't been fired more than 50 shells thru it. After he passed I was cleaning out his belongings and actually found the winning ticket that he presented to claim the prize!
I have it with the gun in a case. Hopefully this will be passed on for generations.

I write stories about either the people I got the gun from, or notable hunts it was on, and put them under the foam in the dedicated gun case for that rifle.  I learned this from a friend who brokered me the sale of an Anschutz that had been a favorite of CL, who burst upon the competition scene in our state, won in many disciplines, and died suddenly and young in a construction accident.  His tale goes with his rifle. 
My uncle inherited my grandfather's guns when he passed, but my uncle is anti-gun, and refused to even pick them up.  My dad and uncle worked out a deal where I would sell them and keep 10% commission.  One was my grandmother's father's shotgun, that had been used regularly.  I have a black and white photo of him with it and his dog.  One might have been my grandfather's father's gun, also used regularly, but I'm not sure if it truly has family history.  One has WWII history, and a possible family connection, but again I don't have the details.  I used my commission to get these, as they were fairly well used, they wouldn't have sold for nearly as much as the others. 

My dad was pretty anti-gun for most of his life, so I wasn't allowed near them.  I wish I had been able to learn about those last two specifically.

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1169 on: October 25, 2017, 02:13:05 PM »
This thread deserves a bump, and I have one that I heard at work:

Grandma of coworker dies.  Coworker's uncle is one of the co-executors.  Coworker stands to inherit 25% of the proceeds from grandma's house.  Two years later, uncle sends a bill to the inheritors for $30k, claiming the work he put into the house increased the home's value from $150k to $230k (home sold for $210k).  Said work was performed without consultation with or permission from the inheritors.  As it turns out, uncle actually owes the estate $15k (borrowed when he was divorced) and owes someone else in the family $25k.

Coworker was smart, called an estate attorney.  Attorney told him to ignore the bill.

Goldielocks

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1170 on: October 25, 2017, 05:39:17 PM »
This thread deserves a bump, and I have one that I heard at work:

Grandma of coworker dies.  Coworker's uncle is one of the co-executors.  Coworker stands to inherit 25% of the proceeds from grandma's house.  Two years later, uncle sends a bill to the inheritors for $30k, claiming the work he put into the house increased the home's value from $150k to $230k (home sold for $210k).  Said work was performed without consultation with or permission from the inheritors.  As it turns out, uncle actually owes the estate $15k (borrowed when he was divorced) and owes someone else in the family $25k.

Coworker was smart, called an estate attorney.  Attorney told him to ignore the bill.
Yeah,   executors can charge for their services, even family, but it is up to a limit, and needs to be "reasonable" to get the max allowed.  For example:

In British Columbia, executors of an estate are entitled to a maximum compensation of 5% of the gross aggregate value of the estate under the Trustee Act, RSBC 1996, c. 464 for their care, pains, trouble and time spent.   

So, if the total estate minus debts and loans is worth $300k, then the max to ALL executors combined would be $15k, and the other executor would need to waive their portion in order for uncle to claim all $15k of it.   The executor does not need permission (except from fellow executor and maybe the court) to do what is necessary to prepare the estate for sale (within reason), but that doesn't mean that they can get compensated more than the legal maximum for their work, even if the work was carpentry repairs, unless agreed to.

Just Joe

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1171 on: October 26, 2017, 09:24:46 AM »
IMO, I think that getting kincaid paintings would have been enough justice on BIL's head.
+1 I haaaaate them. My IL's have a house full and keep buying them as "investments."

That's basically the situation here. MIL bought them as "investments" but she could only afford the mass produced ones. They're worth about 10% of what she paid, if that. She was trying to do right by her kids and grandkids but basically just destroyed her pension lump sum payout between the paintings and the silver "investment" coins. BIL seems to have inherited that mentality.

I really don't like them either. We took one as a remembrance of MIL. It's actually a nice looking lighthouse instead of a cottage and my dad liked lighthouses but it's not hanging yet because the frame is a tacky "gold" thing and we haven't decided if we're going to spring to get it reframed or not.

I've heard of people buying prints as wall art convinced that these will also function as small investments. After 20 or so years though some of these prints have sun damage. Its just ink on heavy paper after all.

Just Joe

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1172 on: October 26, 2017, 09:30:24 AM »
The funny part of dealing with that place is that you can indeed get really nice, ready to use standard frame/glass/mat combinations really cheap. Asking them to do custom work however, can be shocking. I needed to do a 17"x 23" antique blueprint.  I picked a nice looking cheap frame that was actually a faux wood finish on fiberboard. I had a coupon with a huge discount at 65% off. By the time the clerk got done adding, she quoted $330+ for a custom frame job. This was AFTER the discounts. So they were actually pricing the work at over a grand. I laughed and asked if she was serious? I then bought a very similar frame/glass/mat from their stock supply for $15. I spent another $15 on a mat cutter from Amazon, and ended up with a very nice piece of art for $30, or less than 3% of their bogus quote  (pre-discount)

I bought a piece of matting to use as a desk protector for ~$6 a sheet at Hobby Lobby.

I asked the clerk if she could use her mat cutter to reduce the width and length slightly to match my desk top dimensions. She said the cost to cut that mat would be above $20.

That is about 2 minutes worth of work.

I nicely told her that when I buy plywood at the hardware store they will make a couple of cuts for me on their panel saw for free and then I walked away.

Stingy company!

Took the mat home, did 5 mins worth of work with a pencil and scissors for free.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1173 on: October 26, 2017, 10:21:26 AM »
IMO, I think that getting kincaid paintings would have been enough justice on BIL's head.
+1 I haaaaate them. My IL's have a house full and keep buying them as "investments."

That's basically the situation here. MIL bought them as "investments" but she could only afford the mass produced ones. They're worth about 10% of what she paid, if that. She was trying to do right by her kids and grandkids but basically just destroyed her pension lump sum payout between the paintings and the silver "investment" coins. BIL seems to have inherited that mentality.

I really don't like them either. We took one as a remembrance of MIL. It's actually a nice looking lighthouse instead of a cottage and my dad liked lighthouses but it's not hanging yet because the frame is a tacky "gold" thing and we haven't decided if we're going to spring to get it reframed or not.

I've heard of people buying prints as wall art convinced that these will also function as small investments. After 20 or so years though some of these prints have sun damage. Its just ink on heavy paper after all.

Buying art as an investment requires a different approach. You need to buy only art that stands a chance of going up in value, you have to make sure that you'll be able to sell it again which requires that you keep proof of the art's provenance, and you need to ensure the art stays in the same condition it was in when you bought it. Miss even one of these steps, and you've bought the use of a decoration that has aesthetic value but nothing more.

The kind of art that stands a good probability of appreciating will be either an original work or a numbered, signed limited-edition print. The materials used in an original aren't important: it could be a pencil sketch on a napkin and it may still have value depending on who made it. But prints should be on high quality stretched canvas as opposed to paper. The print should be numbered, signed, and from a limited edition. Un-numbered prints do not have resale value except as decoration, and frequently the frame will have a higher value than the print. So if you buy an un-numbered Kincade print, what you have is wall decoration. I'm not saying to never buy wall decoration, just know that wall decoration is what you're buying.

The artists whose work tends to go up in value are the ones who take their work seriously. They submit bids for public art installations, they enter juried art exhibitions, and they make the first page of Reddit. They also have some mechanism to see to it that their art is seen by large numbers of people. So they have a system to mass-produce and distribute at least some of their art. Whether this is a Web site or a gallery distributor that sells on consignment doesn't matter as much as the fact they generate sales and publicity. They mostly don't make money off their originals; they make it off the copies they sell as wall decoration, playing cards, and everything else. In the process, they put their work in front of thousands of different and unrelated eyes.

To maintain resale value, the provenance should be perfect: you need to be able to prove the work is what you say it is and not a reproduction. So you need some record of the transaction, the price you paid, and where you bought the art. I prefer to deal directly with the artist or with the artist's authorized dealer or distributor. You have to hold onto the receipt or some kind of record of the transaction, and you have to keep track of who the artist is or was.

Buying art for investment is a lot like buying penny stocks. Most will go nowhere or even down, but you may luck out and get something by an artist who later goes on to become famous and sought-after. It's also possible to bid on work by established artists at auction, however that's pretty much pure speculation and of course you have to worry about provenance. The prices will already be high, and that's a barrier to entry for most.

For art that is cooperative (a lot of textile based art such as petit point is), you don't need the record of sale because the designers and distributors already publish a picture of the kids they sell, and the artist either sells kit or pattern based copies or licenses his or her work to a company that generates a limited edition pattern. To sell cooperative art, you can do very well if the finished work has no mistakes, has been properly cared for, and of course you need to find the right buyer. Forget eBay and Etsy; a reputable antique dealer would be a better choice. It helps if the needlework was done by someone prominent, but it's equally important that it's done well. Either way it's a multi-generational commitment. Lace and needlework seldom have significant value until they're at least a hundred years old and the design is discontinued. To get them to that age, you need to keep them out of the sunlight, care for them properly, and not treat them like disposable garbage.

If you miss even one step of the above process, you might be supporting an artist and providing him or her with income, and getting something nice to decorate your home or office with, but it's not an investment.
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Chesleygirl

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1174 on: October 26, 2017, 05:38:10 PM »
I've seen a lot of people get jealous when someone they know receives an inheritance. Does that count as drama?

zolotiyeruki

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1175 on: October 26, 2017, 06:31:02 PM »
I've seen a lot of people get jealous when someone they know receives an inheritance. Does that count as drama?
if their envy leads them to do something stupid or exhibit bad manners, then sure!

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1176 on: October 26, 2017, 07:22:40 PM »
My colleague's husband's parents died and left about $80,000 to each of their three children.

My colleague and her husband are very well off. They each work a day or two a week for fun but they're financially independent, very comfortable, live in a $6 million house, travel non-stop.

The husband decided to give his $80,000 to his older, out-of-work, never married sister who has been struggling a bit to make ends meet.

My colleague complained bitterly about him "throwing money away", saying if he didn't want it he should have given it to their adult daughters.

I've posted about their entitled daughters in other threads - they want for nothing. (One daughter is 25 and working full-time, parents bought her a car and give her a "stipend" of $250 a week.)

My colleague saw this as a slight against her family, instead of a generous act from her husband.

TheGrimSqueaker

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1177 on: October 26, 2017, 07:48:24 PM »
My colleague's husband's parents died and left about $80,000 to each of their three children.

My colleague and her husband are very well off. They each work a day or two a week for fun but they're financially independent, very comfortable, live in a $6 million house, travel non-stop.

The husband decided to give his $80,000 to his older, out-of-work, never married sister who has been struggling a bit to make ends meet.

My colleague complained bitterly about him "throwing money away", saying if he didn't want it he should have given it to their adult daughters.

I've posted about their entitled daughters in other threads - they want for nothing. (One daughter is 25 and working full-time, parents bought her a car and give her a "stipend" of $250 a week.)

My colleague saw this as a slight against her family, instead of a generous act from her husband.

If the older sister manages the family money well it will probably come to the daughters in time along with whatever else she owns.
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talltexan

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1178 on: October 27, 2017, 11:25:58 AM »

I've posted about their entitled daughters in other threads - they want for nothing. (One daughter is 25 and working full-time, parents bought her a car and give her a "stipend" of $250 a week.)


I'll have to search for your other threads. By itself, this EOC doesn't seem extreme for a family that could be worth $10-$30 million.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1179 on: October 27, 2017, 01:27:16 PM »
Yeah, well, that was 17 years ago.  She's 97.  Still living.  AND, she's outlived both my mother and an aunt.  That uncle?  Not doing too great, and I think she might outlive him too.

Oh this is just delicious

mustachepungoeshere

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1180 on: October 27, 2017, 03:27:31 PM »

I've posted about their entitled daughters in other threads - they want for nothing. (One daughter is 25 and working full-time, parents bought her a car and give her a "stipend" of $250 a week.)


I'll have to search for your other threads. By itself, this EOC doesn't seem extreme for a family that could be worth $10-$30 million.

But that's the thing, it's such a small amount in light of their probable net worth that it's downright petty for my colleague to be nitpicking over it.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1181 on: October 30, 2017, 05:00:26 PM »
I've seen a lot of people get jealous when someone they know receives an inheritance. Does that count as drama?
if their envy leads them to do something stupid or exhibit bad manners, then sure!

In these cases, envy leads them to make tacky comments that aren't appropriate. I get being jealous because we all suffer from envy, from time to time. But I'm typically good at hiding my envy; these people aren't. I also get that life isn't fair and people inheriting money, didn't work for that money (in some cases, there might be cases where the inheriting parties did contribute financially). But I'm not going to begrudge someone their inheritance. They get what they get. It's their money.
« Last Edit: October 30, 2017, 05:02:29 PM by Chesleygirl »

merula

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1182 on: October 31, 2017, 08:36:21 AM »
It goes to his wife if he leaves a will and specifies that it does. Or if everything is jointly owned in writing (cars, real estate, bank accounts, etc.) or lists her as beneficiary.

But in at least some U.S. states, if a person dies intestate, children from former spouses/partners are legally entitled to part of the estate.

(Obviously not the case in your story - just pointing this out for clarification. Not sure if it's common knowledge.)

This is the case with my family right now. Grandma had two kids from her first marriage and one from her second. She died intestate a few years ago. Grandpa has dementia. (The children of all three consider him Grandpa, as he's the only one they've known.) Child #3 has a major persecution complex and thinks that since he's his dad's only child, everything goes to him. He's wrong; legally children #1 and #2 should have inherited something directly when their mother died, but they're doing fine financially and don't want to fight over the money. #3 insists on interpreting this as "they don't care about me or my dad".  It's a crazy mess.

Also, #3 got mad at grandchildren for going into the (now abandoned) house to try to retrieve photos and mementos before everything was destroyed through neglect.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1183 on: October 31, 2017, 11:59:02 AM »
It goes to his wife if he leaves a will and specifies that it does. Or if everything is jointly owned in writing (cars, real estate, bank accounts, etc.) or lists her as beneficiary.

But in at least some U.S. states, if a person dies intestate, children from former spouses/partners are legally entitled to part of the estate.

(Obviously not the case in your story - just pointing this out for clarification. Not sure if it's common knowledge.)

This is the case with my family right now. Grandma had two kids from her first marriage and one from her second. She died intestate a few years ago. Grandpa has dementia. (The children of all three consider him Grandpa, as he's the only one they've known.) Child #3 has a major persecution complex and thinks that since he's his dad's only child, everything goes to him. He's wrong; legally children #1 and #2 should have inherited something directly when their mother died, but they're doing fine financially and don't want to fight over the money. #3 insists on interpreting this as "they don't care about me or my dad".  It's a crazy mess.

Also, #3 got mad at grandchildren for going into the (now abandoned) house to try to retrieve photos and mementos before everything was destroyed through neglect.

Feel bad for #3 there. Clearly, they're not particularly happy.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1184 on: October 31, 2017, 12:47:28 PM »
It goes to his wife if he leaves a will and specifies that it does. Or if everything is jointly owned in writing (cars, real estate, bank accounts, etc.) or lists her as beneficiary.

But in at least some U.S. states, if a person dies intestate, children from former spouses/partners are legally entitled to part of the estate.

(Obviously not the case in your story - just pointing this out for clarification. Not sure if it's common knowledge.)

This is the case with my family right now. Grandma had two kids from her first marriage and one from her second. She died intestate a few years ago. Grandpa has dementia. (The children of all three consider him Grandpa, as he's the only one they've known.) Child #3 has a major persecution complex and thinks that since he's his dad's only child, everything goes to him. He's wrong; legally children #1 and #2 should have inherited something directly when their mother died, but they're doing fine financially and don't want to fight over the money. #3 insists on interpreting this as "they don't care about me or my dad".  It's a crazy mess.

Also, #3 got mad at grandchildren for going into the (now abandoned) house to try to retrieve photos and mementos before everything was destroyed through neglect.

State dependent, if you die intestate, then often there is a cap where the first $x goes to the surviving spouse, and the remainder is split between the kids...   If Grandma did not have a lot of assets left in the estate (e.g., a home was jointly owned and other accounts were designated beneficiary to grandpa or also joint), there may actually be no money for kids 1,2,3 from her death.  Inheritance upon Grandpa's death would depend on whether kids 1 and 2 were recognized (adopted) by him before he became mentally reduced, (or in a will).


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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1185 on: October 31, 2017, 01:52:08 PM »
It goes to his wife if he leaves a will and specifies that it does. Or if everything is jointly owned in writing (cars, real estate, bank accounts, etc.) or lists her as beneficiary.

But in at least some U.S. states, if a person dies intestate, children from former spouses/partners are legally entitled to part of the estate.

(Obviously not the case in your story - just pointing this out for clarification. Not sure if it's common knowledge.)

This is the case with my family right now. Grandma had two kids from her first marriage and one from her second. She died intestate a few years ago. Grandpa has dementia. (The children of all three consider him Grandpa, as he's the only one they've known.) Child #3 has a major persecution complex and thinks that since he's his dad's only child, everything goes to him. He's wrong; legally children #1 and #2 should have inherited something directly when their mother died, but they're doing fine financially and don't want to fight over the money. #3 insists on interpreting this as "they don't care about me or my dad".  It's a crazy mess.

Also, #3 got mad at grandchildren for going into the (now abandoned) house to try to retrieve photos and mementos before everything was destroyed through neglect.

State dependent, if you die intestate, then often there is a cap where the first $x goes to the surviving spouse, and the remainder is split between the kids...   If Grandma did not have a lot of assets left in the estate (e.g., a home was jointly owned and other accounts were designated beneficiary to grandpa or also joint), there may actually be no money for kids 1,2,3 from her death.  Inheritance upon Grandpa's death would depend on whether kids 1 and 2 were recognized (adopted) by him before he became mentally reduced, (or in a will).

Depending on the timing and location, remarrying can indeed disinherit your first set of children unless you take intentional steps to make sure the surviving spouse doesn't take everything. Family customs often adapt to the local laws. For example, remarriage was historically rare in my family. My grandparents' generation never remarried after the death of a husband or wife. But it was customary for elderly people to have a boyfriend or girlfriend after the traditional mourning period was over. Nobody said a damn thing negative about my widowed grandmother's special friend, for example, although obviously marriage was out of the question.
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merula

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1186 on: October 31, 2017, 01:57:07 PM »
This is the case with my family right now. Grandma had two kids from her first marriage and one from her second. She died intestate a few years ago. Grandpa has dementia. (The children of all three consider him Grandpa, as he's the only one they've known.) Child #3 has a major persecution complex and thinks that since he's his dad's only child, everything goes to him. He's wrong; legally children #1 and #2 should have inherited something directly when their mother died, but they're doing fine financially and don't want to fight over the money. #3 insists on interpreting this as "they don't care about me or my dad".  It's a crazy mess.

Also, #3 got mad at grandchildren for going into the (now abandoned) house to try to retrieve photos and mementos before everything was destroyed through neglect.

State dependent, if you die intestate, then often there is a cap where the first $x goes to the surviving spouse, and the remainder is split between the kids...   If Grandma did not have a lot of assets left in the estate (e.g., a home was jointly owned and other accounts were designated beneficiary to grandpa or also joint), there may actually be no money for kids 1,2,3 from her death.  Inheritance upon Grandpa's death would depend on whether kids 1 and 2 were recognized (adopted) by him before he became mentally reduced, (or in a will).

That is the case in this state, and Grandpa doesn't have a will either. #1 and #2 were not adopted by Grandpa. There were enough assets that they should have gotten some payout, but they didn't press anything because they don't need the money (and Grandma's death was not expected, and very hard on everyone emotionally). In this state, the "payout after the death of one parent" only applies if your parent was at the time of death married to someone who is not your parent, so #3 would not have gotten anything at Grandma's death.

Grandpa is now in a facility and #3 has signed over all assets to the facility to pay for his care. It's somewhat interesting that, had #1 and #2 pressed for their share, they could have then gifted it to #3. As it is, it's unlikely that #3 will see any inheritance at all. (Except, of course, for those items that his nieces and nephews salvaged from the house over his objections.)

Depending on the timing and location, remarrying can indeed disinherit your first set of children unless you take intentional steps to make sure the surviving spouse doesn't take everything. Family customs often adapt to the local laws. For example, remarriage was historically rare in my family. My grandparents' generation never remarried after the death of a husband or wife. But it was customary for elderly people to have a boyfriend or girlfriend after the traditional mourning period was over. Nobody said a damn thing negative about my widowed grandmother's special friend, for example, although obviously marriage was out of the question.

This is also true. On a completely different side of the family is a great-grandma who was married twice (once divorced, once widowed), and for the last ~10 years of her life her "special friend" was her sister's widower. He had a heart attack at her house at 3am one time. The best part was how she would rail against the immorality of the younger generations for living together before marriage.

But there's also the grandpa who has been with his second wife for more than 30 years; they both had grown children when they married and they've deliberately kept completely separate finances and detailed wills so that neither will disinherit their children.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1187 on: October 31, 2017, 02:38:36 PM »
Depending on the timing and location, remarrying can indeed disinherit your first set of children unless you take intentional steps to make sure the surviving spouse doesn't take everything. Family customs often adapt to the local laws. For example, remarriage was historically rare in my family. My grandparents' generation never remarried after the death of a husband or wife. But it was customary for elderly people to have a boyfriend or girlfriend after the traditional mourning period was over. Nobody said a damn thing negative about my widowed grandmother's special friend, for example, although obviously marriage was out of the question.

This is also true. On a completely different side of the family is a great-grandma who was married twice (once divorced, once widowed), and for the last ~10 years of her life her "special friend" was her sister's widower. He had a heart attack at her house at 3am one time. The best part was how she would rail against the immorality of the younger generations for living together before marriage.

But there's also the grandpa who has been with his second wife for more than 30 years; they both had grown children when they married and they've deliberately kept completely separate finances and detailed wills so that neither will disinherit their children.

The moral difference, for my grandma and perhaps also your great-grandma, was this: she and her special friend were physically incapable of having children together and had presumably done their duty by their own children a long time ago. Indeed, by foregoing marriage she was doing a favor to her kids and heirs. An unmarried young couple living together, however, was doing something radically different. They were creating a risk to everyone in the young woman's family, which was a Bad Thing To Be Avoided.

With no such thing as reliable birth control, two young adults living together was a pregnancy waiting to happen. Should a child be born, he or she would have no right to any of the father's assets, having been born outside marriage. Indeed, since there was no such thing as a reliable paternity test he could always deny the baby was his. All the debt related to medical care or child care accrued to the mother of the child, not the father. The same went for responsibility. Instead of continuing her education, running her own business, or earning an income the young woman would be saddled with the responsibility of caring for the baby. Her other responsibilities would generally devolve onto other people in her family, consuming their time and resources to pay for necessities both for the baby and for what could have been a productive adult. After seeing a few young lives ruined because an older sister just had to crank out a baby, the community got pretty resentful pretty fast. ("Sorry, Joe, we had to spend your college money on Mary's baby"... "Sorry, Jane, you can't have a part-time job, or take an after-school enrichment class, you've got to babysit Mary's kid"... "Leave that schoolbook alone, can't you hear the baby's crying?")

My take on it is that a lot of the censure for specific behaviors came less from any social, moral, or religious categorical imperative than from the risks associated with the behaviors. The risks in this case came from biology, technology, and the ways the laws were written. As those changed, the risks were greatly reduced to the point where a teen pregnancy (for example) isn't a danger to everyone in sight. Accordingly, many families adapted until the early single pregnancies became the norm, and marriage is what became rare.
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talltexan

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1188 on: November 01, 2017, 07:16:38 AM »
Depending on the timing and location, remarrying can indeed disinherit your first set of children unless you take intentional steps to make sure the surviving spouse doesn't take everything. Family customs often adapt to the local laws. For example, remarriage was historically rare in my family. My grandparents' generation never remarried after the death of a husband or wife. But it was customary for elderly people to have a boyfriend or girlfriend after the traditional mourning period was over. Nobody said a damn thing negative about my widowed grandmother's special friend, for example, although obviously marriage was out of the question.

This is also true. On a completely different side of the family is a great-grandma who was married twice (once divorced, once widowed), and for the last ~10 years of her life her "special friend" was her sister's widower. He had a heart attack at her house at 3am one time. The best part was how she would rail against the immorality of the younger generations for living together before marriage.

But there's also the grandpa who has been with his second wife for more than 30 years; they both had grown children when they married and they've deliberately kept completely separate finances and detailed wills so that neither will disinherit their children.

The moral difference, for my grandma and perhaps also your great-grandma, was this: she and her special friend were physically incapable of having children together and had presumably done their duty by their own children a long time ago. Indeed, by foregoing marriage she was doing a favor to her kids and heirs. An unmarried young couple living together, however, was doing something radically different. They were creating a risk to everyone in the young woman's family, which was a Bad Thing To Be Avoided.

With no such thing as reliable birth control, two young adults living together was a pregnancy waiting to happen. Should a child be born, he or she would have no right to any of the father's assets, having been born outside marriage. Indeed, since there was no such thing as a reliable paternity test he could always deny the baby was his. All the debt related to medical care or child care accrued to the mother of the child, not the father. The same went for responsibility. Instead of continuing her education, running her own business, or earning an income the young woman would be saddled with the responsibility of caring for the baby. Her other responsibilities would generally devolve onto other people in her family, consuming their time and resources to pay for necessities both for the baby and for what could have been a productive adult. After seeing a few young lives ruined because an older sister just had to crank out a baby, the community got pretty resentful pretty fast. ("Sorry, Joe, we had to spend your college money on Mary's baby"... "Sorry, Jane, you can't have a part-time job, or take an after-school enrichment class, you've got to babysit Mary's kid"... "Leave that schoolbook alone, can't you hear the baby's crying?")

My take on it is that a lot of the censure for specific behaviors came less from any social, moral, or religious categorical imperative than from the risks associated with the behaviors. The risks in this case came from biology, technology, and the ways the laws were written. As those changed, the risks were greatly reduced to the point where a teen pregnancy (for example) isn't a danger to everyone in sight. Accordingly, many families adapted until the early single pregnancies became the norm, and marriage is what became rare.

TGS,
your thoughtful post leaves out one more consequence of the teen pregnancy: reduced value on the marriage market of the unwed mother. If your goal is to capture the thinking of 1940's society (when this grandmother would have been indoctrinated into sexual morality), I think that's important.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1189 on: November 01, 2017, 09:02:35 AM »
Depending on the timing and location, remarrying can indeed disinherit your first set of children unless you take intentional steps to make sure the surviving spouse doesn't take everything. Family customs often adapt to the local laws. For example, remarriage was historically rare in my family. My grandparents' generation never remarried after the death of a husband or wife. But it was customary for elderly people to have a boyfriend or girlfriend after the traditional mourning period was over. Nobody said a damn thing negative about my widowed grandmother's special friend, for example, although obviously marriage was out of the question.

This is also true. On a completely different side of the family is a great-grandma who was married twice (once divorced, once widowed), and for the last ~10 years of her life her "special friend" was her sister's widower. He had a heart attack at her house at 3am one time. The best part was how she would rail against the immorality of the younger generations for living together before marriage.

But there's also the grandpa who has been with his second wife for more than 30 years; they both had grown children when they married and they've deliberately kept completely separate finances and detailed wills so that neither will disinherit their children.

The moral difference, for my grandma and perhaps also your great-grandma, was this: she and her special friend were physically incapable of having children together and had presumably done their duty by their own children a long time ago. Indeed, by foregoing marriage she was doing a favor to her kids and heirs. An unmarried young couple living together, however, was doing something radically different. They were creating a risk to everyone in the young woman's family, which was a Bad Thing To Be Avoided.

With no such thing as reliable birth control, two young adults living together was a pregnancy waiting to happen. Should a child be born, he or she would have no right to any of the father's assets, having been born outside marriage. Indeed, since there was no such thing as a reliable paternity test he could always deny the baby was his. All the debt related to medical care or child care accrued to the mother of the child, not the father. The same went for responsibility. Instead of continuing her education, running her own business, or earning an income the young woman would be saddled with the responsibility of caring for the baby. Her other responsibilities would generally devolve onto other people in her family, consuming their time and resources to pay for necessities both for the baby and for what could have been a productive adult. After seeing a few young lives ruined because an older sister just had to crank out a baby, the community got pretty resentful pretty fast. ("Sorry, Joe, we had to spend your college money on Mary's baby"... "Sorry, Jane, you can't have a part-time job, or take an after-school enrichment class, you've got to babysit Mary's kid"... "Leave that schoolbook alone, can't you hear the baby's crying?")

My take on it is that a lot of the censure for specific behaviors came less from any social, moral, or religious categorical imperative than from the risks associated with the behaviors. The risks in this case came from biology, technology, and the ways the laws were written. As those changed, the risks were greatly reduced to the point where a teen pregnancy (for example) isn't a danger to everyone in sight. Accordingly, many families adapted until the early single pregnancies became the norm, and marriage is what became rare.

TGS,
your thoughtful post leaves out one more consequence of the teen pregnancy: reduced value on the marriage market of the unwed mother. If your goal is to capture the thinking of 1940's society (when this grandmother would have been indoctrinated into sexual morality), I think that's important.

The reduced marriage-market value of people with children generally only affected the ones who produced the children, so I acknowledge that it existed but don't believe it was a contributing factor in the censure, unless the grandparent somehow bought into the whole categorical-imperative notion.

People usually only react strongly to things that personally affect them, unless they conflate the problem into a categorical imperative so that they believe "if X happens, it's right and appropriate to fly off the rocker because X is MORALLY BAD". Once they do that, the context and circumstances that made X potentially dangerous to them or to other people in their tribe can change but the butt-hurt oversensitivity endures. It appears to me that it's happened a lot where other people's romantic and reproductive choices are concerned: people tend to grossly overreact to things that do not actually affect them.
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formerlydivorcedmom

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1190 on: November 01, 2017, 02:02:36 PM »
When my grandfather died, my grandmother was still alive.  His will left her almost everything, with a small amount to each of his 5 kids and some money for the youngest of his 9 grandchildren (only child of only son).  My mild-mannered mother and one of her sisters were LIVID that he didn't include the other grandchildren.  Sister and I didn't care (don't know about my other cousins), but we were honestly worried that the siblings would stop talking to each other.  To keep peace, my grandmother sent a few hundred dollars to each of the other grandkids.   

When my grandmother died 8 years later, they managed to divide the estate between the 5 of them; mom sent my sister and I each a check for $1k as "our share", which was a nice surprise.  The better news is that the siblings still get along!

The other side of the family is messed up.  My grandmother recently died.  Her husband and 2 of her 4 sons (including my dad) predeceased her, and youngest son disowned her.  She wrote a will leaving 50% to oldest son and 50% split between me and my sister (other deceased son had no heirs).  Half her money was in cash, half in cds.  A year before she died, she told us that oldest son had asked her to sign paperwork to reinvest the cds, and she found out after the fact that the paperwork was to move them into his name.  At this point, she had had 3rd stroke and was essentially blind.  She was heartbroken and cried and cried.  We told her it was fine; we didn't need money to know she loved us, and if he stopped paying for the nursing home we'd beat him up for her.  She told us at least we'd get the cash (about $25k each).

The day after the funeral uncle gave my sister a copy of the will, leaving everything to him.  We figured he had her sign that at the same time he moved the cds into his name.  Will states that anyone contesting it "only receives $1".  We joked we ought to contest it just to get something!  Uncle says he'll leave everything to us when he dies; we figure IF he has a will, he'll leave anything he has left to his mostly-estranged grandsons, and, if no will, it will go to his mostly-estranged son.  And if he makes it to heaven our grandmother will kick his butt.   Before then...well, we're probably the ones that get to pick his nursing home!

Grandmother did give away her belongings years ago; sister and I got all of her jewelry and a few pieces of furniture.  It's enough to remember her by.

Sister and I made a pact not to be assholes when our mom dies.  Mom wants to leave everything 50-50.  I said no; sister and her son have always lived with mom (sis pays utilities, helps keep up the house, and plans to take care of mom when needed; she's somewhat of a spendthrift, but she's responsible), and I am not kicking sister out of her home.  Sister should get house, and we can evenly split any other assets.  Mom agreed.  I will nag mom next year to make sure her will has been updated.  Otherwise, I'm the executor, so I bet I can make it work.

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talltexan

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1191 on: November 02, 2017, 07:02:55 AM »
Wait, so all of this dickering by your uncle was over $100,000?

Being a jerk is bad. Being a jerk for--in estate terms--a small amount of money seems inexcusable.

formerlydivorcedmom

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1192 on: November 02, 2017, 07:36:35 AM »
Yep, about $100k.  In my family, that is a lot of cash - uncle had a union job with a nice pension and never saved a dime.  My sister only makes $35k, so this would have been a significant windfall for her.

We did put uncle (a functioning alcoholic) on notice that his behavior over the next few years determines whether we stick him in a run-down nursing home where the only nurses are big hairy men, or whether we put him somewhere decent and smuggle him the occasional Crown Royal.  Right now, he's got a one-way ticket to the former.

I'm grateful for my mom - she's way better with money and taught me well.
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tyrannostache

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1193 on: November 02, 2017, 03:03:11 PM »
IMO, I think that getting kincaid paintings would have been enough justice on BIL's head.
+1 I haaaaate them. My IL's have a house full and keep buying them as "investments."

That's basically the situation here. MIL bought them as "investments" but she could only afford the mass produced ones. They're worth about 10% of what she paid, if that. She was trying to do right by her kids and grandkids but basically just destroyed her pension lump sum payout between the paintings and the silver "investment" coins. BIL seems to have inherited that mentality.

I really don't like them either. We took one as a remembrance of MIL. It's actually a nice looking lighthouse instead of a cottage and my dad liked lighthouses but it's not hanging yet because the frame is a tacky "gold" thing and we haven't decided if we're going to spring to get it reframed or not.

I've heard of people buying prints as wall art convinced that these will also function as small investments. After 20 or so years though some of these prints have sun damage. Its just ink on heavy paper after all.

Buying art as an investment requires a different approach. You need to buy only art that stands a chance of going up in value, you have to make sure that you'll be able to sell it again which requires that you keep proof of the art's provenance, and you need to ensure the art stays in the same condition it was in when you bought it. Miss even one of these steps, and you've bought the use of a decoration that has aesthetic value but nothing more.


Ah yes, "investment" art. My ILs used to travel a lot, and they loved to buy art when they traveled. That's great--their prerogative, and I think they enjoy the things that they have bought. Unfortunately, they also love to brag about how much all of this stuff is going to be worth for my kids. Stuff like spectacularly expensive rugs which their  dog has wrecked, ceramics of dubious origin, and some oil paintings that are "guaranteed" to go up in value. FIL likes to point out how one of the paintings is going to be my kid's college fund. Said painting sits inches above the buffet where they pile wine, beer, and food during family get-togethers. We smile and nod and continue investing in the kid's 529.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1194 on: November 02, 2017, 03:12:49 PM »
IMO, I think that getting kincaid paintings would have been enough justice on BIL's head.
+1 I haaaaate them. My IL's have a house full and keep buying them as "investments."

That's basically the situation here. MIL bought them as "investments" but she could only afford the mass produced ones. They're worth about 10% of what she paid, if that. She was trying to do right by her kids and grandkids but basically just destroyed her pension lump sum payout between the paintings and the silver "investment" coins. BIL seems to have inherited that mentality.

I really don't like them either. We took one as a remembrance of MIL. It's actually a nice looking lighthouse instead of a cottage and my dad liked lighthouses but it's not hanging yet because the frame is a tacky "gold" thing and we haven't decided if we're going to spring to get it reframed or not.

I've heard of people buying prints as wall art convinced that these will also function as small investments. After 20 or so years though some of these prints have sun damage. Its just ink on heavy paper after all.

Buying art as an investment requires a different approach. You need to buy only art that stands a chance of going up in value, you have to make sure that you'll be able to sell it again which requires that you keep proof of the art's provenance, and you need to ensure the art stays in the same condition it was in when you bought it. Miss even one of these steps, and you've bought the use of a decoration that has aesthetic value but nothing more.


Ah yes, "investment" art. My ILs used to travel a lot, and they loved to buy art when they traveled. That's great--their prerogative, and I think they enjoy the things that they have bought. Unfortunately, they also love to brag about how much all of this stuff is going to be worth for my kids. Stuff like spectacularly expensive rugs which their  dog has wrecked, ceramics of dubious origin, and some oil paintings that are "guaranteed" to go up in value. FIL likes to point out how one of the paintings is going to be my kid's college fund. Said painting sits inches above the buffet where they pile wine, beer, and food during family get-togethers. We smile and nod and continue investing in the kid's 529.

Very wise of you. In fairness, if it wasn't for the hordes of people who do exactly as you describe, it wouldn't be possible for artists to sell enough work to feed themselves in significant enough numbers for one of them to beat the odds and become famous enough for their originals or limited-edition prints to become worth significantly more than what you paid for it.
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Dave1442397

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1195 on: November 03, 2017, 06:00:40 AM »
And then you have people who buy art for the frame, and find out they accidentally bought a painting worth serious money - http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1334747/Man-bought-30-painting-oak-frame-discovers-watercolour-worth-48-000.html

In a similar story, a friend of a friend bought a painting for $20 at a silent auction because she liked the frame and planned to reuse it. The painting sat leaning against a wall behind a door for months before she got back to it. When she cut through the paper backing, she found a letter inside. It turned out to be from the curator of a Spanish museum, asking to be notified if the painting was ever for sale. I forget who the artist was, but it ended up selling at auction for $180,000.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1196 on: November 03, 2017, 07:11:25 AM »
I have acquaintances who believe that their paintings are a valuable part of their kids' inheritance too. They are Thomas Kincaide prints. So not only nearly worthless, but also ugly.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1197 on: November 03, 2017, 11:12:29 AM »
I have acquaintances who believe that their paintings are a valuable part of their kids' inheritance too. They are Thomas Kincaide prints. So not only nearly worthless, but also ugly.

If you like Thomas Kincaide prints, more power to you. Decorate your house however you want. My parents love them. I don't want their judgment when my home decor isn't to their taste, so I'm not going to do that to them. even if Thomas Kincaide is objectively bad.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1198 on: November 03, 2017, 11:19:24 AM »
I have acquaintances who believe that their paintings are a valuable part of their kids' inheritance too. They are Thomas Kincaide prints. So not only nearly worthless, but also ugly.

If you like Thomas Kincaide prints, more power to you. Decorate your house however you want. My parents love them. I don't want their judgment when my home decor isn't to their taste, so I'm not going to do that to them. even if Thomas Kincaide is objectively bad.

Haha, rest assured that I do not tell them how I feel! But I do feel it.

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Re: Inheritance Drama: You Got Any? Stories Wanted.
« Reply #1199 on: November 03, 2017, 01:00:57 PM »
Ah yes, "investment" art. My ILs used to travel a lot, and they loved to buy art when they traveled. That's great--their prerogative, and I think they enjoy the things that they have bought. Unfortunately, they also love to brag about how much all of this stuff is going to be worth for my kids. Stuff like spectacularly expensive rugs which their  dog has wrecked, ceramics of dubious origin, and some oil paintings that are "guaranteed" to go up in value. FIL likes to point out how one of the paintings is going to be my kid's college fund. Said painting sits inches above the buffet where they pile wine, beer, and food during family get-togethers. We smile and nod and continue investing in the kid's 529.

Years ago, in-laws went on an artwork buying spree and bought various paintings and sculptures.  They bragged that some of these pieces cost 10K or more but are a "great investment" and will be worth "a lot of money".  Who really knows, but having been in the local gallery scene, DH really doubts it as he found markups to be totally insane and this was around the time his folks bought this stuff.   These items were supposed to fund the grandkids' college but that never materialized since
one grandkid did not go and the other funded it via other means. 

But, they insist, these are still worth money!!!  Now we will inherit them eventually and that will fund our retirement!    We just continue to fund our retirement as per usual but SIL has totally bought into this idea that they are worth something but then again, the she thinks everything is worth money, down to the $10 Hallmark ornaments she gives at Christmas.   

« Last Edit: November 03, 2017, 01:02:59 PM by saguaro »